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Enter At Your Own Risk?

  1. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Dear hubber,

    I've posted to forum on many occassions, trying to gain knowledge of people, their belief systems and how they view life.

    Feel free to ask or talk about anything. How ever, please maintain a level of respect for those who you do not know, either personally or formally.

    Meaning, if you are new around the forums, pay some respect to those who have been here long than you. If you are a youngster, please keep your voice down, that includes your tone.

    The older adults do not want nor do we need your adolesent behavior or childish rants. If you are here to discuss LIFE and it's nuances and other things, then jump in.

    If you can not rationally think out the subject you bring up and cannot provide proof of what you say- then DO NOT say it.

    Otherwise, listen - learn - absorb - understand.

    With that said- Let's begin.

    1. 0
      Justine76posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      k beliefs on what? im goin to beed soon so,dont get mad at me

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Hey Justine,

        Beliefs- if you have some and want to express them, feel free. You want to ask a question about anything, to get someone else's opinions...pick a person or ask everyone.

        The choice is yours. I am looking to gain knowledge about people, so I am engaging as many different conversations as I can, without getting lost.

        I welcome your input at anytime.

    2. Jackson Riddle profile image69
      Jackson Riddleposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It sounds as if that you consider yourself to be a veteran around the forums. Yes you have nearly 2000 posts but that has been over 4 weeks! So instead of spamming never ending threads and trying to gain respect from others by telling others to respect long-time members you might want to

    3. jiberish profile image78
      jiberishposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I have a question; Why are there so many relegious forums?  Wouldn't it be easier to consolidate all these questions into one forum?  Just asking!

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        jiberish, I find myself liking you more by the day : )

  2. wyanjen profile image87
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    You are asking for an awful lot...  LOL
    We'll see how it unfolds.

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yeah, I know.

      But, what can I say, I want more knowledge about people and the only way to get it- is to ask people to talk to me. The forum under this heading we can talk about anything, without actually getting off topic.

      Most forums you have to stick to the topic, which means there is very little leeway to move off in a different direction even if that direction is worth talking about.

  3. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    So, what would you like to discuss?

  4. wyanjen profile image87
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    Instead of watching one forum deteriorate into three or four different threads, we can watch this one to see if three or four different threads blend into one single topic...

    lol

    What's up. I called in fake-sick to work today but didn't do a thing with the project I'm working on. I'll probably get inspired around 11 PM then be up all night with it anyway. Shoulda just went to work i guess! HA

  5. 0
    Rick Marlowposted 7 years ago

    How about the unbelievable salaries some ceo`s are getting?

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      That is corporate America for you. Nothing changes.

    2. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It's capitalism.
      I don't fault anybody for getting the most they can.
      If their unbelievable salaries are coming at the expense of profit, capitalism should correct for that.
      If most of us weren't hurting so bad, we maybe wouldn't even notice this. These salaries have not necessarily increased since the recession started, we just weren't paying attention before.

      Having said all that, the exposure they are receiving for earning unjustified salaries while their corps are losing profit and employees could mean the correction is coming.
      Water finds it's level.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        To add-

        Sooner or later, the salaries are going to become a problem for bottomline profit and gross margins are always the first thing to be hit. If a company has to continue to increase it's margins year over year, because of salaries, then the business model is broken.

        1. wyanjen profile image87
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I believe: company makes no profit, company disappears.

  6. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Well, I can see you at least haven't lost your real-sense of humor.

    Maybe, when we are done. You will be inspired to work on your project. Who is to know? Inspiration comes like lightning and usually when it does hit...it catches you off guard.

    lol

    But, I look forward to an interesting conversation. big_smile

  7. drej2522 profile image85
    drej2522posted 7 years ago

    How about the Fair Tax...anyone for it??

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I will end this conversation simply. There is NO such thing as a fair tax.

      Taxation is a source of government control, through spin.

      1. Messenger_of_god8 profile image60
        Messenger_of_god8posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        how about no tax

        1. wyanjen profile image87
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          how about no streets to drive on?

          Taxes are a necessary evil I'm afraid.

      2. lostgirlscat profile image60
        lostgirlscatposted 7 years ago in reply to this
  8. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Rick,

    How well versed are you in disciple scriptures. Just the ones that talk about things he 'said'.

    Most are conveyed in a specific manner and I'm looking for someone who has a little bit of knowledge, so I can fill in holes to unanswered questions.

    I don't want to tell you the questions, but I would rather you simply tell me what you know? I know that sounds difficult, because you have amassed years of experience, but I'm more interested in material written words from Jesus' time.

    I hope that came across properly.

    1. 0
      Rick Marlowposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I apologise Cagsil, I got called away suddenly on an urgent family crisis and didn`t have time to say good-bye.

  9. Paradise7 profile image86
    Paradise7posted 7 years ago

    They keep trying, but haven't managed to iron out Fair Taxes ever, for anyone, all the way back to the beginning, and I doubt they ever will.

    It's something we live with.

  10. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    for this forum the words i believe or i think should acompany every post . thats what i believe

    1. Jewels profile image80
      Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I agree, because for someone else to fill in 'misunderstood' holes in scriptures is subject to your own standpoint.  So It comes down to "I think", or "I believe." particularly when there is a lack of sentient experience.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Understood....that's why that is in my post, to rick. He knows more about scriptures and probably has them available.

        Therefore, I can ask him to post some and we can discuss each of them.

        Nothing more.

  11. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Thank you for your humor. It was cute. lol

    Hello aware?

    How are you?

  12. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    im  good ty i like your forum topic very much
      good to see you . but i was not meaning to be humorous

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Thank you.

      So, what's on your mind?

  13. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    True enough Jen.

    lol

  14. wyanjen profile image87
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    I believe I have a topic I would like to see everyone discuss:

    Paper or plastic?

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Paper or parchment, per se.

  15. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    insistence as a short coming

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Good one!
      It seems it is a short coming, but what if the insister is the only one who is correct?

    2. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Insistence as a short coming?

      Interesting choice.

      Insistence is based on knowledge and understanding of that knowledge and the overwhelming need to reinforce one's position on such knowledge(and it's understanding pertaining to thesmselves).

      Sometimes, insistence can be seen as arrogance or ignorance. Depending on topic?

      1. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Insistence can also seem needy.

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Nothing I didn't already say. lol

          1. wyanjen profile image87
            wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I took reinforcing a position as arrogant, not needy. Was just my impression as I read.

            But I'm not insisting either way lol

            1. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Right, but what you overlooked was the word "NEED" in front of reinforce?

              lol

              1. wyanjen profile image87
                wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                See? It only took an hour for a semantic argument to pop up.
                NEED = require (to me)
                NEEDY = looking for attention (to me)

                RE from the other thread, why fight?

                I don't mean start throwing insult bombs. I mean, give it your best argument!
                I like the word fight better than the word debate. I'm from Detroit.

                But, don't let the scary-ass pumpkin fool you, I'm a total hippie.

                1. Cagsil profile image83
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Needy people aren't insistent...they are persistent.

                  Fight is a better word than debate, but discussion is still a better word- Want to fight about it?lol

                  1. wyanjen profile image87
                    wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    hell yeah, bring it!
                    lol
                    I didn't know your name is Ray. Nice to meet "Ray". I totally can't pronounce your HP name so I have to associate you with your avatar and you keep changing the picture which confuses me.
                    lol lol
                    problem solved.

      2. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        i define insistence my own way . i dont insist that others  agree on my definition. even the dictionary lets people pick

      3. Sue Adams profile image92
        Sue Adamsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        "....based on knowledge and understanding...."

        at a particular time

        I have often felt strongly right about something and later changed my mind.

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hi Sue,

          How are you today?

          Welcome to the forum....haha.

          Sorry, I set it up and have been chatting for a few hours.

          Glad to see you?

          What do you want to talk about?

  16. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    for writing on i like paper. cups i prefer plastic. notice i didnt post paper is the best or plastic is the only way

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I did notice that smile
      But what if I made you choose?

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I chose paper. Plastic can be dangerous to people and isn't helpful to nature.

        As for drinking cups? I would say, refined wood would be optimal.

      2. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        what do you prefer plastic or paper?

        1. wyanjen profile image87
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I apologize, I wasn't meaning to be pushy. smile
          It seems silly in this thread but it is an honest question actually. I'm working on a recycling project this weekend so I'm curious.

          I prefer paper.

          1. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            See Jen, you were inspired to ask your question which is pertaining to your project.

            Interesting, huh?

            1. wyanjen profile image87
              wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Yup.
              Now, you guys need to all start fighting about it. I have my theory set, but I'm interested in what you are all thinking about it.

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Fighting about it?

                Why?

          2. aware profile image70
            awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            thanks i think  i misunderstood the forum intent my bad not yours.  this post of yours  was good . you shared your preference and stated why and didnt  bash anyone else es  answers .

  17. 0
    sandra rinckposted 7 years ago

    Hi Vagisil! 

    Knowledge from the Rinck perspective regarding the god. 

    Tis like man, thus imperfect (though I believe we are all perfect because we live, to have never been born shows something was not right, thus you did not have what is essential for life, whatever this be.  A child born with only a few seconds of life is perfect.  Those with disabilities, life threatening diseases and such are still perfect.  Perfection in my eyes is the ability to be alive no matter how short or long the life lives and will die as the natural order of life).

    While imperfections are a trait that humans came up with on the search for what constitutes perfection, something perfect can be found in everything that lives and is.  Perfection does not exist in the way that humans like to portray what is perfect.

    If man is created in the image of god then god is imperfect. Because perfection as it is, the way I see this, must live and die and it naturally obeys the laws of nature or the laws of the Universe.

    For something to be from nothing is imperfect.  So I understand God as an imperfection, something that is but never was.  Something that came but never left, something that left but never came... you see the parody here I assume.

    Why something that neither lives, dies, never was or always was but has no origin is said to be "perfect" is unlike anything that actually exist.

    I believe in the Muslim tradition, this is called forbidden. Not forbidden like, "here is a door, do not enter because it is forbidden", more like it's forbidden because it is impossible.

    It doesn't answer that one question we all eventually or have already asked, "where did it all begin. Why are we here.  What is the point of life."

    Some say it is to find God.  To some extent I can accept that as a reasonable desire because in a lot of ways the need to know is with us and has always been.  However what I cannot accept is that god is perfect because we live in a dual reality and god is not natural.

    Time is imperfect.  It never ends.  It may not mean much outside of earth but it never goes backwards and it never stops and who is to say it ever really began.

    So it is in my eyes that most search for something that is imperfect and believe it to be perfect.  They search for what is unnatural and impossible and give credence to it as though it will save your soul.

    Some believe that a life that has only lived a short time was imperfect because it inherited a disease or an illness, they say something was wrong with it instead of giving adoration for being what it is, a real life.

    So they search and search and search for all that is unatural instead of looking at what is right in front of their faces.

    Anyways, you get the point...I think.

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      This is very nice.

  18. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i thought this forum was intended to let people state their ideas not question the ideas of others did i read it wrong?

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It's a generalized discussion forum. You can express your views or beliefs.

      I simply stated mine.

  19. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Hello Sandra,

    I see you are in a spirited mood today.

    I will agree- Mankind is perfect. It is mankind's limited vision to see perfection or create perfection from nothing that seems to be the problem.

    Since mankind cannot or doesn't see how they are perfect- then it is in their nature to strive for it, even though they do not know what holds them back.

    The missing element of what holds them back is their inability to believe themselves to ever be perfect. I do find it interesting that mankind is bent on seeking perfection from the unknown entity, who is supposedly created life on Earth.

    How ever, one thing I've noticed in your post- You say we can from nothing? There is no proof of that, except what is learned from 'religious' text.

    Science has yet to determine where or how mankind came to be, but what I do know- LIFE itself came to be because the Moon in orbit around Earth, established a life-form existent environment. Which, if it hadn't- life would not have formed on Earth.

    So, you can take what you want from that.

    And, on another note- would you please either call me by my screenname or by my name- Ray.

    I do find it disrespectful for you not to.

    1. 0
      sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Sorry Ray, I didn't know your real name.  I apologize. Did I say that life comes from nothing?  If I did then it was a typo. That or it could have been derived from the confusing use of imperfect=god=perfect=man etc...

      To my understanding, life did not begin on Earth but the organism or thing whatever it be, existed elsewhere in the Universe and was brought here by a star (meteor whateva)because water existed before life began but water is essential to the life on Earth. smile

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        See, that is where evolution comes into play. The collision of the meteor that hit Earth, which was established to be our moon, has resources and compounds, which are part of our make-up.

        It helped evolve life on Earth, but science has proven what was the chemical make up of the meteor which hit Earth then. I know because it is part of basic science of Earth and Mankind's existence on Earth.

        1. 0
          sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          You mean carbon?

          1. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I mean alot of things. Nothing one specific.

            1. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              The science hasn't gotten to is about the specifics of 'how' or 'where' we came from and my personal opinion is that it doesn't matter.

              We exist. Living in the past, trying to dig up the past, to learn where or how we came to be...isn't as important as living for today and preparing for the future.

              1. 0
                sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I agree that living today is more important than anything else. smile Though to see the future I think we should have to understand our past and find our origins so we don't repeat the same mistakes such as believing in things that don't exist and killing for them etc..

                1. Cagsil profile image83
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Understood, but not every detail needs to be learned. Learn what you can and move on with what's most important.

                  Same as like driving- you drive a car, you look in your mirror every so often, it tells you where you been, but cannot tell you where you are going. You have to look straight forward to see where you are headed.

                  That's most important.

                2. Jewels profile image80
                  Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  We've said similar things Sandra - must be a planetary alignment!! smile

                  1. Cagsil profile image83
                    Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    As for why people kill people? Well, that's one humanity is still figuring out.

                    Why people believe in something that they can not see, touch, taste or hear...is another question that remains unanswered, but philosophy(I believe) can answer it.

                    But, no likes a shrink.lol

              2. Jewels profile image80
                Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                That depends on what it is you're looking for and why you are looking for it.  I suppose there are differing agendas.  I personally have learned allot from introspective regression.  And in order to move forward sometimes the past has to be cleaned up.

                1. Cagsil profile image83
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  But, as I've learned as a part of my studying over the last 20+ years...I've learned that there are some questions that need never be answered.

                  Example: Theologians for centuries have made a big deal out of where mankind came from or why of the universe?

                  These questions leads to mystical inventions for answers and begs people to argue about a creator or who created the creator.

                  It's irrelevant. Life exists- WHY? is the only question we each must answer ourselves. Why do we live?

                  Sometimes that basic question such as Why do we live? can be answered- you were born?

                  Why were you born? Because your mother got pregnant.

                  Anything other than that...need not be answered.

                  Life exists. Be done and move on.

                  lol

                  1. wyanjen profile image87
                    wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I'm begging to know how and when. I am a history geek.
                    But I don't need to know why.

                    Why implies that there is a purpose. I don't believe there is one, outside of what each person decides is their own purpose.

                  2. 0
                    sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Ah, a very Buddhist answer. smile However, if you gave up the search for answer (regardless of the one you will never find) then what would we do?

                    What would we move on to?  Would we become an even more materialistic and wasteful breed?  Or are you simply saying, stop looking for something that doesn't exist and things will get better?

                    I will give credit to the idea of a god because without it, mans mind may not have been moved in the sentient direction of course it's had its run and should be remembered just not repeated.

                  3. Jewels profile image80
                    Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I'm not interested in those question you have mentioned.  Inner vision is a phenomenal experience.  As for said mystical invention of answers - that is also subjective.  Just because you are not having MY experience does not make my experience invalid.  And the more I have MY experiences of non physical phenomena the less mystical they become.  This is the level of consciousness I seek and am succeeding in doing so.

                    Now it's very easy to get the answers as to why I was born to my parents.  There are organic answers and then esoteric answers.  I have a very delving mind, but putting that aside, I also wish to experience for myself that which is written.  It's not good enough to just move right along and accept someone elses words.

                    Philosophy = the love of wisdom.  Wisdom comes from experiences.  Nous = knowledge = to know = to experience.  The experience unfortunately is missing in todays philosophy and we take as gospel what has gone before.  That makes for a sleepers mentality from the outset.

          2. 0
            sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Sorry, I just think you got something mixed up.  Our moon was formed from the Earth.

            1. wyanjen profile image87
              wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              (diplomatic interruption)
              I believe the moon was formed from the earth - when it got plunked by a meteor. I think you are both correct here...

            2. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Yes, it was. That doesn't mean that an organism must have come from the meteor. There could be another explanation for it, which science hasn't yet found.

              That's all I was saying.

  20. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    You asked what we thought. We told you.

    Is there another question you want answered?

    That might create an argument? Such, as is important to recycle?

    If that would be your next question- I would say "Yes".

    I do realize that the Earth is 4+ Billion years old, but mankind and it's destructive ways, can and will, have long-term effects on Nature, the longer we live.

  21. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i need 8 hrs sleep or i feel tired the next day.

  22. wyanjen profile image87
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    Here's what I'm looking for when I ask paper or plastic:
    Do you think the environment is damaged more by cutting down trees, or creating litter that never degrades back into earth elements?
    Are you concerned about whether plastic may be having a negative impact on your health?

    ...or, whatever angle you are interested in: if you have a different idea, throw it at me. smile

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Are you sure that is all you want me to throw at you?lol

    2. aware profile image70
      awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      see i like this .  ive read that new studys state plastic emits a chemical  thats harm full .   plus  its almost non bio degradable. paper products on the other hand are now largely made from recycled material which ive read costs more and creates more environmental problems via pollution than    fresh material cultivation dose  . farming wood via smaller quick groth shrubs and trees . seems to me to be the best attempt at lessing our impact . think hemp my friend bring back hemp lol

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol

      2. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        AHA! Perfect!
        aware, you brought up a point that I had not included in my outline wink Thanks pal!

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          See, again beneficial?

          Who would thunk it?

          lol  lol

  23. Jane@CM profile image60
    Jane@CMposted 7 years ago

    I'm confused.  This is in Religion, so is the original question to spark a religious conversation or a general conversation?

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You are more than welcome to talk about religion. I have no qualm with it.

      I set up the forum, as it is described in the opening post. I would like your view, knowledge, belief and/or opinion, on whatever you would like to discuss?

      I only ask that if you want me to respond, please make sure you realize I am carrying on more than on conversation at a time.

      So, welcome.

    2. aware profile image70
      awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      god ideas  im cool with the discussion . but not if its gona turn into a debate. i dont follow any religion or book but i have ideas about god and gods. they are in no way  claimed by me to be fact or truth . first post demanding proof of any idea of mine or others and im out . lol. ok ill start. i dont think god or gods have a human form

      1. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I'm not qualified to comment on your last sentence but I'm with you on everything else here wink

  24. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    ty for  the civil exchanging of ideas.. your cool in my book

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No problem.

    2. Jewels profile image80
      Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I really like the hemp idea for paper, bio fuel, clothing.  Solves so many problems.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I'll agree.

        1. wyanjen profile image87
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hemp may be worth it's own Hub.

  25. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Btw, HI Jewels.

    Nice to see you yet again. lol big_smile

  26. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Assumption is the mother of all screw ups. You can not assume anything ever. If you do, you're most likely have it blow up in your face.

    Right.

    1. 0
      sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Isn't that an assumption? lol

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Actually, no it is not. It's factual.

        When you 'assume' something- you in essence are taking it on faith, per se. So, therefore, you can not determine it's course.

        And, if you cannnot see the direction it is going to go, then you cannot understand 'why' or 'how' it goes off course.

        1. 0
          sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          The joke went right over your head.

  27. wyanjen profile image87
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    BTW> wyanjen is my standard internet name. It means Jen, from Wyandotte (Michigan)
    Usually when I make a new account for something, "jenrocks!" is already taken.

  28. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    the thank you i posted was  to wyanjen. just fyi

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      wink

  29. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i think killing is a primal instinct that all carnivorous share.

    1. Jewels profile image80
      Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Animal instinct, survival of the fittest.  I know if I was pushed hard enough I could do it.  Most mothers would do it easily to protect their child.

      We are animals!

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        We are not animals. I think the human race is above animal mentality, simply because of their consciousness.

        Animals are reactionary creatures guided by nature.

        1. 0
          sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          So are humans.  wink

          1. Jewels profile image80
            Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            We are animals for better or for worse.  We share...... what?.........98% of the genetic makeup of a chimp.

            Humans react instinctually and emotionally.  There are differences between the two, but we as humans do both.

            1. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Other animals such as dogs and elephants also react on emotions. smile

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Yes, they do....according to Nature's power or guidance.

          2. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Human has it's own nature. Not Nature of Earth like animals.

            1. Jewels profile image80
              Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              You'd be surprised at how much we have in common with both plants and animals.  Our minds are the only thing that sets us apart.

              Procreation is the main thing we have in common with plants.  Did you know that a plant will continue to have sex until it dies.  No rest for plants.  Apparently we share genes with the banana.

              We have much in common with animals, and it is debatable whether some humans are humans at all.  Take the jungle woman from Indonesia as a good example of how we can mimic animals.

              Our upbringing, our nurturing (or unurturing) environments is what stands us apart from plants and animals.  A child who has been beaten within an inch of it's life, abandoned and uncared for is not just going to forget it's past and move onward and be a fully functional accepting, forgiving, compassionate human being.  Perhaps in an ideal world, but we don't live in one of those.

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I realize everything you said and believe it or not, I understand it.

                What makes people do things is still trying to be answered.

                As for those who live in the wilderness and act like animals, is because they probably are still. Not evolved...who knows, without direct contact. No one can say for sure.

                My research doesn't pertain to that area, because I kept with science and philosophy. No individual make-up which is for deeper study.

                1. Jewels profile image80
                  Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  The jungle girl went missing.  She was initially with her family and got lost.  16 years later she was found.

                  You can't put her circumstances down to her not being spiritually evolved.  It was a matter of not being influenced by humans, but influenced by animals.  The fact humans can be influenced in such a way by animals says major volumes about the human form.

                  You say "what makes people do these things is still trying to be answered"  It has been answered.  Not sure where you are pulling this from.  Human behaviour is modeled by environment, by the upbringing from it's parents, it's food, it's schooling, it's neighbourhood.  What it sees, what it smells, what it touches, what it reads, what chemicals are put in it's body, what it is told to believe.

                  1. Cagsil profile image83
                    Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Like I said, before I posted that- Why someone kills? Cannot be answered.

                    You want to incorporate all the things you've said above you can, but that really doesn't explain - the IRRATIONAL actions of killing. Killing, itself makes no sense, even with all relevant information.

                    That was my point.

            2. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              What nature would that be then?

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                The nature of man and woman? What did you think I was talking about.

                1. 0
                  sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Still, even if the nature is man and woman as you put it, other animals still share the same instincts. 

                  Animals are also very particular about their mates. They protect their young, they reproduce, they survive by instinct and they are driven by Nature, just as we are.  We are guided by our environments.

                  You don't believe that dogs or Rhinos become jealous or angry?

                  1. Cagsil profile image83
                    Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    You are not guided by your environment. You are guided by your mind.

                  2. wyanjen profile image87
                    wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Dolphins rescued my friend Dave. He was on a pontoon boat and got stuck on a sandbar.
                    They bashed and bashed the boat until it was free.

                    He was completely stupefied. At first, he thought they were sharks lol When he realized what they were doing, he just could not believe it.
                    I was blown away by it also, but I hear similar stories all the time.

                    Humans have unique qualities, but other animals have higher intelligence and emotion as well.

      2. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        i see killing in a big way .i eat meat. i kill weeds. and germs when i clean

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Now, you are being too literal. lol

          Your individual survival is all that is necessary.

          1. Jewels profile image80
            Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Tell that to a mother.

            1. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              A mother is going to do whatever is in the best interest of her or her family.

              I was generalizing humans.

            2. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Thank you. smile

              1. aware profile image70
                awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                this father dosent want the right to chose . i wish mothers didnt want it too

                1. 0
                  sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Who says a mother wants to? It would be much easier if we didn't feel the need to ensure the survival of our children.

                  1. aware profile image70
                    awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    41 million a year want to . main reason being? gender. girls die. boys live . statistic's ive read from world health org. state that . granted they could be flawed. i see it not as necessity but for want.

          2. aware profile image70
            awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            is it ok with you for me to be literal? cus if not ill conform  just for you.  but then you have to conform to a way of thinking of mine at a later time of my choseing

            1. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              lol

        2. Jewels profile image80
          Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Those darn germs!

          1. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            lol lol

      3. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        yup. I wouldn't think twice.

        and, yup again. We are.

  30. Jewels profile image80
    Jewelsposted 7 years ago

    wyanjen, I agree about purpose.  So much gets tied up in this purpose for living thing.  Interesting when one finds a purpose and achieves it, they look for another.

    Isn't purpose purely about Living?  And for those who find living difficult, I mean really being ALIVE and LIVING, then perhaps there are deeds from the past that need to be cleared away in order for that person to get back on track and succeed in living.

  31. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i think the meaning of life is perpetuation of the species

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I agree with that idea.
      It is what drives us on.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        It helps add meaning to one's life, but not the sole purpose.

      2. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        i am small life is bigger than me .i derived my answer on this from all life forms not just humans

  32. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i am against abortion except for medical reasons , and rape or incest .

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I'll agree to disagree- the right is always the woman's choice.

      1. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        i think humans are animals

  33. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    im not  insisting conformity tho

  34. tantrum profile image59
    tantrumposted 7 years ago

    I think we're the product of an experiment gone wrong.
    If Eternity exists, our life is meaningless.
    If God exists, he can't be happy with the result of his 'creation'
    If the soul exists, we're here waisting our time.
    If we think we're wonderful. intelligent beings, we're blind.

    One way or the other ,we better enjoy life. This ,as human beings ,is the only life we'll get. Not much, I would say, if you look around. If you realise in the hands of who or what, have you put your life in. Beautiful human beings indeed !

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Welcome Tantrum,

      Glad to see you decided to join us. smile

      Interesting thinking.

  35. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Sandra,

    I hope this helps.

    This perspective is from Aristotle, master philosopher.

    Human beings are by nature good, rational, and productive(or mankind could not exist).  Human beings are competent to fill their needs to achieve happiness.  By being free to act according to their own nature, they will best serve themselves and society without force or coercion from any authority or government.

    1. 0
      sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The intended meaning of nature is instinct.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I see

  36. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    I'll be back in about 5 minutes.

  37. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    You don't believe that dogs or Rhinos become jealous or angry?

    Not jealous or angry. Those are human emotions, which mankind has attached to animals.

    1. Misha profile image75
      Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Umm, did you ever have a pet?

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Yes. I have 2 cats presently?

        Why do you ask?

        1. Misha profile image75
          Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Because watching their behavior makes obvious to me they do become jealous. And they seem to have other emotions, too:)

          brb, in half an hour or so smile

    2. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      These emotions are some of the driving forces of survival.
      Of course rhinos get jealous. If they didn't, they would not compete for a mate.
      Survival of the fittest is more than an abstract theory smile

    3. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Sorry, I was away contemplating plastic...

      I do believe that animals have emotion. Anger, jealousy, fear, love, all come from an area of the brain that all animals share.

      What is {probably} unique to humans is the ability to analyze the emotions.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Animals, if they were not guided by Nature's automatic guidance system- would not be able to exist. They cannot think for themselves, that is the power of nature.

        1. Misha profile image75
          Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          How do you know, not being an animal yourself?

          1. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Science has proven animals are not smart enough and need guidance from nature. Long ago documented.

            I thought that was common knowledge.

            1. Misha profile image75
              Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              No, it is not. To the best of my knowledge, science does not know yet. Care to prove your categorical point, as you outlined in the rules? smile

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Your human consciousness- the ability to separate yourself from the world around you.

                Animals cannot.

                How is that?

                1. Misha profile image75
                  Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Again, how do you know animals cannot not being an animal yourself? smile

                  1. 0
                    sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    My dog separates herself from my kid everyday! lol smile

                  2. Cagsil profile image83
                    Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Science has already accounted for the fact that animals are not conscious beings.

              2. 0
                sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I wonder what books he is getting his information from. No offense Ray but you seem to be getting some really shady science literature.

                1. Misha profile image75
                  Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  IDK Sandy, there are a plenty of books out there, and the whole internet, too. Separating good from weeds is not always easy. smile

                  1. Cagsil profile image83
                    Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Interesting.

                    The fact you don't understand or don't see, is expected. Not everyone retains information the same.

            2. wyanjen profile image87
              wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Giant floating piles of plastic garbage in the Pacific Ocean have proven that human animals are not smart enough and need guidance from nature. lol

              Which animals have science proven to be not smart enough?
              Nature is sounding a little bit like god here.

              Some animals more than others survive on instinct. If you put humans in a different group, how do you explain out own instincts?

              1. 0
                sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                That's exactly what I am sensing here too.

              2. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Different in each person. But, yes mankind is higher intelligence than animals....simply look at the power of mankind versus animals.

                That consciousness separates us and makes humans better.

                GOD? What god? LOL

                1. wyanjen profile image87
                  wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  What god is MY point! Are you trying to pull a fast one? lol
                  Your explanation of nature does sound kinda divine there smile

                  Human intelligence is certainly higher than in other animals.
                  One reason is our ability to think abstractly. Another reason I think is our ability to communicate. If we didn't all have books and schools, if we had no education, we would not be able to discuss abstract things.

                  But none of this means that lower animals are blank slates being guided about with no free thought and emotion. Animals face decisions and then make them, same as we do. smile

          2. 0
            sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            So what you are saying is nature is the guiding force which causes us to learn?

            1. Misha profile image75
              Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              No Your Majesty, I am not going that far - albeit I don't argue with this. smile

              My point was that I frankly not sure we are any smarter than animals, especially those really smart ones like dolphins. I am not saying we are not, but I am not saying we are either. smile

              1. 0
                Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I don't know if we're smarter then animals as humans are the only species to willfully operate outside of balance with their environment and habitat, thus endangering their own survival. Animals know when to stop mating consuming and depleting when the environment can't support it.

              2. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Then I would have to say that you don't give the human race enough credit.... lol

                1. Misha profile image75
                  Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Why should I? Unearned credit is the root of our recent problems tongue

            2. Cagsil profile image83
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Remember....per se, as I said before- Human Nature is different than Nature which guides animals.

              That statement I gave earlier is an absolute about man and woman. Which describes 'HUMAN' nature.

  38. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    You know, jewels and I thought we were getting along so well.

    Now, you seem to be offended by something I've said or by my actions.

    If I have offended, please let me know. I apologize.

    Killing isn't rational at all. It is instinctive reaction.

    It happens without thinking. Why do you think most people who have to defend their life....barely remember what happened?

    Because, instinct takes over the rational mind.

    1. Jewels profile image80
      Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You're talking in circles and not making sense toward your own statements.  You think people don't remember trauma?

      Killing as an instinct is animal behaviour.  Humans act on instinct the same as animals.  Humans do have a rational mind and do know the difference between right and wrong.  But if a human is not nurtured and brought up and treated in such a way, that rational thinking is no longer possible, then you are not going able to play by the ideal rules you are wanting to get to.  A persons mind can become a sewer and that is because of the treatment they receive from their environment.  This is basic psychology.

      In order to understand the rational and irrational mind, high and low states of consciousness one really must learn to See from a wider perspective.  It helps to surround yourself with people of all walks of life who have experienced rape, beatings, abuse, famine, war etc.  And also to surround yourself with people who have had charmed lives, good education.  Then you can understand what makes a person do what they do.

  39. Jewels profile image80
    Jewelsposted 7 years ago

    I have an appointment and have to go.  Cagsil, I really think you are talking about an ideal scenario that is rare.  The majority of people are totally unaware that they are the sum of their parents expectations and wantings.  Until one can separate themselves out from their primal upbringing, their state of consciousness is pretty blurred by circumstance.  Thing is, people don't even know it.  Awareness is not being a sleeper.  A sleeper is one who is embroiled by it's environment and does not have a mind of it's own beyond that environment.

    So to talk about rational thinking and being guided by the choices of ones mind, is a mindfield in itself.

    Enjoy your bantering. 

    Sorry Misha, I couldn't hang around till your return.

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Good night jewels, I enjoyed your company.

      I'll talk with you again sometime.

      It's been fun.

  40. 0
    Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago

    It is a sad but necessary truth that whether desired or not sometimes killing is the only rational option in a situation. Some people can not be reasoned with or negotiated down, and if not killed will kill you. Now will you accept that conclusion or fight against it. If you seek to further your life on earth then the only rational course of action is to kill before being killed.

    This could probably be grouped back under the instinct of survival, but illustrates the problem with rigid beliefs. If you are not free to move beyond beliefs from time to time then it will get you killed literally. I abhor killing and violence, had I not been able to move beyond those beliefs and do what was beyond my instincts I would never have come home from Afghanistan.

  41. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    only men think of ways to kill . only men torture and premeditate. only men kill when told to kill . only men kill over ideas. only men flock to war. only men punish killing with killing. only men whole scale kill their young for theory's sake. or in a attempt to control natures process. on second thought, i think us not animals , i think us worse.

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I once saw on a nature show (so sorry, I don't remember which one) a group of chimpanzees stalk and murder another chimp. They had no motivation in terms of survival to do it.
      They just killed it, and walked away from it. sad

      1. 0
        Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I saw that special too, I think they said that in all of nature humans and chimps share two common traits, they kill for purposes beyond survival, and have sex for causes beyond purely mating.

      2. aware profile image70
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        ohh thats right i saw that one too . so there are holes in my theory . again my friend your a good conversationalist ty again

    2. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      lol  lol  lol

  42. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    scott ive been reading your posts also and appreciate your thoughts and civil dialog . to guys like you make forums worth while i think

    1. 0
      Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Well thank you, I try but you can ask Misha there have been times when I have gotten uncivil, but I do feel bad about it. Ironically Misha has a reputation as a scrapper among many religious posters yet he's usually the one to reign me in.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol  lol  lol

      2. Misha profile image75
        Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        LOL Not that I try intentionally, it just happens tongue

  43. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    wyanjen  scott . its late and works early tomorrow . i hate to repeat  myself but in this case its due   it was cool discussing things  with you both . good job . and good night

    1. 0
      Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Later my friend

    2. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      great discussing with you too - when I publish my paper/plastic thing I'll let you know so you can see where I added the input you gave me. It will be there! lol
      take care

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        How is the project coming along?

        1. wyanjen profile image87
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          It's going pretty slow, what with the forums lol
          tomorrow is another day.
          This really was a fake-sick day for me, so why the heck not waste it anyway...

          1. Cagsil profile image83
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Well, I'm enjoying your company.

            So, I guess that could possibly be consider a plus.

            But, that depends on how you want to look it, you know, perspective and all.

            lol

            1. wyanjen profile image87
              wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I do consider it a plus. Who else was I gonna talk to?
              But if any of you guys sees my lazy butt in the forums tomorrow, give it a kick tongue

              1. Cagsil profile image83
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Thank you.

  44. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Bye aware

  45. tantrum profile image59
    tantrumposted 7 years ago

    LIFE





    That's it.

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      lol lol lol lol

    2. 0
      Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Well there's the problem the sperm are green! or tadpoles, or okay I'm stopping now.

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol  lol

  46. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Scott are you leaving? or hanging?

    1. 0
      Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I'm outta here for now, you all are aces in my book, nice to see a somewhat civil discussion on the forums. I'll be lurking around.

      1. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Scott - Take good care smile

      2. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Take it easy. Have fun.

        Enjoyed your company.

  47. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Animals are not conscious.

    That is proof.

    1. Misha profile image75
      Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Jesus is our savior!


      That is proof lol

      1. Cagsil profile image83
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol  lol

        Where's your proof now? lol lol

        1. Misha profile image75
          Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          In the same place as yours. Want me guess? wink

  48. Colebabie profile image60
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    Animals can make decisions can't they? So they must analyze something.

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Not introspective measurement, such as conscious.

      Prime example: my cat just puked in my mom's room. If it had a conscious it wouldn't have stayed in my mom's room.

      1. wyanjen profile image87
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Maybe your cat doesn't have a high opinion of your mother. Or her room.
        lol

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          lol lol lol lol lol

      2. Colebabie profile image60
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        If ya gotta puke, ya gotta puke. He may have a conscious, but honestly not give a damn.

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Come on. lol

      3. Jewels profile image80
        Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        These types of statements prove you are unaware of what consciousness is.  Did you think perhaps the cat liked your mom's room over yours.  Maybe it felt better and it preferred to puke there.

        The cat does not know what is right and wrong in your eyes.  It knows what is right and wrong in it's own eyes.  It is conscious enough to know that it's better not to puke in it's own bed, best do it in someone elses.  Now that sounds quite human.

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          You know something Jewels, a cat or dog doesn't know right from wrong- "in it's own eyes" even then it doesn't. The animals is too stupid. If you really believe that a cat and/or dog has it's own right or wrong conscious ability.

          Seriously, go back to school. These things are ANIMALS and can not be tell the difference. You act like these animals are human. And, clearly they are not, nor do they have the ability of acting like a human.

          As for my take on consciousness, and we've had this conversation before- so, I'll leave it at that. I'm not going to justify continuing to repeat, repeat and repeat myself.

          How ever, since you are a lady and always showed respect, I will- an animal is alive- yes. an animal thinking for itself? NO! Nature guides it.

          Human are the only one life-form with any intelligence on planet Earth. And, to think that an animal is on the same level as Human is ridiculous. Can your cat do the dishes? Can your dog make the bed?

          I don't think so.

          1. Jewels profile image80
            Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You're missing the point.  From an intellectual standpoint, of course you are correct in what you are saying.  Cats and dogs do not have the same level of reasoning as humans.

            However, and this is what is being passed to you be many previous posts on this thread, human beings are in such turmoil within themselves, their state of reasoning right from wrong is lacking integrity.  It is not hard to compare the actions of a human being with those of an animal.  That's pretty simple to see and it's really not necessary to debate.  A human's actions speak louder than words.

            Intellectually, yes humans and animals are different in knowing right from wrong.  We are a different species.

            1. Misha profile image75
              Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Again, I am not too sure about it Julie. Good morning smile

              1. Aya Katz profile image89
                Aya Katzposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                This makes it sounf as if there are two species on this planet: humans and animals.

                Humans are animals. There are many species, some more closely related than others.

              2. Jewels profile image80
                Jewelsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Good Morning Misha.  Seems we do have to split hairs with this - so for the sake of rational clarity and sanity on this thread I'll stick to being a separate species! smile

            2. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Isn't this sorta like debating with a child?  He believes that Jesus was the first time people became consciously aware.  His science facts are deplorable and his reasoning is deficient.

              At least he has a sense of humor though. smile 

              He says animals are guided by nature and argues their ability to reason while at the same time he says humans are guided by their own nature.  Which is exactly the same as any other animal.  I don't think he really understands "nature" in the context of the debate. 

              Human intellect is stupefied in my opinion.  Washing dishes doesn't make us smarter.  Crapping in a toilet doesn't make us cleaner and it certainly doesn't mean we are superior. 

              As it were, it would seem that a cockroach is more superior than humans but because it cannot do the dishes it must be stupid. lol 

              I thought for real that Ray wanted to learn but it doesn't seem so.  He wants to be right and it isn't any surprise to me that this is what you can expect from people who believed on blind faith in whatever it is rather than being open to just the facts and using just the facts to formulate logic and a reasonable understanding of the natural world.   

              But this you already know. smile

  49. Cagsil profile image83
    Cagsilposted 7 years ago

    Okay?

    Answer: What makes a TREE grow?

    It is considered alive, but has not consciousness....so how does it grow?

  50. Colebabie profile image60
    Colebabieposted 7 years ago

    I'm confused. Isn't it conscience?
    Even I was spelling it wrong because I was confused.

    1. Cagsil profile image83
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Consciousness is your awareness that you are alive.

      Conscience is your inner-voice that tells you the difference between right and wrong.

      1. Colebabie profile image60
        Colebabieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Yes I know the difference. Just didn't know which one you were referring to. Either way, who am I to say that plants and animals don't have either, or both?

        1. Cagsil profile image83
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Well, I guess you don't give yourself enough credit of understanding something you been taught that is basic science.

          Plants are not conscious and to even think so, shows natural ignorance in defiance of science as well as everything else humankind has learned over the centuries.

          Don't take offense.

          If you cannot recognize another conscious life-form, then I say there is a problem with science not getting out to the community enough.

 
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