I have noticed that the forums have been flooded with God, and the proof if there is one or not. Why do you think people ask questions that they really don't believe in. Why do you think they just randomly pick the topic about creation, God. Then they leave some pretty negative comments. Why do you think people act this way?
Because people are drawn to Him, whether they wanna be or not.
Love that picture, by the way!
moths to a flame, love...moths to a flame.
Moths to a flame? Thats a disgusting analogy. I suppose it is fairly apt though since all people will burn in hell......
I think everyone grows at their own rate. People may start with a silly question then actually learn something. IMO seekers make up the majority of world population even among those professing to follow a specific religion. That's why there is so much controversy. Those who do not question authority or standards are either like cattle or they have a wonderful understanding of who and where they want to be.
But silly may be in the mind of the viewer. The seeker wants real answers.
I've noticed this too and it makes me sad. I do agree with Brenda, Toby, and Ms Dee that maybe these people who open up the debate are really just hoping to find the "proof" they've been asking for. - I do believe in God, by the way. I don't have a 1000 words to try to convince anyone else. For me, the proof is US. I also believe Science only proves HOW God did it. - Oh here's a story my Daddy told me. "Scientist decided that they now could create life on their own just like God did and no longer needed Him. So they went to Him and said, "God, Sorry, we don't need you anymore. God said, "Okay, show me what you can do". So they bent down and starting raking the dirt into test tubes and God interupted. "Excuse me, Use your own dirt" I thought it was cute. Y'all have a good day!
Hi Kelly. Maybe some people are hoping to find proof but I wanted to bring up another possibility. For myself, I'm not looking for proof. In fact I don't think it's something that has proof and that's OK. Some people feel compelled to ask questions about things that don't make sense to them.
I question religion because it is the cause of many wars, many deaths and much violence.
People accepting that it is ok to believe in things without evidence leave the path totally clear for crazy people to believe that they have to kill in the name of whoever or they need to kill in order to go to some magical place when they die.
Faith is NOT a virtue and belief without evidence is foolish that causes many problems that this world coul do without.
Unfortunately, believers are pretty serious about their sky fairies and get angry when their invisible friends are mocked or criticized, so they leave negative comments and act atrociously.
Yes, and unfortunately, some people get offended by people 'shoving their beliefs' down their throats when they log into religious discussion forums.
Certainly, one who didn't want beliefs shoved down their throat would choose to be active in religious forums... that makes a lot of sense.
Remember Emrld, this is a writers site more than it is about the forums usage. The religion and philosophy threads are not restricted to those who are religious, but are for everyone.
No, I definitely understand that. It's just interesting when someone claims to hate hearing people's religious beliefs, yet they spend so much time in a religious forum... it's a bit of a masochistic view, imo.
Aww, feeling the need to put words in my mouth to support your dishonesty? Filling these forums with fallacies getting boring because others call you on them?
No, you said those words to me before. I would go get them and quote them, but every time I quote you contradicting yourself you just ignore it. So, there's no point.
Someone needs to do it. The words that are coming out are garbage. You have no right on the forums until you write a hub or two. Go away and come back when you are finished. I hate it when there is work to be done, but some jerk just wants to hang around the water cooler talking smack. I don't tolerate slackers in my shop.
Much better to pretend to hear the words you want to hear?
Really? You are the authority of who gets rights and who doesn't?
LOL! Good thing I have a thicker skin than you believers or I might just report the personal insults.
You know, its one thing to have a discussion where all parties respect the others. It's another to attempt to have a discussion and one particular group insists they have a monopoly on the concept to such an extent that any who don't agree will suffer for eternity for the audacity of having a difference of opinion.
There are quite a few who still enjoy the exchange, even if they do grow tired of those who think it's their duty and right to attempt to force their beliefs. I would think you might understand this. You appear to attempt to be open minded.
I enjoy discussing, I just have no respect for Troubled, who mocks people while pretending to be offended by them stating their beliefs.
I have respect for everybody's opinions. I don't have respect for people who demean others.
Ok. So some here do appear to be completely clueless when it comes to spiritual topics. I still respect their right to choose to be here and weigh in with their opinion. Certain styles of non belief may degrade wide swaths of people in the process of sharing them, but many times so does belief, no matter how sickeningly sweet the believer pretends to be while sharing it.
I personally think that the most clueless people when it comes to spirituality are the people who believe it exists.
Oh, there's one of the clueless ones now. That was cute. Say it again. You guys who can't understand the dialogue keep me in stitches.
Haha, and theres the insult. I knew one was coming pretty soon. You guys are so predictable.
Yes. That's me. You call me clueless. I call you clueless. Shame on me for calling you what you called me. I suppose I could have said you were so profound, but then you'd complain about the fact that I lied.
I was referring to you implying that I am incapable of understanding a basic dialogue.
Oh my gosh! Did I actually type that? That's my bad. I thought it, didn't mean to type it.
Just kidding. That was rude and I apologize. I enjoy reading your posts.
I wouldn't know. All I do know is that there is no evidence that it does exist.
Nope. Just like leprechauns fairies and unicorns have no evidence that they dont exist either.
Then I guess you have to accept the reality that they just might.
I never said I didn't accept the possibility of anything.
The reality is that reality is still being explored, just like the human body is still being explored. However, no spirit and no soul has been confirmed as of yet.
The only reason people even think about it is because of mysticism type ideologies.
I didn't waste anything. The fact that you see it as a waste should tell you something about yourself, but I'm sure you'll dismiss what it should tell you.
What should it tell me about myself oh wise one? I'm sure there are those who find you to be philosophical, I just don't happen to be one of them. By the way, the little smiley faces you put into every post don't really add the things you want them to.
I shouldn't be the one to tell you anything about yourself. Your own conscience should be doing that. So, in the end, you're either living by ego or by conscience......and from what I've gathered, including this post I am responding to...it wasn't conscience which led you to posting. So you figure it out.
Yes there are some who do, but most of those who do read my posts and understand me as a person, knows it's not about philosophy so much, but is about honesty.
They are not there for you. They are there to demonstrate my reaction, which apparently is something you didn't know about using them to begin with.
Do you often react to your own words? Let me show you how I react when I read your latest bit of thought.
Got proof of what? That mysticism is alive and well in people's thinking? Sure, mention the word soul or spirit and it's enough proof that mysticism is alive and well.
Ok, sorry I forgot with you I have to be exceptionally specific and inordinately expressive.
SO, For Ray: D o - You - Have - Proof - Of - Your - Statement:
The only reason people even think about it is because of mysticism type ideologies.
I already know the answer, you never have any proof you simply "know" it is true and anyone with any sense at all should "know" since you said it, it must be accepted as "the absolute truth".
Good Luck with that.
(Hey you haven't flagged and had any of my hub's pulled because of thier titles lately...slipping?)
Horray for the hippies! At least they believed in something. hugs!
Spirituality is solely based on mystic ideologies, which form mysticism. Mysticism is intellectually dishonest and was deemed that over 40 years ago.
Hmmm. Ray, that's weak -especially for you.
exhibit a: 6800 years v 40 years
exhibit b: the mention of precisely the number 40 -a Freudian slip perhaps.
hope all is well!
Actually, it's not. That's just your perception of it being weak. It's intellectually dishonest to speak of something which isn't proven, as though it's fact.
Are you going to now sit there and deny that?
That has been my BIGGEST GRIPE with BOTH Religion & Science.
Both are "dishonest" -yet boldly claim totality of truth.
But again, I cannot say intellect is ever dishonest. Intellect is the processor of something else -human ambition, ambiguity, absolution, etc. Humans did not create or design intellect -so of itself, intellect is pure. But they attempt -for reasons I'll never quite make sense of- to manipulate intellect in the form of scientific theory, mysticism, magic potions, bone fragments, museums, temples and a circus to out due all others.
Always good to 'see' Ray!
ps, you guys get hit with that snow last week. We ended up with 7 inches on the ground -in October!
Science doesn't claim truth and never did.
I think you're missing the point. Rational and Irrational. I didn't say that intellect was created by anyone, but if you want to "think" about it for a second, intelligence is just another concept.
And, it wouldn't be the "intellect" that is dishonest, but the person using their intelligence, which is dishonest. It's irrational intellectual thinking that is dishonest. The person isn't only being dishonest with themselves, but are also being dishonest with other people.
It's good to "see" James.
We ended up with something like 8-12 inches...and yes it happened in October, which hasn't happened in several decades if my memory recalls.
I'm sure you didn't get the memo on many things.
Oh but I am, I want to be all knowing like you.
Nice smart a$$ remark. Showing off your character are you. I make no claim at being all knowing and your ridiculous remark that states that I am "all-knowing", just shows off how much character you have actually learned from your religion.
LOL! The believer believes their beliefs are respectful and don't demean others. Classic stuff!
That is why he is *troubled*. We should try not to get upset with him but state truth and pray for the soul!
Aww, you also felt the need to insult me personally simply because your delicate belief system is undergoing scrutiny.
LOL! It's hilarious you actually believe it has anything to do with logging into religious discussion forums.
I believe in God and God believes in me.
I just don't believe in dogma because dogma does not believe in me.
Mahatma Ghandi once said "I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ."
How do you know god believes in you? Have you met him? That would be awesome.
@ Xenonlit, I love Ghandi. He was a wise and wonderful spiritual man. Some believe that Ghandi was God coming back to earth. go figure!
The fact that the subject happens to be god is irrelevant. If the subject was politics it would be the same (head to the politics section to see what I mean). Could even be sport. Really doesn't matter. In the environments we have developed in, it's advantageous that we compete with others. So we do. Even though in developed societies this is physically unnecessary (we don't have to fight for food) the imperative remains and is therefore expressed intellectually through the various social layers. Religion and politics are two such layers. Physical competition still occurs, either through sport which is essentially pseudo-fighting, or through real fighting commonly known as war. The latter is usually filtered through social layers as well, which leads people to believe that wars are caused by politics, religion etc. which is not the case. Wars are caused by the same thing that causes people to leave negative comments for those who have a different world-view.
It's the imperative to identify yourself with a group, then identify 'others' who are part of a different group, then compete with them. That is a fundamental human behaviour. Sometimes the distinction is religion, sometimes politics, sometimes race, sometimes gender, sometimes nationality etc. Usually those making the distinctions always believe they have a perfectly good reason for doing so. If such behaviour couldn't be rationalised, a person would be faced with the prospect that their behaviour is biologically determined, rather than something they control. Not a comfortable prospect for self-aware creatures like us.
So those people who enter religious forums and leave negative comments might have you believe it's because they want to rid the world of the harmful effects of religion through ridicule (a good cause as they see it). The belief in the worthiness of the behaviour may be genuine. But in actuality they are behaving in a way that is biologically determined and their good cause is simply a rationalisation that insulates them from an uncomfortable truth: that all major distinctions between human beings are superficial and artificial. That essentially they are no different than the people in the group they work hard at distinguish themselves from. This is very uncomfortable in the face of human nature as is, because it flies in the face of the natural tendency to believe 'we' are different (better) than the 'them'.
To Jo's original questions:
1. Questions starting with "why," whether addressed to God or man, almost never seek information, but are the initial start to a bargaining session.
2. You don't have to be in ministry long before you start running into atheists. They think their comments are creative and original, but usually boil down to the same two general situations: they're mad at God (I prayed that God would heal Grandma, but she died anyway) or they're mad at the church (You're not gonna make me believe that crap).
3. They start out talking about the non-existence of God and immediately switch over to abuses by the church (That's two different topics, Tonto. That ain't gonna fly here.)
4. Atheists have a lot at stake here: No God --> No Law --> No Penalty, even though every other choice in life has consequences Yeah, but this is different. Really. I hope. Kinda.
5. They cap it off by saying that we can't prove that God exists. Nobody can prove that love exists either, but a lot of atheists are looking for it. What is this- selective disbelief? Hmmmm. Please let me in on the secret.
6. I'll save the rest for a real post later.
@ pastorjerryl, well you have said it in a nutshell. Thank you so much for sharing. I actually learned something from you! Blessings & hugs!
To you that is. To many others, you've proved nothing.
Also true. To many thier personal biased opinion proves it proves nothing. But they fail to prove thier stance with anything other than thier biased personal opinion...
But to many others I have proven it. "technically true and true are technically...the same thing." ....and everything in the proof is true.
They should ask valid questions; the Creator God by definition is the Being on His own; so it is invalid question to ask who created Him.
Brenda's right. Reminds me of two men arguing about the existence of God. One claims to be an atheist. The second claims there's no true atheist as we're all drawn toward God whereby the first man avers, "I am an atheist. Swear to God I am!"
Even those who say they ask such questions just to get a debate going...because they are bored I think down deep fit what Brenda is saying. They often don't even realize they are being drawn to Him and would call such a notion "hogwash". That's an amazing photo, Jo!
I figured, before I posted, that the obvious would be more than obvious, but I guess not.
Why ask why?
Why ask questions?
People usually ask questions to get answers to those questions.
Are you describing yourself or your wife? I'm not sure exactly, so you're going to need to clarify.
@ greek one, *witch*? is that really necessary? I know you are better than that!
I’ve wondered the same thing. The only answer I could think of to gain hub page credit for asking answering questions, commenting on the forums and generally being considered part of the community regardless if it is positive or beneficial to the community.
sometimes things that are silly to you might be pertinent to others
@ prettydarkhorse, it is so good to hear from you! I hope you are doing well! See, I asked this question b/c of all the negative comments about God and the belief about God. Some say they believe in nothing. Then if this is the case, then why ask a question "How can a christian prove that there is a God"? I didn't mean to offend you or anyone else. I just can't wrap my mind around some of the comments that folks leave about God is all. To me, it is silly, but I apologize if I am coming across with any disrespect for the person to believe in what ever they choose not to believe in. Take care!
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