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Noah's Ark

  1. pennyofheaven profile image80
    pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago

    If Noah's Ark was found how would that alter the evolution theory? Maybe a better question would be... Would the discovery alter the evolution theory?

    1. Ericdierker profile image82
      Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes. But not on a belief scale. It would alter it through the animals and plant life associated with it. Dating would be meticulous. Genetic testing horrendous. Just from the scat we could establish what a monkey looked like at that time. Carbon 14 at a minimum would give us perfect timing within a season. Maybe find traces of humans on things like clothe or even retrieved blood droppings.
      But you know what, I do not think it would alter it one bit because it is so vague of a theory. We evolve no doubt but the parameters are yet to be discoverd.

      1. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The parameters of evolution do you mean?

        1. Ericdierker profile image82
          Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes. I draw the line at premordial sludge. I draw the line that Aristotle looked just like me.

    2. profile image0
      Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It would not alter the theory of evolution because there is no way two of every animal and bug alive would fit on any boat and certainly not the size of the boat described, which is about half the size of a modern cruise ship. Even if it were possible the genetic gene poor from two of a species would not be enough to allow the species to survive. Just forget about the ark, It's nothing but a religious threat to keep humans in line.

      1. Castlepaloma profile image23
        Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Yes, the ark had massive sex exchanges and then all animals evolved from dinosaurs.

        Maybe.

        1. pennyofheaven profile image80
          pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Haha

      2. profile image0
        Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Almost every ancient culture has a flood story. Why not Noah? Why couldn't he have collected two of every animal in what he perceived as the whole world? Why couldn't he have floated for what felt like forty days and nights? Have you ever seen what some people call a mountain? They are puny. Why couldn't his boat have landed on one as the waters receded.

        Nothing about it is far fetched; when you take into account how a story grows and changes in the retelling over the course of generations.

        1. profile image0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Do you have any idea of how many species of bugs exist in just one square mile or kilometre never mind the larger mammals and reptilians. And as I said before two of any species would not be enough for the species to survive. There would also be genetic evidence if they had managed to propagate the species.

          It's simply not possible no matter how you look at it. Sure there have always been local floods, but nothing that covers everything for days. No plants would survive for the animals to eat after the flood. It truly is a ridiculous notion.

          1. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Wasn't it animals made of flesh only?

            1. profile image0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              So all insects and plants including bees drowned over night and then just reappeared after the flood?

              1. pennyofheaven profile image80
                pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I don't know? Why not? Can they not come back to life via the evolution theory? After all the components of what made them what they were might have still existed. Very drowned ones maybe,  but using those drowned components evolution might have done it's thing, only quicker.

                1. profile image0
                  Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  A couple of billion years of evolution to produce the proper diversity of bugs and you think it can happen again in a few thousand?

                  What do you think would happen to all the dead plants and trees with no bees?

                  Think!

                  1. pennyofheaven profile image80
                    pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Why not? How do we know the species that exist today were not new species? In turkey that is. Do we know what species existed immediately after the flood? Could they have been imported like the animals we have here now, that did not exist when our ancients were alive?

                    That would depend on whether the trees and plants actually died. Would depend on their roots. Also too how much room would a bee need in the Ark?

          2. profile image0
            Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            It's a story radman. I'm not sure it's meant to be taken so literally. Did it say anything about bug collecting? And think about it logically. Take a guy. An ancient. No car. Maybe a camel or two. Doesn't go more than a kilometer or two away from his tent in his lifetime. So, maybe he does catch two of every animal he is aware of and puts them on his ark. Let's say he lives in the Shenandoah valley. It floods as far as he can see. That is his whole world. The waters recede, everybody exits the ark and he thinks he and the other inhabitants repopulate the world. And neither he or his descendants, for a few generations, encounter other humans.  Was there a world wide flood? Did he save the world? If not, does it negate the fact that his descendants believe he did so strongly that they wrote a story to commemorate it?

            A point to ponder. Every culture had a flood story. Why did this particular one survive all these thousands of years while others got lost and refound? Humanity could have chosen any of the ancient myths to carry forward into the modern world, but they choose this one, along with the rest of the Bible. Do you ever wonder why?

            1. profile image0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Why do you tell me it's just a story and then tell me it may have happened?

              Someone on here told me their grandfather cured their father of Polio with spit. She was told this as a young child and she still believes it. Does it make it real? No.

              1. profile image0
                Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                But, are you denying that her father was spit on?

                1. profile image0
                  Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I'm sure her father is a very nice man. But according to the tail he was spit on by his own father.

                  1. profile image0
                    Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    A very likely scenario. I believe some Greeks do it often. As a matter of fact, I convinced the kids it wasn't mommy's kiss that made the boo boos better. I told them it was magic spit that women got when they had a child. You'd be surprised how fast the tears dried up when I offered to spit on the neighbors kids. And mine started laughing and forgot the pain. Very magical. Maybe a miracle even. smile

                  2. pennyofheaven profile image80
                    pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    They did things like that in the days. Menstrual discharge from a woman was used to heal broken bones in the aborigine culture.

          3. Ericdierker profile image82
            Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I really like the idea that "it is impossible". It most assuredly is.

        2. Thomas Swan profile image94
          Thomas Swanposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Exactly, every culture has a flood story. Just read the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is earlier than Noah. The ancient Sumerians called it "The Deluge" instead of the flood. I think there probably was a flood, but it would have been a regional flood driven by environmental change.

      3. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        How could it be a threat to keep people in line?

        1. profile image0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          If you don't do as I say I'll flood the entire earth. See threat to keep people in line.

          1. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            According to the scripture a promise was made.

      4. kess profile image60
        kessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Rad man, Your argument is complete if you just say No God exist, it would satisfy every aspect of your argument and each and every one will understand and accept the position you are coming from...

        There is no need to qualify and re-qualify that argument.

        But the Story did include God, which means that anything that one may choose to include become a real possibility. So therefore all the natural and physical constraints you present as an argument is already Moot.

        For all who believes the story do so because they have already accepted that God is beyond and above any and all physical/natural constraints.

        And I am convinced that neither you nor them is really interested in hashing out that age old argument for the umpteenth time.

        1. profile image0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          To all those people who believe that story I'd like to open a trust fund in my name and offer you to put $1000 into that trust fund so as to bless you because I have the power to heal and heal I will for $1000.

          1. kess profile image60
            kessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            The story is believable because it is true....

            Pity you cant benefit from that....worth far more than dollars

            1. profile image0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Of course it's true. You God wiped out every living thing including plants, tree and insects including bees to kill a few people. Sure he could have just killed the people himself, but that's not how he rolls. Do you know what happens without bees and plants?

              1. kess profile image60
                kessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Yep,Thats why you cant believe..
                your only have eyes is so filled with death that it is impossible for you to see Life in anything.....

                if you knew the cleansing power of water, you flood your eyes with it that you may see....

                But as it stand you are in danger of drowning for what is meant for Life you will believe it to be death and death it would be unto you....

                Who can save the man that has no desire to be saved...?

                Not even God from heaven, what so ever you perceive him to be.

              2. pennyofheaven profile image80
                pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Nature does what nature does.

    3. Paul Wingert profile image78
      Paul Wingertposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      There's no way anyone will find any evidence of a fictional ark. Cute story by the way.

      1. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Check it out, early days yet but makes one think. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=io3P2b68DHk

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          It only makes a certain type of person think. Reality is wondrous enough for some of us. wink

          1. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So archaeology does not make you think? Ok.

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              LOL Not that YouTube nonsense - no.

              Genuine archaeology is fascinating though. Bit too difficult to understand for some it seems. I don't blame you - learning is hard. wink

              1. pennyofheaven profile image80
                pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I don't disagree with you there. Learning can be difficult for some.

                So anything on you tube is nonsense? Or is just stuff that does not align with your perceptions of how you understand things?

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  No - just the stuff that is nonsense. Which is probably stuff that aligns with your lack of discernment. Certainly the easy option is to not question anything at all. That way you don't have to learn anything.

                  I don't blame you - learning is hard.

                  1. pennyofheaven profile image80
                    pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Did you actually watch the link? If archaeology is nonsense to you, makes no difference to me.

                    How is it that a seemingly intelligent man like you can arrive at the assumptions that you have?

                    Questioning before assuming is not only easy but very useful in discussions.

                    What discernment might you be referring to? What is it I must learn in your opinion?

        2. A Troubled Man profile image60
          A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          UFO TV Studios? Conspiracy nutters? lol

          1. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Only time can tell us whether that is so. For now nobody knows.

            1. A Troubled Man profile image60
              A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Sorry, but we already know they are conspiracy nutters.

    4. kess profile image60
      kessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      The story will be modified, but nay sayers will be nay sayers and they will hold fast op the old stories or embellish new ones just so that they can remain naysayers...

  2. teacherjoe52 profile image56
    teacherjoe52posted 4 years ago

    Here is a fantastic site concerning the foold and evalution http://www.answersingenesis.org. I like the viedeos.

    1. pennyofheaven profile image80
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Interesting what he says about the dinosaurs. In one breath he says the dinosaur was created on the sixth day then in another breath that some were found fossilised and some were found with flesh etc making it impossible for them to have come from before the flood? Was he meaning that the fleshy ones were from the ark?

    2. Paul Wingert profile image78
      Paul Wingertposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes the earth is about 6000 years old and belivers fill up on fossil fuel on their way tto church. Good one.

      1. profile image0
        Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The lies they invent to hang onto their belief! Staggering.

      2. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Is that the same as bio fuel?

  3. paradigmsearch profile image88
    paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago

    http://lcweb2.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3f00000/3f06000/3f06200/3f06205v.jpg
    This was what really happened. The story has just kept being exaggerated over the years. big_smile

  4. Disappearinghead profile image88
    Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago

    There is no reason to take the flood story literally and no evidence that it occurred in the manner that literalists insist. It is well established that the greatest danger to early civilisations was from localised flooding, and just about every population group around the world has an ancient flood myth. But that's no reason to assume that every myth describes the same flood.

    It is quite conceivable that Noah and his family were real people who experienced a catastrophic flood in their valley/lands/territory, and that just about all his people were killed. It is conceivable that he lived by a large river and had constructed a large raft/boat some time before. It is conceivable that during some monsoon he went around collecting up his livestock and a few other wild animals and put them on his 'ark'.

    Much of Genesis was written during the exile of the Jews to Babylon and Persia. In that time we should not be surprised if they were influenced by Babylonian and Persian beliefs and legends, and swapped stories around the campfire. So we should not be surprised if the Jews perhaps lacking a flood account themselves, assimilated the Epic of Gilgemesh and adapted it to their belief systems, changing a few details of the story along the way. A few thousand years later several million evangelist Christians take a legend literally and formulate a load of pseudo scientific ideas to make it 'real'.

    1. Paul Wingert profile image78
      Paul Wingertposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      "A few thousand years later several million evangelist Christians take a legend literally and formulate a load of pseudo scientific ideas to make it 'real'." Amazing what brainwashing does. If you tell someone a lie (the more outragious the better) over and over, eventually they'll believe you.

      1. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Brainwashing does not just apply to the religious. It applies to the whole of humankind.

        It is sometimes called conditioning or programming.

    2. pennyofheaven profile image80
      pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes any thing is possible.

    3. profile image0
      Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Perhaps it would be prudent for you to go back and read the account of Noah and his family. I just did. The reason many believe it to be a true story is because it's written as a true story.

      "This is the account of Noah and his family." is how it starts. The word account describes how it should be taken as it doesn't say story of Noah and his family. The account continues with "13 So God said to Noah, “I am going to put an end to all people, for the earth is filled with violence because of them. I am surely going to destroy both them and the earth." Doesn't seem like a loving or forgiving God to me. Notice that God plans on destroying ALL people and the earth.
      Further in the account "2 Take with you seven pairs of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and one pair of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, 3 and also seven pairs of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth. 4 Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living creature I have made.” You will notice that the word earth is used as opposed to region and he want to wipe the earth of every living creature that he's made.

      So when you say that it's possible it was just a regional flood you are attempting to justify your question regarding the ridiculousness of the earth surviving a flood as described in the account. It is simply not possible as described in the account to fit every creature in a boat that size. And furthermore it's not possible to repopulate the entire earth with trees and plants with just a few bees.

      1. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Was this meant for me or DH?

        1. profile image0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I was replying to DH, but your certainly welcome to comment.

          1. A Thousand Words profile image80
            A Thousand Wordsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I think Rad Man, the point they are trying to make is that what may have just been a regional flood was given grandiose importance. Embellished, if you will, like many fables, but then written to be an all-encompassing "truth." In other words yes it is false, but it could simply be an embellishment of a real occurence (no connection to God really necessary).

            1. profile image0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Once we establish it's not an actual account and God wasn't involved, what do we have left and how does this effect the rest of the bible? Are they all just stories? To many hold onto this as being factual, they through out all common sense in an attempt to justify and rationalize the bible.

              1. pennyofheaven profile image80
                pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Try not to get hung up on the God element. We all know natural disasters occur. If the ancients attributed it to God's intention it is just how they perceived it.

              2. A Thousand Words profile image80
                A Thousand Wordsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Well of course, Rad. For centuries the fear of this God has been driven into people. "You dare not question the Bible or badmouth the God within it's pages lest you be struck by lightning or with disease!!" It is that fear, mixed with humanity's gullibility(surprising that's a word) and a number of other factors that perpetuates such fables as truth. They make emotional decisions that they later back up with "facts" and believe they've used reason. In a way they have, but, it's complicated and certainly not true critical thinking.

          2. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Ok.

            I doubt there was a world wide flood as was described in the bible. We don't have a flood story and our lineage and the stories attached to it goes way back to our source. The people of Noah's time may have perceived their country as being the whole earth. Or the people who wrote the bible many hundred years later (or however many years later it came into being) interpreted the original story incorrectly.

            I cannot completely rule the 'whole world flood' event out, even though I doubt it. As there seems to be a lot of evidence of other cities or part thereof, under water along coast lines all over the world that would indicate a major world wide flood did occur at some stage. In saying that,  it could have been waters naturally rising. No one knows.

            If that archaeological find is not Noah's Ark it may still have been built to survive a flood?

  5. cptjarum profile image70
    cptjarumposted 4 years ago

    I being a Christian believe that Noah's ark is real and because of personal experiences and choice I believe it not because someone brainwashed me. Any who I think the discovery of the ark kinda makes the theory of evolution invalid if it ever was valid. Since its called a "theory" has it ever been actually confirmed (forgive my ignorance).

    1. profile image0
      Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Okay, I'll forgive your ignorance.

    2. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Suggest you do a search and just a little reading to find out what scientists consider a "theory" - it is not the wild guess unsupported by anything that many people take it as.

      As far as it being confirmed, there are thousands upon thousands of bits of evidence supporting it.  Whereas the tale of Noah has exactly one - the story written thousands of years ago of physically impossible events that destroyed life on earth. 

      You, and everyone else, then have a choice - study and learn about the "theory" of evolution or quickly and easily read of impossible events from people millenia ago.  Choose which version makes the most sense to you, or which is the easiest to learn about, or which makes you feel better inside.  However you make your choice, it remains your choice to make.

    3. tussin profile image60
      tussinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      "I being a Christian believe that Noah's ark is real and because of personal experiences..."

      Cuz you were like totally on that boat, dood.

  6. paradigmsearch profile image88
    paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago

    Go placidly amid the noise & haste...

  7. paradigmsearch profile image88
    paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago

    ...And remember what peace there may be in silence...

  8. pennyofheaven profile image80
    pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago

    paradigm this is your cue....

    1. paradigmsearch profile image88
      paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      "Notifications" are a mess.

      Hi! big_smile

      1. pennyofheaven profile image80
        pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Hi..waiting for the rest of your ditty smile

        1. paradigmsearch profile image88
          paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          "Tell Me Lies, tell me sweet little lies
          ~Tell Me Lies, Tell me tell me lies~
          Oh no no, you can't disguise
          ~You can't disguise, no you can't disguise~
          Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies"

          A quote of course.

          Do you do logic?

          1. pennyofheaven profile image80
            pennyofheavenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Of course.

          2. Ericdierker profile image82
            Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh the beauty in such balance. Please let me know no truth but let me accept Lady Wisdoms suggestions.
            The wonderment of our faith in the "ark" is our testament to belief in things impossible for man yet routine for God

            1. profile image0
              riddle666posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              The wonderment is our ability to believe any nonsense provided it is said in earnestly. Dale Carnegie wrote about a time when people believed a person who said there are blue grasses.
              What I don't I understand is how people can believe that a merciful god killed nearly all humans including innocent children and animals.

              1. Ericdierker profile image82
                Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                That is just too funny riddle666 - there are blue grasses. I do not know if the existed pre Noah.
                Kentucky blue is real and it is blue and there are others.

                1. profile image0
                  riddle666posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Nothing to do with Noah. It was one of his public speaking seminars, a student when asked to make a speech said about putting some fertilizer (or something similar to that, which I can't remember) that made the grasses green.When he was pointed out that it was not possible he repeated it with such passion and vehemence that some of the other students believed him.

                  1. Ericdierker profile image82
                    Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I by no means mean to be vehement. I have never been that confident ;-)

                2. profile image0
                  Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Ha ha ha ha.

                  The name Kentucky Bluegrass derives from its flower heads, which are blue when the plant is allowed to grow to its natural height of two to three feet.

                  1. Ericdierker profile image82
                    Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Great research data. Have you ever seen the whole field of blue waving back and forth in the wind on a sunny day, atop your horse? Or have you laid in it staring up at the clouds. The grass is far more blue than green.
                    But you make the point perfectly -- if all you do is collect data through info systems rather than your own -- Noah could not have existed to you.

  9. Ericdierker profile image82
    Ericdierkerposted 4 years ago

    My brother stole my vinyl. WHAT NOW God!!!

    I think this makes it clear. Noah and the Ark are official. Officially what -- well I do not know.

 
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