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Ten Commandments

  1. superwags profile image81
    superwagsposted 5 years ago

    Why is it constantly claimed that there are only ten commandments in the bible when there patently aren't. There are at least 50! There's 20 or so in Exodus and Dueteronomy each.

    Is there a reason why mainstream Christianity and Judaism has cherry picked just ten and left out the others?

    And now, a joke:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnfCApS0u8Q

    1. 0
      just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think there are 613 commandments. Excellent question. I doubt you'll get a satisfactory answer from the ones who insist the bible is the infallible word of God.

      1. Joy56 profile image60
        Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        so according to Fry the Jews took 10 commandments because they were free. Brilliant.

        1. 68
          paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I don't understand; please elaborate.

          Did Moses mention the figure ten?

          1. Joy56 profile image60
            Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            you need to watch the comedy sketch posted by superwags

    2. 68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think someone selected ten out of them just for convenience.

  2. Joy56 profile image60
    Joy56posted 5 years ago

    er er er er i am struggling with this one....... I will do some research.... Before i say something wrong, i do that a lot.  Will be back....

    say something wrong i do a lot.

    dont research half as much as i should.

    if you know what i mean

    1. 68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Are you finished with your search or research?
      Please mention it.

      1. Joy56 profile image60
        Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        i haven't started it yet, i had my grandchildren here over night and they have both been sick i have packed them off home now. 

        I dont know why but you are really making me laugh.  Are you winding me up.... and everyone else for that matter.

        1. 68
          paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I don't mind if you laugh; it is good for your health.

          I am waiting for the result of your search or reseach.

          Thanks

          1. Joy56 profile image60
            Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            o.k. i will research, and that is good for me too, i am so lazy minded, be back soon, are you laughing too......

            1. 68
              paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I am just smiling.

              1. Joy56 profile image60
                Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm i found out why Jehovah's Witnesses dont celebrate birthdays but that is the other thread. now....

                Moses got the 10 commandments, originally, on stone, then got the others later.  The research is why are we still under some of these commandments and not others..... i am not reporting that on here, you tell us

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                  just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I'm 100% sure that I'm not qualified to answer this. Not sure why you asked me, but  why not?

                  I always assumed the laws had been fulfilled. Jesus said somewhere that all laws would remain until they had been fulfilled. I always figured love god, love your neighbor encapsulated everything. Follow those and all the law is fulfilled. The mosaic law is null and void. All of it.

                  I just assumed mainstream Christianity had fallen into the same trap as the scribes and pharisees, so they were trying to insist on pointless laws to cause grief and confusion in their followers.

                  1. Joy56 profile image60
                    Joy56posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    ha ha..... some of the laws where nailed on the stake (or some believe cross) ...... when Jesus died, to say they were no longer in use.

                    The law about not killing others still stands i am sure... kinda self explanatry i suppose.

                  2. 68
                    paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Please quote from Jesus.

  3. workingmomwm profile image84
    workingmomwmposted 5 years ago

    I don't think anyone claims that there are ONLY 10 commandments. There were only 10 commandments that were given to Moses (and the Jewish people) on Mount Sinai - in that particular instance. These commandments are special because they mark God's establishment of His relationship with the Jewish people.

    But these, and all the other laws and commands in the Bible were summed up nicely by Jesus in Matthew 12. I try to live by that.

    1. 68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Please quote from Torah.

      NT has nothing to do with Torah or Moses.

      1. workingmomwm profile image84
        workingmomwmposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Well, the Torah is quoted quite often in the New Testament, so it does have something to do with it. And the question was about commandments in the BIBLE, which has both the Torah  and other books of the Old Testamant and the NEW TESTAMENT, so I think my response was perfectly appropriate.

        Please stick to your Muslim beliefs and don't comment on things that you don't know anything about.

        1. 68
          paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Anybody who has read the NT knows that Torah is not quoted often in NT.

          Please collect all the verses quoted from Torah in the NT; it will hardly make a full chapter or so, I think.

          1. workingmomwm profile image84
            workingmomwmposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Paar, I don't know why I'm bothering to respond to you, other than the fact that I'm feeling particularly argumentative right now.

            The book of Matthew alone quotes the Torah 18 times. Fortunately, I don't have to list all the instances. Someone else has done it for me. And, yes, I know this list includes other books in the Old Testament besides the Torah, but I think the Torah is more than adequately represented.

            I was going to post a link for you, but HubPages won't let me. Just do a Google search for "Parallel Passages in New Testament Quoted from Old Testament" and look at the first result (Blue Letter Bible).

  4. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 5 years ago

    Jesus never said a word. Not even one. A thorough read of the NT AND OT will reveal the true personalities and motives of those who wrote what he is supposed to have said.

    Further reading may bring you to the belief that no such person existed, and that the jesus story is a concoction built from many older stories that have already been repeated time and again long before the NT was written.

    The NT tries to separate itself from the beliefs of the OT god with all sorts of long-bow interpretations that all fail miserably in every way.

    Logic, spirituality, honesty, decency, and the truth are all immediate victims of the NT illusion that somehow the psychosis displayed by the OT god should be ignored from the NT on.

    As time goes by religion has needed to re-interpret the bible and quoran to fit the things that are so obviously wrong that even the severely indoctrinated wont buy it anymore, and the only place the beliefs remain are in places with almost no education.

    Religion stifles cures for diseases and scientific advancement and is responsible for the deaths of thousands who would have had life saving medicine if not for these loons.

    New medical and other scientific theories take bites out of the silly interpretations of religious tomes.

    Then the arguments start afresh between all these "believers" who get buried in their own interpretations, which is why one book produces hundreds of opposing beliefs among the "faithful."

    So apart from a few recommendations called "Commandments" which my dog could have worked out for himself without needing a god to think them out, the rest only illuminates what it was like to live in the bronze age.

    The other 603 commandments, religionists avoid like the plague.

    1. Jesus was a hippy profile image60
      Jesus was a hippyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Wow, thats some tall claim to knowledge if ever I saw one.

      1. earnestshub profile image87
        earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        No, tall claims here, a tall claim is expecting any adult to believe the bible is the word of a god.
        My claims are based on facts that are fortunately available to a large degree online these days. smile I prefer the views of Stephen Fry, Lawrence Krauss, Stephen Hawking, Carl Jung, Maria Louise Von Franz, James Hillman, Peter O'Connor and others who have a scientific view of man. how the mind works and mankind's need for such myths.

        I can provide peer reviewed credible sources to support my opinions, but anyone who cares to is welcome to correct anything I have said providing they are prepared to do the same.
        If I'm wrong, I will change anything I believe to suit better data.
        After 2 years experience in these threads I know they are never read by those with opposing views. smile
        So... you first?

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          just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I'm sure the polar duck will respond to you, but I figured I'd butt right on in. I agree with you on many points, but claiming Jesus never existed is like proving there is no God. It's opinion. Good for Jung and all the others on having an opinion. Good for you for looking to them for yours. But, again, since it was two thousand years ago and none of us were there, it's kind of hard to prove your point.

          As to the words attributed to Jesus, I would agree that all care should be taken, but it is wishful thinking to say that nothing written was said by him. You have to look at each gospel, try to discern what of the author flavored the work, and wash that out of it. Then compare them all for consistencies.

          You believe the writings are lies. I believe there is evidence of enlightenment. But without proof, either way, it is opinion. I think Christianity is  as bogus as you do, but I won't stretch my opinion beyond what I honestly think simply to push an agenda. smile

          1. 68
            paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            friend Earnestshub is speaking about non-existence of Jesus-Christian-god/son-of-god, I think; and not about Jesus the human beings son of Mary.

          2. earnestshub profile image87
            earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Nice to see you read it and offer your view. smile You are right, I was not there, and neither were those who wrote about jesus.

            It all came later, and my opinion that he did not exist is based on the fact that most of his life story was retold from other stories from other "jesus" figures in other places cultures and times, much like the biblical story of the floods.

            The biblical stories themselves are only a fraction of the information we now have of these times and times before.

            The biblical agenda is demonstrably psychotic, and that does not stop with the OT.
            I have to wonder how someone could read the OT and then say "god loves you" with a straight face!

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              just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I responded to your post about Jesus. I have no reason, or desire, to disagree with any of the rest of it. But, you have to accept the fact that the Old Testament was probably written during the Babylonian captivity in an attempt to help a people hold their identity. Of course, ancient man would write a fanciful history for himself about a wild and vengeful god that smote anything in their path.

              I agree, the mysticism was most probably added to the New Testament. The story was fluffed up to suit an agenda. But the core teachings are easily argued to be from an historical figure. And I believe that the message was profound enough to explain why people went to so much trouble to spread the message. It got buried almost immediately, but that's organized religion for you.

              I've said it before and I'll say it again. If you take everything out of it but what you can know for sure of what he said, and the fact that he was willing to die to send that message; it makes it all the more profound.

              Can you imagine a world where people put the needs of others first? Where they looked to work on their own faults instead of yours?  One where we didn't sit in judgement? We banded together for the greater good? It's a heck of a message to me. Considering the world he walked in I'd have been willing to do anything to spread that message too. smile

          3. superwags profile image81
            superwagsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            There's a hell of a lot of evidence to point to the non-existence of Jesus and not just that Jesus was not the son of god.

            He certainly wasn't born in the way the bible claims, he certainly didn't die in the way the bible claims either - the Romans were pretty meticulous in their record keeping - births and deaths didn't go without notice where taxes were for the taking!

            There is no contemporary writing which refers to Jesus either. Not one line.

            There are an awful lot of other dieties in the mould of jesus - though "in the mould" is not the right to describe it obviously as they came earlier! I mean, if I was a roman flogging a new religion to my populace I'd make him very similar to other roman gods:

            I'd make his birth and death coincide with existing pagan festivals. I'd mould him in the image of a pre-existing god, say.... Mythras. Put his temple on Vatican hill, have him born the son of a virgin, etc etc.

            If jesus did exist then his historical life was nothing like what was described in the bible. But then, is this important or is he just a metaphor for believers?

            1. 68
              paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              You are right.

            2. aka-dj profile image80
              aka-djposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              What else can a nonbeliever say?
              Really! It's not rocket science, is it?

              "If Jesus..." is the key.

              IF He lived, . . . .then . . .
              IF He never existed, . . . then . . . (fill in the blanks.)

              It still comes down to faith, no matter how much anyone denies it!
              I BELIEVE He did, you BELIEVE Hi didn't. What else can be said? smile

              1. superwags profile image81
                superwagsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Well, you could present the historical evidence for and against...

            3. 0
              just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I agree that the man was probably nothing like the myth. But that's religion for you. Give it an inch and it'll give you a god that they're proud of.  But, I do think Christianity had a real figure that caused it's beginning. There's too much reason than to think otherwise, for me.

              1. earnestshub profile image87
                earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Fair enough!
                You have a lot of agreement from both sides for that opinion. smile

                1. 0
                  just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  lol Sorry. I do see your argument. I just love the message I get from the whole thing too much to throw it out.

                  1. earnestshub profile image87
                    earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    That's fine, there are beautiful words in the bible, wonderfully clear archetypes, easily discernible symbols abound, some wonderful tales of love.

                    I can read the bible without having to see it as inspired by anything other than the desire and politics of those who wrote it.

                    There are also many ridiculous megalomanic, psychotic passages that begin with "god said." and recommendations that were obvious to others as murder, rape, slavery and suppression.

                    I enjoy Willy Waveadagga myself, but at least his work is not presented as truth or real threats.

                    Mind you, there is plenty of human truth in such as "Macbeth"

              2. Jesus was a hippy profile image60
                Jesus was a hippyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                I agree with you on that one. Joseph Smith was the real man that started Mormonism, Mohammed was the real man that started Islam and I dont understand why people find it so hard to accept the possibility that Jesus was the real man who started christianity.

                1. 0
                  just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Well, I can see why they would wish he didn't exist. Organized Christianity does have a lot to apologize for, but I'm with you. He was most probably real.

              3. superwags profile image81
                superwagsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                It's more than possible, but the point is that one jesus becomes nothing like what is written about in the bible, where do you stand on everything else?

                I mean, for most believers they'd want Jesus to have at least have done SOME of the things that are said of him. I understand that some things are exagerated (I don't think there are many people who really think he turned water into wine), but surely some of it has to be true to have some resonance?

                Reading the bible gives you the distinct impression that Jesus was cherry picked and then designed to fit other mythical figures of the time. This was done by the people selling this new faith to the masses of the Roman Empire.

                There are plenty of other figures from the bible that almost certainly didn't exist - King David, Adam and Eve etc. Why not Jesus too?

                It surely must be important to add historical context where possible, it makes the whole thing more interesting for a start.

                1. 68
                  paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  It is the scribes that created a mountain from the molehill. Jesus was in the image of the God, not god or son of god.

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                  just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Adam and Eve? Sure. How in the world could that story work to be real. Trust me, I've tried to resolve it in line with what we know. The rest of the figures? Who knows or cares if there are any historical figures buried in the stories. I never saw the answer to that as the point.

                  I assumed the point of the stories was to see the progress of humanity dealing with moral issues from the beginning of their awareness, to the point where they could think enough for themselves to be better, simply because they were able to. That, to me, was the whole point of Jesus' message. He told us what his vision was, but then he told us to look inside. I assume he had enough respect for humanity to believe they would come to the same conclusions. So he preached to stop looking to others to tell you what is right. Look within yourself. Find it and do it. We're all able to see it without religious leaders to guide us. They will always lead you astray, simply because you aren't thinking for yourself.

                  How christianity evolved from that is a mystery to me.

                  Is it possible he wasn't real? Of course. Was he saying the same thing others were? Sure, to a great extent. I think the thing that always got me was; I know Jesus preached of God, and it forces us to look back at the OT and then forward to Paul and the intelligent reaction is WTF? How organized religion pushes what they do is beyond my ability to figure out. But, even though he was Jewish, you have to assume he couldn't see his God the way it's preached today. He could not have had his philosophy within that framework.

                  Real, or not, I don't see the message about trying to find a way to find a better person within yourself any different from a lot of philosophies. I can't find the need to stamp something out that makes sense to me.

        2. Jesus was a hippy profile image60
          Jesus was a hippyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Hmmm

    2. 68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      It is true; Bible included little from Jesus' mouth in its bounds.

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      just_curiousposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      That's either one smart dog, or one tall tale you have going there ernest. But I do hope you feel better after that little diatribe. smile

    4. superwags profile image81
      superwagsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I agree with everything you've just said.

      The idea that nobody had ever thought to apply the commandments prior to their inclusion within the bible is laughable. I mean "do not kill"?! I think it's doing a pretty big injustice to our ancestors' previous 250,000 years on the planet. They couldn't have been a particularly successful species to that point!

      1. earnestshub profile image87
        earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Not coveting your neighbors wife would have been an easy one to work out too, A few wacks over the head with a bronze sword from hubby probably taught them a heap of things that would be better left alone. smile

  5. dingdondingdon profile image60
    dingdondingdonposted 5 years ago

    To be honest I struggle to remember all of the ten they cherry-picked. I'd be in real trouble with fifty.

  6. ceciliabeltran profile image86
    ceciliabeltranposted 5 years ago

    Numbers have symbolic meaning to the Jews. 613 is 6+1+3=10, ya know.

    10 is a number of the number of the total human being so I would lose sleep over that unless you guys really want to go crazy.

    Don't take it literally, like the English, Hebrew was very poetic and their poetry included some mathematical concepts they associated with certain spiritual concepts.

    It is literature, so you have to treat it as such--and with respect.

  7. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 5 years ago

    613... my city and country code.
    I always thought Melbourne was special! smile

 
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