When Christ Jesus quotes Old Testament scripture to use to teach, and selects certain people to do His work.. How then do we question either the Old Testament when Christ ddn't or the people HE CHOSE??
Do we think we know better than Christ??? Is HE not the teacher???
Questioning Jesus' judgement and foresight does nothing to prove your point but show your distrust in His actions and choices.
And does ANYONE that BELIEVES in God really think anyone could "hijack" His people though He is all powerful?
Just to top it off, as all of these questions are relevant topics within this thread, WHY claim scripture as proof and then discredit what you don't like? How then is any of the scripture relevant??
Is that nothing more than your opinion then if what you believe is kept, and disbelieve is tossed?
Isn't then the scripture as a whole irrelevant and not truly scripture if WE choose the correct and incorrect?
I thought the scripture dictated the truth and not vice versa??
And I will be very diligent to be as kind and precise as possible with anything brought up.
Please, I encourage all intelligent thoughts and perpectives upon the matter in a light of love.
Please, be kind.. My only request.
Satans purpose is to hijack (deceive) Gods people. Even thought God is all powerful. He appears to be doing that quite well.
Then, God is obviously not all powerful.
OR it is Gods intention to allow those being decieved to perish. Seperating the wheat from the chaffe comes to mind.
Oh, I see now, it's a superiority issue with believers who believe they are the wheat and we are merely chaff to be discarded.
OR is it you believing you are superior and Christians are sub par?
YOU are the one who made the analogy of wheat and chaff, but I understand how Christians must be intolerant of others while feeling victimized in the process.
Victimised? Of course you're right. I am victimised into everlasting life. Woe is me. Intolerant? Of course you're right. The Messiah died for all sin, including yours, this means you & I are on equal footing.
Thank you for sharing your irrational beliefs, however they don't apply to me.
Yes, we both share reality equally, I have no qualms about that whatsoever.
And I appreciate your irrational beliefs also. Everything came from nothing. Grace be with you.
That is just part and parcel to the many contradictions and hypocrisy believers employ to support their beliefs. Why do you think there's over 38,000 registered denominations of Christianity, not to mention the hoards of Christians who don't follow or believe in those denominations.
Not original, kindly.. Not my first run in the forums.
Repeat opinion, and a famous forum atheist you bring to mind, lol.
And I don't believe in denominations. You're generalizing Christians. Sorry, doesn't work with me. Old game method. Had better accusations anyhow..
Thx for the opinion.
Whether you believe in denominations or not, over 38,000 "Registered Denominations" exist within Christianity. They have their own places of worship and their own versions of Christianity that we have seen right here debated between those factions, usually ending in one side calling the other side evil.
In that regard, reality does not seem to work for you.
As I said, you're a useless case. I won't appeal to ignorance.
You don't look up facts, but twist things into the form which serves your purpose best.
I've done this game with those much better than you are. The best actually, as though he was a massive pain, he was much MUCH more accurate and also included facts not just mauled up opinions, lol..
I'll repeat from another post...
Peace and love dear sir, and enjoy your accusations.
Once again, the believer must attack the person when they can't support the subject matter.
And, they too were probably attacked personally by you when you had nothing to say. Oh look, it's happening to others here, too.
You don't want to do anything but be ugly.
I have not that intention.
I simply wish to share what I know and you wish you be sarcastic, and it is true as shown in every single post you have.
You did, after all, choose your own title for use on hubpages.
And yet, YOU are the one flinging personal insults.
Like calling others names? Is that what you know best?
Really? So, how does the choosing of ones title for use on an internet forum translate into you tossing out personal insults? Are you saying you are free to do so based on my userid?
If i have called you names, any name at all, I AM SORRY. And I mean it.
I just apologized to another, and hope to fix any errors i may have imposed.
I will be loving and kind from now on, as Love is what I believe in above all things.
I have been short in light of certain other conflicts where people (i won't mention names) have in fact really attacked me, and it put me on the defense.
Kindly, I apologize and hope to discuss things in a kinder manner from here on.
You have made me laugh a few times, lol
I don't dislike you as a person. I am just another person here, and am not better than anyone. I've probably done worse than most, but I don't wish to be ill..
Hope you'll agree.
If you don't want to agree, that's ok.
I'll still be kind from now on. Don't worry.
I see no reason to question the OT; it is what it is. It was written for ancient Israel with their culture in mind and as far as I'm aware there are no commandments within it that explicitly state that they also apply to gentiles. That's not to say that it doesn't contain principles, wisdom and all sorts of good stuff for Gentiles to ponder. As someone else here said, the OT can be summed up with love God and love your neighbour as yourself.
Believe Christ summed it up with those two commandments when asked, as for where that came from that is. And I agree.
So does that mean the New Testament is or isn't credible as well in relation to Christ?
Personaly I do not believe that the NT is scripture. When Paul told Timothy that scripture is God breathed......, the NT did not exist, so cannot have been included in this statement or Paul's mind. Only the Hebrew scriptures were recognised as such. Unlike the OT, the NT doesnt say of itself "this is the word of the Lord". There were hundreds of writings in existence at the time of the NT, and the reason we have the NT is because the Catholic Church decided what was in and what was out by committee. Who gave them the authority to decide?
The NT is certainly very useful as without it we wouldn't know what Jesus "said", and Paul does provide us with some good practical teaching. However that does not mean that we are compelled to agree with everything Paul said; in fact we don't because women do not generally cover their heads and are permitted to speak in Church.
As for Revelation I see this has been a major stumbling block to Churches as over the centuries as they try to reinterpret it continuously in the light of their world events as Jesus continues to not show up, despite the 1st century expectation that his 2nd coming was imminent. These days I'm more inclined to think of it as one man's collection of interpretations of 1st century world events that were commonly believed by many at the time.
Isn't the Holy Spirit inside us the Spirit of God? Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all God aren't they? Jesus said to baptize them in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit right?
And what about Matthew 10:20 friend? The Spirit of the Father speaking through them.
Doesn't that mean it's God's words and not their own?
For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.
And you think Simon Peter the disciple of Jesus Christ himself would endorse Paul, previously Saul of Tarsus, if the things Paul said were not true?
Simon Peter certainly would not say good of a man that wasn't sent by God would He? Peter was one of the disciples which loved Jesus most.
2 Peter 3:14-15
Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you.
So then if the man who we believe loved Jesus most, and walked with Jesus day and night agreed with Paul and gave good account for those things which Paul teaches...
Who are we to question him? Jesus own disciple states good on Paul's behalf and we who never knew Jesus can say he has evil intentions and lies?
I believe in Simon Peter's words very much, for as I love the Lord, so I know he does. And I believe if he speaks good of Paul's writings, then I will accept them as so.
Not only that, but that means that Paul certainly did accept Jesus Christ and received the Holy Spirit as even I, the Bible says, have the Holy Spirit in me. But I did not receive a vision witnessed by other men who lead me into Damascus because the vision certainly blinded me. Paul did.
Jesus sent the disciples to the house of Israel, not the gentiles.
Paul rather, was sent unto the gentiles. And praise God for that because I'm one of them. lol
If you see any discrepancies in my post please let me know.
If you think you have relevant text to the paul yashua debate you should be putting them on that thread, your quotes are construed and like the teachings of paul they are insidious lies.
No, I believe my post was perfectly fine here. I don't need anyone to tell me where I should post friend. I know where I would like to post.
Deborah also requested I left that thread, and I agreed to her request.
I'm sorry you feel the way you do about what I have wrote.
And, in addition, everything I put here can be looked up friend. I haven't lied, but posted scripture and the way it looks to me from what the scripture I posted said.
That doesn't answer a single question..
Why even reply?
Actually, I thought I had answered all of them with just that one sentence.
Yes friend.. you answered them all, from a perspective of "scripture is irrelevant anyway"..
Therefore, your opinion is on a subject not applicable to you. Well, sort of.. you help my arguement actually.. lol
Though I like your go getter attitude, and find you sort of cute in a wierd way.
Your answer isn't relevant as you don't claim Christ either, nor the scripture.
So then how can you debate whether it is all or none when you clearly agree with me and you choose none.
The questions were, in short, can you believe some and not all without making it all worthless.
You choose it as useless anyhow, therefore you have no opinion on anything being true whatsoever.. lol
Thanks for the laugh though.
As to whether that opinion is right or wrong, I'm not going there.
Don't start, that is a whole lot of explaining and even including all the questions completely off topic. Maybe another day?
Or could you kindly post your question as a seperate thread?
I'll see what I can do to attend to your questions in another way.
But automatic assertions are not welcome, please consider another route to converse on that.
Cute fairy. lol
It was a simple question. If you didn't want to respond to questions you shouldn't have started a thread. Or, you could maybe write a hub about it? Then you can filter responses you don't know how to address?
I don't know. I feel somewhat cheated here.
I know. I was hoping he would explain how he could post the thread when no one can obviously follow the entire Bible in this day and age. At least I hope they wouldn't try.
I can help you there...Love your neighbor as you love yourself. The rest of the bible is backstory.
That was ridiculous as I gave you alternate methods. The question wasn't releant to the topic, which was whole or partial credibility...
NOT my personal habits..
All I see is a bunch of chaotic mess everyone else wanted to post anyhow.
There is no reason for me to address anything you ask if you can't have enough respect to address the original OP anyway.
And you can't start a thread? Didn't I tell you I WOULD attend to it best I could, just not here?
You all have fun running around on everything but the topic..
What did you click the thead for anyhow then? To derail it like everyone has?
I suppose my answers can be saved for those who understand protocol..
Hoping for a non-finger pointing post.
Did you read your opening statement, before you hit submit? You might have reworded it to avoid the confusion you have created. My question was on topic. You pointedly challenged any who question any point in the Bible. The Mosaic laws are a well defined point.
It's fine to believe anything you want. Unfortunately, if you want to defend it, you have to be willing to step up to the plate and do it. You can't start as you did and then spend the rest of the thread back pedaling. What point has the exercise served?
Why the annoying accusations?
The OP is about the conformity of the authority of the ENTIRETY of the text..
You don't claim ANY OF IT.. Therefore you agree, have you not read prior posts I replied to?
You claim none, and there are only 3 stances, seeing as "I" caused your confusion "I" will clear it up here.....
A- BELIEVE NONE
B- BELIEVE SOME
C- BELIEVE ALL
Other questions included allow topics on:
A- JESUS CHRIST'S AUTHORITY
B- THE HIGHJACKJNG OF GOD'S PEOPLE
C- AND IF: B- OF THE ABOVE QUESTION IS CHOSEN, WHY IS THAT A) AN OPINION, OR B) NOT AN OPINION.
I most certainly DID NOT ""pointedly challenged any who question any point in the Bible."
The questions are in fact in regards to the integrity, or lack of integrity AS A WHOLE.. Because of people claiming you can pick and choose..
Any other descrepancies you don't understand?
I think, it's humorous how you try to herd people into a box. Pretending that only the limited line of thinking of your personal opinions are the entirety of all opinions that is valid on the subject.
The question is....why are you so argumentative? Wouldn't it be simpler to not respond if you didn't want to discuss my question....or not to start a thread when the obvious intent was to seek out conflict?
Off topic here, but; is this one of the reasons why the more militant atheists say your religion causes conflict?
lol, first claims then more accusations..
peace and love..
I hope you cheer up, I quit this thread after that as "the box" shouldn't be needed, hubpages made the rules dear.
You are correct. You are well within the bounds of hub pages policy to make a foolish assertion and neglect to back it up with facts. Believers do it all the time.
The evidence is all around us. But, I don't think it would be fair to pull statements out of other threads and paste them here. The person who posted it deserves the right of rebuttal.
I will admit, here recently people have been harsh on me and I am not as kind as I should be, but I don't feel I was wrong in wanting to be on subject here. I have lots of research still to do and time doesn't stop.
I don't want to be mean, ugly, or otherwise anything related..
I love people, but sometimes I can get quite tired of repetitions, which though you don't know it I've been through that question that began this a hundred times..
God does not intend for us to follow Isarel's Law gave to Moses.
Israel is God's chosen people to prepare the way for Christ and I can talk more on it in depth if you would like. If you will consider not being harsh about it in the process..
I do apologize ( i haven't looked, but know i have elsewhere ) if i was short or ugly IN ANY WAY. I am sorry.
But can I start another thread to answer your questions please?
I have a lot to keep up with and I would like to be organized so i don't make mistakes and accidently give incorrect info.
I would love to be friends even if we disagree.
So, you don't think God intended for you to follow the laws of Moses. That's all you had to say. Sheesh. What took you so long?
Now that you've said it, I'll be watching. Don't be one of those who talks out of both sides of their mouth. You don't have to follow the law. So don't use the law against us non Christians.
lol, see we still aren't quite agreeing.. I'll start a new thread and explain myself.
But I don't expect anything friend except kindness. You seem to know about the Bible, though I have and do argue with some about God existing. I (shh, don't tell on me, lol) need to be more Christ like and really loving instead of picking on people - you and a few others are right, but I'm learning to be a better man.
I don't wish to use anything against you.
I'll write more in the new thread.
Thanks for being kind, sometimes people don't care at all.
People are so crazy about being roight about what they think they know, that their actually using it as a mask. It's a protective layer between the eyes and the self, it buffers reallity to suit the needs of the individual.
People are so concerned with how much more powerful their God/god is, compared to that of another.
I couldn't agree more, i think you have hit the nail on the head there!
From Mischievousme: People are so crazy about being roight about what they think they know, that their actually using it as a mask. It's a protective layer between the eyes and the self, it buffers reallity to suit the needs of the individual.
People are so concerned with how much more powerful their God/god is, compared to that of another.
I also agree
These threads are full of blathering self-righteous fools who do not realise that in braying what they think as scripture, they are only exhibiting their weak minded ego.
For those who rely on scripture so heavily, maybe you should take a trip over to the discussion thread on how the words you blindly follow were written by the person who may be the anti-christ that your man spoke of, used by the religious powers of the day to erase the true message of the events of 2000 years ago, whether the event was real or just a story.
"People are so concerned with how much more powerful their God/god is, compared to that of another."
Please quote me as I see not the connection kind sir, and please quit accusing me without said quotations. It's quite annoying to continue correcting issues off topic. And annoying to keep having to defend myself against false accusations.
By the way, the correction and TRUTH would be...
NOT about WHO'S God is more powerful, but that no other God exists as He is the one true living God and all others are imposters made by men, which OF COURSE they would claim we done. lol
Anything ON TOPIC you'd like to add?
This is getting quite redundant..
And nonbelievers ignore anything which contradicts what they "know" to be true. No one knows anything. You call up as proof, any theory which you are comfortable with, disregarding the meaning of "theory"
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