jump to last post 1-6 of 6 discussions (46 posts)

Do You Know What You KNOW?

  1. profile image0
    Chasukposted 5 years ago

    Do you believe that you know what you KNOW,  or do you believe that you only BELIEVE what you know?

    1. aka-dj profile image79
      aka-djposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      YES!

      1. vector7 profile image60
        vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        lol

        Nice.

      2. profile image0
        Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        do you literally believe both simultaneously, or are you being facetious?

        1. vector7 profile image60
          vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          dj made a funny Chasuk.

          smile

    2. Disappearinghead profile image88
      Disappearingheadposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think Donald speaks for all of us:

      "There are known knowns; there are things we know we know.
      We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know.
      But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know."

      1. Jane Bovary profile image88
        Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        The latter I think- I only believe what I know. I believe that the sun will rise again tomorrow but I can't know that it will because it might not.

        Or have I missed the point of the question? I believed I new it but now I don't know..

        1. vector7 profile image60
          vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          lol.. cute

      2. profile image0
        Emile Rposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I really like this response. It's the unknown unknown I keep an eye out for.

      3. profile image0
        Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I think that Rumsfeld was actually being quite clear when he said this. I've never understood the mockery.

        1. Disappearinghead profile image88
          Disappearingheadposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I wasn't mocking him. smile

          1. profile image0
            Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Thanks for the clarification. So many people do, that I wasn't sure. :-)

        2. Jane Bovary profile image88
          Jane Bovaryposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Maybe it had something to do with the source and delivery. If a crusty philosophy professor had proclaimed it from the leather chair in his book-lined study, while gazing thoughtfully at the embers of his dying fire, people may have thought it a penetrating, insightful observation.

          1. profile image0
            Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Rumsfeld presents a problem for me. I've listened to him speak, and I've read his memoir, and he is spooky smart. However, for various reasons too tangential to be shared here, I also believe that he is -- probably -- a truly evil man. To me, evil exists in intentional action. It isn't a metaphysical force, but it is expressed whenever a person knowingly performs, or causes to be performed, heinous acts. It might include failing to prevent a heinous act when it is within your power to do so.

            So, here is Rumsfeld, spooky smart, who, by his action or inaction, countenances evil. I don't like admiring a man and despising him simultaneously. It makes me insecure about my knowledge. Maybe Rumsfeld knows something that, if I knew, would transform what I perceive as evil into a necessary thing, maybe even a good thing. As I say, Rumsfeld presents a problem for me.

            Rumsfeld said this about his "known unknown" infamy:

            "At first glance, the logic may seem obscure. But behind the enigmatic language is a simple truth about knowledge: There are many things of which we are completely unaware—in fact, there are things of which we are so unaware, we don’t even know we are unaware of them."

    3. A Troubled Man profile image61
      A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I prefer to understand rather than believe.

      1. Disappearinghead profile image88
        Disappearingheadposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Grasshopper, when you believe, you will understand.

        1. A Troubled Man profile image61
          A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          No, you don't.

      2. profile image0
        Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I like that sentiment. It's pithy, deep, and I agree with it.

        Consider it borrowed.

        1. A Troubled Man profile image61
          A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Anytime, thanks. smile

          1. vector7 profile image60
            vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            lol

      3. aka-dj profile image79
        aka-djposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        That's a laugh. lol lol lol

        Oh, you mean FACTS, not people! sad

        (My mistake!)

        1. vector7 profile image60
          vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          LOLOLOL..

        2. A Troubled Man profile image61
          A Troubled Manposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          It's your strongest characteristic and what you're best at doing.

          1. aka-dj profile image79
            aka-djposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            You snipped the BEST part.

            Why? 'Cause it's true, that's why!

    4. Trish_M profile image85
      Trish_Mposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I think that I know what I know, when I say that I know it, but I do believe that I may be wrong about what I know, and, so, only believe that I know it.

      Who was it, who said that someone who knows, what he doesn't know, knows more than he thinks he knows? ~ Or words to that effect. smile

      1. profile image0
        Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I'm not sure who said it, but I appreciate the sentiment.

    5. profile image0
      klarawieckposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Since I don't have all the answers and I like to question everything, I'd say: I know what I've learned and experienced up to now, but what I know in the present is not a definite belief system.

      1. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
        Jesus was a hippyposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Haha you have to think that your belief is true otherwise you wouldn't really believe it would you?

        1. profile image0
          Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          The words "believe" is definitionally awkward.

          For example, the common definition of "believe" is, "accept x as true."

          What, then, does "I believe that x is true" actually mean? It parses as, "I accept that x is true is true."

          My question was intended to spark a discussion of the many interesting puzzles of epistemology.

          Perhaps unsurprisingly, it failed.

    6. vector7 profile image60
      vector7posted 5 years ago

      Considering I'm willing to step in front of a loaded pistol aimed at another individual to protect them and considering it no loss to me due to trust in Christ if the trigger slips?

      [proof in pudding - have done it]

      Yes, I believe I know what I know.

    7. Cagsil profile image60
      Cagsilposted 5 years ago

      I hold very few beliefs and none of them have anything to do with what I know.

      1. profile image0
        Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Elaborate, please.

        1. Cagsil profile image60
          Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I had thought I spoke quite clearly. What is it that you need elaborated?

          1. profile image0
            Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            You make a distinction between belief and knowledge. I request an elaboration of that distinction.

            1. Cagsil profile image60
              Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Your observation apparently is a bit messed up considering I said no such thing. I stated that I hold very few beliefs and those beliefs have nothing to do with what I know I know.

              1. Randy Godwin profile image96
                Randy Godwinposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Did you just get out of detention hall, Cags?  lol  I figured it was about time you were paroled again!  I certainly hope you learned to respect your "betters"!  tongue

                                                       http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

                1. Cagsil profile image60
                  Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  lol lol lol Hello to you too Randy. And, yeah I was paroled. lol

                  1. Randy Godwin profile image96
                    Randy Godwinposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    I was going to check last night to see how much longer it was till you had your parole hearing, but I was accosted by some religionists and forgot.  Welcome back, There's still plenty of trouble in paradise!  tongue

                                                                      http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg
                    >

              2. vector7 profile image60
                vector7posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                lol

                "I believe i believe / have beliefs"

                "and has nothing to do with / is seperate from / is distinct from [distinction]"

                "what I know I know / knowledge"

                lol

                Yeah, 'nothing to do with' doesn't mean there is a distinction at all.......... lol

                1. Cagsil profile image60
                  Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  roll

              3. profile image0
                Chasukposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Your memory is apparently a bit messed up, considering that you actually said, "I hold very few beliefs and none of them have anything to do with what I know."

                This clearly makes a distinction between belief and knowledge.

                I'll diagram it for you, so that you understand your own words:

                "few beliefs"

                --> "NONE of them [those 'few beliefs') have ANYTHING to do with what I know" <--

                "what I know"

                Do you see that separation? That's called a distinction, which you made here when you separated "belief" and "knowledge" according to criteria or criterion that I asked you to elaborate.

                If the reason that you made this distinction is too difficult for you to remember -- due to your faulty memory -- just let me know, and I'll understand.

                1. Cagsil profile image60
                  Cagsilposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  WOW!

                  Apparently, you seem to think that "what I know I know" as knowledge? If I read your words correctly. "What I know I know" isn't knowledge by itself. You made the distinction.

                  My beliefs as they are few, DO NOT have anything to do with "what I know I know". I hold NO beliefs with regards to what I know I know.

                  Knowing something isn't the same as knowledge. Knowledge is just one aspect of what the totality of everything accumulated to gain wisdom.

                  Wisdom is truth in the truest form. Beliefs are thoughts/ideas which are believed true. Belief isn't necessarily true, especially if it's based on a lie to begin with. A belief becomes non-existent when that person no longer believes it to be true, but found truth about it through wisdom.

                  I hope that explains.

                  1. Randy Godwin profile image96
                    Randy Godwinposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Don't try to use logic, facts, and reasoning with this guy, Cags.  He won't fall for those old tricks!  lol

                                                                   http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

    8. Jerami profile image76
      Jeramiposted 5 years ago

      We just don't know what we don't know,  Ya Know?

    9. Druid Dude profile image60
      Druid Dudeposted 5 years ago

      What I know, I know. What I don't know, I can learn, and if what I know is wrong, I'm always willing to modify what I know. Any other questions? You a cop, or are you writing a book?

    10. lorlie6 profile image87
      lorlie6posted 5 years ago

      Gawd, I JUST started a thread almost exactly like this-my apologies, I didn't see this one before!  Well, maybe 2 will be extra-interesting and full of 'knowledge'!
      lol

     
    working