Mormon temple ceremony

the font

what I would like to do, if I could prevail upon the spirit, is to compare a few features of the latter day temple and it's ceremonies to the practices of the original temple of Solomon and the priests of Aaron, and their concurrence with the teachings of Christ.

First is the Brazen sea, originally it was used to wash the priests. In Latter day temple ceremonies it is now used to fulfill the commandments of Jesus Christ for those who never had a chance to be baptized.

John 3:5 "Jesus answered and said verily, verily I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of God."

When Paul speaks of the resurrection to the Corinthians he mentions the dead works; 1 Corinthians 15:29 "Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?" It is a precept given to the spirits in the hereafter as a key to unlock the door into heaven not withstanding that person is willing to open the door, the same guideline still stands as the savior still stands at the door and knocks.

Here we are justified by this ordinance with the power of the priesthood which is the ability to bind on earth the things which are bound in heaven and loose on earth the things which are loosed in heaven.

This specific ceremony along with the sealing and anointing ceremonies, given as priesthood keys through the prophet Elijah, binds families together for eternity. Thus in the spirit of Elijah fulfills the prophecy of Malachi, to "Turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to the fathers."

The priest's garments

Below is a standard layout of what the ancient priests would wear as part of their ceremonial worship. Now in our modern day temples the priests adorne a similar type of clothing with a few variations as they wait to pass through a renewed veil which leads into what is called the celestial room. This most sacred room is the closest place to God as one could hope to enter on earth without seting foot in heaven.

Note that one is required to pass through a veil in order to enter this room, in the same way the ancient priests had to pass through a veil in order to enter the holy of holies.

Dual fates

This is the Nauvoo Temple which was destroyed after the saints were forced out of Illinois in 1846. It's fate is similar to that of Solomon's temple which was pilfered and polluted several times. The Nauvoo temple has since been restored to it's original form as such was the temple of Solomon until it was completely destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar.

Although this part is not significant to the temple ceremony, it is a representation of the hardships and perseverance of the church, and like the prophet Joseph Smith whose testimony was sealed in his own blood, This temple saw some of the most notable miracles in our dispensation before it was destroyed.

This is the plan of exaltation, to unite families by the power of God which is eternal. In the beginning God created man, but man was not complete without woman, and so is life in the eternities to be sealed together as one.

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Comments 46 comments

ruffridyer 5 years ago from Dayton, ohio

This teaching, this doctrine, this truth is what first touched my soul. Baptism for the Dead. This is why I searched the scriptures and called unto God to known if the Church of Jesus Christ of latterday saints was true. Thank you for this hub.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Always glad to help inspire the brethren/sisters!

ohplease 5 years ago

What was the point of Christ’s death? There is no need for a temple or ceremonies. Christ dead so that we may come directly to God the Father. This is proved by the tearing of the real temple curtain which removed the barrier. This is a hard thing for some to accept, no need for all the pageantry and secrecy. We are not righteous by the ceremonies we perform, which account for nothing more that filthy rages. Righteousness comes by faith in Jesus Christ. That simple. Jesus said follow me. Not a man named Joseph Smith or Billy Graham, a church, a prophet, or a denomination.

Just to be clear, Jesus loved us so much and wants a relationship with us so much that died and rose so that we could come directly to God the Father.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

It is an undeniable fact that temples and prophets existing in the latter days have been spoken of by the mouths of God's previous prophets and apostles. The LDS temples are a direct fufillment of those prophecies.

Isaiah 2:

"2And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

3And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem."

Revelation 11;

1. And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

Latter day saints know full well that the only path to salvation is through the Lord and savior Jesus Christ, and the path that the lord requires is that we follow his commands, to dedicate our lives to his service.

Subsequently God has revealed a higher law to his chosen people to perform ordinances and enter into sacred covenants in his holy house, all with the express purpose of growing closer to our creator.

It is interesting that you use "pagentry" and "secrecy" both in the same sentence to describe the same thing.

ohplease 5 years ago

"God has revealed a higher law to his chosen people" there's the secrecy, and false teaching. But it sells good doesn't it. Pageantry as in the showy temples.

What about the real temple ( there was only one by the way ) curtain being torn when Christ was crucified. That destroys any idea that we should be building more temples and hanging new curtains.

Have you missed to whole reason for Christ's death and resurrections? Once again, all believers have access to a relationship with God the father and we don't need a "prophet" or temple works to take us there.

ohplease 5 years ago

correction, death and resurrection

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

To lable LDS temples as "showy" and "pagentry" is contradictory to your reasoning, in fact the origional temple built by Solomon was filled with all manner of precious materials which far exceeded the glamour of modern ones. So are you saying that Solomon was being showy as well?

Along with temple worship it is a historical fact that the public, or "the gentiles", were not included in the temple ceremonies. No gentile was permited to go into the temple, as were few people (even non-Levite Israelites), allowed to go into the holy of holies.

Were the priests of Aaron being secrative as well?

The fact is that all of Gods children have had access to a relationship with their Father in Heaven through faithful prayer and obidience to his laws. If indeed we do not need prophets to receive guidance from our father in heaven, then mankind never has. There would be no need for the woks of Christ, and there would be no need for our mortal existence.

paliza 5 years ago

God did indeed reveal a higher law just as Onusonus said. The Israelites that left Egypt and headed towards the Holy Land were to be taught the higher aw, but when the created the calf and sinned against God, they lost that opportunity and were forced to live the Law of Moses. While the Law of Moses was easier to follow Spiritually, Physically it took a toll on the children of Israel. They had to be so specific and look up all the laws all the time (thus the 5 books of Moses, mainly Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy) and make sure they were following them word for word. Even then, the people still participated in the sacred rights of the temple, while, however, they were limited and only had the Priesthood of Aaron, or the Aaronic Priesthood (read Hebrews 7). That is why Christ said come and take his yoke, or the higher law that he was teaching, that the burden of a new law, and the way of repenting for ones sins may be lightened. He was the ultimate sacrificial lamb, and those vessels that were used in the temples would now be used to not only bring to pass the salvation of the living man, but also bring to pass the salvation of the dead. Work for the dead hadn't been able to be done for a few reasons. 1.No one in Israel, save the Holy Prophets, such as Moses, Elijah, and others had the Melchizedek Priesthood, or the higher Priesthood. Since Jesus hadn't taught the higher law to the people as of yet, The Melchizedek Priesthood could not be obtained. The higher law then, is in reality, revealed to his choice people, or the people that choose to follow the commandments and better themselves. Many are called but few are chosen. ring a bell? 2. Christ hadn't come to earth and had died yet, opening the gates for the dead to be able to be resurrected. In 1 Peter 3 and 4 we read about the atonement of jesus christ and its extensions beyond the grave, and how he himself went and preached, taught, andset up the missionary service to have that work to continue onward after his resurrection. If he had not first died, then opened the gates of death, and was resurrected himself, then the entire ceremonies of the temple would be for not. It wouldn't matter if the ordinances were done, because the people on the other side wouldn't be able to use them.

The temple prepares men to meet with God. For you to say that it doesn't means you are literally spitting in the face of the authors of the holy scriptures and in the faces of all those men that served in the temple in ancient times. That is a very blasphemous statement. As for us needing prophets, yes we do. Prophets have many special jobs fo:r us. They are called of God,not of men(Exodus 28:1, Jeremiah 1:5, 26:5, 1 Samuel 16:1-13, Amos 7:15), and they receive Revelation from God to tell us what to do (Amos 3:7, Numbers 12:6, Proverbs 29:18, Matthew 16:13-19, Galatians 1:11-19, Revelations 1:1). More importantly, there were Prophets and are Prophets after Christ (Acts 11:27, 13:1, 15:32, 21:10,and Revelations 11:3-12, 18:20)

As for the Curtain being rent, it was basically the fall of the Sadducees and the Pharisees and their "rule" as the spiritual leaders. Judaism fell that day, and christianity was born.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Very good assertion.

ohplease 5 years ago

Sorry, the assertion sounds good but is a partial truth. The curtain did end the Sadducees and the Pharisees rule as well as any other priestly authority other than Christ's. Mormons can't accept this because it invalidates their temple ceremonies and the whole structure of the church. Which I've read is really a corporation not a church as most people understand churches. Twisting God's words to fit man's desires is wrong and was Satan's scheme in the beginning.

I sense that those commenting are doing so in a concerted effort and not on their own. There is nothing wrong with that just that it is deceptive when people think that this is a sounding board but in fact LDSers are being directed by the corporate structure to join and propagandize. Great marketing but still deceptive.

To prove as much, more than a few posts of mine have been deleted or hidden. Once more a scheme by the LDS corporation to deceive and hide the truth.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

I believe that when you origionally asked the question about the banning of polygamy, the person who answered your question was duped, by you, into believing that it was a sincere question which it was not. Hence he deleted your further arguments. It is a common practice of people in the church not to engage in frivilous arguments that only grow heated and insulting, and the outcome ends in the detraction of any kind of potential for spiritual growth.

One of the benefites of communicating with others about their religion is gaining understanding about who they are and where they are coming from. Subsequently we learn to accept the values of others and become more capable of showing them that the doctrine of Christ is implemented through love, understanding, and longsuffering. Rather than bickering, zealotry, and hypocracy.

ohplease 5 years ago

How do you know why my comments are deleted?

All the doctrines of the Mormon church should by questioned. All of which, if followed, will hinder spiritual growth. If potential readers know the history of Joseph Smith the game would be over.

This is not about be but let me say, Not all values are equal or worthy of acceptance. And once again, if followed, will hinder a relationship with Christ.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

I admit I don't know exactly why your attacks against that person's beliefs were deleted, I'm only speculating.

I find it to be perfectly acceptable to question one's own beliefs as well as other's however you are spining your wheels with me, I've done plenty of research on the history of my religion and the history of Joseph Smith, and none of it gives an inkling that his doctrine or his lfe was anything short of the characteristics of a true prophet of God.

ohplease 5 years ago

I appreciate that but how do you answer the rebuilding of the Independence temple prophecy to be complete in the 1800's? How do you defend Brigham Young saying the Christian God is the Devil of the Book of Morman. And then his willingness to knife apostates in one of his meetings. How to you explain all the hostility towards Christians up until the last 20 years or so when it became expedient for the church to appear as close to Christians as possible. Why do Mormans need a “temple recommend” when Jesus died on the cross as the only way to salvation. Doesn't it seem that someone has thrown all these extra requirements above and beyond what Jesus did? Some one else said the temple curtain was torn to end the corrupt temple priest hood. Well it was torn to end all temple priesthood and therefore all the ceremonies that you guys say Mormons must undergo. We haven't even started with the church finances and giving, and who directs the millians. What about B. Young's claims that the pine in the temple would turn to stone. I'm not a scholar of your churches history and don't want to be. All I'm saying is Jesus died once and for all as the perfect sacrifice. Nothing more, that's all there is or ever can be. Nothing you do, as in ceremonies at the "temple", will do more for you than what has already been done.

ohplease 5 years ago

This may not be the form but back to Paliza: Let’s be very clear. The Israel-its didn’t lose the opportunity for a higher law. I don’t understand “higher law”. Does a loving God create a secret “higher law” and then expect everyone to live by that, not at all, His requirement is clear “Be Holy as I am Holy”, more on this... The children of Israel became impatient and fearful so they tried to find their own salvation by worshipping the golden calve which I understand was part of the Egyption way. They didn’t wait on God. The law was given only to show how utterly impossible it is for man to live a Holy life. The law was given, in case there was any doubt, to show the vast difference between a Holy God and sinful man. So that we would have to say, Ok I am not God, I’m not Holy and never will be, I need a saver! To rescue me from myself. The sacred rights of the temple were not secret either. They were a blood sacrifice to show the high cost of sin. There had to be a sacrifice for sins, even if as imperfect as an animal was. Why do Mormons make such a big deal about the priest hood. They were there to administer the sacrifices that peoples sins cost. Christ comes and abolishes the priest hood. Christ was the perfect sacrifice! Once the prefect sacrifice is offered there can be no other sacrifice and thus no need for another priest. I think the Mormons have twisted the simple understanding of scripture to justify religious positions for which Christ abolished any need for when he died. This is not an attack, not name calling just serious criticism.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

The specific revelation given concerning the building a temple in indapendence Missouri states that the temple, "shall be reared in this generation", when speaking in a biblical sense there are several applications to the word "generation."

Gen. 2:4, "These are the generations," means the "history." 5:1, "The book of the generations," means a family register, or history of Adam. 37:2, "The generations of Jacob" = the history of Jacob and his descendants. 7:1, "In this generation" = in this age. Ps. 49:19, "The generation of his fathers" = the dwelling of his fathers, i.e., the grave. Ps. 73:15, "The generation of thy children" = the contemporary race. Isa. 53:8, "Who shall declare his generation?" = His manner of life who shall declare? or rather = His race, posterity, shall be so numerous that no one shall be able to declare it. In Matt. 1:17, the word means a succession or series of persons from the same stock. Matt. 3:7, "Generation of vipers" = brood of vipers. 24:34, "This generation" = the persons then living contemporary with Christ. 1 Pet. 2:9, "A chosen generation" = a chosen people. The Hebrews seem to have reckoned time by the generation. In the time of Abraham a generation was a hundred years, thus: Gen. 15:16, "In the fourth generation" = in four hundred years (comp. verse 13 and Ex. 12:40). In Deut. 1:35 and 2:14 a generation is a period of thirty-eight years.

So, the nineteenth-century understanding of KJV Biblical/religious usage of "generation" includes such variations as:

-all the descendants of



-succession or series of people from same stock

-race, posterity

-one hundred years

-thirty-eight years


So it is biblically accurate to refer to this generation, and be speaking of an entire dispensation in time, Hence Jesus Said "This generation shall not pass away until all these things be fufilled", and yet to this day as Christians we still look forward to his return.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

One of the major issues that early LDS leaders had with those that professed to be "Christian" was the fact that they were sometimes foremost among the persecutors of the Saints.

Suppose we now notice that part of the world called Christians, that profess to believe the Old and New Testament, King James's translation. They say they believe this Bible, yet if you are in France, Germany, England, in the United States, in the Canadas, in the islands of the sea, or no matter where among the Christian nations, the moment you make it known that you have embraced the Book of Mormon, and that you believe Joseph Smith is a Prophet, they will at once accuse you of throwing away the Bible, they will publish abroad that you have become a "Latter-day Saint," "a Mormon," and consequently have denied the Bible you formerly believed, and have cast it entirely away. What is the reason of this, which I need not undertake to substantiate, for it is a fact that almost every person knows? Now, we ARE believers in the Bible, and in consequence of our unshaken faith in its precepts, doctrine, and prophecy, may be, attributed "the strangeness of our course," and the unwarrantable conduct of many towards this people. (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 1:237) We lived in Illinois from 1839 to 1845, by which time they again succeeded in kindling the spirit of persecution against Joseph and the Latter-day Saints. Treason! treason! treason! they cried, calling us murderers, thieves, liars, adulterers, and the worst people on the earth. And this was done by the priests, those pious dispensers of the Christian religion whose charity was supposed to be extended to all men, Christian and heathen; they were joined by drunkards, gamblers, thieves, liars, in crying against the Latter-day Saints. (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 19:61)

Brigham's point was that those who persecuted the Saints were not extending the charity that typically characterized Christianity. This was not a condemnation of Christianity in general, but rather a condemnation of those who professed to be Christian but did not practice Christian principles. Brigham was denouncing hypocrites. Likewise, Joseph F. Smith also denounced such hypocrisy:

I felt to thank God that we still possessed our lives and freedom, and that there was at least some prospect of the homeless widow and her family of little ones, helpless as they were, to hide themselves somewhere in the wilderness from those who sought their destruction, even though it should be among the wild, so-called savage, native tribes of the desert, but who have proved themselves more humane and Christlike than the so-called Christian and more civilized persecutors of the Saints. (Joseph F. Smith, Journal of Discourses 23:74)

The denunciation of hypocrisy among those who professed to be Christians is not a denunciation of Christianity itself. Latter-day Saints certainly identified themselves as Christians during this period of time.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

The myth that 'It is only recently that LDS leaders have attempted to identify themselves as Christian' has been thoroughly debunked in many articles produced by the church and it's supporters. It is obvious, too, that other non-LDS observers frequently referred to the Saints as "Christians." Those who rely on such a claim demonstrate either their unfamiliarity with the historical facts, or a complete disregard for the truth in their efforts to malign the faith of the Saints.

It is also clear that early LDS leaders did not object to Christianity per se—since they clearly considered themselves Christians, this would have been nonsensical. What early Church leaders did object to was the hypocrisy of some Christians, who discarded Christian scripture and principles and lied, misrepresented, persecuted, and visited violence on a Christian group with whom they disagreed: members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Saints are not unique in this regard; history is full of violent or bigoted men who claimed the sanction of Christ for their mistreatment of others, as victims of crusades, pogroms, shunnings, and inquisitions can bear witness.

It is ironic, but perhaps not surprising, that many present-day authors who attack and misrepresent the Church are likewise Christians. Latter-day Saints understand, however, that such critics are not representative of all Christians. Happily, they are generally a small, if shrill, minority. We reject their tactics without rejecting the Christianity in which they claim to drape it. It is difficult to believe that the Prince of Peace would sanction such tactics.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Unfortunately for [critics] it is quite clear that the New Testament apostles continued to worship in the Jerusalem temple after Christ's ascension (Acts 2:46, Acts 3:1-10, Acts 5:20-42). Even Paul worshipped there (Acts 21:26-30, Acts 22:17, Acts 24:6-18, Acts 25:8, Acts 26:21). Paul is explicitly said to have performed purification rituals (Acts 21:26, Acts 24:18), and prayed in the temple (Acts 22:17, cf. Acts 3:1); he claims that he has not offended "against the temple," implying he accepts its sanctity (Acts 25:8). Indeed, Paul also offered sacrifice (prosfora) in the temple (Acts 21:26, cf. Numbers 6:14-18), a very odd thing for him to do if the temple had been completely superceded after Christ's ascension. Finally, and most importantly, Paul had a vision of Christ ("The Just One" ton dikaion) in the temple (Acts 22:14-21), paralleling Old Testament temple theophanies, and strongly implying a special sanctity in the temple, where God still appears to men even after Christ's ascension.

There is no evidence that the early Christian apostles abandoned the use of the temple. Indeed, they embraced it, and continued to use it for the appearance of the Risen Lord, and the receipt of prophetic calls.

It is not surprising that Christians have since down-played the importance of the temple, since most do not have one. No one would want to admit they are missing an important part of the gospel. But, if Paul and other apostles valued and honored the temple, why do critics attack the Latter-day Saints for doing the same?

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

I've not found any Brigham Young quotes saying that the Pine in the Temple would turn to stone.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

I too believe that the sacrifice of Christ is an atoning sacrifice for the sins of the world, and so do all Latter Day Saints.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

As for the higher law it is obvious that there were people ordained by God in the old testament era who were given the higher priesthood, (Melchezedek) and this priesthood was not heard from very often because of the prevolance of idol worship amongst the children of Israel. We see that Christ posessed the higher priesthood and did in fact deligate it to others, (Peter, James, and John,) who were worthy to receive it. The priesthood has always been an important aspect of the gospel of Jesus Christ, as he has continuously ordained prophets and apostles from the begining down to our day. Animal sacrifice was only a small part of the duities of a priest, and as you can see LDS priests do not engage in any animal sacrifices for the very reason that the sacrifice is now and always will be through Jesus Christ. the sacrifice required of those who follow him are a contrite heart and obedience to his commands including temple worship.

ohplease 5 years ago

Why do Mormons repeatedly delete my questions and comments? The propaganda machine is rolling strong but it can't answer questions about the Mormon founders own words and writings. That must be difficult.

May you find truth beyond yourself.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Oh please, as your name indicates you are coming at me with an incessant wall of criticism, and skepticism reminiscent of a staunch atheist. I have answered your questions quite thoroughly, and none of my answers will ever satisfy you.

Your last ten questions have been baseless accusations posited to assert nothing more than shock value, and are merely opinionated assertions. You are beginning to treat my comments section like your own anti-Mormon stomping ground. I have no problem with a theological debate but in the end it all comes down to faith.

The gospel of Christ is optimistic, and intelligent. It is centered around temperance, and enlightenment. The holy spirit speaks by way of intelligence and comfort to the soul.

I have not seen any of these attributes in your discourse with me or any of the other Latter Day Saints on this sight, and that is your right to act any way you wish. It however, is less than convincing, and you have made no effort to explain any of your beliefs other than the fact that you believe my church is wrong.

ohplease 5 years ago

Thanks! Yes I'm full of faults.

In this age of "what ever you believe is fine as long as you are sincere" is very agreeable with Mormons. However there will always be right and wrong. If someone says 2+2=5 and no one questions, that it is a problem. Then everything else must be called into question.

So my last point was about the papyri J.S. translated and it being completely wrong. What is your answer for that?

What about B. Young and men on the sun and moon.

Is there a need for theological debate when the foundation is flawed. False prophets create false religions. That is what people should know.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Brigham Young made the following statement in 1869:

"it has been observed here this morning that we are called fanatics. Bless me! That is nothing. Who has not been called a fanatic who has discovered anything new in philosophy or science? We have all read of Galileo the astronomer who, contrary to the system of astronomy that had been received for ages before his day, taught that the sun, and not the earth, was the centre of our planetary system? For this the learned astronomer was called "fanatic," and subjected to persecution and imprisonment of the most rigorous character. So it has been with others who have discovered and explained new truths in science and philosophy which have been in opposition to long-established theories; and the opposition they have encountered has endured until the truth of their discoveries has been demonstrated by time...

I will tell you who the real fanatics are: they are they who adopt false principles and ideas as facts, and try to establish a superstructure upon, a false foundation. They are the fanatics; and however ardent and zealous they may be, they may reason or argue on false premises till doomsday, and the result will be false. If our religion is of this character we want to know it; we would like to find a philosopher who can prove it to us."

The context for Brigham's remarks, then, are that new ideas and truths are often mocked or rejected by those who cling to older ideas. And, were he to have such an idea, he would want to know.

He then says:

"We are called ignorant; so we are: but what of it? Are not all ignorant? I rather think so. Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening, called the moon? When we view its face we may see what is termed "the man in the moon," and what some philosophers declare are the shadows of mountains. But these sayings are very vague, and amount to nothing; and when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the most ignorant of their fellows."

Brigham goes on to speak about inhabitants of the moon. In context, his point is clearly that no one;—even experts—knows very much about the universe. There are many things (such as whether the moon is inhabited) about which no one of his day could speak clearly.

It then becomes very clear that Brigham is expressing his personal views, not laying down divine truth from on high:

"So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain."

Brigham is obviously expressing his opinion, but his point remains that no one knows very much about such things. To reject a novel idea simply because it is new—such as Mormonism—is absurd. All true ideas were once new, and treated with suspicion.

(It is also of note that William Herschel—the preeminent astronomer of his generation and the man to discover Uranus—was also firmly of the belief that the sun was inhabited.)

Brigham is clearly expressing an opinion, and there is no evidence that he is making a prophetic declaration concerning extraterrestrials. He even goes out of his way to indicate that this is what he "rather think[s]," and asks his congregation to consider what they think. He also says that he would want to know if an idea he has is false—even including his religion. These are not the sentiments of a man convinced he must be right by divine gift of prophetic omniscience.

It is particularly ironic that Brigham's remarks were focused on the fact that no one knows much about anything, and so humility is appropriate on most questions. Critics have taken this wise stance, and have tried to invert Brigham's intent—changing him from an advocate of humility before the unknown into a doctrinaire know-nothing who is certain of absurdities. The critics might do well do follow Brigham's example.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

As for the accusation that the book of Abraham was translated wrong you still have brought me nothing except a baseless accusation. And since there are many false claims made by anti-Mormon sources I will refer you to this article which refutes all claims made against the book.

Although I doubt you will read any of it because all you do is come up with an accusation and when it is addressed you move on to the next.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Also Mormons do not buy into the "what ever you believe is fine as long as you are sincere" mantra of the day. One would think that if you knew anything about the LDS faith you would know that quite the opposite is true. Because we believe that people have the basic human right to believe what they want, doesn't mean it is correct or that it constitutes their ability to enter into God's presence in the next life.

wonderful 5 years ago

Brigham claimed that every sermon he preached was scripture so when he says these things about the inhabitants of the moon while preaching he didn't think it was opinion.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

The context for Brigham's remarks, are that new ideas and truths are often mocked or rejected by those who cling to older ideas. And, were he to have such an idea, he would want to know. Brigham goes on to speak about inhabitants of the moon. In context, his point is clearly that no one;—even experts—knows very much about the universe. There are many things (such as whether the moon is inhabited) about which no one of his day could speak clearly.

If you were to read his comments in context you would very easily be able to see that Brigham is expressing his personal views, not laying down divine truth from on high.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Further President Young himself gave the following quote.

"I have known many times I have preached wrong.

Ladies and gentlemen, I exhort you to think for yourselves, and read your Bibles for yourselves, get the Holy Spirit for yourselves, and pray for yourselves.

The great masses of the people neither think nor act for themselves. . . . I see too much of this gross ignorance among this chosen people of God.

What a pity it would be if we were led by one man to utter destruction! Are you afraid of this? I am more afraid that this people have so much confidence in their leaders that they will not inquire for themselves of God whether they are led by Him. I am fearful they settle down in a state of blind self-security, trusting their eternal destiny in the hands of their leaders with a reckless confidence that in itself would thwart the purposes of God in their salvation, and weaken that influence they could give to their leaders, did they know for themselves, by the revelations of Jesus, that they are led in the right way. Let every man and woman know, by the whispering of the Spirit of God to themselves, whether their leaders are walking in the path the Lord dictates, or not. This has been my exhortation continually.

Brother Joseph W. Young remarked this morning that he wished the people to receive the word of the Lord through his servants, be dictated by them, and have no will of their own. I would express it in this wise: God has placed within us a will, and we should be satisfied to have it controlled by the will of the Almighty. Let the human will be indomitable for right....

Let all persons be fervent in prayer, until they know the things of God for themselves and become certain that they are walking in the path that leads to everlasting life; then will envy, the child of ignorance, vanish, and there will be no disposition in any man to place himself above another; for such a feeling meets no countenance in the order of heaven. Jesus Christ never wanted to be different from his father: they were and are one. If a people are led by the revelations of Jesus Christ, and they are cognizant of the fact through their faithfulness, there is no fear but they will be one in Christ Jesus, and see eye to eye.

How often has it been taught that if you depend entirely upon the voice, judgment and sagacity of those appointed to lead you, and neglect to enjoy the Spirit for yourselves, how easily you may be led into error, and finally be cast off to the left hand?

I do not wish any Latter–day Saint in this world, nor in heaven, to be satisfied with anything I do, unless the Spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ, the spirit of revelation, makes them satisfied.

I am more afraid that this people have so much confidence in their leaders that they will not inquire for themselves of God whether they are led by him. I am fearful they settle down in a state of blind self–security, trusting their eternal destiny in the hands of their leaders with a reckless confidence that in itself would thwart the purposes of God in their salvation, and weaken that influence they could give to their leaders, did they know for themselves, by the revelations of Jesus, that they are led in the right way. Let every man and woman know, by the whispering of the Spirit of God to themselves, whether their leaders are walking in the path the Lord dictates, or not.

Seek diligently to know the will of God. How can you know it? In matters pertaining to yourselves as individuals, you can obtain it directly from the Lord; but in matters pertaining to public affairs, his will is ascertained through the proper channel, and may be known by the general counsel that is given you from the proper source

It is your privilege and duty to live so that you know when the word of the Lord is spoken to you and when the mind of the Lord is revealed to you. . . . Suppose I were to teach you a false doctrine, how are you to know it if you do not possess the Spirit of God?

"Live so that you will know whether I teach you truth or not." Suppose you are careless and unconcerned, and give way to the spirit of the world, and I am led, likewise, to preach the things of this world and to accept things that are not of God, how easy it would be for me to lead you astray! But I say to you, live so that you will know for yourselves whether I tell the truth or not. That is the way we want all Saints to live. Will you do it? Yes, I hope you will, every one of you.

The First Presidency have of right a great influence over this people; and if we should get out of the way and lead this people to destruction, what a pity it would be! How can you know whether we lead you correctly or not? Can you know by any other power than that of the Holy Ghost? I have uniformly exhorted the people to obtain this living witness each for themselves; then no man on earth can lead them astray.

How do you know but I am teaching false doctrine? How do you know that I am not counseling you wrong? How do you know but I will lead you to destruction? And this is what I wish to urge upon you—live so that you can discern between the truth and error, between light and darkness, between the things of God and those not of God, for by the revelations of the Lord, and these alone, can you and I understand the things of God. . . . But to return to my question to the Saints, "How are you going to know about the will and commands of heaven?" By the Spirit of revelation; that is the only way you can know. How do I know but what I am doing wrong? How do I know but what we will take a course for our utter ruin? I sometimes say to my brethren, "I have been your dictator for twenty–seven years"—over a quarter of a century I have dictated this people; that ought to be some evidence that my course is onward and upward. But how do you know that I may not yet do wrong? How do you know but I will bring in false doctrine and teach the people lies that they may be damned?"

Richard 5 years ago

Hi. You should consider that notwithstanding the restoration of Temples and temple work through Joseph, the Gentiles have still polluted the holy church of God-- including the Temples-- just as the Book of Mormon predicts. (Mormon 8:38) The latter day shift against the Gentiles predicted in 3 Nephi 16:7-13 has not taken place without the Lord revealing His secrets to his servants the prophets.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Richard, I believe that the Lord has established his Priesthood in this last dispensation by way of revelation, and that the priesthood of God is the same on this side of the veil as it is on the other side of the veil.

Further, Angels were sent to minister that line of authority by the hands of Joseph Smith the prophet and thereby will not undercut that authority by ordaining outside of that line. Thus I believe that Mr. Crossfield whom you quoted is a false prophet as are his constituents who went and formed their own church outside of that line of authority which was originally established by the Lord Jesus Christ by the laying on of hands from our Lord, to Smith, to Young, to Taylor, and every succeeding LDS prophet down to the current President Thomas S. Monson who is God's true prophet in these latter days.

To this day the temple remains to be the holiest place on Earth and no man can get closer to God than by worshiping in this most sacred house that he has established in his restored Church, The church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints.

Richard 5 years ago

Hi Onusonus. Wow, what a quick thoughtful reply. I appreciate your strong convictions. The 2BC forbids setting up another church. Rather, it predicts (2BC 24) that the Lord will cleanse his Gentile church (LDS) in a coming year of cleansing. Do you have any evidence that the gift of D&C type revelation has been amoung LDS leadership in the last 120 years? (I have the evidence that the first four LDS prophets had this gift.) I remain convinced that Priesthood Authority must have Word of the Lord revelation at its head, and I cannot honestly reject the 2BC revelations. Here are some of my thoughts:

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Well again Richard, It is a somewhat interesting topic and I don't wish to invalidate your beliefs. I've never heard of this sect of Mormonism until now, but my beliefs remain rooted in my religion.

I believe that this is the problem that occurred with the ancient church when the priesthood was lost shortly after the apostles were all crucified. The people went on claiming priesthood authority when they didn't have it, and later people like Martin Luther John Calvin, and other reformers made their own churches claiming that they possessed the same authority from the very church they had rejected.

It hardly makes sense in my mind to say that you can retain the priesthood from a church which you have been excommunicated from. It is also inconsistent with the revelation given in the doctrine and covenants which specifically states that that authority will never be taken from the Earth again.

Now clearly in the excerpt you provided Mr. Crossfield was teaching that the LDS apostles and prophets were becoming apostate, and that he himself had received revelation for the people of the church when he did not possess the proper priesthood keys through the ordinance as pertained in the gospel.

Again I am not being judgmental, rather It is my understanding that the gift of prophecy, seership, and revelation comes through certain channels, and revelation from God to the church on the whole will only be provided to his authorized servants. I believe it is this way now and has been from the beginning of creation.

passingtheword 5 years ago

hey everyone study the Freemason's temple ritual and you will see that it is almost identical to The lds temple rituals. Joseph Smith was a Freemason at one time and he just copied a few things he went through.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Actually it's not identical, but so what?

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Passing the word, My religion is not a cult. It is the restored gospel of Jesus Christ.

Doug H 5 years ago

It saddens me that there is so much nitpicking on the LDS faith. We believe in being a law abiding society, patriotic, being good neighbors, allowing everyone the privilege to seek and believe in God as they will.

We have standards we believe to be true doctrine from our Father in Heaven. Just because we believe in living prophets and priesthood government does not make us wrong or a bad people. Have you ever wondered why we believe in an eternal marriage when there are others who say "until death do you part"? That is a major difference in how LDS people look at their faith and their futures.

We welcome anyone who may be curious about us. Since childhood (long before I converted to the LDS faith), I always believed that marriage had to be more than until death do you part. I couldn't see myself spending eternity in a crowd only singing and praising . . . there had to be more.

I know Jesus Christ died for me and for all mankind. I know God lives and Jesus is the Christ, and that the Holy Ghost is a companion that can only testify of the truth.

Just dying -- believing that faith is the only requirement to reach Heaven -- will get you through the door; but, haven't you ever asked yourself "Is this it?" or "Is this just the beginning?"

I have total faith that God wants the share all He has with each of us. We believe that receiving those gifts comes with obedience to sacred, eternal laws and covenants that the family of man must be willing to accept and enter.

The mission of the LDS church is three-fold: 1) Proclaim the Gospel of Jesus Christ (Oh,yes! We believe in Jesus Christ.); 2) Perfect the Saints (the living); and 3) Redeem the dead.

I revere the temple very much: first, for my living family and me; and, second, for family members that have passed on. If there are families who submit the names and information on their dead for temple work, we do that work on their behalf of those who are not able to come to the temple on their own. Temple work is sacred, not secret.

If Jesus had not come to set the stage for man's entry into eternity, what would be the point of this life? I believe this earthly life is a preparation for what is to come. It is my hope that many of us will be willing to submit ourselves to the will of the Father. I also believe that we must remember that man is not in charge of God. I also believe that it is far better to better govern ourselves so that we may truly be worthy to be governed by God.

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Onusonus 5 years ago from washington Author

Doug, thanks for sharing. My original intent for this article was to simply share my beliefs with others. unfortunately you are always going to get some opposition from some people. It is how we interact with those people which defines our character, and that says a lot about our beliefs.

Doug H 5 years ago

Thank you, Onusonus.

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Penelope and Sara 4 years ago

Excellent Hub Onusonus. And excellent answers and interaction in the comments section as well. It is no small thing to be able to remain calm and civil when something you believe in very strongly and assert as holy is demeaned. That's a good skill to have no matter what religion a person belongs to.

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Rodric29 3 years ago from Phoenix, Arizona

Wow! The comments here were so juicy. Richard's view is different. It is not correct, but very interesting assertion as you stated Onus.

There is countless proofs of God's gifts remaining with the brethren. The church has felt no need to add the revelations they received to scripture is all. When is that a crime?

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Onusonus 3 years ago from washington Author

Thanks for reading Rodric, if you think those comments were juicy you should have seen some of my other hubs on Mormonism. They got nasty, I got nasty, but I'm feeling much better now.

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Rodric29 3 years ago from Phoenix, Arizona

Hey, I already follow your hubs, so you know I am going to come across them eventually if I ever get time to read! I love your explanations so thank you for writing.

I get to see the ugly side of Onus!

I really love the temple and I love the comparison of the clothing. I was imagining it in my head. I think those of us who have been to the temple with understanding and faith and revelation appreciate the significance of the clothing. It set a more rooted tone in my mind for the continuity of the ceremonies in the temples.

I also love the fact that the ceremonies change as the people change so that God can effectively guide us to exaltation.

It is really interesting to see how things will change as the church reaches out to more cultures and has to deal with the degradation of society at a close and personal manner now that it is permanently out of the Utah Valley and into the world or sorts. My wife told me there have been changes recently when she went to the temple a few days ago. I have not been in at least three months.

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Onusonus 3 years ago from washington Author

I haven't been there in a few months either, but they were nice enough to ask me to be a veil worker. If they ever ask you to be one I highly recommend doing it.

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