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Truth no longer matters?

  1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
    sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago

    Has anyone else noticed that more people are blatantly lying these days and when confronted with the truth, they get angry with you?

    1. couturepopcafe profile image62
      couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Maybe people are lying just as much as ever. You're just seeing through it more. No reason to confront unless it affects your life, right?

      1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
        sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Lying affects all of us, doesn't it?  From Government down to friends to acquaintances you meet in every day situations.  If everyone has their own truth, than there is no true reality...black is no longer black, words are just words without true meaning, you can no longer trust in anything or anyone....we just have chaos.

        1. mischeviousme profile image60
          mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          And then, words are but noises we believe we understand. This would be to say that words are just as meaningless as that they were meant to label and this world we live on will truly never be understood. The only true lie is that we know something. We have a basic understanding, but we truly only know how words affect us and that is all.

          1. profile image68
            paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I don't agree with you.

            Words are always meaningful; as particles in the physical world.

      2. profile image68
        paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        A good piece of advice

    2. Pearldiver profile image87
      Pearldiverposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      The truth is that you are right! smile

      Just as people are in denial of their need to stop eating junk food, before airlines finally refuse to carry them, or liars refuse to take responsibility for the fact that they have in fact knowingly chosen to lie, because they choose to not be real, or are actually mentally defective... perhaps it is true that fools believe that they are Not Fools and others don't give a damn! yikes

      Perhaps it represents the cost of accepting all the things in life that are sugarcoated!  sad  But... ultimately it is a matter of personal choice!

      1. profile image68
        paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this
    3. A Troubled Man profile image60
      A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      They will lie if it jeopardizes or shatters their belief systems.

      But then, that's exactly what facts are all about, shattering belief systems. smile

      1. profile image68
        paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Many a time

    4. profile image0
      icountthetimesposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Politicians always lie and are at the top of society. We're set back examples and it filters through. Plus I guess it's an extend the ability to lie is within all of us. I'm not sure that i'd say people lie more than they used to. Things never change all that much, just our perception that they do,

    5. GoldenBird profile image60
      GoldenBirdposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      What is lying? How do you know what is truth or not? Even when you're sure, who cares to get burnt by playing the heck?

    6. profile image68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      So, Truth matters.

  2. MelissaBarrett profile image60
    MelissaBarrettposted 5 years ago

    If you are framing that in the context of religious philosophy (as per forum subject) then there really can't being any lying.  Just a lot of people who think their opinion is the truth.

    1. profile image68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      That is why the discussion is made.

  3. profile image0
    Muldaniaposted 5 years ago

    It would depend on which truth you confront people with, because there are so many, and they mostly disagree with each other.

    1. Disappearinghead profile image88
      Disappearingheadposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      By definition, if one truth does not agree with another truth, either one or both of them is not the truth.

      1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
        sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        "which truth"?   "there are so many"?  What happened to truth being something that is backed up with facts, as the dictionary meaning states -  "the true or actual state of matter" "conformity with actual reality; verity" "a verifiable or indisputable fact, proposition or principle".  There is only one truth in most situations....one that can be verified, indisputably.  That is the truth.  I think it is very sad that more and more people today find it so easy to lie because their end justifies their means - but it does not really when no one can trust anyone anymore and you never know if someone is actually telling you something that is a fact or just a fictional fact in their own mind.

        1. mischeviousme profile image60
          mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          The concept of truth will differ from one person to another, so then when one is speaking honestly, it will probably not be a truth to the listener. The definitions in dictionaries are but labels and basic understandings. How can one see it as fact, if it is but a series of labels and basic understandings? Higher understanding then, could still be seen as lies by the ignorant. So it's realy not so much about lying, as it is about individual ignorance.

          1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
            sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            So, I guess in your world, black is or can be pink or green or purple, birds can be dogs or cats or elephants, humans can be ladderback chairs or eggs or books...right?  If the dictionary meaning of something is only a "label".   I think it is about lying...and lying is about individual irresponsibility and selfishness.  It is just another way for someone to avoid facts and still allow the person to acheive something that convinces them of their own reality that is truly irreality.  Those people that lie and convince themselves it is ok, do not live in reality and are just fooling themselves in the long run and cause damage to the relationships with those they are lying to.

            1. mischeviousme profile image60
              mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I'm just looking at from a different angel, which is a healthy way of affirming certain realities. Words are but chatter if the meaning cannot be conveyed to everyone. Just as foreign languages are impossible to understand, so then is the chatter of animals. We only think we fully understand things, but in truth, we only understand them in concept.

              1. profile image0
                Muldaniaposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                The human mind constructs its own truths all the time.  We simply take it for granted that the way we see the world is the only way it can be seen.  However, in this world, we will encounter others who have their own mental constructs of truth, which are as real to them.  Even objective scientific truth can change.  What was once scientific fact can be overturned.  And there are scientists working in the same field as each other, who conduct the same experiments and reach totally different conclusions.  So, even the scientific method is not immune from personal opinion.

                1. mischeviousme profile image60
                  mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Absolutely. But them some are so filled with "I" that, to them, there truth cannot be overturned. They are truly lost and for that, I feel a sense of loss and it is a shame indeed.

      2. profile image68
        paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You mean anomalies help us find the next reality.

    2. profile image68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      A lot of effort and prayer to the Creator God is required to discern virtue from evil.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        How about just being mindfull of every aspect of your own actions. You don't need a God or gods for that. If you see evil or do evil it is a happening, not a creation. You decided to do evil things because you weren't being mindfull of how your desires affect you and the world around you. Instead you let somebody convince you to think like they do.

  4. anonimuzz profile image83
    anonimuzzposted 5 years ago

    I think many people are mostly looking for comfort rather than truth, when it comes to religion/spirituality. It's just that, eventually, people might conclude that only the truth can give them that comfort they want, and so, at that point, they truly put on the critical thinking glasses to find it (not as an ultimate purpose, but as a mean for the relief they need). However, I think that whatever truth we come up with in this field will always be relative, never absolute. So, I'd be careful about 'confronting people with the truth', as I think that the real big truth is: we just don't know.

    1. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Thank you. I've been trying to convey that forever. But I don't think everyone will agree with you either.

      1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
        sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I was not necessarily referring to the "truth" as in religious truth when I chose this forum topic, this was more for the philosophical part of the topic....religious truth per the gospel of Christ is for another day.  I was referring to black v white, proven factual truths....tangible truth, that so many people today find easy to lie about.

        1. mischeviousme profile image60
          mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          How do you know they are lying or just speaking individual subjective truth? To lie to someone, I have to something like "The sky is not up, it is down". But then again, if I don't know that the sky is up and had been told it was down, how do I know I am lying?

          1. A Troubled Man profile image60
            A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Simple, when you are shown that the sky is up and you continue to argue it is down, then you should know you're lying.

            Individual subjective truth? lol

            1. mischeviousme profile image60
              mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              That's how philosophy works. Questioning the nature of things. You can pick on it all you want, but you're realy only making yourself look ignorant. I like you, but I don't have to like what you say. That is the nature of disagreement.

              1. A Troubled Man profile image60
                A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                No, that's how science works. Philosophy asks the question 'why' which is a question of a subjective nature.



                lol

                1. mischeviousme profile image60
                  mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  You are filled with hate and I'm sorry for you. I cannot change you though and it is something you'll have be alone with. I'm sorry.

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image60
                    A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    lol <--- me being filled with hate.



                    Really? Is that something you often do to others, try to change them so they are viewing and believing in your esoteric gobbledegook?

            2. profile image0
              Muldaniaposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              It could actually be argued that the sky is down.  We have agreed as a species, to understand things in the same way as each other.  The map of the world for instance is always shown with Europe and North America at the top, and Africa and Australia at the bottom.  But how can we know which way the universe is pointed?  North can only be at the top, if we know that there is a top and bottom of the universe, which we don't.  People used to joke that going to Australia would mean falling of the world, because it was underneath the Earth.  However, gravity makes such understanding meaningless.  When maps were made centuries ago, the world was Euro-centric, so it made sense to place it at the top.  According to our accepted view though, the Australian sky could be said to be "down" because it is below the Earth, even though Australians would need to look up to see it.  Up and down, and north and south are however subjective experiences, even though they are commonly agreed upon.

              1. anonimuzz profile image83
                anonimuzzposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Ohhh, good point! I never stopped to analyze the way maps are made. Indeed, Europe is pretty much the center and the top. Makes sense historically, but it would be fun to see some maps turned upside down, with Europe at a lame corner, etc. I'll stop writing nonsense now; there's an interesting discussion going on.

        2. profile image68
          paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Does that happen, really? Please elaborate for us all.

    2. profile image68
      paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think your last sentence in very truthful; science only discusses possibilities as they say; absolutes could be understood from the Word of the Creator God; if correctly looked into.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        When you can come up with some concrete proof that none can deny, you'll have all the believers you could ever hope for. Until then you'll have just as much credibility as everyone else in these matters (none). I cannot tell you what is true for you, only you can. The concept of God is just as much a guess as anything else. Your brain makes it real for you therefor, it is an illusion. The fact that you honstly think something like this is absolutely real is a product of your brain and how it's been conditioned by what ever crowd you are following. So if it is true, it's probably only true for you and your version of a  creator God is is your's, not evryone else's of said crowd. Think for yourself, without your brain and ignore what anybody says is absolutely true about God.

  5. sallieannluvslife profile image86
    sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago

    There really is no such thing as "individual subjective truth"....basic knowledge is that a rock is hard, a pillow is soft, the sky is up not down here on earth, ice is cold, fire is hot....c'mon...you don't really believe what you are saying....you may as well live on the moon - but the moon...oh shoot....the moon ....do we really believe the moon is the moon or is it just a subjective truth?  Maybe it really isn't the moon at all because the moon is a word that labels something...it could be the noom now or the couch or the sea....I'm beginning to like my world even better!!  My husband can now be my boyfriend or just an acquaintance on the street...I can say my dog meows and my hair will never turn gray because gray is just a subjective truth and label.....

  6. recommend1 profile image71
    recommend1posted 5 years ago

    Lie and truth are not necessarily directly connected.   

    It is only a lie when you are deliberately stating what you believe to be untrue.

  7. sallieannluvslife profile image86
    sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago

    *see previous postings for responses

  8. Reality Bytes profile image93
    Reality Bytesposted 5 years ago

    The games are played with your life on the line
    Some lose, you win if you keep on trying
    I don't mind doing the time, I'm happier being alive
    Now I know the only truth is your own, most sacred lesson I've ever learned
    I know we are free

    I've been robbed, I've been fooled
    I intent now to make my own rules
    Dagger's edge cut the line, I've been down that road
    Too many times
    What's to fear. fear no more,
    Show my conscience what fear's for
    Now I know this is so real
    What's done is done so do as you will!

    Testament - The Ballad

  9. sallieannluvslife profile image86
    sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago

    I would like to thank everyone for their insightful input into my forum question.  It has really helped me to understand the world we live in today - that there are those of us who live in reality and those of us who live in their own personal subject truth "reality" which allows for no personal responsibility and no consequences for personal choices, where words are just labels and labels are well, whatever you would like them to be, along with everything else.  This forum has helped me to understand why there are so many confused people in the world, why the world is so chaotic and why psychiatrists are so rich.

    1. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      lol I like the psychiatry jab. I am a pragmatist, a realist and I have many roots in religion. I just see myself in everyone and I see everyone in myself. I see all of the qualities that make up my psyche in that of others and I attemt to relate to them on a personal level.

      1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
        sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        It was not a jab at all, just a statement made by view of the obvious....and frankly, made in sadness for those that are so confused, not an attempt to jab.

        1. mischeviousme profile image60
          mischeviousmeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          The words ye spake created laughter in my heart. This world we live on is just one large sanitarium, in which we are all the patients.

          1. sallieannluvslife profile image86
            sallieannluvslifeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Agreed!

          2. profile image68
            paarsurreyposted 5 years ago in reply to this



            The hell would be hospital for the wrong doers to improve oneself; this world is test from the Creator God.

  10. profile image72
    SanXuaryposted 5 years ago

    There is no way not to notice. When one considers that are entire society has been robbed and we do nothing but accept it we have an enormous problem. We are witnessing the great age of denial and the anger simmering underneath is one of great confusion. One has to truly fear doing the right thing in a society that has legalized robbing your home, 401K, the tax payers and this list could go on forever. Still there was money and all of it is still in some ones hands. Worst of all they can legally do it all over again when ever they please. Now you get to be the con man or the victim. Most of us are still working for these masters for even less today as they lie and take you for the next ride. When we are no longer in denial and realize the truth then all hell will break loose. I am guessing we will continue to blame the wrong people and eventually be robbed until we have nothing and no choices left. Perhaps things will level out and the blind will walk into the night and a few decades from now we can get robbed again.

 
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