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same sex is a sin...

  1. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    There is a lot of confusion and errors in this hub. And the correction is out of love, for those God loves he corrects. So, all that's been written here is out of a man misinterpreting of the scriptures for we are to pray without ceasing and ask for God's help and guide on understanding of the word. God put pairs one female and male in the garden to bear fruit create human life and one pair male and female of the animals in the ark and God does bless marriages where it's male with female. God intended to be this way in Genesis  there is no debates on this in the beginning it was male and female women made out of the rib of the man. I pray before I read the bible and the rainbow is the symbol of God promise that he won't destroy the world threw water the flood. And we all have learned this in church as a child. If fordination is a sin and adultery is a sin then having sex with the same sex is a sin. This world is saying evil is good and good is evil mentality. It's an spirit of the flesh the world but Christians are not part of the world.  well I didn't enjoy your miss inform of scriptures. It reads error something isn't right here.  So in Provers it reads "It's better to open rebuke... than a hidden love." And also As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. So there is no judgment here just God's correction. Water reflects a face, so man's heart reflects the man.

    1. Disappearinghead profile image88
      Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Why did God make gay people then?

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image87
        Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Did He really?   Did He?  It is so hard to understand that.

        1. Disappearinghead profile image88
          Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Yes why else would they be gay?

          1. IslandBites profile image85
            IslandBitesposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            It was the devil. LOL

          2. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Decisions, decisions...
            Stealing is wrong. Some say that others have a predisposition to the practice (kleptomania) however, this does not now make thievery a "good or acceptable" practice. There is your, or whomever's "thorn". We all deal with some sin. But we must recognize it as such, or we find ourselves scrambling to tell God what should and should not be sinful. Sin is sin and it was written down for all to see. His grace and mercy covers all though. We worship God in spirit and truth. We must show him our hearts and allow him to show us what we need to do. He is a father and will not cut you off for imperfection. Arrogance and "self" are his antagonists.

            1. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              I did not "choose" to be gay.  You do not "choose" your sexual orientation.  When did you choose to be straight?  When did you actively choose who you would or would not be attracted to?  What if the world told you that you were "wrong" for liking who you were attracted to?  Would you like it very much?

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Please don't be offended. God corrects me on my "garbage". I'm am NOT gay, but I am all kinds of other "sexually wrong". I too find no fault in you. smile the bible says that WE are wrong. But oh how different people would feel if they could see your HEART...

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  my heart is a physical organ that pumps blood to the rest of my body.  That's all it does.  That's all that your heart does too.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Oh! Well now you are speaking from a carnal standpoint. Spiritually, the heart of you is your center being; the origin of thought and deed. The bible needs to be understood spiritually. From the heart (not that fleshy thing just waiting to return to dust...

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                  Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Genea, it's one thing to say you sin. It's another to tell someone else they do.  I'm sure any adult can determine for themselves what they consider to be right and wrong. I wonder how you would feel if someone told you it was sinful to be a woman, or that your eye color was an offense to God. We are all what we are. We have to be what, and who, we are. If accepting yourself for who you are is a sin, then where is the love?

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    To convince me of anything WRONG, one must first point me to the scripture. One cannot just "tell" me my gender and eye color are wrong. Those things don't matter to God. I can say I sin. And since we know a tree by the fruit it bears, I can point out your sin too. However,I have no tools to hold you accountable. I cannot tell you you are "wrong" if you honestly (from the heart) see that the scriptures do not address your "issue". God sees the heart, is my other way of saying that he knows your thoughts behind your (or anyone else's) actions. He KNOWS if you KNOW that you are wrong when no one else can tell. He is judge. He judged fairly.
                    If you know your bible, some "meat" fit for my consumption is a no-no for yours. God knows which is which.

              2. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                JMcFarland you said, ‘What if the world told you that you were "wrong" for liking who you were attracted to?  Would you like it very much?’

                Is that what it is all about? What you like very much?

                What if the world told Jerry Sandusky that he was “wrong” for liking who he was attracted to? Would he like it very much?

                Sexual orientation is not solely determined by genetics, like race or gender (except perhaps for extreme examples some keep giving me). And it is not orientation that matters, it is willful actions.

                Take Catholic priests. They all have a sexual orientation of one sort or another. Most have a heterosexual orientation I would assume. Some have an orientation toward more than one woman. Some have an orientation toward men, and some boys. What matters is what those priests do about the orientation, their willful actions.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  again, with the slippery slope into pedophilia.  Someone's going to get the impression that you're just obsessed with sex pedophilia and bestiality specifically.

                  children are under the age of consent.  They cannot consent to sexual relations with an adult.  It hurts and damages the child - often for the rest of their lives. 

                  Committed homosexual relationships don't hurt anyone.  both partners consent, and it's far more than just "sex".  That's like saying heterosexual relationship are only about sex, not about the commitment.  Not about the companionship.  Not about the support. 

                  I'm a lesbian.  I'm in love with my wife, and we have been legally married for almost a year.  We've been together for almost 3.  My marriage does not hurt anyone.  It does not force anyone to enjoy it or watch it or agree with it.  There are a lot of heterosexual relationship that I don't agree with, but it is not my place to tell them that they shouldn't be married.  it is not my job to make laws to prevent them from being married or have that marriage recognized.  I see heterosexual relationships falling apart all around me, and my friends have repeatedly told me that my wife and I have the best marriage that they've seen - and they want to be more like us.  my marriage harms NO ONE.  It affects NO ONE in a negative manner.  that's the bottom line.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Actually, though I am NOT trying to get on your nerves, the BOTTOM line is what GOD says/how he feels,

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                  Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  And hows that working out for them? And once again you bring up pedophilia, but this time you only mentioned pedophilia towards boys as if it's not a problem if directed towards girls? A pattern is beginning to emerge.

                  1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                    BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Yeah, what's that? I also didn't mention that some have an orientation towards animals. Even moreso priests who grew up on farms, if you believe Kinsey.

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        Brianna Stuartposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        God did not make "gay" people, we are sinful people, it is in our sinful nature, but that is it. Its a form of "lust". Because truly no man can love a man like a woman can and vice versa.

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          Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          I believe you have no idea what you are talking about. Wait, perhaps believe is not the right word, the right word is know.

        2. A Thousand Words profile image80
          A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          And you know this by experience, or is that what other people keep feeding you?

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      Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Since I can't make heads or tails of the OP, I'll just address the title. If you think same sex is sin, don't do it. That should be all you have to think about. If someone offers it to you, say no. Please, point to anything you call scripture that impels you to attempt to force your idea of right and wrong onto the heart of another individual and I bet five people can come up with ten passages between them to prove you wrong. So, God isn't standing behind you, or beside you, on this one. These are your prejudices getting the better of you.

      1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
        BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        I'll take your bet. What do you want to bet?

        1. 0
          Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          I'm probably not the best qualified to cross scriptural swords, but OK. Can we agree to ground rules? Since I assume you are a Christian, I would think you could agree that Jesus' words take precedent over, say, something someone else said? Any quote from him should immediately disqualify something contradictory said by another?

          1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
            BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Let's go with what you specifically said. If you think something Jesus said contradicts something else said, it's up to you to prove it.

            You said, "Please, point to anything you call scripture that impels you to attempt to force your idea of right and wrong onto the heart of another individual and I bet five people can come up with ten passages between them to prove you wrong.”

            I’ll start with 1 Timothy 5:20: “Those who continue in sin, rebuke in the presence of all, so that the rest also be fearful of sinning.”

            Okay, hit me up with the ten passages between five people to prove me wrong.

            With your ten passages you may want to try and find ones of what Jesus said to contradict the verse I quoted above.

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              Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              You do realize I'm only one person? I'm not so egotistical to think I'm worth five. smile Ok, let me think about this a few minutes and I'll hit you with two. Unless someone else chimes in first. Then I'll simply save the two I found for later.

              1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                You said ten. I'll wait for the ten. Unless I get bored with waiting.

                1. 0
                  Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes, I said ten. Five people could find ten passages. I assumed we both understood we would divide ten by five. Well, I'll give it a shot.

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                  Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Hey. You have to give me a pertinent quote. First, that says they should rebuke sin in the church. This is no church. Second, it assumes we are talking about sin. You have to first prove it is sin we are talking about.

                  1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                    BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    The preceding verses in the chapter prove it is sin.

                    Again you said, "Please, point to anything you call scripture that impels you to attempt to force your idea of right and wrong onto the heart of another individual . . ."

                    I would be far more likely to rebuke the leader in a church than others.

                    For example let's take a minister who is engaged in an extra-marital affair. Are you saying Jesus would say it's wrong that if I felt called up to rebuke that minister by referring to Scripture?

                    If so, I guess I'm in big trouble.

      2. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        There is a biblical duty to warn. Some people don't know what the bible says. It is our job to tell it like it is. However, that is all. We've all "read the words" it is important to glean what hits you. God KNOWS the heart.

        1. psycheskinner profile image79
          psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Anyone who wants to know what the bible says can read it free online whenever they want.  People who don't do that probably don't want to know.

          1. JMcFarland profile image92
            JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            I think it's insane to believe that no one has "heard what the bible says about _____" by now - especially in the United States.  I don't need to be told about the Bible.  I've read it many, many times in many different languages.  I'm familiar.  More familiar than a lot of other people that I talk to who actually believe in it.  Funny, that.

          2. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            They are for whom this message is sent. All will know... The bible promises.

    3. Naomi's Banner profile image75
      Naomi's Bannerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      You realize that when you make a statement like that you are going to stir up a hornets nest among the homosexual population that love to hate the God of the Bible because He fails to allow for their sexual lifestyle. 
      One thing I will say is I understand what you are doing but living a lifestyle of the Word of God will say more about the love of God then openly judging others.  Jesus did not come to this world to condemn the world but to save the world.

      1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
        BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Ah yes, that word condemn.

        The Old Testament condemned certain behavior. The penalty was death. There is no condemnation in the New Testament. Jesus took care of that. But that does not mean that there is not still sinful behavior that must be reformed and repented to be right with God.

        1. pennyofheaven profile image81
          pennyofheavenposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Did not Jesus die for our said sins? What was the point if it did not remove sin?

          1. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            It removes sin for those who put their faith and trust in it.

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              Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Why does he only care for the gullible? Didn't he make us all as we are? Do you have any idea how elitist you sound?

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Good question!!!
                No, sin makes us who we are. God makes us who he wants us to be once we say yes to his will and way. He wants to commune with those who trust him. He does not sit well with suspicion. Questions, no problem. smile But once the answer is received, to ask it again sends off a signal of mistrust, rite???

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                  Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes that's what I said. He wants to continue with those who trust what that can't see or detect. The gullible. The gullible are those who believe what people wrote thousands of years ago while trying to give their people a sense of entitlement. Hook line and sinker.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Well, people who don't believe what the bible says believe all kinds of other things. Who do YOU trust to tell you the truth?

            2. pennyofheaven profile image81
              pennyofheavenposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              So as long as one has faith and trust, sin is removed? How so?

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                Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                No so. This is simply how she get through life. She can do no wrong. She is a slave to her super-ego.

              2. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                God forgives his children and does not condemn.

                1. psycheskinner profile image79
                  psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  If even a murdering pedophile can go to heaven for believing in God, that's a jacked up system.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    A murdering pedophile is probably not a believer. But only God is judge. He does not "respect" persons. Whosoever will, let him come. That is not the end though. It is only the beginning of life with God. He corrects his own via the spirit. When you believe you come to love. When you love, you want to please.

                  2. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    And the ego allows you to believe that you are in some way "better" than the murdering pedophile???

      2. JMcFarland profile image92
        JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        actually, i am a homosexual atheist.  I don't believe in the god of the bible, therefore I have no reason to hate him.  Do you make a habit of hating things that you don't believe exist?

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          Missyhaloposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Intelligently said by the non believer! Even the non believer have something to reason about. But the truth is, go look in the mirror... Look around, and confess all intelligent things were creatively designed. And who designed us? Isn't it isn't that enough to believe there is a God? I agree there are a lot of demented Christians out there that belong to different branches  of this so call Tree... Oh and speaking about branches and trees, there are also other different demented religions and trees and all the inconsistencies in the Bible and other scriptures, BUT, on top of all that, there is a God! Look at your beautiful eyes, you reflect him handsome. Don't let your heart get ugly, stay handsome

      3. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Jesus never condemned. But he corrected frequently. He showed the KNOW-it-alls of his day, the errors in their discernment of script. He showed us how to do it too.

        1. Naomi's Banner profile image75
          Naomi's Bannerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Yes you answer correctly.

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          Missyhaloposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Yyou Christians hate being corrected like dumb Peter, Saul, etceta from the Bible at some point in their lives. Go on and continue to hate you hypocrite, it is what you do best, Jealous. Love your brthers and your sisters, you're a little older than some in your faith. There will be many surprises in heaven. Jesus showed the know-it-alls just like He'll show you. Jesus is not even his real name and there is no power in that name since the was no letter "J" till the 1500's. The devils laugh at all your aka names for God. Here, let me give you a new name miss hater, it will be Peaches! He said cast demons out in His name, obvious Jesus isn't it because the Church changed that.  He also changed in the old testament Bible by saying the it is ok to mingle interacially and that it is okay to eat all kinds of meats! And yet though he said not one verse will not be jotted out, things were changed. God changes for our our sake believe it or not. Use your reasoning skills, dont believe every the Bible says, because the Bible has been tampered with. He even okay'd that it is okay to wear all kinds of fabrics, dont be a dumb donkey and enjoy life the right way. Be happy, everyone deserve to be love. And girl, you're stuck in ancient Egyptian times. We cant sleep around with our brothers and sister or with our cousins and cousins like the Bible teaches. And who do you think changed that? Go on and run your mouth, what else is new! If I can choose to do right or wrong, hen what the is destiny, explain that teacher? Its a bunch of nonsense what who ever created the Bible, and not even you who behaves like an all-knowing can follow and obey everything there-in, stop accusing and stop persecuting me, he lgbt people. Oh' and no you cant have more than one husband or many wives like the kings and queens and ancient people use to have just because the Bible said it was okay, and who you think changed that, who said we cant have more than one husband or wife, the church or government? The government would be out of business if that were the case. And no! You cant keep enslaving citizens or aliens immigrants like the Bible teaches!smile

          1. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Sorry, this one I will not read. Please break it down point by point. It just sounded SO hateful, I decided not to work my brain after the first 5 or 6 sentences.

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              Missyhaloposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Its explains itself if you stop being lazy and read it. You insult lgbt indirectly with kind l sweet sound sounding words,you're exposed as dry honey. Well, reap what you sow. Good love.bye love bee, becareful who you sting.

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Not lazy. Attention defunct. wink
                I don't insult lgbt. I simply ask that truth is recognized. If lgbt are "offended" by what I say, then it is called conviction. I speak along biblical lines. God does not bend the rules for any of us. We MUST recognize the truth of the matter. I have laid quite a few of my "issues" out. The Lord does not say to me, "ok, Genaea, you have had 2 husbands and since you belong to me, I declare it NO LONGER SIN!!!" His conversation goes more along the lines of, "now, Genaea, you know you wrong girl, you "heard" what I said! But since you love me and you trust me, I will WALK you through it. Don't let go, I love you, I do not hold it against you." Truth, TRUTH, truth, and TrUtH!!!
                YE SHALL "KNOW" THE "TRUTH", AND IT WILL MAKE YOU FREE"

                1. psycheskinner profile image79
                  psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  You call the insult a truth.  It is still an insult.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Insult??? Homosexuality is biblically wrong, insults you??? You mean convicts???

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          Missyhaloposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Just for you Cgenaea. You Christians hate being corrected like dumb Peter, Saul, etceta from the Bible at some point in their lives. Go on and continue to hate you hypocrite, it is what you do best, Jealous. Love your brothers and your sisters, you're a little older than some in your faith. There will be many surprises in heaven. Jesus showed the know-it-alls just like He'll show you. Jesus is not even his real name and there is no power in that name since the was no letter "J" till the 1500's. The devils laugh at all your aka names for God. Here, let me give you a new name miss hater, it will be Peaches! He said cast demons out in His name, obvious Jesus isn't it because the Church changed that.  He also changed in the old testament Bible by saying the it is ok to mingle interacially and that it is okay to eat all kinds of meats! And yet though he said not one verse will not be jotted out, things were changed. God changes for our our sake believe it or not. Use your reasoning skills, dont believe every the Bible says, because the Bible has been tampered with. He even okay'd that it is okay to wear all kinds of fabrics, dont be a dumb donkey and enjoy life the right way. Be happy, everyone deserve to be love. And girl, you're stuck in ancient Egyptian times. We cant sleep around with our brothers and sister or with our cousins and cousins like the Bible teaches. And who do you think changed that? Go on and run your mouth, what else is new! If I can choose to do right or wrong, hen what the is destiny, explain that teacher? Its a bunch of nonsense what who ever created the Bible, and not even you who behaves like an all-knowing can followi and obey everything there-in, stop accusing and stop persecuting me, he lgbt people. Oh' and no you cant have more than one husband or many wives like the kings and queens and ancient people use to have just because the Bible said it was okay, and who you think changed that, who said we cant have more than one husband or wife, the church or government? The government would be out of business if that were the case. And no! You cant keep enslaving citizens or aliens immigrants like the Bible teaches! Change and treat others fairly just like you want to be treated.
          replymore →

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      Missyhaloposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      There have always been earthquakes, floods, tornadoes, hurricanes, battles, Wars, homosexuals, transexuals or eunuchs, liars, corruption, winners, losers, Kings, rulers, demons, angels, ufo's, rain, famines, rapes, etc- There is nothing new under the Sun. I don't know any intelligent righteous holy father that would throw his own image or child into a lake of fire, especially if he/she believes in him. God is merciful and great in love, compassionate and forgiving.
      I'm a transexual-intersexual-natal/cis gender woman, so if God don't make mistakes and he created me with a penis and a vagina and I decide to lay or have sexual intercourse in marriage with a man who has a penis like I do or if I decide to lay or have sexual intercourse with a woman who has a vagina like I do , I don't see how I would be wrong or sinning.Homosexuality is a man-made created human stupidity by stupid believers who use God's name to lie. The prophets in the Bible are

      inconsistent with each other, and Paul the apostle inconsistent with himself. Back then there was no plastic for douching since it had not yet been created according to today's Science, so anal sex was pure nasty. But we don't live in those days anymore. The church people are always talking about the rapture, wars, hate, survival in case of famines, etc. They seem to push these subjects all the time upon thee Americas hoping to increase the pace of ending this world by claiming that the world is

      coming to an end like people throughout the entire A.D. era has and calling upon God to come get them like the Bible teaches them to for the world is evil; And I have to admit, that sounds pretty suicidal in artistic words. And please stop blaming the government for everything. Isn't it obvious that your government are Christian ruling believing leaders in Christ- many are if you ask them, and those that are' obviously  believe the separation of church and state is plain bullshit in their eyes if they cant follow the rules and American laws.

      There is still an on going debate as to whether or not transsexuals are intersexuals in mind. There are many different types of intersexuals, some of which are transsexuals- I am a woman, just a different type of classy woman.

  2. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    God did not create  people to have same sex. one male one female that's the order. and that's the way he made it to be . The devil evil demons put this in people mind to sin cause he does not want you to know the truth and go to heaven . God is love and he created you in his image. And he has given free will so it your chooice but know that the way you live it's either your way light or darkness you can't serve two masters you either love one or hate the other. I say love the sinner but hate the sin.

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      riddle666posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Earth is the centre of the universe that is the order. Saying it is not, is sin.
      Do we still have to suffer this self righteous arrogant, ignorant barbarians? Isn't 2000 years enough?

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        Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Are you calling another Hubber an ignorant barbarian??!!
        sad

        It is your post that comes off as self-righteous and arrogant, and really hateful!
        The thread author was stating Biblical fact, and actually, common-sense moral facts about humanity.   And you want to attack!    This is not right.

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          riddle666posted 3 years ago in reply to this

          So what do you call a fellow who follows what ancient barbarians followed, saint?


          For condemning what barbarians used to do? For not hating my fellow being because he/she is not of the same sexal orientation as mine?

          Yes, fact of barbarians who lived  20 century before, whose knowledge about the world was near to nothing.

          Earth is flat too was common sense, so?
             
          Whose moral? Morality does not ask anybody to look what two consenting adults are doing in private. They are called "peeping tom" and are condemned.

          Barbarians are not to be encouraged.

    2. Disappearinghead profile image88
      Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Have you actually seen or heard a physical demon? Have you seen the devil? Do you have any independent credible objective witness or evidence for such things?

      How can you base a belief on something you have never seen? When you see the word Devil or demon in the NT have you never wondered why you don't see these things in the OT? Are you sure you understand these things? Have you ever considered that these ideas have evolved over the centuries in accordance with the cultural beliefs of those at each time? Have you never considered that these things might be just allegorical?

      1. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        You see very clearly in the OT that the evil one was present. Have you read the bible??? He showed up soon after the people got here, remember???
        And yes, we see the devil clearly with a spiritual eye, everyday. He is just about everywhere. Haven't you "seen" him too??? smile
        You do not "see" your thoughts. But that does not mean that you don't have them, rite???

        1. Disappearinghead profile image88
          Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          You clearly don't understand the OT or the Jewish culture for which it was written.

          The only place you see the devil is in your own imagination.

          1. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Please!!!! Help me out!!! I wanna understand the Jewish culture so that I may understand that I already knew what I was speaking of. I need YET ANOTHER confirmation. I will wait.

            1. Disappearinghead profile image88
              Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Simple. Just go read up some Jewish encyclopaedias and Jewish theology. Jews do not believe the Christian satan exists; there is simply no arch fiend fallen angel in rebellion against God. These are Western Christian mythological ideas, so you won't find a devil in the OT unless your pastor told you it was there.

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Ok, no devil if that's what YOU "like".

                1. Disappearinghead profile image88
                  Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  No it's not my opinion, it's the opinion of God's chosen people, which when one studies the OT makes perfect sense.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Okaaaaaayyyyy smile I won't argue that point.

              2. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Well if I remember correctly, the Jews were chosen as Gods people until they rejected Christ. Then the Gentiles who were willing to listen to the CORRECT messages about scripture were offered the kingdom of God. So, there you have it... The Jews rejected Jesus and that may be why they can reject other things.

                1. Jerami profile image77
                  Jeramiposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  the way I understand it;   God kinda told his self, Hummm!   I need to make an example of somebody SOooos tha rest of ta people can see what benefits they can recieve if they were to be mine!    Well ? ...   let me see, I guess I'll use43 these people over here. I choose them!          It wasn't that there was anything special about them; they were just there.        So, The Hebrews were his chosen people. 

                      And they didn't behave quite as well as he had expected; considering all of the mericles he did for them and all??    ANYWAY/ ?    here we are today ?

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Wow!!! You've really been boning up on the bible. smile teach me your ways!!! . (As sarcastic as allowed.)

                2. Disappearinghead profile image88
                  Disappearingheadposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  So on the basis that the Jews did not recognise Jesus as the Christ you think they also missed Satan as well? Your illogical conclusion is most amusing.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    A merry heart doeth GOOD like medicine. smile
                    Glad to be of service.

    3. Iamsam profile image66
      Iamsamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Reading Bible and prayer may help the gay people to realize the sin they are involved.

      1. JMcFarland profile image92
        JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        I've done it.  Still gay.  And now an atheist.

        What else you got?

        1. Cgenaea profile image59
          Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          It could possibly not be sin for you per se.  The Lord deals with us individually. He may have a "covering" especially for YOUR situation. He covers me for sure. He will definitely cover you too. The bible clearly points out "to me" that what is sin for some is not for others. It reminds me of how my parents were with my brother and I. As two different individuals, we needed individual scholastic guidelines. For example, I was rewarded for A's my brother "B's" our abilities were different. God knows what we need. And he sends us just that. I can't say if he accepts/covers YOUR homosexuality. Only he may say. But I know that your feelings really do matter it his area. If one feels condemned/guilty, then they are probably on the sinnin' side.

          1. JMcFarland profile image92
            JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            This doesn't make any sense.  It sounds like you're saying that sin is different for everybody and what is not a sin for you would be a sin for someone else.  That for some people being gay may not be a sin, but it would be a sin for others.  the problem is that, for christians, there is ONE book.  You've said interpretation is not an issue.  You've said that personal feelings are not an issue.  So what is the issue?  I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

            1. Cgenaea profile image59
              Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              God - is - judge...
              He knows the heart (again , not the fleshy beating thingy).
              The bible speaks on this issue when discussing the laws for the meat that was left on the altar. Many of the people felt it sinful to eat that meat; for them, it was sin. Some had no neg feeling related to the eating of the meat. For them, not sin.

        2. pennyofheaven profile image81
          pennyofheavenposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          lol

      2. 0
        Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Reading Bible and prayer may help YOU realize the sin they are involved. It may not, but some thought will help.

  3. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    So you either love God and Believe or you don't love God and are a atheist who is lost and does not know the truth and a sinner who is blind and can not see the truth or want to see the truth. They love to be in the carnal mind you reap in the flesh shall reap corruption but He who sow in the Spirit shall of the Spirt reap life everlasting. GOD IS EVERLASTING CREATOR OF THE MATHMATICS 0 +0=0          0+1=1GOD 1+1=2 a pair   One female one Male = a pair add more people

  4. Jerami profile image77
    Jeramiposted 3 years ago

    In a perfect world, if there were an equal proportion of males versis females, and each person were allowed only has one mate, It would then be a very bad thing if two men were to marry, CAUSE two women would have to do without.   
       Sometimes our decisions does affect ohers more than we think  or have a right to do????     maybe not!.

    1. 0
      Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Has nothing to do with statistics.
      It's a bad thing no matter what.

      1. JMcFarland profile image92
        JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        yeah, there's nothing about my life, my marriage or my relationship that's bad.  Hate to break it to you, but we have a beautiful life - and we don't need your acceptance OR your approval to have it.  We have a legal marriage.  We have federal recognition of our legal marriage, and we have the same rights and responsibility that you do.  That's the way it is, and I don't particularly care if you like it or not.  You don't have to accept it.  It's your right not to - but you do have to deal with it.

        1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
          MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          +1

        2. Cgenaea profile image59
          Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          This is not about like/dislike of another human about your preference. This is about what the bible (what I believe to be God's word) says about it.
          No you ARE NOT bound by what the world thinks of you. God is judge. He said (if you believe the bible to be his word) that homosexuality is sin. It is THE SAME "NO " FOR ANY UNMARRIED COUPLE HAVING SEX. But surprisingly, we don't hear so much "bashing" for heterosexual UNMARRIED; Probably because the "world" has put a stamp of approval on it. However, it takes a "heart" that pleases God. Our "actions" just don't measure up.

          1. JMcFarland profile image92
            JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            yes, well I don't have to worry about that.  Since I am legally married.  Just like everyone else.

            Jesus condemns divorce, but you don't hear the christians out there touting that particular rule.

            You also don't hear them talking about the fact that biblical marriages WERE polygamous, or that extremely often brothers, sisters, cousins, nieces, nephews, etc got married.  That all gets ignored.  But lets all talk about the sin of the gays.  It's called cherry picking, and it's incredibly dishonest.

            1. Cgenaea profile image59
              Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Again for clarification; this is not about the WORLD's acceptance. How does God feel about it is what the matter here is. When God is for you, no one can stand against. What matters is right standing with him.
              I believe that polygamous marriage and marrying thy brothers wife are more for care of widows and quick procreation in that time. The laws on who could marry who were adjusted I do believe. Like the laws for how close into the family one could marry. Then the "one wife" thing.
              You are right when you point out the "cherry picking." Your brother is no "righter" for bedding the chick he took out last night. Although the masses have "accepted" that behavior. But God still does NOT.
              However, God does not think how we do. He sees the heart. That makes a HUGE difference.

              1. JMcFarland profile image92
                JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                I don't base acceptance of my LIFE (not  lifestyle) on a 6000+ year old book that has changed the definition of "marriage" more times than I can count. 

                Where were the "laws of marriage" changed?  Because I'm pretty certain that, according to the bible, women should be forced to marry their rapists, and if they don't scream loudly enough (while being raped) they should be dragged out to the gates of the city and stoned.

                That seems to be what the god of the bible wants.  You're cool with that, right?

                1. Cgenaea profile image59
                  Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Well, the bible is a telling of things that occurred many years ago. The bible speaks of marital changes, "husband of one wife" is mentioned somewhere. And also the rules about how close a bloodline married persons should have. However, if you do not agree with "the book" and do NOT base your life on it, this is probably not a good conversation for you. I thought that this discussion was "biblically" based since we're talking about sin and all...

                  1. JMcFarland profile image92
                    JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    husband and wife is mentioned multiple times - and in the culture of when it was written, that meant that one man could be married to multiple women.  It meant that cousins, siblings etc could get married.  Who exactly do you think the children of adam and eve (if they ever existed) married and had children with?  Who married Noah's grandchildren?

                    Just because I don't believe in the bible doesn't mean that I cannot discuss it.  You don't seem to even know what it says about marriage - or where it says it, yet the atheist does.  That's saying something, don't you think?

                    Would you like to be stoned if you were raped, or would you like to take the easy way out and be forced to marry your rapist, give birth to his children and live the rest of your life being subservient to him?  Would you like your husband to be able to sell your daughter into slavery?  Would you like to have your husband picked out for you, regardless of your desires or wishes?  If you're not down with any of those options, then you're probably not on board with biblical marriage.

      2. Jerami profile image77
        Jeramiposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Was just wondering what ya thought Gods plan would be if women out numbered men two to one?

        1. 0
          Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          What mankind does, or what happens by course of nature, and how mankind reacts, is sometimes just that, Jerami-------mankind's doings. 
          It wouldn't necessarily indicate any particular "plan of God" if women outnumbered men two to one.   And any "statistics" would have to take into account the fact that some women (as well as some men) have always wanted to stay single,  and the fact that the cycle of life-and-death leaves people as widows or widowers who are eligible to marry one of those who are single, etc.

          If the majority of people decide to jump off cliffs,  does that mean God had it planned that way?   Heck NO.

  5. psycheskinner profile image79
    psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago

    fordination?

    1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
      BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      English may not be her first language.

  6. psycheskinner profile image79
    psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago

    I dunno.  If an all knowing, all powerful God makes a race of cliff jumpers, I think He's implicated.

    1. Jerami profile image77
      Jeramiposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      for so few words as it was,   that said an awful lot !!
      And don't see how anyone can argue with it.

      1. 0
        Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        What?
        Jerami, are you joking?
        I guess I must've figured wrong when I thought you actually were interested in the Bible and sorting out its truths.........
        you seem to keep leaning further and further left all the time.........

        oh well.  Just an observation.   That's your choice.

        1. JMcFarland profile image92
          JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Anyone that disagrees with you and your specific interpretations automatically is uninterested in the bible and sorting out all of it's truths?  Can you just be impressed by a profound statement by taking it for what it is and not making judgements on others because of a simple, single statement?

          1. 0
            Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Are you Jerami?
            'Cause I was replying to Jerami, not you.
            Can you not jump into the middle of something that doesn't concern you, especially bringing your own personal bias into it?

            1. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              In case you didn't notice, Brenda, this is an open forum, which means that anyone is free to comment on anything they'd like at any time as long as they follow the forum rules.  I've seen you jump in on conversations multiple times - or are you now of the position that you can do whatever you'd like, but no one else should be able to do the same?  Darn that freedom of speech thing.  It doesn't just work one way.

              1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Yeah, like you were whining yesterday that I jumped into one of your conversions. Which I didn't.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Not whining.  Pointing out a sequence of events.  Notable difference to most people, present company apparently excluded.

                  I did not, in any way, imply that you did not have the right to post.  If you read it again, it was without emotion, including anger.  I was correcting your version of what happened, since my first post was in direct response to something someone asked me directly, which you responded to.  You're perfectly allowed to respond, and I'm allowedto disagree.  What I didn't like was your claim to victory when I just decided, based on your responses that I no longer wanted to participate in the discussion with you, and I even told you why.  That doesn't mean you "won" but if that's what you choose to believe, that's fine.

                2. Jerami profile image77
                  Jeramiposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Yeah ....   Everbody is doin it so why don't everybody say
                  Yep,I did it too .....    say I'm sorry and don't do it no more, no more    'or hit the road Jack AND DON'T COME BACK NO MORE ...."    sorry about that, don't know why that melody happen to invaid my head when it did.

                  1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
                    BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    That is some sort of _______phobic slur. I just have to figure out which one.

                    Did you have an older sister who picked on you named Jack or something? (short for Jacqueline of course).

        2. Jerami profile image77
          Jeramiposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          I dunno.  If an all knowing, all powerful God makes a race of cliff jumpers, I think He's implicated.
          =====
          What is it about this statement do you find objectionable?

          1. 0
            Brenda Durhamposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            The idea that God "made" people to be cliff jumpers.  LOL.
            I don't understand why anyone would blame God for what they themselves do.

            1. psycheskinner profile image79
              psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              You raised that particular hypothetical.

    2. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      +1

  7. psycheskinner profile image79
    psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago

    Basically, people who think it's a sin probably shouldn't do it,

    People who don't think its a sin or don't even believe in sin should do whatever they want to. It's a free country, and a secular one.

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Right again.

    2. A Thousand Words profile image80
      A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Amen to logic...

      1. 0
        Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Half of it is almost biblically  sound. lol
        James 4:17
        If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them.

  8. Jerami profile image77
    Jeramiposted 3 years ago

    Yep,I did it too .....    I'm sorry and I won't do it no more, no more  ,,, no more no more

  9. janesix profile image61
    janesixposted 3 years ago

    Sinse God is most likely androgynous, perhaps being gay (male and female in one body) is a level up from the dualists.

  10. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    God will Judge you not me you will have to stand before him

    1. psycheskinner profile image79
      psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls [Romans 14]

    2. 0
      riddle666posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Wasn't it Indra?

    3. A Thousand Words profile image80
      A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      If you're a Christian, your Bible says that he will judge all, including you. You will have to give account for every decision you make. Be careful.

  11. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    its better to be alone then with bad company

    1. psycheskinner profile image79
      psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Judge not, that you be not judged.

  12. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    yes the devil made them do sexual sin

  13. Marina7 profile image81
    Marina7posted 3 years ago

    It is not judging to tell people what God says in the Bible. I love your hub and what you said is true. Sadly you will get a lot of feedback that is negative and I know how that feels. Just stay strong and I am praying for your strength to stay strong. Great Hub. Congratulations for an honest Hub!!

  14. Diane Woodson profile image60
    Diane Woodsonposted 3 years ago

    You are right Forum writer, The Bible which is Gods Holy Word, states that homosexuality is a sin, and its also an abomination, wish I had my Bbile right here and would give you the scripture for this, however its in the New Testament. Most do not want to hear it, maybe feel sorry for those who are different, and try to look over it, but we must also pray for these people who are men and women doing horrible things and well, God will judge unless they change their minds.

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      actually, the abomination part is in Leviticus - which is the OLD testament.  Kthanx.

      1. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        We also show the abomination part in the NT. Where it matters is your faith. If you can wrap up all the scripture about homosexuality and see no sin in it, God is judge. But for the majority, it is black and white con. The Lord does not like homosexuality from my standpoint. But that is not where I struggle, though many people do. My struggle is about what I do that I KNOW is wrong. You can SAY that you don't believe the scriptures say that homosexuality is wrong all you want. What does your inner man say? Is there peace behind your decision or do you feel led to convince? Conscience is at the beginning of heart/spirit. The Lord works with the heart (conscience)  to reveal flaw. He reveals mine to me; he reveals yours to you. Whether we accept it or not.

        1. JMcFarland profile image92
          JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          actually, the word "abomination" is only found twice in the entire New Testament.  once in Revelations 21:27
          27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

          and once in Luke 16:15
          15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God
          Neither mention homosexuality. 

          Next?

          1. 0
            Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            You forgot Matthew and Mark. Interesting. You must have a different Concordance.

            1. Diane Woodson profile image60
              Diane Woodsonposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              I don't mean my statements as judging, however they openly parade it all over the media and its as commonplace as going to work in the morning. I do not like the subject but answered to my best ability. God does not wink at the sin and nether should we, we certainly should never let anyone think we belive its right!

              1. JMcFarland profile image92
                JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                you do realize, that when you're gay - it IS just as commonplace as getting up in the morning.  I'm married to my wife.  It's in the news because the overturning of DOMA and Don't ask don't tell is, I don't know, newsworthy.  There are a lot of topics in the news. murder, mayhem, mischief.  Should that not be reported either?  What would you LIKE to see in the news, exactly?  More on the divorce rates in heterosexual relationships?

                1. Diane Woodson profile image60
                  Diane Woodsonposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Of course..they should. I did not mean to get something started....we all have our views on this highly politicized subject.

              2. 0
                Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                I'm not certain why you posted that to me, but if everyone simply worried about being the best they could be and stopped pointing fingers at what they think others should do we would have a better world. Which goes all ways, of course. But, I think those of us who argue against the belief that homosexuality is wrong only do it because threads such as these are started. As I told the OP, if you think it's wrong, don't do it. Leave it at that.

                1. Diane Woodson profile image60
                  Diane Woodsonposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  The ? was here I was trying to participate I do not hate gays ok., God hates the sin, as he does all sins..People taking the Bible out of the proper context is what gets on my nerves like nails on a chalkboard would.....Please read the whole bible without taking one or two things to say its ok to sin. Look in NT and you will find the verse I refereed to and you will with an open mind see what I am referring to.

                  1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
                    MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Not to state the obvious, but you just said that we shouldn't just pick one or two verses out of the Bible to draw a conclusion... and then pointed us to one specific verse to draw a conclusion.

                    Just sayin'

                  2. JMcFarland profile image92
                    JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    actually, I have looked in the new testament.  I listed the verses that talk about abominations in the New Testament.  homosexuality is not among them, so you'll need to try again.

                  3. 0
                    Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    I know what you are referring to. I simply disagree. I disagree because I do believe that behavior which caused this thread to be started and behavior which causes people to attempt to defend that position were the primary things your namesake was preaching against. Sin exists in the eye of the beholder. You choose to see sin.

            2. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Matthew and Mark are quoting the old testament - Daniel specifically.  I left those out of my search. 

              I should have made that more clear.

              Apologies, and thank you.

              1. Diane Woodson profile image60
                Diane Woodsonposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                OK I want to make sure you guys know this, The Bible is Gods infallible word that it is a SIN no two ways about it, the sin God hates the sinners of any sin he LOVES.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  now can you prove that any of what you said is true?  Or is it true just because you said it is?

          2. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Look again.

  15. Kane Bauer profile image60
    Kane Bauerposted 3 years ago

    Based entirely on the premise that sin isn't imaginary and that any god exists, let alone your favorite one, which you haven't proven.  So any further examination or conjecture is silly until the foundational claim is evidenced.

    1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
      BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      I see on your profile page you want to run for political office.

      1. JMcFarland profile image92
        JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        *blinks again* what does that have to do with the price of tea in china?

        1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
          BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          I thought it was rather obvious. He wants to run for political office. Based upon his statement above, I would think that all the heathens on this thread would want to send him campaign contributions.

          1. JMcFarland profile image92
            JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            actually, being a "godless heathen" myself, I don't support political candidates based solely on their beliefs or lack thereof.  I support them based on their positions on multiple issues.

            I think it's only the religious that expect and seek out a religious agenda of their candidates.

            1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
              BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              If they are heathens most of their positions on multiple issues are likely to be compatible with your own.

              Are there any atheists who do not support same-sex marriage? I never met one, myself.

              1. JMcFarland profile image92
                JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Yes there are.  They're rare, though

                1. psycheskinner profile image79
                  psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  There are even gay atheists who do not support gay marriage.  people are a diverse lot.

                2. 0
                  Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  And for good reason. Thought. You know, actually thinking for ourselves.

              2. 0
                Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Correct me if I'm wrong here, but are you saying you would vote for anyone who is against gay marriage regardless of his or her character?

  16. pixelsweet profile image61
    pixelsweetposted 3 years ago

    just wanted to share my point of view this is only a  debate

    1. psycheskinner profile image79
      psycheskinnerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      One person's point of view is another persons life, love, marriage and main joy in life.  To a person who is gay, it is not a theoretical debate.

      1. 0
        Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        +1

      2. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
        BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        One person's point of view is another person's life, love, marriage and main joy in life. To a person who is a member of NAMBLA (North American Man-Boy Love Association) or the other NAMBLA (North American Man-Beast Love Association), it it is not a theoretical debate.

        I don't think anybody clicked on the link I provided yesterday about men marrying beasts.

        1. BLACKANDGOLDJACK profile image84
          BLACKANDGOLDJACKposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          +10

          1. 0
            Emile Rposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            You can't plus yourself. It's like talking to yourself. We have to take away the ten. Subtract one as a penalty. Minus one since I had to take the time to type this. You are now at negative two.

            1. 0
              Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Ha ha ha ha, too funny Emile, but there are some other factors that should taken into account.

        2. 0
          Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          You understand the difference between Homosexuality and those other things you are interested in right?

      3. JMcFarland profile image92
        JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Well said.

  17. 0
    Beth37posted 3 years ago

    http://s1.hubimg.com/u/8163232.jpg

    This has been my background for my HP's profile for a week or so. It's kind of my philosophy, but I would be the first to say that how we live our lives matters to God and to the ppl whose lives we touch. We all will answer to someone for our choices... of course, I'm thinking of myself here when I say this.

  18. Cgenaea profile image59
    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago

    U want some "cover"???

  19. Jerami profile image77
    Jeramiposted 3 years ago

    It doesn't matter who we are and what we are doing; self justifinacion is at our fingertips.

    It is like the air is full of excuses and all we gotta do is pick the one that goes best with what we are serving.

    "Everbody is doin it".  when we come to a place where we no longer need to "Pick an excuse" we might be a little closer to where we ought to be.

    1. Cgenaea profile image59
      Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      We have a case of adjusting script for feel good purposes with the one who is at "fault". If we were speaking of divorce, I could not/would not argue. God deals with me according to my faith. Now I cannot look at scripture and label my divorce acceptable and yours not...

  20. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago via iphone

    Note that just as homosexuality is a sin so is premarital sex, oral sex, shacking up, cheating, phone sex, porn, lusting, and masterbation. So when calling out a homosexual man and or woman, be reminded that no one sin is greater that the other. Homosexuality is not a species it is a spirit. Everything in nature is created perfectly and balanced appropriately. Still we do not have the right to judge. We are ordered to do two things, spread the gospel and pray.

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      so you're telling me that I have a "spirit" of homosexuality?  Like a demon?

      Yeah, my parents tried that one.  It didn't take.  There is NO proof whatsoever for this assertion.

    2. 0
      Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      How is oral sex a sin? lol

      1. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        I really don't know. Unclean thoughts are against God. What is unclean, hmmm, prob spirit/ conscience determines. Does the bible speak of oral sex?

    3. pennyofheaven profile image81
      pennyofheavenposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      +1

  21. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    The Bible tells us that the Word is so righteous that it pierces between the soul and spirit. This is a reminder that the soul and the spirit are not the same. Our spirits Make up our personalities. To answer your question yes homosexuality is a spirit. In your heart you know that what it is you desire is wrong yet you are compelled to do it for emotional and sexual reasons. Just as the average cheating male or female do what they do for self satisfaction. I am not condemning you, please understand this. However people are susceptible to spiritual oppression and bondage when they are exposed to actions, hanits

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      That's actually not true, and you have no right to tell me what I feel or what I know.  You don't know me from Adam, and you cannot presume to speak for me.  At all.

  22. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    Beth37 and all read the books of Leviticus and Exodus we are given the law.

    1. 0
      Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      I don't believe the Bible addresses oral sex between spouses at all. If you know of a specific verse or chapter, I would be very open to reading it. There are many who believe that there are veiled references to oral sex in the Song of Solomon. "Garden" refers to her genitals and "fruit" to his.

      (Bride) Awake, O north wind
      And come, wind of the south
      Make my garden breathe out fragrance
      Let its spices be wafted abroad
      May my beloved come into his garden
      And eat its choice fruits! (4:16)

      Like an apple tree among the trees of the forest
      So is my beloved among the young men
      In his shade I took great delight and sat down
      And his fruit was sweet to my taste. (2:3)

  23. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    The bible does not specially use the term oral sex but Ephesians 5:3 does say that there should not be even a hint of sexuality... This means thinking about it and doing things that bring about the same finale. The book if Leviticus tells us that if a mans semen touches a bed drape then the drape must be destroyed. The biblical term for immorality is found in 1 Corinthians and it refers to any conduct out side of marriage

    1. 0
      Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Did you mean Chronicles here instead of Corinthians?

  24. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    @JMMcfarland... Demonic oppression and possession are not the same. An oppressed person is conscious of what they are doing and does what they do because they feel they must. A possessed person is conscious of the fact that something else altogether is in control of them. Draw your mind away from the Hollywood definition of spiritual interface and go back to the Bible, seek his truth for yourself. I know you had to be raised in A Christian home or a home that believe in the Biblical God because you stated that your parents told you that it was a spirit. You must understand that we battle not against flesh and blood. Why do think that God destroyed Sodom and Gomarrah? If he created gay people and if being gay is right then why would he have destroyed them. The first thing God commanded Adam and Eve to do was to be fruitful and multiply. How can his word be fulfilled if two women are joined. He said in his word that heaven and Earth shall pass away before he could lie. Read 1 Corinthians 5:11

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      god actually destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of pride and inhospitably.

      Ezekiel 16:49 Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.

      See, that's the thing.  I was raised in a Christian home, and I went to a Christian college where I learned Greek, Hebrew and Latin.  I've read the bible.  If you're going to try to use it against me, you might want to learn it a little better.  Kthanx.

      I know what the bible says about devils, demons, etc - at least in the new testament, which is VASTLY different from the belief in the adversary depicted in the Old.  I just don't see a reason to believe that any of it is true - namely because neither you nor anyone else can actually, i don't know, PROVE IT.

      1. vtwilli profile image81
        vtwilliposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Genesis 19:5

      2. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Well, you seem to be making this sort of one-sided. I grew up in a Christian home and tho k Christian values. I went against all of it... But now my religion is actually relationship with God himself. I have only read the bible in English. However, we are not talking about self here. All your knowledge means 0 if, "a hearer only" you do NOT agree with the bible, but you need to "prove" that to me and others??? I believe you when you say that you don't believe, in spite of all that you have witnessed and learned in the Kingdom of God.

        1. A Thousand Words profile image80
          A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          What does her lack of of belief have to do with anything that was said. She doesn't want to be a doer of his word because she isn't a christian. However, every single word she said was sound, looking at the scriptures concerning Sodom as a whole, instead of taking little parts out context to make it what she wanted, which is what the other woman did. Notice how she couldn't actually rebuttal anything intellectually.

          1. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            The idea that she must prove her disbelief. I believe that she wants to be counted among the non believers. That topic is not under debate. My comment responded to her extensive knowledge on the subject at hand as well. Reading it and memorizing it is not enough to fully grasp the concepts. Doing it makes the difference. Reporting the heavy bible background seems a bit off.

  25. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    No Beth 1 Corinthians 7:2

    1. 0
      Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, I understand that... I don't understand what that has to do with oral sex.

  26. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    Hopefully we are not here to make anyone feel bad or praise ourselves. Before I went back to God I was a fornicator too. The one thing Christianity does teach is to love. The bottom line is that everyone has to answer for him and herself. I can judge I can only share what I believe. We all believe differently but that difference in opinion should never usher in disrespect. Goodnight Hubbers.

    1. JMcFarland profile image92
      JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      except I'm not a fornicator.  I'm actually legally married.  Thanks for the concern though.

      Sure, you're not here to judge - after telling me that I have a spirit and that my LIFE the very person that I am is a sin.  that sure sounds like judging to me.  I guess you must have a different definition of the word.

      1. vtwilli profile image81
        vtwilliposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Sorry for anger but I'm not judging you only God can do that. The problem too many people try to use the bible for their definitions. You obviously have not read the story of sodom and Gomarrah. You are right it was not only homosexuality that corrupted the city but all types of sin of a sexual nature . When they arrived in the city the men saw the two Angels and beat on the door begging to have them . Lot offered his daughters to them instead.

        1. JMcFarland profile image92
          JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Yes I have, and the bible itself spells out what the sin of sodom was, in the verse I just provided for you.

          Let me give it to you again.
          Ezekiel 16:49 Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.

          Lets talk about the story in Genesis, if you don't want to take Ezekiel's word for it (incidentally, how do you NOT take Ezekiel's word for it, who was supposedly a prophet of god and supposedly knew what he was talking about)

          You have two angels going to Lot's house in the middle of Sodom.  The bible says that ALL OF THE MEN came out to try to rape them.  Not only is it statistically impossible for all of the men of ANY city to be gay (since gays represent about 10% of the population at any given time) but you also have to understand the culture and context.  It was not uncommon for soldiers on the victorious side of a battle to RAPE the soldiers of the losing side.  It was an attempt to demean them - to put them in the place of women who were considered to be the property of their fathers - and then their husbands.  This is why the bible says it's okay for a father to sell his daughter into slavery - or why it says it's okay to force a woman to marry her rapist. 

          Since it's impossible that all of the men of Sodom were gay already, it becomes even more clear when Lot offers his daughters for them to rape instead.  Why would he offer them women - his virgin daughters - if they were all gay?  Does that make any sense to you?

          THEN read further in the story.  The angels blinded the men so that Lot and his family could escape - then his DAUGHTERS (the same one that he offered for gang rape) turn around and get him drunk - so they can have sex with their father in order to continue the bloodline.

          THAT'S your standard of morality?  Really?

          If you tell me that I am inhabited by a spirit (when you don't even know me, don't know my background, don't know my wife or what I had to go through to get to this point in my life) and tell me that who I am is wrong, I don't care HOW you slice it - you're judging me.  As soon as you're called out on it, however, you immediately back down and say it's gods place to judge, not yours.  Do you think god needs your help?  Is that why you were judging me to begin with? 

          The bible also teaches to judge not lest you be judged - in the same way you judge others, so will you be judged yourself.

          1. vtwilli profile image81
            vtwilliposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            So you interpreted that according to what you believe to be statistically correct? Again I am apologetic for your anger. I am unmoved in my beliefs. I read it for what it says. That problem is that so many statistical interpretations has given birth to so many sects. Listen to the book. What does the book say? Either you believe it or you don't. If you don't believe don't try to synthesize it for others. Base all of your answers on your logic. Don't try to self promote by discrediting it.

            1. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              I don't know what statistics have to do with anything.  It's a fact that gay people historically make up between 8-10% of the population - and in biblical times no one was "gay".  Everyone got married and had a family, whether they wanted to or not.  It was the cultural standard and the cultural norm.  If you disagree with that, then you have to have proof for your statement, and not just expect anyone (least of all me) to just accept it at face value because you said it - when I don't know you or anything about your background.

              I don't care about your beliefs.  I don't care what you do or don't believe.  You have a right to your belief, but your right to your beliefs ENDS when they start infringing on the rights of others.  You do not get to make laws based on your religious convictions - especially in the United States which is a democracy, not a theocracy. 

              You read the parts you want to read, and interpret them the way that you want to.  A lot of Christians disagree with your interpretations.  You don't just get to decide that your interpretation is correct while all other interpretations are wrong based on nothing more than your opinion.

              I'm not trying to promote myself, and I don't know where you got that from.  I'm pointing out that the Bible (which you believe in) ADAMANTLY STATES what the sin of sodom was - and it says NOTHING about homosexuality.  You want to interpret Genesis the way you want, while throwing out Ezekiel completely.  If you want to cherry pick scripture to fit your own particular bias, that's your right - but don't expect anyone else to buy it based solely on your opinion.  Rational thought and reasonable discussions don't work that way - and if you're going to pound the bible at me, you need to be more familiar with what it actually SAYS and not what you have interpreted it to mean.  I know what it says.  I don't have to believe in it to know what it says.

              Ironically, in all of the recent pew studies, atheists are far more biblically literate than their believing counterparts.  Why do you think that is?

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Because they search the scripts daily looking for a "loophole" and/or "contradiction". Their souls long to be right, they try to find themselves right or a way to discredit the story altogether. That's why. Kthanks wink

                1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
                  MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Or... they were raised in an abusive Christian house that forcefully shoved the Bible down their throat, got a degree in it and then realized that it wasn't true for them... Sometimes actually reading the Bible has that effect on people of a rational mindset.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    So I am told... smile

                2. Zelkiiro profile image84
                  Zelkiiroposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Looking for a falsehood/contradiction in the Bible? Here's one of my favorites:

                  In Ezekiel chapter 26, God says he's going to destroy the city of Tyre/Sour in Lebanon, because Old Testament God is kind of a jerk. Ezekiel 26:21 states, "I will make thee a terror, and thou shalt be no more: though thou be sought for, yet shalt thou never be found again, saith the Lord God."

                  ...But clearly that wasn't the case...

                3. A Thousand Words profile image80
                  A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  You are adamant about what you feel based on an emotional connection to the traditional, popular, and yet cherry-picked and uneducated interpretations of Biblical scripture. She is pointing out what the Bible actually says. Sorry, but there's no way around that. The only scripture that is actually specific about what Sodom did wrong happened to fail to put homosexuality on that list? Be honest with yourself, and set your emotional connections aside. But you probably can't do that because your world is based on creating an emotional connection to a book and the so called God of a book from 2,000 years ago.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Emotion does not play a part on my end. Honesty forces me to see the attempted rape of the men in that city and how it was viewed. "Eeeeewww!!!, here! Take my virgin babies instead" or something like that. The scripture is plain on the matter. We may look at it differently if we want, but our arms are too short. Right is right. Wrong is wrong. We cannot approve ourselves, what God disapproves. Vice versa.

          2. vtwilli profile image81
            vtwilliposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            You have deep seeded forgiveness issues. I am so sorry for what may have happened to you that makes you so bitter. Have you tried counseling. Let it go. I was not judging. I will stand before God to answer for my sins I believe I said that earlier.

            1. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Now you think you're my PSYCHOLOGIST?  Based on what?  A few posts in an open forum?

              yeah, I studied psychology, too.

              do you always make these types of snap judgements about complete strangers without even attempting to get to know them?  Does that work well for you?

              I've got to tell you - it sounds incredibly arrogant.  I'm pretty sure that the bible says that pride is a sin, too.

              Additionally:
              Matthew 7:4-5
              4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

              1. vtwilli profile image81
                vtwilliposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                I'm not about to be waiting for you while you google scriptures. Goodnight. Do not go to bed angry.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  I don't have to google.  Yet another dishonest assumption by a christian.  I'm not surprised.

                  I don't know where you got the idea that I was angry.  I'm not.  I actually don't take these types of forum discussions personally.  I've been debating for over 20 years - you develop a thicker skin.  When you apologized for anger, I assumed that you were apologizing for yours.  You can't really apologize for someone else - especially if they're not the least bit angry.

                  Here's the thing.  You can tell yourself that you're not judging, but it's clear to everyone that you are.  You can tell yourself that I have anger issues or psychological issues - but you're not a licensed psychologist.  You can argue about scripture, but i'd guess that you're not a biblical scholar either.

                  You can make yourself feel better by trying to minimize the intellect of others that disagree with you.  You can make snap judgments of complete strangers to your hearts content - but that's not going to get you very far when trying to communicate with them.  It's just going to make you look immature - and that's not going to get you very far when attempting to have a serious conversation about any topics.

                  You didn't disagree with my depiction of what happened in Sodom except for "statistics".  You didn't disagree with what Ezekiel said, although you chose to ignore it in favor of your interpretation.  You didn't disagree with my pointing out what Jesus said about judging. 

                  And once again, you don't...know...me..at...all.

                  So what gives you the right to make ANY type of assumption/judgment about me?

                  1. 0
                    Beth37posted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Kind of a broad sweep there.

                  2. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Lot of feeling... For no feeling...

              2. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Tree/ fruit it bears.
                My "assessment" is anger and bitterness for making the preference a sin. Sort of like an "Ef-U-then!!!" But he aint angry. He understands better than you. He is faithful. He is still there. Try not to be angry if you can. As I said, he accepts us all with all our fault. If the heart is quickened by the scripture. For you it is sin. But God is a master sin-coverer.

                1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
                  MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  One of the absolutely best religious lectures I ever got came from a wonderful older woman that LIVED Christianity.

                  I know it so well I can quote it verbatim.

                  She said "Girl you need to find Jesus"

                  I told her I was standing in the middle of his house.

                  She said "Oh you got Jesus in your mouth, you just ain't got him in your heart."

                  I'm gonna pass that on to you right now, because Girl, you need to find Jesus.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    I am searching, thanks. smile

          3. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Quoting the bible , eh??? smile

            1. A Thousand Words profile image80
              A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Of course she is... they are discussing scripture. There's only one possible way to do that. By quoting it. Doesn't mean that she secretly believes they are true or accurate. She is simply pointing out what the book says. No strings attached.

      2. MelissaBarrett profile image61
        MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Slightly off topic and excessively...er... something.  I don't know what, I'm too tired for words... but excessively something anyway...

        Is it even possible for lesbians to fornicate? I mean technically? Barring any err... implements..., isn't lesbian sex largely non...

        Oh screw it, you know what I mean.  Is everyone that engages in heavy petting and a bit of... screw it again... outside of marriage guilty of fornication?

        1. Cgenaea profile image59
          Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Even if a man thinks about sex with one who does not belong to him. Sin according to scripture.

          1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
            MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Thank you, but I was actually asking Julie. Not to be offensive, but I think she's more knowledgeable about it than you.

            1. Cgenaea profile image59
              Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              I step aside... wink

          2. 0
            Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            What about women?

            1. Cgenaea profile image59
              Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Same deal

              1. 0
                Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Show me the scripture please.

                1. Cgenaea profile image59
                  Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Same scripture.

                  1. 0
                    Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    So it doesn't apply to women.

        2. pennyofheaven profile image81
          pennyofheavenposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          lol

      3. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        I cannot nor can any other human tell you that you are wrong for anything. We are having a discussion about what the bible says. Tell me... Are you hearing someone/thing tell you that you are wrong???
        I havent read those words. Conviction is a funny phenomenon. It takes many forms. "Voices" in your head ( where YOUR heart lies)?
        Come on Spirit and truth. Throne of grace/ obtain mercy. Though sins be as scarlet... You know the rest! God is not hoping to condemn you. His grace is fully sufficient. In his arms, there is rest for the "weary" soul.

        1. 0
          Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Ahhhhh. yea.

        2. A Thousand Words profile image80
          A Thousand Wordsposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          ... You can easily read the many posts in the forum and many others that say that being gay is wrong. Look at the title of the forum... "Same sex is a sin." C'mon, now.

  27. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago via iphone

    Off from work

    Romans 1:26 " because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men..."

    I am joyful because I have come along way. I once was what I now advocate against. I am not ashamed of what I was and my sinful state was no different than that of a same sex state. Sin is sin. I said this earlier in the conversation. I am sorry if someone is anger without a cause. I now understand why though. When you know you are wrong and won't admit it, you will fight tooth and nail hand over foot to pretend to be right. I am no bible scholar and never claimed to be. It is true the devil does know the bible better than most saints. I also have two degrees and have published two books... My focus is empowering woman, saving marriages, and rebuilding families. In the end we are judge by our hearts not our knowledge or deeds. There is a right side and a wrong one. Lets just hope wherever we are we are winning. Again I did not judge, I got my sins to answer for.

    http://static.lulu.com/browse/product_t … lution=320

  28. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago via iphone

    I had an awesome evening with conversation. Everyone be blessed.

  29. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago via iphone

    1 Corinthians 6:9-11

    Do not be deceived; Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexuals nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the Kingdom God. And this what is what some of you we're, but are now washed..."

    1. Cgenaea profile image59
      Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Ha!!!! I just love the word rightfully discerned. Now, the scramble begins to totally discredit that homosexual piece... Wait for it... In my Katt Williams voice. smile
      That last part of freedom will be totally disregarded. The door is open.

      1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
        MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Well the first discredit would be that the word homosexual didn't exist at the time that was written in the language it was written in...

        1. Cgenaea profile image59
          Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          Did THAT word mean homosexual?

          1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
            MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            The word that didn't exist till hundreds of years after the penning of the bible? Sure, that word meant homosexual.  It was a bit late to be included in the original translations, but the middle age churches remedied that by retroactively creating it.

            "The first known appearance of homosexual in print is found in an 1869 German pamphlet by the Austrian-born novelist Karl-Maria Kertbeny"

            So yeah, it's a pretty new addition to the bible.

            1. Cgenaea profile image59
              Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              There is nothing new under the sun. There WAS homosexuality then. There had to be a name for it. We definitely have a difference of opinion. ALL of God's children will be with him when he comes. Some of them will have been  gay. If I am wrong, I will be corrected.

              1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
                MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                It doesn't bother you at all that the Bible is using a word that wasn't invented until less than a couple hundred years ago and has no equivalent in the original language, but you are basing opinions off of it and telling people they are sinners because of it?

                And that the major writings connected to that word (that didn't exist) are essentially the laws for the holy men of another religion?

                1. Cgenaea profile image59
                  Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Again, there were homosexuals then, they must've had a name/title

                2. 0
                  Deepes Mindposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  To be fair, that word was not in the KJV Bible. It appears in latter versions and translations

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Mainstream has brought it to the forefront in an attempt to normalize and gain approval. Spirit kinda knows what is implied. Carnality looks for the "deeper" meaning; for a "good" reason. Who wants to be wrong for something they like???

  30. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago via iphone

    @CGenaea... Everyone knows what is implied in that scripture. You are correct. More modern teachings have only focused on the corruption of the cities in a non sexual light because of the growing numbers of homosexuals in the world. I believe that one of these posts said something about it being 8-10% of the city population, but who is to say that it wasn't more. Who is to say that so even now with all of the people who are bisexual or in the closet it does not have the potential to in the next 10 years be 50% of our world pop? I do not want anyone to think as I think. I do however want my opinions to be heard just I find others opinions thought inspiring and sometimes valid.

    1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
      MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      I think bi-sexuals are already counted in among that number.

      A 50% gay population would be awesome though.

      Famine and overcrowding would end. Mass adoptions of unwanted children would happen. Unemployment percentages would drop like a rock. Now that would be a true blessing.

    2. Cgenaea profile image59
      Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Sure. Validity is also measured with a spiritual stick. The ways of God are foolishness to the carnal mind.  We have no power to say what is or is not valid. Rightful dividing of scripture without self involved, is what it takes. Relationship ties to the father makes rightful divide possible.  All this chatter about NOT believing in a God that I spend ALL DAY talking about is to me, a bit...let me think...

  31. vtwilli profile image81
    vtwilliposted 3 years ago

    @melissa... Lol. I cannot lie in my line of work I employ a large number of that sexual preference and they are always the most honest and friendliest people to be around. I love them... Then again I love everybody.

    1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
      MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      I wouldn't say that as a group they were any more honest or friendly than anyone else, so you got lucky.

      LGBT people are just people.  They don't really have any shared traits other than being L,G,B and/or T. They just want to be allowed to love the people they love and have families.

      I'm not sure how that goes against the bible.

      I'm also not sure why Atheists and Christians are sitting around debating what is essentially Jewish law... but hey, whatever.

  32. 60
    Brianna Stuartposted 3 years ago

    The Bible says God made a companion for Adam, which ended up being a woman. Only man and woman can populate the world and there is no going around that.

    1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
      MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      I think the world's quite populated enough.

      And while L and G alone can't populate the world, there's no reason many T's can't. And I, as a B, have certainly done my part in it.

      In addition, God doesn't really send people to hell for being barren... generally he gives their husbands Egyptian concubines and starts other religions with their sons.

      1. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        I actually laughed out loud. God knows the plan. I'm following him. You may choose whatsoever you wish.

    2. 60
      Brianna Stuartposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      But, no matter what anyone truly says on here or debates about, all those who do not accept Christ in their heart and lifestyle will all face judgement. No one's personal opinions matter when it comes to God's judgment. Our opinions do not override God's truth.

      1. 0
        Rad Manposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        Doesn't everyone get judged? Our opinions vary on what the truth is. You better hope you've got the right version.

    3. Zelkiiro profile image84
      Zelkiiroposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      The Bible also says that God destroyed Tyre/Sour in Lebanon and claimed it would never be found again. We did, in fact, find it just a few years later, and now Tyre/Sour is the 4th largest city in Lebanon.

      1. Cgenaea profile image59
        Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

        If the bible says that Tyre/Sour is gone, and never to return; then it is GONE, and NEVER to return.

        1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
          MelissaBarrettposted 3 years ago in reply to this

          OK, I'm calling Po's Law on this one.

          You can deny evolution, you can deny the history surrounding the Bible... You can even, I guess, say a word was in the Bible that wasn't even invented until a couple of thousand years later...

          But you are seriously going to say that a city with 100,000 people just simply doesn't exist?

          At this point I have to believe that you don't really believe anything you say and that this entire thread is one giant trolling expedition.

          1. JMcFarland profile image92
            JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this
          2. Cgenaea profile image59
            Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

            Again my faith is sure. I believe that the bible does not lie. You spoke of evolution. From my view, most of those pieces fit with evolution. In science, the world's atmosphere is much different from biblical times. Your 100,000 in population city is NOT the one biblically spoken of.

            1. Zelkiiro profile image84
              Zelkiiroposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              In case you've forgotten, Lebanon is a very, very small country, with a very small southern coast (where Tyre was located), and there's only so much coastline onto which you can build a large harbor town in the southern region of a very small country.

              And there are only so many ancient cities on the southern coast of Lebanon that are also major archaeological sites that contain artifacts that identify the location as the ancient city of Tyre. In fact, there can only be one of those, because it's effing Tyre.

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Read this, I just pulled it from the Internet.


                When Alexander the Great conquered the Medo-Persian empire, long after Nebuchadnezzar's siege, the new island city of Tyre resisted his advances. Frustrated by their efforts, Alexander ordered his troops to build a causeway to the island by throwing the ancient ruins of mainland Tyre into the midst of the sea, and using the dust to create a way for his troops, thus fulfilling the prophecy that Tyre would be thrown into the midst of the sea.

                For me, this is easy to believe; know why???

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  yes, but what does the bible say about Tyre again?

                  For thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will bring upon Tyrus Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, a king of kings, from the north, with horses, and with chariots, and with horsemen, and companies, and much people. He shall slay with the sword thy daughters in the field: and he shall make a fort against thee, and cast a mount against thee, and lift up the buckler against thee. And he shall set engines of war against thy walls, and with his axes he shall break down thy towers. By reason of the abundance of his horses their dust shall cover thee: thy walls shall shake at the noise of the horsemen, and of the wheels, and of the chariots, when he shall enter into thy gates, as men enter into a city wherein is made a breach. With the hoofs of his horses shall he tread down all thy streets: he shall slay thy people by the sword, and thy strong garrisons shall go down to the ground. And they shall make a spoil of thy riches, and make a prey of thy merchandise: and they shall break down thy walls, and destroy thy pleasant houses: and they shall lay thy stones and thy timber and thy dust in the midst of the water. And I will cause the noise of thy songs to cease; and the sound of thy harps shall be no more heard. And I will make thee like the top of a rock: thou shalt be a place to spread nets upon; thou shalt be built no more: for I the LORD have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD. [2]

                  1) Nebuchadrezzar, the king of Babylon did not destroy Tyre.  Alexander destroyed part of it.
                  2) Tyre was never to be rebuilt, according to the bible.  It was, an it exists to this day.

                  still a failed prophecy.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    Did you read my post? Are Nebuchadnezzar and Alexander related? Did you read that the thing was built? And the ashes were tossed in the water? Never to be rebuilt. Now, we have a proxy Tyre. smile

            2. JMcFarland profile image92
              JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

              Unfulfilled prophecies of denial

              This section is for prophecies that Biblical inerrantists claim to be fulfilled but are not. It also includes unfulfilled prophecies that inerrantists would prefer not to acknowledge.
              [edit] Destruction of Tyre

                  For thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will bring upon Tyrus Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, a king of kings, from the north, with horses, and with chariots, and with horsemen, and companies, and much people. He shall slay with the sword thy daughters in the field: and he shall make a fort against thee, and cast a mount against thee, and lift up the buckler against thee. And he shall set engines of war against thy walls, and with his axes he shall break down thy towers. By reason of the abundance of his horses their dust shall cover thee: thy walls shall shake at the noise of the horsemen, and of the wheels, and of the chariots, when he shall enter into thy gates, as men enter into a city wherein is made a breach. With the hoofs of his horses shall he tread down all thy streets: he shall slay thy people by the sword, and thy strong garrisons shall go down to the ground. And they shall make a spoil of thy riches, and make a prey of thy merchandise: and they shall break down thy walls, and destroy thy pleasant houses: and they shall lay thy stones and thy timber and thy dust in the midst of the water. And I will cause the noise of thy songs to cease; and the sound of thy harps shall be no more heard. And I will make thee like the top of a rock: thou shalt be a place to spread nets upon; thou shalt be built no more: for I the LORD have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD. [2]

              In this block of text God states quite blatantly that Nebuchadnezzar would sack and destroy completely the city of Tyre. However the events given in this passage never did come to pass. After a 13 year siege Nebuchadnezzar withdrew his forces. Despite being conquered by Alexander the Great 240 years later, [3] Tyre still exists. [4]
              [edit] Destruction of Egypt
              Egypt. What a desolate wasteland

                  Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will bring a sword upon thee, and cut off man and beast out of thee. And the land of Egypt shall be desolate and waste; and they shall know that I am the LORD: because he hath said, The river is mine, and I have made it. Behold, therefore I am against thee, and against thy rivers, and I will make the land of Egypt utterly waste and desolate, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. No foot of man shall pass through it, nor foot of beast shall pass through it, neither shall it be inhabited forty years. And I will make the land of Egypt desolate in the midst of the countries that are desolate, and her cities among the cities that are laid waste shall be desolate forty years: and I will scatter the Egyptians among the nations, and will disperse them through the countries.[5]

              This passage is one of the most erroneous in the entire Bible. Egypt has never been a desolate waste, there has never been a time when people have not walked through it, there has never been a period of forty years when Egypt was uninhabited, and it has never been surrounded by other desolate countries.[6]

              In Ezekiel 30:10-11 he further predicts that Nebuchadnezzar will destroy Egypt:

                  This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I will put an end to the hordes of Egypt by the hand of Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon. He and his army—the most ruthless of nations— will be brought in to destroy the land. They will draw their swords against Egypt and fill the land with the slain. (NIV)

              However, Nebuchadnezzar was defeated in his only attempt to invade Egypt.[7]
              [edit] Nile will dry up
              Yep, still there

              Ezekiel 30:12 continues with a prediction that the Nile River will run dry.

                  I will dry up the streams of the Nile and sell the land to evil men; by the hand of foreigners I will lay waste the land and everything in it. I the LORD have spoken. (NIV)

              There is no evidence that this has happened in recorded history.
              [edit] Triumph of Judah

              In Isaiah 7:1-7 God tells the king of Judah that he shall not be harmed by his enemies.

                  And it came to pass in the days of Ahaz the son of Jotham, the son of Uzziah, king of Judah, that Rezin the king of Syria, and Pekah the son of Remaliah, king of Israel, went up toward Jerusalem to war against it, but could not prevail against it. And it was told the house of David, saying, Syria is confederate with Ephraim. And his heart was moved, and the heart of his people, as the trees of the wood are moved with the wind. Then said the LORD unto Isaiah, Go forth now to meet Ahaz, thou, and Shearjashub thy son, at the end of the conduit of the upper pool in the highway of the fuller's field; And say unto him, Take heed, and be quiet; fear not, neither be fainthearted for the two tails of these smoking firebrands, for the fierce anger of Rezin with Syria, and of the son of Remaliah. Because Syria, Ephraim, and the son of Remaliah, have taken evil counsel against thee, saying, Let us go up against Judah, and vex it, and let us make a breach therein for us, and set a king in the midst of it, even the son of Tabeal: Thus saith the Lord GOD, It shall not stand, neither shall it come to pass.

              Yet it did come to pass. His enemies did harm him.

                  Wherefore the LORD his God delivered him into the hand of the king of Syria; and they smote him, and carried away a great multitude of them captives, and brought them to Damascus. And he was also delivered into the hand of the king of Israel, who smote him with a great slaughter. For Pekah the son of Remaliah slew in Judah an hundred and twenty thousand in one day, which were all valiant men; because they had forsaken the LORD God of their fathers.

              [edit] Isaiah predicts the Nile drying up, Sea draining

              In Isaiah 19:1-8 Isaiah tells us the Nile will dry up, ocean drains in the time of pagan Egypt.

                  Isaiah 19:1 The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD rideth upon a swift cloud, and shall come into Egypt: and the idols of Egypt shall be moved at his presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in the midst of it. 2 And I will set the Egyptians against the Egyptians: and they shall fight every one against his brother, and every one against his neighbour; city against city, and kingdom against kingdom.3 And the spirit of Egypt shall fail in the midst thereof; and I will destroy the counsel thereof: and they shall seek to the idols, and to the charmers, and to them that have familiar spirits, and to the wizards.4 And the Egyptians will I give over into the hand of a cruel lord; and a fierce king shall rule over them, saith the Lord, the LORD of hosts.5 And the waters shall fail from the sea, and the river shall be wasted and dried up.6 And they shall turn the rivers far away; and the brooks of defence shall be emptied and dried up: the reeds and flags shall wither.Isaiah 19:7 The paper reeds by the brooks, by the mouth of the brooks, and every thing sown by the brooks, shall wither, be driven away, and be no more. 8 The fishermen will groan and lament, all who cast hooks into the Nile; those who throw nets on the water will pine away.

              This is an interesting prophecy because Isaiah outlines a very clear timeframe, the alleged prophet is unmistakably referring to Pagan Egypt, which ceased to exist in the 4th Century. (Isaiah 19:1-3) Since then, Egyptians have stopped using charms, wizards, and there are no statue-worshiping idolaters anymore, (Isaiah 19:3) so the reader can conclude this isn't an end times prophecy. The alleged prophet blatantly identifies the dried up river (Isaiah 19:5) with the Nile (Isaiah 19:8). And he goes even further to say one of the seas Egypt borders will drain, and this appears to coincide with the Nile River drying up. There is absolutely no hint of this prophecy being interpreted symbolically or metaphorically. Isaiah actually goes out of his way to stress the literal, physical, carnal fulfillment of this prophecy.
              [edit] Egyptians will speak the dead language of Canaan

              In Isaiah 19:18 Isaiah says Egyptians will learn the tongue of Canaanites

                  Isaiah 19:18 In that day shall five cities in the land of Egypt speak the language of Canaan, and swear to the LORD of hosts; one shall be called, The city of destruction.

              Not only has the Canaanite language never been spoken by Egyptians, but it is now an extinct language. There is the very unlikely possibility Isaiah was referring to Hebrew, which is technically a Canaanite language. However, Hebrew was also never adopted by the Egyptians. And according to the context of this passage, Isaiah is specifically referring to Pagan Egypt, which ceased to exist in the 4th century. (See Above) So even if Egyptians started speaking Hebrew at this very moment, it would still be an inaccurate prediction. Also, it's worth noting that Isaiah believes the Egyptians will convert to Mosaic Judaism (a dead religion) and start offering sacrifices to the LORD shortly after this incident, (Isaiah 19:21) a practice no longer done by Jews since the Temple was destroyed and priesthood lost.
              [edit] Failure to smite Jebus

              In Joshua 3:10 the eponymous Jew is quoted as saying the following:

                  Hereby ye shall know that the living God is among you, and that he will without fail drive out from before you the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Hivites, and the Perizzites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Jebusites.

              This is a repetition of a promise had from God's own lips in earlier books. However, mere moments later we learn that:

                  As for the Jebusites the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the children of Judah could not drive them out; but the Jebusites dwell with the children of Judah at Jerusalem unto this day.[8]

              The Books of Samuel relate that Jerusalem eventually falls to David, however there is no mention of the Jebusites being driven out. The Book of Kings implies that the surviving Jebusites were made serfs

                      1 Kings 9:20: And all the people that were left of the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites, which were not of the children of Israel,
                      1 Kings 9:21: Their children that were left after them in the land, whom the children of Israel also were not able utterly to destroy, upon those did Solomon levy a tribute of bondservice unto this day.

              The above verses from 1 Kings also contradict Deuteronomy 20:17 (ie. the Jebusites were meant to be slaughtered entirely):

                  But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee.

              [edit] Israelites will be unbeatable

              In Exodus 23:27 God tells Moses that he will defeat every enemy he encounters:

                  I will send my terror ahead of you and throw into confusion every nation you encounter. I will make all your enemies turn their backs and run. (NIV)

              However, history indicates many defeats suffered by the Israelites. Note that most believers will pull a no true Scotsman and claim that the defeats happened only at times when the Israelites weren't pious enough.
              [edit] Land promises

              In the Bible, God allegedly made promises to Abraham to deliver him land then under the control of other tribes. For example, upon Abraham entering Canaan, Genesis 12:7 states, in part, "The LORD appeared to Abram and said, 'To your offspring I will give this land.'" (NIV) This promise was reiterated in slightly different ways throughout the books of Genesis and Exodus.

              However, this did not reasonably soon thereafter come to be, as illustrated by Hebrews 11:13, which, regarding Abraham's descendents, states,

                  All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance. And they admitted that they were aliens and strangers on earth. (NIV)

              Similarly, in Exodus 23:31 God promises to give the Israelites all the land from the Mediterranean to the Red Sea and from the Euphrates River to "the desert." Historically this never happened.

              Joshua was also promised specific land. Per Joshua 1:3-5:

                  I will give you every place where you set your foot, as I promised Moses. Your territory will extend from the desert to Lebanon, and from the great river, the Euphrates—all the Hittite country—to the Great Sea on the west. No one will be able to stand up against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so I will be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you. (NIV)

              Strangely, Joshua 11:23 indicates that he did indeed take the land:

                  So Joshua took the entire land, just as the LORD had directed Moses, and he gave it as an inheritance to Israel according to their tribal divisions. Then the land had rest from war. (NIV)

              However, history and the Bible indicate all the land was not taken. Per Joshua 13:1-5:

                  When Joshua was old and well advanced in years, the LORD said to him, "You are very old, and there are still very large areas of land to be taken over. This is the land that remains: all the regions of the Philistines and Geshurites: from the Shihor River on the east of Egypt to the territory of Ekron on the north, all of it counted as Canaanite; the territory of the five Philistine rulers in Gaza, Ashdod, Ashkelon, Gath and Ekron—that of the Avvites from the south, all the land of the Canaanites, from Arah of the Sidonians as far as Aphek, the region of the Amorites, the area of the Gebalites; and all Lebanon to the east, from Baal Gad below Mount Hermon to Lebo Hamath. (NIV)

              [edit] Israel will live in peace with its neighbors
              A Merkava vineyard planter

              Ezekiel 28:26-24 predicts that Israel will live in peace with its neighbors:

                  No longer will the people of Israel have malicious neighbors who are painful briers and sharp thorns. Then they will know that I am the Sovereign LORD. This is what the Sovereign LORD says: When I gather the people of Israel from the nations where they have been scattered, I will show myself holy among them in the sight of the nations. Then they will live in their own land, which I gave to my servant Jacob. They will live there in safety and will build houses and plant vineyards; they will live in safety when I inflict punishment on all their neighbors who maligned them. Then they will know that I am the LORD their God. (NIV)

              Ouch, that one hurt. A consistent aspect of history is that Israel has never gotten along with its neighbors. (Or, if you prefer, that its neighbors have never gotten along with it.) There's still hope that Israel and the neighbourhood will be peaceful one day, but it requires everyone in the region to stop "inflicting punishment" on each other.
              [edit] Davidic line will endure forever



              There are several specific biblical prophecies that were flat out wrong.  now gymnastically worm your way into justifying these mistakes and make them to mean the opposite of what they actually said so you can still claim they're true.  You can't.  They're just wrong.  Your god got it wrong.  So much for omniscient, I guess.

              1. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Oh Lord!!! Somebody's "angry" gimmie a sec. This length of post really boggles my mind.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  why does pointing out failed biblical prophecy make me angry, exactly?

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    I'm not sure.

              2. Cgenaea profile image59
                Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                Yes, I remember you... I will be kind so as to NOT get "banned" THIS TIME, ok??? smile
                You have found "proof" that God is a liar... Now, go find "proof" that he is NOT... I just know its there.  And since the AD kicked in, I haven't the patience to read each report.
                Tyre is gone. The Nile did or will dry. And Nebuchadnezzar's kids are probably still around. God DOES NOT lie.
                How'd I do??? smile

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  What are you talking about?

                  tyre is still there.  The king of Babylon never destroyed it.
                  The Nile has never dried up.

                  Its a biblical prophecy, supposedly from god, that FAILED.  its wrong.  Plain and simple.

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    "Proxy" Tyre is there... And the Nile has, or WILL dry. God does not lie J...

              3. Naomi's Banner profile image75
                Naomi's Bannerposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                There are many Bible prophecies that have not come to fruition yet.  That does not indicate they are incorrect.  The end result remains to be seen.

                1. JMcFarland profile image92
                  JMcFarlandposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes, but Nebuchadnezzar died several thousand years ago.  He's not exactly able to conquer anything else, is he?

                  1. Cgenaea profile image59
                    Cgenaeaposted 3 years ago in reply to this

                    At the hand of him could very possibly mean his children's children's children's grandchildren. smile