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Why does the Religion Forum cause such anger and hostility?

  1. darkside profile image80
    darksideposted 7 years ago

    The world will never know peace. How can it? People are too busy enjoying hating each other.

    1. 0
      Leta Sposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Is this a little like the "saltines are socialist" post?  lol

      The religion forum is as it is because the internet (and Hubpages, by making it free to sign up) has given voice to those who ordinarily would not be able to publish anywhere and who probably, in real life, nobody listens to.

      I find the discussions pretty lame (with a few notable exceptions and contributors).  It's said that approximately 14% of the US population has a 4 year college degree...and I have never thought of that as significant before, and because in reality one generally associates mainly with those in your social group who are in many ways similar to you.  Hubpage discussions have really opened my eyes to what education/and or decent self education does for a person, (A. 

      And B), there are some just plain scary crack pots out there who really believe everyone should think as they do, and who if they didn't have the forum as an outlet to vent (or whatever they think they are doing), would probably be doing some real damage out there in society.  ....Seen in this light, perhaps the 'anger and hostility' expressed is a positive thing.

      1. 0
        Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Indeed big_smile

    2. 0
      Ghost32posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Darkside, your post is right on target.  As for the question posed in the title, I can only say...no clue.  How any human can become upset by the contents of another person's mind (i.e. thinking process, belief set, etc.) is--and always has been--beyond me.  If you send your cow over to eat my cow's grass, that's one thing, but anger because you think Brahma cattle are sacred while I think Angus are good to eat?  I don't get it.

      For many years, I've had a "stock" answer for those who would ask about world peace or any similar "we are all one" topic, and that answer agrees with your own conclusion:

      Put any three people together, and two of them will promptly begin plotting against the third. 

      Of course that "rule" is riddled with exceptions; it's not meant to be concrete-literal.  But it does underscore the point:  We humans are, when considered en masse, a contentious lot...and that aspect of our construction (sadly) does not seem likely to wink out of existence any time soon.

    3. 0
      zampanoposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      We shouldn't forget the "hardware".
      A man of nowdays, is still a "homo erectus" with its hunter cro magnon brain with its fears and its carnivorous teeth.
      No change has taken place in man's nervous system since.
      His pulsions are still the same as they were at the time.
      Cultural veneer doesn't change much of this state.
      It would need a major genetic mutation for a naked ape to behave like a god.
      But we're not really longing for it. Aren't we ?
      I think this accounts for much.

    4. dejajolie profile image61
      dejajolieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I try and stay away from those and Political forums..."people fear what they don't understand" We also tend to forget what is "right" for me does not have to be right for you doesn't make my beliefs 'less true'.....

    5. carolegalassi profile image79
      carolegalassiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I think it's because a lot of people are burned out searching for the truth.  Especially the way the world is today.  The world says whats right is wrong and whats wrong is right.  Like abortion, it's wrong yet the world says it's ok.........a choice.
      The truth will set you free. People are frustrated because they can't find the answer or even get close to it.........and it is as close to them then they think. It's the distant from the heart to the mind.  Change the hearts of man and so will go the mind and the way we think.

  2. shazwellyn profile image83
    shazwellynposted 7 years ago

    Life is for living!  Lets just love each other!! x

  3. rebekahELLE profile image92
    rebekahELLEposted 7 years ago

    very true words, sadly. religion and politics divide, they don't bring together. I wonder what it was like before they were defined. hmm

    1. shazwellyn profile image83
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      well, lets just go beyond the ego, break down barriers with love x

    2. 0
      Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Happy.

      1. tantrum profile image61
        tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Before they were defined, there were no human beings ! lol

        1. shazwellyn profile image83
          shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          omg.. yes.. absolutely!  Marx had it right about the fairest way to live but the only thing he didnt take into consideration was HUMAN BEHAVIOUR! There are similar parallels here hon.  Brilliant!

          1. Jonathan Janco profile image81
            Jonathan Jancoposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Problem is Marxism became like a religion for people who distrusted religion. Just as Jesus' message of peace and brotherhood inspired the people who carried out the Crusades and the Inquisition, Marx inspired some of the most malevolent dictatorships in history.

            1. shazwellyn profile image83
              shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              yep, human behaviour again!  It goes and spoils everything.. boo hoo!

        2. rebekahELLE profile image92
          rebekahELLEposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          you know what I mean. smile I guess with the first man, who looked up and saw lightning and communicated that god was displeased.

          and the other one, said, no, no, its the angels....... lol

  4. Jonathan Janco profile image81
    Jonathan Jancoposted 7 years ago

    Apparently, the religious forum is a place to project or unleash anger. I'm often in there trying to bring everyone to a nice middle ground. Then I'll read a thread that really p***es me off and all of a sudden I'm just as guilty as everyone else. Just as well since when I do post threads that are attempts at peaceful resolution, one of those nice Christians tell me I'm going to hell because I don't quote scripture, therefore I'm not a real Christian. The religious forum is a no win and put on your thicker skin before entering.

    1. 60
      Godsweirdsonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Unfortunately, we have confused two totally different things trying to use the same definition.I don't believe that true Christianity is a religion. By definition, religion is man seeking God. Christianity is God seeking man. So if my "eternal" destiny is up to me and what I do, then yes I am going to argue that I'm right and your wrong. But if I am in a relationship with my Creator, and so are you, then it opens the freedom of being an individual.
      Allowing each other to "work out their own salvation" as Paul says in Philippians, is what we need to concentrate on. No, we don't "work" for salvation, but we DO work out our own daily walk with Him.

  5. Jonathan Janco profile image81
    Jonathan Jancoposted 7 years ago

    Better yet, post a quote from the Old Testament and then go on a three paragraph rant that has no conceivable correaltion to the quote. You'll fit right in.

  6. wyanjen profile image89
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    You make it sound like a scary place to go...

    I love scary places smile

  7. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    All the best ideas always end up in the trash. What a pity.....

    1. shazwellyn profile image83
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Like seeds from a poppy, most are wasted hon.  Most things are wasted, dont you think?

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Unfortunately, yes. But the ideas are so good. People get into the mix and it gets all muddled.

        1. shazwellyn profile image83
          shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          You know, I often wonder how many 'Einsteins' have been wasted because there was no opportunity?

          1. 0
            Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Or how many were ,um, eliminated in the countless purges of countless dictatorships? sad

            1. shazwellyn profile image83
              shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              as you said, most is wasted sad

              1. 0
                Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Still happening today.  sad

                1. shazwellyn profile image83
                  shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Absolutely.  I see the frustrated ones - they know they are disempowered.  The controllers are so bent on control, they keep em down cos they are a threat.  If they question or attempt to make them accountable, they silence them.  The only way is to try and beat the controllers at their own game.  Dont show them your cards or they will stack it against you.

                  A story...  I worked to empower people with learning difficulties and challenging behaviour.  I believe in being used as a tool so as they can live life independently.  The only thing was, that the team were controllers and werent interested in empowerment (which was my job description) but control.  They did for them, they didnt care about dignity and respect, whereas i did. 

                  I advocated for the clients.  What happened?  They made my life a misery.. until I left.  So what good did it do for the clients. f all.  So I learned to play lip service. Act as a 'controller' but be an empower without the team knowing.  That way the clients got choice, although limited.  You cant beat the system, im afraid.  It is the nature of human beings. x

                  1. 0
                    Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    I just became a victim of that as I just couldn't keep my big mouth shut. I advocated real change at my work that would have given the floor workers more autonomy, where in this case, it actually would have benefitted them and overall production, but it circumvented the Production Manager and Poof!, my job has been eliminated. Go figure. big_smile

          2. rebekahELLE profile image92
            rebekahELLEposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            what a provocative question. I have thought this also working with young children who are so bright and then they are told not to ask questions about why something is?  some of the greatest insight comes from a 4 or 5 year old. they don't set boundaries on the universe ...

    2. 0
      lyricsingrayposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      sad

  8. 0
    Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago

    It's an issue of pride, people will argue all day over what they heard or read instead of honestly admitting "I just don't know" Isn't that why its called belief because we don't know for sure. We believe because its what seems right and most plausible, if we knew for sure though wouldn't we all be knowing, not believing. I hear alot of talk about science, and its refusal to believe, but I have seen many a scientist say, "We just don't know". I also hear them say quite often in the face of new evidence we have reevaluated our conclusions. Try to get a religionist to say, you know what "I'm just not sure", see what happens then and bring a helmet and pads.

    For any human being to say that "I know for sure" is the ultimate act of arrogance, ignorance, and hypocrisy. The very act and basis of faith is built on the notion of not knowing for sure. The very premise of science's search for answers is that we don't know for sure. So why can't we just stop fighting and say what is true, " I just don't know for sure."

    1. tantrum profile image61
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      because they want to believe that their faith is based in something more than a mere presumption .

  9. aware profile image71
    awareposted 7 years ago

    because no one  believes exactly alike .  agreement on the issue is impossible

  10. Jonathan Janco profile image81
    Jonathan Jancoposted 7 years ago

    It's not that scientists don't believe, Scott, they just believe something else. And speaking of science, as ridiculous as the creation myth in Genesis is, I think what keeps so many people believing in it is the utter absurdity of the Big Bang theory. After all, what created the thing that banged so big, anyway?

    1. 0
      Scott.Lifeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You have a good point but here is when mass misinterpretation comes into play, physicists and astronomers do not believe that this Singularity or big bang was the origins of creation or the universe but of this current one. There are equations and calculations that mathematically show the existence of something before that event, Scientist have always said that as to what happened before they do not know given the current evidence. They admit to this but the average religionist will try to tell you that science believes everything began with this event and that it proves their belief in a lack of God, when that is not the case at all. Too many people confuse the comments of extremists on both sides as the actual stance of that side.

      1. Jonathan Janco profile image81
        Jonathan Jancoposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Wow, you always get me Scott. I don't know what it is, maybe the Fluid. Thanks for adding to my comment. Perhaps that will provide some clarity to some people.

    2. wyanjen profile image89
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Science isn't a belief.
      This is where some of the hostility comes from, I think.

      Scientists may or may not have a belief, but their work involves using evidence to prove or deny theories. Science is not like the bible, which can be interpreted in different ways.

      2 + 2 = 4: No dispute.
      Thou shalt not kill: An unbelievable amount of dispute.

      The math argument doesn't create a lot of controversial arguing.
      The commandment on the other hand, get everybody riled smile

    3. qwark profile image61
      qwarkposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      What is the "utter absurdity" of the "big bang" theory?
      Qwark

      1. Bovine Currency profile image59
        Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I prefer to believe there was no beginning.  Makes life a lot easier.  No big bang, no creator.  Just is.

        1. qwark profile image61
          qwarkposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I can't find fault with that.
          I thought that your use of the words "utter absurdity" indicated that you had studied all facets of the theory and rejected it as "balogny." Your answer seems to be just an opinion....NP..opinions are a dime a dozen. Yours is just as valid as any...:-)
          Qwark

  11. aware profile image71
    awareposted 7 years ago

    the bible isnt my thing but if its yours im ok with that. im not the book burning type

  12. aware profile image71
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i wish to dispute the 2 + 2 = 4 . 2 girls + 2 boys does not = 4 girls . nor 4 boys.

    1. wyanjen profile image89
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      you are wily... lol

      but you can't dispute that you have four people just the same. smile

      1. aware profile image71
        awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol good to see you. 68 + 1 = 69. im happy to be one person  equaling  your 69 fans.

        1. wyanjen profile image89
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          geez, I've been hoping somebody would join me or quit me. You are the first one to call me out though lol

          cue the relentless "69" teasing....

          Good to see you aware, how have you been? I have not forgotten that project from a few weeks ago, with your ideas for me about paper recycling. I'm hoping to finish and publish tonight. Or, tomorrow. I'll let you know. smile

    2. Cagsil profile image60
      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I wish to dispute all math- 1+1=3 lol

  13. Paradise7 profile image85
    Paradise7posted 7 years ago

    The people who feel the most strongly about a particular religious view get on the religious forums and anyone with more moderate ideas, willing to listen to others' points of view, doesn't have a look-in. 

    The religious forums here are apparently for "Fanatics Only" so anyone else has already been driven away.

  14. relache profile image87
    relacheposted 7 years ago

    A HubPages version of FTFY...

  15. myownworld profile image79
    myownworldposted 7 years ago

    religious forums = my idea of hell
    'abstinence' is the key ! wink

    1. Paradise7 profile image85
      Paradise7posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, you go girl.  True!

    2. 0
      Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The delete key?

      1. wyanjen profile image89
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        shift delete, actually...

      2. myownworld profile image79
        myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol if only it was that simple...!!!

        1. 0
          Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          It is, I just keep missing the damned keys. big_smile

          1. myownworld profile image79
            myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I pressed mine so hard, it got jammed! I've been cursed now! yikes

            1. 0
              Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I would not have believed that big_smile

              1. myownworld profile image79
                myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                oh I know u're going to hell with the rest of us for sure! imagine the fun we'll have there...ah heavenly!! big_smile

                1. 0
                  Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  In heaven there is no beer..... wink

                  1. shazwellyn profile image83
                    shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    In hell there is beer... only YOU CANT HAVE IT! lol

  16. wyanjen profile image89
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    OP, I don't think the forum causes anger or hostility.

    It simply attracts it. And then condenses it to extra-strength.
    smile

  17. myownworld profile image79
    myownworldposted 7 years ago

    Heaven:
    - no beer
    - no casual sex
    - none of us
    - all the religious from the forums! yikes

    Give me hell any day!!

    1. 0
      Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I'm gonna race you there!

      1. myownworld profile image79
        myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        yeah, that's me in your avatar in pink!!

        1. 0
          Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Oh yeah, take the one who's winning lol

  18. wyanjen profile image89
    wyanjenposted 7 years ago

    Hey wait...

    we're supposed to be angry and hostile here. tongue

  19. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    Oh yeah. Um, my God is better than yours. Yeah ,that's right I said is........ big_smile

    1. wyanjen profile image89
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Well, that's no insult to me since I don't have one.
      so, go to hell.
      oh wait, same problem.... 


      ummm...

      you've got cooties. neener, neener, neener tongue

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Now that's just downright mean! My God's name is neener! And, I already have my handbasket picked out. big_smile

        1. wyanjen profile image89
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          oh.

          neener neener neener is a sign of... tolerance... and um... respect.
          or something.

          Where you going with that handbasket? Oz?

          'Cuz the whole world is going to Oz in a handbasket.

          1. 0
            Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Perhaps, but not in mine. I got mine all tricked out in suede with fuzzy dice hanging off the rearview mirror an' stuff.....

    2. shazwellyn profile image83
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      more like.. I believe in god... No, I believe in god.  *fighting over the same thing*

      1. wyanjen profile image89
        wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        You're kidding, right? lol

        This was a joke between a christian and an atheist. See, we're not all enemies...

        Sometimes a joke about sheep is actually a just a joke about sheep.
        Not in the "lord is the shepherd" sense, just the regular old four foot wooly animal.

        There are some bullies and haters no doubt, but how often are people reading in their own hostility?

        This is a general statement, not directed at you shazwellyn... I really can't tell if you were kidding smile

        If an atheist says go to hell, it's not really an insult, is it? That's why I said, you're going to Oz with a handbasket. smile

        1. 0
          Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I was sooo insulted that I sheared myself in protest. big_smile

          1. wyanjen profile image89
            wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You know how self-righteous I am when I send you to Oz.
            You are styling with that basket though. It's much nicer than mine.

            How long will it take you to grow back that wool? It's getting cold you know. I hope your protest got fair market value, anyway...

            1. 0
              Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Well, in the current U.S. market, I wasn't going to do well, sooo...I sold it to some search engine tycoon in China! China! lol

            2. shazwellyn profile image83
              shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              not fair market value... hair market value! lol

              1. wyanjen profile image89
                wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                lol lol
                Nicely done.
                I was fairly sure you were being ironic... but I don't assume lol

                And for some reason, people do seem to get offended when we make sheep jokes... Not a lot, but there are a few...
                I think that's what happens when somebody skips right to the last page of the forum. They miss all the "subtle" points.

                1. shazwellyn profile image83
                  shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Denno loves it!  Denno is one of my favourite people here - such a sense of humour!  Gives me joy and a chuckle, especially when subjects get seeeeeeeeeeerious!

                  Life is for living! *wink*

                  x

          2. shazwellyn profile image83
            shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            no.. I was being ironic.  All religions believe in the same thing.. so why fight? x

        2. shazwellyn profile image83
          shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          sorry babes.. who is the athiest and who is the christian? x *confused, totally lost the plot!* lol

  20. tantrum profile image61
    tantrumposted 7 years ago
  21. 0
    sneakorocksolidposted 7 years ago

    I've got your violin and your neener right here!

  22. Bibowen profile image90
    Bibowenposted 7 years ago

    OK, to all of you self-anointed brightlights (and you know who you are). Is this question really seeking an answer or is it just a thread to bash the people you don't like elsewhere? I hope you can appreciate the irony of this thread in all the love it’s spreading to dispel the hatred on the religion forum.

    Isn't anyone yet tired of the listening to the bore who puts down the guy who always thinks he's right? I guess he think's he's wrong when he's bashing Bubba for being a know-it-all….

    The fact is that debating religion is a fine tradition that goes back many centuries. Ever heard of Luther v. Eck? The reason for the intensity is that people believe they are right about the points pertaining to religion. That's what makes a debate interesting. Who's going to tune in for 5 minutes to listen to two debaters verbally shrug their shoulders as if the topic isn't important? I want to listen to two guys who are certain they are right go at it.

    In American universities and in some in Europe, there has been a surge of interest in debates pertaining to religion. University religious clubs, not normally noted for having a large attendance to their meetings, often find themselves overrun with students in their club-sponsored debates on religious topics, like the existence of God, the veracity of the resurrection, Intelligence Design, etc. I've heard this story repeatedly over the last 5+ years. Our students appear to be interested in topics pertaining to God, Jesus, the afterlife, etc. And the way they are choosing to explore this interest is through a debate on religion.

    The fact is that debates on religion are intersting and are more likely to attract people's attention to Hubpages than some of the sad-sack musings I've read here. Your welcome.

    Now, I know for saying these things that I'm going to be showered by affirmation and love, unlike the no-nothings on the religion forum who would call me names, engage in character assassination, etc.

    1. 0
      Leta Sposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      As a self-anointed bright light (or whatever...I guess), most of the stuff I read in the religion forums does not even APPROACH what I'd call reasonable debate.  The lack of basic knowledge of world religions and different schools of thought is kinda scary.  I hope to God people are not 'debating' like much of what I've seen here at the university level these days.

      I seem to recall DISCUSSION on the thoughts of St. Augustine and Thomas Aquinas, Martin Luther, Golda Meir, Khalil Gibran, the principles of morality and ethics, etc., etc.  Not an insistence that one Christianist God is the correct way to indoctrinate children, ie.

      Mainly, I personally just stay away, unless posters I respect start a discussion, because there simply is no point in talking to wingnuts.  I figure they must be getting something positive (or a release) out of ranting, but surely I would never call any of it 'interesting.'

      1. Uninvited Writer profile image81
        Uninvited Writerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        yes...I seem to remember a thread when we talked about comparative religion and they all assumed it came from one book big_smile

  23. Jerami profile image77
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    seems as though intiligand discusion is a good thing,and intresting,
        Debate betweem two people who can not listen is booring
        When neither are willing to think about the points made by the other; time is wasted to extreme.

  24. Ben Zoltak profile image81
    Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago

    Clearly this dialogue would benefit from a less erudite quote, "A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." Willy Wonka.

    Religion is a set of gold-plated toggles engineered by the wealthiest members of all the world's societies. Inflammatory gestures are cultivated by well-meaning if somewhat less intelligent leaders who blindly worship the aforementioned wealthiest elite. The Human race is too fruitful for it's own good and is only placed in check by one of two forces: war or famine. This is the dogma engineered by the elite. Religion is this world's most notorious double edged sword used both to heal the sick and weak, while at the same time used to inflame the strong bodied and weak minded, thereby allowing the elite to cull the herd. You, me and most everybody we know are the herd.

    There are other paths to take, but in the history of mankind, rarely do we take the third path, namely: exploration. It costs as many lives as war or famine, the rewards are vast wild resources, but the risks of earnest exploration are conceived of as, ironically, too life threatening!

    1. rebekahELLE profile image92
      rebekahELLEposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      this post seemed to get lost in this thread, but says so much.

      1. Ben Zoltak profile image81
        Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this
        1. Bovine Currency profile image59
          Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Nice bump.  I enjoyed that.

  25. Quilligrapher profile image91
    Quilligrapherposted 7 years ago

    Someone said earlier in this thread, “The reason for the intensity is that people believe they are right about the points pertaining to religion.”  This reminded of a story told to me many years ago:

    When people die and go to heaven, they are divided into groups and taken on a tour of the place so they will be able, later, to find their way around.  So it was, one day, that the Angel Gabriel was leading a group of new arrivals, pointing out the various parts of paradise.  At one point on the tour, as they were approaching a place totally enclosed in high walls, Gabriel instructed the group to be very quiet while going past this area.  “Walk softly,” he said, “and don’t make a sound.”  Of course, everyone did as they were instructed.  Once they had passed the area, one person raised his hand. “Yes?” said Gabriel. “Do you have a question?”  “Yes I do,” said the new comer.  “Can you tell me why we had to be so quiet when we went past that place back there?” “Well, you see,” Gabriel replied, “that’s the part of heaven where all the born again Christians live and they think they are the only ones up here.”
    Q.

    1. aka-dj profile image79
      aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      They WILL be the ONLY ones up there. Haven't you read that yet? It's in Red Text

      1. Quilligrapher profile image91
        Quilligrapherposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks for your opinion, d. But, the fact that it's in print, no matter what the color, does not make it true.

    2. Uninvited Writer profile image81
      Uninvited Writerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      LOL...that is great smile

  26. Uninvited Writer profile image81
    Uninvited Writerposted 7 years ago

    Well that party got derailed by those with no sense of humour quickly enough...

  27. myownworld profile image79
    myownworldposted 7 years ago

    ((((this thread is in serious danger of turning into one from the religious forum!!)))

    1. 0
      zampanoposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I was thinking just that when I got to your post.
      how are you ?
      Beware of "abstinence"...

  28. shazwellyn profile image83
    shazwellynposted 7 years ago

    The forums, from a psychological perspective, are great for anaylising human behaviour.  It reflects behaviours safely, and can be viewed comprehensively, the inner thoughts and feelings of individuals.  This can be lost in a 'controlled' environment, where people are aware of social context and may be closed in their feelings.

    When debating religious context, people feel strongly because it isn't about the subject matter - but something deeply personal.  Something that is so strong in peoples identity that it is taken as an afront to them.

    Considering the identity, it might be thought of as the foundations of a house (the house being the whole person).  When an aspect of the identity is scrutinised and disected, it is like damaging the foundations of a person.  If these foundations are damaged, the house starts to subside.  The person starts to break down. It is fundamental to the individual's well-being to attempt to keep these foundations in tact.  The attacking nature is a form of defense.  They need to defend their whole being so they don't crack and subside.

    This is why the forums are so challenging, because the subject stirs up challenging behaviour. Signs of what is happening within an individual can be measured by the behaviour displayed.

    This is my input from a psychological perspective.  I hope this helps x

    1. Quilligrapher profile image91
      Quilligrapherposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It is a good input at that! Well said.

  29. 60
    evebey754posted 7 years ago

    I am new to HubPages but wanted to add a comment to the topic.  I feel that the problems with religion is that each group believe they're right.  When someone believes they are right, then someone else is wrong.  However, if each group believed that their way is only "one way" and not the "only way" we would have a different result and less problems regarding the issue. An analogy:  Think of a tree, it has many limbs and branches, but only one trunk with lots of roots unseen underground.  The limbs and branches represent the various religions and the trunk  (God) represents the one link to everything else.  Meaning all parts of the same Source. The roots (connected to the tree) are unseen but without them, the tree could not exist.

  30. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
    TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago

    Anyone considered religion as a control system?

    One can be easily misled and manipulated. There is a saying which goes like this;

    'repeat something over and over and people will blindly believe it.'

    Ever considered that the religion people are taught by their masters or priests isn't the religion their masters and priests practice behind closed doors?

    Look within and the truth shall set you free!

  31. UPStar profile image61
    UPStarposted 7 years ago

    religion and politics are both important.

    1. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
      TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Important to incite wars, segregation, racism, split the masses and keep the super wealthy in power.

      Even more important to keep the world suppressed of truth and to be living in fear!

      As long as people pay their taxes, support the system that doesn't support them then everything will be just fine!!!!

      1. UPStar profile image61
        UPStarposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I would say I utterly disagree, but I dont want to create anger and hostility. So... how's the weather?

        1. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
          TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Not that great in England, never is to be honest.

          However, I accept your opinion and we can both agree to disagree if you like. The biggest crime ever to mankind was when the few got to enslave the many. If you really knew what religion was or what people were actually worshipping then you would have a totally different outlook on life. I am not the one who can tell it how it is for it is up to the individual to seek the truth for themselves. Politics and religion or socialism is devised to keep the sheep in line and for the sheep to compete against each other for a slice of success, but never for a slice of freedom!!! Only the select few can taste freedom for what it really stands for. How inhumane!

          Don't let your feelings get you down and have a good day!

          1. Quilligrapher profile image91
            Quilligrapherposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Nearly every civilization known to exist in recorded history, of which “ours” is but the latest, has condoned physical slavery in some form.  Most of these civilizations predate modern religions, so it is hard to argue that religions created slavery.  I think that most people know what religion is and most adults that actively practice a religion know what they are actually worshipping.  Religions may have many flaws but I would not say they were devised to herd sheep although there are plenty of examples of how religion was used for that purpose. 

            Religion has two characteristics that attract large numbers of followers and both are among the main reasons why it exists at all.  First, it provides answers to all of the questions about life that we humans can not yet explain rationally, albeit many rely on interpretation and faith.  The origin and the purpose of life, and what ever comes after, can all be found in the teachings of religion.  Secondly, religious practice grew, not because it enslaved, but because it empowered mankind.  Early religions provided the weak and the meek who lived in constant fear, with a “sword” they could use against men more powerful then they were.  In their defenseless existence, the commandment “Thou shall not kill” really advocated “thou shall not kill me!”

            While religion may not have been intended to enslave people, it has proven to be an effective “glue” for bonding groups into individual societies.  When combined with language, traditions, and customs, it becomes part of a viable alternative to anarchy and people freely cooperate for the purpose of their own identity and the overall good.  In some modern cultures, the influence of religion is waning because it is less essential for physical survival.

            Q.

            1. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
              TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Slavery comes in many forms not just physically. There is all types of emotional slavery and mental slavery. In the past people were forced into slavery by physical means and they were given accommodation and food to stay alive. Nowadays we live in a more sophisticated society where a false sense of freedom is pulled over people's eyes. There is no need to use brute force against the people anymore because people willingly accept slavery today as a part of life.

              People are giving up their freedoms in so many ways today and in most cases without knowing so. The birth of terrorism in the modern age has given those in power the tool to restrict people of their constitutional rights. What people are also unaware of is when they sign the dotted line on certain documentation they have willingly but unknowingly wavered their rights as a human being, especially when joining a corporation. Religion is also devised to herd the sheep and to segregate the mass population. If you dissect any modern religion you will find so many similarities between them all - albeit the change of names and locations to suit a particular culture. If you dig a little deeper you will see that they all represent the same principle. Any holy scripture or doctrine are based upon the most earliest ancient worshipping but have been cleverly designed to give half truths and myths to keep people scratching around in the darkness.

              While people play the system and let themselves be manipulated and misled - chasing dreams and materialism - those who are practicing the only way to experience real freedom are the only ones really enjoying the ride while they dangle carrots for the few along the way, but there are so many that won't even get a glimpse of it!!!

              1. qwark profile image61
                qwarkposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                ..so? What does that tell you about the majority of human life? Do you have a remedy?
                Qwark

  32. Andrew0208 profile image60
    Andrew0208posted 7 years ago

    This is very common with all Religion forum. When you see people ravaged with hatred and hyprocricy while playing the game of Religion. Religion stinks without love.

  33. prettydarkhorse profile image66
    prettydarkhorseposted 7 years ago

    there is so much hatred and hostility here because they are taking it personally when in fact they can argue but being respectful of all opinions

  34. Niteriter profile image79
    Niteriterposted 7 years ago

    Oh Ben, you are so studious and sincere. I salute your great knowledge and your willingness to study the issues. Nevertheless, the more often someone injects a little levity in threads like this one, the less likely it is someone will go all postal on us.

    1. Ben Zoltak profile image81
      Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Haha, niteriter that's hilarious!  Maybe it's because I was raised by a Postal Worker that drank a lot of coffee, I learned to try and diffuse anger early on!

  35. Bovine Currency profile image59
    Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

    Moo

  36. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    Baaah.

  37. Bovine Currency profile image59
    Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

    If cows and sheep can get along... tongue

    1. shazwellyn profile image83
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Help!  we are being out run by hoofies! 'duck everyone, before the splurg!'

  38. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    It's the hairless monkeys that have a hard time playing in the same sandbox..... big_smile

    1. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The hairless monkeys.  Love it!

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        They constantly try my patience. lol

        1. wyanjen profile image89
          wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hey now.
          Scamper off and play.
          Let the monkeys throw their poo in peace.

          1. 0
            Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I left you a present; don't look down. big_smile

          2. Bovine Currency profile image59
            Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            tongue  Does a gorilla poo smell better than chimp poo?

            1. wyanjen profile image89
              wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Depends on which religion the gorillas are.

              1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                What if they are communist gorillas?

      2. Ben Zoltak profile image81
        Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Make mine a naked ape!

  39. Bovine Currency profile image59
    Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago
  40. Valerie F profile image61
    Valerie Fposted 7 years ago

    I think the religion forum itself causes no anger. People become angry when they feel threatened by views that differ from their own. Or they're already angry, but they use religion or the lack thereof as their scapegoats. Or they use the forum to spread untruths and misconceptions about other religions, then do not respond well to correction.

    1. Evolution Guy profile image59
      Evolution Guyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Lets be honest here.

      Your religion makes people angry and hostile. wink

      1. Valerie F profile image61
        Valerie Fposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Sure, blame my religion for your anger and hostility.

        1. Anna Erwin profile image60
          Anna Erwinposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          How about, people like you in your religion make people angry and hostile.

          1. tantrum profile image61
            tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I totally agree
            But she wouldn't see that!

            1. 0
              sneakorocksolidposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Always the victim never the bride! Hey Tantrum!

        2. Evolution Guy profile image59
          Evolution Guyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          LOLOL

          Yup that is a Christian right there.

          "Don't go blaming me for your anger and hostility. It is not my fault god said you are a fool and are going to burn in hell for all eternity. Plus - you are a sinner because you do not follow the rules I tell you god said are right. Why oh why is everyone so hostile and angry?" lol

  41. Anna Erwin profile image60
    Anna Erwinposted 7 years ago

    http://www.myteespot.com/images/Images_d/d_7208.jpg

    1. shazwellyn profile image83
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      kewl x

  42. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
    TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago

    ..so? What does that tell you about the majority of human life?


    -----------

    TWO words

    SUPPRESSED and IGNORANT

    Remedy?

    Look within and don't let the ego guide them.

    Remember this saying...

    'The best things in life are FREE!'

    How do people recognise this?

    By Opening their eyes and snapping out of the induced coma!

    1. qwark profile image61
      qwarkposted 7 years ago in reply to this
  43. goldenpath profile image81
    goldenpathposted 7 years ago

    Pride will always be the driving factor of contention.  It is the "unseen" walls we build up from childhood.  It is that superficial veil we build to protect our ego and perceived self worth.  The test is in finding the courage to burrow a window in that veil that new light and understanding can penetrate that secret room in the soul.  Only then can one find true liberty in their agency to choose in life.

  44. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
    TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago

    your remedy is purely idealism.


    -------

    We are living in a world driven by self interest. What does this do? It separates people from each other, promotes competition and satisfies the ego. This splits the population into thinking a particular way. Religion, politics, racism and socialism are designed so that the super elite can rule and divide. When wars are waged, fatal diseases are distributed and financial depressions are created the masses are chasing dreams and materialism, satisfying the ego and thinking about what time they should call round for the football match with a case of beer or what shoes would look better with the dress they are wearing.

    1. Ben Zoltak profile image81
      Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I admire the conviction behind your arguments "All C-ing I" but your last post excerpt," while the masses are busy chasing dreams and materialism, satisfying the ego and thinking about what time they should call round for the football match with a case of beer or what shoes would look better with the dress they are wearing"

      this begs the question: What superior diversion are the elite indulging in that is so much better than the masses?  To read your other posts, you imply that the elite must only be indulging in that which is "free" so from your logic you imply that the elite only partake in going to the library, long walks in the park and the occasional buffet at their neighborhood soup kitchen. Some how I think the elite chase the same dreams and materialism as the masses, only on an inordinately grotesque scale.

      I am curious how you would vote in my hub:

      http://hubpages.com/hub/Vote-For-Who-Yo … or-Zealots

      Let me know and I'll measure the degree of your magnanimity for free, so you know it's gots to be good!

  45. andromida profile image75
    andromidaposted 7 years ago

    As long as people giving more importance to religious leaders rather than the true human value or the real message which every religion convey-all religions in fact convey the same message- such anger and hostility will continue.

  46. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
    TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago

    The elite can indulge on a grand scale there is no doubt although they too can take that quiet long walk in the meadows. Yet they do so with free thought, do so without having to play the system or make any sacrifices of their own.

    Life is about seeking energy for that is all what life is after all!

    While the masses fight it out amongst themselves for the scraps of energy that is allowed into the system the elite can sit back and bathe in it at the expense of us all. Life is simply to be lived. We either live positive or negative. We create our own reality and our own environment. Free isn't just rolling around in the fields, kissing and cuddling and eating fruit and veg. Free goes so much deeper than this, but to experience the deeper, one can only see this from within.

    If we choose to chase outside fulfilment then we become locked into the system where we have to play the game. Money, religion, materialism and egotism is an outside form of worship which creates competition. It is designed to make us feel separated from everyone else. It is created to make us feel individualistic and it is also designed to stop unity and a coming together of all.

    While people are too busy judging others and blaming everything bad that happens within life upon others instead of looking within and seeking understanding of self - thus seeing the real problem for what it really is - they will be subjected to negative thinking which brings to them low feeling that manifests their reality.

    The press, government, religious institutions and entertainment business are controlled and structured to make people look outside of themselves for both fulfilment and answers. While people scratch around in the darkness seeking that thing, that particular thing that can make them feel whole and complete, to fill the huge gap that is gaping in their lives which always seems to be there, the deep empty feeling that is eating away at them, sucking the energy from them, making them feel alienated from everything around them you can be assured that the elite are experiencing that yearning which the masses seek.

    Money, religion, politics and entertainment are simply put before us to act as a smokescreen to give us a false sense of freedom and security. It also diverts our minds away from the truth and away from the things we aren't supposed to know.

    1. Ben Zoltak profile image81
      Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this
  47. TheAllSeeingEye profile image59
    TheAllSeeingEyeposted 7 years ago

    I also enjoy your multifaceted rendition of freedom.  I would have you know though, that many regular non-elite, enjoy these kinds of liberty.


    ---------

    They enjoy it because they don't know how to enjoy life period! Their minds are controlled and their life experience is guided by others with their consent of course...

    While they sit back with their feet up, drinking fluoride and aspartame beverage and munching on foods tampered with preservatives and toxins, reading a magazine filled with negative thinking or watching the latest action packed movie complete with subliminal messaging and symbolism that all goes toward occult worshipping people like themselves somewhere in the world are being killed off and sacrificed in some war without a cause or hate filled crime. Let's just hope it doesn't happen to them....

    1. Ben Zoltak profile image81
      Ben Zoltakposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I will hold tight to what you said about happiness residing within, that is solid advice I can use.  Also not to affected by outward negativity! Thanks EYE!

  48. Jerami profile image77
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    With out a doubt the religious forum does not cause anger and hostility.
       Anyone that believes that it does is lying to themselves.
       The truth is that when anyone has a chip on their shoulder and want to dare someone to knock it off, the most popular place to do this is the religious forum.
       
       And there are other benefits as well.
       The believers can think that they are showing the non believers the truth the light and the way.
       And sometimes people come on here only with the intention of hijacking the thread and the subject mater that would have been discussed is pushed to the wayside.
       
       Any one should feel free to ask honest questions or express honest comments but; just to rob the opportunity for others to do the same thing is just wrong.
       That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

  49. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    To do that you would need to ban religion.

 
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