REFUTE of UNIVERSAL SALVATION – Answer to SoM
The reason for yet ANOTHER hub refuting Universal salvation is due to the FACT they leave hub-length comments that simply cannot be answered in a paragraph or two. Following is a comment left by SoM on my hub called “The Location of HELL” and below his comment is my response. Now, I’m not going to type out every scripture I reference here, so I highly recommend SoM and readers PICK UP A BIBLE and read the passages. I am fully accountable to the Word and I trust you will read it, also.
I am SoM.
Ps 111:10 (NEB) The fear of the Lord (says nothing about fear of eternal torture) is the beginning of wisdom, and they who live by it grow in understanding...(brackets are mine)
We are now in the times of the new covenant sister, not the old covenant. But here is a verse for you.
1John 4:18 There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
But if you like to do quote or word search in scripture, maybe you can tell me on what scriptural authority is the Greek word Gehenna, literally ‘the valley of the sons of Hinnom’ and the city garbage dump in the time of Christ, translated as ‘hell’? While we are at it, find for me the words "free will" as well in its original language. I also noticed your use of censorship on my comment to another brethren regarding your molech mentality. Such fear to block something so blunt and obvious is not new to me among you determined hell believers. Let us compare our image of God. Your image of God is a loving God, but if you do not except His son as your saviour, then you will have to go to hell forever. If you do not worship God when you except His Son, you will go to hell forever (Dan 3:1-6). Your view of God and salvation is either He can save all, but wont, or He wants to save all, but cant. He is dependent on our free will to save us, or Christ needs our permission to give us the free gift of grace with no strings attached. Man's will is sovereign over God's will (1Tim 2:3-4). He commands us to love, bless and forgive our enemies unconditionally, but is incapable of doing the same to His. Your view of God's punishment is vindictive instead of corrective. God did not send His Son to be the saviour of the world, because He is the saviour of only some. According to your belief of eternal torture, the devil is stronger than God. It is written that God made man in His image, sadly, Christians like yourself have repaid the Father by doing the exact same thing to Him. Your view of "the good news" is really not good news at all. Do you still seek hope?
My image of God is Christ as He walked in the flesh. Christ loved even those He rebuked, and He forgave those who did not ask for forgiveness just as the Father did in the prodigal son parable. He is true to His promise to Abraham and has blessed all nations. He not only conquered death, He destroyed it. God truly is the saviour of all and especially the believers (1Tim 4:9-11) and I command and teach this, you don't. He felt sorrow for His Jewish brothers that He knew would fall A.D.70. He rebuked His disciples who wanted to bring fire down on the Samaritans (Luke 9:54-56), because He did not come to destroy life, but to save it. My God is absolute love, mercy, and forgiveness. He is a Father of all (Eph 4:6) and will reconcile all to Him through His Son. It is written that God made man in His image, sadly, I cannot even begin to imagine how I can be as good as Him. My view of "the good news" is the greatest news of all times. Hope has been made for me and all mankind.
CARRIE's Answer to SoM
SoM, What you’re missing in Ps 111:10 is ‘they who live by it [the fear of the LORD] grow in understanding’ The New Covenant is yet the same Covenant as the Old; just the requirements have changed. The Old was based on keeping the Law, the New based on faith in Christ Jesus, as Abraham had, long before the Law, for Jesus Christ forever accomplished all the Law (Heb 7:28), nailing it to the cross (Col 2:14).
Regarding 1 John 4:18: Clarke's Commentary on the Bible
“The man who feels that he loves God with all his heart can never dread Him as his Judge. As he is now made a partaker of His Spirit, and carries a sense of the Divine approbation in his conscience, he has nothing of that fear that produces terror or brings torment. The perfect love - that fullness of love, which he has received, casteth out fear - removes all terror relative to this day of judgment, for it is of this that the apostle particularly speaks.” See clearly that there ARE conditions to abiding in God’s perfect, agape love.
You can find all the passages regarding Gehenna here: Mt 5:22 & 5:29, 10:28, 18:9, 23:15 and 23:33; M'r 9:43, 9:45 and 9:47; Lu 12:5; Jas 3:6. Lake of Fire: Mat 25:41; Rev 19:20; 20:10, 14-15 and 21:8.
I do not teach ‘free will’, but ‘free choice’. God cannot work in us to will (Phil 2:13) unless we have His Spirit IN us (Rom 8:9). So, you are a Universalist Preterist…Let’s look at a couple of passages regarding ‘free choice’:
Rom 6:16 “Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?”
Deut 30:19 “I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants.”
Ez 18:31-32 “Cast away from you all your transgressions which you have committed and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit! For why will you die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies,’ declares the Lord GOD. ‘Therefore, repent and live."
Josh 24:15 “If it is disagreeable in your sight to serve the LORD, choose for yourselves today whom you will serve: whether the gods which your fathers served which were beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you are living; but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD."
Regarding Molech, I answered you in another comment on that hub: “God is not into child sacrifice, that's why people need to 'understand' that God shed His OWN blood for us (Acts 20:28).” I have a hub on THIS subject as well called “With His OWN Blood” . If I ever censor your postings, that is my right here on HubPages. It is NOT due to “Such fear to block something so blunt and obvious is not new to me among you determined hell believers” That’s your depraved ego talking.
You can’t have the Father without the Son, nor can you have the Son without the Father. Anyone who knows the Word of God accepts this Truth. 1 John 2:23 “Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.” Why? Because He is the SAME God.
1 Tim 4:10 tells us (NLT) “This is why we work hard and continue to struggle, for our hope is in the living God, who is the Savior of all people and particularly of all believers.” Jesus died for ALL, but not ALL will be saved. Did God not love His enemies by dying on the cross for them, so they could CHOOSE His gift of salvation? Absolutely. Satan is not more powerful than God; for this reason He is condemned and knows it (Rev 12:13; 20:10). Even the demons know they have an ‘appointed time’ for the judgment to TORMENT (Mat 8:29).
Speaking of MANY or ALL in regard to the Savior’s sacrifice, Jesus said in Mat 20:28 “the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many." He laid down His life for ‘the sheep’ (John 10:11) and not all are sheep (Mat 25:32). He laid down His life for His friends (John 15:13), and not all are His friends (Jam 4:4). Abraham, because of His FAITH was called ‘the friend of God’ (Isa 41:8; Jam 2:23). That’s how you know the difference. He obeyed the voice of the LORD (Gen 22:18). By man’s own choosing they nullify His grace (Gal 2:21).
Jesus talked more about hell than He did heaven. People that were forgiven in the Scriptures had faith. Mark 2:5, for instance, tells us “When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, ‘Son, your sins are forgiven." People who were healed had faith (Mat 9:22 and many others). I’m not going to spoon-feed you; you will have to study for yourself. The Prodigal Son Parable is about the ‘sons of God [the Father]’, and as I have clarified in a previous comment to you, not all are sons of God John 8:44; Mat 13:38; Acts 13:10; 1 John 3:10).. He has blessed Abraham’s offspring, not ALL nations (Gal 3:29; Rom 11).
Let’s read John 3:17 and the NEXT VERSE, too: “For God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. He who believes in Him is not condemned; he who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.” Just as Satan and his angels and demons are already condemned, so are they that choose to reject Christ, making them sons of the Devil. They have an appointed time for condemnation, and that IS the TRUTH.
More by this Author
God has burdened me with the L. Ray Smith followers, and if I be called to somehow share the truth with them, I praise God with all my heart. I beseech born-again, Spirit-filled believers to shew these that THEY...
Many today profess to be “Christians”. How can all these people be Christians when there are some very marked and serious differences in their foundational beliefs? The most critical difference is the...