This question was recently brought to my attention by the current excavations being conducted in Turkey on the location of Noah's Ark, is there any current news on this subject?
I have photos that prove Noah's ark was real and is being covered up by the Turkish government.
Contact me through my profile page and offer a reasonable price for this priceless set of exclusive photos.
Recently "bought to your attention" how exactly?
Recently brought to my attention too, although I didn't have the location. My son told me last night - he must have heard it in school.
And what credence do you give this "recently bought to your attention" bit of information?
We are talking of Evidence of Biblical History in Modern Time, are we not?
My son mentioned to me last night that pieces of Noah's Ark had been found on a mountaintop. That is all he said, we never finished the conversation.
The Dead Sea Scrolls that have been found are all the evidence I need.
No - we are talking about complete and utter nonsense - that is what we are talking about. The very idea makes me laugh out loud at people like you who talk about "Evidence of Biblical History in Modern Time" with Capital Letters.
@ BDazzler - LOL - Cover ups? Evidence? You religionists really are extremely funny, but I really suggest you are using real meanings of words instead of making them up as you go.
I put those words in quotes for a reason, Mark.
Ah - I see - you meant "made up nonsense" instead. I missed that - sorry.
In case you didn't notice, Evidence of Biblical History in Modern Times is capitalized in the subject line.
I am not here to try and convince you or convert you. I am here to state my opinions. I hear your opinion loud and clear, and the only complete and utter nonsense I see is rudeness.
Well - I let it slide as a forum headline. Of course you are not here to convert or convince me, although I don't see anyone being rude.
Do you mean laughing at people who believe that Noah's Ark was a real boat? Is that rude?
but I really suggest you are using real meanings of words instead of making them up as you go
The very idea makes me laugh out loud at people like you
LOL - Cover ups? Evidence?
I see these as rude statements. If they are not intended to be rude, I apologize.
I was making fun of some one else - BDazzler - we have interacted on many occasions and I am sure he was not offended.
But - yes - If you think that Noahs Ark was real - I will laugh in your face. Is that rude of me? How do you deal with delusional people who tell you they have facts pulled out of their behind? Do you laugh at them?
How should I deal with delusional behavior? Lock them up? Shoot them? Is that more polite?
Keen to know...........
Not going to point out how offensive it is when you make assumptive statements that are obviously lies and garbage - and further insult my intelligence by accusing me of being rude when I will not accept them as true.
Nah, but if I get really pissed at you, I will take away all your Single Barrel Jack Daniels and make you drink Evan Williams.
I do not say you are being rude for not accepting my truth. Yes, I feel it is rude to laugh in someone's face. The first 2 examples I gave above were responses to me, not BDazzler.
The only delusional behavior you have to deal with is your own, anything else is a choice.
What statements of mine were assumptive? I would like to know, because I have never been considered to be assumptive.
Marks photos may be nice, but I have pieces of the ark to sell if you wish. They look like bits of wood, but I can assure you, they are from Noah's Ark.
I give away a Free Piece of The Genuine Ark with my photo set.
Yes - and a 20% discount on my upcoming Dinosaur Hunting Trip to China.
Hmmm... Okay, I'll also throw in some photos with me standing next to Noah giving a thumbs up to god for wiping out the earth.
The pieces of the Ark I have are personally signed by Noah.
Flatten out the surface of the earth.
Flood it with all the earth's "fresh" water.
The depth of the water would be less than 2 inches.
How the "frick" did the "ark" get up on Mt Ararat?
An "epiphnay' is called for!
I've been aware of the story of the government "cover up" of Noah's Ark since the 70s, seen books, photos etc. At this point, even if it's "proven" it won't be "proven". By that I mean that at best there could be evidence of a "boat like" structure. Those who believe will say, "See? Proof!" and those who don't will say, "It could be anything!"
It is interesting, but like all "evidence" it is open to interpretation.
I should have considered my wording, sorry, I recently recieved a blog request on this subject and came across Robert Carnuke’s Dec. 2008 video. There have been more recent reports of Biblical history Chuck Holton’s report from last month on Paul’s shipwreck on Malta.
Let me post a completely hypothetical situation to illustrate my point:
Suppose a previously uknown Viking/Rus chief who had converted to Greek Orhtodoxy decided to build a big hall on top of that Mountain in say, the mid 800s.
Suppose he was inspired by the legend/story of Noah, and used his knowledge of naval architcture and the stories from his priest/advisor to build a big house that looked like a boat.
It has features that make it look like a boat, and a zoo.
The glacier and other natural disasters move in, cover the big building up, the chief and his people move on, get wiped out in some forgotten battle and nobody even knows the building is there.
A thousand years later, with legends of Noah's ark mixed with stories of the building people dig up logs and "evidence" without understanding it, because everything about this hypothetical chief has been forgotten.
Because no other evidence of this paritcular hypothetical viking chief exists, the people of modern times never even consider that he built this big building to look like a boat... but there is money to be made by going to churches and speaking to "prove" something. So, that's the story they tell.
The existance/non-existance of Noah is completely irrelavent in this situation.
All the "evidence" shows is a bunch of wood and nobody remembers that viking.
For it's own reasons, the Turkish and Soviet goverments don't want people poking around in rural areas, they could be plotting military action for all they know, so they are accused of "cover ups".
Perfectly reasonable, with everybody putting their own spin on things, many without realizing it.
Hypothesis aside, I hate to use a cliché, proof is in the pudding.
The legend of Noah’s Ark isn’t just resigned to Christianity and the church, the stories of Noah and the great flood are recorded in many legends including The Epic of Gilgamesh, Matsya in the Puranas and Deucalion in Greek Mythology.
It’s just as easy to believe the story of Noah is the original.
I am getting completly off topic here. I was asking about any other news.
Not angry Mark, thank you for your impute.
I haven’t been conned. My beliefs are just those.
Actually I was researching topics for my client such as the one I alluded to in an earlier post for the benefit of my article. Paul’s shipwreck on Malta.
There were some photos released a few years ago saying that they were photos of the Ark. Nothing conclusive at all about them. It seems I recall Ron Wyatt stating that he found Noah's Ark and the photos may have been his to begin with.
As I said, nothing conclusive about them. Photos are easily doctored to look like something they are not.
SirDent, do you remember a documentary in which they found what appeared to be a very large boat under the surface using some technology that had just been developed. I can barely remember it, but wondered where the story went from there?
http://www.stevequayle.com/Giants/Ancie … s.Ark.html
http://www.specialtyinterests.net/the_r … k.html#wfe
so, is this proof? read for yourself.
First I do believe in a historical flood and the existence of Noah. Second, I don't know what the archeological finds mean, and they may, in fact be Noah's Ark.
But, those carvings of Byzantine crosses support my Greek Orthodox Viking Chief theory ... I'm just sayin' ...
Your belief would remain intact despite the fact a vessel of that size couldn't possibly carry the millions of species that exist on the planet, and TWO of each species to boot?
I had a long explanation for you, but I deleted it all, and I'll just simply say "Yes".
You may now begin your ridicule.
I have read many accounts of those who attempt to justify the millions of species allegedly "saved" by Noah. The problem is that when these types of fables were written, they had no clue there millions of species inhabiting the planet and they simply didn't think it through very well.
In general, based on my observations of your comments to others, you and I would be unable to agree on items considered axiomatic, therefore, it is logically impossible for us to come to the same conclusion.
I will simply say that I asked these very questions decades ago, did my own research and have come to my own conclusions. The issue is settled in my mind for reasons I deem reasonable and rational.
If you have come to other conclusions, for your own reasons, so be it. I feel no compelling need to persuade you that my point of view is correct.
I will say, because I am enjoying this discussion, that the evidence presented in previous posts on this thread show pretty clearly that something man-made was there and that some people believed it to be be Noah's ark (thus my joke about the viking chief).
Even though I believe in the ark, I do not believe that the evidence presented is conclusive enough to say that that spot is the resting place of Noah's ark, only that "something" was there at one time, and some people have thought it was the ark.
That would stand to reason for anyone with reason, yes?
I'm sure you did, and I would be grateful as to how your research led you to conclude millions of species around the planet managed to fit on the vessel, along with food and provisions?
The short version: I believe your numbers are based on a flawed use of modern taxonomy. I also believe that modern Christianity's most popular interpretation of the events in Genesis 6+ is also flawed.
I also believe certain boundary conditions have been ignored by both camps.
In short, I believe everyone is wrong in their interpretations, the "scientists" are wrong about what the data means and the "theists" are wrong about what the scripture means ... So, everyone is wrong! Except me of course ... but I'm probably wrong about that .
Could you please provide the correct taxonomy and the sources?
I had a JW bang on the door of my house a few months back who tried to convince me of the six major flaws (he called them lies) of Christianity. It was like Mother Goose trying to convince me not to believe in Aesop's fables.
However, feel free to elaborate if you think it supports your case.
What boundary conditions?
It's not easy being right about anything when you haven't a shred of evidence to present and all there is are countless interpretations of ancient texts to go on.
No, and that's not what I said. But thank you for being polite.
I did say that I looked into this several decades ago, and the matter was long settled in my mind. Since it was for my personal benefit, not a work for all time, I did not save everything to have at my finger tips.
Because I cannot do as you ask, I am not asking you to believe the same things I do. I am only asking you to believe that a man of integrity and reasonableness can come to a different conclusion than you have.
I have no doubt that your education, experience, background and training are substantially different than mine. I respect that fact that you have reasons for seeing this in a completely different way than I do. Your point of view may even be correct.
You've mistaken my purpose. I have no case to present. I have no interest in convincing you that I'm right, I am here only for my own amusement. I was stating personal beliefs and conviction and conclusions, specifically in reference to a joke I made about a viking chief. My point was my joke, not my belief.
In context of this thread, I was saying that I don't believe the evidence submitted is sufficient to prove the existence of Noah, within reasonable scientific certainty. That was my one and only serious point.
The fact that I also happen to believe that Noah was real was simply an aside. I feel no compulsion to go back and rehash, what are to me, old arguments.
Here's a very simple example:
Generally speaking, it is well know that initial conditions of any experiment (a primary boundary condition), when not recorded, cannot, by definition be known or reproduced. They can only be assumed. If you change your initial assumptions, any data can show something completely different than the original conclusion. Thus even our best scientific data on any topic is subject to re-interpretation by changing stated assumptions regarding initial conditions.
In this specific case, what was the genetic makeup of the various species of the earth 1000 years ago? We have recently discovered that dogs and wolves, are truly the same species, but coyotes are subspecies. What was the genetic make up of the canine species 1000 years ago? 10000 years? A million? We cannot know. We can assume, and we can agree that it is a "good" assumptions. But that's all they are. Assumptions. As to what makes a good assumption and what doesn't? Well that seems to be a matter of "majority rules".
"Majority rules" makes agreements, but agreements are not necessarily truth.
I was making another joke. It seems like you took me seriously. I'm really not sure why, but it looks like the side comment matters to you. I'm not trying to persuade you to change your mind, just clarifying where I stand.
As you say, there are countless interpretations, and mine is just one. I freely admit to being potentially incorrect, but it is not because I just picked something that sounded good and went with it.
I share my interpretation of that specific ancient text face to face with close friends around a campfire while smoking damn fine cigars and drinking small batch Bourbon or single malt Scotch. That's the place for serious discussion of life's real issues.
I do appreciate the respect you've shown in this conversation so far, thank you.
It's a simple matter of logistics over magic. The logistics of such a size of vessel couldn't possibly have held even one of each of the worlds species, let alone two. That is, unless Noah had a "shrink ray" he used on all the animals.
That time span is not enough to see dramatic changes to species. It is thought that at the time of Noah, there were at least 10 million species on the planet.
No problem. Anytime.
Not to mention Noah and his family, and the massive amount of provisions.
I've heard it argued that god provided the food and water for all the inhabitants of the ark, but one of things not argued was whether or not god picked up the shit afterward.
Side stepping the whole Noah's ark thing, you know I have asked this question of myself a thousand times.
And..., in my honest opinion I cannot come up with, nor think of one "biblical" inspired bit of history. It does not exists. Which makes me wonder, how was it that so much was accomplished before man could record the moments. And, why nothing has happened since the alphabet was invented.
It truly brings me pause in my faith sometimes.
hello Intimate ... If something does happen and we took a picture or movie of the event it would be skepticized to death. No one would believe it. The film could not be proven to be real. It would be said that it could not be disproven?
And then ignored.
Yes, this could be true. However, nothing? In the last 2000 years, nothing?
I don't get it.
Well it is just my opinion but I think that we are living in the times of the Gentiles in which this world has been given into the hands of the BEAST. Next time he realy shows himself it will be for the grand finale.
Really Jerami- really? That surprises me. Still, I appreciate your honesty and sharing that opinion with us. Although, you must know already, that I would not nor do not agree with your sentiment.
Why? It is quite simple really. I do not give the devil that much credit over my time. See, I'm more about praising God's messages rather than giving the devil praises, for creating the awesomeness of weather changes, plate tectonics, or the visual hues of sunsets. But that is just me. I do not fear what God has to offer, anymore than I believe that the devil is compatible of creating rain.
I guess that could be. Night Jerami, good chatting with you. But I'm getting sleepy. We can pick this conversation up sometime tomorrow. Cheers!
Could this be the lost ark?
I do not understand why nobody is allowed to dig at this site. What is Turkey afraid of?
The lost Ark?
What did they say when you went there?
Sh*t Mark- I've never been there. Of course from your response, you already know this. I was only adding to the conversation. Which apparently got your attention. Therefore it work. Which we all know is a good thing.
Quite truthfully, I have a hard time believing in the story myself. All the animals 2 by 2. Really? I don't think so.
Of course - I was just making fun. If a bunch of Christians actually believed there was an actual Ark in Turkey being covered up by the Turkish government - you think the Christians might have gone and had a look?
Sorry - I did not get the fact that you were making fun of the idea and your question seemed as serious as all the other Kristians.
2 by 2? If you discount all scientific knowledge - sure - why not?
Marcus "Aurelius" Knowles!
Haven't 'seen' you in a while.
Thought I'd pop in to say `ello and see how you have been.
Oh - I have been around. Congratulations on making the "Top Ten Posters in the Irrational Belief Forum," by the way. I know that was a personal goal.
How do you make it? My personal goal is to have 2701 followers like you.
really? lol, didn't even know.
cool, now i have a new goal: top forum poster in less than 21 minutes !!! lol
wait, i was always in the top ten, garsh. now i have to find a new forum.
Even if we were to dig there, whose to say that the Romans didn't built it anyways. Or the Chinese, Egyptians, Greeks, Philistines, etc...
http://www2.rgzm.de/Navis/Musea/Ostia/I … 1f0007.jpg
I'm outta here. The MU T I G E R S are getting ready to play in the NCAA tourney soon, take care and have a great week. Cheers!
Even if this was Noah's Ark, I don't see how that could be proven. Whatever you decide to believe, the Turkish government is missing a trick here. The site could be exploited as a tourist destination bringing in huge sums of money for the local people and government. Perhaps once Turkey joins the EU it'll see the capitalist light.
I would think that the ancient word that "the whole earth" was translated from should be reexamined. Especially when in reference to this story.
When King Cyrus wrote, that God had given him all the kingdoms of the whole earth and has CHARGED him to build him an house in Jerusalem .. This same word was translater "Whole earth". In that reference it pertained to the region around the Medetarian.
Theist and Atheist both like to pick and choose when to take the translation of words and statements as being literal or not, depending upon how it suports their arguement.
There are similar stories to the biblical flood that comes from around the world.
Instead of the story being borrowed can't this similar event have happened all over the world.
I don't know but that is the way in which I have always understood it.
I'm curious how this forum thread, became stagnate on Noah's Ark.
Just goes to show you, that there is no evidence to that pertaining to a momentous, and biblical modern day event.
It conversations like these, that bring doubt to my beliefs. Why hasn't God shown his might, in the past 2000 years? I'd like to see the parting of the Pacific ocean, something, anything.
Did God lose his magic touch?
Hi intimat, actually I didn't start this thread searching for any specific history. I was wondering if there was any recent discoveries for an article I was writing for a client.
In truth there is evidence though many will not see it as such. The changing of the seasons, birth, the simple color of a flower or flutter of a birds wing. All these things and more,in my opinion, are evidence of God.
Of course "many" will not see it as such. That is because this is not "evidence."
Any fool can see this is proof of the Star Goat and only workers for the anti-goat like you would attempt to deceive your fellow man in this fashion. Get thee behind me ring worm.
It's a good question. We are listening to 45th hand accounts by people with a vested interest and most of the believers do not seem to actually believe. They are more interested in showing some sort of superiority than living as Christians.
Exactly why doesn't god show himself like he used too?
You beleebers - please do not bombard me with the standard - You have to have faith - argument - if that were the case - whey did god supposedly show himself all over the place for the bible fairy tails?
But not any more. Now the only "evidence" is flowers.
Take off those cheap glasses and maybe you could see more.
Not that you are trying to convince me of anything.
Sorry - not interested in sharing your delusion. The Anti-Goat has many minions here on earth who attempt to spread the wurd that the Universe was not vomited by a Star Goat.
See? There are Goats, therefor the Star Goat vomited the Universe.
If you opened you eyes as well as your mind - you would see this as obvious truth.
Why else is there grass? Exactly. No other explanation. Proof.
Yeah. You know Mark, I have to agree with you here. Like I said, it is this area of subject matter, that puts doubt in my heart about my faith.
Why doesn't God show himself?
What's he got to lose?
How come we don't have people turning into pillars of salt, or witness water turning into wine, or bushes spontaneously erupting into flames, while the darn thing talks to you?
I'd like to seeing a burning, talking, bush.
I'd like to see someone turn into a pillar of salt.
Like for instance, my mother.
Hi intimat, have you seen this:
I'm not saying these peoples stories are positive proof, but they do make one wonder. What if you were there?
No I haven't seen what is in the link. However, hell ya I'd believe if I were there. You know, I believe in him now. I'm just saying that it makes no sense why all that happened 5000 years ago, and nothing happens today.
I'd want to see something like the parting of the Pacific ocean, Lake Michigan turning into blood, Miami w/no Cubans....., something that is major and impossible, on a grand scale. So why did he just stop? You know what I mean?
I'm just thinking out loud.
Well good luck with that.
You know- there have been a couple underwater expeditions at the Dead Sea.
There is future hope that these expeditions will bring up some new biblical discoveries. It is an interesting concept, but I don't anything has come out of it yet.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 … 173122.htm
I'd still like to see the parting of the Pacific ocean, something, anything.
I found it, Here's a picture of it for free.
sombody turned it into a burger joint, thats capitalism for ya.
by secretmemoir5 years ago
Given that there are over a million species described how would you fit them on a boat? Even if you were to take only the mammals, you're looking at a minimum of 5000 described species - in pairs (plus all their...
by True Believer6 years ago
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/home … 865513.cms
by Writer Fox20 months ago
No matter who you are, your ancestry is traced from Noah and his wife. This is where your family tree begins. Could this be Noah's Ark?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7iycpe16V0
by marinealways246 years ago
Can you explain without faith how Noah's ark is logical without using faith?Did they have the dino's on Noah's Ark?Logic tells me that noahs ark is faith based. I mean, did the dino's wait in the single file line to...
by aka-dj6 months ago
A worldwide flood (like described by Noah's flood) is said to be part of many cultures folklore.Creationist proponents belive geological evidence "supports " such an event. Atheists (and others) do not. What...
by pennyofheaven3 years ago
If Noah's Ark was found how would that alter the evolution theory? Maybe a better question would be... Would the discovery alter the evolution theory?
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