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The Bible....

  1. 0
    ellie1142545posted 7 years ago

    I'm just curious....Does anyone really know what the Bible really is?  Do you read it daily, sometimes, or not at all?  All are welcome to reply, but because of so many differant beliefs, I ask that everyone be respectful.....

    1. chukra G profile image61
      chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      i am just curious to know whether
      besides bible have you ever read any other religion so far?

      1. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        No...Not really....And why do you use the word religion?  It's just a mere word, and has nothing to do with beliefs.....Peace!

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Allow me to introduce you to the true word of the one true god then. As you discard the bible for the worthless religionist trash it is - you should seek out the FSM and ask him (or her) to touch you in a non-sexual way (unless that is your preference) to guide you to the real truth.

          Ramen

          1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
            Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Trash? were you absent when the poster requested respect !

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Where I come from respect has to be earned. Sorry.

              Do you automatically respect everything I say - apparently not judging from your comments. You should respect my opinion that the bible and religionist spoutings are trash. No?

              A one way street perhaps?

              http://markpknowles.com/wp-content/gallery/offensive-to-all/atheist.jpg

              1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
                Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Mark where I come from that statement was arrogant

                and dont say sorry -when youre not

                I would consider it very immature to put down something you hold dear , just because I could, or thought a particular author was trash.

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Now you know what you sound like.

                  And I am sorry. Truly, genuinely sorry that you need to earn respect - not demand it.

                  Really, really sorry.......................

              2. Valerie F profile image62
                Valerie Fposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I don't find that cartoon represents your reaction just to disrespect from people claiming this, that, or another faith. Rather than attempt to break the crosses of only those who have bashed you over the head with them, you do that to people who try not to do that.

                Where I come from, respect for others is considered the default for basic politeness. It's disrespect that must be earned.

                I could easily turn that cartoon around. An atheist chases random believers around, calling them "primitive, superstitious, irrational evolutionary throwbacks from the Dark Ages, responsible for atrocities in the name of some old fairy in the sky..."

                When they get tired of the insults and leave, the atheist then cries, "But you're not answering my questions!"

                Or a believer gets sorely provoked and smacks the atheist with a religious symbol of his or her choice, at which point the atheist demands respect.

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  And this is how you earn that disrespect. I have quite clearly explained to you why this cartoon is perfectly appropriate.

                  You prefer to argue with me that it was the atheists who started going around accusing people of poor behavior and that believing in god was foolish.

                  Wait a minute! That won't work because the term atheist would not exist if it hadn't been for the believers selling god and telling people they are fools for not believing.

                  I understand that this is not an acceptable viewpoint for you, but that doesn't really matter. This cartoon very accurately represents the way I feel, and many others do also.

                  Whether you choose to listen to me is up to you. You arguing with me that it is really my fault, and I started it without provocation is not really going to change my mind.

                  I have read the bible.

                  It clearly tells me in words I can understand and do not need to look into a deeper meaning of, or discern the intent behind, that I am a fool.

                  Every time some one tells me they believe in the bible and accept everything it says, they are calling me a fool.

                  Yet I am the one making an unprovoked attack? wink

                  1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
                    Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    He said
                    She said
                    An on it goes...

                  2. Valerie F profile image62
                    Valerie Fposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Mark, there is one way to avoid earning disrespect. That's to not behave like a hypocrite. If you think deliberately insulting people for their beliefs or opinions is a bad thing, don't do it yourself.

            2. usmanali81 profile image61
              usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              LOL

              There is no word of respect in the world of atheists, they prefer to follow their monkey elders.

              1. Colebabie profile image62
                Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Rude.

                1. usmanali81 profile image61
                  usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes, atheists are rude

                  1. Colebabie profile image62
                    Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I was talking about you. I know we'll never see eye to eye usman. You and I have already had a discussion that led no where. I just have to ask you to please learn and consider others before you use your words. Ask questions, be open. I know that is asking a lot. And I'm fairly certain you won't listen. But I had to ask.

              2. earnestshub profile image87
                earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                So now everyone who does not follow usmanali's beliefs is from a different species!

                1. usmanali81 profile image61
                  usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  No, it's not like that. Anyone who supports theory of rubbish (evolution) is supposed to be from a different species.

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                    sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Says who?

                  2. goodfriendiam profile image60
                    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I hear what you are trying to say. But I know from experience, that most people, are so very tired, hurt, upset. Because we have so much religion here in USA and everywhere, constantly trying to convince us of there way or no way, so people begin to rebel, against all said and known religion, and begin to form there own theory's. Its not a thing truly of disrespect, just tired and anger that's all.

          2. 0
            ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I don't know you, and I don't want to know you....What you just said about the Bible....I wonder if you really know what you've done....

            1. fierycj profile image86
              fierycjposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              O he knows...trust me, he knows.

              1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Yes, he does.

                He has brought down the wrath of a vengeful, jealous god. I know - I have read her hubs. lol

              2. 0
                ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Is he one of those who claim to know it from cover to cover?

          3. 0
            ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Excuse Me?  I don't, and will never, discard the Bible....The Bible Is written By....God's Words, to the Scripter's ear....The Bible Is True....Don't put words in my mouth that doesn't fit....

            Religion is just a mere word....Just like denomination....They have nothing to do with Christianity, nor any other belief.....

            I know the real truth....So...since we don't agree, lets agree to disagree and leave it at that...

          4. nicomp profile image60
            nicompposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            FSM is old and tired. The poster child for straw-man arguments.

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Show some respect for the One True God please.

              1. nicomp profile image60
                nicompposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Done and done

          5. nicomp profile image60
            nicompposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Tired old strawman

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Nice contribution to the discussion - again. wink

        2. chukra G profile image61
          chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          most of us holding tight to religion beliefs and missed to understand the message, understand the message and your beliefs, God is not beliefs, religion is, GOD is TRUTH not beliefs....Peace for you too smile

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            ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Yes, God is truth....God is not belief, and religion, is just a mere word....When someone asks me, what is your religion, I'll ask them, what do you mean?  Then they generally ask, what is you Faith....Mine is the Christian Faith....I stand upon the Word of God....Peace!

            1. chukra G profile image61
              chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              God is not neither faith, God is truth, faith is not

              1. chukra G profile image61
                chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                even the word truth is not truth compare to god

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                  ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Oh yes...Faith is very real...I have Faith In Jesus Christ, The one who died for all.....

                  1. chukra G profile image61
                    chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    know yourself first,

              2. 0
                ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Oh dear, better agree to disagree....Leave it at that....

      2. IntimatEvolution profile image81
        IntimatEvolutionposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Man I know that this has gotten alot of responses, so I'm probably not adding to it's dialog.  However, I thought these two questions were real important questions especially geared towards "God loving" denominations like Judaism, Islamic and Christian religions.

        I don't think a herd of elephants coming at me full speed, could convince me that out of any of these groups that 2/3's of their populaces have researched or read historical doctrines pertaining to the fundamental foundation to some other religion, let alone their own!

        As a believer in God and Christ and Aliens, and...., I find that overwhelming irresponsible of "so called believers", and I find it incredibly sad. 

        Just my thought on the matter.

    2. fishmox profile image59
      fishmoxposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The Bible is a collection of 66 Books (the Protestant version, that is) all inspired by God.
      I can tell you what the Bible DOES NOT say.
      It DOES NOT say that one has to accept Jesus Christ to be born again.
      It DOES NOT say that the Bible is for all men.
      It DOES NOT say that the power to be sons of God is thru receiving Christ.
      It DOES NOT say that the belief of or obedience to the gospel results in one's eternal salvation.
      It DOES NOT say that church members of today are to give 10% of their income.
      It DOES NOT say that wrong beliefs, unbelief, wrong theologies, wrong creeds, wrong doctrines RESULT in eternal damnation.

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        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        1) No it doesn't...It is for those who beliee in in it's intirety...

        2)No it doesn't....The Power is of the Holy Spirit....

        3) No it doesn't....And that's where many people err....There is only one way to Eternal Salvation....

        4) No it doesn't....I give because I want to.  I consider it a privilage to give.....

        5)  This is where you are wrong...It does say so...Read the Book of Revalation....

    3. Make  Money profile image71
      Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I generally have an online version of the Bible opened in another tab when I come into these Religion forums.

      You know just in case our curly haired friend by the name of Mark Knowles wants to discuss the Word of God. smile

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        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        From all the forums I've been on, he's always been against...And he's worse here....I asked everyone to show respect, and all he's done is shown condemnation....

        1. janni321 profile image61
          janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          He has no concerns with respect. May be he doesn't know the meaning of these words like respect, honor, esteem and similar words.

          1. 0
            ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I have to agree with you there...Peace!

      2. pjk_artist profile image78
        pjk_artistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Has anyone explained to all of you what the bible really is yet?
        Its all parabolic revelation instructing you how to discover God within you. It additionally imparts to man instructions on how to use the power of God within you to make your life on earth better. Read my hub on the Three Little Pigs and The Holy Bible for more details.

    4. iantoPF profile image87
      iantoPFposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I'm very new to Hub and I read through this discussion with interest. I wanted to answer your question directly though;
      I read sections of the Bible occasionally. Though I read it completely as a child now I use it mostly for reference.
      I am convinced that the Bible is a collection of Hebrew Mythology followed by a middle-eastern legend. the mythology is useful for the valuable lessons and insights in the stories, the middle-eastern legend is of interest to amateur historians such as myself.

    5. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Dear,

      Bible is not the word of God at all.

    6. Mobile Phones profile image60
      Mobile Phonesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      If the Bible had anything to do with Cell Phones, I would have read it but ......

      http://hubpages.com/x/hub_32.gif cool http://hubpages.com/x/hub_32.gif

      1. Jewels profile image82
        Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        :LOL:

    7. kingjames4ever profile image59
      kingjames4everposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      My second name is James, and I'm a Christian, so I thought about KJV of the Bible so I used that as my user name here in Hubpages.

      Anyway,

      The Bible is the progressive revelation of God Himself from the Old Testament to the New Testament, through Himself being The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, in relation with His creations, especially His people.

      I read it often.

      1. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Thank yoou for your reply, I to read mine often...God Bless!

    8. lorgh profile image59
      lorghposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The Bible is just the words of God in printed form.
      It's like a history book, values, songs, romances, and scifi all rolled in to one book.
      Or talking about it being scifi it puts things into a different view.
      If you lived during that time how would you explain things that are happing now to your best friend.
      Ghost, man, there are some cool stories about ghosts.
      Demons, shoot, they all there. Their names and what they do to your body.
      Come to think about it the diciples thought Jesus was a ghost when he walked on the water.
      Just read it for yourself and take your time if you want.
      It is up to you. 
      Just remember to repent if it gets too scary.

    9. Mobile Phones profile image60
      Mobile Phonesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Atheist Inside the House.

      http://z.hubpages.com/u/209654_f260.jpg

    10. lilpichie profile image58
      lilpichieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hello my comment the bible in my opinion is like a guide for mankind I don't read it daily but I should I believe it gives you comfort and understanding to some questions that a person may have.  I only read the king james version I don't believe that you should mix different readings because this is how you get confused.  I am not an expert I would say also that you could ask a pastor in regards to other questions that you may have.  I hope this helped

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        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Amen to that....I've read numerous Bible's over the years....AMV, NIV, NKJV, TLV, EVMM....I always think of the KJV....The last two I had, my Son, has the one that I inherited from my Mom, and a very close friend, who needed it for her Church now owns the last one....Missed it so much, that I just bought another one....And for all you who own one, and the first word on it is The, like my last 2 had....This one has Holy Bible....

    11. SparklingJewel profile image66
      SparklingJewelposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      sooo, sticking with the subject of the thread...the Bible is a book of God, like every other holy book and books even about philosophies and other belief systems.

      How a person perceives God is unique and individual...yet people can have unity in their diversity...hence religious groups and mystery schools, etc...

      The Bible, like all the others, are human interpretations of perceptions of God. When a human's words about God are spoken and written in "the flame of truth", then another person can "sense" that "truth" and connect with it and learn to emulate and reiterate that "truth". But the "way is narrow", and easily misinterpreted, so teachings go astray, but can be recovered and continue to be reiterated...that is why some holy books,etc., affect some and not others...

      it's kind of like recurring waves, that depending on other conditions around the waves, can change in height and strength and recurrence rate. And depending on where a person is standing on the beach or actually in the water, the waves affect each person differently.

    12. Bibowen profile image90
      Bibowenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I could give you an encyclopedic response, but I think that would miss the point.

      I believe that the Bible is the Word of God, that it's a book written by men, but inspired by God. That it's assessment of the human condition is total, that it reveals the greatest love story ever written, that it states the problem and provides the solution, that it contains the greatest joy and the greatest terror, and that we are accountable for what it says and will one day be judged by it.

      My personal experience has been that when I live my life by it, life is good and when I ignore it, life is not. I'm not always successful, but I try to read some of it every day and I have been doing that for many years. Its words ring true in my experience.

      In short, I love the Bible and the God that gave it to us.

      1. Randy Godwin profile image92
        Randy Godwinposted 7 years ago in reply to this
      2. usmanali81 profile image61
        usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I am sorry, but i can not hide the truth, your Bibles have got some grave defects. Part of it, yes, may be a word of God. And i am sure you ignore the pornographic verses of Bibles and dont prefer to read them often.

        1. Randy Godwin profile image92
          Randy Godwinposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I play it safe, I believe all of the Bibles were written by flawed individuals, ordinary men who loved to hear themselves talk.  Just like you and I.

          1. Bibowen profile image90
            Bibowenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I agree with all of it except the part about "men who loved to hear themselves talk." You couldn't possibly make a judgment like that from having read it. Why don't you find a substantive critique. Nothing you have said undermines the Bible's divine authority.

            1. Randy Godwin profile image92
              Randy Godwinposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              And nothing you've said upholds it.

            2. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Divine authority over who?

        2. JonTutor profile image60
          JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Ya gotta be funny.... Mohammed himself ordered his adopted son to divorce his wife to satisfy his lust... and also married minor..... incest and pedophile gotta be ok... but alleged "pornagraphic" verses objectionable.... you're so funny  lol

          1. usmanali81 profile image61
            usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            No, that's not the case. You are quoting out of context.

            Let me tell you the meaning of context.

            Suppose
            (a) You are going through brain surgery.

            Now if i take the above statement (a) out of context and say that you are a mental patient by birth that's why you are having a brain surgery, it will be illogical. When you are having a brain surgery then there is a context, the context may be that you have struck your head against wall or the context may be that a decent person have punched your head repeatidly or the context may be that you are mentally sick by birth. NOW THAT'S THE IMPORTANCE OF CONTEXT. Unless i get the context of your brain surgery it's illogical to give my own meaning and say that you are a mental patient by birth.

            1. JonTutor profile image60
              JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              What context????.... Ya know I'm mentioning about your prophet's libido...11-13 wives... marrying his own DIL.... having sex with 9 yr old... horny old man. lol

        3. Bibowen profile image90
          Bibowenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          What if I do ignore the pornographic sections (whatever that means)? That does nothing to undermine the veracity of the Bible. The Bible's claims are not made false by my negative reactions to it.

          1. Mark Knowles profile image60
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Neither are they made true by your positive reactions to it. wink

            Although, the muslimist is best ignored...........

          2. 61
            START SMARTposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Dear, pornographic means nude, nakedness, obsenity. Do you really think these pornographic verses of Bibles are from God ???

            1. candice5 profile image61
              candice5posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Hello funny that squidward seems to be following you, doing a sock puppet.

              1. 61
                START SMARTposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                You also seem to be following me.

                1. candice5 profile image61
                  candice5posted 7 years ago in reply to this
          3. JonTutor profile image60
            JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Any claim not verifiable by experiments and experiences that can be replicated.... IMO fair game to be challenged. smile

            1. fishmox profile image59
              fishmoxposted 7 years ago in reply to this



              He is probably referring to the Song of Solomon which has some very descriptive language in it that some of our lady classmates in the Bible college I went to blushed and some actually stepped out of the room from embarassment.

              Take these verses for example:
              Thy lips, O my spouse, drop as the honeycomb: honey and milk are under thy tongue; and the smell of thy garments is like the smell of Lebanon.
              1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead. 2 Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them. 3 Thy lips are like a thread of scarlet, and thy speech is comely: thy temples are like a piece of a pomegranate within thy locks. 4 Thy neck is like the tower of David builded for an armoury, whereon there hang a thousand bucklers, all shields of mighty men. 5 Thy two breasts are like two young roes that are twins, which feed among the lilies. ..........Thy lips, O my spouse, drop as the honeycomb: honey and milk are under thy tongue; and the smell of thy garments is like the smell of Lebanon. (Song of Solomon 4:1-5,11).

              or these:

              1 How beautiful are thy feet with shoes, O prince's daughter! the joints of thy thighs are like jewels, the work of the hands of a cunning workman. 2 Thy navel is like a round goblet, which wanteth not liquor: F22 thy belly is like an heap of wheat set about with lilies. 3 Thy two breasts are like two young roes that are twins. 4 Thy neck is as a tower of ivory; thine eyes like the fishpools in Heshbon, by the gate of Bathrabbim: thy nose is as the tower of Lebanon which looketh toward Damascus. 5 Thine head upon thee is like Carmel, F23 and the hair of thine head like purple; the king is held in the galleries. 6 How fair and how pleasant art thou, O love, for delights! 7 This thy stature is like to a palm tree, and thy breasts to clusters of grapes. 8 I said, I will go up to the palm tree, I will take hold of the boughs thereof: now also thy breasts shall be as clusters of the vine, and the smell of thy nose like apples; 9 And the roof of thy mouth like the best wine for my beloved, that goeth down sweetly,  causing the lips of those that are asleep to speak.

              (Song of Solomon 7:1-9)

              You call that pornography ?
              Man, check out the stuff in the bookstores that pass themselves off as novels.

              1. Make  Money profile image71
                Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                This is cool.  The Douay-Rheims Bible compares the Song of Solomon to Christ speaking of His bride, you know how His church is often referred to as His bride.

                The sub-title for Chapter 4 is "Christ sets forth the graces of his spouse: and declares his love for her."

                The sub-title for Chapter 7 is "A further description of the graces of the church the spouse of Christ."

            2. Bibowen profile image90
              Bibowenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              As a Christian, I am not opposed to any idea that I put forth as "fair game to be challenged." As for your claim that "any claim not verifiable by experiments and experience that can be replicated" is itself a claim that is not subject to verification by experiments and experience. It's simply a claim like any other. This village positivism was abandoned long ago.

              1. JonTutor profile image60
                JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Exactly dude... but what "claim" seems more to logical to ya?

    13. petsnakes profile image81
      petsnakesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I try to read it on a regular basis and/or participate in online forums/communities that make me use it as a resource. As a Christian I feel I should be well armed to answer any questions people might have about it from a Biblical perspective. Not to mention it is imperative for my spiritual health to consume the word of the Lord.

      1. onthewriteside profile image73
        onthewritesideposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        If you want to read the "word of the Lord", you would first want to be well-versed in where that "Word" came from in the first place.  The New Testament is based upon the Old Testament, and the OT is what is considered the "word of God", (specifically the Pentateuch, the first 5 books).  When you consider that the stories in the Torah (or Pentateuch) are mere generic copies of MUCH older and much more detailed tales told throughout Mesopotamia, and had to do, originally, with a full Pantheon of multiple Gods and Goddesses, then you will realized the fallacy of Judeo-Christian-Islamic "monotheism".  Or at least you would realize that the stories in the Bible, whether they be based on actual events or not, were clearly not based on what the Bible says they were, but rather what the older, more precise texts said they were.

    14. jacobkuttyta profile image46
      jacobkuttytaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Almost every day I read bible.  There are exceptions also.

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I don't read it know more myself, I use to read religiously, but then I decided to walk away from it, the bible that it is, and just start asking myself questions, ya know throw out questions and then kinda wait to see what comes back. I like two books in bible Esther and songs of Solomon.

        1. AEvans profile image71
          AEvansposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          My two favorite books are the book of Psalms and Corinthians, I take it back there are a total of four. Genesis and Revelations. smile

  2. janni321 profile image61
    janni321posted 7 years ago

    Todays bible is not completely that one that revealed on Jesus Christ

    1. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      True, it's not in Hebrew, or Greek, but King James is as close as it gets....

      1. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ah - you speak Hebrew and Greek also. Where did you study these languages you speak so fluently?

        1. fierycj profile image86
          fierycjposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          And Mark Knowles is just warming up.

          1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
            Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Maybe he will be a star in your next movie CJ...

            1. fierycj profile image86
              fierycjposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Ha ha. I know just the part.

            2. goodfriendiam profile image60
              goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              That is to funny, he would defiantly be a huge "BOOM", in your face, lightening rod sort of guy.(by the way Mark that is a compliment) dee

              1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
                Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Yep goodfriend and I will be the leading lady lol theres some fireworks right there BOOM! lol smile

                1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                  goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  LOL if  the movie isn't a bang at the box office, eaglekiwi, will share a margarita with the little umbrellas of course, down on the beach laughing our _ss off.

        2. fierycj profile image86
          fierycjposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          And Mark Knowles is just warming up.

        3. 0
          ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          No, I just know that when the Scrolls were first written they were written in Hebrew...And then in Greek...

          1. Misha profile image77
            Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            So, how do you know that what you read in English has any resemblance of original scrolls? You have no way of checking it for yourself, right?

            1. 0
              ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Sure I have a way, just like everyone else....King James though, is/was translated directly from the scrolls...The other Bibles like NIV, AMV, etc.  Is translated, taking the thee's, thy's, and thou's out, making it easier to understand....Oh, and lets not forget the begat's....Peace!

              In case your wondering though, most people who claim they know all about the Bible, have gotten their information from the computer....Anything I need to know, will be asked of, and answered by, God....

              1. usmanali81 profile image61
                usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Look at the conflict in the following regarding King James Version.

                "THE MOST ACCURATE AND CLOSE RENDERING OF THE ORIGINAL" — (The Times)

                "YET THE KING JAMES VERSION HAS GRAVE DEFECTS." And, "THAT THESE DEFECTS ARE SO MANY AND SO SERIOUS AS TO CALL FOR REVISION . . ." Preface RSV 1971

                Following is a photographic reproduction from the R.S.V. 1971

                http://z.hubpages.com/u/1368707_f520.jpg

                Your media claiming it to be the finest version but your own Bible says there are grave defects in it. WHAT'S THIS ???

      2. 0
        dennisemattposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Some would argue that King James purposely changed the Bible to fit his beliefs. Unless you know how to read Hebrew and Greek,  you have no idea what translation is most accurate. It would be helpfull to have acess to the original Dead Sea Scrolls too.

      3. usmanali81 profile image61
        usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        not 100%

        you dont have 100% the same Injeel as was revealed on Jesus (peace be upon him). Also it contains numerous defects.

      4. BISG Writer profile image59
        BISG Writerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ahhhh, there's the rub. The King James version is what is available to most Christians today. First, however, you must look back at the Council of Nicea that determined which writings should be included in a bible.

        Then you must remember the instructions King James gave to his writers that basically said if they ran across a problem between their interpretation of the original language and the current Catholic Bible, they should follow the Catholic Bible.

        I believe Jesus gave us the short version when He said, "Love one another."

      5. BISG Writer profile image59
        BISG Writerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ahhhh, there's the rub. The King James version is what is available to most Christians today. First, however, you must look back at the Council of Nicea that determined which writings should be included in a bible.

        Then you must remember the instructions King James gave to his writers that basically said if they ran across a problem between their interpretation of the original language and the current Catholic Bible, they should follow the Catholic Bible.

        I believe Jesus gave us the short version when He said, "Love one another."

  3. Eaglekiwi profile image76
    Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago

    I read the Bible ,not every day ,it varies sometimes 5mins...sometimes an hour

    Its a living book , it comes alive smile and inspires

    1. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes it does....Thank you...God Bless!

    2. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      What about the pornography mentioned in your Bibles ???

      Reading Bible stories to children  can also open up all sorts of opportunities to discuss the morality of sex. An unexpurgated Bible might get an X-rating from some censors, The PLAIN TRUTH October 1977

      http://hubpages.com/u/1451895_f520.jpg

  4. Greek One profile image81
    Greek Oneposted 7 years ago

    I speak Greek.. need something translated?

    1. 0
      SirDentposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Translate the following please. smile

      οὕτω γὰρ ἡγάπησεν ὁ Θεὸς τὸν κόσμον, ὥστε τὸν υἱὸν αὐτοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ ἔδωκεν, ἵνα πᾶς ὁ πιστεύων εἰς αὐτὸν μὴ ἀπόληται, ἀλλ᾿ ἔχῃ ζωὴν αἰώνιον.

      1. 0
        SirDentposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I just want to bump this reply up so it doesn't get lost.

    2. andromida profile image75
      andromidaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hello Greek.How are you.Speak your mind.I love to read your post.

    3. Davinagirl3 profile image60
      Davinagirl3posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Do you think translation would help? lol

    4. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      yes ignorance. Cause there is a lot of it going around. oh wait that isn't Greek. maybe you could look up the word ignorance and post the Greek meaning for all of us in English of course. Thank you. I liked your post. dee

      1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
        Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        ..And maybe some Baklava on the side smile ..

        1. goodfriendiam profile image60
          goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          ya or a gyro, mmmmmmm.....lol

  5. Eaglekiwi profile image76
    Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago

    Perhaps a sign of insecurity to not respect another because of their beliefs, interesting.

    I find your manner , and personality arrogant, aggressive and derisive and thats way before I even know what you beleive in.

    Someone once said to me , that Mark Knowles , he scares me , I wont go into the Religious forum because of him.

    I tried to tell them , hes just a man , he cant hurt you , but you do because you bully and twist what people say ,all because youre angry at God??? or just angry ,I dunno

    Get over it Mark and quit being such a smart arse lol

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      LOLO

      Very nice. Sorry I find your beliefs ridiculous and irrational.

      Why are you so angry that I do not believe the same stuff you do?

      Do you hate me for it?

      Why is being against what you believe being a smart arse?

      Is it the telling accuracy of my statements - or the inescapable logic?

      "You are going to hell and I am saved."

      Need I say more?

      And the person who said that has now decided it is OK to talk to me after all. Ask Brenda yourself.

      1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
        Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Hate ,no as a matter of fact Hell nooooooooooo...
        ( the only thing I hate are -Cockroaches-) seriously


        Your statements are quite often inaccurate or you split hairs

        ( today is sunny , so eaglekiwi you dont like rain?)

        and no you dont need to say more ,in fact less is better ,lol (sometimes)

        Wasnt Brenda ,just two people that you casually blew off with your charm n insensitive remarks.

        No doubt their fault for not having thicker skin , shame really, but you wont be pushing me around, saved or unsaved, so there smile

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          No - I get it. You are determined to spread the word and no matter how many times I tell you it is offensive and upsetting you will continue. I got it. Your beliefs NEED to be spread no matter what. Yes - thank you - I understand.

      2. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Well Mark...You do sound angry, all the time!  Yeah your beliefs are differant then mine/ours, but, you need to show respect sir....I requested it from the beginning, and so far, I have not seen any shown in your remarks....As for the "Your are going to hell and I am saved."  If I were to say that to you, and I won't, I would be standing in judgement and condemnation of you...Not nice to do at all...Because I would be Judged by God, twice over.....

  6. Greek One profile image81
    Greek Oneposted 7 years ago

    what's FSM?

    1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
      Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The one true god.

      1. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Synchronized posts. I added a link though big_smile

        Is that a sin?.............

        1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
          Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Shhhhhhh.. we're forbidden to ask that since the infamous sheep buggering episode

          1. Mark Knowles profile image60
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            God's M***** F*** D****** F**k S** Sh**mother **** G*d  - I had forgotten about the sheep. Was it a sin or not - I can't remember. Seems to me sheep have free will so maybe not?

            1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
              Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              We were censored before reaching a conclusion.  The question was, "Is it a (hub police defined expletive deleted) to wear a fake LV scarf while buggering sheep."

              I guess we'll never know.

              1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Well, there is sure-fire way to find out. I can get the fake LV scarf - if you can find a willing sheep, we can test it.

                I imagine god will surely step in before things get out of hand. Or - one of us gets to bugger a willing sheep wearing the scarf.

                Either way - proof.

                1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
                  Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Just borrow fierycj's

                  (scarf, not sheep)

                  1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                    Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    No - the scarf is not an issue. Where I live they are a dime a dozen. The problem is the sheep. After years of abuse, the typical French or Italian sheep is very wary. Not to say - disinclined to be involved with a human male wearing a scarf. Especially a fake LV. (They know.)

                    The issue is a willing sheep.

                    This is where you come in.

                    You need to find the willing sheep. I can provide the scarf at minimal cost (about 4 euros)......

      2. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        If it is as you claim, they why is the "g" underscored, and not capitalized as it should be?

    2. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this
  7. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    Hallowed be thy name

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Ramen.

  8. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a287/S1m0n/sheep.jpg

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hmmm.

      I am not so sure "plastic, inflatable," sheep is the same as "willing."

      Maybe one of the religionists could help us out here?........

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Mark, I see that if you were a (religious man) I believe you would be called a son of thunder....which is a compliment.

        1. 0
          ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Wait a minute, I thought no html was allowed on hubpages!!

  9. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    ya all know what, I am totally lost. But that is sometimes not to hard for me. First of all, it saddens me to see, there are those that can dish it out, but when it comes back it gets to hot. Now I know this is touchy, but everyone of us is in titled to our own beliefs. And it's not nice, nor fair to push belief on someone else, and further more to tell anyone there damned for hell. Jesus, never pushed himself on anyone but he did get upset when religious leaders or teachers of the law tried to push stuff on his sheep. As for the bible, some is true, some is false. It even says in the bible. thanks

    1. chukra G profile image61
      chukra Gposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      the false is, you wont damned for hell just because you are not christian smile.

    2. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I expected this to happen, hearing from those with differant belief....That's fine, as long as respect is shown, regardless of their belief....On the other hand, there is one on here, that makes a mokery of God's Holy Word, and it makes me wonder...Does he know anything about the Bible at all....As a matter of thought here, do you know what you've just done, In saying what you just did about the Bible?  Peace!

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        As a matter of fact I do, and I will say it again, some of the bible is true and some is false....Let me ask you this ellie DO you know what you are talking about..you talk as if you know the bible inside and out. Then why don't you know this scripture
        2 timothy 2:15 study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. and another one you may find interesting is this
        luke 7:13 that we are to rebuke (correct) our our fellow brothern kindly and so on and so on now what do both of these scriptures mean for you and me, for starters 1. we are to divide what is true in the bible to what is false in the bible. 2. we are to correct our fellow brethern kindly and that is exactly what I am doing to you. Good day

        1. 0
          ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          1) I know the verse (2 Timothy 15).  And, what are you getting at here?  Is it because I refuse to condemn or judge another because his/her belief is differant than mine?  If God wants me to be that way, He'll let me know...I've talked to Him before about this, and thus far, I'm still the same way, as I've always been....If I do wrong, trust me, He convicts me....

          2) Luke 7:13....Sorry, but you just might have a wrong verse here...I'm not reading what you are saying.....I have my NIV open here and Luke 7:13 says, when the Lord saw her, his heart went out to her and he said,"Don't Cry."  You've just proven what I've said all along, no one really knows the Bible in whole...

          While I was in Luke, I came upon this....Luke 6:37:  "Do not judge, and you will not be judged.  Do not condemn and you will not be condemned.  Forgive and you will be forgiven.

          Luke 6:41-42 "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?
          (42) How can you say to your brother, "Brother let me take the speck out of your eye." when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye?  You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck in your brother's eye.

          This is what I live by...Yes we are to rebuke our fellow brother's/sister's...But before you do, be sure you pray on it....You just may find, that you are about to rebuke your brother/sister for doing something, that you, yourself may have done.....

          Do I accept any belief that are differant then mine? No I don't....But....I will show my respect to everybody...Including those whose beliefs are differant then mine....As long as God does not convict me of a sin here, I will keep doing what I've done for years......

          1. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I don't need to pray in the fashion, you are speaking of, for I speak to wisdom and wisdom speaks to me everyday...but it seems you totally skipped around the issue. You say the bible is "god breathed" and I say it is not, But the bible says, as I have stated before, which you choose to overlook, we are to divide the truth from false in the bible and people I might add. Furthermore sorry that i read the numbers backwards in Luke it should be Luke 17:3 and I am not judging you only trieing to correct you, But I do say you my dear are judging people you do not know. they do not believe what you believe so you are closed minded and trieng to convert. for I hear with my ears, why you posted it in the first place. You are trieing to snag people in to your faith and we could argue this point all day, but I won't. I have other things to do. good day

            1. 0
              ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Okay, we have differant beliefs here...So let's agree to disagree, and leave it at that...

              1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                thank you ellie, i agree with yah. And after all that, I do believe that you  posses a passion inside you, and i commend you for that.

            2. sandy1020 profile image61
              sandy1020posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              As Christians, it is our responsibility to witness to others and to share God's Word with them. We are not condemning or judging in anyway. It is God's place to judge. It is our  responsibility to witness.

              1. Misha profile image77
                Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Yeah, how wonderfully said!
                Let's witness together the greatness of His Noodly Appendage!

              2. 0
                ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Exactly!!  And that's what I've lived by....Some people, like the majority here, see it as pushing our beliefs down their throats....You know, that's a good feeling...It tells us were getting through, but they just don't like it....God Bless!

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Interesting attitude you have. "They don't like it, therefore this is good."

                  What a wonderful way of showing god's love. Annoy and offend people. Perhaps to the point of physical conflict. 

                  Do you think it is for our own good?

                  I do find it interesting that you chose to ignore my response about what the KJ bible actually is. Care to do so now?

                  1. janni321 profile image61
                    janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    If you do not have believe in God, why you are messing with Him anyway on religion forums, The bible thread. Isn't that mean, you internally believe in Him and just shouting that ''I don't believe in God''

                  2. 0
                    ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    The Good in it, even though I respect all beliefs, and do not really push my beliefs down anyone's throat, but you, and others claim I have, and therefore are persecuting me, because of my belief in Christ Jesus, and the Holy Word of God...Yeah, that's where the good feeling is coming from.....

        2. Make  Money profile image71
          Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Actually goodfriend 2 timothy 2:15 says we are to rightly handle or divide the word of truth.  The Bible that I use says "rightly handling the word of truth" instead of "rightly dividing the word of truth."  Anyway 2 timothy 2:15 says nothing about there being anything false in the Bible.  This is the full verse from the Bible that I use, "Carefully study to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth."  The verse in respect to the whole chapter means to study the word of truth carefully and don't be ashamed to share it, that's all.

          Respectfully
          Mike

          1. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Hi Mike, OK fine then what ever trips your boat. But maybe you better ponder on this verse a little while longer, for it says  "rightly" what does rightly mean? Second "handling" what does handling mean? Third "the word of truth" what does the word of truth mean? When you find the answers get back to me. And don't give me what you have read, ponder with in your heart heavily first. Then, and only then will I enjoy talking with you. Dee

            1. goodfriendiam profile image60
              goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Mike I hope you will forgive me, for I was wrong for attacking you. there is no excuse. Dee

              1. Make  Money profile image71
                Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Of course Dee.

                1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                  goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Thank you Mike!!!! smile for it seems, I was the one who needed to ponder and remember exactly what this verse means. Thank you truly from my heart.

      2. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I am very familiar with the bible thank you.

        It is largely religionist trash, most certainly is not the word of god, and although there are some truths in it, it is not True with a capital T.

        Realistically, the version you are claiming to be the word of god was translated some 400 years ago and written expressly for the British Crown. In fact, if I remember correctly, the Crown holds the copyright in perpetuity.

        The instructions the King gave the translators were fairly explicit in the threats of death and dismemberment being handed out for not following his instructions. Oddly enough, using religion or "faith" to control the masses has long been a hallmark of your "god's word."

        It doth certainly belong unto Kings, yea, it doth specially belong unto them, to have care of Religion, yea, it doth specially belong unto them, to have care of Religion, yea, to know it aright, yea, to profess it zealously, yea to promote it to the uttermost of their power. (taken from the instructions to the translators)

        The KJ was translated from Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic.

        Personally - I speak four languages reasonably well, and spend much of my time speaking with my friends in those 4 languages. It is almost impossible to translate certain phrases and words exactly - so I imagine what you have in your "God's word," is what whoever did the translating thought god meant to say.

        Which makes it Man's word - or rather The King's instructions.

        So - oddly enough, it tells you to accept your lot in this life and a better life awaits after death. lol

        See where I am going here?

        And - yes - I know what you think I have done and you are very, very wrong.

        1. 0
          ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          No more wondering....I still believe that The Bible was written (on the Scrolls) were written in a very special way....From God's Lips to the Scriptor's ears.....And, Would you care to tell me, what I think you've done?

          1. Mark Knowles profile image60
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I understand that is what you believe. Regardless of the fact that I and another have pointed out the fact that even if that is the case - you have no way of verifying that.

            But go ahead and tell me what I have done. Please. In case I got it wrong by thinking I was sitting in the seat of the scornful.

            1. 0
              ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I'm not a mind reader....So I have no clue what you're thinking that I am thinking....Thanks for the respect here....Now, do you have a Bible (dumb question I perceive you do).  What is the first word on it?

              1. 0
                dennisemattposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                THE

                1. 0
                  sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  lol that exactly what I was gonna say! lol

                  Maybe she meant, in the book of Genesis.  In that case... IN. lol

                  1. Misha profile image77
                    Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    You really are much alike girls. You might want to talk to each other, who knows, may be a friendship will be born smile

              2. Mark Knowles profile image60
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Well, you still haven't told me what I have done - and I am not a mind reader either.

                And as several others have stated, the first word in mine is "The" also.

                1. 0
                  dennisemattposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  HA! So your Bible is like mine?

                2. 0
                  ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Okay....Mine has it on the Binder...And The is not there....Sorry guys....I know that most Bibles do have the word The on them....I was looking for the word Holy....

                  I'm off for the weekend....So Have a good weekend....I'll be back to check out the forum from time to time, during the week, since I'm never on on weekends....I Thank everyone who has responded....And Mark?  You really don't know what I was thinking as you say....So...I will no longer think it....Peace to you all....And again....Thank You...

                  1. 0
                    dennisemattposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    have a good weekend!!
                    sorry about the 'the'
                    I have about 6 Bibles, and they all start with ...the..
                    my point is...there's lots of different versions, how's a person to know wich one is right?
                    and how can a person get all mad at soemone else, simply cuz they got beat down so much, they are pretty sure Gods not looking, or doesnt exist? I personally wish I could believe he didnt exist. Its alot better then being abanodoned

  10. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    Further more, do you not see. that those you are trieing to convert to your way, they see what you are up to. You oh so nice introduction, that I am just curious... they see and they are not dumb Jesus talked about this also, be careful of those that come in sheep's clothing, but are really wolves ready to eat you (my wording) and stomp on you with there nonsense and I am holier then you garbage. They see you are trieng to bait them. So if anyone is to blame here for starting something it is you and you alone..good day

    1. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Excuse me?  Trying to convert?  I'm sorry, if you think that....Everyone on here knows my beliefs, or should by now....Your beliefs are differant then mine, and I respect you for that, but please, don't say I'm trying to convert you....I'm not...

      I write, what is going through my mind, and of course God is in control there....You know...Maybe your right, maybe I am trying to convert everyone else....But if I am, then It is God Doing His Worderous Work through me...I am nothing without Him...Now...Can we just go back to the origional question that I asked?

      Oh yes...Sometimes Curiosity is good for the Soul.

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        No. Haven't you ever heard the old saying "curiosity killed the cat"

        As for praying for me that was a nice gesture. But I would be afraid, of what your god might bring down on me, no ill feelings or anything. dee

        1. goodfriendiam profile image60
          goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Ellie I am sorry, for there is never a reason to hurt someone else period. I hope you will forgive me. Dee

      2. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ellie dear, you think, you write what is going on in your mind. But you are full of holes. And God is whole. Think on that one for awhile. Dee

        1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
          Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Ouch someones prickly today

          1. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            lol, no just wanted to get back to this deep whole, and dig out some posts that I wanted to comment on.

            1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
              Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              alrighty then

              1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                LOL!!!

          2. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            OK maybe a little....lol

  11. sandy1020 profile image61
    sandy1020posted 7 years ago

    In response to your original question, I believe that the Bible is the inspired Word of God and I read it daily. The more you read and seek to understand, the better you will understand. I personally use the NIV Life Application Bible. The footnotes apply what you have read to your life which is so important.

    1. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Amen!!  I read my NIV Study Bible when I want to get in deep to the Word.....And that's more often then not, lol!  I too, read my Bible daily...God Bless!

  12. 0
    \Brenda Scullyposted 7 years ago

    Hi Everyone

    Hi Mark

    I love the bible read it every day

    Mark does not believe


    MISSED him when he was away as i have learned on hub pages

    better the devil you know than the devil you don't

  13. Make  Money profile image71
    Make Moneyposted 7 years ago

    That's nice goodfriendiam.  He's still looking and sees you dennisematt.

  14. Make  Money profile image71
    Make Moneyposted 7 years ago

    Hopefully some words of comfort for you Dennise.

    Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
    Blessed are the meek: for they shall possess the land.
    Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
    Blessed are they that hunger and thirst after justice: for they shall have their fill.
    Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
    Blessed are the clean of heart: for they shall see God.
    Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called children of God.
    Blessed are they that suffer persecution for justice' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
    Blessed are you when they shall revile you, and persecute you, and speak all that is evil against you, untruly, for my sake:
    Be glad and rejoice, for your reward is very great in heaven.

  15. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Come on Mark, give girl a break. smile She personally did not shove anything down your throat, and she will learn all what it is there to learn for her in a due time, no need to push it smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I agree with what misha said, for i was once like her, she has passion inside that she knows not of and one day she will understand.

    2. 0
      dennisemattposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      thanks Misha. I will learn whatever I have to learn, sometime I guess. Anyone can say anything they like to me. I am a bit thicker skinned then you might think. I am actually pretty surprised anything I had to say was worthy of a repsonse from Mark.  smile

  16. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    The only thing I believe is "to insist on the freedom to be oneself and to give and receive love." There is no book upon which I base my life. And I find the arguments revolving around the forums over and over again to be depressing.

  17. 59
    samadamsposted 7 years ago

    Good Book - Soloman is one of my favorite people- He used everything availble to him to make himself happy, wise,thankful,and successfull-

  18. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Doesn't it feel better to play in fathers and daughters? wink smile

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      lol

      You are a sucker for a pretty girl, Misha. big_smile

      1. Misha profile image77
        Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Never tried to conceal it smile

  19. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    "Where does "faith" come from? Certainly it is driven into you from childhood. " Mark Knowles

    Mark, as you know, but more recent contributors may not, I disagree with you on this point. Psychological studies, most notably those in the field of logotherapy by Victor Frankl, have produced strong evidence that we are born with an emotional "need" to believe in a higher power.  This of course falls well short of proof that such a power exists, but does suggest a reason as to why so many faiths exist.  I believe that some are the product of genuine spiritual encounters, others shamelessly invented to consolidate control over masses of people. (I believe Christianity falls into this category)

    This doesn't mean that as children we are blank slates filled with the beliefs of controlling adults as I think your post suggests, but rather that we are born with an innate succeptibility to conversion from rational thinkers to metaphysical "believers".  Some have this trait exploited early on in life, leading down a false gnostic path.  I choose to wait for the experience that will provide enlightenment, perhaps after my physical death, rather than be stuck with the false dichotomy that the revelation has happened or hasn't and never will.

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes - I do know. But all these (including Mr Frankl) are missing the point. There is an arrogance that comes from self awaereness that says, "I exist. And I am aware I exist, therefore this world was made for me."

      This will be our eventual downfall and Douglas Adams said it best with his puddle analogy:

      "Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in, an interesting hole I find myself in, fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!' This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, it's still frantically hanging on to the notion that everything's going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for."

      The "Need" to believe in a higher power comes from fear that we are no more or less "worthy" than any other creature. Once you can get over this and accept that this is not the case, life becomes much simpler. wink

      I am happy to be a grain of sand on the beach of life.

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        me too mark, and I new i saw what seen in you

      2. Eng.M profile image74
        Eng.Mposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        we all should be because we have no choice.

        but each of us is still be some grain .

        a different grain in some way .

  20. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    As far as I know Mark always accepts that there is a lot of unknown that seems to affect our lives. What he always rebels against however, is putting this unknown in a form of an old guy with white beard, that lives on a cloud and cooks sinners for eternal dinner. Or any other form for that matter. smile

    Mark, sorry if I said anything wrong smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      thanks misha,

    2. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No need to apologize - this pretty much sums it up. big_smile

  21. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    Mark, I'll remind you of the faulty reasoning exhibited by Adams's puddle.  He has confused his knowledge of his immediate surroundings for knowledge of the creator (and his intentions) of those surroundings.  He also does not relize that his evaporation as a puddle is a necessary step toward becoming part of a cumulus cloud (heaven for puddles)

    As for my own puddley thoughts, I have never precluded the possibilty of spiritual existence for creatures lacking in self awareness (even fierycj smile ) I think that what makes my current fluid existence and knowledge of my inevitable evaporation peaceful is knowing that infinite possibilities exist.

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Exactly the point. And I am sure the heaven for humans in not much different from the puddle's. Being as we are largely made of water. Which brings me to another favorite saying that "Humans were created by water as another way of getting around."


      There are indeed infinite possibilities. I am pretty sure my atoms will be scattered around goodness knows how many other places after I am gone. But - I would hesitate to jump to the conclusion that there is a divine being involved or even that there was a "spiritual existence," in there. Sentient or otherwise. wink

  22. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    I read somewhere that the whole universe is made up of math.. that really got me thinking...but even so someone had to create the math...

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Really? It couldn't just come about naturally? Nothing happens unless it is "created"?

      Therefore there must be an invisible super being "creating" everything.

      How sad.

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        you are peculiar..thats a complement. But yes it seems so...for are you not creating right this very moment

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          No. I am not.

          And even if I were, it is a big jump to say that because I am, everything else must be created.

          Arrogant even. wink

          I create, therefore everything else must have been created, because otherwise - it makes no sense and I am not as important as I thought I was.

          1. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            No i am saying that as u speak you are creating, as you write u are creating and as you think u are creating. I see passion and fire in you...

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Well, thank you - but why does that mean someone had to "create" the math?

              Surely it comes with the territory? Math. Explanation of the way things work. ~~Natural. Organic.

              No creator needed.

              1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                how can it not. if we are creators ourselves does it not go around and come back around and do it all over again

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  So - Because we are "creators" therefore there must be a "creator" for everything?

                  I see - we "create" therefore everything must have been "created" therefore there MUST be a "creator"

                  How simple.

                  I love it. This must mean there MUST be a god. An invisible creator who made us. Because it is not possible that anything happens naturally and we did not evolve - we were "created"

                  How very simple.

                  Do you happen to know what this "creator" wants us to do? Should we worship him?

                  Please do tell me - I am keen to know just exactly what this creator wants from me.........................

                  1. goodfriendiam profile image60
                    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    yes i do, he wants us to be happy, with what ever we choose to do in this life, and to live out that which makes us happy to the fullest. thats it.....simple...now the hard part for some is figuring out what makes them happy. for it is sad, to live,  but to never be alive.

      2. aka-dj profile image80
        aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Yes. . . .Yes You got it!!!
        Aaahhh, No, it's you Mark, you just won't accept it. For just a moment I thought. . . lol

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yeah, but you believe in talking snakes so........ big_smile

          1. aka-dj profile image80
            aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I perceive this as ridicule. Am I right?
            Perhaps you can explain to me why there are a (growing number of) "scientists" (probably evolutionary scientists) that are working overtime trying to establish some form of communication with animals. I'm sure you have heard of some of them. They study chimps, gorillas, killer whales, dolphins, to name a few. hmm

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Just a gentle jest dj. smile

              And we even have one of those radicals here on hubpages:

              http://hubpages.com/profile/Aya+Katz

              I have no idea as to these people's motivation I'm afraid. Does it bother you that they are trying to learn something new and communicate with other animals apart from ourselves?

              1. aka-dj profile image80
                aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Not at all. In fact I'm as curious as they. I'd love to know what they "think" of us etc.

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  If they have any sense, a pretty low opinion I would think. I know I do - as a species rather than individuals.

                  Which reminds me of a zoo I visited once. I don't remember where, but they had an exhibit entitled "The most dangerous animal on earth," in one of the big cat houses. After visiting the Lions, Tigers etc - you went into the room and found a big mirror. big_smile

    2. 0
      sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      But humans made up math to express in certain terms things that are not otherwise expressible.

      That's why they call it the Universal Language. Doesn't mean it is right, it just means it works. big_smile

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I have never heard that. Neat I learn something new everyday. Thanks

  23. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Frankly I don't see any logic either. May be you guys need to agree on definition of "create" first? smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      can you explain, create? I'm not sure because it seems to encompass so much. I will have to think on that one.

  24. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    It's not my conversation, it's you and Mark. smile I am watching it, and sometimes trying to help, but this is not the topic I am currently interested in seriously discussing smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      thanks misha, for looking out, but i enjoy having a friendly debate and sometimes intelligent conversation. i am enjoying my time with Mark. I usually talk to my 16 mth old....lol. which is good...lol

  25. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    Have any of you looked in to the theory of dirty DNA? It is another entry to human knowledge that is being considered by some well recognized scientific minds.
    On the matter of religiosity, Carl Jung spoke about humans having a need for religion built in. I think it is fear based as most things seem to be!

  26. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Oh, I am definitely not looking out for you. smile I am enjoying your conversation and collecting some information for myself. The first time I interfered I thought Mark already was done for the day, cause he is in France, so I dared to clarify his position so you don't need to wait till tomorrow. Second time I thought you guys got somewhat stuck, and offered a way out, as I saw it smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      i am sorry that i miss took, what you said. For you are a good man thanks for your honesty

  27. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Thanks for the giggles Usmanali, sometimes it's even nice to have you here lol

    1. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      i have a reason for my comment. I dont put mere allegations like atheists.

      1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
        Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Do you practice "self indulgence" while posting?

  28. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    Usman, do you think you have anything to learn? Or do you think you know everything you need to know? I'm being serious.

    1. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I am very flexible and my learning will not stop.

      1. Colebabie profile image62
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ok, do you believe your religion is the only one that is correct?

        1. usmanali81 profile image61
          usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yes,

          1. Colebabie profile image62
            Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Do you know everything there is to know about all of the religions?

            1. usmanali81 profile image61
              usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              may be, almost all

              1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
                Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Zoroastrianism?

              2. Colebabie profile image62
                Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                So if you don't know everything about religion or about everything in life. Isn't is possible, that maybe, just maybe, your religion isn't the only one that is correct, or even that your religion isn't 100%? Or even, just think about this one, you're not always correct? And you could learn from others?

                1. usmanali81 profile image61
                  usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  hmm ... you see when there arises any question in my mind, any question, i cant sit rightly unless i get the answer. whenever questions related to other religions arose i consulted their followers but they dont reply it at all or their answers come out as confusing and conflicting. In contrast, there also came certain questions against Islam but whenever i searched their answers, i get it in a tip top position, very attractive, informative and logical.

                  Therefore, whenever a person gets answers, he / she makes a decision on that very answers.

                  1. Colebabie profile image62
                    Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Do you think it may be a bit biased? Like you believe what you want to believe? And if it conflicts with your original thoughts you may push it aside more easily? Is it fair to say you think your religion is the best for you? But may not be the only correct, or right for someone else?

  29. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3286/2617145601_dff7c450d1.jpg?v=0

  30. Ron Montgomery profile image61
    Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

    http://img164.imageshack.us/img164/4055/00freemasonsfeatkatherinz9.jpg


    Dancing Jewish Cupcake Bakers.

  31. janni321 profile image61
    janni321posted 7 years ago

    hey listen everybody! some filthy freemasons made a new plan to destroy the world, I am planning a suicide attack on them  lol

    1. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Janni, we got just the man for you!

      1. janni321 profile image61
        janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        sorry, I don't get. who's that man

    2. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You are right my dear, Freemasons, Zionists and Humanists will start WWIII just as they started WWII and WWI. Also the atomic bombardments were done by the Masonic State - USA

      1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
        Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Yeah, but only after pearl harbor was attacked by the demon JapMasons!

        1. janni321 profile image61
          janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          and 9/11 by MuslimMason lol

        2. janni321 profile image61
          janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          do you ever calculate the innocent deaths in both pearl harbour and attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Now the 9/11 Vs Afghanistan innocent casualties.

        3. usmanali81 profile image61
          usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          so pearl harbor justifies atomic war .. ha ???

          1. Ron Montgomery profile image61
            Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            No, attacks by groups we disagree with do.  Like those freakin' JapMasons! mad

      2. janni321 profile image61
        janni321posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        They are the fellow of Antichrist ( Dajjal ) andevery part of their bodies need to be chopped

  32. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    Well I will say this you are a man on a mission, and you can't be stopped. You are like a rock that can't be moved. You stand for what you believe, and I haven't seen you once try to convert anyone. You state your point. And go on.

  33. janni321 profile image61
    janni321posted 7 years ago

    most of the people justify and relates these attacks to pearl harbor

  34. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    I didn't disregard it. I said exactly what you said. I understand what the passage meant.

    Usman, you didn't get my point. Whatever career, doctor, prostitute? (I guess), teacher... you seek out the knowledge. Realize that using the word of Islam to back up your opinions does not make one want to learn and follow Islam. Because while Islam is what you have chosen, it may not be what someone else believes they should base their life on. You know that. You said yourself that people have a choice. You do not have a right to give your "presentation" or whatever you want to call it.  Do you/have you ever done something that is not based on the teachings of Islam?

    1. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      There is no being on earth who seeks out knowledge on its own. Unless you see the sky, you are unable to realize that there is a sky, unless you see doctors and medicine you are unable to realize that there are such things like doctors and medicine. The first stage is of presentation.

      So unless you are presented with the ultimate art of living - Islam you can not realize that there even exists that kind of 100% accurate thing. Even doctors and scientis used to present their theoriess, ideas, thoughts and researches in front of public so that they start distinction between old and new, right and wrong, good and bad.

  35. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    Yes maybe after seeing something that sparks an interest may someone seek out knowledge. Saying "hey I follow Islam and I think it encompasses great beliefs" is one thing, using passages to bash other religions and people is quite another.

    Usman, realize, please, that Islam is for you. It is not, nor will it every be, for everyone. Religion is a personal choice. Your "presentation" is not introducing Islam to others but rather showing them that that is the only justification you have for anything. It is showing them about you, not about Islam. And you are not Islam. You didn't answer my question regarding doing something that is not based on Islam teachings. Basically, my point is, chill out on the Islam stuff. You're doing no good by using it as a basis for argument. You use it to bash others beliefs and lifestyles. No good Usman, no good. There is such a thing as freedom of religion. And in my beliefs the freedom to be yourself.

    1. JonTutor profile image60
      JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Relax...He isn't gonna listen...He has been thoroughly brainwashed... those terrorist schools do a thorough job... Usmanali is totally incapable of independent thinking now... another casualty of Madrasa.

    2. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You are right, I am not Islam. And chill out is also allowed in Islam but there are boundries for it. You can even chill out by merely abusing or giving out a false news but Islam prohibits these kind of chills for me.

      Freedom of religion, i agree, but ISMs are not religions. Freemasonry is not a religion.

      1. Colebabie profile image62
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Giving out false news, basically lying, is not chilling out. I never suggested that. Freedom of religion also includes the freedom to live absent of an organized religion, or to change religions. Please respect that.

        1. usmanali81 profile image61
          usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yes, certainly you are free to choose anything. And that's enough respect from my side smile

      2. JonTutor profile image60
        JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        @Usmanali We aren't discussing freemasons.... you're certainly suffering... are you aware of PPD.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranoid_p … y_disorder

        1. usmanali81 profile image61
          usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          LOL

          why the word Freemasons bite you always lol

          1. JonTutor profile image60
            JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I care a damn for them..... I dunno any freemasons....  It is you who has a fixation... which I'm pointing out.

            1. usmanali81 profile image61
              usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              you missed the target, the aero is after you now.

              1. JonTutor profile image60
                JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                what aero?? you mean arrow

                1. earnestshub profile image87
                  earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  He means he is going to ignore your reply.

                  1. JonTutor profile image60
                    JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I will miss him... he is thoroughly entertaining... one doesn't meet "cave" men these days online...  coming straight out of Tora Bora Caves. lol

  36. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    Not just me Usman. Everyone. And if that is all the respect you will give, that's sad. It is sad that you are withholding respect because you want to prove that you're right.

    1. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      what's your point ??

      1. Colebabie profile image62
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Why "and that's enough respect from my side"? Are you withholding respect for some reason? Seems strange to me. Whatever the reason, I'm going to sleep. I hope you'll chill out with the judgments and religion/people bashing. Whenever you feel the urge, just think about it and resist. I'm sure that bashing people is not a part of Islam. Night.

        1. usmanali81 profile image61
          usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I always give respect specially to women and i did'nt bashed anybody.

          SLEEP WELL.

  37. Colebabie profile image62
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    You have bashed homosexuals, "Freemasons", those without organized religion, those with religions that are not your own, you told me that if I wore a bikini I was putting myself at risk for being raped, and that I was a "bad girl".

    "You are bitter and have issues.  I dont think your religion is working for you.  Religion is not meant for such twisted hatred.  Perhaps you should find a new one or drop religion all together."
    "Look, my dear, your english language skills are very poor."
    "ill mouth"
    "You are denying His UNITY (ONENESS), You are denying His Message and Messengers"
    "Shame on your old age. Look at your old age and look at your irrational comments."
    "hhmmm ... it's not your fault as your mouth is suffering from rectal prolapse or may be anal fissures"
    "and you need a doctor .. very seriously"
    "...no fear of being trialed after death so let's go, shoot Lennon, enjoy LOL "
    "So, you joined the hell at last."
    "victims of rape do not gain anything from reporting the incident."
    "If there is no religion - then there will be no terrorism" "Agreed excluding Islam"
    "Hopefully those virgins will not be like you Are you virgin ???"
    "If you have no interest in Islam then KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT. "


    Looks like a whole lot of bashing to me. And obviously you aren't "flexible". I'm pretty sure bashing and now lying are not in the teachings of Islam.

    1. JonTutor profile image60
      JonTutorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Relax.... Don't take his words so seriously..... he is a nut case.... I find him very entertaining. lol

      1. Colebabie profile image62
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Oh I don't don't worry. I find him very sad.

      2. usmanali81 profile image61
        usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Hey Colebabie,

        What about the Jon's comment about me ???

    2. usmanali81 profile image61
      usmanali81posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      LOL lol lol lol

      You built a strong case against me. lol and you forgot to mention that i do not call you DEAR anymore.

  38. 0
    \Brenda Scullyposted 7 years ago

    cannot believe this thread is stil going strong,,,,,, HI EVERYONE......

    1. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hello Brenda, nice to see you.

  39. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    We certainly are the most dangerous animal, and possibly the dumbest. Even dirt is too smart to destroy itself and it's environment. "I think, therefore I am... a pain in earths ass"

  40. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    Mark were is your rational explanation. For yours does not add up, but I am trying to see it.

    1. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Rational explanation for what?

  41. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    I never said myself that I hear anything in my head, but I do listen to the silence, and the silence speaks to be in silence.

    Maybe sometimes I come off arrogant, but not all people have reached this level of enlightenment (if that is what you call it.) we are speaking of, and because they are wanting it, and seeking it, you must use whatever words, terminology that they can grasp or comprehend for the time being. Some people are so sensitive that you could through them in to the next universe, and whos to say what would be come of them. And furthermore, love or the bigger then us that you like to use, loves much, and knows that some can't eat the whole thing at once. But in tiny bites

  42. 0
    ellie1142545posted 7 years ago

    Especially For Mark....Faith was not pushed on me as a child....My parents didn't become Christians until their late 70's.  I became a Christian in my mid 20's....Thanks to very special people in my life......So...You are not right to say, that faith was pushed on people as a child, at least in my case...Don't know about anyone else here....

    1. kingjames4ever profile image59
      kingjames4everposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I found the light shine on me when I was 14 at Church camp. The best life-changing event I went to. Then I go to Church camp almost every year. We actually had it again last July 3-5.

      God bless you too!

      1. fishmox profile image59
        fishmoxposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        My first conversion happened when I was 27 in a little city in Cebu Province.
        I had been involved in activism that led to a short armed underground sortie that didn't progress much and ended with our cell being taken into custody by the Marcos intelligence dogs and just a comrade and myself escaping arrest.
        I then took my entire family, wife and 2 daughters south, got a job, and was walking the neighborhood doing cold canvass when I chanced on this Baptist church.
        To make a long story short, the following Sunday I was a visitor and was listening to this Bible-thumping, pulpit-pounding, heavily caffeinated, salivating preacher talking about a Christ in a way I have never heard of before in any of the religions in my religion-bound country.
        I was a developing Marxist at this time in ideology and of course atheist in belief, and when I realized I was understanding this guy on the pulpit word for word in a dialect I BARELY spoke, I knew I had to have that Bible they were giving away to those who wanted to "accept" Christ as Savior, so I walked forward during the invitation.
        I just wanted to know why I understood this guy word for word.
        That was my first conversion.
        There were subsequent conversions, doctrinally and practically through the next 36 years, from Arminianism to Strict Calvinism to just a believer in the Doctrine of Grace.
        The Bible is a compilation of personal messages in a personal book by a personal God to His people and to them only.

    2. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Ah I see. Thanks for pointing that out. I am keen to know where it is you live that you did not have to recite "One nation under god" every morning in school (or in my case attend a morning service) and there are no churches ringing bells every day and putting posters outside their buildings and no evangelists on the TV.

      Where is this exactly?

      1. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        -Yeah I did Pledge The Alligence In School, when I was young, but by the time I reached High School, it had ceased.....I'm American Born....Did it feel like they were cramming God down my throat?  No....You know, I'm beginning to feel sorry for you....You must have had a very bad life, at a young age....So did I, but I did not let it take over my life....It was much easier to forgive, then to carry all that bitterness around....

        I never saw any evangilists until after I became a Christian, and until I became one, I paid no attention to the signs on the Churches....

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Well, I already feel sorry for you.

          You must have had a really really bad life to imagine that there is a life after you die that is somehow better than this one. And feel the need to evangelize about it in case others do not agree. 

          Rather sad really.

          Good for you for being not affected by the signs outside the churches. Bet you are not affected by other forms of advertising either. Doesn't shape your decisions in any way. lol

          Sorry to be the one to point out that you have been sold a bill of goods and even though you do not speak Greek or Aramaic or Hebrew, you  are convinced that King James was in no way influenced by his personal goals when instructing the translators to translate the bible the way he said or die horrible deaths.

          Very, sad - I feel sorry for you. What a crying shame.......
          Never mind - I bet it helps to know you will live forever after you die. wink

  43. jenny88 profile image60
    jenny88posted 7 years ago

    Mmm read the bible

    I have a few times but still cannot make head nor tail of it.

    Some people say 'it comes alive' and 'speaks to them'

    how is this ?

    There are some great verses in the bible though that are a good encouragement and in this world hope is what a lot of people need

    so maybe will try again

    jenz

    1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
      Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hey jenz
      It is a great book , The Bible ,most loved , most hated , and most sold.

      Some of it is heavy ( like one of those old Shakespeare drama's) and some is inspiring , some romantic ( Song of Solomon) woohooo...

      I liked Proverbs alot last month ,lately Corinthians.

      I can see why it also has been called "Lifes Instruction Manual"

      For even though its been scoffed at and its truths ridiculed , one thing can not be denied.

      It has survived and when most of us on this forum are all gone , The Bible will still be around ...smile

      Jenz for you > Matthew 5, 1-10

      1. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        You forgot "most forced upon with threats of physical violence."

        Easy to forget that one. Conveniently............

        1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
          Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Oh I left out many other things  historic, inspirational,contraversial, violent , passionate...more

          1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
            Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            lol@ convenient, in a forum , hardly

            1. Mark Knowles profile image60
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Inaccurate, responsible for millions of deaths, wildly mis-interpreted, irrational, etc etc etc.

              Fortunately, as some one else pointed out - holding irrational beliefs used to be an evolutionary advantage, but is becoming less so.

              Thankfully. Unless of course education really takes a hit in the financial crisis and homeschooling becomes the norm again. Maybe then it will once again take a good grip.

              Who knows..........

              1. Misha profile image77
                Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                LOL This is where we definitely diverge. Coming from the country where homeschooling was just impossible, cause government had to indoctrinate every single child, I look at homeschooling much more favorably smile

                1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  It depends on your motivations. If you homeschool your children because you think evolution is a lie and you wish to ensure that they believe that you are correct...........

                  1. Misha profile image77
                    Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    It is still the same motivation - to escape government indoctrination, whatever part of it a particular person does not sign up to smile

                  2. goodfriendiam profile image60
                    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I homes school to allow my children to naturally  form there own opinions. Allowing them to read all forms of literature and what not. And making sure they form there on conclusions, not someone else s. I believe the schools today shove it down there throat and say this is the way it is, not allowing for children to explore and discover things for themselves. Everything is fact and don't question nothing..is the way teacher around here are.

              2. Eaglekiwi profile image76
                Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Humans seem to like violence

        2. 0
          ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          So tell me then....Why have people died, because they believe in The Bible?

          1. goodfriendiam profile image60
            goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            No ellie it depends on who you believe wrote the bible, was it the spirit of evil or the spirit of good? For the good spirit, saves lives and the spirit of evil kills, so I guess if you believe that the spirit of good inspired it then you might just   die for your belief in that.

            1. 0
              ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              You already know my answer...The Word Of God...Has a name on it...That comes after The...Holy...It's Word Is Truth....And that's what I live by...

      2. 0
        ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this
  44. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    got to go lay my child down for a nap but would still like to finish this some time

  45. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Denys, I think i agree with Mark, you need to do your homework on evolution before you guys can move any further. You don't seem to understand that it is not about ape banging ape and giving birth to a human child. smile

    1. goodfriendiam profile image60
      goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      first of all I am not stupid I know that. Second of all I did skim over it earlier before mark posted here, i was over in science forums earlier, second I watch alot of discovery channel, national geographic and so on. And I don't believe humans came about from two apes banging one another. And yes I do think I understand now that humans and apes branched off from the same "branch" you might say. Is this correect And yes I went back to the article and I read the whole thing.

      1. goodfriendiam profile image60
        goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I do believe that if need be that an animal that is threaten in its environment, could adept and possibly  evolve as in lizard to water lizard growing fins and what not. And I could even see a human that would be threaten over time (like the movie water world) to adapt to a new way of living. But it would not lose its intelligence. And I will read up some more on all of this.

        1. Mark Knowles profile image60
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          An interesting point to look for is the point at which time we started creating art. Or rather became "self aware" wink

          Not so long ago really. About 35,000 years is the best guess so far.

          "Divine intervention"?

          Who knows - but that is what I would be arguing if I was a religionist...............

          And I know plenty of humans who seem to have lost their intelligence. lol

  46. Misha profile image77
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Oh, I definitely know you are not stupid. Just a statement of ape+ape=human did not really go well with understanding of evolution, hence my suggestion. And now it seems you got closer to understanding of evolution. The key thing really is that it is not ape+ape=human, but rather ape+ape=marginally changed ape, repeated countless times; plus those apes that better fit the environment tend to more often survive and make ape+ape smile

  47. 61
    My Downtown Viewposted 7 years ago

    Texas board of education just passed laws that include creationism taught in Biology. Which is potential serious since most textbooks in the US are produced in Texas and Texas education has a tendency to dictate what is in text books.

  48. goodfriendiam profile image60
    goodfriendiamposted 7 years ago

    I home school,

  49. Eaglekiwi profile image76
    Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago

    Did Hitler start war because he followed the Bible ...

    No ,he along with Stalin (and others) were Atheists


    them and us


    or simply evil versus good , intelligent minds would choose...an intelligent answer

    1. Misha profile image77
      Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Kiwi, are you implying atheists are evil? I would take an offense on this.

      1. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Of course she is. She speaks for god (good) and atheists do not (evil).

        She is apparently choosing to ignore the fact that Hitler was a Catholic and started the "Christian National Party," using the ancient christian symbol the Swastika.

        Convenient that.............

        1. Misha profile image77
          Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I would argue that swastika is older than catolics, but this is immaterial in the sense of this argument smile

          1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
            Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Regardless of which religion or god Hitler used or which faith he was raised ( all kinds of people committ henous crimes with no professed faith)


            I repeat  good is good
                      evil is evil

        2. Eaglekiwi profile image76
          Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          So are you assuming all Catholics are Christians now?

          Wow I never said all atheists were evil ,although Mark appears to 'know my mind' oh and Gods too...lol

          1. earnestshub profile image87
            earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I thought all Catholics believed in Jesus through the Trinity... is that not so?

            1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
              Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              My point was and still is that it is not the Religion that matters
              People have the potential to committ evil crimes christian and non-christian alike

          2. Misha profile image77
            Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Your original post says just that: hitler and stalin atheists, them vs us, evil vs good... you really could have found better arguments...

            1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
              Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Id argue with a monkey ,but they cant talk lol

              yea what I should have said was christians have done things in the name of God etc ( when really it was what they wanted to do)

              and the same can be said for non-christians , atheists , o whoever else is against God and or bible...

              History books are full of people who had all kinds of influences.

              1. Misha profile image77
                Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Better smile
                However, for the last couple thousand years (may be except for the last century) people doing all mentioned terrible things on average tend to be christian. smile

                1. Eaglekiwi profile image76
                  Eaglekiwiposted 7 years ago in reply to this
        3. Make  Money profile image71
          Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Actually both the Nazis and the Communists studied Darwinism.

          How are Communism and Nazism based upon evolutionary thinking?

          The Root of Terrorism - Darwinism and Materialism

          And you are full of crap Mark.

          Hitler didn't start the Christian National Party.  He started the National Socialist German Workers Party popularly known as the Nazi Party.

          And the Swastika is not a Christian symbol.  Archaeological evidence of swastika-shaped ornaments dates from the Neolithic period. It occurs mainly in the modern day culture of India, sometimes as a geometrical motif and sometimes as a religious symbol. It remains widely used in Eastern religions / Dharmic religion such as Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.  Many modern far right and neo-nazi groups such as Afrikaner Weerstandsbeweging, the Syrian Social Nationalist Party and Russian National Unity use stylized swastikas or similar symbols.

          But what is more troubling is the connection between the Seventh-Day Adventists in Nazi Germany and the endorsement of the Seventh-Day Adventists by US political leaders on both sides of the political spectrum.

          Seventh-Day Adventists in Nazi Germany

          President Bush and Seventh-Day Adventist

          Senator Clinton and Seventh-Day Adventist

          1. Mark Knowles profile image60
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            SO, we agree - religion is just an excuse.

            Thanks Make Money, I can rest easy knowing that the Christian National Party that Hitler started was just another excuse to use your invisible super being.

            I really, really appreciate you pointing out the seventh day Adventists as being exactly the same as all the other religionist political religions such as the catholic child molesting party.

            Oh, I am sorry - the holy see.

            lol lol lol lol

            As usual, your contribution is a 4LOL one. Good luck with the child abuse. Hope it goes well for you. wink

            1. Misha profile image77
              Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Nice link Mark. I especially like the quote from Nazi's program  in relation to our current vocal proponents of public needs lol

              Oh, well, those who don;t remember history are doomed to repeat it, true dat. sad

              Also, I got a question. Mike states you are full of crap. Implying of course that he is not. Do you know what exactly his ass produces then? Diamonds? lol

              1. Mark Knowles profile image60
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Wouldn't even care to guess what his ass produces.

                I know what comes out of the other end though. lol

            2. Make  Money profile image71
              Make Moneyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Oh aren't you a sly one Mark.

              I read this two page site you posted but it does not mention anything about a "Christian National Party" even though you used "Christian National Party" as the text link for this web site.

              That's getting pretty sleazy Mark.

              It's getting to the point where we can not believe anything you say at all Mark.

              In fact Mark the web site that you posted says this on the top of the 2nd page.

              "Slightly more common were anti-clerical Nazis who continued to accept basic theistic and Christian doctrines, but who repudiated churches and priests. This seems to have been a view gradually adopted by Hitler himself."

              Here's some more quotes from Adolf Hitler from this web page.
              http://answers.org/history/hitquote.html




              Wow I think I remember you saying those exact words Mark, "The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death".  Is Hitler a hero of yours or something?



              And there are more disgusting quotes by Hitler, your hero on the above web site Mark.  The above web site also refutes what the character on the web site that you posted says about Steigmann-Gall's book.

              Mark what I find amazing is how close some of your posts and some posts by your New Age friends are to what Hitler said.  And what some people from one denomination say as well.  Because Hitler's Germany followed Seventh Day Adventist beliefs the German people are still paying reparation to the Jews for the atrocities their nation committed over 60 years ago.

    2. Ron Montgomery profile image61
      Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hitler actually had a great deal of Christian influence (having been born into a Catholic family) on his world view.  He was a great fan of passion plays (would have loved Mel Gibson's movie) and was aided and abbeted by church leaders who also wanted a "final solution"

  50. 61
    My Downtown Viewposted 7 years ago

    Doesn't the government dictate the curriculum anyway? Like, you can't just home school your kids and teach them whatever you want; aren't there requirements that need to be met in order to receive a state certified Diploma? Otherwise, what's the point of going to school? Some states have really awful education programs, so that's kind of not fair if this is an option for people subjective to crappy schools systems since they don't tell you have the choice to do better...

    1. 0
      ellie1142545posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      My Niece Home Schools her children...One has graduated...Yes, there are rules that she must follow....And when the child reaches Jr. High-School Age, they need to be enrolled, and take some courses, such as Physical Education, Biology, Etc. which can't be taught at home....This will go on, until the child graduates, from the local High School.....This is in Washington State.....

 
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