jump to last post 1-11 of 11 discussions (43 posts)

Testimony of Native Indians' genocide in Canada. Shame on Anglo-Saxons

  1. maxoxam41 profile image77
    maxoxam41posted 21 months ago

    http://youtu.be/88k2imkGIFA
    A vibrant testimony of what the Indians in Canada suffered from the Anglo-Saxon Catholics. In the US, Australia, Canada it seems like the white Anglo-Saxons perpetrated ethnic cleansing with impunity. WrenchBiscuit, I dedicate you this document, as a testimony of the horrors Native Indians'suffering. Your opinion?

  2. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 21 months ago

    There are many horrors of our history in America , Canada , Australia ,  hell  , everywhere .And ,    If the idea to begin with was for government  to steal away the identity of a people  by attrition ,then   I believe they succeeded . Yet in the native regions of America  the people's mission to reclaim  an identity may be on the road to a successful recovery ,   I have passed though  the native  reservations a bit and  I can see an attempt  to do just this .

    Tourism , for lack of a better venue , is being used to  show how  the native peoples journeys have  so come so far !   Historical sights visited by non-natives are being used , as well they should be , to  spread the word ,so to speak .      I personally love these history lessons !     If the native peoples of any country were beaten down by this war of attrition - then they can and are reclaiming small victories by the same manner !

    All that ANY  of us ! Have to do now is reclaim the identities of our youth culture , in any of our races !    There is  exactly where we are all losing our history .   Letting our young people fall by the way of drugs , alcohol ,lack of spiritual connections to life , to family and any pride  at all , especially  from an attitude of general apathy in life  !

  3. Oztinato profile image83
    Oztinatoposted 21 months ago

    I am amazed people are not protesting about the history and current issues regarding indigenous peoples: the media and general population are more concerned with trivialities. The hypocrisy in this situation is so abysmal that it reflects badly on the general standard of social priorities. It is also a harbinger of a deep spiritual malaise that will no doubt trigger awful karmic consequences.

    1. ahorseback profile image46
      ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

      Yes  true except , you have to take into context the natives  unwillingness and deep desire NOT to want to adapt   their culture to ours  .   They don't want what  America has . =  Culture differences  are too ideologically separate ,at least    In my understanding .

      1. Oztinato profile image83
        Oztinatoposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        I think the truth is worse than that. Here in Australia indigenous people were brutalized, poisoned, shot, herded onto missions, land disinherited,  languages destroyed and also had families deliberately separated. Added to this was the attempt to totally eradicate all traces of indigenous culture. This has lasting effects on many many generations.

        1. ahorseback profile image46
          ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

          Of course it's "worse than that ", it's a travesty .  Today's  criticisms  though aren't based using history  to verify  the cruelty of the time , BUT  using hindsight .     Consider being in the center of this issue but IN  the past . It was a war ,  the native tribes were unfriendly to even there own people at times , but especially other tribes ,  ' and most anyone that came along .   Was there a  war against them from the beginning , Yes .   Were they also in this war from the beginning , yes .

          Native Americans , for good reason , were as if the" big bad wolf " were  alive and living in the woods right near your house . Why ? because they were !   What Americans of today fail to do is to read the real history " of those times",   Yes,,  the same atrocities were carried out against them ,those  that they used against others AND there own kind , and worse  .  Yet we need to keep real history in perspective .

          What I said above is true still . Native Americans  didn't then and don't want to assimilate  , even today !

          They are also  sovereign nations within our own  nation  , in America that is  ,  still want to tell them what to do according to our standards , or do you leave them be ?

          1. maxoxam41 profile image77
            maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

            Who would befriend people who steal their land, livelihood...?
            If they don't want to live in an Anglo-Saxon culture it should be their right. There's nothing to envy us. They were free, we enslaved them in our so-called civilized society.
            In the documentary, it is said that the children are still suffering. Didn't he refer to paedophilia? Doesn't it mean that in some way such institutions still exist? You know like foster care abuse children...

          2. Oztinato profile image83
            Oztinatoposted 21 months ago in reply to this

            You have presented here a typical stereotype. I have studied anthropology and I can assure you that a civilization would not last a few generations under your simplistic description.
            When Europeans invaded it was then a war setting. In wars terrible things happen.
            Also I am not saying indigenous cultures were perfect. In any society there are good and bad. Certainly some ancient indigenous civilizations decayed and disintegrated just as many ancient European civilizations.
            However in the particular scenario of this forum topic the barbarity of the invaders makes the Indians look positively saintly.

            1. maxoxam41 profile image77
              maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

              Answer to horseback's last comment.
              Who are we to pretend to bring the best model of society? For proof, most western countries accept the killing of children and civilians to enrich their elite, they accept the killing of racial minorities by the so-called branch of society that is supposed to serve and protect, they vilify homosexuals, transgenders, democracy to their eyes is a reality, individualism reigns and so forth...
              I understand why they don't want to assimilate.

              1. ahorseback profile image46
                ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

                Were talking  old history of America here ,   of course  indigenous people  were persecuted .   They were also  a defeated  society in time of wars ,and un- like many defeated societies  ,  they  were  allowed  to  treaty .  Lets ask ourselves this though , Are they working as hard as they could with what they are given  to grow their culture  into a successful  society ?       Many of them  receive allowances as tribes , do they do the best they can with that ?   Not unlike America's   culture ,  they are also  fighting to keep their  cultural  identity . Are they succeeding ?

                1. maxoxam41 profile image77
                  maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

                  What about if they don't want to be slaves that is to say to stick to your model of society, to work hard? Why does it have to be the point of reference?

            2. ahorseback profile image46
              ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

              And My answer is stereotypical !    My point is simply ,natives were as brutal and in the beginning a just as major a  threat to the new world .  Simply put -they were the defeated entity in this conflict  .  Here is a better question , Why are so many people better  at and more comfortable being the victims ? Stop supporting victimization  and start requiring  accountability in the native populations ,in many cases  they are and do , why can't you  !

        2. maxoxam41 profile image77
          maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

          And who is at the origin of those atrocities, the British and its offspring.

          1. wilderness profile image95
            wildernessposted 21 months ago in reply to this

            I thought you said it was the Christians of the time?

            1. maxoxam41 profile image77
              maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

              If you don't follow, don't waste my time. If it was an attempt to ridicule me through a puerile joke, it didn't work.

              1. wilderness profile image95
                wildernessposted 21 months ago in reply to this

                Sorry.  In the OP, you said: "A vibrant testimony of what the Indians in Canada suffered from the Anglo-Saxon Catholics. ".  I thought Catholics were Christians, although I know that some claim otherwise.  As a great deal of the damage was done in the name of "converting" that natives as well as the general attitude that because they weren't Christian they didn't count as real "people" it seemed more important that the origin of the invaders.

                1. maxoxam41 profile image77
                  maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

                  For Christians or Catholics, it is in the name of Christ.

      2. maxoxam41 profile image77
        maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

        Why do they have to adapt? We were supposed to adapt, not them. It is their land. I would have preferred the rule and laws of the Natives versus the Anglo-Saxons that have a long history of exploitation and ethnic cleansing.

  4. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 21 months ago

    I suggest everyone read  some ' real' history ,   In the early days  of the New England  colonies ,  the very real fear of killings, abductions , slaughtering of families  was all very, very real . Why ?. Because it happened .    Early Native American tribes warred  against each others tribes AND sometimes against there own peoples .   Cruelties of warfare were not exclusive to white men either , now that goes against   political correctness  when describing said  wars against Native American  , I know !.  Some of the most inhuman  atrocities  of torture  came from Native Americans too .

    There is no one particular  guilty party to the history of Anglo- Native relations  ,   all parties were guilty of  stealing , killing , rape , torture ...........Lets face it . In  the history of  wars all over this world there are the victors  and there are the defeated societies ,  generally the defeated do what ? They  most often assimilate into the victors cultures  ,    Native tribes ., some of them , chose not to do that . AND In treaties  ,    these very tribes were granted sovereign   citizenship in there own nation , if they so chose ! Most tribes within the US.  have there own   !       So, in that sense  there are many nations within this  nation  . 

    Does that make the United States wholly responsible  for the people of these  reservations ?   Only by conditional treaty .    Have we honored completely those treaties ? No.    but that's another issue .    But maybe  another hundred or so  gaming casino's will allow the Native Americans to be able to afford  more economic   success  stories for their  own people 's , you know , things like food ,better shelter ,  better  educations , college's of and for  their own teachings ,  As to  economic , cultural ,  and  political  failures  The blame is not all  theirs   , nor is it all ours !

    1. Credence2 profile image84
      Credence2posted 21 months ago in reply to this

      Having lived on the Crow reservation in Montana while employed in the area, you recognize that the anger of native american people there go beyond being compensated for with 'money' The white man's system considers exchange of money as due compensation for what was taken. For the tribe something more fundamental was taken, a way of life. The Government offers mere trinkets relative to this. But we cannot return to a 19th century reality, thus the continued frustration of  allNative indiginous people awaiting an answer to: "when do you give it back'?

      1. ahorseback profile image46
        ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        As a matter of fact , we don't "give it back " , nor are we required to "give it back " , ask any nation defeated by an outside influence !   Does any victorious nation EVER give it back ?   Morally , of course it was all a travesty .      What war isn't ?      But  just what  does a wandering , migrating  , native  culture that owned no  land  nor understands the ownership of land --- in their own words , ever  demand they "get it back "?  Just what is  IT  ,anyway ?

        The problems associated with the loss of cultural identity is another story .   Although  , not many indigenous  native cultures seem to  have that  under control either , welcome to America people !    Just what is it you want back ?

        1. maxoxam41 profile image77
          maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

          All the empires gave back the land they conquered besides England and its "commonwealth". To know that it was their land was enough for them. We had to accompany it with a title to make it official.
          Not understanding a culture doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

      2. maxoxam41 profile image77
        maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

        It is interesting that you referred to the white man, it says it all.  Given the history of the US, it is a well deserved appellation. They are not Americans but only distinguishable by their color, the white man. I like that.

  5. maxoxam41 profile image77
    maxoxam41posted 21 months ago

    Who writes history? The victors.
    Had the invasion by the Anglo-Saxons happened now, there would be no difference with what is happening in Palestine.
    Casinos are a pittance, are you joking?

  6. Oztinato profile image83
    Oztinatoposted 21 months ago

    Japan was defeated in world war two and immediately the allies made attempts to restore the Japanese economy and to rebuild the infrastructure and culture etc.

    1. maxoxam41 profile image77
      maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

      Japan was defeated by shameful nuclear bombing (as done in Yemen presently) just after Japan acknowledged its defeat. So let's not glorify allies that didn't deserve honors. IfJapan was rebuilt by the allies it wasn't for the Japanese benefit, was it?

      1. Oztinato profile image83
        Oztinatoposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        I was responding to the "point" that alleged conquered peoples have to accept defeat etc(made by critics). The fact is that modern civilized conquerors assist the conquered peoples; they do not leave them in a permanent state of moral defeat.

        1. ahorseback profile image46
          ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

          And just what" modern civilized conqueror's" are these ?

      2. ahorseback profile image46
        ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        At the time and given Japans  violent  colonialism , that which happened -Had to happen !
        And they had not acknowledged  defeat yet -to the rest of the world , only among some of their own leaders ,   The US was staring down the road of tens or hundreds  of thousands  of soldiers dying  in a land  invasion .  The bomb HAD to happen , get your facts straight before making  an apologists  statement like that !'      How about some brushing up on real history ?

        1. maxoxam41 profile image77
          maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

          If I accept your logic because of the violent of the US (throwing wars everywhere it salivates about the natural resources of a country) it will deserve the same end than Hiroshima or Nagazaki?

  7. Oztinato profile image83
    Oztinatoposted 21 months ago

    You have not responded to any of my points.
    Constant stereotyping could well be seen as bigotry.

  8. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 21 months ago

    I'm not sure what it is about those of you who feel some comfort in  resorting to an apologist's reactionary  stand in forums .  Is it because you feel discomfort in being part of a larger population  that demands  some accountability in  our  countries historical content .   Native American issues ,  the wars of the past ,  the history of slavery ,   the manifest destiny  of the U.S. ,   

    Does being some part of todays  reality  actually bother your conscience so much as to adopt an apologist attitude to every issue of political correctness . Is it because you cannot change our  checkered history and feel some  geo- socio-  guilt  complex and feel to the need to apologize to everyone - just in forums ?

    There are times when  we have to just admit , - We today  were not a part of these historical events , facts or fictions .    And so , the comfort level of active apologist's  OR  adopted victimization attitudes serves only to keep old wounds open and festering .   In other words   we today,  were not marauding cavalry soldiers ,     not violent slave owners ,  not colonial kings  and not the victims of these  either .

    We all would do far, far more good by going to the voting booths - at better than less than a  half of our voting population and making changes , real changes !

    1. janesix profile image59
      janesixposted 21 months ago in reply to this

      +1

  9. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 21 months ago

    In reality , besides the usual dissection of  any historical happening ,  Those who  judge the acts of long ago history  by the standards of our present day  socio-maturity  are merely finding fault for political reasoning  !   Apologist's  and  victimization activists  are  always hard at work to  find fault with  our countries history . 

    Here's some advice for the O.P.  , lets go ask the Native American or Native Canadian  just what they want out of  us now ! Seems like you'd get a more honest agenda  for discussion .   I say let's stop apologizing for ancient history !

  10. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 21 months ago

    And by the way , I have this theory that the Native  North Americans should stop whining about the atrocities  related to Columbus Day and start calling for giving back this country to the real indigenous native . Those who came over the land bridge from .....where  Siberia ?   Possibly  the peoples from the south pacific or Hawaii or even the Mayans ?   . Hey , just saying , let's go all the way , we don't want to make two wrongs instead of right , right ? Maybe we should give it all to Ward Churchill - let him divvy it up !

    1. wilderness profile image95
      wildernessposted 21 months ago in reply to this

      Shh.  You're not supposed to ever mention that it was stolen in the first place.

      1. ahorseback profile image46
        ahorsebackposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        It wasn't stolen , it was taken !    May the strongest man win !

    2. maxoxam41 profile image77
      maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

      It makes no sense whatsoever.

  11. Castlepaloma profile image22
    Castlepalomaposted 21 months ago

    As the story continues to the middle east. Don't want those browns around. Too bad they will win the earth in the end, when we mix all our skin colours together and become brown :-)

    1. maxoxam41 profile image77
      maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

      Can you be more explicit?

      1. Castlepaloma profile image22
        Castlepalomaposted 21 months ago in reply to this

        The only predominate white country USA has attack was Germany because they wanted to own the World, that's America's job. America has attacked 79 brown countries.

        1. maxoxam41 profile image77
          maxoxam41posted 21 months ago in reply to this

          Indeed. What is also interesting is that Germany to the eyes of the Second World War alliance has still its statute of enemy, it implies that the US, France or England could attack her on a whim. I read it recently.

          1. Castlepaloma profile image22
            Castlepalomaposted 21 months ago in reply to this

            The good thing is when we mix all the colour skins of the world.  We will BE all Brown, with nobody to attack except ourselves.

 
working