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Rod Martin Jr says
M. T. Dremer says
I kind of agree. A lot of believers see no problem with assuming that atheists hate God or asking if we do, but if you reverse it or bring up the fsm or santa, they get offended at the comparison. Makes no sense to me.
do you think the creators of south park ever dreamed the FSM thing woudl get so big? there is an FSM church and i saw an FSM car decal the other day.
I have an FSM decal actually - and I have a knit FSM that a friend of mine made. I like it because it's cute - and it makes me feel like a part of something that relatively few people (in my area) know about. I'm surrounded by Jesus fish.
they are kinda cool looking actually. that's an interesting comment about feeling like a part of something. do you think that why we are seeing atheist churches poppin up? I read there are a few mega churches in California, I guess joel osteen size?
I think atheists are human beings that enjoy a sense of community in a world where they often feel outnumbered and ostracized. I'm wary of the idea of "church" because it can give the religious credence to their claim that atheism is a religion.
that was actually my thought when i read about the mega churches. seems like it could just be, or at least turn into another religion.
How can a lack of belief with no tenets or dogma be a religion? Is bald a hair color or not playing soccer a sport? Is every group or meeting thereby a religious gathering?
no. but referring to it as a church is a good start to being a religion. also everyone there would have 1 essential belief. the belief that there in fact is not God. this must be a core topic of conversation and/or teaching there.
Calling something a "church" makes something a religion now? Church is term that means many different things. Social gatherings, community. Additionally, most atheists do not say that there are no Gods. You know better than this nonsense.
I thought the FSM was invented by a school teacher who opposed creationism being taught in science classrooms?
you could be right. I first saw it on south park. great show.
just curious, what made you make this statement?
" I'm wary of the idea of "church" because it can give the religious credence to their claim that atheism is a religion"
What I meant to say is that it SEEMS to give credence to the claim, but the claim is absurd. Religions are not based on a lack of something. Bald is not a hair color. Saying atheism is a religion just attempts to level the field by believers
Most 'true believers' don't want to have to think for themselves. In the area of religion it's foreign to them. They are told how to think--thus, the bible quote.
" Bald is not a hair color."
I heard a new one the other day. Atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby. lol u can use that later by the way
MK - already heard that one, sorry :-)
which bible verse?
i was originally agreeing with you, it can be perceived that way. i do think these mega-churches could also turn into an organized religion. already at lest 1 major shared belief, add few rules/regulations.
would you categorize the lack of a belief in a deity as a belief? It is like saying that not collecting butterflies is a hobby. It's a contradiction in terms. How do you define religion?
a set of beliefs held, and practiced by a group of people. i understand atheism is a lack of belief in God. but thats all its a lack of. atheist do hold many views. i could even argue certain sects
So anything that holds a set of beliefs and adheres to them is a religion? The pta? Unions and union workers? Boards of directors? The only thing that all atheists have in common is the fact that they have no belief in a god. It's one thing.
i wouldnt say that. humanist have a set standard of beliefs. so do materialists. i would even call Buddhism an atheistic or non-theistic belief system. thats accepted as a religion. what difference does it make if some atheists did make a religion?
do you call a group of people to get together to talk about how much they hate Magic the Gathering a religion? Not all atheists are humanists, materialists or nihilists. The only thing we agree on is a lack of a belief in a god.
i understand the point youre trying to get across, but i think its apples and oranges. not all christians are baptists, evangelists, or methodists. couldn't you be naming different sects? what is your definition of religion?
a. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
b. A personal or institutionalized system based on such belief or worship. What do atheists believe or worship?
science comes to mind for some. atheists must have beliefs. evolution, aliens, gravity. i have my lack of beliefs as well. the only thing that really separates atheist and theist is a belief or unbelief in a god/gods
You don't have to believe in something that can be proven, and I don't know any atheist skeptics that believe in aliens
alien believers come in all walks of life. i even seen one atheist here on hubpages that believes all kinds of spiritual things, just not God. is it more logical then to believe in something that cant be proven?
JMc, I am going to quote Judge Judy here...
"If something doesn't make sense, it isn't true."
I say that because I believe, as you believe, that the offense taken by simple comparisons is nonsense. Therefore, I surmise that it is pseudo offense.
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Bill Akers says
U seem to b what I feel is a good example of your faith so let me ask, have your experiences w atheists been full of anger and hatred toward you or God? Most, few, none?
Because faith is losing its membership and some people feel threatened by that, like Atheists (or other religions) are trying to destroy them. Then there's the rise of the Muslim boogeyman since 9/11 and everyone is hypersensitive to religion.
Cre8tor, in my conversations with atheists, it totally depends on the subject matter. I have had heated debates about creation and evolution, because both of our opinions rest on what we believe. A majority of conversations are just conversation.
I think b/c you seem 2 b "conversable". Based on my experience, unlike other Christians. I should clarify that I speak of the firm believer. I make a distinction between Christians & "Christians". Anyway, the talk will go as the people in it.
Some of my best friends are Christians. Even though I don't strive to love everyone, I do strive to understand them. I disagree that we should try to love the sociopath. Some people are just broken and fall outside my ability to feel compassion.
Jstfish, I think it's so different today because there is much more access to diversity. Perhaps this misplaced anger everyone has would have been present had the internet been around? I wish it still just "made the world go 'round."
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Beverly Stevens says
There are plenty of things done in the name of religion that I do despise. I don't know the context of the Hitchens quote, so I can't comment on it - but I haven't run across many atheists that display anger at god - possibly his followers, however
listen to his debate with frank turek to get the context. im not really tryin to get in to a who's more moral debate. its easy to find bad behavior in any walk of life. im just pointing out, some atheist are this way, even if U or others U know arent
Sadly bad examples draw good attention thus many assumptions/stereotypes are made. For atheists this is bad because so much is already being assumed about what an atheist is beyond the word itself.
very true. its the bad examples of any religion that make the headlines and/or get on tv. i think the same happens with the non-religions or atheists .the bad examples seem to stand out more and paint the picture.
What have you read by Hitchens? I'd be very surprised to read the quote "I hate him (god)" in anything Hitchens has written. I think you don't know what you are talking about, christiananrkist.
why do all your comments seem so angry? you probably didnt bother reading any of the comments, i dont sometimes either. but listen to his debate with frank turek to see what im talking about. if anything it was a very entertaining debate.
Angry? I laugh when I read your comments. Watched this debate again, and no where did he state "I hate god." Maybe you misunderstood what he said. Is it that you think I'm angry because I take issue with your comment? Or, is it because I'm a woman?
i think your angry because you have hateful and unnecessary things like " I laugh when I read your comments" . You're not the 1st to take issue with my comments. i couldnt also care less if youre a woman. which debate did you watch? they had 3.
I watched the first debate. P. S. I'm not angry at all. I don't even get how you think I'm angry.
ok. i apologize. i guess i can be overly sensitive. i'll look for the other debate i was speaking of. i think i heard it on unbelievable, which you can find on podcast or premier.org.uk. i will look for it on youtube if i can though.
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