What is the Root Cause of Intolerance

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just_curiousposted 13 years ago
I've been here longer than I probably should have been, reading a lot in this forum. I have come to the conclusion that I have found an answer or two, so I don't begrudge the experience. I have, at times, been as intolerant as the next person. It seems to me that the following holds true.

belief= yes to a true or false question.

non beleif= no to a true or false question.

religion=an emotional need to fill in the blanks created by an emotional reaction to a perceived incident.

atheism = an emotional reaction to the action of a person with religion.

evangelism= an emotional need brought about by the arroganct assumption that everyone should have the opportunity to share your perception of reality.

aggressive atheism = an emotioinal reaction brought about by the arrogant assumption that everyone should share this perception of reality.

No one could possibly explain to either side how emotional their argument is.

I have come to the conclusion that both ends of the spectrum are too emotionally attached to their arguments to listen to the other half of their brain.

Does anyone have a different take on this?
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Emotion is mostly a good thing, really.
  God is an emotional Being.
  So is Satan.
  Jesus came to divide! To challenge! And indeed He has done so.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes He has.
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  And to reconciliate
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  dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I think you've got atheism wrong. Aggressive atheism is right, yes, but not all of us are atheists because of something a religious person did.
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  Dave Mathewsposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  What is the (prime root) of 1??
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  if you look at people who ostracize homosexuals, for example, I'd say the root cause of intolerance is a combination of fear, ignorance and narrow-minded clinging to a rigid view.
  
  Many believers believe incorrectly that atheists are evil.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  And the other way around ,ok different word, but the animosity is always close to the surface like a volcanic mountain waitin to spew...
  
  I dont think anyone is evil until they commit evil.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, we all have sin in us through the bloodline of Adam... Hence the reason Jesus was born by a virgin. The details get complicated but it roots in what God told Satan in Genesis about putting enmity between 'the woman's seed' and him:
  
  Genesis 3:15
  
  15 "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
  
  May have to do some googling.. I'm not an expert, but that's how Jesus was COMPLETELY sin free.
  
  Unlike the rest of mankind as Paul states:
  
  1 Corinthians 15:22
  
  22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
  
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  presumably Mary was still a 'sinner', despite being a virgin
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I've said my piece in this forum, but I just wanted to offer some clarification of this point...Roman and Eastern rite Catholics for certain (and I believe possibly Orthodox Christians as well [Eastern, Russian, Greek]) believe differently about Mary's sinful nature than Protestant denominations do. The mainline, NON-Catholic Christian believes that Mary was a virgin, but just like everyone else otherwise, i.e., born under original sin and all that.
  
  The Roman and Eastern rite Catholics believe in the Immaculate Conception - which means that Mary was conceived without sin. Since she was intended from conception to carry the human incarnation of God, it was imperative that she be free from all stain of sin, so by grace, God conceived her that way. She was sinless, like Christ, but by GRACE from God - not by nature as Christ was.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks for this explanation.
  Are you sure that's what it means?
  ...I always thought that the Immaculate Conception was referring only to Jesus's conception, not Mary's! That's how I believe it anyway, as does the Christian community.
  
  You said they believe "God conceived HER that way".......
  How can that even make sense to even a Catholic? Because wouldn't that mean, according to Catholicism's view, that Mary's parents (or at least her mother) was...sinless...? And/or that she also, like Jesus, had no earthly biological father? And by that, her grandmother would've had to have been sinless, correct?
  
  This doesn't compute! Not even in the wildest imagination....
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  dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oh dear. No. The Immaculate Conception refers to the conception of Mary. She was born without any sin on her. That's why she is sometimes referred to as Immaculata.
  
  It's quite bad when an atheist knows more about your religion than you do.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You wrongly assume that I'm Catholic. Well, I'm not.
  The Holy Bible says nothing about Mary being sinless nor divine.
  
  Why don't you save your insults for someone who wants to hear 'em?
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  dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I know you're not a Catholic. In fact, I get the impression you have rather a low opinion of Catholics.
  
  I just found it amusing that an atheist knows more about a subsect of Christianity's beliefs than a Christian does.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Born-again Christianity is not a "sub-sect" of Christianity, I'm pleased to inform you. It is pure Christianity. Catholicism, while it tries to retain the original, has become more a religion than a Christian doctrine. That makes me sad, because "she" has left her first Love (Christ) and given place to erroneous doctrines like calling Mary divine and giving all authority to the succession of Popes, who are simply fallible men just like any man.
  
  And no, I don't have a low opinion of Catholics. I just have a low opinion of their tendency to listen to all the carp that comes from the Vatican instead of reading their Bibles for themselves!
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You do know the 'born agains' came out of protestant christianity, which came out from the catholics?
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That may or not be debatable.
  What I do know is that my views came from the Word of God, who (yes, who, since Jesus was the Word of God in the flesh) says in John chapter 3 that we "...must be born again." and "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
  Therefore, I am a "whosoever" and very Blessed to be so!
  So it matters not to me what group or denomination was instrumental in carrying those words to my sight and ears, only that God Himself wrote them and spoke them.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ironically Brenda, you've not even a clue with regards to which words are metaphors within your scripture. Now, that's truly sad.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Cagsil,
  your attempts to discredit everything I say are very redundant and without basis.
  So boring and futile.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, wasn't trying to discredit what you say and if you could see beyond yourself for more than 2 seconds you would not find a need to be defensive about your position.
  
  I cannot help your lack of knowledge of your own scripture, but I can help you with it, which apparently since you know all I cannot help.
  
  No discrediting need to be done on my part, you do fine without my help in that area.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, but I don't need an unbeliever's help with deciding which passages of Scripture are metaphorical or literal! Just so you know. And while your offer may be sincere (who knows?! lol), I will say no thanks because it wouldn't do you any good either, since your mind is closed to the Word.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I wasn't offering to help you with what scriptures where metaphorical or literal.
  
  I said, and as usual, I will repeat myself- YOU do not know which WORDS of your scriptures are metaphors.
  
  So, stick that in your pipe and smoke it.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I will do neither! haha
  Why would I stick a lie into a pipe and smoke it?
  I neither perpetuate a lie, nor do I smoke a pipe!
  
  Gee.....I bet we're providing LOADS of entertainment now! You telling me to stick something in a pipe and smoke it sounds like school-yard jargon! LOL Don't ya just love it when discussion is reduced to childish bantering!? Surely you must, or you wouldn't do it.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You're religious, of course you perpetuate the lie. You just don't know it's a lie. Not surprising though.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, I certainly wouldn't have been offended if you had used my name, rather than referring to me as "she." And, fear not, I have not left my first love. And apparently, my explanations about Mary fell on deaf ears, as I did not once refer to her as divine. As to the authority of Papal succession, I wouldn't begin to address that with you. As to reading the Bible for myself - I have, several times, and do, frequently. I've also studied it and been instructed by very solidly grounded people of the Christian faith, both in and out of the Catholic Church. I find it regrettable that you appear to have misunderstood what it was I had to say. Thank you for at least allowing me the illusion that you had in fact listened with an open mind. It was encouraging, if only for a brief while.
  
  Peace and blessings, and all the prayers in the world that your fight is won!
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I used "she" to refer to the Catholic Church. I wasn't referring to you personally. That Church usually refers to itself as "she" or "her".
  I'm sorry if I gave the wrong impression!
  One reason I referred to it like that is because I just the other day got through reading a book by a Catholic priest, a former Presbyterian minister, who had "converted" to the Catholic Church years before. It's called "Where We Got the Bible" by Henry G. Graham, along with his conversion story "From the Kirk to the Church".....and in that he kept referring to that Church as "she"...
  I read it with an open mind, thinking he was gonna tell the readers about his actual Faith in Christ, his salvation story, maybe even about being born-again! But it was just his story of how he came to change denominations! He ranted on and on about how much Protestants owe the debt of gratitude to the Catholic Church for translating and preserving the Bible, but how we "worship" the Bible and how we've supposedly attacked the Catholic Church wrongly!
  Of course, maybe the Protestant movement was different then than it is now. I dunno. But the book was so steeped in religious ritual and drooling over the beauty of the Catholic Church buildings that it was obvious that the man was so arrogant that he couldn't even search the Scriptures for himself. And he admitted that he shaped his views of Faith in a direction entirely against the advice of his own father and fellow ministers.
  Of course, the doctrines of the church he grew up in weren't the most Scriptural either!
  But it simply let me know that he had gone from one set of knowledge to another and had meanwhile entirely missed the fullness of the message of Christ's salvation! He went from one set of religious beliefs to another, out of the frying pan into the fire, and all the while touting the infallibility of the Popes and the Catholic Church.
  
  So many people are still steeped in religion. And that's how the Catholic Church is----hugely religious! One thing they do right is their helping the poor and widowed, I'll say that. But I don't think they know what a relationship with Christ is like at all! "They" meaning in general.
  I have not meant to offend you! But indeed I've been offended by the arrogance of the Catholic Church's teachings and influence many times, both impersonally and personally, that perhaps I'm a bit defensive.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I'm certain I understand it correctly. Very few Christians (or even Catholics) actually do understand it that way. Jesus did not need to be immaculately conceived, as He was sinless by nature. Mary's earthly parents were indeed sinners (as the definition is traditionally understood by believing Christians). But, God, by grace - removed from Mary the stain of original sin passed down through human parentage to cleanse her and make her a fit vessel to hold the His human incarnation in her womb. As to that meaning that her earthly parents would have had to be sinless, this isn't the case. It computes because it is God ultimately responsible for the act of conception - therefore, despite the sinfulness of Mary's earthly parents, it is quite possible that the God of the bible, known to often do the impossible, created Mary different from the rest of us for His express purpose. Much like when a Christian is saved, she is made sinless in the eyes of God, due to accepting the gift of God's grace - same here. Only this gift of grace was given to Mary prior to her birth.
  
  And God's indeed is the wildest of wild imaginations.
  
  Immaculate Conception=Mary
  Virgin Birth=Jesus
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  So, that theory of her sinlessness (not just her virginity) is why Catholics tout her as the "Mother of God" and worship her?
  
  And yes of course God's doings are the wildest! ha
  
  But there's no valid reason that He would've had to make Mary sinless, since in fact Jesus's Father (God) is sinless, but Jesus's human side WAS subject to temptation of sin. Jesus was sinless, yes, because he resisted temptation in every way. Remember, he had the opportunity to sin if he wanted to. God led him away to be tempted by Satan.
  
  The whole concept of Mary as touted by the Catholic Church has served only to (in their eyes) elevate her above Jesus!
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why we tout her (as you say) as the Mother of God, yes. Catholics, however, do not worship Mary. Worship is reserved for God alone. While prayers have popped up over the course of history that mistakenly use the word worship in regard to Mary, the actual teaching of the Church is this: Worship/adoration is reserved for God alone. Honor may be paid to Mary and the saints, but it is NOT worship - it is exactly that: respectful honor. Mary, according to the Church is due a higher degree of honor as she was, indeed, the Mother of God. The Latin word for honor is "dulia," which is the honor paid to the saints (biblical and afterward.) Mary is afforded "Hyperdulia," meaning high honor. In no way does the Church (as a living, teaching, breathing body) elevate Mary above Jesus. Certain, mis-instructed or misunderstanding Catholics may do so. Any honor paid to Mary by a Catholic is meant to allow them to see the greatness of God through the gifts bestowed upon her. Only that.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  So, tell me then,(according to your understanding of how Catholicism is or should be) whether these things are good------
  
  I heard a Catholic priest on a television program say that Mary replaced the fallen angel Lucifer as far as position in heaven.
  
  And several times I've seen Catholic masses on tv, or maybe they weren't masses; whatever; but a "Mother" so-and-so, nun, was repeating over and over (as were the other nuns) the words "Holy Mary, Mother of God", or "Blessed Mary, Mother of God" along with other words. The references to Mary far out-numbered the reference to Jesus, whose name got tacked onto the end of the rituals, as, "...and Blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus".
  
  Jesus was obviously secondary in those ritualistic sayings!
  
  Is that the kind of worship that the Catholic Church authorizes?
  Was the theory that priest proposed condoned by Catholic authorities, by the Catechisms?
  They're definitely not in the Holy Bible!
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I will not debate the issue, but I'll do my best to answer the questions you ask. As to the priest, that isn't something I've read or seen in either Scripture or the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It is possible that it has sprung up over history as a traditionally held belief among Catholics. That makes it neither biblically correct, nor an actual teaching of the Church.
  
  What you are referring to is called a Rosary - It is a rote prayer that focuses on the central "mysteries" in the Life of Christ. Included among the prayers of the Rosary are the Our Father (or Lord's Prayer - depending on your preference), The Apostles' Creed, and the Glory Be. The Hail Mary is repeated as a sort of meditation upon the individual mystery of Christ that is being considered. While the second half of the Hail Mary is not found word for word in Scripture, the first half is taken directly from the Gospels and are the words of Elizabeth (Mary's cousin and the mother of John the Baptist). When Mary visited Elizabeth during her own pregnancy, she spoke both to Mary being blessed among women, full of grace, and the mother of God. See Luke 1:42-43
  
  Peace.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks for answering.
  
  I was asking partly because I assumed Catholic priests and nuns and teachers were subject to the Church as to what they're allowed to teach. Are you saying there are false teachers among them like there are false ones in Protestantism?
  
  And I think one major concern of mine is that "Protestants" are considered by the Catholic Church to be "separated brethren".....when in fact, I know that I myself am a born-again Christian and that's the "religion" set in place by Christ and the Apostles. Yet the Catholics that I've had occasion to meet follow the idea that I'm "separated" from their Church, when in fact I believe THEY are separated from the original Church.
  
  (sigh) it's almost impossible to discuss these things with them. I've tried. And they get defensive way before I do. Which cuts out the possible sharpening of iron together. I find it frustrating and very sad, really. So I have no choice but to refrain from trying to fellowship with them. My only consolation is that I remain totally confident in my own Faith.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  In regard to your first point, yes priests and nuns are subject to the teachings of the Church about what they should teach. Unfortunately, much goes unmonitored, and therefore, yes to your second point as well. There are false prophets and teachers in the Catholic Church, as well as in her Protestant counterparts.
  
  As to the separated brethren issue - sadly, all Christians are separated brethren in the grand scheme of things.
  
  As to discussing it, I'm always glad to answer any and all questions posed to me. If you ever have any, please feel free to ask. Know, though, that I speak only for myself, not for every Catholic in the world. I also have come to my understanding and acceptance of what I believe as the result of prayerful and careful consideration of Scripture and the Catechism of the Catholic Church. I've been sold a lot of crap by a lot of well meaning Catholic "teachers." Rather than accept it as plain fact, I try to go to the source.
  
  And, frankly, I started this side conversation with you also of the opinion that you had a fairly low opinion of Catholics. It's ended for me with the pleasant conclusion that I feel you were truly open minded about my responses.
  
  Thank you for that.
  
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You're welcome.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  As to His reason for making her sinless, it is no different than His reason for making US sinless through the gift of redemption. Sin cannot stand in the presence of God in all His heavenly glory. It then follows that a sinful womb cannot contain the incarnate God . Hence, the need to cleanse it and make it worthy to hold Him. In His human nature, Jesus was indeed tempted. But in His divinity, He resisted.
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  Joy56posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am agreeing with you all the way Brenda, thought i would let you know, instead of just sitting here nodding in agreement.........
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  hemustincreaseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There has only ever been three sinless human beings. Adam and Eve, before the fall and Christ Jesus, God incarnate.
  
  Mary, the mother of Jesus was a sinner no less than any other.
  
  Did you know that God places emphasis upon the ‘blood’ as being the life of a person? It is through ‘blood’ that sin is inherited and it has been through blood that sin is cleansed. Ultimately the ‘blood’ of Christ. (There is so much to be said about ‘blood’ from the Scriptures which add greatly to this discussion, but i am going to pass it all over for the sake of brevity and concentrate upon Mary alone.)
  
  For Christs ‘blood’ to be capable of cleansing us from sin, it had to be sinless. Did you know that a pregnant woman does not give a single drop of her blood to the unborn baby? The babies blood supply is 100% separate to the mother. She passes essential nutrients to the unborn baby but all of his blood is developed in the embryo itself. From the time of conception to the time of birth, not one single drop of blood passes from the mother to the child. An egg by itself cannot develop. Only when a sperm enters the ovum and a foetus begins to develop does blood appear. It is the sperm which brings the ‘life’ (blood) to the egg.
  
  Mary was created the exact same wonderful way as all the rest of us ladies. But a sinner the exact same as us too. In all other human births a sperm from the father is required in order to create the blood of the unborn babe. And through this blood ‘sin’ is inherited. The Lord Jesus inherited NO sin whatsoever, because there was NO sperm involved. His blood came from His Father. It was nothing to do with His earthly mother and He had no earthly father. God created women in truly amazing ways. Through a woman sin entered the world. But through the miracle of pregnancy which only a woman can achieve, salvation came. Mary was a sinner. But her sinful blood never touched the sinless baby in her womb. The virgin birth is a miracle. But the reality behind the Lord being sinless is scientifically proven (for those who have ears to hear and eyes to see).
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
  This may be the funniest thing said by a believer-in-majik on this thread.
  
  Scientifically proven - but only if you have faith.
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  hemustincreaseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  What does faith have to do with the ‘fact’ that a woman’s blood is not passed onto her baby? This is the ‘reality’ i spoke of as being scientifically proven.
  
  But sure! Faith is ESSENTIAL to believing upon Christ. Whether belief about His birth, His death or His resurrection.
  
  Glad to see lots of smiles anyhow. Laughter is the best medicine.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  My mistake - I thought you said this:
  
  Little wonder your religion causes so many wars. If it wasn't for that it would be funny that you do not appear to even know what you have said.
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  hemustincreaseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mark
  
  I sure did not offer up the info i did to get into a ‘fight’ or any kind of striving. I was speaking to a lady who clearly already had ‘faith’ in the virgin birth. I offered her some ‘facts’ that are ‘behind’ that miracle and can be observed as ‘fact’ by people today.
  
  I said what i said. “The virgin birth is a MIRACLE” And the "REALITY BEHIND it (the blood not being passed from mother to baby............not the virgin birth itself) is scientifically proven.”
  
  I certainly apologise to you sir, if my initial post was not plain. It is quite hard at times to put in black and white type a full thought, without it being entirely misunderstood. I am certain that had we discussed this in person, these things would have been easily clarified without any reason to call anybody a liar etc.
  
  And the best thing about this morning. My blackberry is resurrected! Yeah! And i have absolutely ZERO evidence as to the hows and whys of that. But the thing works and thats all that matters.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The virgin birth is nonsense. Why the need to lie and back it up with "scientific facts?" Science is pretty clear that humans can not reproduce without sperm being introduced to ova. (Unless Jesus was a clone?)
  
  It appears that FAITH is not enough.
  
  I am happy your blackberry is mysteriously working again. Another "miracle" and scientific proof that Mary was a virgin, and Jesus was the son of god no doubt.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  hemustincrease
  
  You speak intelligently and I enjoyed reading your post on babies and mothers blood -wow just one of many miracles.
  
  I am astounded everyday at just how intricately we are wired.
  
  Ask any surgeon ,scientist and many are equally amazed.
  
  To suggest all that came from -nothing
  
  My goodness that takes more faith to beleive that, than in Gods Creation for sure!!
  
  Bless you hemustincrease
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I thought you did believe it came from nothing. Don't you?
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you for clarifying the mainline Christian belief about Mary. I was clarifying the Roman Catholic belief. Whether you are Catholic or not seems to be the deciding factor as to how you choose to interpret this.
  
  I, as a regular person and not a theologian or a scientist, am unable and unwilling to debate this issue with anyone. I simply stated the belief quite objectively.
  
  The mistaken belief is that we worship Mary. We offer her high honor as the mother of God. We believe in Mary as the New Eve - basically that she was made miraculously sinless by God so that she could contain the human incarnation of God in her womb. We do not worship her as worship is reserved for God alone. That was further explained later.
  
  Thank you for your sincere attempt to "set me right." I appreciate your concern.
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  hemustincreaseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Not seeking to set anybody ‘right’. Just presenting a ‘fact’ about a mothers blood and that of her unborn child. It is just personally fascinating to me.
  
  What you take from that (whether guffaws of laughter as Mark or nothing at all) is entirely up to you.
  
  Off to find a thread that tells me how to get water out of my blackberry! It’s DEAD and i need a resurrection.
  
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  tritrainposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ignorance and lack of empathy are the root causes of intolerance.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  To be honest, I was simply referring to the intolerance in this forum. In my opinion, you are correct; in your statement as regards intolerance, in general.
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  tritrainposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oops. My mistake.
  
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No. My mistake. Thinking that pointing out the obvious in the religious forum might do some good. I think they simply enjoy the conflict. If they're having fun, who am I to judge?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hey JC youre lookin pretty darn cute these days -cool pic!
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks. I started coughing up hairballs. Thought the change of avatar would more accurately reflect my mood.
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  Cheeky Girlposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The root cause of Intolerance is Ignorance. The root cause of Ignorance is Fear. The root cause of Fear is lack of Love. The root cause of Lack of Love is bad parenting - or Ignorance, rinse and repeat...
  
  The root cause of...
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Cheeky where have you been!!!!
  
  Good logic (as always) short n sweet
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  Joy56posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hi cheeky girl, i totally agree, you just saved me lots of time typing my answer
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am intolerant of religious teachings that teach you to hate others not because of ignorance but because of the harm it does to society.
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Religion is following doctrines.
  
  Atheism is the lack of belief in any religion.
  
  Agressive atheism? what the hell is that?
  
  Are you just talking about agressive people that just so happened to be atheist? I think you are and I think you are confused about what atheism is.
  
  It is simply the lack of belief in any god. You dont believe in Vishnu so that makes you an atheist to vishnu. It doesnt mean you have emotions about Vishnu. That would be silly since you dont even believe he exists.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Not confused..I see you are new here. Wait a while. It will all become clear.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with you ,since I have met aggressive and angry people who happen to be Atheists or Christian.
  
  I dont know whether its a Hubpages thing or an Internet thing ,but people who dont like what you have to say seem to be alot ruder than I suspect they would be in real life ,perhaps thats an incorrect assumption on my part.
  
  Lack of maturity ,name calling,mockery etc.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Aggressive atheism appears to me to be the flip side of an agressive evangelical. It seems to have an unhealthy emotional interest in the subject that leads it to argue ridiculous points with a vehemence that defies the notion that it is looking at the problem pragmatically.
  
  Lighten up. Sheesh. I know you probably feel the butt of some cosmic joke. Who wouldn't? I mean, if I was a polar bear with the head of a duck I'd be mad about it too. Have a little faith. You might get to be a centaur in your next life. That would be cool, and well worth the embarassment suffered in your current incarnation. Don't you think?
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  JackSummersposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  ignorance.
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  paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I think it is true; the atheists often resort to ridicule and derision which proves that your above comments are true.
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earnestshubposted 13 years ago
I disagree. The lack of tolerance from those who don't accept the invisible entity story has come about from seeing religious fanatics start post after post for years now, with titles that were so loaded itwas like being asked "Are you still beating your wife?
It eventually infuriated many people who tried to stop them spreading their hate.
No "atheists" (another loaded word) has ever told a religionist they are going to rot in hell.

Also there is the quality of the 2,000 year old fantasy itself.
Of all the stupid stories that could be concocted to support an omnipresent omnipotent omniscient god the bible is pitifully out of step.
In reality it presents a neurotic psychopathic murderer of most of the human race, who has made thousands of threats throughout the book, and for some unknown reason goes bananas when he is not being idolized, adored and prayed to, has never appeared at any of the catastrophes the bible claims he makes to help those dying in agony because of what he has done, which is explained away as "they were the sinner", not one prayer answered out of billions daily for 2,000 years, no reason for any god anyway. Gee I wonder why we get fed up with getting fed this tripe?
Not intolerant, just sick of megalomania posing as love by those who wish to live in the past and pretend to be more important than those who don't believe it.
Just my take on it.
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Earnest you wont rot in hell but you might grow mold in heck
  (was told that once a very long time ago now)
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I found that very funny!
  Needed a good belly laugh thanks!
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Glad I could be of assistance
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  dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with the majority of your post but I disagree that atheist is inherently a loaded word. It just means "one who is not a theist (believer in deity/ies)". I feel that describes me pretty accurately.
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I was not clear in saying that I feel it is a loaded word. I should have said the word has become loaded in the way religionists misuse it.
  I don't call myself an atheist, it gives weight to the arguments of those who see it as a counter religion. I am a simple non believer in my eyes, I don't need to be anything else to see the bible the way I do. I know it well, and I would rather trust the data in Alice in wonderland.
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kirstenblogposted 13 years ago
What is the root cause of intolerance?

I strongly believe the root cause is the desire to tell someone else how to live, what to think, and how to feel. Control. The desire to control another leads to intolerance. Oddly that sort of thing is met with what? Intolerance! Tell me why I should believe blah blah blah and I will tell you why blah blah blah is wrong, and around and around we go, ain't this ol merry go round fun!

Thing is, on this forum for instance I have never asked what anyone's religious affiliation, yet for most people here it is impossible not to know their religious affiliation. I am told they are not pushing their religion yet post after post is put up airing their religious views for all to see, then complain when anyone says they disagree. The desire for some to be victims is sadly high, just what God needs, another victim!
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  Moonchild60posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Fear plain and simple. It is at the root of most irrational behavior.
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pisean282311posted 13 years ago
Intolerance comes from emotion part is right...but i believe intolerance comes from insecurity...
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  So secure people would have been tolerant of hitler and saddam hussein?
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Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years ago
@Just curious.

I agree with your summation of the reasons for religious intolerance.

With regard to antheism, I don't agree.

The anger of atheists has come about, not because they want to convert religious people to their thinking, but because they are constantly bombarded by religious people who want to 'save' them. Everywhere they go, they see this message. Every forum they join is dominated by religious people spouting what should be a privately held opinion. Of course, they can't do that because their religious says that they won't be saved unless they witness! So, they have to bombard everybody who else who head the same thing from 30 people the day before (well, just using hyperbole here to emphasize my point).

And, yes, it is an emotional reaction. I know that I have it. I'm sick and tired of the perpetual bombarding of Christianity. They have no respect whatsoever that other people might like to stop hearing from them, and it never, never, never, occurs to them that they might be mistaken.
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  dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I actually think that it does occur to them that they might be mistaken. I think that's why atheists and agnostics make them so angry, because the more militant Christians struggle quite hard with doubt and our existence just reflects their own doubt right back to them.
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Greek Oneposted 13 years ago
lack of fairly distributed alcoholic resources to the masses causes frustration and man's hatred for man
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  insightful and accurate.
  but no solutions in sight.
  The nature of many disavows alcoholic beverages for the many - least they too feel that delicious feeling...
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  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  i have a dream...
  
  a chicken in every pot...
  
  and a bottle in every hand
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mmmm. Coq au Vin? I could live with that!
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm with you Greek. If everyone could just get a damn beer and a place around the firepit, life would indeed by much better and man would indeed be less hate-filled.
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I reckon we should bring back prohibition. It solved the distribution problem for 13 years!
  See religious beliefs do work!
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Mark Knowlesposted 13 years ago
trolling = the emotional need to create conflict and discord by posting inflammatory nonsense.

Little wonder your religion causes so many wars.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  More accusations? I thought those created conflict?
  
  I love you Mark..
  
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Vala Fayeposted 13 years ago
Fear.

Simple, instinctual, self-preservative fear.

Kept us from getting eaten by predators who aren't known to us,and out of harm's way by distancing ourselves from those who were behaving in an to us incomprehensible way.

Intolerance stems almost from xenophobia.

Tolerance is the result of demystifying your fear and enlightenment.
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  Maembeposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed Vala. It really doesn't have anything to do with religion. People simply use religion as an easy way to justify their hatred.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wisdom there.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Exactly.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Precisely.
  
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
My 2cents worth : Forum Headings

There is a Religious and Beliefs Category, along with several other catergories.

Not sure what the percentage/stats would be for any one catergory ,but I would think if Atheists were feeling intolerant of Christians ,then they would start their own post ,or use some logic and just not visit the threads they dont like?

I know I usually only frequent threads that interest or titilate my senses.

Just curious , in reply to your OP though ,I think the root cause of Intolernce is evident in both camps and probably has its roots in 'doesnt play well with others'
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There's a difference between intolerance and anger as a result of intolerance. Religious people don't tolerate (i.e. allow people who are not believers to live their lives in peace without interference). What is happening now is a backlash against it, i.e. anger.
  
  The worm has finally turned.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe worms should stay clear of high flying birds then
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Difficult when the high flying birds keep pursuing the humble worm...
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Humble Oh missed that worm,wasnt on my shift.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It's difficult to see, I agree, when one is perched on such a dizzy height...
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ah. There's that vengeance again.
  You sound like Reverend Wright. Taking pleasure in seein uncalled-for vengeance being reeked upon people who are doing nothing wrong.
  
  The root cause of anti-Christians' intolerance is rebellion, pure and simple. The root cause of conservative/Christians' intolerance is common sense. There are things we should not tolerate, as individuals and as groups and as a Nation.
  But you wouldn't know anything about that, would you, Sophia, seeing as how you claim no allegiance to any Country?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Doing nothing wrong? Interference in someone's life isn't your place. It's wrong. What part do you not understand about your own actions?
  It's not rebellion at all, you dress it up as that. Those who are non-believers want to be left alone. Get it?
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Really? The list of the most active in this forum is below.
  
  MOST ACTIVE IN THIS FORUM
  just_curious
  paarsurrey
  Beelzedad
  Mark Knowles
  Castlepaloma
  vector7
  Cagsil
  earnestshub
  Eaglekiwi
  pisean282311
  
  How many of these are believers and how many are not? If they truly want to be left alone, they would stay away from where they feel they are not wanted.
  
  In answering the OP. Many are intolerant because they feel they are superior in some way. Some believe themselves to be more intelligent and think others are fools. Some think their life experiences apply to everyone and should be followed.
  
  Not many are intolerant of sin. Only believers are. Most who post here believe they have no sin. In other words, everything they do is good and will always be good no matter what it is that they do. They believe themselves to be perfect while proclaiming humility. Reminds me of an old song I used to hear on the radio. "Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, when you're perfect in every way."
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It's a public forum, something you seem to overlook? Nice try.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes it is indeed a public forum. But look over their posts. Constantly accusing believers of posting hatred and being condescending when they are doing the attacking and making condescending remarks. Passive aggressive posts come from non believers also while accusing believers of being passive aggressive.
  
  Constant insults come from some non believers and when someone raises up and calls them on it, that person is spreading hate and fear.
  
  Definition of HYPOCRITE
  
  1: a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
  
  2: a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings
  
  Not all hypocrites are believers.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I post more than anyone else in the forums, and you're telling me to look over their posts, like I don't already do that.
  I've read my share, however, believers don't help themselves.
  What is it with people and the usage of "passive aggressive" wording- it's an oxymoron and an illusion. It's either passive or aggressive? One or the other, but cannot be both.
  Insults? Are subjective based on one's inability to deal or accept self.
  
  Again, it's a public forum. It's part of membership of Hubpages.
  
  Anything else? If that's all you have, then you have nothing.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You digging more holes Cag??
  
  You're something else.. Conflicts just follow you everywhere..
  
  I love you Cag..
  
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Like your post isn't conflict?
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You mean that I love you??
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Sir Dent calling it like he sees it
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Trying to answer a question like the OP - "What is the Root Cause of Intolerance?" is not well served by simply providing an example of it - intolerance, I mean, not its root cause. <Sigh>
  
  This is exactly what keeps any of us from ever being able to have a conversation. We can only ever debate, argue, discuss. We can never simply exchange thoughts or ideas, as conversation is meant to do. The minute someone offers an idea or a thought contrary to one of our own, we attempt to eviscerate them verbally. Or, like children often do - stomp our feet, glare at them, and tell them we don't like them anymore and they should go away.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  If you look at my previous post you will see that is part of the answer I gave to what Cagsil wrote.
  
  My answer to the OP was below it.
  
  In answering the OP. Many are intolerant because they feel they are superior in some way. Some believe themselves to be more intelligent and think others are fools. Some think their life experiences apply to everyone and should be followed.
  
  Not many are intolerant of sin. Only believers are. Most who post here believe they have no sin. In other words, everything they do is good and will always be good no matter what it is that they do. They believe themselves to be perfect while proclaiming humility. Reminds me of an old song I used to hear on the radio. "Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, when you're perfect in every way."
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I remember that song, it was pretty funny. I haven't heard it for a while, but it was good for a laugh.
  I don't think denying religion has anything to do with thinking we are perfect though, or that we are never wrong.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SirDent, with very sincere respect, I read through every post on the forum prior to making my own. I even read through your original response to the OP. I pulled the particular statement that I did, though, because it sort of illustrates how an actual attempt at discussion becomes intolerant. I had no intention of insulting you - just to show that even in talking of the root cause of intolerance, we can rarely be tolerant. And she didn't ask about the intolerance of sin - she asked about intolerance in general. Everyone's need to come out on top turned it into something different.
  
  Again, my apologies if my post appeared insulting in any way. It certainly wasn't intended to. The assumption that I didn't read the entire thread, though, was a bit unwarranted.
  
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I don't believe I'm perfect. I also don't believe I'm rotten to the core
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Anytime a person claims a moral high ground, they imply that they are perfect. Anytime a believer is ridiculed for their belief, the person doing the ridiculing is making a claim to be more perfect.
  
  No one said you were rotten to the core. Christianity says all men are sinners but God made a way out. All one must do is believe in Jesus Christ and that God raised Him from the dead while confessing it with your mouth.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Believers are the ones who make the claim of a higher moral ground, because they are using a god's will of morality as their standing, which is supposedly the highest stand one can take. So, please...blow smoke that makes some sense.
  No one is perfect, this is common knowledge and ridiculing someone's belief isn't always ridicule, but happens to be truth refused.
  That's the problem Sir, what god?
  Again, we've had this conversation in the pass and it's obvious, that it's going to be had again. Jesus' teachings had nothing to do with religion or a god. It's ironic that believers have been suckered into believing the lies religion has sold them.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus' teachings had nothing to do with religion or a god
  
  Care to expand a little-Im interested.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SirDent. Ageed. Very well stated.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  how is having a realistic and healthy view of myself taking a higher moral ground? The only ones I see claiming a higher moral ground are the believers
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SirDent, You hit the nail right on the mark on both replies. This is a public forum, but no one has a right to barge in to attack chistians because of their faith. Everything the unbelievers are accusing christians of is a reflection of themselves. I have not seen one post where a christian have atacked a unbeliever because they do not believe that God exist.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  you can't be very observant then
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am more observant than what you think Bailey. Feel free to show me a reply from a christian who personally attacked an atheist for not believing God exist. Do you believe an atheist is entitled to attack a christian because of their faith?
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I've been called Beelzebub, schitzo, judgemental, hateful, bitter, unable to love, liar, Hitler by HP christians here because they didn't like what I said. Pretty sure you used some of those words too
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Bailey, Actually, I was requesting for you to point out a reply from a christians who enter the forums to attack atheists. You changed the subject. I have stated that you were bitter or hateful toward God. It was quite obvious in the words that were used. I don't think you are a hateful person. There are many christans who love God. Why do you feel the need to say demeaning, negatives things about God in a attempt to knock our faith? Let me clarify, I never called you hateful.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  'I have stated that you were bitter or hateful toward God...I never called you hateful.' So which is it then?
  
  I didn't change the subject. I said what some christians here have personally attacked me.
  I am a real person. Whether god exists or not is a matter of dispute.
  Besides, what have I said that is hateful? Please quote me
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bailey, I guess I didn't make myself clear enough. I never stated that you were a hateful person. I stated that you were hateful toward God. For some reason, your are determined to label it as a personal attack. It's not kind to twist my words Bailey, but I love you anyway. Everyone is a real person. I prefer not to quote without viewing it first. If I quote it wrong, you might call me a liar.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  WOC - I've called you up on this before.
  Whether you say I'm hateful towards god or santa, you're still saying I'm hateful. And then you say I twist your words.
  
  You won't quote me, because I think you'd have a hard time finding anywhere I've used hate speech. You asked me to back up my claims, and I provided examples, which don't seem to satisfy you. You can't/won't back up your personal accusations against me
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I also called you up when you were using poor sarcastic humor concerning Noah and the ark, and then you tried to justify your behavior. Trust me, I was not angry when I saw the words on that particular thread. I just wasn't expecting it to come from you. It would be best to ask me why have I not quoted you whether than come up with false assumptions. Please kindly read my post below. Your claims is not what I requested to begin with. There is hate speech from you on several threads stating that God is a murderer and attacking the believer's faith. I simply choose not to quote you, and dig up threads and post it here. One can look on the recent threads to view themselves. I am sorry you took me the wrong way by thinking I said you were hateful. Take care.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  WOC - go ahead and find those threads to show just how 'hateful' they really are. Be specific, if you're going to make such accusations.
  
  As for joking about Noah's ark - plenty of christians make atheist jokes on here.
  
  Pointing out the facts that your bible portrays god as a murderer is not hate speech. Whether god exists or not is debatable anyway.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  you asked for some examples:
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/55350#post1259738
  "Atheists are evil. Anyone who denies God is evil. I watch these forums but rarely comment and the Atheists are incredibly nasty. I rarely see a hateful comment from a Christian but the Atheists specialize in hate. Then by transference they accuse Christians of being "haters.""
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/55278#post1256761
  "Hi sandra, you seem to have experience some painful things in your life, and it has cause you to be very bitter. "
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/70468#post1542599
  I can't take trying to explain things to someone who is so hateful towards God in the first place"
  "et sometimes I hear you having the capacity to judge and denergrade Christians ,that you do not know either?"
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/50349#post1163379
  Wonder which one of our resident Satan whisperers you are really?
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/64181
  
  "This is a shameful, demeaning section that smacks of being inspired by demons....This kind of thought can only come from the blackest of hearts." (to Joyous)
  "Don't mind the insults from the demon-possessed." (on Magnoliaz's Hitler hub)
  "Beelzebub wrote: (then quoted me)...You are not simply misinformed; You are lying throught your teeth...You have served your master well."
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wow BB you sure seem to have an axe to grind, and have been busy digging up a little aray of arrows there.
  
  I cant help wondering though ,are you pissed at anyone in particular or just having a kinda general rant
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, she was asked for links like those.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ok ,still whats the point?
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I was asked to provide examples and you still criticise
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, asking what the point of it all was not critising..
  
  Mercy me!!!
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  well what sort of answer do you expect? You sound like a smart-a#@ saying 'what's the point?'
  
  I was asked to justify with real comments from real threads (otherwise I'm a liar, apparently). Looks like it was a waste of time, as you lot don't care anyway
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Are they like horse whisperers?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bailey, Please read above to my first post post to you. These links are not related to what I kindly requested. Here it go again. "Feel free to show me a reply from a christian who personally attacked an atheist for not believing God exist." Thank you for sharing the links. I find it hard to believe that you think I personally attacked this individual. Bitterness were obvious in her message, and I politely called it for what is. It was just that simple. Many times you take my comments on the forums and twist them the wrong way. I am not mad at you. I still love you.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't see any bitterness in her message, plus she said you were wrong in drawing that conclusion. You've said the same to me, and I wasn't bitter.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "How many of these are believers and how many are not?"
  
  I'm a believer!!
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I couldnt leave her ,if I tried (oops wrong thread)
  
  I love God and Im not perfect (Hes not finished with me yet)
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yea I think I said before ' I go to the threads I'm interested in'
  
  P.S Sir D, Do we get a prize
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus has your reward waiting for you.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you very much Sir Dent for proving my point. I love it.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Does a lil victory dance~~~
  
  Do I get a Amen!!
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you EK. Something I can now remember about you.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oh Cags, you should see me dance to and with Motown !
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm going to savor this thread....it's now become priceless.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Amen Kiwi!!
  
  Amen....
  
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Another. This just gets better.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Eaglekiwi, Praise God!
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Praise and thankyou Lord for Hubpages and having vision to read and enjoy all these people from all over the world
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  half on the list are believers, but I doubt they believe exactly what you believe
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That speaks volumes for Christian intolerance, SirDent.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  @Brenda. Are you real?
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  For sure.
  I even was listed on the latest U.S. Census, and for 50-some years before that. The better question isn't whether I'm real or not; it's more like.....what about you?
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm surprised.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm surprised.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not at all surprised that, me having answered your questions several times on this, you have consistently ignored my questions.
  Whatever! Silence is sometimes an answer in itself.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  @Brenda, I paid you the utmost respect (as I would anybody before responding to them) and going to your hubpage profile reading up about you, plus reading a few of your articles.
  
  My conclusion is that you are not the kind of person one can discuss anything with. You so completely believe the myths that have been sold to you that it is impossible to have a rational conversation with you. If you will insist that just because you believe something, and just because you have had certain feelings, and just because a 2000 year old book (that has been rewritten many times makes you right, then it is impossible for anyone to discuss anything with you. You're completely closed to questioning your own belief system.
  
  Ergo, I'm sorry, i can't talk to you.
  
  No disrespect intended.
  
  I admire your zeal to do good for others, but I believe it is the bible that says that misplaced zeal is not the wisest thing on earth.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "My conclusion is that you are not the kind of person one can discuss anything with."
  
  Nonsense.. Many, many of us discuss many, many things with Brenda and find no problems.
  
  It's the accusations that we're fools because of our beliefs that makes things difficult for you. People that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones...
  
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, obviously you can discuss things with her. You believe the same mystical pie in the sky.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  But we disagree on things within the belief.
  
  BTW, that's a perfect example of throwing stones.. "You believe the same mystical pie in the sky."
  
  To call our God "...pie in the sky." or anything about Him that, is disrespectful. We aren't telling you that what you believe in is mystical. Please find one post. We allow you to draw your own conclusion. I think we deserve the same privilege.
  
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, you disrespect yourself when you speak about it. And, yet you've not clue about what I am talking about.
  Of course not, because they you would be lying.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hunh.. Where'd you come from?
  
  It's ok...
  
  I love you still, never changes..
  
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed. Brenda and I have discussed many great things. She is a compassionate down to earth person.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  now what was it Brenda said a few months ago about the young man that committed suicide after being filmed with his (gay) partner?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Will you please tell me exactly what did she say without twisting her reply to fit your view?
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I hope Baileybear will do so. Since he/she insists on bringing up homosexuality in the middle of a conversation about Catholicism and Christianity, that's still okay with me. Apparently my views on homosexuality have caused much thought from people. Maybe sometime one of them will actually consider the right view of it instead of the wrong one. I can only hope, and in the meantime field their insults of God's word.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am giving her opportunity to explain for herself in case I quoted her wrong. The jist of what I got is the young man deserved it because of his life of immorality - but that's just my recollection
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Your recollection is biased.
  However, I myself wouldn't mind if you can find my exact quote. I would think I may have said something about the consequences of that lifestyle, yes, but most definitely not in the manner you wish to portray. I'm just as sure that it wasn't the uncompassionate things you would like to accuse me of.
  
  What thread might it have been in? I've actually been trying to find it myself. I'm perfectly willing to discuss whatever I actually said. Much better than letting you keep up with your twisted gossip about it.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, your views have caused much thought. I hope so too. Some do not tolerate the word of God at all.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bailey, that's why I didn't prefer to answer your question. The exact quote is needed for the discussion to go anywhere.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  wouldn't let me reply to posts below.
  
  Here's the thread which you can read in full. I just re-read it and still get the impression that Brenda was more concerned about the young man's 'sinful' lifestyle than those that committed a hate crime against him
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/55357#post1257750
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks for the link.
  I don't have time to re-read the entire thread right now, but will later. The posts on the first and second page that I did re-read....are posts I stand by, and which, incidentally, of course do NOT indicate any such thing as the rumor you seemed to want to perpetuate.
  But indeed it's typical of the type of liberal accusations I've received many times here. I'm used to it by now. Still doesn't make it right, and I consider you owe me an apology.
  By the way, even in just those first few pages, there are several things said by others that are fodder for much more outcry than anything I said. The new fad of trying to label right, wrong, and wrong, right, and to blame all ills on conservatives, is in full swing since the liberals took over our national Government.
  
  Do me a favor, please? From here on out, refrain from making snap judgements of my words and perpetuating false gossip.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, I remember reading that thread, and your words did not indicate what you have been accused of above. I agree with you about the new fad. It's very strong nowadays.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, I don't see why I should have to apologise for not sharing WOC's opinion that you are 'compassionate & down-to-earth'.
  
  As for accusations of 'false gossip' I'll take this to the other comment made in the middle of this thread, as this part won't allow posting.
  
  PS - US politics have nothing to do with me
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lovemychrisposted 13 years ago
Root cause of intolerance: I am better than you.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  !!!!
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  i.e.
  
  Pride??
  
  Agreed.
  
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
I have never meet a person that isn't intolerant for something or someone.

Some people just like that feling SOooo much that this is where they focus all of their attention ... thus creating HELL for themselves and everyone in their immediate enviroment.

So, Yes I would say that the fires of HELL are contained within the spirit of mankind.
And just like a big ole belly laff; they can't controll it.
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Motown2Chitownposted 13 years ago
My opinion is worth little in the grand scheme of things, and worth even less in the world of the HubPages forum, but personally, just_curious, I think it all boils down to our amazing ability as human beings to generalize. I've seen it in this thread and countless others. Certain posters responding to the posts of others generalize that because one person said such-and-such, then they believe all of this-and-that as well. So, with no regard for what that person might actually believe about everything they believe, the posters argue, debate, accuse, ridicule, and yes - attack - the poster to whom they're responding. My opinion is that most human beings do not want to understand. They want to win. They want to be right. And, they will tell anyone at all who may speak or think differently about any issue at all that they are wrong - thus achieving their goal.

One of the posters in this thread, for example, is very adamant about how ALL of one group does a specific thing ALL the time. My question is: does that person know EVERY SINGLE PERSON who happens to claim a label that places them in that group? My guess is no. So, how is it then, that that poster is able to speak for not only all of THAT group, but all of the group he/she appears to claim the label of?

It's a generalization issue - and, in my opinion, an "I wanna win at whatever cost," issue.
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  lovemychrisposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am guilty of that! My BF tells me all the time, "You always have to be right!"
  
  Good analysis M2C!
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you, lovemychris. It just seems to make the most sense to me. We're just people - all of us. No better than anyone else. I fear that's the actual cause of such behavior. Some of us recognize that and try desperately to BE better. Being better than someone else is often far less work than just being ourselves.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Motown, Agreed. I have read several posters on the forums stating that all christians think they are better than others. It's called sterotype, assuming everyone is just alike.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Did ya remember to water the spring frecks.
  
  I think mine are spreading a little, so I figure by 2012, they will have all joined up an vola ,mercy me 'Im a new creation'
  Eat ya heart out J'Lo!
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hahaha! I have, in fact, with hubby's reminders, been watering them. Growing quite nicely, btw.
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Stevennix2001posted 13 years ago
All I will say is this. I can understand where both parties are coming from on this, but the one thing that pisses me off is this. It seems all these people whine and gripe about religious forums are always the same people who contribute to it more than everyone else. Not only that, but their logic is too much of a double standard if you ask me. As i seem to recite one atheist say it's their right to teach their belief in there's no god to others, as it spreads peace; while condemning other religions for passing their views onto others. Can anyone besides me see the double standard logic besides me? I know I can't be the only one that observes this. Look, my thoughts are is this. WHO CARES! You want to believe in a god, then fine believe in one. If you don't, then don't. Nobody puts a gun to your head to believe in god, or not. And please don't bring up how over the years people have been killed for not believing in a certain type of god, as I'm well aware of it. However, i'm damn sure it doesn't apply to everyone in this forum, as i'm sure nobody is putting a gun personally to YOUR head at this time, so it's irrelevant.

Besides, what a person believes in is nobodies business but their own. Hell, I'm a christian, and I've been friends with people that were into voodoo, wicca and various other religions, and it never bothered me. the only thing we expected of each other was respect. i don't think that's too much to ask for right? Hell, i even met quite a few atheists in real life that i have a lot of respect for. however, we never try to pass our beliefs onto each other, as we all respect each other's differences. Get the point?

as one hubber eluded to, their right. it is an online public forum, where anyone can participate if they like. however, it doesn't mean you have to. if you don't like something, then don't participate in it. this is just like the michael moore thread, where I told people that the more you talk about the man, the more you're giving him what he wants. Want to know why? because statistically speaking, the michael moore haters see his films more often than the fans do. Therefore, you're actually helping him by talking about him. however, everyone on that thread seemed to have ignored that comment and blew it off as nonsense. however, it still reigns true. for if we just ignored him, then he'd go away, and you wouldn't have to worry about him anymore.

same thing with religious forums. don't like it? don't participate in it. it'll die out with less followers of those threads, and you won't have to worry about them anymore. However, what do i know, right?
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well said.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bet that felt good to get off youre chest
  
  Just teasin ,well written, and gotta love the logic.
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks motown.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "However, what do i know, right?"
  
  I'll answer that.. You know a good bit worth sharing.
  I think I'll second all of that except for three four letter words..
  
  Excellent post.
  
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks vector. I appreciate the high praise. To be honest, I was kind of on the fence posting that, but I'm glad I did.
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  Beth100posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
  Bang on Steven. Oh, I heard this works with trolls and sock puppets too.
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  thanks beth. that means a lot coming from a lovely lady such as yourself. yeah, you're right. i guess it can work for those things too, as that's a good point.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Great points in your reply Stevennix.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bet that felt good to get off youre chest
  
  Just teasin ,well written, and gotta love the logic.
  
  ( posted this under someone else's post)
  
  Got all befuddled
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks WOC. I appreciate the compliment
  
  @eaglekiwi
  
  it's okay. i know you were busy doing your little dance, so there's no worries.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  oh youuuu
  
  For the record this ole girls still got some moves~
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sure you do.
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Kiwi is a nut..
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  A Kiwi Nut, now theres a nifty spin for Planters lol
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  vector7posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There's a new link to a page I found about Hell on my homepage.
  
  Crazy...
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Beth100posted 13 years ago
root causeS of intolerance = ignorance, closed mindedness, control over others, selfishness, disrespect

basically it's all about the ME factor
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Pretty much what I said - just a much more condensed version. Great answer.
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  Stevennix2001posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep, as always Beth, your responses are always spot on.
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Cagsilposted 13 years ago
Hmmmm...looks like everyone is happy with themselves.

What a priceless thread. Just too cool.

It certainly was a pleasurable learning event. I love it.
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Cagsilposted 13 years ago
*basks in knowing and seeing....

Anyone else want to contribute.....I'm just loving this.
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BunuBobuposted 13 years ago
Well Intolerance develops over time.

There is a possible genetic link to lactase deficiency (lactase is the enzyme that digests lactose in milk, I think).
It could also be caused by injury to the small intestine.

Best to avoid milk based products if you have the symptoms.
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Cagsilposted 13 years ago
It's truly amazing how little the religious actually know about their own religion.

Boy this thread is getting better and better all the time.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Man - I love it when 2 religionists get into fighting about wot god sed.
  
  Still - at least they have stopped burning each other at the stake for it.
  
  Go Protestants!!!!!
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't see anyone fighting.
  Discussing, yes.
  
  Boy, you and Cags are so easily entertained!
  
  I had cake-cheesecake for breakfast this morning. Does that tickle you two? Or does that bristle your intolerant personalities? LOL
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Intolerant?
  
  Gays and liberals?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, They don't seem to know the difference of a discussion and a fight.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No kidding!
  And many of them like to instigate a fight when there is none, and/or compound any argument that does come up.
  
  Well...I've just spent the last 20 minutes trying to find a quote of what I might've said that Baileybear likes to spread around with his or her own interpretation attached to it.
  I've searched several old threads, but so far haven't found it.
  
  If Baileybear or anyone can find the exact quote and refer me to it via the exact thread, unedited, then I will discuss it with anyone.
  
  But in the meantime, it's very annoying to be accused like Baileybear has accused me. But getting very boring too.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I remember that particular thread if I am not mistaken, but I can't recall the exact title. The word gays was used in the title. Maybe someone will found it.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, as for these 'accusations' against you, I merely didn't agree with WOC's opinion that you are 'compassionate & down-to-earth'.
  
  I find it ironic that christians ask atheists to show tolerance for their belief in an invisible being & get told they are going to hell, yet christians like yourself do not show much tolerance for gays & catholics with the comments you've made. eg this thread
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/70992#post1549529
  
  Brenda:
  
  "There is nothing I or anyone can do about it now. It would be good if we could! But there is no hope.
  "If Tyler were still alive and I had the opportunity to tell him anything, I'd tell him that there is forgiveness for those who repent of any sin, and that he's very talented and has the same chance as anyone else of living a well-balanced, joyful life. I'd tell him that everyone at some time does something shameful and wrong
  f you are to say that they knew it was wrong, and that it was a deliberate act of assault to put the video online, then.....the young person who died also knew that what he was doing was wrong, and should be responsible for his own actions too.
  "The truth is that I think it's a horribly sad situation, and I have compassion for Tyler. But it's too late to do anything about his mindset now.
  I would've hoped that he would've been taught that there is forgiveness to be had for all sins, and that he would have somehow found the way to resolve his inner conflict."
  
  Replies to Brenda: "No, I pointed out exactly what you said, with your words as you wrote them in response to the OP--that is the original subject to which I am still trying to stick and from which you are still trying to run. As usual. Any rancor you detect is born of your flagrant refusal to see the paradoxical nature of your "loving" desire to see the "sinners choose the right path" while admitting that you wouldn't allow them choose that path were it determined to be genetically possible to do so. In a small child or even a teenager, this sort of willful ill-logic is easily dismissed, but in someone of, in theory, adult age who is as active as you are, it's dangerous and must be countered with reason and a type of goodwill that does not come with so many strings."
  "Wrong. I insisted nothing about that kid because I couldn't (and still haven't) gotten you past the point of your paradoxical position yet.
  
  "And frankly, you using his first name with such casual familiarity, acting like you care in the same breath you tacitly condemn him to hell is nauseating.
  
  "All I can do is stare into my screen and shake my head in awe when I read the things you say.
  
  " I would tell him that the world is full of snakes and vipers who will pretend to care about him, but whose love comes with conditions and judgments. I would tell him not to listen to them, to ignore those whose dark hearts are masked by saccharin words of pseudo-piety, poison that drips acidic from the fanged mouths of hypocrites and fools and falls hissing at his feet. I would tell him he should be strong and push through the difficult time of youth, when the opinions of others weigh most heavily, and that there are many who will truly love him, despite what some hateful people say, especially those who corrupt the memory of Jesus and try to steal his glory for themselves. That's what I'd tell him."
  
  "???!!!
  
  Put his shoes on, be video taped while you have sex with someone and then state clearly what that feels like. How far from the bridge would you stay?"
  
  "Conscience bothering him. That is just twisted.
  Your bigotry on this subject is sadly very well documented throughout HP forums. Not only are you constantly beating a dead horse you are also constantly wrong in doing so. "Tyler" was doing whatever he was doing in the privacy of his own space. He had every reason and every right to expect it to remain private. The fact that your own perverted sense of right and wrong leads you to believe that his being engaged in homosexuality gave these no doubt good upstanding christians the right to invade that privacy is not only truly sad but horrifying. "
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I stand by my post.
  
  The part about "there is no hope" is based on the fact that, after a person is dead, there is no more opportunity to repent of sins. That must be done while a person lives and breathes and is able to make decisions.
  Now, of course apparently no one besides God knows whether Tyler accepted Christ before he died. So, in that sense, his loved ones who are still alive can, of course, hold onto the hope that possibly he did get forgiveness at the last minute or second, or that God will hold him unaccountable because of his mental state at the time. That I don't know, and only God does!
  
  And in that other thread, I did indeed hold those other two young people ALSO responsible for THEIR actions.
  
  Thanks Joy56, and Woman of Courage as always, and SirDent and anyone else who input some common sense and Biblical fact into the controversy.
  
  All that being said, and with the clarifications I posted, I think I've been about as tolerant of the accusations and anti-Christian posts as I'm gonna be. The modern liberal call for "tolerance" isn't all it's cracked-up to be, because there are many things a person should NOT tolerate. The reactions in this thread have proven that it is indeed non-believers who are more intolerant than Christians, for sure! I now exercise my right to be intolerant of false accusations and anti-Christian sentiment if I wish. Meaning, for right now at least, I'm gonna go find better threads to read, hopefully avoiding anymore of that ilk from you Baileybear or whoever else.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda, The things you would have told Tyler if you had the opportunity reveals that you are indeed compassionate. Everything you have written is just common sense. The reactions in this thread have proven that it is indeed some unbelievers are intolerant of christians in the first place. You are right. I don't know anyone who tolerates everything. One should ask if they do not understand something before jumping to false conclusions. May the force be with you. Praise God.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  meanwhile, your belief is that Tyler went to hell for homosexuality. Yet, you say you have compassion. Or is that sympathy, because he didn't 'get saved' first?
  
  Your beliefs and personal opinions are just that - based on interpretation of your 'holy book'. They are not facts that all people must live by.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Bailey, I am sorry, but you need to wake up or visit Lenscrafters. Where do you you see in my reply that I believe he went to hell?? I have no idea if Tyler repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and Savior before he committed suicide. It's not nice of you to put words in my mouth and spread lies. It seems you are holding a grudge against Brenda and I and you are determined to tear us down. It's not going to work. We love God and we love people. Lastly, the holy bible is factual with Godly morals for everyone to live by whether they choose to or not. When we live by Godly morals, things work out well. With self-made moral, nothing gets accomplished. Take a look at the world around you.
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Let me just see something. Do you agree with the godly moral of stoning rape victims to death for not crying out in public?
  
  Do you agree with the godly moral of killing anyone who tries to lead you away from god?
  
  If you dont, then why? Is it because the morals that you follow are your own and not the godly morals from the bible?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Will you kindly show me scriptures in the bible concerning this?
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  and if he didn't 'accept jesus as savior' prior to death, what then?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why ask me? Didn't you read the bible when you were a christian?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Is called provocation
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That is how you see. Not surprising.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, is how Webster sees it
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Which influences how you see.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Who is the authority Cags ,on word defination that is ?
  
  (Actually I grew up using the Oxford Dictionary) but I think for Americans it would be Webster?)
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  and you don't provoke?
  
  In my book it's standing up against hypocrisy & double-standards.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hey WOC, don't put me into the same category with Mark. He is an atheist and I am not. Do try to keep up.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ok, I have noticed you said that before. Isn't an atheist someone who doesn't believe God exist?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  An Atheist has a clear definition for a specific ideology. Atheist have a belief that no god exist.
  
  I am of no belief whatsoever on the topic. I've no religion affiliation whatsoever and depending on what country you are in- Atheism is a religion, determined by government classification.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Let me make sure I get this straight. You believe that you are your own God right?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  My understanding is the word "god" is just a metaphor. I am my own authority and I rule myself through proper use of my conscience.
  
  Metaphor "god" = Self Mastery. Master of self, knowing/understanding/acceptance/love of self.
  
  Hope that clears up any confusion.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I was not confused. I am not surprised with your view of your own understanding. Remember, no one knows and understands everything.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The confusion was the difference between Mark and myself.
  At least I am honest with myself.
  Everything is a large term. If you're insinuating/referencing unknown and known...then obviously you would be correct. But, if you are referencing known...then it is possible for one to know everything that is already known.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mark, I didn't realize that answering a question that was posed sincerely was participating in a fight. She asked, I answered. No more, no less. You might notice that neither of us has drawn a sword to lop off the others' head - but I'm fairly sure you won't be looking that closely.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Dear me. You obviously do not know what Brenda thinks of Catholics.
  
  But sure - Katholics never fought anyone and your religion is not nonsense. Like I said - at least you have stopped burning people at the stake for not believing nonsense.
  
  Oh wait - that doesn't matter any more right?
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yup - I know exactly what Brenda thinks of Catholics. She stated it quite clearly during our conversation.
  
  What matters to me is now and what comes next.
  
  It very obviously still matters to you.
  
  Be well.
  
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes it does. I am a keen student of history and see you repeating the same things now. It matters to me what comes next - but I prefer to learn from the past.
  
  Pity you don't.
  
  Be realistic and honest.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I strive to be both realistic and honest. It is apparently my failing that you do not recognize the effort.
  
  When you know me, I will gratefully accept your pity. Until then, I will simply continue to wish you well in your endeavors.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Realistic and Invisible Super Beings do not go well together. I don't pity you at all. What makes you think that?
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I misread....rather you find me pitiful. In that case, by all means, carry on.
  
  And, while I know that you would love for me to get into a deep and meaningful discussion about my inability to accept reality, I'm too lazy to put that much effort into a discussion with you. As I said in my initial response to the OP, I'm not in it to win it. That ultimately means that playing with me will be no fun for you.
  
  Cheers.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I do not find you pitiful either - what gives you that idea? I completely understand the comfort you derive from believing as you do and ignoring reality. Neither am I trying to "win" anything other than maybe get you to see why your irrational beliefs cause so many conflicts. If you see that and change - I guess I could "win" something ion making the world a better place?
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Okay, for the sake of...I don't know, sanity I guess, and with the full knowledge that this will be a futile attempt, I will ante up and address your concerns.
  
  The fact that you believe I find it comfortable to believe as I do, and that I ignore reality means that you A) Do not know me even one whit, and B) Have no concept of the actual, very REAL circumstances in my life. Trust me, they are often incredibly UN-comfortable. But, you hang on to that pre-conceived notion if you must. I cannot dispel it for you, nor do I feel the need to do so.
  
  I believe, as you do, that religion has caused many, many - perhaps even innumerable conflicts over history. While I have mentioned in other posts that there are other things that have perpetuated that sense of conflict throughout continued history, that is not a denial that religion has its share of responsibility. It is simply an assertion that religion (contrary to your frequently towed line) is not the only source of human conflict in human history. Acknowledging that religion has played its part, however, makes me no more able to change it than I was responsible for creating it in the first place. Hence, my concern for now and what comes next.
  
  You will, unfortunately, be unsuccessful in attempting to change my "irrational" beliefs. I guess I'm just too far gone for that. In that regard, you have lost, and for that I am sorry. BUT, I guarantee that I have never (and do not ever intend to do so) begun a conflict over religion. I have posed questions about the subject in a sincere (and scornfully mocked) attempt to understand the different beliefs (or lack of belief) of my fellow human beings. I do not see that as an attempt to incite conflict. I see it as a genuine attempt to understand those whose race and history I share. If more of us were willing to do that, we might be able to make now a little better, and ensure a future a little less filled with hatred and intolerance.
  
  So, you have won, in that you have now seen me admit that religion does in fact cause conflict. You have lost in that you have not managed to sway me from my "irrational" beliefs. I have neither won nor lost, I have simply spoken my piece. Take it or leave it. I know from past experience that you find very little that I have to say of value or meaning, but perhaps someone else who happens to read this actually will. See, I too am a student of history - and a fairly astute one at that.
  
  As always, I wish you all the best in your continued endeavors to better the world around you.
  
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No - I understand that your need to cling to your irrational beliefs outweighs the potential conflicts you may cause.
  
  I get that. We all see that quite clearly. This is why your religion causes so many conflicts. Pity you don't care.
  
  I will keep trying to explain - as Jesus did.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Do you even actually read what people post in response to you?
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That is why it is necessary for mankind to remove all of that which causes such conflict in the world, no matter what the source.
  
  Yet, the source of conflict will always be there where others can take it up and cause conflict. If you embrace the source of such conflicts, mankind will never be rid of it. All you will manage to accomplish is to perpetuate the source of conflict, and that alone is causing conflict.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you for playing. Didn't realize anyone thought I was still in the game...lol
  
  Belief in God is destructive and causes conflict when misused for personal gain or triumph. I do not USE my belief for either of those two things. Unless I tell it to someone, they are unaware that I even hold those beliefs. If expressing it to someone is discomfiting to them, I'm just as quick to hold back.
  
  To each his own.
  
  Conflict is perpetuated when I, in response to the differences of another, choose to beat my head against a wall in the hope that the other's skull will crack. That is what happens when people continue to try to slam what they believe down someone else's throat. I choose not to do that, therefore, what conflict others begin may very well end with me.
  
  Or it may not.
  
  When you've found a way to eliminate from
  the world everything and everyONE who causes conflict, you shall then be lauded as a great hero, and there will be, at last, a Utopia.
  
  I'm content to do my best until the end of my days to be gracious to, and respectful of my fellow human beings. Should others find those attitudes combative or find that they cause conflict, I will immediately amend them.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  And yet, you are presenting your beliefs here for all the world to see.
  
  So, you don't follow your religious tenets of evangelism? Why not?
  
  I understand the religious believers notion of creating a Utopia, but that really isn't the quest of mankind. If believers can simply focus their attention on mankind rather than their invisible gods, perhaps then can we reduce the conflict substantially.
  
  I seriously doubt that.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You may seriously doubt whatever you choose. That is well within the scope of your human freedom. I have spoken the truth about what I can do (and have done). Again, you may freely choose to doubt whatever you will.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, there are many believers here claiming they have spoken the truth and tell us what they have done and will continue to do.
  
  That's why there is so much conflict in the world.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wouldn't it be nice if everyone causing the conflict would step up to the plate and share the blame. Sadly, you prove thats not going to happen.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Unfortunately, they won't as they believe they have the right to create conflict by spreading the word of their gods.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I wasn't talking about them only. I was also referring to the schmucks that insist on arguing with them.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  How sad it is for you to resort to name calling. More conflict from believers?
  
  Yes, I understand that believers wish the rest of us would just go away and leave them to their evangelism, letting them spread the gospel across the planet.
  
  The problem is that we have already witnessed the results of that and have had enough of the conflict they have produced and continue to perpetuate.
  
  The big difference though, is that the rest of us use words, rather than swords to get our point across.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, not quite beelzedad. I think we've all graduated from swords. I find it sad how much finger pointing goes on. It shows a true lack of compassion among us all.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Nope, laws have been made so that you're no longer allowed to use swords against people who don't share your beliefs.
  
  Compassion is a human trait, not a religious trait.
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  just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I know.
  
  I know.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Dont worry Motown in my country thats called sh ** stirring.
  
  Quite pathetic isnt it.
  
  Some people must seriously too much time on their hands.
  
  I have thoroughly enjoyed hearing you and Brenda discuss beleivers and their alternative/mainstream values.
  
  Oh I get it unbelievers are here to learn way to go kids!
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah, we learn, but not what you think. Plus, we're entertained.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ah, well, at least we excel at providing solid entertainment.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Learning is good for the edifying of souls.
  
  Laughter is indeed the best medicine.
  
  Ive sure laughed my head off,bent down to pick it up ,and laughed some more
  
  I like you Cags,and Earnest even Mark ,Sir Grumpypants
  
  You all have written such interesting hubs ,and amazing different personalities.
  
  My brain has had a good workout
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Eaglekiwi, You are so funny. I am laughing with tears in my eyes I agree with you. We are learning also.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  And still you two remain?
  
  Hmmm...
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Glad to entertain you Cagsil.
  
  But again, my "religion" is not Catholicism.
  What part of that don't you understand?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Brenda my dear lady, I know you're a 'born-again' Christian, yet fail to actually understand your own religion, simply because you've taken the bible in totality as a truth, which is your whole problem to begin with, but fail to realize it.
  
  To understand Jesus' teaching is to strip it from religion altogether and had you actually research(I spent 10 years doing so), then you would know and understand that Jesus' teachings had nothing to do with religion or a god.
  
  But, thank you for entertainment nonetheless.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wow. Ten years' study brought you to that conclusion!?
  
  Oh my.
  
  Your money and time were ill-spent, I'm sure.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  At least my research wasn't just inside the book you claim as truth and was of the collective knowledge of all of humanity and history. Something you lack.
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  Motown2Chitownposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Cags, I gotta question for you, completely unrelated to this forum thread (sorry, just_curious). Check on this thread and see if you have any wisdom to offer on that question?
  
  http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/71031#post1546560
  
  Thanks!
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thread is now atop the forum list of threads with my response. Unfortunately, it's not something that is going to be beneficial.
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Greek Oneposted 13 years ago
Root cause of intolerance in the world(and poverty among young Greek Canadians)...

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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Who is that good looking guy?
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  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I think he said his name was Satan-something-or-other??
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "Minion" is the word you are looking for.
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  prettydarkhorseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Paulo Coelho?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Better than Peter Gabriel.
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  prettydarkhorseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  they're both good looking.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No when compared to you PDH
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  prettydarkhorseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hi kirsten and Cags. Now, I am shy. Sorry we all bother this thread now.
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  This thread was just begging to be hijacked with cookings, brownies (I'm looking at you Ray *stern glower*) and loveliness, the only cure for intolerance. Sit down with someone for milk and cookies, or brownies and see if you don't want to get along
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  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Marko Knowlente
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kirstenblogposted 13 years ago
Any of you kids wanna cookie?

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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No Thank You Kirsten, I have brownies I recently made and cupcakes my mother also made. But, do appreciate the offer.
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wait! Wait just one minute! You have brownies and haven't offered!
  No wonder everyone is still arguing here
  Don't bogart those brownies bro!
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earnestshubposted 13 years ago
It's 5 in the morning here, and I have a bad case of the munchies, watch ya fingers!
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  is this you earn?
  
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Me on the left.
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I kinda thought so
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I got up at 4.45! Woke up with an idea and went to work. Well, I moved to the office in my undies, to my workstation anyway.
  
  I hate it when my brain does that at 4.45 am!
  Stupid brain!
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I love it when I have the freedom to let my brain do that, wild things seem possible when I can ignore clocks and follow inspiration when it hits for as long as it will carry me
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep! That freedom is priceless.
  I am in my time and space, no others to disturb from sleep. I know how valuable it is to be able to leap out of bed in the middle of the night, shout "Eureka!" and go straight at it.
  I cherish these times.
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I get them for brief periods, when the school is on holiday for a good stretch, I get more and more erratic and productive and creative. I think the contrast helps tho, when used to have the freedom all the time I didn't realise it, now I treasure the time cause I know it will be back to the grind at some point. HP is one of the places I love spending that creative time
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  My situation is a bit the same. I have quite a few hours daily running kids around, looking after them, making meals for them, giving them snacks after school etc, telling stories, dressing in a tu tu....... don't ask.
  
  That is all great time, but when I need solitude I retire to my little bungalow away from the house and enjoy my own company. That space allows me to continue enjoying the luxury of personal space to write study and hopefully produce something worthwhile.
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waynetposted 13 years ago
God, Religion and the bible!
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Just like I woz sayin!
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mrpopoposted 13 years ago
The most common form of intolerance begins with ignorance. Lack of information can be the biggest factor in creating and perpetuating intolerance.

But is every kind of intolerance bad?

I'm not speaking of intolerance out of ignorance, like being intolerant of a different race, gender or sexual preference. I'm speaking of being intolerant to the intolerance, the ignorance, itself.

Should we be tolerant of these things? Or do we not want to speak out against this sort of thing out of fear that it will be labelled as politically incorrect?

For example, the Catholic church does not tolerate the use of contraceptives. Should we tolerate this, knowing that spreading a religious message that contraceptives are evil can be extremely damaging in AIDs ridden countries in Africa (assuming this message has any influence on them)?

Likewise, should we be tolerant to cases where basic ethical standards are not being met? Should we tolerate irresponsibility? Needless violence?

The best way to combat this is by distributing knowledge. I'm not quite sure what the Catholic church has against contraceptives or what reasons they believe it to be evil, but I doubt they're warranted when using contraceptives can prevent the suffering of millions.
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waynetposted 13 years ago
Drinking too much! oh damn that's incontinence!
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No thats peeing too much
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Cagsilposted 13 years ago
But in all seriousness, specific words are metaphors and IF YOU don't know which are, then you are likely to take it out of context.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Don't worry about me. I totally understand what Jesus was telling Nicodemus! And while, yes, many people do not, your assumption that I do not is...very condescending. Especially when you've given no indication that YOU understand what it means. Are you like Nicodemus? In which case, it is you who would need the Scriptures explained to you.
  
  Let's hear it------go ahead and interpret those passages about being born again. Surely you aren't clueless enough to ask, like Nicodemus did, if we can enter again into our mothers' womb and be born again literally......are you?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Of course you would find it condescending, that is what your religion teaches you.
  
  I've tried before and was told by YOU and many others that I was wrong.
  My dear lady, the scriptures are definitely not something I need explained. However, the knowledge with regards to metaphors, when they were developed into human language and what stage the human mind was at, does factor into the context of Jesus' teachings. Not to mention, it would be helpful to also to understand the time frame which Jesus lived. Which, I'm sure you do not know, because your knowledge stems from just reading the bible itself.
  "Born-again" is to see with new eyes- change of view/perception/perspective. And, no- to think that "born-again" to be literal would be foolish.
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awareposted 13 years ago
I feel strongly these days that the lack of civility and tolerance were seeing . Is a result of it not being taught to them in school and its importance emphasized strongly. Most i think will respond to this idea by saying its the parents job to teach that. But at home there are not other kids to hone these skills if taught . .
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
What you say can ? be true? "IF" ...YOUR ...Master of self, knowing/understanding/acceptance/love , comes from the right place.

I am sure Jeffery Dommer felt that he had all those things!
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You're comparing me to a psychopath?
  
  Man, you need to grow up.
  
  As for "comes from the right place"? Maybe you should bang your head against a wall....shake something loose...you're a bit too tight up stair.
  
  Jesus' teachings were about looking within self. Which apparently, you don't do.
  
  I found myself, I've reached into that dark area you refuse to go and found true faith in myself to determine and discern truth about my life.
  
  Too bad you cannot say the same.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  But wait a minute Cags.
  
  Dont you compare me,Christians with some or groups with a similar belief system as being all the same ,no wait ,believing and acting all the same.
  
  Jerami was perhaps thinking you put yourself under the defination ,not the behaviour
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  But you are the same....everything is based on belief.
  
  No so with Mark and Myself.
  
  Mark believes there is no god.
  
  I have no belief with regards to a god. I didn't form an unbelief or non-belief. The topic of a god not existing is known, no belief forming required.
  
  You have a belief in a god. That's no different than religious folks. So, sorry, you go into the same basket as them.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oh you!
  
  You just want your own special basket
  
  I know your type
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm unique, haven't you figured that out yet.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Never doubted that for a second.
  
  (We all are) even if you disagree,doesnt change that fact
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jerami has trouble seeing past himself, long enough to think clearly.
  
  The definition and behavior to him would be no different. He isn't very good at being clear.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Do you think your analysis is correct? or just what you perceive.
  
  I do it myself ,but I dont think assumptions are always correct and to assume so is a little arrogant.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I let his actions speak volumes for him. So, no.
  Suit yourself. I judge actions and other factors.
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
Heres the thing (for me)

If we were all marooned on an island together,do you think we could work together ,without either belief system in operation.

Remember we all have a past and made of many many influences?

Oh now theres a concept huh?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I know you and I would work well together, as long as you were to understand one thing- our survival together was the only matter and end result.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Survival-Yes
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Then we would have no problem.
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
Jerami wrote:
What you say can ? be true? "IF" ...YOUR ...Master of self, knowing/understanding/acceptance/love , comes from the right place.

I am sure Jeffery Dommer felt that he had all those things!
---------------------------------
Cagsil wrote
You're comparing me to a psychopath?
-------

ME
No I didn't! BUT it is too bad that you do not see the flaw in your statement that not everyone that thinks that they are master of self, and thinks that they are knowing/understanding/acceptance/love in their own eyes are realy doing so.
I am sure that Jeffery Dommer doesn't see himself as a psychopath?
-------------

Cagsil wrote
Man, you need to grow up.

As for "comes from the right place"? Maybe you should bang your head against a wall....shake something loose...you're a bit too tight up stair.

---------------

ME
It is an honest man that follows his own advice ..
At least he believes that which comes out of his mouth.
Maybe you should bang your own head against a wall; or have you already done so?
----------

Jesus' teachings were about looking within self. Which apparently, you don't do.

I found myself, I've reached into that dark area you refuse to go and found true faith in myself to determine and discern truth about my life.

- - - - - -

And self is all that you have found?

Myself .... When I am going into the dark places looking to find something; I take a flashlight.
But if banging your head against a wall works for you...
I say ... GOOD FOR YOU.

But don't get so angry when others don't take your advice.
...........
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, you're correct, not everyone think that they are master of self. Which is why people like you, question things that are truth, instead of recognizing them as truth. I'm sorry, if you're unable to see truth when it is biting you in the ass. But, look on the bright side- when truth is not recognized, then people's normal reaction is to be defensive, but apparently you're not wise enough to know or understand that.
  
  Actually, Jeffrey Dommer didn't see himself at all nor did ever understand what a conscience is, something he shares with all other psychopaths.
  
  An honest man teaches those fail to teach themselves.
  The lack of wisdom in your own words shows you've lived too long inside your book.
  Nothing like twisting words to appear the good guy, when you fail to realize that your words always work against you.
  All there is to find is SELF, if you're insinuating to find a god, then apparently you are still looking for self. Keep searching..
  Your humor is witless.
  Again more witless humor.
  You see anger in my words do you? Goes to show you need more help than the average person, please do seek it from the professionals. I cannot help you.
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
Jerami wrote:
No I didn't! BUT it is too bad that you do not see the flaw in your statement that ...
"not everyone that thinks that they are master of self, and thinks that they are"

You even argue in an arguementive fashion.
.................
Cagsil wrote .. NO, you are correct" (What?)
No, you're correct, not everyone think that they are master of self.
Which is why people like you, question things that are truth, instead of recognizing them as truth. I'm sorry, if you're unable to see truth when it is biting you in the ass. But, look on the bright side- when truth is not recognized, then people's normal reaction is to be defensive, but apparently you're not wise enough to know or understand that.
.....

You sound like a VERY Angry little boy! Where did you come up with a statement like that (NOT) from anything that I said.

I am sorry that you can not see how twisted and hypocritical you wisdom (HA HA) actually is..

I have seen you argue with people concerning what they said, forgetting that you said the exact same thing the day before.

Clasic example of "Putting up a sign and then argueing with it"

"IF" you have went into the darkness and found yourself ? as you proclame!
I suggest that, ... "get your hands out of your pockets and open your eyes." You "should" find that you are NOT the center of the universe! And you can never know everything there is to know.

When you find true wisdom, you will discover how little you realy know, and you will quit insulting everyone else in an attempt to elivate yourself (in your own eyes)

A tough guy doesn't have to go around telling everyone how tough they are.

An inteligent person doesn't have to tell anyone how inteligent they are.

A loving person doesn't have to tell anyone how loving that they are.

I am happy that you have found yourself in your own delusion. If it works for you, great.

You don't see that you are PUSHING your beliefs upon others exactly the same as you accuse "The religious people" of doing"

It is human nature that you can not see your own faults except when you see someone else wearing them.
This too will pass ... when you grow up.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Good effort writng this Jerami and effectively get your point across (in my opinion)
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  Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks I have always heard that people can not see their own faults the same way as they can not see the dirt on the back side of their own knees.
  
  It can be done, but it takes a great deal of effort.
  
  Sometimes it seems to be more like, not being able to see the spinache stuck between our teeth, or smell our own ONION breath.
  
  A true friend will let us know ... But then we will problay get angry with them, so they don't.
  
  But a TRUE friend will tell us any way.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Lol thats true.
  
  'Do these pants make me look fat' ?
  
  Fake friend 'No shows your womanly curves'
  
  Real friend'What were thinking when you bought them!! they make you look big as a house!!
  
  Fake is not nice. I admit I have been.
  But Id rather say nothing at all sometimes.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  How odd. I am being a real friend by being honest yet you argue and fight with me. So you do not really want a real friend - you want a fake friend to tell you your beliefs don't make you look fat.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No Im real and I think you prefer me like that.
  
  Fake would have said nothing ever.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  3 options
  
  Tell me Im fat and you dont wanna be fat like me because ..rant rant OR
  
  I think youre fat and I dont wanna be like you. Or
  
  Say nothing about the 'fat' thing, and accentuate all my other fine qualities
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  If you didn't keep telling me you were thin and if I did wot u sed god sed I would be too - we wouldn't even being having this conversation. But you can't stop yourself can you?
  
  No - not going to be a fake friend. Sorry - I am too honest.
  
  See? I said you wanted a fake friend.
  
  Last time I comment on one of your hubs as well. All believers delete what I say when I make a point they wish to pretend does not exist.
  
  This is why your religion causes so much conflict.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ok.
  
  No you commented twice on my hub ,at great length too.
  
  Dont imply otherwise
  
  (didnt want my hub to filled up with same 'ole same ole from you or me)
  I dont think Hubs should be a 'forum' as such.
  
  No wars today ,they have been cancelled due to lack of interest.
  
  Its a joke Mark for goodness sake lighten up.
  
  Youre gonna give ya'self a damn ulcer.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You deleted the third comment because I made a point you do not want to acknowledge. I will never comment of one your hubs again.
  
  ciao
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Make it here then ,oh thats right you have already
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Dint even read it did ya?
  
  Hardly surprising your religion is responsible for so many conflicts.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hey EK, if you agree, then you're not any better than him. And, that's really a shame.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I will never agree with attacking people Cags ( you should know me a little better than that)
  
  I did however agree with some of his points and I think English is not Jerame first language hence the effort he made ,putting pen to paper (so to speak).
  
  If someone ,anyone ,I include myself can make his point without calling the other person an idiot or laughing/mocking I reckon thats not a bad start to a healthy discussion.
  
  Condenscending remarks are surely communication barriers.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Again, it is not attacking. What is with people? It's always an attack, attack, attack......WOW!
  
  Apparently, he more issues than English being his first language.
  It would be, but it's always best to point out things that are more than obvious to those who actually have their eyes open and not talking from ego they cannot see beyond.
  Condescending remarks are usually seen only because of ego of the individual who refuses to see truth or accept it.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ohhhhhh rolleyes (temporarily)
  
  Ok heres the thing ,first reaction to your answers ,oh but doesnt Cags see ,he is describing himself as well.
  
  Then using your analogy I can understand ,you wouldnt necessarily see that ,because you are relating it (definations) to someone else.
  
  So my take on it is this.
  
  Your psychology is sound enough ,but for it to be fact,it would need to be applied evenly to everyone
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jerami, you continue...unbelievable. I'm not arguing, yet YOU see it as arguing. I'm was trying to explain something to someone else, yet again, you step into the conversation, pushing your beliefs, but your own words work against you. WOW!
  
  Spin it however you want to Jerami, there isn't any anger in my words and all you are doing is blowing smoke.
  Actually, hypocritical is your view. There isn't anything in what I said that is, again trying to twist. Dispelling you and showing others how your actions defeat you is my pleasure.
  Actually, point out would be your best point, if you can.
  For someone trying to argue his point or make a point, which I'm unsure what you're attempting to do....you make a lot of errors in your typing...now that either comes from (a) your frustrated and angry, which is creating your errors in typing or (b) you're actually illiterate. So, I'm willing to doubt it is (b), but more so (a).
  Okay, this statement is completely foolish and again, trying to twist was has been said in the past and presently. It's amazing you do not see how your own words defeat you.
  
  As I have said, and for YOU I will repeat- "everything"- as I said to WOC, it is a large term and you would be correct if you are referencing to knowing the unknown as well as the known. BUT, if you're referencing knowing all that is known, then you fail in understanding that what is known is possible for one person to know, understand and pass along. So, until YOU define what "everything" you are talking about, you are just blowing smoke to try and make yourself look good, but failing miserably.
  Actually, only an idiot would not know what they know. So, apparently YOU don't know sh!t.
  No a tough guy doesn't go around telling people, he is bully. But, I don't expect you to know the difference, as per usual.
  I don't go around telling people how intelligent I am. And, had you been able to see beyond your miserable life and ego, then you would know that.
  No, a loving person actually uses what they know to improve the life of others, which is apparently nothing you know about. Instead you rather attempt to tear me down, when you fail to realize your own failings. How ironic.
  Delusion? No delusion at all and this entire post has pointed out you to be the who is delusion and not me. But, keep trying.
  Pushing my beliefs? Who said anything about my beliefs. Not once have I ever said it was my beliefs. I swear, earlier I said I would give you the benefit of the doubt between the two choices I pointed out (a) and (b), but after this foolish statement, I'm more inclined to go with (b) now.
  I've seen my faults, I know I have them, but none of them exist with regards to what I learned and what has been discerned as truth. Sorry, you're unwillingly to accept yourself, but the truth of the matter is it's your own ego in your way. This too should pass, but not likely in your case.
  When I grow up? I'm not the who needs to grow up, as this entire post attributes to truth, that you don't know sh!t and now is more than obvious to anyone who is reading.
  
  Enjoy yourself.
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
When you find true wisdom, you will discover how little you realy know, and you will quit insulting everyone else in an attempt to elivate yourself (in your own eyes)

A tough guy doesn't have to go around telling everyone how tough they are.

An inteligent person doesn't have to tell anyone how inteligent they are.

A loving person doesn't have to tell anyone how loving that they are.

I agree with those comments in a general way .

I strongly dislike it when anyone uses the You You thing, however.

It is very accusatory and I drift off to another place
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Eaglekiwi, One is usually pretty miserable if they feel a need to put another down to feel better about themselves. I try to refrain from using the "you" "you" too often, but sometimes we need to use it to get a point across.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  maybe everyone could improve in this area. The whole 'you are this' or 'you are that' is why people get upset
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed.
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
Cagsil wrote:
Again, it is not attacking. What is with people? It's always an attack, attack, attack......WOW!

Apparently, he more issues than English being his first language.
-------

You can look through the forums and see where everyone has mispelled words and/or made mistakes in grammer many times, such as yours in the above statement.
"what is with people" ????
"He more issues than ..." ???

Everybody does it.

It is a sad thing when we do not understand that which some one else has spoken ... cause they mispelled a word.

That is a great way to avoid the subject matter ...
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jerami, Exactly. No one is perfect.
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
I apologize for my sporatic attendence here in the forums.
Making a couple of posts and ZOOM gone.
Do not mean to be rude.

Life has been topsy turvy of late.
Too much to do and not enough time.

And little is going as I think that it should.

I stop in when I can. And stay awake as long s I can
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cindi hposted 13 years ago
WOW!! I've read every post and I must say--I forgot the question. LOL Seriously, Intolerance can be seen in many areas, not just religiously, which this thread has seemed to focus on. People can be intolerant of a specific race, social class, sex,etc.. Intolerance is based on the inability or unwillingness to accept a different opinion from your own. I was raised a 'catholic' but I am more spiritual than 'religious' and never ever do I criticize or condemn another person for their views or opinions. I use the differences as a learning experience and try to keep an open mind. I know what I believe in but that is MY personal choice to believe it, I could be wrong. My dear father always used to say," To each his own", and those have been words I live by.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  agree that intolerance is not just with religion. Sounds like your father had good advice.
  
  So do you think intolerance these days is basically a choice, and there should be no excuse for ignorance?
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waynetposted 13 years ago
This forum thread started by the intolerant!
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
I believe this:

For you formed my innermost being. You knit me together in my mother's womb.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Can't answer the question then? Typical - this is one of those tough questions that go to the core of your beliefs so you resort to drivel.
  
  Got it.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I already said I didnt come from
  nothing!
  
  Point is did you get ?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  What did god make you out of in that case?
  
  I had thought we were talking about everything - not you individually.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No ,I was talking about me ,but ok everyone is fearfully and wonderfully made.
  
  Why even Science attests to that fact!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Science attests to no such thing.
  
  So - you no longer think god made everything out of nothing - interesting.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  does that include babies that are born without a brain & destined to die shortly after birth? Babies that have their hearts or bowels outside their bodies and would die without painful surgery?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Gods plan was perfect ,Man didnt accept it.
  
  Now we have the sonsquences of mans choice.
  
  Sadly we have the result of mankinds original choice.
  
  Look at it this way ,if you plant a bad seed ,you still get some good fruit ,but that fruit will always carry a defective seed.
  
  Just the way it is.
  
  God created everything ,but in excess or used incorrectly of course that changes the result.
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  mrpopoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "Gods plan was perfect ,Man didnt accept it."
  
  If that's the case, then it's a result of one of two things:
  
  1) Man did not have the capacity to acknowledge perfection.
  2) God's plan was not perfect.
  
  Either way, whose fault does it boil down to?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  1) Man knew he wasnt perfect.
  2) God is still perfect.
  
  Mans was created perfect (once)
  
  And God saw that He(Man) was Good.
  
  Then he disobeyed God ( Who was perfect).
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  mrpopoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Again, assuming Man did not have the capacity to acknowledge perfection then that's God's fault for not giving Man that trait. If Man was created perfect you'd think he'd be able to recognize perfection.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I used to think that too.
  
  But that is where the act of free will comes into play,or we would all be like robots ,yes sir ,no sir.
  
  God wanted man to chose to follow/obey him.
  
  We still do have that choice.
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  mrpopoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why would a perfect being make such an imperfect choice?
  
  No matter how you slice it, even if you throw free will in there (or the illusion of free will) it still doesn't make sense.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, you have a choice to be a robot and follow/obey and invisible god.
  
  Although, robots go to Silicon Heaven.
  
  Is it not written that "The Iron shall lie down with the Lamp"?
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  so some good people get 'punished' with horrific birth defects & many bad people have healthy children - how is that fair?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Its not fair and I will tell you once again how that came to be.
  
  Adam and Eve were made perfectly.
  They were also given the choice to choose between good and bad.
  Without getting into details ,they chose to disobey God.
  
  God looked for them ,and asked why? ( did they chose to disobey),they were hiding so clearly knew they had done wrong.
  
  God explained the consequences for their action and how sin breeds sin, or how certain fruits will follow certain fruits..
  
  As any father would do he disciplined his children and from that day forth cause and effect followed...
  
  Childbirth-pain
  Men-Work-Labour
  
  Alcohol-alcoholics
  Promiscuity-Prostitution
  Homosexuality-Diseases
  Divorce,Violence,Crime- Cause and effect or sin ,or turning.
  
  Or if the idea of anything scriptual is irritating figure this.
  
  Common sense tells us lack of morals causes all kinds of problems in society ,kids without fathers,mothers working the streets ,prisons full. The news everyday speaks about all kinds of dishonest behaviour and violence.
  
  None of those things are fair either Bailey Bear ,but we ,mankind want God to fix our problems or act like Santa Claus ,when we throw up our arms and scream its all Gods fault.
  
  Bit like complaining after the horse has bolted isnt it.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "Common sense tells us..."
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep so listen up
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You mean to the fairy tales you posted above?
  
  Yes, at opposite ends of the intellectual spectrum.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Sometimes ,but not always.
  
  Beezel there are Christian Scientists
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  sounds incredible that a 'father' would punish his 'children' for their first ever mistake, way out of proportion to the crime, and all generations forever more. And then to have his son who was also himself, brutally murdered to 'fix' it.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God did not punish them. He told them what would happen if they ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. They had everything they could ever want but listened to a serpent instead of listening to what God had warned them about.
  
  God gave the best He had to redeem man back to his former glory. Jesus gives life that man had lost in the Garden of Eden.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Sir D - you obviously don't agree that the punishment (sickness, death, pain, suffering) was way out of proportion to the crime (eating a piece of fruit).
  
  Would you punish your child for many generations for their first mistake?
  
  No, the whole thing comes from mythology trying to explain why there is suffering in the world (before people knew about microbes etc)
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  If my son puts his hand on a hot iron, he is punished not by me. He did it to himself. Adam did the same thing. He knew that death would come if he ate the fruit, but yet he did it anyway.
  
  Why does it seem so hard to understand?
  
  Did you move all the furniture in the house when your children were small so they would not get hurt on any of it? Have you ever told your child to not do something or they would get hurt? it is really rather simple.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It's utterly ridiculous, SirDent. Did you throw your son out of the house cursing him and his sons forever, banishing him to the land of Nod, never to return?
  
  That's what your god did to Adam, SirDent.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God put Adam out of the garden to save him. Here I thought you were more learned in the Bible than that. So many claim to be experts in fields they have no idea about.
  
  God put Adam out of the garden to keep him from eating the fruit of the tree of life and remain in his sinful state, and in his body of flesh that feels pain and agony and does wear out.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  To save him?
  
  Such a loving god to banish and curse in order to save. Hilarious.
  
  Yes, let's look at your gods love:
  
  “So He drove out the man; and He placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.” (Genesis 3:24)
  
  “CURSED is the ground for your sake; in toil you shall eat of it all the days of your life … in the sweat of your face you shall eat bread.” (Genesis 3:17-19)
  
  “In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread till you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken; for dust you are, and to dust you shall return.” (Genesis 3:19)
  
  “And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel.” (Genesis 3:15)
  
  I don't see any love or saving here, SirDent, but only the seeds of intolerance.
  
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  What you are not seeing is the fact that if God allowed Adam to stay in the garden and Adam ate the fruit of the tree of life, he would then live forever in a body o9f flesh that will deteriorate but not die.
  
  Would you like to live in your body forever?
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wow, thats some imagination you got there. How do you manage to make up such nonsense? I mean, it doesnt say anything like that in the bible.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Who's sock puppet are you?
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Nobodies but my own. You're making some wild ass claims there. Care to back them up?
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Wasn't that the original purpose of his creation, SirDent? Or, did your god set up Adam to take the fall?
  
  Which is it?
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God did not set him up to fall, but he fell anyway. God made a way for him to get back to his former glory and live a blameless and righteous life.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Nonsense, he banished and cursed him forever, and every man forever after, the words are right there for you to see, SirDent. Can you not read them?
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Are you able to read and discern what is written? Jesus died for the sins of Adam as He did for the sins of all. He even died for your sins. This is the only way that man can be made perfect again.
  
  Have you ever had the pain of arthritis in your joints? Would you like to live forever with that pain? God removed Adam from the garden to save him from that. The curse was put upon the land when Adam sinned. The curse was put upon Adam when he sinned.
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus died for our sins, oh god where to begin with that. Isnt god able to forgive people without someone having to die horribly? and in any case, what did jesus sacrifice? he rose from the dead and came back to life so he didnt sacrifice anything.
  
  As for your nonsense about god saving adam from life long pain that is just what you have MADE UP. It is not in the bible anywhere.
  
  Stop making things up.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It is OK to lie about these things if it for Jesus. You can make up whatever you like to defend Jesus and god.
  
  Says it right there in the New, "Biblical Nonsense For Dummies - The Bible Translated into Simple English," Version printed in Texas last week.
  
  If you wait a minute - Dent will start posting some cut and pasted Ancient Greek for you to see how right he is. Not that he has ever left the state - but he does speak ancient Greek like an ancient Greek. I gather.
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
  It is written in the KJV Bible 6,139 times.
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Name a single verse where the bible implicitly states that adam was removed from the garden of eden in order to SAVE him from life long pain.
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, he did not, he cursed and banished Adam and gave him and all mankind arthritis, cancer and a host of other ailments that science has had to deal with all these years. Satan did not do any of those things, your god did it all. You can read the bible to confirm.
  
  Had your god kept Adam in the garden rather than banishing and cursing him, would he still have arthritis?
  
  Yes, and YOUR GOD cursed Adam.
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  Jesus was a hippyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  He sounds to me like one of those people who, when a mugger says give me your money or else and the guy tries to fight and gets a broken nose, will say, you did it to yourself the mugger did warn you.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It wasnt the fruit ,it was the disobediance.
  
  Example: If one of my kids disobeyed in such a way that would effect his future ,wouldnt I want to stop it?
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, and like your god, you should banish him forever, cursing him and his sons forever... etc.
  
  Or, if he talked back, you must stone him to death.
  
  Of course, that is if you believe the bible.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  More nonsense
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Then we both agree the bible is nonsense.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Quite the reverse. God is perfect,he obviously had a bigger plan.
  He could have given up on man with the first couple ,but he didnt.
  Still mankind insisted on His way.
  
  Jesus was the bridge if you like.
  
  But why am explaining all of this,you once walked with God ,you already know this B.Bear.
  
  Its all in the Bible.
  
  ( My own father who I once thought was mean because he had certain rules,but boy am I glad he insisted they were obeyed now)
  Discipline protects.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SD yes, touch a hot iron, get burnt. but you're not going to keep burning him and his children and their children - that would be insane, and it cannot be compared to discipline.
  
  EK yes I know all the arguments,but one has to not think about how ridiculous they are to accept them. Punishing with birth defects etc is not discipline
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  SirDentposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SO what you are saying is that even though they had to die because of their disobedience, God should let them live?
  
  If I am not mistaken, that is the whole purpose of Jesus being born. He came to take the place of Adam and die in his place. Not only Adam, but all of mankind.
  
  The fact of the matter is this. The one touching the hot iron after being warned of harm is at fault for touching it. The scars he carries will be with him for a lifetime. Everything we do affects our families whether it is good or bad.
  
  The abusive alcoholic father abuses his children and wife. This has an effect on his whole family.
  
  A loving man takes care of his family and hugs them every day when he comes home from work. This also has an effect on his family.
  
  It is just how things are.
  
  Do you think you have to pay for the disobedience of Adam?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God is a loving and just God.
  
  He didnt want sin. He knew sin detroyed.
  
  You respect Science BB ,see it as cause and effect.
  Focusing in on one scenerio is not the issue.
  
  I believe God was looking at the result of the whole garden.
  
  Like I said in an earlier post ,if the seed is contaminated ,(Adams sin) then all fruit to come from that(fruit) ie disobediance sin will be contimated.
  
  The example you presented of a baby born with defects is not the babies fault nor Gods...
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  when my child is disobedient, I can't expect to punish his children and their children for it with cruel things - it's ludicrous. How can you justify suffering as being a simple act of first ever disobedience thousands of years ago?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  SirDent, kiwi, The words in your replies are just common sense.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Proverbs was one of the first books I read years ago ,and I couldnt get over the practical,common sense wisdom.
  
  Finally after reading many 'self help' literature a book that made sense and had practical answers. PLUS it didnt cost a cent
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That must be a definition of common sense I've never heard before.
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_sense
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep was around before Wiki and will be around after (by the looks of things )
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I see you haven't noticed there isn't a thing about common sense in your posts, according to that definition. (by the looks of things)
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Which would pretty much tell you which book (or programe) I respect more.. :rollseyes: specially for common sense !!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Really? How odd - it specifically tells you that women are not to preach at men.
  
  You wish to go back to owning slaves and stoning adulteresses huh? The good ole dayz when biblical "common sense" ruled.
  
  I wonder if you have even read this book you insist in going against all the time. Certainly not a good ad for it are ya?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Can tell how you respond how you were educated in religious matters.
  
  Truly odd.
  
  And it doesnt matter what I write ,you seem intent on making things up.
  
  Real shame about that ,however no excuse for you too to remain wilfully ignorant.
  
  Jesus liberated women! Amen
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Where does it say Jesus liberated women? Perhaps you could post the specific piece where it says women can preach?
  
  Far as I recall, Jesus had no female disciples, and the words Paul wrote after Jesus alleged death were pretty clear. Perhaps you could give me a list of admonishments in the bible that you do not have to follow?
  
  Little wonder your religion causes so many wars. Willfully ignorant? LOLOL
  
  Gawd that is funny.
  
  "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man;she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner." Timothy 2:11-14
  
  You have actually read this book - right?
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  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, your posts are very revealing.
  
  So, when will you stone to death your son for talking back?
  
  When you will kill me for not believing in your god?
  
  When will you actually read the bible?
  
  report
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I will get back to you on that one.
  
  ( My momma always taught me to answer a silly question with a silly answer)
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  report
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Of course Science and God say much about both.
  reply report
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cindi hposted 13 years ago
Almost everything in life is a choice baileybear. We choose to fall victim to our emotions. We choose to be ignorant and unaccepting.
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
Mark Knowleswrote ...

The virgin birth is nonsense. Why the need to lie and back it up with "scientific facts?" Science is pretty clear that humans can not reproduce without sperm being introduced to ova. (Unless Jesus was a clone?)

It appears that FAITH is not enough.

= = = = = =

ME thinks. That it is very strange that You say ...
Science is pretty clear that humans can not reproduce without sperm being introduced to ova.

And yet an entire universe can produce itself without anything being introduced to anything.

If the universe can do that ??? How much simpler can it be for a itty bitty embrio to come into being without a sperm.
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1. 0
  Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jerami,
  I just had to pop back in here and say that's a brilliant post!
  Common-sense question, absolutely brilliant post.
  reply report
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  Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks .. It just seems that a virgin birth isn't all that big of a miracle compaired to others.
  reply report
  58
  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It's a logical fallacy, Brenda. There isn't anything brilliant or common sense about it. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other.
  reply report
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  yAY INNIT.
  
  Dear me. No wonder your religion cause so many wars.
  
  INNIT
  reply report
3. 58
  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That's called a strawman argument, Jerami. What does the origins of the universe have to do with human reproduction?
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God is the center of the universe. Plain and simple.
  reply report
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  that is your opinion, which is not proven fact.
  reply report
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes and still on the throne
  reply report
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  we call the toilet the throne
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Kiwi, Give God the Glory for he is worthy to be praised.
  reply report
60
gogetter4uposted 13 years ago
I was raised in a to accept Jesus as my savior and to believe in the Word Of God. Anything outside the Word Of God, the Bible, is not His Word. I believe we get into trouble speaking away from the Bible which is God's spoken word.

also....

they're writing a story on the forum marked books & lit & writing...it's fun & people r adding 2 it 2c how far its goes. go to lets write a story..tell us what's next in the story...this is a good way to get known... have fun..
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
Jerami wrote:
Mark Knowleswrote ...

The virgin birth is nonsense. Why the need to lie and back it up with "scientific facts?" Science is pretty clear that humans can not reproduce without sperm being introduced to ova. (Unless Jesus was a clone?)

It appears that FAITH is not enough.

= = = = = =

ME thinks. That it is very strange that You say ...
Science is pretty clear that humans can not reproduce without sperm being introduced to ova.

And yet an entire universe can produce itself without anything being introduced to anything.

If the universe can do that ??? How much simpler can it be for a itty bitty embrio to come into being without a sperm.
==============================================

Mark wrote ..
yAY INNIT.

Dear me. No wonder your religion cause so many wars.

INNIT
=== - - - ===

ME
Mark ... you believe tht the universe magicaly creted itself from nothing into nothing creating something....
Why can't a itty bity human life come into being by the same means as this gret big universe did?
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74
Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
Your brain is a super computer and can process up to 30 billion bits of information per second. Brain is equivalent to 9,656 Km of wiring and cabling. Your internet of nerves contains about 28 billion neurons. Neuron is a tiny computer; interpret information received through your five sense organs. Each neuron is a tiny self-contained computer, capable of processing one bullion bits of information. Neurons also communicate with other nerves through a network of 160,935 km of nerve fibers. Brain and network of nerves are one of the fascinating human body systems. Creator had designed your super computer brain with a view that you can use it purposefully for living well.

That came out of 'nothing' yea right
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1. 0
  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  yet, look at the boy who was raised as a chicken (am about to start a hub on him). He cannot talk or connect with humans & probably never will - the pathways for human interaction & human behaviours weren't formed in his brain from his environment - only chicken behaviours & sounds
  reply report
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I look forward to reading that hub.
  
  Is that called Imprinting?
  
  Bit like Mowgli jungle boy etc.
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  Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I've heard that word used, but I haven't used it in my hub. Have written the first draft. Will publish it in April to have a crack at the writing contest
  reply report
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Jeramiposted 13 years ago
If I plant a tomato plant in the basement and it dies, does tht mean that the creator should have designed it better.

And of course I shouldn't plant it in the hot dry sand.

Everything comes with directions for survival, and when they aren't followed, it doesn't survive.
reply report
1. 74
  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  True enough.
  reply report
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logic,commonsenseposted 13 years ago
The root cause is FEAR!
reply report
1. 74
  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well said:
  
  Perfect love casts out fear
  reply report

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