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Best Answer Pn'N says
PlanksandNails- I totally agree, many many thanks.
Ronald Bachner says
Ronald- Thank you. I believe there is much carnal mindedness by those members of any christian church that holds secerets of their church of any kind.
Eric Dierker says
Eric- Can you give me one good example, where Jesus would expect or accept the idea of keeping , in whole or in part, anything about His church seceret or hidden? Thanks.
Oh most assuredly. The mysteries of Faith, The mysteries of the Trinity. The timing of His return. He is God, I am a man, I do not know all He knows. Perhaps we should take the negativity out of secrets. Because something is a secret is it bad?
Eric- I believe there's a difference between true spiritual mysteries that can be study about through God's word. What I question are the secerets IMPOSED by MEN within the churches to mislead or hide for whatever reason. Thanks again Eric.
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Rod Martin Jr says
celafoe- I agree with you complaetely.
It's go to see you back. Have not seen you in a week or two. Thank you.
yes, we spent a month in USA and so glad to be be back home and relax.
I am sorry you two, but this is just wrong. Do you both think the "priest" confessional should not be privileged in law and canon? Do you both think a man should talk about sex with his wife. What kind of nonsense are you speaking of. Secrets=Privat
Eric- Thank you. We're not talking about personal issues between man and wife or so much what is said between a member and pastor as confession. It's things kept seceret that may relate to daily funtion of a church and kept from members out of fear.
I am sorry I read the "NO" as meaning "NO" secrets. And even secretly praying in a closet is a "church" secret.
whew--- oh ok wow eric i was beginning to wonder about you.
Certainly we speak of church liturgical and congregational secrets and doctrinal secrets if we say no secrets. Otherwise we must insist the church keep secrets. And then we must agree it is only man to man that secrets are kept. So we must agree, yes
Eric- Example. Most man made churches received money from it's members. These churches will then invest much of this money into stocks, bonds, mutual funds for investments. These actions by the churches are kept seceret from church members. Why?
Keeping an investment portfolio private. Hmmm. I think most people do that because it is private not secret. SEC Corps do not even necessarily make that public in particulars. There are good reasons to keep them private. Yes they should.
Eric- I think we have a disconnect here. Example. Let say I go to a"church service" and donate money. The "Church" then take's that money and invest it in a stock, bond or mutual fund to gain more money. Are you saying that's O.K. with you? Thanks.
I went back and read your original post. Yes I think you are taking offense at something that is just plain practical. Of course churches invest in order to have financial security. Making those matters public serves no purpose. Private or Secret?
Eric- I am by no means offended. The whole point behind all of this is that the "Church" ( individual persons) as I understand it to be is in the world, but not "Of The World". I see stock, bonds, and mutual funds as (one small part) of the world.
Eric, then what I hear you saying is that ministry is not to trust God with their future, but to trust in man? So when the market goes bust and they lose millions because they trusted in man it is ok? And meanwhile the work of God is lacking.
Interesting take from both of you. Yes I do believe that it is OK to provide for lease payments, ministers retirement, insurance, Sunday School teachers and child care.
Eric- "Church" as I understand it to be, has none of the things in it that you just described. The Church as I understand it to be is strictly spiritual in nature. I don't mean this to offend you in any way at all. I just see a difference. Thanks
Well what to you call those buildings where people gather to worship Christ?
Eric- Thanks again. I know this may sound odd but I see them as just buildings and nothing more. But most people who gather at a building will call it church. Most building are constructed is such a way to give a sense or appearence of holiness.
eric, where does the scripture provide for "retirement" of a minister of Christ? I understand where the churches of men get it but not men of God.
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JThomps42- There are many christian churches out there that hide there deep doctrine from the public. They will say one thing in public, and to the members of their church say something else and tell them to keep it within their church. Thans you JT.
You are very welcome my friend.
Graceinus, help me out here, I have been around awhile and except for movies I do not know in such occurrences. Please illuminate us. Maybe the Mormons with inner sanctums? Maybe voting for a Pope? You have me intrigued
Eric- Here's one example, research the Pilidelphia Church of God. And then call them and ask if you can attend one of their services. You will get a NO. There is a process one must go through first. Why. They are very seceretive.
Now I get it. In that context, that kind of secrecy is just down right evil and scary. I shutter. I mean it, I have to block them from my mind for I am not strong enough to combat it. Thanks for walking me through this, I have learned a lot.
Eric- I agree with you 1000%.
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