I'm curious, how many of you out there believe that on May 21, 2011- your god is coming to earth to carry you up to heaven?
What makes you Christians believe in this BS?
http://www.patheos.com/Resources/Additi … -2011.html
"On this day, Camping predicts, the earth will shake, tombs will open, the dead will arise, and, along with a faithful remnant of Christians everywhere, the true believers will ascend to the heavens to meet Jesus. Camping estimates that only 2 percent of the earth's population will be "raptured," or rise to meet Jesus in the clouds, while the rest of creation will endure five months of torment before the curtain falls on the human and planetary adventures."-Bruce Epperly wrote on 5/11.
No one can know the exact month, day, and year Jesus will return. It is written in the bible that we don't know the exact time. I don't listen to what people say if their words are not in line with the word of God.
You don't think these people have Biblical support?
It would be nice if these people can point out any scriptures in the bible stating that Jesus will return to earth on May 21, 2011.
"I know it's absolutely true, because the Bible is always absolutely true."
— Harold Camping, president, Family Radio
Case closed. Harold Camping says so. So there.
Excuse me while I sell off all my assets and crawl into a corner and cry.
I am willing to buy some of those assets at a discount.
Actually I'm planning to sell them only to nuns, children under the age of 8, and Canadians--in other words, only the people I can be certain will be alive in eternity in heaven.
Great idea! I have 3 under 8 kids right here.
Excellent. Paypal me the money for the shipping to Australia and it's yours.
I'm Canadian. But I advise you keep your money. I have it on good authority that the world will end in a few billion years when the sun goes red giant. Put a few bucks in a high interest savings account and when the time comes you should have enough money to book at least one descendant on the space ark.
I'm with you. As to Mr. Camping, he's a reformed pastor who has become an embarrassment to reformed churches, since much of what he teaches now is not Biblical. Please don't paint all Christians as people who believe as he does. No church is perfect, but when people disdain the correction of their denomination and go off to be lone rangers, is easier for them to slip into errors and lead others in the wrong direction. Reformed denominations have, for the most part, said goodbye to Harold Camping with sadness, since he has stepped away from their fellowship and taken others with him. It will be interesting to see what he says on May 22.
With the state of the world as it is, we could well be in the last days, and I suppose Christ could return on any day -- even May 21. But I'm not expecting it will be that day, and Jesus said even He Himself did not know the date so it's hard to believe CAmping got a special revelation of it.
I hope its not that day, I am supposed to be having my daughter's birthday party, and according to my mothers religion, celebrating birthdays gets you on God's bad side. I would rather he didn't return on a day that I am "willfully sinning."
??? Ah, but jus think of the excitement at the party as tombs open and zombies come forth, chasing the kids around. Great fun!
It'll look just like a Michael Jackson video. Maybe he'll put in an appearance himself.
What you are essentially saying is that you don't believe Camping got that information from your god, which basically says you only believe in those who get such revelations from god because that is what you want to believe.
Maybe Camping did get a revelation from god and is warning everyone. How do you know he didn't?
I don't. But it appears, according to the apostle Paul (I Corinthians 1:26-33, that prophets are instructed to give their prophetic utterances in the context of a church assembly where there are other prophets present. When one prophet is speaking, the others are to keep silent and weigh what is said until it is their turn, so that all don't try to speak at once, leading to confusion. Verse 32 says that "...the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets."
I could well be mistaken, but it's my understanding that Mr. Camping has given up on the church -- all denominations-- and encouraged his followers to leave them for their own family house churches. He speaks to his followers mostly on the radio and says the churches are all wrong and he's got it right. He has basically left the oversight of any other "prophet" who would scrutinize his utterances because he has written them all off and feels he can ignore them.
I have heard Mr. Camping speak on the radio once. I had heard plenty about him before that, since some in my church had been led away by him. His station, Family Radio, has some wonderful Christian music that my church hardly ever sings anymore, and I miss it. But when I heard the things Harold Camping was teaching, things that did not even pertain to the last days, it was obvious he was leaving what the Bible teaches. If he is indeed speaking the real revelation of God, it will come true. If we are all still here, including Camping, on May 22, it will be evident God did not reveal what he claims. I suggest we all continue to walk with God and go about doing what he's called us to do. Then, whenever he comes, we will be prepared to meet him.
In Thessalonians, Paul says that though the Day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night when people seem to be enjoying peace and security, those who are following Jesus will not be caught off-guard because they will be living in obedience and walking with God, and will be happy to see Him come. In essence, we really don't need to know the day Christ is coming back, since we will not have to do anything special to get ready that we have not already done or are not already doing. Neither the church nor the world can expect that they can be like a disorderly class when the teacher has left the room and then start behaving again when they hear him coming back down the hall to return. We must desire to obey him all the time, and have repentant hearts when we have fallen into sin, turn our backs on that sin, receive his forgiveness, and continue to follow him. This is a daily thing -- not like cramming because you think finals are coming.
So what? The fact that he doesn't follow some "prophet protocol" does not diminish his claims of divine knowledge. Who is say someone is or isn't a prophet? You? Me? Fred Flintstone?
Exactly, it's either going to happen or it isn't, just like every other empty claim of apocalypse throughout history, including the Christ version. Never happens.
Yes, but those are just your personal beliefs and aren't really relevant or valid in reality, much like the claims of raptures and apocalypse.
Yes, those are my personal beliefs, and they are just as valid as your personal beliefs. Mine are founded in faith, and yours in lack of such faith. One is reality and one isn't . One day one of us will be discovered to be wrong, since two opposite beliefs cannot both be true. Or maybe both of us will turn out to be wrong and neither of us knows the ultimate truth or reality. Until that ultimate truth is revealed to all, or at the time of our deaths, each of us will cling to what we believe.
Hmmm. So you admit it is a toss up concerning who is right?
I seriously doubt that! I suggest you might be biased towards your own opinion.
Of course I am. Aren't you biased toward your belief?
By definition, to have a belief is to be biased to one opinion. It goes for everyone.
I believe in reality. I'll leave delusion for the fundies!
So yes, I am biased towards facts instead of fallacy and myth. But I have no problem if you choose the latter two. You were probably indoctrinated at an early age.
Yes, I did go to a Presbyterian Sunday School at an early age and had some teachers who were believers. My dad was a believer, raised in the Pentecostal Holiness church, who never talked about his faith, and my mom was raised Episcopalian and never talked about her faith except when expressing horror at the negative beliefs of the Baptists and Brethren who thought she was not saved because she danced. My parents compromised on the Presbyterian church where I was raised, since it was also about the only church in town and was considered a community church.
Wen I hit high school, my mom went back to college and took a philosophy course and quickly lost the faith she'd never really had. It got to the place where she would not even bow her head when Dad said grace. She began to try to "unconvert" me when I expressed concern about her lack of faith. She succeeded the year I was president of my youth group. Naturally, I tried to resign, explaining I was not sure I was a believer anymore. Our sponsor insisted I stay on, so I said I would only do it on the condition we study other faiths. And we did.
My boyfriend and I attended a couple of services at the Unitarian Church, since my mom had set me to reading their writings. I currently have an atheist friend who is quite active in that church, so people can really believe anything they want and still go to church there. One Sunday the service was a concert instead of a sermon. I enjoyed the concert, but it was easy to see this was not a church that really worshiped anything. I saw no point in continuing my search for truth there. I still believed in God. I just wasn't so sure about the trinity.
I won't bore you with my entire story. When I hit the campus of UCLA I realized I had no words of comfort for my friend at home when her father died, if what I had not believed before was true. God knew I was reaching out for him and met me where I was. I came back to faith, only this time it was a grown up faith. I met plenty of people on campus like Randy and Beelzedad and would often talk with them until the wee small hours. You two haven't said anything they didn't say first. I don't think any of us ever changed each other's minds anymore than I think I will change your minds or you mine. If I'm wrong, I'll find out someday. If you are, so will you. I will continue, meanwhile, to believe in things I can't prove through science -- faith, hope, love, grief, hate. We cannot prove them, but we can see the changes they make in people. As a matter of fact, a belief is another thing you can see only in a person's actions. People's true beliefs have consequences that come out in other areas of their lives. That would include the belief that there is no God or no reality that science can't prove. It will affect the way you live your life. It doesn't rally matter what people say they believe. What they really believe can be seen in their actions or lack of them.
No problem here, Wanna! It seems your god made it harder for some to buy into things there is no evidence for, than others. Do you think he makes it easier for some to accept dubious information than for others to do so? Is being aware of scientific information which contradicts the bible a sin?
Or should one merely ignore the proven facts in lieu of the "Holy Word Of God"? Quite a quandary for the scientifically educated person.
I have no such personal beliefs in invisible friends, gave those up when I was a small child, thanks.
Yes, faith based beliefs often have nothing to do with reality.
Sorry, but that's what science is all about, understanding reality, which it is very successful in achieving. Your beliefs are most likely wrong, but you are free to show how they are right compared with every other religion on the planet, which is something you would need to show true before even attempting to compare your beliefs with reality.
Yes, unfortunately the indoctrinated cling to their irrational fantasies no matter how much reality shows them to be wrong.
The point is you don't know if those words came from your god or not, it is something you are choosing to not believe. That doesn't say very much about your faith in your god nor does it say much about the fact that you only listen to your gods words.
Very few Christians are actually buying into this. Most Christians follow Jesus' advice about how "No man knows the day or the hour". Not sure what drives people to believe end of the world stuff all I know is Camping and his ilk haven't done nearly as much damage as 2012 proponents.
What damage have the 2012 proponents done? Most are just using it for an excuse to have an end of the world party! Wrote a hub 'bout it! Like to hear it? Here it goes...!
No really, I was very surprised this hub I wrote for fun seemed to get so much interest in having a final bash to end all bashes!
Another cool thing is, it falls a few days before Christmas so no use in wasting all that cash on presents when everyone will be-how shall I put it-indisposed? We can take all that money intended for gifts and spend it on party favors, food, entertainment, costumes, and of course, intoxicants.
Max that credit card out too! You get the idea! Might as well enjoy seeing how the whole history thing turns out after so long.
But of course, the Mayans could have been mistaken after all. In that case, better see what Camping says this May 22 and follow his lead. I'm sure he has a plan B!
If the end is coming as predicted, I would be quite happy to live Christian free for five months. I can't see how that would be tormenting at all.
If you have read the Bible and understood it, you will not believe this non-sense.
It will take at least 7 years for the world to come to an end. I could be any time after that.
NO dates and no years.
Read the Bible carefully.
Not so sure about that! A decent sized asteroid could do it in a matter of seconds. But then, I doubt Jesus discussed scientific facts very often with his followers. How boring his life must have been not being able to discuss the real cause of then unexplained phenomena with his friends and followers.
"Well Peter, lightning is caused by static electricity building up and suddenly discharging in a powerful burst of energy and sound"!
"Jesus! I thought your dad caused it like he did the rainbows!"
Where does the idea of seven years come from? Tribulation?
According to Daniels prophecy of 70 weeks, the anointed one comes after 69 weeks. How then can there be a gap of 2000 years between week 69 and week 70 aka 7 years of tribulation?
Sounds like he was one of the writers of "Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy" who went astray.
Don't insult HGttG, earnest. That is a fabulous book! James
Actually, with respect to the Christians, I would like to see some textual validity for this, seriously. I once believed it, but after studying the text for years, found nothing to support it.
a. A Rapture.
b. Immanu El [Y`shua; Jesus] stating he was returning.
c. An entity Lucifer mentioned anywhere in Hebrew or Greek text.
d. A battle between a collective 1/3 of 'fallen angels' that humanity is somehow responsible to participate in.
Could anyone provide exact information, not just 'supposedly' information for me to read and study.
twenty one days! here are your answers to look up and read..The primary passage describing the rapture is 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, in which Paul cites "the word of the Lord" about the return of Jesus to gather his saints.
And swear by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
Can be found in Matthew 16:28, 23:36, 24:34.. Luke 9:27, Mark 9:1, 13;30, Luke 21:32.Proverbs 16:1: "The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the Lord." Hosea 10:12: "Sow to yourselves in righteousness, reap in mercy; break up your fallow ground; for it is time to seek the Lord, till He come and rain righteousness upon you." Any spiritual truth that falls on bad ground doesn't bear fruit. Matthew 13:8: "But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold." Verse 9: "Who hath ears to hear, let him hear." We are told plainly in those different parables that He went out and sowed seed, and the seed was good; there was nothing wrong with the seed or the sowing of the seed. The trouble was that He sowed it on four kinds of ground, and only one ground was prepared. So the seed fell on some ground and the fellow was converted. You remember how old Bill got gloriously converted, and he shouted, and he went down on the streets and told how God had saved him. And two weeks later he folded up his tent, taken down the flag, and took off! You see, the Scriptures say there was no root there. He flourished for a little while, but because the seed didn't take root, the first time a little wind storm of adversity came, he played out. Matthew 13:5-6: "Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth: And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away."
I as well gave you a link to follow..I pray that your eyes and heart will be opened!
Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_th … z1MOHSVazY
Yes, I am familiar with 1 Thessalonians as well as Romans.
But, that wasn't my question.
The question was: where did Immanu El [Y`shua; Jesus] or the other 12 state, after the resurrection, he was returning?
In addition, there is no mention in Johns letter of such an event, nor another great tribulation, nor a battle between humans and angels. In fact, Johns letter of revealing is something entirely different the most perceive.
As for Rapture, it is not mentioned anywhere. The terms 'lifted up', 'caught up', 'in the clouds' all mean the same thing: glorified. It doesn't mean physically floating off into the sky, but physically, mentally and spiritual being reunified --as Adam was. Some use Johns letter as a back up for this passage. But, looking at that passage in the letter is expressly says this:
"And this is the FIRST resurrection; blessed are they who share in the first resurrection, the 2nd death (that is of spirit) has no authority over them."
So, one must ask this: when was the first resurrection?
And also, was there a resurrection after the first; is there ever a mention of a second resurrection?
Now, immediately following this, John says something very important --and quite awesome actually: (in order of appearance)
ha-satan was released and then no more.
Gog and Magog also no more.
All are judged.
Death and Hades are no more.
Look! [God’s] dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them ( Immanu El --Creator In Us; Kingdom In Us).
These events occurred at the first Resurrection. The new Jerusalem has come and dwells in each one who walks by faith (will explain this later on).
As for no more time, that is a different topic, which I have written a lot about...
I wonder if Camping would bet his life on it? His reputation is already wagered, it seems. I'll bet on May 22 he claims he asked god to spare us sinners one more time and the big guy answered his prayers! Any takers?
Or, he pulls a "Swaggart" and his followers fall for it like they did his prediction.
P.T. Barnum would have been all in this $#1+!
He said that if no one is "raptured" than it just means he came, and went because no one was worthy.
So he has already worked that angle to his advantage. But what really pisses me off about this dude, is that he is so "politically incorrect" in his speaking of the Jews.
He said, since he didn't speak Jew that he had to rely on Google translate, and now that Google translate can speak Jew - he got his dates right this time. He has made predictions before about JC's coming to America. They came and went, just because he couldn't read "Jew."
What ignorant namesay speaks like this nowadays? You know, he only makes us all look stupid.
How did this guy become a preacher in the first place? And what the hell makes Christians follow him? That's what I want to know.
Yeah- he does seem like he might be from the backhills of somewhere. I, like you Rk, wonder what the rest of humanity thinks when they read stuff like what this guy is saying. You're right, it does make Americans appear to be stupid and completely one sided when it comes to religion. Here we have a guy who is an ordain minister, supposedly educated in the Christian faith, and he doesn't know that Jews speak Hebrew. Are you kidding me, how stupider can one be?
Interesting article! Good to see you out and about. Been busy at the museum? I hardy get to talk to you anymore. Love ya!
A billboard in South Jersey proclaims , May 22, 2011. So what gives with this date? I'm amazed at the stupidity of large groups of people at all times. I shouldn't be!!
I bet there are hundreds of lawyers rubbing their hands hoping for some get rich opportunities to sue Camping on behalf of the muppets who have quit jobs, sold houses, etc, etc.
The old saying was "there's one born every minute." The only difference today is with population increases there's 10 born every minute.
Camping ? Is that the same idiot that predicted the same thing was going happen on September 6, 1994 ?
If he's right this time I am going severely out of pocket 'cos I've got a bet on with a Jewish bookie that I'll still be around to celebrate the birth of the Pagan Sun God in December 2012.
Personally, I just think the butter has slipped off Campings toast !
may 22nd huh? I doubt it. My 39th birthday is the next day..the 23rd. What a great gift that would be, if I was able to see my Yeshua! :-)
your not going to. either you'll ascend to heaven, or suffer some amount of months, I forgot already how many they said. but anyway, good news is ... no dying that day!
Wait, wait. So what if I happen to die the day before that? Will I be one of those dead arising out of their graves?
I mean I never dreamed of being a zombie, but I suppose I'll take that over 5 months of suffering.
aww sweet!!!! I hadn't thought of that, you could be a zombie.
(I wouldn't recommended attempting to become a zombie tho, just in case that guy is wrong, and just hears voices.) BUT if you do become a zombie, your welcome to pop by the b-day party and scare some kids.
There is an elderly gentleman at my MIL's church, who has mathematically figured out "when" the last day will happen, but even he thinks it could be wrong. He says if it isn't this December, then he has another date predicted. Go figure... I have not seen his evidence or anything, but I do think nobody can know for sure when it'll happen.
Great comments WannaB!
The Bible says: "But concerning that day and that hour, no man knows, not the angels of the skies, but the father alone." Matthew 24:36
We have been given information to watch for signs so we are indeed prepared and ready. I do not believe God has shared the day or year with anyone on earth.
Beelzedad (and all unbelievers), every single soul is going to live forever either in Hell or with Christ. And everyone will be forced to acknowledge Him as King and Lord if he/she doesn't do so out of truth. All He wants is for us to believe in Him, love Him and allow Him to love us. Isn't love a wonderful thing to look toward? Please just read the book of John with an open mind. I long to see you and all my other brothers and sisters in the next life, living free and in full worship. Just try it, not for religion. Religion is not Jesus, love is totally different.
I am not going to argue back and forth. I just wanted to offer you this opportunity to see Jesus as He really is and not as many have portrayed Him.
I would never want to worship or have anything to do with a god who will "force" me to acknowledge him, especially if it is to love him and believe in him. Only a psychopathic despot behaves and makes demands like that.
If the only other choose is hell, so be it.
Thanks for confirming what we pretty much already knew about your god.
Funny how Satan does not make the same demands or threats as your god.
There is no proof Jesus ever existed (his real name wasn't Jesus anyway) and even less evidence he was anything but a mortal man if he did indeed exist.
I doubt seriously he would want to come back anyway.
We're doomed Earnest! I heard the meteor is heading towards Australia, mate!
I hope not, because I will not be ready. The bible did say the end of the world will come like a thief in the night.
WOW! One week from today the world is going to end! According to who? I can't wait to laugh at this fool.
I respect your thoughts. I believe the way I do, because of the real miracles I have received in my life when I follow "my truth". If you were to see the pain and heartbreak in my life, as well as the miracles that came from it. You may then have the ability to open your heart and mind to the possiblty of something that is really wonderful! I would rather be wrong and not lose my soul, than follow another's truth and lose my soul.
How do you know YOUR truth is any more factual than others? What if you are encouraging others to worship the wrong god? Will you be accountable for them losing their souls if you are wrong? I certainly hope so, as you would deserve great torment for convincing them to follow your own delusions. Or do you disagree?
Yes! I will be accountable for my decisions, my choices. There is no way around that one. The God I worship is the right one. He is the way, the truth, and the Life! If I am delusional, than I am one heck of a happy person in being delusioned. Now, may I ask you? What has turned your heart so cold? My heart is really sad for you. I will keep you in prayer. That you may find peace, love, and forgiveness. You are wonderful and specail! You are a talented writer. So please don't be angry with me, for what I believe, ok? Maybe we can agree to disagree? I am not here to upset you. I am trying to grow as a writer, encourage others. And learn from everyone! Be safe, and Blessings in your life! :-)
No one can predict a day, or an hour for Judgment day, because even Jesus, the angels in heaven but only the father knows the day and the hour for the great tribulation to start. Judgment day is not a literal 24-hour day, but a period of time. Judgment day takes place when the tribulation is cut short. We don’t know that date either, that’s why Jesus urged us to keep on the watch, because it will come at a time that you do not expect.
See you on the 22nd
Just like there are false messages in the world there are false messages in Christianity. False messages are the greatest tool for toppling pride.
Just as a word for those who read my post containing the weak and sickly among Christiandom. This scenario clarifies what i meant. The weak and sickly will flock to this kind of message because they are not strong (grounded in the word and person of Jesus Christ).
Just in case I am going out Friday night and I'm gonna have a night to remember (or not to as the case may be!). The world may just as well end on the Saturday, I wont feel it...lol
Anyone else want to come party??
I had a really hard day today at work. Our surgical case load was difficult to say the least. So, here I am, draggin' hind-tit, and my Atheist husband says to me, "Honey, just look at the bright side, you'll be flyin' high on Sat."
I was like, hardy, hard, har.... butthead.
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