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Clip from "Star of Bethlaham"

  1. Sed-me profile image81
    Sed-meposted 2 years ago
    1. Righteous Atheist profile image59
      Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Shocking ignorance. Thanks for pointing that out. Scary how ignorant some people are isn't it?

      1. Sed-me profile image81
        Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        What specific part did you find ignorant?

        1. wilderness profile image97
          wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Maybe that the earth and moon aren't the same size.  Maybe that an "earth eclipse" would look nothing like that.  Maybe that that specific portion of sky would ONLY be visible during an earth eclipse at one tiny period of time each year with all other dates and times showing something very different.  Maybe that the constellations designed and named by man, with great imagination, does not say anything about God. 

          This is what happens when theologists try to use science they don't understand to "prove" their theology.

          1. Sed-me profile image81
            Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            It's not a "proof" it simply happened.

            1. wilderness profile image97
              wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              What happened?  That someone made a video from photoshop?  Like the dinosaurs in Jurassic Park?

              I'm confused.

              1. Sed-me profile image81
                Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                What happened? It was shown in the video clip. At the same time that history says that the man Jesus was hung on the cross, at the moment the bible records that he died, an eclipse occurred that "blacked out" the heart of Aries, the ram.

                Kepler's math, was able to calculate the map of the sky in the 1600s, but he made a mistake (based on the work of Josephus' writing) about the day Herod died. When they figure out the mistake and make the correction about the star of Bethlehem... everything falls into place. You should watch the movie, it's awesome if you like astronomy.

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzWi0tWKoxo

                1. wilderness profile image97
                  wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  Not possible; history does not even record a man named Jesus, let alone the moment of death.

                  1. Sed-me profile image81
                    Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    He is not named by name, but many historians believe there was a man that fit the description.
                    The time of death is simply taken from the bible.

                    Did you watch the whole movie? It explains quite a bit. It's interesting, even if you're not a believer.

          2. Chris Neal profile image81
            Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            Where did the guy say that the earth and moon are the same size? And if an 'earth eclipse' wouldn't look like that, what would it look like? Do you have a link?

            1. wilderness profile image97
              wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              The earth is much larger than the moon; from the moon, then, the earth would be many times the size of the sun.  Not equal, as the moon is as seen from earth.

              1. Sed-me profile image81
                Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                That's why the moon and the sun look the same size to us here on earth.

                1. wilderness profile image97
                  wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  No it's not; the size of the earth has nothing to do with what the moon looks like from the earth.  Plus, of course, the apparent size of the moon is constantly decreasing as it moves further away.

              2. Chris Neal profile image81
                Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                Really? Huh. Because the astronauts have talked about how small the Earth looks from the moon. I'm not sure whether to believe guys who have actually been to the moon and seen Earth from it or not now...

                1. wilderness profile image97
                  wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  Compared to what it looks like when standing on the surface, I bet it does look small and insignificant.  But what does that have to do with the relative sizes of each compared to sun and when standing on the surface of the moon/earth?

        2. Righteous Atheist profile image59
          Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Pretty much all of it - as wilderness has explained to you. Thanks for showing us how ignorant that person is. sad

          1. Sed-me profile image81
            Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            You didn't understand the things he was saying?
            You don't have any actual criticisms, just a blanket statement?
            Ok then. Thanks for taking the time to participate.

            1. Righteous Atheist profile image59
              Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              I understood just fine thanks. It was mostly drivel and - as has been explained to you - incorrect or outright lies. Still - must be helping you maintain your irrational belief so who am I to point out how ignorant that person actually is?

              Want some specifics -  check out what wilderness already explained to you.

              What a shame this belief system always causes you to be so aggressive.

    2. 0
      Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Sorry, I don't get it. There was no one on the moon to see it from that perspective and we don't know a specific time of his death.

      1. Righteous Atheist profile image59
        Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        We don't know he even existed. lol

      2. Chris Neal profile image81
        Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        No, there wasn't anyone on the moon, but that does not mean that we can't get a pretty good idea of what it would have looked like. We do it all the time in other contexts. Even Star Trek has heard from scientists who looked at star patterns and worked back to whether those would have been accurate. I mean in the episodes that took place on Earth.

        The Gospel of Mark states that Jesus died 'in the ninth hour.' That would have been 3 p.m.

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          Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Guys, I think we need to back up a bit. It is said that Jesus was crucified and died at passover, correct? When is passover celebrated? Passover is a spring festival, so the 15th day of Nisan begins on the night of a full moon after the northern vernal equinox. In other words it's impossible to have a solar eclipse during passover. Unless someone has information I'm not privy to.

          1. Sed-me profile image81
            Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            It's a lunar eclipse from the earth, not a solar eclipse. You can *only have a lunar eclipse during a full moon.

            1. 0
              Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              Right, but a lunar eclipse doesn't make day become dark does it?

              1. Sed-me profile image81
                Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                IDK... my husbands the expert on astronomy... Ill pick his brain when he gets home. I just really enjoyed the movie. It had a lot of good info.

                1. 0
                  Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  I've watch it before, one must have to make sure it's the right information.

  2. Nancy Hardin profile image60
    Nancy Hardinposted 2 years ago

    The only aggressiveness I found in these threads, is when someone makes fun of another's beliefs. We all have a right to believe what we want to. I don't think it's good to make fun or bash someone for having a certain belief, or no belief. I am not a churchgoing person, but I have no problem with those who do. I can believe what I want to believe, even if I want to believe we came from star people. Nobody knows exactly how the heck we all got here. Yes there are theories, but that's all they are. Theory simply means "1. abstract thought, 2. the general principles of a subject or 3. a plausible or scientifically acceptable general principle offered to explain observed facts." In other words a hypothesis about something. We have the right to have our own theories about religion. We have the right to NOT believe or TO believe, it's that simple.

    1. Sed-me profile image81
      Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      I very much appreciate those words Ms. Nancy. Thank you for speaking your mind.

    2. Righteous Atheist profile image59
      Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Do we have the right to say some of these beliefs are ridiculous? wink

  3. 0
    Rad Manposted 2 years ago

    I'm still not getting any of this. I just don't see the point. It's said he was crucified and died during passover and during the day. That would make a full moon visible on the night side of the earth, which means the moon could not have blocked out the sun and even if there was a lunar eclipse it's perspective from the moon is irrelevant as no one has seen it.

    I think this is an example of a psychics technique of throwing out erroneous information in hops that something catches.

    1. Chris Neal profile image81
      Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      It is mentioned in a Gospel that there was darkness over the land at that point.  People who look for natural explanations for this would say that it must have been a solar eclipse.

      1. Jomine Jose profile image81
        Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        And only in gospel. No contemporary person ever so it.
        Why not mention the dead men walking around in town? Why none bothered to explain?
        In truth a described eclipse by Thallus was used by a later charlatan to say that a darkness occured.

        1. Sed-me profile image81
          Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Use the edit button por favor.

          1. Jomine Jose profile image81
            Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this
            1. Sed-me profile image81
              Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              lol... you completely revised that sentence so that it makes sense... then put a bunch of question marks like you didn't understand what I meant... then posted a link to the "dishonesty of Christians."
              If I am skilled at dishonesty, I bow to your greater skills. If you dont want to discuss the link in any depth, I will letcha go.

              1. Jomine Jose profile image81
                Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                I added two more sentences which I thought is relevant. I didn't change it to mean anything completely different.

              2. Jomine Jose profile image81
                Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                I added two more sentences which I thought was relevant. I didn't change it to mean anything completely different.
                And I still didn't get this "Use the edit button por favor.".

                1. Sed-me profile image81
                  Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  Really? Cause you used the edit button, y gracias.
                  Anyhoo... let's bid each other farewell for a spell eh? smile

                  1. Jomine Jose profile image81
                    Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    You people never address the point of discussion, do you?
                    That is why the link.

              3. Jomine Jose profile image81
                Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                The OP in the link describes those who reply after reading only the first sentence perfectly.

                1. Sed-me profile image81
                  Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  Are you from India Jomine?

                  1. Jomine Jose profile image81
                    Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    Yes. My address is there on my website provided in my profile page link.

      2. 0
        Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        That's my point, It couldn't have been a solar eclipse during passover.

        1. Jomine Jose profile image81
          Jomine Joseposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Which could barely last 10 minutes, let alone 3 hours. But considering it was written by charlatans who thought two days and nights constitute three days, it's ok.

        2. Chris Neal profile image81
          Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Then what would it have been?

          1. 0
            Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            A story.

    2. Sed-me profile image81
      Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Im sorry. Im waiting for my husband to get home. He explained it to me, but he was working on the comp. while he was talking and there were like 2 min. breaks between each sentence. lol
      I really think if I try to explain it, it will not answer your precise questions. smile

      1. 0
        Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        Did you get an explanation from him yet?

        1. Sed-me profile image81
          Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          We've had a super busy couple of days... we're watching that Tom Cruise movie where he dies over and over. I'll ask him to answer your questions then. He doesn't enjoy these kinds of things so he's just being kind to me. lol

        2. Sed-me profile image81
          Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Paul read thru this and he said Chris gave you good responses. Were there any specific answers that you didn't get?

          1. 0
            Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            The question I had asked was how could there have been a solar eclipse during passover (full moon) which would have been the explanation for the darkening of the sky? If the description of his death is correct he died during sunlight and the moon wouldn't have been insight. Thanks for the effort.

            1. Sed-me profile image81
              Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              This is Paul.

              People have posted some interesting info on the subject on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucifixion_darkness ; noting Passover only takes place during a full moon, eclipses are short, and there was one on April 3, 33 AD.

              The moon, full or otherwise, is visible during daylight hours as often as it is visible to us during night hours; rising in the east & setting in the west. Look for it during the day if you haven't noticed it before. Another interesting fact is the moon and sun "look" the same size to us from earth because the Sun diameter is 400 times larger than the moon and the sun is 400 times farther away.

              Anyway, my dialog is superfluous to the main info in the original video Beth posted. The presenter is a lawyer just showing what the view of the earth looked like if one were standing on the moon at the moment of the death of Jesus of Nazareth, using an accurate app called "Starry Night Pro". It was only an interesting observation, this lawyer didn't make up the information, he simply discovered it using this software. How dd he know the exact moment of his death? He reveals how he discovered it in the third section of his full length feature presentation: http://www.bethlehemstar.net/about/  He isn't dogmatic about his discoveries, but meticulous in his research. Also, the purpose of his research wasn't to prove the existence of God, but demonstrate biblical accuracies and finding other interesting observations besides the view from the moon,

              1. Chris Neal profile image81
                Chris Nealposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                I like that.

              2. 0
                Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                Please tell Paul thanks for his effort and time.

                It does perplex me however that the video shows that the moon was in back of the earth (relative to the sun) at the time of his death therefore it could not have been in front of the earth and caused a solar eclipse.

                It appears we are confusing the full moon with the new moon. When we see the entire moon during the day it's called a new moon, when we see the entire moon during the night it's called a full moon.

                If passover happens during a full moon and the death of Jesus accordingly then there is no chance of a solar eclipse being a possible explanation to the darkness described in the bible.

  4. Sed-me profile image81
    Sed-meposted 2 years ago

    Sure Rad Man, with zero sarcasm you are 100% correct. The following simple 1 min explanation of the phases of the moon shows what you're saying: http://youtu.be/jgoIP90apEs This "Starry Night Pro" software backs up what you're saying too. It backtracks time in the sky based on Kepler's math (enhanced by Newton's math) and isn't demonstrating a solar eclipse at this moment in history. This app is showing what us humans call a "lunar eclipse". Which at night makes the moon appear reddish (if one is on that side of the earth) and lasts less than 2 hours as the moon passes through the earth's shadow. The moon would "see" a very bright sun "disappear" and then "see" only refracted sunlight which had passed through the earth's atmosphere (if anything at all). That same refracted light would of been reflected back towards the night side of the earth. Meaningless detail to the people who where observing in Jerusalem around noon their time that day. However, to a Christian it might be interesting the "ram" in our constellations happened to have a "dark heart" at that particular moment from the particular angle (standing on our moon).

    1. 0
      Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Okay good. We have established that the moon could not have blocked out the sun on that day. Good, because many have been suggesting that.

      Next you will have to find evidence that God named the constellations and their meanings and then you'll have to explain what that had to do with coming from the perspective of the moon. to this day no one has seen that perspective. You could look around for some more erroneous signs much like a psychic search and listing names until you notice and that you only remember that name. What you are saying is that on that day there may have been a lunar eclipse that line up with a constellation or group of stars? So what?

      1. Sed-me profile image81
        Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        That last reply was from Paul.

        PS... did anyone notice I spelled Bethlehem wrong in the title?
        Im a sad, sad little writer.

        1. 0
          Rad Manposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          You're asking the wrong person about spelling errors. Didn't notice, don't care. Couldn't spell it without a computer anyway.

          Tell Paul, some Atheistic Canadian says thanks.

          1. Sed-me profile image81
            Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            lol... I will... he may post more later. (Paul said you could call him if you wanted to.)

        2. Righteous Atheist profile image59
          Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          I noticed, but compared to the mistakes and falsehoods in that video, it didn't seem worth mentioning. wink

          Did you actually sit through the full video?

          1. Sed-me profile image81
            Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            We watched it on Netflix (edit, sorry someone loaned us the DVD)... I didn't watch them on Youtube.

            1. Righteous Atheist profile image59
              Righteous Atheistposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              You have more stamina for that sort of thing than I do then. Just that clip was enough to make my eyes bleed. big_smile

              1. Sed-me profile image81
                Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                That's a funny joke, thanks for taking the time to share it with me.

 
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