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Do unbelievers know everything?

  1. uszealot profile image61
    uszealotposted 7 years ago

    Does any sane person believe that humanity has learned all there is to learn about the universe? I sincerely doubt it. Yet when unbelievers dismiss as impossible those things which superficially appear incompatible with our current understanding of the universe (e.g. the existence of a "spirit world", the Genesis account of Creation, the miracles of Christ as recorded in the Gospels, the very existence of God, etc.), aren't they implying that we do know all there is to know?

    1. Mark Knowles profile image61
      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Are you saying we should accept the ridiculous because we cannot "know all there is to know"?

      At what point is it reasonable to apply common sense?

      1. uszealot profile image61
        uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        What is ridiculous? Is anything that can't be perceived with the physical senses ridiculous? Is the "big bang theory " ridiculous? Einstein and most of the scientific community once thought so. Is the concept of dark matter ridiculous? Can you see, hear, or feel dark matter? Or antimatter? or even gravity? Does that mean those things do not exist?

        I'm not saying we should or should not accept anything. I am only saying that to dismiss as impossible or "ridiculous" anything that is not compatible with our current understanding of our universe is to greatly limit the potential for discovery. Perhaps mankind's greatest limitation is its own narrowmindedness.

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          cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          i hate to seem disrespectful but the only people who appear to be "narrow-minded" are Christian people. scientific minds have, through the ages, been the ones to question everything, imagine every possibility and attempt to find the truth, not just blindly accept what others tell them as fact. how can you talk about "mankind's limitations" when scienctific innovations have cracked open the Universe?

        2. fatfist profile image86
          fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          (Is the concept of dark matter ridiculous? Can you see, hear, or feel dark matter? Or antimatter? or even gravity? Does that mean those things do not exist?)

          If you talk about concepts then that's what they are: CONCEPTS. People have conceived of mermaids swimming in the gaseous oceans of Jupiter. There is no problem with concepts until someone insists that they are reality. That is when "proof" knocks on your door. The person making the positive claim needs to provide proof.

          There are hundreds of claims posted on the net each day. I don't see you or anybody else accepting them as fact without proof. What makes your claims so special so as to be exempt from proof?

          Also, if you claim a concept "exists", it only exists in minds. If you disagree, then for the purposes of science you must propose an unambiguous definition for "exist".

          1. uszealot profile image61
            uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            There is a difference in "accepting" and "not dismissing as impossible".

            1. fatfist profile image86
              fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Are you serious? So you are ACCEPTING all the hundreds of claims everybody and their brother proposes on a daily basis? Both you and I know that you don't do that smile

              A claim, any claim, is not deemed to be possible or impossible. Science doesn't deal in likelihoods. If the claim is "reality", science will study it. Science is the study of existence.

              If you don't like the constraints imposed by science, your other options are:

              1) Using any system of logic, prove that the claim is true in reality. Even if it cannot be scientifically tested, prove that it is logically true.

              2) Use religion/faith-based arguments to demonstrate your claim in the context of a specific religion. In this context, your claim is ALWAYS true!

        3. Mark Knowles profile image61
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          So I should not apply common sense then?

          Because I cannot "see" gravity - I should not dismiss the relgious garbage spouted by Christians as "ridiculous."

          I should not dismiss the ridiculous notion that we are "born in sin" and god died to save us from our sins as being utter garbage.

          They could be right when they say that the invisible god is offended by homosexuals.

          Interesting. And this is being "open minded,"? wink

          I should not look at the evidence for evolution as being in any way indicative that the Genesis creation account is not to be taken literally.

          Sorry - I need to apply some common sense to what I am prepared to accept as reasonable and just because I cannot see it does not mean it exists.

          Plus - of course - your religion is ridiculous. Sorry. sad

          At best, I could become an agnostic - but it is much more entertaining to take a solid viewpoint that god does not exist - if only to listen to the ridiculous argument that because I cannot know everything - I should not dismiss it.

          But we can dismiss all the other gods, the Flying Spaghetti Monster and unicorns and the Tooth Fairy etc - because they are just silly. wink

          1. Misha profile image75
            Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You forgot Santa, Mark! yikes How dare you lol

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              thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Another case of Santa Syndrome lol

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      cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      not at all. in fact, scientific people acknowledge that the entire body of work that Man has done is just the tip of the iceberg to what lies yet undiscovered. there are many scientists who believe in God, past and present.

    3. tantrum profile image61
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Who is 'we' ?
      who are you ?

    4. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
      AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The existence of a spirit world is unprovable and so cannot be categorically denied, that is right.

      The Genesis account of Creation is just dumb, thus the reason for not believing it.

      Miracles are probably performed at certain times by certain people: I don't see why not, so I agree there.

      God, too, could exist, it can't be proved otherwise, but the God of the Bible is a weird cookie, so let us hope he doesn't at least (I mean, maybe a slightly different version might be ok -- and you probably couldn't disprove the existence of a God like that, but lay off on some of the weirder stuff: things have got to square with common sense, and logic, at least to some degree; isn't that the criteria we use as human beings "made in God's image" to decide what to discuss, and what to forget: we're not just monkeys after all wink )

    5. DogSiDaed profile image61
      DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      This argument is so idiotic I took about 10 minutes deciding whether to respond. Now I am, it seems so glaringly obvious what the mistake is to everyone, I'm not even going to make an effort.

      1. tantrum profile image61
        tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol  lol

        Going to Hell with us ? big_smile

    6. 0
      thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Great topic. Don't worry about mark if you want him to go away ask him to prove molecule to man evolution without voodoo. He'll flee then. big_smile

      1. Mark Knowles profile image61
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        No - he won't. Sorry you cannot understand that even if evolution was a lie - your beliefs are still nonsense. Sorry.

        You must be very angry. I don't blame you. sad

        I would be too.

        1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
          AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Right. Imagine... a religion that says -

          If you believe explanation x about molecular biology you cannot enter the presence of God!

        2. 0
          thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Ha lol Do it again ACT sympathetic! It’s funny and revealing. Just remember you don't need to prove your myth.  Just keep screaming it's true, bring back evol guy. 0+0=? lol

        3. uszealot profile image61
          uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Actually, Dr. Gerald Schroeder (two doctorates from MIT)has shown that The science of the big bang and Darwinism are completely compatible with Genesis. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid … 891971315#

          1. Mark Knowles profile image61
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            LOLOLO

            So - are you open to the idea that you are delusional?

          2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Again I say, Genesis, Smenesis. If you are a Christian aren't you supposed to be focused on Christ -- the bits about him are written hundreds of years after Genesis was put to paper, and appear hundreds of pages after Genesis in the Bible. It seems to me that some of you guys are Genesistians not Christians -- who cares about Genesis; heck, who cares about Evolution -- I thought your purpose here on earth was to be an embodied witness of Christ's transforming power through the good works that are the fruit of your faith: not armchair biologists -- you're in the wrong job

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              thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              See that’s blind faith, you must be an evolutionist. God told you to test all things and hold on to truth, He tells us not to believe every sprit and to be weary of so called science. We know Moses existed for a fact and he was descended from Adam. Jesus often quoted from Genesis so we know it's a fact. You can have blind faith, but that's not Christianity.

              1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Look, I may no longer be a church-attending Christian, but now you are insulting all those good, card-carrying evangelical friends I used to have -- why should I believe you over them!!!

                I'm not an evolutionist because I am not a professional biologist. I suspect evolution is right, but, frankly, I don't really care that much. I also couldn't care less about Moses (despite the great beard). Why should I?
                Tell me my friends don't believe in "real" Christianity again and I'll poke you in the eye (though I suspect I'll need a long finger -- I am very far away...)

                1. 0
                  thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Okay?

                  1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                    AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Yes I'm fine, thanks for asking

            2. uszealot profile image61
              uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this
              1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I will assume this is what you are trying to say.

                Please answer my question.

                Are open to the possibility that you are wrong and are under a delusion?

                Nice though. Very condescending. You are a christian - right?

                Also - are you open to the possibility that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the One True God?

                1. DogSiDaed profile image61
                  DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  The Flying Spaghetti Monster IS the True God. It said so on an old manuscript I found and have taken as literal truth smile

                  1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                    Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    It is impossible to deny unless you know everything. wink

              2. uszealot profile image61
                uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this
          3. fatfist profile image86
            fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Really? Then please explain how nothing (no space, no matter, no energy, no void, no god) can surreptitiously create 3-D objects like stars and planets. The doctor is pushing yet another blood line to Yahweh & Allah.

            1. 0
              thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              The Law of Cause and Effect, God being the uncaused cause.

              1. fatfist profile image86
                fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Every effect has a cause, and a cause is an effect from another cause.
                You said that god is not an effect and does not have a cause.
                This means that god cannot partake in any cause & effect in reality because god self-refutes the laws of causality.
                Therefore god is only a concept!

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                  thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Nope it means we wouldn't be here if there was a infinite regression meaning God must be personal and purposeful, and eternal.

                  1. DogSiDaed profile image61
                    DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Let me try and explain (as well as I can) in terms of dimension. by definition we see a change as occuring over time, although, in a one dimensional universe everything is at one infinitely small point and hence theoretically 'nothing' without latter dimensions. These dimensions could have come into being regardless of time (or outside it's constraints, but then, there was no outside, but infentissimal inside XD), as time is one of them, so time could in theory have started without having existed. This then begs the question as to whether time does exist, which is something now being challenged by some.(but I do not know enough to fill you in exactly, and at the moment that area is almost entirely speculative, aside from proving quantum equations without means of time)

                    The reason this is a hard concept to grasp is out understanding of the world relies so much upon progression in 'time' that it is nigh on impossible to discount it from the equation at any stage. Still, while these theories are tough to prove, more evidence is always going to come along, while humans live to persevere and explore smile

                  2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                    AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    How do you know it wasn't a passing Martian who caused it (or, in this case, him)?

                  3. fatfist profile image86
                    fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Is that what the church taught you? smile

                    Here's a tip for you: In the system of classical logic, anything resolving to infinite regress is actually a logical INDUCTIVE PROOF for an eternal context.
                    You have just PROVEN via induction that the universe is eternal.

                    Good job smile

                    I know, I know, you didn't see this one coming. I've nailed William Lane Craig on this one before. It's one of his favorite BS arguments!

            2. earnestshub profile image87
              earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Schroeder is a religionist, what else would you expect?

      2. DogSiDaed profile image61
        DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        If he flees, it will only be to escape your lack of knowledge and refusal to understand his logic, which seems to me to be undeniable.

        Keep it up Mark!

        1. 0
          thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          If you say so. Do you want to learn about evolution I'd be glad to give you a lesson.

          1. DogSiDaed profile image61
            DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You can try. Although I might be able to pick you up, you see I am actually fairly clued up, and have a fairly wide Biological knowledge. Give me what you got smile

            Oh but keep it short, because I'll be honest, my attention span can fade if something is uninteresting smile Then again, make it interesing and you shall obtain my undivided attention.

    7. thisisoli profile image64
      thisisoliposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I think tis is a very strange view to take, you are suggesting that lack of knowledge is proof of God?

      Most scientists are more than aware of what they don't know, from Gravity to anti matter.  Scientists are not particularly against religion, though mostly they are against the specific existance of God.

      Please remember that most people disbelieve in God because it is similair to Father Christmas or the Easter Bunny, not because of any actual scientific basis.

      As with Santa Claus etc, unbelievers have no real concern about other peoples belief, that is generally something that happens between other religions. I mayself have no belief in God because I view relegion as just another fairy story.  It has it's uses, just as Santa Claus does, but it's something that should be grown out of, and definately be the cause of the misery in the world today.

    8. pylos26 profile image78
      pylos26posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      They usually know a gullible fool when they meet one.

    9. Ron Montgomery profile image60
      Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Sarah Palin

      1. earnestshub profile image87
        earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        The thing about your stock answer Ron, is that it is indubitably correct! lol

        1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
          Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          It helps with my carpal tunnel.  Now if I could only condense the other activity that aggravates it.........

          1. earnestshub profile image87
            earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            lol lol

    10. Don W profile image83
      Don Wposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Just different approaches to knowledge. Many non theists are evidentialists, meaning that something is only accepted (tentatively) as  true based on the evidence that supports it. And only objective (not subjective) evidence will do. The issue is that theism, by its very nature, lacks such evidence. If someone's approach to knowledge is evidentialist then it is very unlikely theistic belief could be something they can accept as true.

      In terms of accepting the possibility, for some non theists I don't think it's about thinking he/she knows everything there is to know. I think it's about believing that unless there is evidence either way anything we say is merely speculation, and is therefore irrelevant to the business of getting on with life and dealing with the things we are (reasonably) sure of.

      Don't fall into the trap of making generalisations about non theists as if there is only one kind. That's as untrue as the belief that all theists are the same. There are bigoted non theists just as there are bigoted theists. There are sensible non theists as well as sensible theists. For the most part it's the difference in approach to accumulating knowledge that separates the two. That's a disagreement between two philosophical positions, but it's fundamental to the way some people live their lives.

    11. Pr0metheus profile image60
      Pr0metheusposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No, they're implying that there is no evidence or proof that a "spirit world" exists. 

      The lack of logical abilities in religious people on these threads never ceases to amaze me.....

      1. Cagsil profile image82
        Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol lol lol

      2. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Having spent most of my life dealing with spirits one side of the fence or the other, I can tell you categorically that the spirit world exists and is in fact much more 'real' than this mirage we live in.

        1. Cagsil profile image82
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Just curious......are you taking any meds? Because what you are shoveling is just sad.

          lol lol lol

          1. 0
            Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            starting trouble again?

            1. Cagsil profile image82
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I'm just asking a question. That's all.

              1. 0
                Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Hmm, the way you ask, perhaps?

        2. Pr0metheus profile image60
          Pr0metheusposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Honestly, I agree with you there.  You need to use some tact when conversing with people who are not apt to believe in it.  "Proof (for me)" WILL NOT WORK.

    12. 60
      (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, and in fact believers imply they know absolutely all there is to know based on their scriptures. Their first failure is their mistake to assume their scriptures are correct when compared with other sriptures.

      Of course, we haven't learned all there is to learn, that will take time. But, it would be folly on our part to make assertions for the supernatural simply because we don't have the answers readily available.



      The rational or open mind will entertain any and all possibilities. Accepting those possibilities is another story altogether. An open mind will not accept the supernatural. Big difference.



      The mind of child believes that which cannot be perceived are real. An adult grows out of those childish beliefs.

      One would not be telling the truth if they claimed to "know" god.

    13. Friendlyword profile image60
      Friendlywordposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Amen Brother! People need to say "I don't know" a lot more than preach to you on one side or the other of the argument. Any sane person has to say I DONT KNOW FOR SURE.

  2. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    God spelled backwards is...

    1. tantrum profile image61
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Who is the Dog ?

      1. myownworld profile image80
        myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        you two are going straight to hell!!!

        ((make sure u wait for me before the fun starts!))

        1. Misha profile image75
          Mishaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hey girls, wait for me please! wink

          1. tantrum profile image61
            tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Tickets for you too ! tongue

        2. tantrum profile image61
          tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Don't worry MOW, I bought tickets for you ! lol

    2. aka-dj profile image80
      aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      That just about sums up the intelligence that is shown here by the self same unbelievers.
      This sort of thing belongs to 8 yr old kids. sad

      1. myownworld profile image80
        myownworldposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        are 8 year olds allowed in hell?

    3. cheaptrick profile image64
      cheaptrickposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      As a dyslexic atheist I agree There Is No Dog!
      I tried to commit suicide once but I kept jumping Behind the train!

  3. Len Cannon profile image89
    Len Cannonposted 7 years ago

    Are you arguing that agnosticism is the only valid theological viewpoint since no one can know everything?  Is that your pro-religion argument?

    1. uszealot profile image61
      uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Good point, but no I am not arguing that. An agnstic says "there may or may not be a God. I don't know." Therefore he is not dismissing the existence of God as impossible. He has an open mind.

      Believing in God used to require a great leap of faith for me. I did not "believe everything I was told" as an earlier post suggested. But as I've gotten a little older, and hopefully a little wiser, I've come to understand that the most real things of all are things which cannot be perceived with the physical senses. Now God's existence is not a matter of faith, it's a matter of knowing.

      1. Mark Knowles profile image61
        Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        So - are you open to the suggestion that perhaps you are mistaken and under a delusion of some kind?

        1. uszealot profile image61
          uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Are you?

          1. Mark Knowles profile image61
            Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Will you answer the question please?

          2. marinealways24 profile image61
            marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            How do you get shut down with your faithful belief on the second page of the thread? You can't answer a simple question? Who is the limited mind? You fear to think or answer a question in fear of your belief. Don't use logic, God might get angry with you.

            1. uszealot profile image61
              uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              HA! I didn't get shut down, friend... just had to go have a life for a while. To answer the question... I'm open to any suggestion...make your case.

              As I read many of these posts, it strikes me as ironic that so many people can demonstate such rank hostility towards something they believe "does not exist". Personally, I don't believe atheism exists. I have no hostility toward atheism, because it is only a word... nothing more. I can't see atheism. Nor can I smell it, hear it, taste it, or feel it. Therefore, it does not exist.

              1. marinealways24 profile image61
                marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                You refuse to accept the thought that there could be no God because it challenges your faith and belief. This is not a logical belief when you are scared to think about something.

              2. Mark Knowles profile image61
                Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                LOLOLOL

                Just another religionist. Sorry Marine. He is closed to anything other than he has the answer. And they wonder why they are despised? LOL

                It is because they are incapable of thought, and wish to inflict that on all others. Fortunately - they are poorly educated, incapable of argument and will be gone soon.

                Not soon enough but still....

                Oddly Ironic that they are unable to understand the hostility they create when they claim to have the easy answer, and refuse to engage in conversation. And the obvious lies in starting threads like this with a thinly disguised agenda. And it is apparent that their ridiculous, pathetic god does not actually exist.

                He is just here for a fight - the same as all the pother religionists.

                1. uszealot profile image61
                  uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Wow! That's civil... Anyway... Answer this question. How is it ridiculous and pathetic to believe in a creator, but perfectly logical to believe that the whole universe spontaneously come into existence from absolute nothingness?

                  1. uszealot profile image61
                    uszealotposted 7 years ago in reply to this
                  2. Mark Knowles profile image61
                    Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Sorry that other people do not believe the same rubbish you KNOW to be true. sad

                    You must be very angry to need to lie about it. wink

                    Civil? Oh - you mean like avoiding any and all questions to push what you KNOW?

                  3. fatfist profile image86
                    fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    That's because there was no nothingness and no creator. Just show one of something that is created - just ONE.
                    The universe is eternal as PROVEN with the help of your friends: thetruthhurts2009 and William Lane Craig. See page 5 of this thread. You people are so out to lunch that you don't even realize that the cause/effect argument is for an eternal universe. Priceless!

                  4. marinealways24 profile image61
                    marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    You claim to have a logical mind when you have a belief that contradicts logic? lol

                2. aka-dj profile image80
                  aka-djposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  As I recall, YOU were the one who "threw the first punch".
                  I, for one did NOT come for a fight, but to share, which you DESPISE.

                  1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                    Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Cannot keep it to yourself huh?. You have to share. lol

                    Not such a "personal relationship" then I guess.

        2. 0
          cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          yikes big_smile

          there's things in the Bible that you know, through science, are simply not possible:

          the virgin birth

          a race of giants (including the giant David slew), some who had sex with women

          global catastrophic flooding

          a human (Sarah) being turned into a pillar of salt)

          rivers turning to blood

          spontaneous healing of afflictions such as blindness and leprosy

          there's tons more...

          1. tantrum profile image61
            tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Rising from the dead

            1. 0
              cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              oh i forgot that one. hmm i wonder how they can explain that one wink

          2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            It's funny -- in my own dalliance with evangelicalism I can remember being told distinctly that all that mattered was my position on, and relationship with, Jesus Christ; the rest really didn't matter, because Jesus ushered in a New Age, anyway, and was the fulfillment of the all Scriptures that came before Him (and so on).
            So, which is it? Maybe these people here are idolaters: putting a false god before the real one; that false god being the Bible.
            So there

          3. DogSiDaed profile image61
            DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I'm sure the giant race would be exploited for porn should it still exist today...

            I didn't know about the woman being turned into salt, but the rest I recognise, and they all seem pretty stupid. Unless God was an ace chemist who converted someone into salt, which could be possible to an extent? My chemistry is not as in tune as my Biology XD

            On that note, I found an interesting theory for the river turning to blood, red algal bloom containing neurotoxins. I don't know the details, so I won't pretend to know more than I do, but it's certainly plausible, especially with organic runoff from the Egyptians farming methods etc.

          4. 0
            thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Really? There was no global flood?, you need a science lesson too, and a history lesson, All ancient cultures have a flood legend which you can conclude arose from an actual event. If all the layers we see are billions of years old why are there no erosion marks? Giant my dear existed look into Smithsoniangate who deliberately kept the discovery of giants bones for out of the museum to further the evolutionary  lie. The rest are miracles, and only to you do they seem impossible, but how else do you explain away the proof(in the bible and out) of the resurrection?

            1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              How does the fact that there was a global flood (let's say there was, for the sake of argument) tell you anything about whether or not people should consider the notion that Jesus is an entity/spirit (or some other, better word) that exists right now, and can be experienced. I mean, isn't that what Christians are most concerned about. Who cares if there were giants. What has it got to do with the price of fish!!! (Oh, I guess a giant flood might affect the price of fish, that's true)

            2. DogSiDaed profile image61
              DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              CONGRATULATIONS! YOUR ARGUMENT IS USELESS!

              Ok so maybe there has been catastrophic flooding... Let's say that for the sake of argument there was a global flood to the extent of the bible (which there wasn't).

              Ok now we are on our knees, one point may be about to slip away... But wait! Let's think, Noah put two of every animal on a boat?! Well the boat would have to be the size of a medium sized country at least, not possible to make back then. Then how would the animals gain sustenance and not kill each other? Oh and if that's true, how can there be creatures that only live a day or two? Surely they would be extinct? Oh and how did the water become so high it covered ALL land by a distance? Because you know there isn't enough water on earth for that tongue

              1. 0
                thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I put this together for people just like you, enjoy.

                http://hubpages.com/hub/Noahs-Ark-Missi … complished

              2. 0
                cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                "Smithsoniangate"?  yikes big_smile

                1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                  AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  hehehe -- isn't that guy from the British version of The Office in the movie of that?

                  1. 0
                    cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    those are the same people who believe that man kept dinosaurs as pets and the grand canyon was formed in a matter of weeks when the flood waters receded. oy.


                    and now, Robin Williams' Immaculate Conception

          5. aguasilver profile image85
            aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            How do you know that through science?

            The fact that science is limited to natural laws makes no difference to God who is NOT subject to natural laws.

            The problem (which will never go away) is that science keeps changing its parameters as new science discovers new things that disprove what they were certain about yesterday....

            If you cannot believe in miracles, so be it, you cannot experience any in all probability, and you limit yourself to earth bound natural laws.

            But it does not have to be that way, and most disciples of Christ will have experienced Christ still healing the sick, and setting the captives free.

            The bible lives for believers, it does not for non believers.

            Neither 'side' can prove they are right, so why argue?

            Why is Christ such a threat to non believers? - why don't non believers simply ignore we believers and get on with their lives?

            1. Mark Knowles profile image61
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Not going to happen Daddy.

              Keep your ridiculous beliefs in your head where they belong and we are good to go. wink

              1. aguasilver profile image85
                aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                It's just not worth answering you.

                1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  You asked - I answered. Sorry you do not like the answer. sad

                  Stop spreading the Word and I will stop telling you how ridiculous it is.

                  Understand?

                  1. aguasilver profile image85
                    aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Actually I'll do as I please, you can be as stupid as you like, it matters not, so I guess we will continue treading on each others toes for a while longer.

      2. Len Cannon profile image89
        Len Cannonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        I guess don't follow then, unless, perhaps, an open mind is possible.  Atheism isn't about believing you know everything.  Nor is it about having a shut mind.  It is about a simple lack of belief.

        There's nothing inherently "closed minded" about atheism, at least no more than being a baseline Christian.  Both have the same evidence and have come to different conclusions. I have not met a single non-believer who would dismiss God if given scientific proof of it.

        Most atheists are firm believers in science. Any scientist will tell you that one of the main tenants of the profession is an understanding that we know less about the universe than we think we do.  That does not mean believing in everything, but it is certainly far from "close minded."

        As someone who values, studies, and participated in science I don't think I've ever met a single non believer who would refute God given the proper evidence.  Some, I think, would probably feel relieved.  You can't reasonably expect people with different value structures to suddenly place an emphasis on "faith" and gut instinct, and it certainly isn't a reflection on anyone's belief that they "know everything."

        1. Don W profile image83
          Don Wposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          That's not strictly true. Atheism is more intricate than that. It falls into two categories, implicit and explicit atheism.

          Implicit atheism can be characterised as a lack of theistic belief. Explicit atheism is sub-categorised into weak and strong atheism. The former is refraining from theistic belief, but not denying the possibility of deities. The latter is holding the belief that deities do not exist. Technically this would be better described as anti-theism, but it's commonly called atheism also.

  4. myownworld profile image80
    myownworldposted 7 years ago

    (((leaning back...sipping drinks....with Denno, T & Misha in HELL...watching this thread...while 8 year olds play nearby....such joy!)))

    1. tantrum profile image61
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      big_smile
      ((((yeah !)))))

  5. DogSiDaed profile image61
    DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago

    Ooo just had a thought, would a virgin birth not be possible nowadays? Strange to think eh?

    1. glendoncaba profile image81
      glendoncabaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      parthenogenesis has been observed in nature.

      http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v4 … 1021a.html

  6. 0
    ralwusposted 7 years ago

    I know everything, I just can't figure it out yet. It's right there in front of us all, within us all. Wish I was a physic exert. I make a mathematical formula for ya. All is matter, plus or minus 2 tants and divided by three Knowles times the 10th power of gentry.

  7. 0
    B.C. BOUTIQUEposted 7 years ago

    No living human could possibly know everything about everything..it is impossible.
    We all learn something new every day about something.

    I want to meet this person who knows every bit of information about every single subject there could possibly be..when you find them I will be glad to give them my address, but if they know everything, they already know who I am and how to find me and where I will be at the moment they are found...


    LMAO!!!!

    1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
      AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Why do unbelievers need to know everything? I thought they only needed to "know" Christ (I mean, of course, from the Christian perspective). Why does it matter what else they do or do not "know."

      1. 0
        B.C. BOUTIQUEposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        It does not matter because no human could ever "know" everything..

        I believe in God and Mother Earth working as one....only a spiritual being could possibly "know" everything..

        1. DogSiDaed profile image61
          DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Well yeah, but that doesn't mean there is one.

        2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
          AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          It also does not matter because a God that condemned people for what they believed about rocks and monkeys would be a bit of a loon

          1. 0
            B.C. BOUTIQUEposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I fully agree with that..you are perfectly correct about your statement of comdemnation - that god would be a loon.

            1. DogSiDaed profile image61
              DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Is something missing...? XD

  8. DogSiDaed profile image61
    DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago

    Also thought you guys should see this shirt I bought to celebrate this discussion XD

    http://www.zazzle.com/carbo_diem_fsm_ts … 4175885438

  9. DogSiDaed profile image61
    DogSiDaedposted 7 years ago

    This thread just ain't as good without Mark showing people up, I'm outta here tongue (For the time being)

  10. 0
    cosetteposted 7 years ago

    yikes

  11. 0
    cosetteposted 7 years ago

    animals kill to survive.

    i have seen plenty of people raised in secular homes who are very moral, and people raised in religious homes who are very immoral. the ability to distinguish right from wrong comes from your conscience, not from a holy book. even a two-year-old knows it's wrong to hit another little kid or take their toy away without asking.

    1. 0
      thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Where does conscience come from? Morals don't come from a book(whoever said that?) it comes from God.

  12. 0
    cosetteposted 7 years ago

    smile

    i'm going to have some soup, play with my bunny then write another hub. good luck out there! wink

  13. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    Bunny soup? How ghastly! big_smile

    1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
      AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      There was a movie about that too: Glenn Close -- also ghastly (Glenn Close I mean, not the movie)

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Oh good, I was hoping you weren't going to say that Glenn Close was in Brown Bunny. That would pretty much end it for me. lol

  14. AEvans profile image70
    AEvansposted 7 years ago

    Honestly I do not believe that either side knows
    everything and if they believe they do then they are politically incorrect. There is not a single person that walks this earth that knows it all. smile

    1. 0
      thetruthhurts2009posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes Maam! Thank you.

  15. 0
    Crazdwriterposted 7 years ago

    Nope afraid not...no body knows everything. We have to learn as we go and make our own choices of what we believe or don't believe. It isn't up to ANYONE to force what they believe on others. We make mistakes and we learn from them as well, our knowledge about life growing.

  16. ronjer1 profile image61
    ronjer1posted 7 years ago

    come on buddy, nobody knows everything.
    but you try to imply nonbelievers say they do. They don't. And believers don't either...

    But nonbelievers know one thing. that 'idea' you call God, is only an idea in your head, and not in reality.
    you don't have to be omniscient to know that one simple thing.

    1. AEvans profile image70
      AEvansposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You are naughty , it isn't an idea and I am certainly a realist, however you believe in what you believe and I believe in mine so we should not be mudslinging again because there will not be any end. smile

      1. ronjer1 profile image61
        ronjer1posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        sure it's an idea. monsters, fairies, santa, godzilla, etc. are ideas just like god.
        if you don't want it to be idea, then show it in reality. This is not an issue of what you or I believe...

  17. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    No, but the OP thinks he does! lol

  18. Bovine Currency profile image59
    Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

    MOOOooooOOOo.

  19. quietnessandtrust profile image60
    quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago

    The Light shines in the darkness
    and the darkness cannot comprehend it.

    1. marinealways24 profile image61
      marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Do you think your dark bold quotes and close up picture make you look more like the prophet you think you are?

      1. quietnessandtrust profile image60
        quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Neither.

        1. marinealways24 profile image61
          marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Do you think your truth is the absolute truth?

          1. quietnessandtrust profile image60
            quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Because I am a liar by nature...I do not accept the term "your truth"

            I have none.

            1. marinealways24 profile image61
              marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              You said you believed the bible before, now you say you have no truth. Did it change?

              1. quietnessandtrust profile image60
                quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I do not know your truth Derek...

                you asked me "Do you think your truth is the absolute truth?"

                and so I gave you an answer...."your truth" does not exist in my vocabulary.

                1. Cagsil profile image82
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Nice play on words. lol lol

            2. Cagsil profile image82
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              You are a liar by nature. Hmmm....that defies your nature. So, you are here to play games, more than anything else.

              Why am I not surprised.

    2. aware profile image70
      awareposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      i can pop that zit on your nose if you like. lol jk i had to you set me up so well

  20. aware profile image70
    awareposted 7 years ago

    noone knows everything .its imposable.but a everything bagel with cream cheese that everything i know to be delicious

    1. wyanjen profile image87
      wyanjenposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Ben and Jerry's has a flavor called Everything But The...
      I know that everything is also delicious.

  21. 0
    Denno66posted 7 years ago

    I like bagels.

    1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
      Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Oh Yeah?  Well I don't!! mad

    2. WriteAngled profile image91
      WriteAngledposted 7 years ago

      I don't know everything. But then, I'm not an unbeliever. However, I don't believe in Jehovah of the Old and New Testaments.

    3. aware profile image70
      awareposted 7 years ago

      ron you dont like bagels? really?

    4. tantrum profile image61
      tantrumposted 7 years ago

      Do unbelievers know everything?


      Of course !

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        No tantrum we believers only know what God has told us in his word, only God knows EVERYTHING. wink

        1. tantrum profile image61
          tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Well that's why we know everything and you don't know anything !
          You only know what God told you .
          We know the rest!
          lol

    5. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago

      I do not understand how anyone who reads the bible could believe the entities spoken of are gods? One helpful hippie maybe but the rest of it is all about how this benevolent god is gonna rip you a new A hole!

    6. 0
      Denno66posted 7 years ago

      Insanity is so fun, though.

      1. marinealways24 profile image61
        marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Yes, it is pretty amusing when accepted!

    7. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      i know everything.

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Thank God for that... who's Professor Bogle then?

    8. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      Guess the churches are going broke?

      1. tantrum profile image61
        tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        lol Sure are !

      2. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Chance would be a fine thing.... don't think for one minute I exclude false churches that fleece the people from my statement, getting rich means you make someone else poorer, unless you are the government in which case you let the Fed print a few more billion and make EVERYONE else poorer except the bankers... (rhyming slang)

        1. Bovine Currency profile image59
          Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          You amuse me to no end

    9. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      every dog has his day huh

      even the rich dog gets a bite on the ass tongue

      1. tantrum profile image61
        tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        By whom ?

    10. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      "Spinoza’s deliberate use of a traditional theological vocabulary for the transmission of a new set of concepts and his substitution of the signification of this traditional vocabulary by these new concepts, can be judged, according to Walther, a cause of the semantic revolution that took place in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries and finally would effectuate the destruction of the metaphysics underlying this theological vocabulary and in the case of Spinoza of all metaphysics."

      Source:http://autodidactproject.org/blog/culture/index.php/2008/08/spinozas-semantics/

      I doubt that will make sense to you aquasilver and I doubt my attempt to simplify reality for you as follows will make sense either, to paraphrase the above;

      Spinoza is not a believer, never was.  Try think of it this way, (to use a concept of your creation, try opening your spiritual eyes) Spinoza, in a vain attempt to reason with the unreasonable, accepted the fact his audience was of closed mind.  Not only a philosopher but a poet but much misunderstood, his faith in the faithful, similarly misinformed.

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Has it ever occurred to you that believers are 'of closed mind' because they are 100% certain that God exists and that those who do not believe are seriously disadvantaged.

        They are certain of Gods existence because they meet with Him and as stated, He guides and guards their lives... now it's obvious that you cannot understand that and that it means nothing to you, as your quote on Spinoza means little to me.

        Spinoza was entitled to his opinion, you are to yours, believers are to theirs.

        What's the problem, I'm not trying to convert you to anything, you can believe or not believe, but I will not sit here and see people attack my Lord and just let them spread lies and propaganda as they see fit.

        1. fatfist profile image86
          fatfistposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Your lord is a big enough boy to stand up for himself in front of anyone. "He" doesn't need you to stick up for him - unless he's just an imaginary being in your mind.

          There is one thing that is certain though. He is TERRIFIED of me!

          1. aguasilver profile image85
            aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You are a fool and not even a funny fool...

        2. Bovine Currency profile image59
          Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

               As above.  Bovine Currency.

    11. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago

      Goodnight aquasilver, sleep well. smile

    12. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      good idea tongue

      Sleep well.

    13. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      aguasilver wrote:


      Tantrum, I won't 'look' anything, if I have been wrong these last 16 years and the personality I meet with daily, who guides my life and protects my family, is actually non existent... well then I would just be as dead as you will be.

      It surprises me that people think (or don't think) that such complex things as we humans just happened along, that there is nothing else superior to us in the whole universe, that our lives are inconsequential and that when we die that's it.... strange for such intelligent folk.



      Such complex things....

      is not your god theory rather more complex than humans, a creator with no creator...

      just, happened along?

      Logic is more superior.

      1. tantrum profile image61
        tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this
        1. aguasilver profile image85
          aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Too late, whatever.... (standard good night reply)

          As we are made in His image I would imagine that God has both sexes present in His personality, but as there is no sex in Heaven, as we know it, sexuality will be a moot point.

          1. aguasilver profile image85
            aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Good night!

            1. Bovine Currency profile image59
              Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Smart choice.  I wouldn't argue with me either.

    14. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago

      aquasilver, I think you are relying on your belief, and the results of that belief are positive in your view so you defend them. I think that if you believe the tooth fairy is behind it all you would get the same good result. smile

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Ernest, believe me if the tooth fairy spoke to me, guided me, protected me and sent me daily provision I'd listen to him, but the only person I know who believes in the tooth fairy is you! big_smile

    15. quietnessandtrust profile image60
      quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago

      I am the author of no truth...so I cannot say "my truth"

      1. marinealways24 profile image61
        marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        So, you do or don't believe the bible as truth? "Drumroll"

        1. Cagsil profile image82
          Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hmmm... no answer? lol

          1. marinealways24 profile image61
            marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            And I even added a drumroll for him.

        2. quietnessandtrust profile image60
          quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I believe the truth when I find it...wherever I find it...same as anyone who looks for the truth...cymbal crash!!!

          The truth comes from no man...men are liars.

          1. marinealways24 profile image61
            marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            And men wrote the bible. When did you change your mind that the bible was divine truth?

            1. quietnessandtrust profile image60
              quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Men write plenty of things...if it is truth...it still did not originate with them...truth originates with no man...divine truth is just that...divine, unadulterated, pure truth...not concocted by men.

              1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Nice take.

    16. mobilephone guide profile image59
      mobilephone guideposted 7 years ago

      Science works in this way, religion too. Logical fallacy of affirming the consequence:
      Theory P predicts that we will observe Q.
      Experimental observation shows Q.
      Therefore theory P is true.

      Just because a theory works, it doesn't mean it is ever certain. It can only be accurate only on a number of decimal places. Surprise! No one knows everything.

      However being an unbeliever (of anything, question everything) lets you be free of hindrances like fundamentalism. It lets you think more. If new evidences are presented then you should/could re-evaluate your beliefs.

      Have an open-mind and humility, these traits lack, although not all, in both atheists and religionists. Both asserts belief in no-god and "there is god" and sticks with it and does not bother to look even more. An atheist haven't experienced god and does not bother to look. A religious person with full faith in whatever scriptures also does not bother to look.

      /end blabber

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Main Entry: fun·da·men·tal·ism
        Pronunciation: \-tə-ˌli-zəm\
        Function: noun
        Date: 1922
        1 a often capitalized : a movement in 20th century Protestantism emphasizing the literally interpreted Bible as fundamental to Christian life and teaching b : the beliefs of this movement c : adherence to such beliefs
        2 : a movement or attitude stressing strict and literal adherence to a set of basic principles <Islamic fundamentalism> <political fundamentalism>
        — fun·da·men·tal·ist  \-tə-list\ noun
        — fundamentalist or fun·da·men·tal·is·tic   \-ˌmen-tə-ˈlis-tik\ adjective

        "interpreted Bible as fundamental to Christian life"....YES

        "a movement or attitude stressing strict and literal adherence to a set of basic principles"

        Hmmm... now the second definition seems to fit just as well to non believers as they explain all the various rules of non belief we believers need to keep to in order to answer your inane queries...

        Yes I'm a fundamentalist, yes I'm brain washed, because my brain DID need washing from all the accumulated junk and nonsense that 30 years of serious thinking and exploration had filled it up with.

        When you guys make accusations (another of the names of Satan; the accuser) when you do your masters bidding, practise first in front of the mirror... smile

        1. Mark Knowles profile image61
          Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          So -how come lying by omission is OK with Jesus? Your definition says:

          "literally interpreted Bible as fundamental to Christian life"

          yet you then pretend it says:

          "interpreted Bible as fundamental to Christian life"

          which says something completely different by omitting one word.

          You are just persuading us that Christians are liars.  Why do you do that all the time? I am already convinced. Do you like my new forum signature? wink

          I am not anti-Christian.
          I just don't like lies.

          1. tksensei profile image60
            tksenseiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Yeah, right    roll

            1. Mark Knowles profile image61
              Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Sorry I do not like lies.

              You must be very angry.

              1. tksensei profile image60
                tksenseiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                And yet you say you are not anti-Christian? roll

                1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                  Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Sorry you did not understand. sad

                  I can see why you are angry. I would be if I were you.

                  I am not anti-Christian.
                  I just don't like lies.

                  1. tksensei profile image60
                    tksenseiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Oh, I understand alright.

                    1. Mark Knowles profile image61
                      Mark Knowlesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                      If you understood - you would not need to ask so many inane questions. wink

        2. mobilephone guide profile image59
          mobilephone guideposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          first time i've heard that brainwashing is good. well that's fine, if it works for you keep it to yourself.
          accuse? accuse of what? from that statement, i think it is you who's doing the accusing. neutral

    17. earnestshub profile image87
      earnestshubposted 7 years ago

      I disagree. Most non believers here seem to have good bible knowledge. Religionists are only allowed to see what there god tells them to! smile

      1. mobilephone guide profile image59
        mobilephone guideposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        yes, in that way, they are too dependent on god and fundamentalism got into their heads.

        1. aguasilver profile image85
          aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Morning Ernest...."Religionists are only allowed to see what there god tells them to!"

          errrm....

          1. Who does the allowing if our God does not exist?
          2. Why did my God tell me to read the Quran, The God Delusion, and may other 'non Christian' books if He was censoring my reading material and thoughts?

          You've made the statements, now answer my queries, I'm interested to know who (in your atheist world of nothingness) is commanding my thoughts and actions?

    18. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      is it just me or is there a small sect of threaders here causing most of the problems, for religionists and non-religionists alike.  I am getting sick and tired of the fraud.  If you want to take high moral ground, stand your ground.  If you admit fault, do not then expect people to forget if you then go about the same behaviour.  Apologies mean nothing if you don't change and if you act so proud but have no integrity, no tricks will help you save face.

      This is a general message and not directed personally, I know it should be obvious to most people and there are some I have in mind but it is a general worry and not to me, it is getting out of hand.

    19. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      P.S. That was not a surrender note, I am not vacating on the account of a few pests.

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Hi BC.... for the record, am I a pest?

        (Nothing snide or ulterior, I am genuinely interested to know how you perceive me on the forum)

        John

    20. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      if you genuinely are interested in my opinion, you can email me.

    21. 0
      poetlorraineposted 7 years ago

      no unbelievers no nothing.... well you did ask

    22. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      all is as expected... big_smile

    23. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      The loaded question @ Mission: Critical

    24. Sa Toya profile image84
      Sa Toyaposted 7 years ago

      We do not know all we need to know, I'm a believer in God and exercise my faith but I also know and believe I do not know absolutely everything, The Bible does not have everything in it- I always thought of it to be on the 'need to know' basis.

      Many scientists are avid believers in God and I do not believe all of them are out to disprove or prove his existence they just want to know more about our world, our universe ad I'm good with that

    25. Gregg Biancci profile image81
      Gregg Biancciposted 7 years ago

      Anyone that tells you they know everything, religious or otherwise, most likely knows nothing.

      1. aguasilver profile image85
        aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Agreed, only God knows everything, the rest of us see in part, as if through a glass darkly.

    26. 0
      cosetteposted 7 years ago

      if i were God, i would make sure to have my word (the Bible) written in such a way that there would be absolutely no room for doubt or questioning, as i would want to be understood by every man on Earth (and other planets in the billions of galaxies out there). even Harry Potter had books with moving pictures in them, so i would make the bible with moving pictures (and sound, even), so that people would know it was made by a god. it would also glow with a golden light and i would divinely transport one copy on every doorstep in the world, in every language, depending on where i was leaving it. i would also, since i know the past, present and future, mention things that exist now like space shuttles and cell phones, for example...i would explain them in words anyone could understand but also use correct terminology and be very specific. for example: "in the future, Man will build flying ships that will take him to the stars, these ships will be called space shuttles" or, Man will be able to talk to his fellow men anywhere in the world on vessels called cell phones", that sort of thing.

      also, those commandments would include "honor thy children" and "thou shalt protect thy child first and foremost and not harm them". that always killed me that God thought it so important for man to honor his father and his mother but left the kids out of the equation.

      i bet if the bible was like that, more people would believe it.

    27. h.a.borcich profile image60
      h.a.borcichposted 7 years ago

      Hi Cosette,

        Not looking to get into a war or anything by any means.

        You mentioned about the Bible not adressing protecting children. I do know of one verse which I do not recall where, but it says basically it is better to be cast into the sea with brick shoes than to be a stumbling block to a child.
        Not arguing or trying to change anyone's belief, but wanted to share what I remember.

        Personally, I consider that to be a strong indication of God's position on harming a child.
        Have a good one, Holly

      1. Bovine Currency profile image59
        Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Too bad Abraham killed his own son.

        1. 0
          sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          And his daughters raped him while he was drunk. eww.

          1. h.a.borcich profile image60
            h.a.borcichposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              WOW! That was amazing... I simple mentioned a verse I remembered and somehow I am underfire for whatever else.

            1. Cagsil profile image82
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              It's not YOU under-fire. It's the actions stipulated in the bible. What she said...was correct according to the bible.

              His daughters had sex with him when he was drunk. That's all Sandra was pointing out.

              1. h.a.borcich profile image60
                h.a.borcichposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                That is fine and well, but it was not being debated. All I did was respond to something another hubber wrote - and viola - I am faced with that? Seemy point?

                1. Cagsil profile image82
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  I know.....bunches of people STEP on other people's conversations....that's difficult to stop. Sorry. big_smile

                  1. 0
                    Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    It's called freedom of press. big_smile

                    1. Cagsil profile image82
                      Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                      Actually, YOU are WRONG, yet again.

                      It's freedom of speech, NOT press. Freedom of press is for media personnel. big_smile

              2. Bovine Currency profile image59
                Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                big_smilebig_smile

                "Truly you are a God who hides himself, O God and Savior of Israel."

                1. Cagsil profile image82
                  Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  lol lol lol big_smile

          2. aguasilver profile image85
            aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Error again, please get your facts right.

            1. Cagsil profile image82
              Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              It would be nice for YOU to get your facts straight. lol

            2. 0
              sandra rinckposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Oh sorry, he raped his own daughters.  My mistake. eww.

              1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                hey agua, what's this 'error again' anyway?

              2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                I don't get it. Don't Bible-literalists have consciences? Why don't they just do like the rest of us and follow that? Or... believe these things, but not worry about whether the rest of us will or not BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MATTER (though it is fun though, as someone above pointed out smile )

          3. quietnessandtrust profile image60
            quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Wrong, you are thinking about Lot and his daughters.
            They wanted to keep the family going because their mother was dead.

            1. Bovine Currency profile image59
              Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Heaven forbid the blood line stop!? hmm  But the bible says kill homosexuals.  Makes so much sense now!?  Sick.

            2. tantrum profile image61
              tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              So incest is OK ?

              Lot was a great guy !! how smart and lusty !
              lol  lol  lol

        2. aguasilver profile image85
          aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Error, Abraham  did not kill his own son, he killed a ram that God supplied, Abraham  was prepared to sacrifice his son, just as God did later, and it was a pictogram of what God knew would happen, including the sacrificial ram provided (representing Christ).

          At least get it right before you attempt to slander God.

          1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Do you eat pigs? (Just wondering)

          2. marinealways24 profile image61
            marinealways24posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Do you think a creator of all would need you to stick up for him to protect your own faith?

            1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Motion seconded

            2. 0
              poetlorraineposted 7 years ago in reply to this
            3. Bovine Currency profile image59
              Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I didn't slander god.  God doesn't exist.

              1. Cagsil profile image82
                Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Good point. big_smile lol

          3. Cagsil profile image82
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            It would be nice, if YOU yourself knew what you were talking about, and since we know that you don't.....he happens to be correct.

            lol

          4. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Hey man, take it as symbolic; I assure you, you'll get much more mileage around here (and across the whole cross-section of American/North American/Western society) if you do -- as a symbol it is very powerful: as a metaphor, you know. Taken literally it, well, sucks, to be frank... barbaric, in fact (though I guess, perhaps, it is a matter of opinion, I concede)

            1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              (And do you eat pigs: you didn't answer?)

              1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Who is it you are addressing here?

                I eat pigs smile

                And The Books?  I can see the metaphors... no problem there.  I just find it highly amusing when chumps cannot see it that way.

                1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
                  AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Not you. Chumps smile

        3. quietnessandtrust profile image60
          quietnessandtrustposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          No he did not....read the passage.

          1. Friendlyword profile image60
            Friendlywordposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            What difference does that make if he didn't get to actually kill his son?  If God had not given him something else to kill; that schizophrenic would have killed his child. God aint talkin to the likes of me, you, Abraham or anybody else.  When you do start having conversations with God; get yourself some help.

            1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Plus he (likely) didn't exist (Abraham, I mean)...

              1. Friendlyword profile image60
                Friendlywordposted 7 years ago in reply to this
                1. Friendlyword profile image60
                  Friendlywordposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Or course he did. The Bible is also very good history book for those that are able to separate truth from fiction.

                  1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                    Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Deleted

                    1. Bovine Currency profile image59
                      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                      How does one separate the truth from fiction?  The book was written by men, the truth and the fiction are bound.

      2. 0
        cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        hello.

        that would be the Book of Luke, and it was Jesus who was telling people not to cause seekers to stumble. he was talking about those who were just starting out in the faith, and he referred to them as "little ones", which was a metaphor for new followers. the actual verse is as follows:

        He said to the disciples, It is impossible that no stumbling blocks should come, but woe to him through whom they do come! It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were thrown into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones." (Luke 17:1-2)

        i'm not offended by your comment at all. i appreciate your being respectful, and i hope that i am to you in kind. best regards.

        1. h.a.borcich profile image60
          h.a.borcichposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Thank you Cosette for pointing out the specifics smile I only offered what I remebered trying to help. Thank you for realizing my intent. Take care, Holly

          1. 0
            cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            you're welcome. smile

            one thing i have learned about the religion forum - you gots to walk softly and carry a big stick wink

            1. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Wow. I've been snowed in for two days (ok, well I was at a bar till early Sunday morning for part of that time...), and you guys *still* haven't decided if unbelievers know everything or not??? smile

            2. AdsenseStrategies profile image73
              AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Who was that -- Teddy Roosevelt? Didn't he ride into battle on horseback, so maybe not the best authority on tackling artillery... smile

              1. 0
                cosetteposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                oops...i was wrong. he said "SPEAK" softly and carry a big stick, which means try to negotiate peacefully while at the same time brandishing a big stick just in case big_smile

                and those teddy bears look so harmless too yikes

    28. Bovine Currency profile image59
      Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago

      "Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not understand,
      but the passages that bother me are those I do understand."
      — Mark Twain

      http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/BibleQuotes.htm

    29. 0
      poetlorraineposted 7 years ago

      you know what i feel so sorry for so many of you that frequent these religious forums and wish with all my heart that you had better things to do with your time

      so what am i doing here i wonder myself

      1. 0
        Denno66posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Feeling sorry for them? lol

      2. Bovine Currency profile image59
        Bovine Currencyposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Have you reached a conclusion?

    30. 0
      poetlorraineposted 7 years ago

      more than sorry actually sad sad sad creatures

     
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