Have you seen the take on religion in the movie Zeitgeist?
It's on youtube.
Christianity is plagerized from another religion, Judaism. Obviously the new testament consistantly quotes the old testament. Some folks call that the fufillment of prophecy.
It's believed that in Judaism, the atonement and judgment part of Rosh haShanah and Yom Kippur were borrowed from the Babylonian religion of the time of the Jewish exile to Babylon. (There are probably other examples as well, but that one comes to mind)
However, there are two beliefs that the author seems to have misattributed to Judaism:
- there is no concept of hell or any form of permanent/eternal punishment in Jewish thought
- there is no concept of an apocalypse in Judaism
Both of these exist in Christian doctrine, though.
Excellent article. I agree with some of the Zoroastrianism teachings like God creating good and a separate evil entity creating evil, which is contrary to Jewish beliefs. It is a fact that Judaism was heavily influenced by paganism. Therefore the prophecy of a divine messiah was tossed out in favour of an earthly one and that is the very reason why Jesus is rejected by Jews.
I am not disputing that point of view but adding to it.
The Jews were expecting the Messiah to come in the manner in which they understood, from reading the writings of their prophets.
They understood the writings of Daniel to say that before the coming of the Messiah, they must endure life under the dominion of four great Empires.
They understood that under the reign of the fourteenth king of the fourth Kingdom, the Messiah will come to redeem them.
According to their understanding; Jesus was nine kings and almost a hundred years too early. Daniel 7: 23 & 24
Had Jesus came when they were expecting him to come,
Had Jesus come in the manner they were expecting him to come,
Had Jesus fulfilled their EXPECTATIONS they would have believed who he was.
Had they not misunderstood these prophesy correctly?
But, in psalmes it is written that their eyes will be blinded that they not recognize the Messiah when he comes.
So the fact that the Hebrews rejected him does not prove that Jesus wasn't who he said that he was.
Jesus said that there were some standing right there in front of him that shall not taste of death before they see the son of man coming in the clouds of heaven, sitting at the right hand of God, And they didn't acknowledge that either, because that didn't happen in the manner in which they were expecting it to happen.
None of the prophesy were fulfilled the way in which we were expecting them to have been fulfilled.
Most Christians are blindly awaiting the fulfillment of prophesy the same way in which most Jews are awaiting the first coming of the Messiah.
How ironic is that?
You are preaching to the choir with me friend
I doubt even Jesus would approve of the churches built around him
Think a bit was nicked from Mythraism too, such as the virgin birth, though its possible that Mythraism also had it's origins based in Zoroastrianism.
Christianity also took a lot from the local religions as it spread out, such as with the Celtic Irish. From their beliefs they incorporated the stories of St. Brigid, who was in Celtic lore a Goddess, they turned the Goddess into a pious, charitable, saint, who's story is taught as fact in Irish primary schools
I've been looking up zoroastrianism - some say there is archeological evidence that it predates christianity; of course, christians say their texts are older. Any accurate info on Zoro? Jesus and Zoroaster same kinds of legends?
Can anyone write a hub on this with references?
Zoroastrianism predates christ by a long way, when the priests of Zoroastrianism were trying to come up with an origin date (apparently by counting back generations of priests) they came up with 10th century B.C.
Also they did this solely because the Seleucid Empire tried to initiate a new calender in the vein of the Age of Alexander, which Zoroastrian priests disagreed with.
So even if the calculated date of origin is wrong, the priests who made the calculation were from an earlier time than Christ
Zoroastrianism inarguably predates Christianity by at least five centuries. Not much of their sacred texts texts survive, and what does survive is in the form of a compilation from the 3rd or 4th century AD. However, the originals are thought to been composed no later than 300 BC.
and the earliest christian gospels were 80-100AD?
Yes. Even if they were composed the year Jesus was born, the Zoroastrian texts are older.
maybe you should write something, as I couldn't find much on net confirming that; mainly stuff from christians claiming opposite
I used to work in London three days a week. I traveled there by train, and frequently shared a car with several Zoroastrian teenage girls. They were traveling to a London Baha'i center on the same days that I was traveling to work. This was in the mid-1990s. I'm not sure whether this is still true, but in those days, in London, the Baha'is and the Persians were very friendly towards each other.
Anyway, that's where I learned what I know about Zoroastrianism. Maybe I should write a hub about it.
could texts have been deliberately destroyed? I read that christians went thru a phase of burning down libraries, for instance
not by christians...those place was never conquered by christians...it was pretty much Zoroastrian belt till muslims took over...
you sound like you know a lot about evolution of religion?
not lot ...but at core all religions are more or less same...some like hinduism are liberal...it has all paths lead to god concept...others are strict...like Abrahamic ...only my path and my prophet/god is real kinds...but if we dig deeper ...all end up in similar lines...the thought process becomes same as we go deeper ...beyond rituals...now some might say since divinity began religion so it has to be same...but i believe evolution is the answer...
zoroasterism was first monotheistic religion? polytheism preceded mono? poly would have been when some land masses separated as many separated ancient peoples had their oral mythologies?
well i dont think there was any first mono religion ....since humans began to think , questions like who m i , why i am here, what happens after death, where do our loved ones goes , who control nature might have poped up...there might have been various thoughts ...some might have been mono too...for e.g. oldest veda ,verse starts with concept of god which has not shape , size ...which controls everything , which creates , which was always there, which predates before time and which is cause and matter...something like that..it has glimpes of mono in it...so i think mono and poly might have been parallel thoughts...but poly was more popular since humans work in that fashion....we dont have single person doing everything ...be it be government or corporate or even family...so poly was natural thing...but when humans evolved....who is the boss theme too might have got stronger...paving way to ultimate deity...and finally came modern religions...
Wow, what an amazing coincidence. I just saw a documentary on the discovery channel about this very same topic. talk about timing there. i know many archealogists and historians speculate that either the bible was plagarised OR they could all be referring to the same event that happened in history, but from a different perspective. Which one is the definitive answer, it's tough to say. Although you got to admit, it's fun learning about history. At least for me anyway. lol. Not as much fun as learning about movies, and their history, but it's fun nonetheless.
zoroastrianism is older one...i think instead of viewing religion as divine ...we must view it as evolution of though...iran plays very important role in religion...largely there are two different set of religion which are in majority...one being abhramic and other being from India...the vedic concepts began in iran and then aryans migrated to India ...from there came hindusim and its off shoots...so iran might very well be focal point for all major religions...
does anyone have any hubs that match up the evolution & migration of people with evolution of religion? I'm curious eg how ancient separated cultures all had their oral traditions, mythologies, art etc
some of stories are similar...like great flood...you can find it in hinduism and abhramic religions ...both...in hinduism it is manu while noah in other and by some other name in another...but story is same...that too makes me wonder about similar origin of all religions...let us take virgin birth concept...now that is for christ and 5 characters of largest epic too which is part of hinduism...then we have concept of child born at 90+ age in most religions...there are many similar or same stories...
yes, have heard there are many stories in common. Would love to read more hubs on this stuff (I won't attempt to write any, as would need to do a lot of digging) - history's not my thing
this link is interesting:
talks about mythologies in common eg tree, dispersion, creation, flood etc
A great flood is in nearly every cultures legends, I think. Also several stories from different countries tell of a great man that talked about peace and love and tried to unite everybody together. Hiawatha, Buddha and others I can't remember. I was really interested on religious similarity in high school but have forgotten much of it. It's part of what made me form the opinion that any one religion only has part of the story. And if God is real why wouldn't he care about all cultures?
The Creator-God cared and cares about all cultures; that is why the similarities in different religions. The Messengers Prophets of all religions and in parts of the world received the same original message; the people could not secure it that made the difference.
exactly. I'm going to put together a hub (my next one) - a compilation of the influences of religion, particularly christianity - it will have links to the many hubs that have more detail about various aspects. If anyone has a great hub related to the evolution of religion, particularly christianity, & how they are all based on the same mythologies, let me know so I can link and promote it.
I will be sure to read it when you are done! I find the similarities fascinating.
It's going to be mainly a compilation - I'm not an expert on this stuff, but I will instead link to interesting stuff I found and comment on why I found it interesting
has just published it - evolution of christianity & other religions. Hope I got all my facts straight
Zoroastrianism is widely established as having predated Christianity by many centuries. I'm a little surprised to hear that some Christians deny that. Just another example of twisting and contorting the objective facts to suit their own purposes, I guess.
We know that ideas such as a savior offering salvation, miraculous and even virgin births, prophets with special powers and resurrection from the dead existed in various forms in various times and places before and during Christianity's development.
On this topic the following information is very insightful:
http://www.religionfacts.com/christiani … ontext.htm
In order to understand early Christianity, one must understand the bubbling stew of new religions and cults and faith communities in the Mediterranean world at the time of Jesus. The beliefs and messages of Jesus' particular movement bear striking similarity to other contemporary cults and religious movements in the Roman empire.
Subsequently, as Christianity expanded, it definitely incorporated the customs and ideas of local groups and cultures. Someone mentioned a specific case of an Irish goddess-turned-saint. This type of thing occurred all over pagan Europe, as Christians adapted their religion to gain the followers. Indeed, the concept of a "saint" is, I believe, not actually in the Bible. It was basically manufactured to attract pagan converts. Today, the Catholic Church continues to use sainthood in a political way to attract converts or bring people back into the flock, by canonizing various local heroes or legendary figures in Latin America, for example.
Similar adaptations occurred vis-a-vis holidays and feasts. Christmas is a great example--the Christmas tree has pagan origins. Pagan celebrations of solstice were often adapted into the Christian fold.
An argument could be made that the Protestant split from the Catholic church was influenced in a big way by the more egalitarian and individualist cultures of northern Europe--which are precisely the cultures where Protestantism came to dominate (Germany, Britain, Sweden, Denmark, etc).
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