The Age Old Question: Why Does A Loving God Allow Pain And Suffering?

(This is part 1 of 2 in series)

I believe there isn't a person alive that hasn't wondered why a God who reveals so marvelously that He is Love, seems at times to look the other way when His children or creatures are in pain and are suffering. It would seem to give validation to the atheist that begins arguments with, "If God exists why..." It always seems pain would add to the burden of the downtrodden and to discourage the strong. Doesn't God care? And if He cares, why do His creatures suffer so much?

"He who does not love does not know God, for God is love." (1 John 4:8)

To give grounds and premise to our "verbal adversaries" is the last thing Christians want. So how do we respond to the above question?

1. Pain Causes One To Call On The Lord.

We know that Satan is in charge in this world and sin is universal, present in every person. And we know that God is able to turn off the pain and suffering should He see fit. But the world needs pain. That's what I said, the world needs pain. Now, I know that seems to be the statement of a lunatic, but I'm serious. We sinful humans need a focus, something to get our minds off what we are doing, or thinking, or how we are living, and onto something much more important. But then the argument is: "What could be more important than our comfort, our peace of mind? When we are suffering, doesn't that distract from what is important? Just what is more important anyway than quality of life and ending of suffering?"

"You are of God, little children, and have overcome them, because He that is in you is greater than he that is in the world." (1 John 4:4)

"These things have I spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world." (John 16:33)

The important thing for the world to know is that this is only the beginning. There is an eternity beyond this life and where they spend that eternity far outweighs any pain or suffering of this life. The world needs pain to cause them to look for God. Suffering eliminates things from one's focus. Everything boils down to only a few things or even only one thing. The pain and suffering then causes the person to call on the Lord God of the universe to save them. He is faithful to allow that call to come through. He is faithful to bring into a person's mind that He can solve this for them and that they need Him to do just that. If God allowed no pain into the life of the unsaved of the world then He truly would not care, for Hell is even worse and never ends! All are bound for it and can't stop the inevitability of going there unless God intervenes. The Holy Spirit convicts and calls, and woos and stands with arms wide open. He forms thoughts and offers a solutions to the pain and suffering. He reaches into the minds of each individual to let them know that a Savior who cares is there, if they only would say, "Yes, come in."

Our lives are cluttered with things that all fight for our attention. We need God to allow pain into our lives so that we will stop and remember to call upon Him. I can share with you that I fight panic when trouble looms on the horizon. I am usually quick to call on the Lord and turn to His word to give me strength. I really wish God didn't have to allow those times of angst, but I realize that He does. It reminds me that I need to draw each breath, do each deed, and think each thought for His glory. I am quite sure that if those times did not enter my life, I would not turn to God as often as I do.

2. Pain Is Given To Chastise.

When I was a youngster there was a time or two that I got my bottom whacked. In hindsight, I don't remember those times as proving my parents didn't love me, but to the contrary, that they did love me. I remember trying not to cry and feeling as if I would die as I was being disciplined. Painful, are the lessons we learn as we grow. It even seems grievous while we live through the classroom of life, but it's for our own good. Be careful not to despise the chastisement of the Lord. In fact, God's correction proves He loves us for we are His children.

"Harsh discipline is for him who forsakes the way, and he who hates correction will die." (Proverbs 15:10)

"And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as sons: "My son do not despise the chastening of the Lord, nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him; for whom the Lord loves He chastens, and scourges every son whom He receives." (Hebrews 12:5-8)

3. Pain Nurtures Character.

Under the artisan's hand, clay is formed into the shape he desires. In like manner, God forms us into the image of His Son. He builds in us qualities that will display the supernatural fruit of His Spirit. As our character changes, we enjoy a closer fellowship with God. We are not "more saved," but our lives are more acceptable in His sight. We are urged not to conform to the world but to be transformed (changed) by God's Spirit. Pain is one vehicle that God uses to do just that.

"But now, O Lord, you are our Father; we are the clay and You our potter; and all we are the work of Your hand." (Isaiah 64:8)

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love; joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control. Against such things there is no law." (Galatians 5:22)

"For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness, righteousness, and truth, finding out what is acceptable to the Lord." (Ephesians 5:9-10)

"And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God." (Romans 12:2)

4. Pain Teaches Us Who Is In Control.

God created man in His image and gave him the ability to do many things. He intended man to live in obedience to His word. Sin adds the dimension of rebellion to the mix, which brings about a struggle for control. God uses pain to bring about a humbling of the human spirit before Him. This is completely necessary to our growth, for without trouble and pain, man would not see the power of God work in their individual lives. A good example of this is Israel when Moses said to "stand still" and see the power of God.

"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God he created him; male and female He created them." (Galatians 1:27)

"And Moses said to the people, "Do not be afraid. Stand still, and see the salvation of the Lord, which He will accomplish for you today." (Exodus 14:13)

Things To Remember About Pain

1. We Must Learn To Be Thankful For Pain.

Pain is trying to show you that God loves you and that He is alive. Pain works out to the glory of God. Each time that we thank God for everything, our treasure builds in heaven. Remember, you are in the amphitheater of the eternities. There are those watching us from heaven. There are those that watch us here on earth. We display God to them. Angels rejoice when we obey and demons get angry. What happens when we are weak and unthankful for what God is doing in our life? Don't you want to please God? and considering how Satan hurts all of us, don't you want to tweak him a little (or even a whole bunch) by magnifying the name of his enemy, Jesus?

"For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Walk as children of light." (Ephesians 5:8)

"In everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you." (1 Thessalonians 5:18)

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

"Therefore we also, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which so easily ensnares us, and let us run with endurance the race which is set before us." (Hebrews 12:1)

2. We Can Let Pain Teach Us To Avoid Pain In The Future.

Pain is a great schoolmaster. God has promised that He will not allow you to go through pain alone. He promised to hold you up and get you through it. You will be able to bear up with His strength. Things that "cost" us emotionally are more easily remembered. God does not want us to hurt any more than is necessary for our character to be matured. If that was not so, life would be just so much torture. But God is in control and in control of all we experience. Learn from each pain and let it become a part of you. Learn and let the time spent in pain teach you. If you think about it, pain can school you to avoid pain in the future.

"No temptation [in this case temptation causing pain] has overtaken you except such as common to man; but God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will also make the way of escape, that you may be able to bear it [If you escape the temptation you escape the pain associated with the consequences of the sin]." (1 Corinthians 10:13)

3. We Can Let Pain Teach Us How To Help Others In Pain.

We must also be mindful that we are not here to sit idly by while others suffer at Satan's hand and not help them. People need encouragement, edification, and the benefit of your experience, to grow and be spared suffering that could possibly be shortened or avoided. You are the way that God has provided for many people to escape needless pain because you have been through the same pain yourself. In this way, God can use your knowledge taught by the pain you've suffered to help others. Have you ever thought that the reason you are going through a particular trial is to spare another from suffering? or perhaps to strengthen him to endure what he is going through?

4. We Can Use Pain As An Opportunity To Witness.

Of course, the greatest need people have is to be spared from is the inevitability of hell for those that are lost that surround us. Your pain can open up opportunities to witness to others around you. They see your courage in the face of a trial or in sickness or tragedy. They see you glorifying God and see it as genuine. Perhaps it is the Spirit using you to lead others to Christ. So don't be so hasty to despise the life you live just because you have pain in it.

So, dear reader, if you live with pain, what is God saying by not removing it immediately from your life? If you never have reached out to God, that's the first thing that you need to consider to do to make your pain make sense. God is saying that sin in the world has caused all of this pain and suffering and He came to suffer more than any man to pay for that sin. He was nailed to a cross after being beaten with a cat-o-nine-tails. He see-sawed up and down on that cross for hours just to breathe and knowing He was bleeding to death and could have gotten Himself down, He remained on that cross for you. The pain, doctors say was more excruciating than any other ever devised. Not only that but he also bore in His body the sin of every man, woman, and child ever born and God punished that sin with that same crucifixion. That's the evidence that he suffered more than any man, even other men who were crucified. His pain was multiplied because of the punishment He suffered for everyone. He did this for you and to make sure that you have an eternity with Him and not be separated from Him forever in a place with even more suffering than can be explained. Reach out to Him and turn to Him. Pray this:

Dear Lord Jesus: I am in pain. I have lived a life where I have hurt and I hurt even now. I don't want to live this life with its pain and then have to pay for my sin for all eternity too. Please Lord, forgive me of my sin and save me. I believe that You came to earth and suffered more than I can understand for me. You died and they buried You and in three days You rose from the dead. I believe it. I turn to You from my life that I've been living without You and turn to You because You are the only Way of salvation. Thank You for saving me. I pray this in Jesus' holy name, Amen.

Part 2 of series.

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Comments 45 comments

quietnessandtrust profile image

quietnessandtrust 6 years ago from Carbon Canyon, California

Interesting that God said to Eve

"I will greatly increase your pain in child birth"

Pain must have already been part of the plan. Temptation was too.

Sin was always knocking at the door and we were suppose to resist it from the beginning and we were to rule and reign and subdue the earth.

Good hub man.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Thank you. Pain is such a many opinioned subject and the book seems to be so narrow on what to do about it. It always seems to draw a lot of "but I thinks" We'll see what happens with this one. Many Blessings to you.


DeBorrah K. Ogans profile image

DeBorrah K. Ogans 6 years ago

No body,

God wants us to have Hearts that are loyal to Him. Pain and suffering are a process in which we learn to TRUST God! We are also able to develop thick skin that keeps our soft heart protected! You are right "Pain nurtures character!"

Jesus who was sinless suffered for us! So in order to become Christlike we must also suffer, pain also embeds within us a deep inner strength amd compassion. "The just shall live by faith!" FAITH puts us at ease as PATIENCE comes to our rescue! And yes, "It helps us to Call on the LORD!"

Thank you Brother this really makes one think?

Blessings


quietnessandtrust profile image

quietnessandtrust 6 years ago from Carbon Canyon, California

It is written that Messiah learned obedience through the things HE suffered.

That is a staggering thought to contemplate!!!

HE was never disobedient as HE was learning though. So 3 things appear to me here.

1) HE learned.

2) HE learned it through suffering.

3) We must do the same.

Suffering is the only was to give birth to something great!!!


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Hi Deb thanks for the validation. I appreciate your comment and support. I have wondered about pain and knew that as I grew older somehow the nature of the pain changed. I realized that Jesus was allowing those things through that were building character in my life. Love you DeB. You are a wonderful sister.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

I agree with you. I was a Trekkie and I remember one of the Bad movies with Captain Kirk. It was the one where Spock's emotional brother was offering to take away all of Kirk's painful memories. The things that haunted him. I don't know who wrote the dialogue but one line stays in my mind. Kirk said "I need my pain. It makes me who I am." I know the Lord uses pain to form who we are and forms our usefulness to Him. Thank you for stopping by. Blessings.


coffeesnob 6 years ago

NB

Every one says I am quite the character (LOL) - guess that is all that pain that has shaped me. Kidding aside - I have experienced a lot -some self inflicted, but - mostly by other people, events etc. But I know that there are others who have seen and suffered worse. I think of Hebrews 11 -that great hall of faith and know that we may never see a reward for the faithwalk we have and rather may see suffering (at least in the world) and I know so many brothers and sisters in Christ die daily for their faith - when I think of that my pain is minimal. I agree that pain nurtures character if we let it. My mother lives in constant pain and she just presses on in her faith and trusts God - funny thing though is she only became close to God after the death of my father. The pain of that event brought her closer to the Lord and brought a spiritual connection between the 2 of us. Anyway -sorry for the essay - I can just so relate -love you brother


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Hi CS I love you too sister. I understand and I love the essays. I learn more about my friend and you get to share a testimony with the world. God will use it to His glory. One thing about God, He is a debtor to no man. When He allows pain that we are to go through, there is a reward in character and treasures in heaven. He absolutely loves to thwart Satan's plan of total ruin by not only working out for some other unbeliever's salvation but also making the person that went through it stronger against Satan's plans. I love it when a plan comes together. Essay me anytime. Hugs for you and your family.


Lisa 6 years ago

I'd like to know why God allows children to be tortured at the hands of adults... say, any kind of assault including sexual. I keep thinking of the story of two children, a boy and a girl both under the age of 13, who were abducted by an adult from their yard. The man sexually assaulted the children for several days or weeks, and then he murdered the boy in front of his older sister. This story really bothers me, and there are countless others than horrify me as well. Children who suffer at the hands of family, friends or strangers... Why does God allow this?

I'm not asking to challenge... I really would like to hear some thoughtful answers. I'm trying to know and understand God. Thank you.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

I may have to write another hub about this. I prayed very hard about how to answer you, Lisa. I know how very many times I've seen the injustice done by one individual to another and it is hard to see or hard to hear about. When it is done to a child who can't defend himself then it is even worse. I get indignant and have to remind myself of the Scriptures and that I know that God is faithful to them. Sin has wrought a mark on humanity and Jesus took all of this crud upon Himself for us. I believe that no one could ever imagine the wrath that came down upon the Son as He took the punishment for all of this hiddeousness that we see. We know that God hates it when things are done to a child.

"But whoever causes one of these little ones that believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around His neck, and he were drowned in the depths of the sea." Matt. 18:6

This is one way that the devil knows he can hurt an omnipotent God. To hurt children.

"When my father and mother forsake me, then the Lord will take care of me." Ps. 27:10

"For in the time of trouble He shall hide me in His pavilion; in the secret place of His tabernacle He shall hide me; He shall set me high upon a rock." Ps. 27:5

I believe this Scripture to apply to a child who is harmed. God loves them and at the time that their body is damaged or their mind is hurt in any way, God hides them in His pavilion and they don't feel what is happening and very often forget all of the trauma. Those that remember can overcome the hurt with the Lord and it then will be part of the child's strength. God is faithful to children and even though it seems that He has left them, He has not. Those children who lose their lives are present with the Lord, in His care and love, healed from all the trauma. Lisa, I know that this is a hard topic. I can see you are a woman of compassion and it hurts your heart to even think of such things. Believe in God. He takes care even when it isn't apperent to us. I hope this helps a little. I will set to work to write that hub. Much love. No body.


Lisa 6 years ago

Thanks for your very thoughtful answer! I suppose I could do more to work on this problem myself, by volunteering to help children in need. If I could even help one kiddo... I look forward to reading your new hub on the issue!


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Thank you for commenting again. I was afraid (everyone must know now that I am vulnerable to the fear demon every so often) that you needed more and I was not going to be able to give it. It is one of those prices humanity has paid for sin that the depravity is so deep and so evil. When the devil holds sway in the tribulation and the Holy Spirit does not intervene but lets him have his way, that will be so bad. I'm glad that the church is gone by then and I don't have to see it. Lisa, I will pray for you every time the Lord lays you on my heart. I promise. I know that you will do good to the children you serve. Just remind yourself that as much as you love them, God loves them more and wants the best for them. With much love no body.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago

This is a fantastic Hub. I can see that you are willing to tackle the most difficult subjects. You are one of the best Christian writers on HubPages and I am thankful you are here.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Thank you Jim. I don't know what to say other than God is good and faithful to me, even when I'm not faithful to Him. I am trying to write another on pain and it is even harder. The problem is that we are so accustomed to thinking no pain should be in our life at all. I have to tell the objective, bigger picture without sounding as if I don't care, because I do. This is especially true when it comes to the pain of children. So pray for me. I know I see things like the apostle John, through the prism of love but sometimes it's hard to explain how love exists alongside the hard effects of the fall of man, you know? Sin has caused so much damage and I don't want to stumble younger Christians either. So I thank you for loving me and covet your prayers. You are a good brother.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago

I am praying for you.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Thank you Jim. It is as hard as I thought it would be. I come away from reading my own hub thinking that there is nothing I can say to minimize the pain that these people feel that have lost some innocent or that is confused over others that are going through such heartache. Sure they will know why it is here but how do you minister to the feelings that make them want to die? Like I said to Miss Lisa, God is in control but it is a hard sell because looking at it with human eyes it doesn't seem so. The ones with great faith are able to put the pain somewhere but these others who don't understand will still be hurting. Thank you for the prayer Jim. It should be done later today to publish. Love you buddy.


spiderpam profile image

spiderpam 6 years ago from USA

Amen! You have beauitful way of expressing God's love.


JimLow 6 years ago

Pam,

I actually got to squeeze in some time off my job to check the site & found this new, wonderful Hub of yours. I absolutely agree. I also see in God's Word where pain & suffering are a part of what was caused by man's fall. At the same time God works all things together for those who love him and are called for his purpose.

I'm a big guy and always hard working, love sports and outdoors things and then in 2003 I developed autoimmune thyroid disease, with co-morbid Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. The Lord actually dropped a word into me about this before it happended. I know for a fact that God has purpose in this and though some of this I keep close to my heart as personal, it has helped me relate better to others going through similar illnesses and provided me a ministery for that.

It also brings to mind the great Apostle Paul's "thorn in the flesh" (some type of physical ailment) that he sought God 3-times to remove from him but that God reminded made his strength through Paul perfect because of the physical weakness. The scripture also indicates that because of so much divine revelation Paul had received, God knew Paul's heart and that he might have tendency to become self-exhalted due to it. The thorn in his flesh was a humbling experience. He may very well have had it removed by God as some point but God knew the timing if that was so.

Some in the faith-movement claim it was not God's will for Paul to carry the thorn but the scriptures state otherwise and very clearly that it did indeed have a purpose.

Didn't mean to post so long. Your Hub has made my day!


JimLow 6 years ago

Whoops! don't ask me why I addressed you as Pam, I knew it was you no body but looking through the comments I got sidetracked! That's what I get for posting on the run!

"no body" I meant to give you credit and noticed I mistated when I came back to read the Hub again. Sorry about that!


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Hi Pammy, pain and suffering is a hard topic because no one wants to hurt or see anyone else hurt. The first thing people think is "I don't deserve this." It's hard the tell them that there is good that comes of it. Love you.


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Hey Jim. You made my day as well. I love it when the word touches folks when I spend so much time writing it and trying not to sin so that that Lord talks through me. I'm touched by your ailment but encouraged by your great attitude. You will have fruit because of it. Many Blessings.


Kim Garcia 6 years ago

Wow!! Great Hub! Fantastic and a very difficult message to convey. The book of Job was and still is one of the hardest books for me to read. The age old question; "Why does pain happen to good people, Godly people?" And the answer has stumped me for years as I watched my grandmother suffer, who was a saint in my eyes. She believed until her last breath, till her dying day the God was going to heal her. But he never did. I know this will be one of my first questions I ask Jesus when I see Him face to face. I realize to experience pain and suffering is possibly the only way we can have compassion for others. It's a hard lesson, but God chastises those He loves, and I thank Him for it. Many Blessings to you!! ~K


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

I understand the "first question asked" statement. I think we all have them. The fact is- that God's will is not our will many times. We do not live unto ourselves. We, in fact, effect all those we come into contact with. I would say that your Gramma's ministry partly WAS her sickness. I know that sounds a little crazy or a lot crazy. She obviously had faith in God and assumed His will was that she be healed in this world. God's will was that she be healed in the next. Her MINISTRY was DEALING with the sickness in THIS world. All those around her were changed by her experience. In that change, for the good or bad, God was able to do things that He would not have accomplished without that cross she was bearing in her life. Our God never left her to suffer alone. He was with her the whole way. He asked her to bear a situation that many others could not have borne and what you will find out when you ask Him why, is the many, many, Many, MANY in heaven because her testimony affected them and contributed to their getting saved. I'm sorry you had to see the harsh side of the experience, but the sweet side will be to see an eternity of her strength and gratefulness in how God used her for the greatest purpose she could have been called to do. Much love. Bob.


angela_michelle profile image

angela_michelle 6 years ago from United States

Wow, I addressed this same issue, but I think you did a much better job at addressing it. :) Thanks. :)


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

I'll have to read yours. Sometimes the Lord gives us different views of the same thing so I will read yours and see what I can learn. The Lord is a good God. Many Blessings Angela.


angela_michelle profile image

angela_michelle 6 years ago from United States

Wow! Powerful! I actually made a link from my hub to yours. Excellent information. Very Godly, good use of verses. Just great and very insightful!


no body profile image

no body 6 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Praise God Michelle. You never know how these verses are going to help people. If they spoke to your spirit to answer some questions, then they may speak to others in the same way. Thank you for being there and giving that help to others. Much love, Bob.


Justcallmeleroy 5 years ago

Hello no body, My Brother reading though this hub and reading the comments is special to me. I have never written about my pain I know some would like it. About 12 to 13 years ago I had emergency Open Heart Surgery they had tried to balloon an artery and it tore open the artery and the Dr. said I had one hour to be in Open Heart Surgery he wanted to call my family in so I could say good bye. I told Him no that I knew the Lord was with me. Now I have lived since then with Angina sometimes worst then others but it is always with me. I thank God everyday for that day. I try to Praise Him always for He is so good to me. I have learned to depend upon Him for my Life. Some times I am thankful for each moment. For when I am weak He is Strong. Yes Pain is good even when it is pain you know could bring about your last breath. But He is Faithful and True His Tender Mercies are with me always. I have been brought down low and have been humbled. But I Glory in all to my Jesus I know he is with me and I am thankful for all. God Bless


no body profile image

no body 5 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Wow, so encouraging. My pastor has a saying and that is: "A Christian has opportunities, so don't waste a good cancer. Don't waste a good heart attack." God is loving and everything we go through for Him is worth it because He is omniscient and knows how to reach those around us. The angels would love to live the lives we live (minus the sin of course) and to be able to effect the souls of men for eternity. We have such an opportunity and once this life and time is over we will never be able to please our master like this again. Your heart attack had an effect on the nurses the doctor, your family and children. On you to make you more Christlike. So many positives and just a few things to endure. But very much worth it. Love ya buddy and thanks for sharing.


alvin 5 years ago

2 options here:

1. Your God is not loving, he's crude.

2. Your God does not exist.

As pain exists, one of those theories MUST apply, no excuses like "there needs to be pain" or such. If you combine loving god + pain, it doesn't work, can't be loving and at the same time allow pain. (Yes, your god is omnipotent)


no body profile image

no body 5 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Well Alvin, seems you have not even given the Bible a chance at all. The premise you share comes with a preconceived idea that does not include sin, God's holiness, our responsibility, a devil or demons, anything that the Book reveals to us to explain how we got here. If you had considered any of these things, you would have seen that sin has devastated mankind. God created man with the ability to choose right or wrong, life or death. I don't think you've considered the mercy at play here, for if we got what we deserved, everyone would have been wiped off the face of the planet and He would have started all over again. But He didn't because He loves us even in our sin. What would you say God should have done? create us with no choice just to obey? Or should He not have sovereignty and allow anyone to supplant His rule. No. God is sovereign. He is holy. He is merciful and our sin's consequences are held at bay so that we can benefit from the pain's instruction. There is someone who keeps tabs and knows our sorrows. He lived on this earth too and was killed in it. He was called a "bastard" and rejected of men. He was tortured in a way that we can not immagine. Crucifixion was and is the worst possible way to die. When on the cross He accepted no pain killer (gall) He bled droplets of blood (hemotidrosis) that made the pain even greater. He lost all of His blood for you and me to pay for our sin and you say He is cruel or does not even exist. Whether you call Him my God or your God, He is God. We all will meet Him one day and will answer for our sin. Either it will be paid for by His Son or He will know that His Son's gift of life was rejected. But either way He is is God.


drpastorcarlotta profile image

drpastorcarlotta 5 years ago from BREAKOUT MINISTRIES, INC. KC

Wonderfully written! Praise God!!! Voted-Awesome!!


no body profile image

no body 5 years ago from Rochester, New York Author

Lottie, you are a faithful sister. I love you lady and pray for your ministry all the time. Satan loves this world of pain that he helped to create. He can frighten us with it and use it to torture our minds. He can use it as a premise for those who don't believe so that they have a harder time to believe. All we can do is explain that God is the whole story and He is the answer to all this. All we can do is stick to our guns and keep offering the same answer to them.


Oztinato profile image

Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

If an atheist person blames God for suffering they are still admitting He exists.

I call this the "blame God paradox".


no body profile image

no body 22 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

Good point Ozinato. Most atheists are careful how they complain against God though. They usually say, "IF a God exists... then He is a cruel being." But they DO blame God in one breath and deny Him in the next. I think atheism is a hard way to reason because all people know intuitively that God exists. I believe they have to check their thinking and cancel out God every time. Thank you for stopping by and for your insightful comment. Bob.


Oztinato profile image

Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

No body

you also might be interested to know that even Richard Dawkins believes we are hardwired to believe in God: so its a hard thing to try to suddenly ditch.

Philosophically even if we say "IF God exists..." we have to admit the possibility first to proceed.


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no body 22 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

Yes, that is interesting. Oh the problems of debate and rationale... I think a person has to learn to speak atheist lingo so he or she will not stumble into a verbal trap of his/her own words. I also think it is so funny for people to believe that nature "has designed" laws but still denies any intelligent force behind those laws. Thanks again Ozinato. Bob.


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Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

Bob

I agree. A massive explosion that leads to infinite perfection?

I do respect ethical atheism which practices compassion. It needs to be related to the evolution of ethics and law which evolved from religion. By totally denying this evolution an atheist could be seen as unscientific.


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no body 22 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

I don't think I ever read up on "ethical atheism." Might be interesting.


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Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

I am promoting the concept of ethical atheism even though I believe in God. By putting it out there in the collective conscious it may have an effect.

Once a person loses their compassion things like Infanticide become entirely acceptable. Of course it is just as easy for a religious hypocrite to lose their compassion as we are seeing with ISIL. The difference is that other Muslims are fighting against this whereas many atheists don't bother fighting the trend to lack of compassion.


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no body 22 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

I think that Scripture presses in on me too hard to think that "objectively" about such things as "Muslim's religion loses compassion." I believe that religion and Faith in Christ are two very distinct opposites and most of those premises make one use very broad terms that I feel do not apply. It is very hard for me to remain that detached to Scripture in my reasoning for Scripture negates most of the premises of discussion. Religion is such a general term that anyone that is devoted to anything can be placed under the broad heading of religion. When Jesus pointed out the Pharisee that was religiously praying and loudly placing money in the offering box, Jesus said that that man's behavior was not faith. (but it was religion.) Plus Atheists would never accept that what they do is a religion so you lost all of the contributors to a "rational" discussion. I don't think I would be a good one to bounce ethical atheism off of for conversation sake. hahaha (yet I could be wrong. An article may still be interesting) Bob.


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Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

Any person who loses compassion either theist or atheist is medically diagnosable as sociopathic etc.

Atheism may not be a religion but it needs compassion. Dawkins promotes "empathy" which is just another word for compassion.


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no body 22 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

I think that individuals are the ones that need compassion, regardless of whatever their beliefs. It is harder to do with people that mean harm but we need to show them the love of Jesus, our God.

Atheism itself and its promoters do not deserve compassion because of the Biblical mandate to see them as accursed. I read in the Bible to hate the sin and love the sinner. Any philosophy that denounces and denies the Christ is supposed to be accursed. Anyone that preaches such is to be shunned for teaching the accursed doctrine just the same way. But they still are prayed for and pursued for salvation because we love the sinner and wish them to be in heaven with us. That may make me a sociopath in your opinion but I have to cling to Scripture for my doctrine. Bob.


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Oztinato 22 months ago from Australia

If you hate the sin but not the sinner that does show compassion.

Many atheists hate the believer not the belief. This lacks compassion.

The correct term is enlightened Love. Apparently the idea of Love is now being denigrated. Many atheists now regard love as a chemical reaction.

JC sometimes showed limited clean anger for brief moments. On the other hand having anger 24/7 leads to illness.


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no body 21 months ago from Rochester, New York Author

Love is a chemical reaction? It never ceases to amaze me how stupid smart people can be. They stretch their minds to come up with this stuff and yet the effort is wasted and their conclusion is diametrically opposed to what is right. "Thinking themselves to be wise they became fools." God IS love. A chemical reaction, how laughable. I knew that they had thought along those lines saying that we are but animals reacting with instinct of Almighty Nature the god of accident. But I guess it just struck me a particularly funny today. Sorry I missed your comment until now. It was not on my email feed. Thank you for the comment and the input and the interesting posts as usual. Bob.

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