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Jesus' saccrifice was in vein

  1. mischeviousme profile image60
    mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago

    If jesus died for the sins of men, it would be all men. I think (if Jesus existed) that Jesus was trying to get people away from religion instead, people made a religion of the saccrifice. Something that was supposed to pertain to all men, was reserved for the few. If one can say they are part of an exclusive club, they can draw in more followers. If it was said that it applied to all people, none would be interested.

    1. Chris Neal profile image84
      Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      No, it pertained to all men at all times. Yes, He came for the Jews first, but He also interacted with the Gentiles.
      Your logic is phallacious. Something that applies to all men applies to all men (and women.) Something is what it is. Because many people weren't (and aren't) interested does not make it less valid. Nor does trying to redefine something using nothing but vague psychology make it true. In Jesus' own day, He encountered many people who were uninterested in something that applied to all men (remember the Pharisees and Sadducees?) They were the members of the exclusive club, Jesus pointed the way to God.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        If that is so, how can one tell me that I have to be christian to find God? If Jesus died for all men's sins, then they wouldn't have to accept him as their savior. A true hero saccrifices for the whole of humanity, not for the needs of the few.

        1. 0
          Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Being a Christian simply means accepting Jesus the Christ as your Savior.  Why would He die for anyone just so they could follow someone else who isn't divine and has no power to save anyone's soul?  He didn't die for you so that you could follow Buddha or some other man or statue.  HE is the one who died for you and for all mankind to have the opportunity to be born-again and go to heaven. 
          His sacrifice is only "in vain" for those people who refuse to follow Him.

          1. mischeviousme profile image60
            mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Can I not just follow the meaning of the teaching? I am not of a Buddhist, Christian, Hindu or any other religion. I see them all as equally valid perceptions, they all point in the same direction, just the motives of the individual differ. If Jesus died for all man, as it says in the bible, then he also died for those that would never know his name.

            1. 0
              Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              The whole world knows, or will know, His name.  Christians are commissioned by Him to tell the world about Him.  That's shown in the Bible.  For anyone who's never heard of Him, then I believe He reveals Himself to them at some point before they die (He IS God, after all, and the sacrifice of Jesus is the only Way that's sanctioned for anyone to be saved).

              1. mischeviousme profile image60
                mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                What if I don't believe that? What if I am already with the creator? What can one say then? To me, Jesus was just one of many pointing out a path... I walk the path I was born to walk. If my path brings me to my God, how can anyone tell me otherwise?

                1. 0
                  Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  You can believe whatever you want.
                  I'm just wondering why you wouldn't believe in the God who Loves you enough to die for you.

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Perhaps, for similar reasons why you don't believe in Allah, or Zeus, or ...

                  2. mischeviousme profile image60
                    mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Because I have a personal relationship with the God I've created for myself. I walk the path of my perception, to me God is not out there, God is everything, everywhere, all of the time. God is not something I seek, I have found my God within my self. My God has no name, but that which I percieve.

            2. Chris Neal profile image84
              Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              The meaning of the teaching IS that you must follow Christ. Of course He died for all men, but those who reject Him will be rejected by Him. That's pretty clearly spelled out several times in the Gospels. Yes, God is love (as it says in 1 John) but He is also justice and righteousness.

              1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                lol Yes, that's real "love" - pure rejection.

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  "Sigh"

                  You know, the sad thing is that if you would ever actually open up and have a real conversation, we might actually get along. I'm the first to admit that the church isn't what it should be and Christians don't always do what they should. But then you go and make blanket statements like that, what should I think? That you had a horrible life? If you did, then I'm sorry. That you just like making statements like that because it gives you some kind trip to think you're "sticking it to the Christians?" I'm too old and have been too many places to buy that.

                  Saying that you've received "pure rejection" would be sad if it were true, but even from me that hasn't been true (come on, I'm still talking to you! If I completely rejected you I wouldn't do that!) I mean, there are enough stories about Christians and other religious folk who have been unnecessarily hard on people, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all you ever faced from Christians is total rejection.

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    lol





                    lol

                    Having a "real" conversation would not include the religious fantasies you embrace and shove down throats as it only shows there is nothing "real" at all about anything you could possibly say.

                    But, I know you'll never get that, because Jesus is the only way to Heaven. lol

            3. 0
              Phoebe Pikeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              In my experience and in my studies, I have found that those who believe and accept that their is life after this, and go towards goodness will be in heaven. There was this tribe in Africa where the women are brutalized daily and the men are taught to be "master" to the wife as if she is a dog. When missionaries went there, to tell them of Jesus, the women all ready knew even though no one was allowed to tell them about him before. They had a different name for him, but they had all the core values.

          2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
            Vladimir Uhriposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Brenda, you said it all. Truth shall set people free.

            1. 0
              Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Amen Vladimir.
              You have a wonderfully interesting profile and I'm loving your hubs so far!  Blessings! smile

        2. Chris Neal profile image84
          Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Actually, you don't have to be Christian to find God. People who are anything BUT Christian do it all the time. It's just that if you DO find God through His Son, Jesus Christ, and understand just what He did for us, then of course you become Christian after that.

          But I never said you must put the cart before the horse!

          And by the way, He did sacrifice for the whole of humanity. Whoever has told you that His sacrifice was just for the chosen few has led you badly astray.

          1. mischeviousme profile image60
            mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I find the entire scope of Christian belief confusing. I was a die hard Christian for over 20 years then one day, I woke up. I realized that God was not contained in a religion or in a teaching, I realized that the only God I truly percieved was a part of my perceptions. I saw that God was an aspect of my consciuosness, not so much a fairytale being. I saw the universe as one large living entity, in which God was but one small part; perception.

            1. Chris Neal profile image84
              Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              You're right that the entire scope is confusing. You're right that God is not contained in a religion, although His teaching is contained in the bible. God is an external, personal God (meaning He is a person, not that He's your personal God.)

              The universe is certainly in motion, but it is not alive in the same sense that you and I are.

              I don't want to be hard on you, but I think that your failure to understand the basics of Christianity (that Christ died for everyone's sin, that He was raised on the third day, that we must accept this free gift) or at least that it got lost in the clutter, means that you were probably (I don't know this for certain, of course) a die hard for a specific teacher or church, and not for Christ.

              1. mischeviousme profile image60
                mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I respect the teachings of Jesus, not so much those contained in the bible. There are other books written at around the same time and many of the gospels are lost to history and the Nicene council. I see the teachings of Siddhartha Gautama just as valid, I don't discredit Meher Baba, Ghandi or Sai Baba either. To me there are many paths and I am on mine.

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I understand where you're coming from, and even understand why it might sound good. Do one thing, start listing out what each book actually teaches about God, sin, man, the afterlife and grace. They all disagree with each other, even many of those "lost" gospels disagree on very important points with the books actually written by men who knew Jesus. If the paths lead to different places, then not all the paths are valid.

        3. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
          Vladimir Uhriposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I am glad of Chris answer. Actually beside paid the price by Jesus for our sin He came also to restore faith trashed in Garden of Eden. The faith is the certificate of Governor while we in jail, that we are free.
          BTW we were children of God but by sin we were adopted by Satan.

      2. A Troubled Man profile image61
        A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        lol You spelled one word wrong there and I'm hoping it wasn't Gentiles. lol

        1. jonnycomelately profile image86
          jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          " Chris Neal wrote:

               He also interacted with the Gentiles.
               Your logic is phallacious. "



          Hahahahaha!!!   I could add some more gen,,tle humour but it would get banned pretty quick.

        2. Chris Neal profile image84
          Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Simple pleasures for simple minds!

          Yours! lol

          1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
            Vladimir Uhriposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Chris, great answer.

      3. jonnycomelately profile image86
        jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The important thing, in my opinion, is that we need to recognise the Pharisee and Sadducee  in our individual self, today, in reality.  It is no use harping back on history, as vague as some of it is, trying to decide how we should live today, UNLESS we can sort out our own inner attitudes and the outward hatred/cruelty which emanates as a result.

        This Hub, and others like it, is full of "Zealots" arguing ad infinitum about the theoretical aspects of christism, yet our world has so many practical problems which we could be solving with good common sense and caring.

        It's always been difficult to look inside of one's self for the answers because there is much more fun looking outwards at other people, and trying to solve their problems for them.

        1. Chris Neal profile image84
          Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Actually I agree with you.

        2. Chris Neal profile image84
          Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          However, although I do agree with you, let me be clear that there is nothing theoretical about Christ, or what He did for us. I'm not too sure what you mean by "christism," (google has nothing) but what is theoretical is any one given persons acceptance of it. Chistianity IS a practical approach to solving the world's problems. However, we must start by practicing it ourselves so that others can see what it really looks like. One of the drawbacks to this forum, and forums in general, is that it favors the argumentative over the practical.

          1. jonnycomelately profile image86
            jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            "Christ-ism," because I want to get away from the habit of using "Christianity," because the latter is used by christians to set themselves apart from "other religions."

            1. Chris Neal profile image84
              Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Now I'm intrigued (no kidding!)

              Christianity is seperate from other religions, as is Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism and (whether they want to admit it or not) Baha'i. I mean, the central beliefs are all different. So, I am really interested in knowing what you mean by "Christ-ism," especially that would make it different from Christianity.

              BTW - this is not me being argumentative, it's me geeking out. Even before I became a Christian I was interested in learning about different religious and philosophical thought systems and beliefs!

              1. jonnycomelately profile image86
                jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                One way in which christians tend to put themselves, and their religion apart, is to call it Christianity, and use the "-ism" to describe other religions.  I see it as a way of putting christians above the other religions in terms of authenticity and relevance. 

                All religions in my opinion are there to satisfy the human's innate need to believe in and worship a higher being.... I have no quarrel with this.  I will never try to pull a genuine belief apart, as long as it is used to satisfy the individual and his/her life needs.

                I perceive the Ego as that which puts "myself" and/or "my needs" first, raising my own importance above anything or anyone else.  Of course I am personally inclined to do this.... we all are to a greater or lesser extent.  The path to Enlightenment is a process of becoming aware of this ego and the way in which it poisons one's own pathway.

                I am very aware of the christian's ego, this again was very much part of my make-up, probably still is.  The life task is, again, becoming so aware of this that Ego becomes negated and is no long a stumbling block to Enlightenment. 

                It is possible to see Jesus' journey as being just this pathway.  He obviously had courage, conviction, awareness, wisdom.  And presumably he was well aware of the stumbling blocks in his own life, so thus was able to see them in others.  At the last moment, having felt that he had done his Father's work through extreme trials and tribulations, having gathered around himself those special friends whom he loved;  THEN he felt so let down in that final effort of the Ego (Satan, or any name you wish to give it) to retain its importance.

                Can you imagine what that man went through?  The humiliation of being called wrong by the hypocrites of the time; being stripped naked before a jeering crowd; made to carry a heavy "tree" on which they were going to hang him; seeing his loved ones, his family and friends, standing down there absolutely distraught by his suffering and embarrassment; then hanging there for hours, bleeding, in pain, barely able to breath because of the weight upon his lungs; AND HE ASKS his father, "after all I have strived to do in my life, why has it come to this? "

                That was Ego having a final fling.  Trying to prevent the Unconditional Love from winning.

                I personally do not see Jesus as being a Son of God apart from the rest of humanity.  I see him as having been just a human person.  When I delve into the deeper meanings of what is written in the New Testament, it is the personal lessons I can learn which are important to me.  It is not an excuse to place myself above others, or to declare Jesus, whoever he was in reality, as a demi-god or anything more than he was in reality.  That would be pandering to the "worship" bug.  I could equally believe in a star football player.

                There is a lot for you to consider here.  Good luck.

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  "One way in which christians tend to put themselves, and their religion apart, is to call it Christianity, and use the "-ism" to describe other religions.  I see it as a way of putting christians above the other religions in terms of authenticity and relevance. "

                  Without getting into everything else you said at this time, I might point out that the term "Christian" was actually originally a derogatory term that was adopted by the early believers. The same is true for "Quakers." So it is not a self-coined term, and in that sense is not meant to place us "above" Hindus, Muslims or Jains. That the others (mostly) have "ism" after their name is more a matter of semantics than psychology.

              2. jonnycomelately profile image86
                jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                There is a further point I would like to put here, also for discussion with others interested.

                I submit that the "religions" as practiced by Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc., are very different in the way they are practised by the general populations. The methods of prayer, devotion, chanting, music, pomp, decorations of the church/mosque/temple, etc. are different.

                However, the "pure" disciplinary spiritual practices in the background of each religion are essentially the same.  The process of meditation, focusing on the soul, or self, is understood by all the devotees, and you would find they all focus on the Divine Consciousness.

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes, the "pure" disciplinary practices (if you are talking about the mechanics) have substantial similarity. But the "Divine Consciousness" is a (sometimes very) different thing. Islam does not point to the same divinity as Christianity does not point to the same divinity as Hinduism does not point to the same divinity as Native American religion. For some that consciousness is an internal process or goal, but for the monotheistic religions it is very much an external, and self-aware, "consciousness."

                  If what you are saying is that all roads lead to the same destination, then I would have to disagree with that. If that's not what you are saying, I apologize and admit that maybe I'm not quite gettiing what you are saying.

                  1. jonnycomelately profile image86
                    jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Ok, I hear what you are saying:  "If what you are saying is that all roads lead to the same destination, then I would have to disagree with that.... "  We will have to agree to differ.  It is one of the reasons I don't call myself christian.  I can understand how you would see your point of view as fundamental to your calling yourself christian.

                  2. jonnycomelately profile image86
                    jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    With respect to what you have written and your point of view, Chris, but I see you as caught up in the "religion," so you cannot bring yourself to see the Divine Consciousness as being anything but alien to the christian way of thinking. 

                    It is not different at all, except in the name given to it.  Divine Consciousness is an undefinable quality, a spirit, something all-pervading. In this respect it is synonimous with Holy Spirit.  It's everywhere, without form, only manifest by the actions of "beings."

                    Some have argued about "Nothingness," and been unable to get their minds around accepting it.  I see "No-thingness" as being what all living things return to upon death of the body.  With "no-thingness" you have no defining, no boundaries, no form.  There is no differentiation, e.g., light or dark, big or small, high or low, black or white, colour or no colour, etc. 

                    Conversely, when there is "some-thingness" you have differentiation. You then have our Finite existence.  When something is finite, everything is changeable, there are boundaries, areas, up/down, wide/narrow, colours, blacks, whites, greys, loud, soft, far and near. There is a constant movement by degrees from one condition to another.  So, to be conscious of this finite existence depends on change.  Without change there can be no consciousness. 

                    Change is thus the fundamental factor of our existence, all the time we are living, and finite.  Without change there can be no consciousness. Once the body and the consciousness dies, there is Nothing.

                    God is infinite and therefore Nothing.  You and I are finite and therefore Something. 

                    Divine Consciousness therefore must be a Something in another dimention. 

                    Will this cloud the issues for everyone here in the forum?  Or is it too deep and difficult to grasp?  Maybe needs to be a new Hub.

                2. mischeviousme profile image60
                  mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I would have to agree with this and the above statement. Religion can straighten out one's own moral compass, though sometimes it can fuel a mob mentality.

                  That aside, people have only themselve's in this world. We are trapped by our own dogma and we definitely create our own dichotomies, religion (if practiced on an individual basis) can lead to a more fulfilling existance. When someone goes to a religious venue to be with the crowd and do what the others are doing, he/she is missing the point all together. Religion is about seeking a higher path, not about pleasing the higherarchy of the governing clergy or what have you.

          2. A Troubled Man profile image61
            A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            lol Yet, all it's ever accomplished is destruction and genocide. Christianity has failed miserably at solving anything. It divides people and sets them against one another. Pure nonsense, dude.

            1. Chris Neal profile image84
              Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Not true. Christianity kept history alive.

              Christianity fed the poor in Calcutta.

              Christianity sent in people to help in New Orleans when the government was unwilling and unable to.

              And Christianity has given people who need to be angry something to be angry at. A better grasp of actual history would be helpful, but I don't think you're all that interested. As long as you can point at any one given thing and say that's all it is, you're satisfied!

              Mazeltov!

              1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                While it murdered millions as a result.



                Non-believers.



                Certainly not your personal version of history. lol

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Perhaps, but all you have is your personal version as well.

                  First of all, what you are saying (whether you intended to or not) is that Christianity is the only force in recorded history that has ever decided to murder those who disagree with it for any reason. That is so not true that it really doesn't deserve the respect of a reply. BUT...
                  If you didn't mean to say that, then you might be a little more precise with your facts and a little less generous with your attacks.
                  If you DID mean to say it...

                  And that's just dealing with the (over)generalizations! lol

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    You mean the one written in history books as opposed to the bible?



                    Don't flatter your religion, Christianity does not hold the monopoly on murdering those who disagree with it's dogma.

                2. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Oh yeah, and it still fed the poor in Calcutta.

                  Which atheist organization did that? And when did they start?

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    "When Mother Teresa died, foreign dignitaries and the Western news media descended on the city. The reports on the funeral portrayed a city filled with starving orphans, wretched slums and dying people abandoned on the streets, except for the fortunate ones rescued by Mother Teresa.

                    Charity need not be inconsistent with clarity. Calcutta is a modern Indian city where poverty and inequality coexist with measurably increasing prosperity, expanding opportunities, cautious optimism and, above all, pride in its unique character. Mother Teresa might have meant well, but she furthered her mission by robbing Calcutta of its richly nuanced identity while pretending to love it."

                    New York Times lol

                3. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                  Vladimir Uhriposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  A troubled man, Christians means Christ like. What you refer were not Christians who kill. Exception is national right to protect.

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Sorry Vlad, but those who kill in the name of their God will tell you straight out they are about as "Christ like" as one can get. Since Christianity teaches Gods commands as opposed to morals and ethics, there have no qualms about it.

            2. bali777 profile image62
              bali777posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Agree but the problem with Christianity is that the whole bible is full of telling people about sins and good deeds ...

              and just in one place it says ... that Jesus absorbed everyone's sins and buried them in the ground so there is no such thing as going to hell

              if that was the case .. y does it even talk about sin anyway when it is not going to affect anyone in any way possible smile

    2. paradigmsearch profile image90
      paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Actually, it was because he didn't pay his taxes. That was the standard sentence for that particular transgression back then.

      1. Chris Neal profile image84
        Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Where did you get that?!

    3. Jerami profile image78
      Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It wasn't in vain!  It accomplished exactly what it was intended for.

        Just because we misunderstand what the intentions were ??? doesn't change the event one bit.

      1. mischeviousme profile image60
        mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It poisons the teaching and the meaning of the message.

        1. Jerami profile image78
          Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          sorry it takes me so long to reply to coments sometimes.
          cooking breakfast washing dishes and such.

            Do we ever fully understand the intentions behind someone elses actions.

            I know I don't.

          1. mischeviousme profile image60
            mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            If jesus actually was a saccrifice, he was probably saccrificed to show men their own evil nature, not for the sake of religion.

            1. Jerami profile image78
              Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I think that the only answer that we can have in this matter is to remember that which he said. 
                 He came into the world to fulfill all prophesy concerning himself.

                 I would guess to answer this question, we would have to search those prophesy.

            2. Chris Neal profile image84
              Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              He sacrificed Himself, so that men could be made right with God. He spent His time before the sacrifice teaching men about our own evil natures.

              1. jonnycomelately profile image86
                jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                My problem with your replies here, Chris, is that you state things as being facts, whereas they are your beliefs.  "I believe that Jesus Christ ......" would be a more honest way for you to write.

                1. Chris Neal profile image84
                  Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  No, that would be dishonest on my part.

                  Either He did it or He didn't. If I believe something that is wrong then I'm pretty much guilty of everything that troubledman has accused me of. But if I believe something that is right, then I am guilty of worse by sidestepping.

                  It's not about what makes me comfortable. If that were the case, I would not be a Christian. It's about what's true. And God is true. It would be worse than useless to choose to believe something that is not.

                  1. A Troubled Man profile image61
                    A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Guilty. smile

              2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                Vladimir Uhriposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Chris Neal, Dinesh D'Souza wrote books: What is good about America and What is good about Christianity. Excellent books. People who are doing nothing they do not have anything to do just criticize others. Is something bothering them inside?

    4. bali777 profile image62
      bali777posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Its a wrong concept ... Jesus Didn't sacrifice himself for the absorption of other men sins ... but he did that just to show that he remained steadfast in the way of the God and didn't leave it ... and while someone pretended to do that ... he was taken up to the heaven and one day he will return before the Judgement day to this world ... to bring the never ending chaos to an end and spread peace and love in whole of the Earth smile

      1. vector7 profile image60
        vector7posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        John 1:29

        1. jonnycomelately profile image86
          jonnycomelatelyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I am unfollowing this thread... it's full of nonsense as far as I am concerned.

          1. Chris Neal profile image84
            Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            That's too bad because even though I don't agree with you on a lot of things, at least you are well spoken and have actually thought out what you are saying.

            Helps keep me on my toes!

  2. noturningback profile image79
    noturningbackposted 4 years ago

    "Jesus' saccrifice was in vein" as posed by mischeviousme, You are correct sir for saying Jesus sacrifice was in vein, for it was only by His blood spilled forth from those veins that we are atoned for of our sins and of sins for future generations.
    Even those who yet to know of Jesus or even those who would curse Him; all will one day know Him. He is the "Living Water", those who came to hurry His death on the cross and having discovered he had already returned to the Father, pierced His side, from which forth spewed a large amount of blood and water.
    Only by the shedding of that precious blood was the proper sacrifice made, the sacrifice of the Lamb.
    I don't expect all to believe that He died for them, in fact, Paul said that "For the message about the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing in 1 Corinthians 1:18
    As far as other religions are concerned, Ghandi himself admired Christ, he just wasn't too sure about Christians. God is love!

  3. ialexis profile image59
    ialexisposted 4 years ago

    It's not.. but everything must happen.. It is for the prophecy to be fulfilled.. Can a molded pot say to the potter, = Sir don't make me like this, it's not fair.. It is what the potter wants and wills.

  4. 70
    SanXuaryposted 4 years ago

    How does this pertain to any thing? Is this just another uneducated argument with another ridiculous comment made by an unbeliever? IS there anything you really need to learn from this posting or our you looking for another worthless argument that you will choose to ignore? Perhaps the sacrifice was a waste of your time.

    1. psycheskinner profile image79
      psycheskinnerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Please use the reply feature--not everyone is in threaded view/

    2. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I never claimed to be a nonbeliever, that's your assumption.

  5. 70
    SanXuaryposted 4 years ago

    IF you read the Bible then you would know the reason for his sacrifice and not claim other wise. If you do not believe in God then why would you care about such a sacrifice at all. What is the point?

    1. mischeviousme profile image60
      mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I'm not an atheist.

  6. Billy Hicks profile image88
    Billy Hicksposted 4 years ago

    At the risk of sounding repetitive: "Obvious troll is obvious"

  7. pisean282311 profile image57
    pisean282311posted 4 years ago

    chill...jesus never sacrificed......imagine you being son of god and your father hanging you and then saving you...you too know that ur father would not let u die...you also know that your father has all fixed...how is that sacrifice?...in today's term it would be called political stunt...

    1. Druid Dude profile image60
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      The show ain't over till the fat lady sings.

    2. Druid Dude profile image60
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Imagine that you want your followers to rejoice at your murder. Bathing in the blood, performing ritualistic cannibalism. I smell something fishy...and it ain't Galilee!

      1. Chris Neal profile image84
        Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        You're missing some pretty basic points, I think...

    3. Chris Neal profile image84
      Chris Nealposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Chill yourself, He most certainly did.

    4. bali777 profile image62
      bali777posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yeah i agree ... and that is exactly what it was ... he didn't sacrifice himself to take all the sins inside of him but he showed the others that he did something like but in actual he didn't smile

      1. pisean282311 profile image57
        pisean282311posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        @bali77 u mean to say jesus was liar,manipulator?....i dont think that is true...jesus was convinced that he is someone special...death proved him wrong like it does to most god mans, prophets etc ....but then story was invented by his followers...

  8. pisean282311 profile image57
    pisean282311posted 4 years ago

    first for going in vein, there must be sacrifice to start with...If we believe in divinity of Jesus...it was not sacrifice but stunt...if we believe jesus was ordinary human being , dying for one's conviction is age old phenomena and cant be termed as sacrifice...

 
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