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The Kingdom of God is not about who goes to Heaven or Hell

  1. Disappearinghead profile image89
    Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago

    For the very many years I was in Church attendance, the Kingdom of God was always equated with Heaven. It was a future event that only those who believed in Jesus would see either when they died or were raptured, whilst the remainder of humanity would go to hell. A Christian could be disqualified from this future glory if they backslid, turned from the faith, or sinned certain sins.

    But has the Church misunderstood the Kingdom of God?

    The Kingdom of God doesn't get much of any mention in the Hebrew scriptures. At first glance it is Jesus who first talks about it. Throughout the gospels he insists that it is near, at hand, imminent, come upon some of those he spoke to. He certainly never put it off to some future millennial rule event, or something we receive when we die. He said that tax collectors and prostitutes were already entering it. He said that some amongst them would see it with power before they died.

    He said that it was easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for the rich to enter the Kingdom. Does this really mean the rich are going to hell? He said that the least person in the Kingdom was greater than John the Baptiser. Was John outside the kingdom, was he going to hell? He said he spoke in parables to those outside the kingdom. Does that mean the general population was all going to hell? I say no to all of these.

    Paul spoke about inheriting the Kingdom of God. We don't inherit something when we die, we inherit when someone else dies, whilst we are still alive.

    Daniel spoke about the Kingdom of God to Nebuchadnezzar when interpreting his dream. He dreamt of a great statue representing Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome. At the time of Rome, God would set up a new Kingdom that would smash these Earthly kingdoms and last forever. It was built upon a rock cut from the mountain of God, and it would grow until it filled the Earth.

    I put it, taking all of the above, that the Kingdom of God is here now, and has been here for 2000 years. It is something we experience in this life, not when we die. It is not about going to heaven or hell, it is about experiencing the Kingdom of God in us, in you, as you sit there right now. To be outside this Kingdom is to live a life of ordinary humdrum, but never once did Jesus ever suggest that to be outside is to go to some hell.

    Jesus said in Mark 1:15 what the good new is. It is not that we don't have to go to hell as is commonly believed. The good news is that the Kingdom of God is near us.

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image87
      DoubleScorpionposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Something I find interesting, is so many are concerned with trying to get to heaven when the die, that they live in hell while still living.

      1. Disappearinghead profile image89
        Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Something I find interesting too is that Jesus didn't speak about going to Heaven when we die, so much as speaking about this life and how to live it. I think that seeking this Heavenly afterlife experience is seeking the wrong direction, it leads as you suggest to a complete loss of focus in this life.

        1. DoubleScorpion profile image87
          DoubleScorpionposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          smile

        2. tamron profile image63
          tamronposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          You are so right.  People are so focused on avoiding hell and getting to heaven they totally forget their relationship with God/Jesus.

        3. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
          Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Jesus stated He was returning to the One who sent Him and that He was going to prepare a place for Us and It was needful for Him to return Unto the Father and He promised to send another in His place Know as the Comforter Which I believe is Jesus in Spirit the One who resides within all who shall accept repent and Believe in and Upon Jesus as the Christ Emanuel (GOD With Us)

      2. pennyofheaven profile image82
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Interesting indeed!

    2. AshtonFirefly profile image82
      AshtonFireflyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I agree with you totally. Thanks for sharing smile

    3. jonnycomelately profile image84
      jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Many of us will see clearly all the points and directions you are voicing here, DH.  There are also many who are very afraid to think outside of the "square hole" they have dug for themselves in religion.

      I feel it's almost like we have to turn around an "evangelize" them, but I hope it never comes to that.... because there really is room for all our opinions in this world, as long as we respect each other's.  Period!

      1. Disappearinghead profile image89
        Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks Jonny. I hope I don't come over as preachy. The reason I post these things is an attempt to encourage those who have been spoonfed (as I as for 25 years) to look at things differently, to question what they believe to see if it is rational or reasonable. I feel I must also speak out against ideas of Satan, demons, and God sending people to hell. The more I read the bible, look at history, look at Judaism, and think about them, the more silly they become to me.

        1. jonnycomelately profile image84
          jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Fully agreed with all you have said, and please don't think think you come over as "preachy."

          Even though I argue with people who are adamantly, single-minded and not lateral thinking in their  christian zeal, I still reserve a care for people who find their faith and belief a strong support in their lives.   This in many cases is not, for them, a defeatist attitude I think.  It can often be a sort of joy, a celebration of life.

          I have just watched a short news snip about people receiving the "Bionic Cochlear Implant."  The joy and surprise on their faces, and some giving thanks to God, is such a powerful emotion.   I am not free to step in and question their faith.  It does me no harm.. 

          The individuals who pummel us with evangelism here in HubPages are usually here to try and convince others to follow their way.   A very different situation as far as I am concerned.

    4. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
      Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I have wrote My opinion on this; as I believe it is of the Story and the Good Book. Here at Hubpages: http://sinbadsailorman.hubpages.com/hub … Conditions

      Heaven Is and has always been wherever GOD the Father and Creator Is in His full Glory. Hell is a lie of Satan's and now of Mans. It is the separation of Ones self from GOD which is impossible to do. GOD owns All souls even still He owns Satan's. In a way we are in a condition of Hell or Heaven on this earth while in our earthen bodies; which are condemned to die the death of the flesh.

      So far as I can tell only three have ever fore gone this flesh death and corruption,which then was caused to be corruptible unto this earth. Enoch,  Elijah, (and a possibility of Moses)  and Christ Our Lord Jesus even though Christ suffered a death His flesh was incorruptible and ascended from which it came.  We are here for one thing only to witnesses the sentencing of Satan and to chose either GOD or Satan. There is no Life without GOD! so Satan is the name of death and Hell.

      1. tamron profile image63
        tamronposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        That was beautiful way of putting it!  I am not sure If I agree with everything you just said but I defently know I am in hell without God.

        My life was so screwed up without him.  I couldn't imagine one day without God.  Not one day!

        I curse God out in the middle of a lightning storm and dared him to strike me dead.  I called him every name in the book.

        I broke down crying!  Then I felt an overwhelming since of peace.  At that point I knew God was listening and he new I was angry at him.

        I was trying to control things I had no control and it pissed me off,  but God let me have a temper-tantrum.

        I felt better knowing he was there and didn't leave me although I have turned my back on him.

        1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
          Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          GOD our Father Has been Hurt By Satan and Satan thinks that this Hurt Has given him an edge to win souls of his own. But Father Has said No unless they so choose. This is what the war is and was about.

          Satan has and does claim us all here; as his own, and Father has already caught him in many lies. Hence his new Name Satan for there is no truth left in him. Satan plays the god of our world. This is why GOD sent his son to inform the world that the Prophets and their prophecies were true. GOD has been away doing what HE does. Creating our Places in HIS Kingdom, far out in Space the outer rim, as we think we know It, but  He did send Jesus His only begotten Son. And Satan Caused His death in the Flesh as we now are. But No fear Father is returning and He brings the Host of Heaven along with Him. For to Mend the Divide.

          Space and Time are folding in on itself as Father returns here to Earth Our Nursery. We have all been Lied to and confused to Who our Father truly is. Father is Not the God that this world has portrayed Him to Be ! The truth is out There Seek it and you shall Find ask and it shall be given unto you. So Glad you have finally felt Him and His presence. Donnie/ Sinbad the Sailor Man

    5. Niteriter profile image78
      Niteriterposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I like to think that the Kingdom of God has always been "here" (here likely being the whole of creation) all along.

      Humanity, as it has been evolving physically, has also been evolving in consciousness; and during that period we have had a small number of people, of whom Jesus of Nazareth is one, arrive with the capacity to grasp the entirety of the nature of existence. As we continue to evolve and more and more people develop the ability to understand, in time we will all have entered the Kingdom.

      1. jacharless profile image81
        jacharlessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Am inclined to agree with this. As that amnesia is repaired, that thinking of the human being properly ordered once again, the reality of the entirety becomes evident -inside and out. It 'opens' the 'door' to the 'hidden world' we have for so long been deprived of {by our own doing, or course}. Today, some say, consciousness is at its prime, although presently led by self-ism. In this evolution, this restoration, I believe this to be the final hurdle. It was the original hurdle. The Restoration then is coming full circle. In the last three months alone, I have seen, heard or engaged very interesting -even inspiring- conversations regarding human immortality, on a real, tangible level of consideration. Twenty-odd years ago, when I began to seek, never would have expected to be having these types of dialogue, with everyday 'ordinary' people.

        James.

        1. pennyofheaven profile image82
          pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes again. (these were the fastest responses I have ever had to make:lol:)

      2. pennyofheaven profile image82
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Yes

    6. pennyofheaven profile image82
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes agree.

    7. Titen-Sxull profile image93
      Titen-Sxullposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Within the Gospels and New Testament writings you can find remnants of the gnostic teachings and what appear to be an earlier, less physical, Jesus. The idea that the Kingdom of God was something internal, a spark of the divine that you could tap into, is not uncommon though such interpretation has fallen by the wayside over the centuries.

      This, I suspect, is why we see at least two versions of Jesus in the New Testament. One as a savior who sacrificed his life to give people a "get out of Hell free" card through grace. And one who appears more concerned with how we live our lives and take responsibility for the "log" in our own eye. See the idea of responsibility, of owning ones sin, of cutting off one's hand if it causes them to stray, is in direct conflict with the idea that Jesus laid down his life to provide forgiveness for ALL sins.

      In my later years as a Christian (somewhere around age 18-19) I took to a pseudo-gnostic view of Christ. The version of Jesus I took to believing in was just a man, a teacher who may or may not have actually existed, who came not to die FOR mankind but to show us the way to die TO our sins. By living as close to a perfect life as he could and giving various moral and spiritual teachings Jesus was attempting to show us how to become our own saviors. We could all be sons and daughters, we could all follow Jesus and pick up our cross and take responsibility for our own sins and thus we could all have a piece of the kingdom.

      So in many ways the idea of this LITERAL heavenly kingdom is just another interpretation in the vast array of different interpretations of the vast array of beliefs, myths, and scriptures that make up Christianity. Unfortunately many documents were likely lost over time, our image of the early Christian church is extremely fragmented. Who knows what we've lost, maybe the more redeeming aspects of Christianity are now lost in time.

  2. Joy56 profile image60
    Joy56posted 4 years ago

    sincerely hope we are not in the kingdom yet...... Lords prayer does ask for kingdom to come on earth though...... dont have to go to heaven for kingdom.........

    1. Disappearinghead profile image89
      Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      When Jesus said "Your kingdom come" in "The Lord's Prayer", he was not saying we should ask for the end of the World and a supposed millennial reign. He was saying we should ask for the Kingdom to come to us, to change us from the inside.

    2. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
      Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      We are in GOD's Kingdom it is not our earth, it is God's. Which GOD or God depends on your thinking, your beliefs. GOD owns everything and It all is still under His ruling Body or governmental forces. Hell is but a Lie and one that which Our Father has Allowed as to teach his other children the failings of the Fallen One. The contender the Liar the murder of truth Satan.

  3. jacharless profile image81
    jacharlessposted 4 years ago

    Deuteronomy: "the word is in you to hear and do."  Nearly 5300 years ago the KOH was mentioned. This is why Yshua said, do not look over there, over here, up there, down there to find it. He said, simply: look within, first, and watch how the external {anointing; christos} manifests {all things pertaining, added to us}.

    And yes, if one seed dies it produces much [wheat]. If all seeds die, there is no harvest.

    Although recited by many, "Death is swallowed up in the victory", folks still hold fast to a heaven-hell concept -the afterlife. The afterlife then divides in two: heaven, hell. Can it get anymore pagan than that; belief in the underworld of fire, brimstone, torment, dark arts where demons suffer humanity for the seven deadly sins?

    Not surprising, Kevin, I posted something on FB, a question as to why Immortality scares the bjingas out of people? Immorality would be the manifest KOH here and now. Not "afar off", in some distant place or mystical hide-n-seek portal nor dropping from the sky amid a global annihilation battle.

    But to achieve that "pressed down, shaken together, running over"; that transfer through the needle's eye, we need to give up the entire concept of this planet, as we see it today. Immortality does not need buildings, procreation, economics and such. It is a very difficult thing, because we have been born into a particular view of existence, taught what to think, "how it's supposed to be", brainwashed into reason -a step just above the animal kingdom, when we were designed to be so much more.

    Above all, it is fear -possibly the ultimate fear. The ego -even the last strand of it- does not want to let go, because it fears oblivion, losing control, the knowledge of. So, folks put the responsibility on the shoulders of the Firstfruit -in both testimony and works of faith. They say, "he'll do it for us, we just have have to follow the rules until he does." Much of this is old Judeo thinking, old coven -as they were waiting for the KOH to come, in the same manner: a king to rule over the earth and made right all the wrongs.

    James.

    1. Disappearinghead profile image89
      Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      smile s in agreement.

    2. pennyofheaven profile image82
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes agree again.

  4. Paul K Francis profile image83
    Paul K Francisposted 4 years ago

    I feel that the Kingdom of God is the presence of God in our everyday lives and that it is a naturaly peacable kingdom, and by living in this presence we have the ability to take simple actions that may perhaps lead to a more peacable earth - you know - as it is in heaven, here and now.

    1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
      Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yea and this was our first commandment from Father to be fruitful and to multiply some would say and think It was not to eat of the Tree! But This I believe wasn't a commandment but, I would say this was a warning because GOD stated it in such a way; as you will, surely die and not that you will be put to death as Satan has claimed for himself. We are to Fed the Children it is our foremost pressing Plea from Christ our Lord Jesus and a commandment from Father. To be fruitful and to multiply What? The Story, the Truth, the Choice, the Garden? Everything within our selves that we knew and know of It all.

    2. pennyofheaven profile image82
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes.

  5. pisean282311 profile image59
    pisean282311posted 4 years ago

    @ts obviously...it was political movement and many young jews believed in god would intervene and such stuffs...jesus was one of them , it has nothing to do with heaven , hell and even god...it is hope of jews of those era and later christians...jesus's death infact ruined the concept bcoz romans came hard on jews and no god intervened ...

    1. pennyofheaven profile image82
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Who or what is ts?

      1. pisean282311 profile image59
        pisean282311posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        topic starter...

        1. pennyofheaven profile image82
          pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Oh I learn something new everyday! Thanks!

          1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
            Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            The Story is very Clear on who the Anti-Christ Is it is Satan himself the prime reason we are all here to begin with as we are in the flesh. It is not a Human Man but an angel lower to the state of Man

            1. jacharless profile image81
              jacharlessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Really? I am curious as to which story you found that information. Because of a 15 translations read, I have yet to fnd any information supporting the claim of an archangel rebelling and being turned into an evil creature, then punished, temporarily, by being sent to earth, to torment the most awesome creation ever made -humans, accompanied by 33% of more rogue angels assigned to do the same as it. Then, an ultimate fate of being burned forever in a pool of sulfur. And please do not refer to the King of Babylon {ie Morning Star, Messenger of Light (lucem ferre or lucifer in Anglican)} because you will be shockingly surprised to learn that Moshiach was called exactly these specific two items as well.And how is this angel precisely the reason humans are here ??? Again, no proof of that, but there is -watch closely- over 10,000 mentions of the human ego {ha-satan in the Hebrew}. Ha translated the and satan translated adversary. It is NOT a proper name, but a pronoun, describing the human ego. The translators got it wrong, and now millions of both believing and non are caught up in a cloud of doctrines about demons, versus their true purpose: manifesting the KOH.

              James.

              1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
                Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                well James we disagree the Holy Bible and the King James is My Good Book Story and Yes the Cherubim Known as Lucifer the Angel that Covereth is Satan. What He was to Teach and enlighten The Children of GOD to was to come to the Mercy Seat to Repent and to be Forgiven and to Sin No more.
                Lucifer's Name was Change by God to Satan because God stated he no longer Held the truth within himself. and Yes you wont get it from Only the Good Book you Must ask and receive It For The Comforter The Holy Spirit you must Seek with your Heart and Not only your Mind.
                The Original Sin is the Failure to Repent and Satan and the Fallen have , and Hold to It they were Not reborn into Humans as many of the fallen 1/3 were. you must have heard the story before. or bits and pieces of It. ask yourself why would God Come in human Form and allow Himself to be put To death. It was to defeat Death also Satan. Satan Plays many roles But his favorite One is god of this our world a world of guilty fallen angels seeking repentance or Not seeking It. Which are you? Repent and sin No more! Twas John' the Baptist Message It has been the same Message of all the Prophets of GOD.  The War of Powers and Principalities is Between GOD and Satan  Not GOD and Man. Satan Has been purposely Left out and down played. so when he returns or is cast out of heaven he can again proclaim himself as god of our world and he will fool many. How anyone who claims to read and study the word or the Bible has missed this story is beyond me.

              2. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
                Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Jesus and the parables, Jesus stating that He saw Satan the Former Lucifer Fallen from Heaven. Not Once But Twice. How Old do you proclaim that the story is it is Much older then any other story ever written.  Who do you think the Trees in the Garden are? One is for sure Satan the tree of good and evil, the Other the Tree of Life is Jesus in spiritual Bodies as Adam was as Eve was before their fall from Grace.

                1. jacharless profile image81
                  jacharlessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Incorrect. What he is referring to is ha-satan, the human ego, which came between the Twins {TOL, TOK}. Never, and nowhere does it say humans were not permitted to have the fruit of Knowledge. They were expressly told: do not eat {indulge, chew on} of Knowledge. For in doing so, would be cut off from Immortality {Life} and die. Incorrect, Moshiach did not say Lucifer, he never ever mentions that term. Again, not Satan but ha-satan fell from immortality. Man went down the rabbit hole, into the depths of information, put into him from the beginning, so that he would not need to indulge that information to exist in perfection.The Twins are the Tree of Life and Tree of Knowledge -residing side by side within each human being. Incorrect. The Tree of Knowledge is not ha-satan. Reason {meaning the ego} is ha-satan. Reason divides Knowledge. Reason forms good-evil, not knowledge itself. Again, the correct Hebrew translation of the satan is ha-satan, not as a person, but as a thing. A thing that opposes, is adverse to, divides, blocks, thwarts, etc. You might also like to know this same word is used to describe a conversation Moshiach had with Petra and is also the same term used to describe the Pillar of Fire that opposed the way of the Pharaoh; the Sword of Fire, that blocked the way to the Tree of Life; the Law that was adverse to the Truth; the Curtain that hid the Presence from the people. The Veil that covered the face of Moshe. And many, many more examples.

                  Remember what the text says: "As Moshe lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so also the Son of Man must be lifted up." Do you understand what he is talking precisely about? If you say yes, then you also understand what the serpent was in the 'Garden' stasis and what tempted him in the desert.

                  The serpent was between the Twins and egged Eve on until she gave in to her own ego. She then convinces Adam to do the same. That serpent is called ha-satan, the thing that comes between humans and Creator. What divides Love from Wisdom {Philos} when they were in fact created together, united...



                  James.

                  1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
                    Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Adam and Eve are But One Flesh and One Soul! What GOD has Joined can not be Separated by EGO  Self worship. This Is Not what Man Did.  Man was deceived buy the Light Barer that was Guilty of Self Worship in his desire to be god.  Not as GOD but to be god of his own souls.

                    These souls are his fallen Angels and the Children of GOD which were caught up in This dragons Tale (Satan's) / Lucifer which drew 1/3 of Heaven.  Who's Heaven? Not Ego's, Not Satan's, But the Heaven Lucifer was Privy too; GOD's Heaven. Why? For all souls belong to HE who Created Them.

                    I too believe in a Twin theory. I believe it was only within the Garden ( now Paradise) the Garden and not after.   Lucifer Fell he was made in the Full Pattern A gift which GOD will not repent from so Yes he would resemble the  Christ. Who is GOD the Creators [AVATAR] HIS high priest Forever  in Heavenly Dust or in worldly Dust. A Lowering of The GOD who resides in the Spirit with No Need of a physical body as we know It. GOD is the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and the Omega, The First and the Last

                    For with out GOD who is the Ocean we are sustained in there is Nothing.

  6. lone77star profile image89
    lone77starposted 4 years ago

    The Kingdom of God (Heaven) is within you. All you have to do is to decide to give up all attachments to this world.

    The gateway to Heaven is so narrow that ego is too thick to pass through. In fact, anything with any space-time component cannot fit in a non-physical Heaven.

    Yes, you can experience Heaven, now. Again, it's a decision. It's a shift of viewpoint from the physical (false) self of ego, to the non-physical (true) immortal, spiritual self (soul).

    But when you do enter Heaven, you have to give up ego and all other attachments.

    That's why the so-called Christians who continue to hunger after evil things are not really following Christ. One "Christian" I met wanted to continue to do his crimes, but be perpetually forgiven those sins. Sounds as though he was attached to those crimes more than to Christ.

    Certainly, that Heaven (the Kingdom) is near, is good news, but Jesus did say that those who are found wanting will be cast out as chaff into the fire. Sounds like Hell, to me.

    But Hell is a decision. Like any decision we make in life. How much of this world can you give up. Can you give away all of your possessions? Can you give up your prized ideas? Complete and utter humility isn't so easy. I have found it at times, but then I get distracted by my own attachments. Learning to let go of them has taken me a lifetime.

    The heavenly afterlife is merely from the fact that heaven gained in this life means the rejection of ego and attachments and the reawakening of the spiritual true self.

    Christ's "everlasting life" is the continuity of consciousness enjoyed by the true self being fully awake. And that true self (child of God) is not Homo sapiens. After all, we were created in His image and likeness. The bodies were added later because we needed temporary consciousness to help plot our way out of the pit of darkness.

    1. jonnycomelately profile image84
      jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      There is a lot of personal religion being expounded here.   I can't say it grabs me as anything more than  people hallucinating.   Play with the concepts/beliefs as much as  you like, none of it appears to me as anything but theoretical nonsense.   
      Fear of death;  fear of satan; fear of judgment..... all fear, no love or acceptance of the beautiful things we are blessed with in this world.
      It all sounds like you individuals have been "got at" by others peddling religion.  You have swallowed the bait, hook line and sinker!

    2. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
      Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I believe people Limit  the Kingdom to what they know of it. Once the Kingdom was Broken up by the Fall it is not fully GOD's Kingdom but a Kingdom under Chaos, a Kingdom out of kilter. GOD's Kingdom is Not what Remains of the former KINGDOM but the One He will usher in at HIS coming.
      The Heaven that did not fall as well as the Part thats did fall  will Pass away and become as it was before or even better then It was Before the Fall. Here in this Our world we can only but be secured in the Spiritual Parts of the Former Heaven.While Believing on those to Come.

      By default many people, Sects  teach a dualism when in fact there is an Infinity of time and spaces. We see (Comprehend) But One, and these shall all pass away.

      1. Disappearinghead profile image89
        Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        What makes you think Jesus will usher in his kingdom at his coming? He already ushered it in at his resurection. It's why he said repeatedly that it was near, imminent, at hand, and some, the tax collectors and prostitutes, we're already entering it.

        Where do you get the idea that part of heaven fell at 'the Fall'? Please quote some verses.

        1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
          Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I will, but until you ask of the Father you may or may not see what I see.
          Again using only what the majority of people have to use the Bible as it is commonly claim to be completely Holy. Genesis 1;1 In the Beginning God created the heaven should be ( Heaven) the complete and unbroken full 3/3 of it  and the Earth also Unbroken or void Period. Why Because Before the Fall GOD's KINGDOM was not subject to TIME. every day was but one day.
          Genesis 1:2 And the earth (Earth) That was in the Beginning which became Void at the Fall. and darkness was upon the face of the deep. Why was darkness upon the Face of the Deep where was God when the Fall took Place one of Jesus's Parables cleared this up for me it was the parable of the Vineyard. GOd the creator was in a Far country or rather Deep space as we Know it doing what He does and for who He does It for God was Creating Mansions for a lack of a better description for whom the Newly planted seed or Children angels not yet of age.  As you Can see I see more then what Satan would ever allow any Man to see with out Pleading to the Father for Truth.

          And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Waters because the sea was divided. And God said let there be Light and there was Light Light is nothing more than the truth of the Matter for wherever God or even the Son are there is Light. For they are the Light of THE WORLD or the Kingdom of GOD.

          Here I have shown you the Fall can you see It? The taxes collectors and prostitutes were often stoned or even Murder   who would then enter into Paradise either Knowing or not knowning of the Truth of their world now because of Jesus's arrival. That the proceeding Prophets were telling the truth of our world. So they would also be Held unto Judgment or the coming Judgment which we are all beholding to because of our Falling away from GOD and the Kingdom of GOD. From the Fall forward The Fall imitated the beginning of TIME   The Kingdom was broken with the Fall Satan and his angel refused Repentance which started a war the war of Principalities and Powers which even we are now to fight ourselves.

          And God saw the light and it was Good God saw the truth of the dispute in Heaven while He was off and away for the Host of Heaven the ones you claim have no free will which is popy cock and foolishness We all have free will or there would be no dispute ever. there is only Two beings I have ever heard of that might not have this and that is because of their true love and devotion unto god and Those would be the two that sit on either side of the throne of God as Beast of Labor their Name is also often in dispute.  Maybe now you can see where I get what I get.

          1. Disappearinghead profile image89
            Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So you read a couple snippets from the bible and string them together with stuff you make up and claim God told you. I know he didn't tell you any of this as Satan does not exist. I think we've now reached the end of this conversation.

            1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
              Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Of Course we have. You were intent on having it your way the hole time any way you look at it; as was I. But I was glad to share my beliefs with you. Thanks Donnie/ Sinbad the Sailor Man

          2. jonnycomelately profile image84
            jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Sinbad, you only spout what YOU see through your egotistical eyes.   This trick you use, by saying someone else can only understand what you are saying when they have "asked of the Father," or "received the Holy Ghost," etc., is so common and so crafty.   You seldom listen to what others are saying.   Everything must come back to your own stuff, and nothing is true unless it agrees with YOUR understanding.   (But then you have god's gifts, don't you?    yikes )
            Tell us how all of your opinions and learning have a real, down-to-earth beneficial effect in your life towards others around you.   Do you engage in any "good works," or true charity?  Or is the theoretical christianity your only interest?

            1. Sinbadsailorman profile image56
              Sinbadsailormanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              The Best Charity My Brother would be the best truth of a matter. I never claimed absolute truth. Only the truth that I deem to be truthful. I do what I can when I can and for all that I can. I am neither rich or poor, but I am sustained as the Lord sees Fit. And John your username fits you well. as does mine fit me. And Yes these are the things I see ME and Not what others have taught me it is what I see from the Bible and the Stories as a whole with in It.  as well from Life lessons and many other sources.

              1. udontnomi profile image61
                udontnomiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I see you sails are full of hot wind. You cross the horizon as one who has the "Doplar Effect" instead of a personality. It is growing feint, but I still hear you. Beep, beep, beep.

 
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