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Why do people walk on egg shells around the Catholic Church?

  1. Claire Evans profile image90
    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago

    On various occasions I have been attacked because of my condemnation of the Vatican even by non believers!  It is more severe than any other topic I bring up.  Why is it so hard to accept that evil has infiltrated what is supposed to be a representative of God?

    I don't want this to be a repeat of Margie's blog.  If it does I'll ask the moderator to close it down.  I just want an honest answer.

    1. aguasilver profile image88
      aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Claire, there is a major difference between Churchianity and Christianity, and the RCC is just another branch of Churchianity, no different from all the other organisations that police religion, except perhaps corrupt and deceived (and deceiving) for longer than our 'protestant' varieties.

      God has scattered His people in ALL the areas of Churchianity, and I know real believers in most of the sections, they are His remnant, and God hides His people amongst all the tares and hirelings to protect us when the time comes.

      But the call is up to 'come out of her my people' and believers are doing that, they may still attend their local branch of Churchianity, or not, but they are OUT of the world and waiting for the Kingdom, and that is also part of Gods plan.

      1. noenhulk profile image55
        noenhulkposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Sometimes I find myself tied in a religion I believe I am free. It is maybe the word "respect" because until now I am in search of the true church.

        1. Paul Wingert profile image79
          Paul Wingertposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          All organized religions have one thing in common and that is the suppression of its followers. They want control over their congregations and the idea of them thinking for themselves would be disastrous. Keep the lambs in line! Since ancient times, religion always had a great marketing tool – believe in this nonsense or die (literally). Even today, religion imposes death threats to their congregations, while not so much literally death, but eternal damnation. Baaah!

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You are right that religion can be used for control.

        2. Claire Evans profile image90
          Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I don't believe there is one "true" church.  All have their drawbacks.  The best "church" is a personal relationship with God.

          1. ackman1465 profile image60
            ackman1465posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Claire:  THIS single submittal sez it all!!!!   

            "Religions"... which prescribe for people WHO is their "God"... and HOW to worship Him/Her (if that is necessary) are simply organizations which use this particular scheme for extricating money and loyalty from their adherents without really providing anything more than a building (in most cases) and a format for followers to follow THEM (the religion)... AND a promise that it (the religion) knows something that they don't about Salvation... whatever that is.....

      2. Jerami profile image78
        Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        aguasilver ... I agree completely. 

          @Claire Evans ..  believers do not want to believe this to be true, I think; because to accept this as fact opens the door to other questions which no one wants to face.
          Evil hasn't crept into the RCC. Read the History of the first 1000 years of the Church and its Popes and you will see that evil was there from the beginning.
           How many Popes were assonated by their predecessors? How many Popes had many  children out of wedlock ?
           How many believers were killed for refusing to become Catholic?
           People do not WANT to see these things because Catholicism is the Mother of Christianity as it is today.
          To question our mother, causes us to question our selves.
            The bright side is ...  By having these doubts, we can begin to repair the cracks in our own belief system.
             For prophesy says it will be so.
        Again ..  I completely agree with the way aguasilver expressed himself.

        1. Claire Evans profile image90
          Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I was quoting Pope IV about evil infiltrating the church.  It was later that the Illuminati infiltrated the Vatican and took control over it and the Jesuits. 


          Peirs Compton, author of the book, ""The Broken Cross" (1981) and ex-editor of a Catholic newspaper, "The Universe", says:

          ""The Illuminati had ...a plan ...they decided on a most ambitious line of conduct. It would form and control public opinion. It would amalgamate religions by dissolving all the differences of belief and ritual that had kept them apart; and it would take over the Papacy and place an agent of its own in the Chair of Peter."


          "It (this All-Seeing Eye) overlooked the crowds who gathered for the Philadelphia Eucharistic Congress in 1976. It was taken up by the Jesuits who edited the Society's year book; and it appeared on a series of Vatican stamps issued in 1978." (p. 10-11)

          http://www.cuttingedge.org/ce1037.html

          Is he right?

          http://s2.hubimg.com/u/6631401_f248.jpg

          The all-seeing eye is the classic symbol of Freemasonry and the Illuminati infiltrated Freemasonry when they were dispersed.  The all-seeing eye represents many "gods", especially Lucifer.  Others include Horus, Baal, Phoebus, Apollo and Osiris.  The Illuminati formed in 1776 as revealed on the American dollar bill.

          John Daniel, Scarlet and the Beast, Vol. III, pp. 6-7, (c)1995:

          The Illuminati, founded by Weishaupt in 1776, adopted as their Seal "a 13-layered unfinished pyramid with the capstone missing. Hovering above is a sun-rayed triangle, as if waiting to be lowered to complete the structure. In mystery religions the triangle symbolizes power, such as a throne or kingdom, and is sometimes pictured as a horn. The triangle is also a symbol of the dwelling place of the pagan higher power, representing a mountain top in hilly country, a pyramid in Egypt, or a ziggurat in Mesopotamia. The ancients called the ziggurat Hill of Heaven, or Mountain of God." (Daniel, Vol. I, p. 163)"

          Just my commentary on this, this is why Moses often visits God on the mountains. This is the pagan influence in the Old Testament.

          http://www.redicecreations.com/specialr … story.html

          The El Diablo had hand signal illustrates the devil's horns associated with the pyramid.

          http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6631408_f248.jpg

      3. Castlepaloma profile image23
        Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It looks like the Catholic are the biggest and most satanic like group out there, and true Christian are hidden away waiting for JC to set them free.

        Kind of like how the first mammals evolved into man because the rat like mammal went hiding into the cracks of the earth for safety or the Dinosaurs would eat them all up. Then the rat like man grew into Aguasilver like creatures, it all makes perfect sense, like How God created us to be perfect...wow amazing how history repents it's.

      4. Wesman Todd Shaw profile image95
        Wesman Todd Shawposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I love you two folks!

        1. aguasilver profile image88
          aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          smile

        2. Claire Evans profile image90
          Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Todd, thanks for the support, man! Always happy to hear from you.

      5. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I don't agree that God has scattered people in all areas of Christianity.  I believe people are responsible for that.  They are just too many variance in opinions of the religion for their to be one church.

    2. Mark Knowles profile image60
      Mark Knowlesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      You have not been attacked. Some one pointed out how funny it is to see you attacking the Catholics (all the same to me) and then complaining that people were "attacking," your ridiculous beliefs. Gotta say - yours are a tad further out there, but - once you start believing the sort of nonsense you guys believe, it is hard to grade it. lol

      Agua just seem to be jealous that his church is not as big as the Vatican. lol

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Why do people tell lies? Have I ever attacked the average Catholic? I speak out against the Pope and the Vatican.

        1. 0
          jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Telling the Catholics their leaders are satanists and they are ignoramusus for not being able to discern such a simple thing is not attack? Oh! Attack is, if you are told you are a satanist. When you tell it, it is just plain truth!
          Any normal human being knows conspiracy theories cannot be disproved, but one need be a psychotic to believe in conspiracy theories and most psychotics do believe it.

        2. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Claire Evans
          I'm so happy, not to have to fight religion, atheist or anyone because I am not for being against or downing anyone.

          Don't you think being against is part of thr problem like in the word
          ATTACK To set upon in a forceful, hostile, or aggressive way,with or without a weapon; begin fighting with: To begin hostilities against; start an offensive against: to attack the enemy, to blame or abuse or bitterly, To direct unfavorable criticism against; criticize severely;argue with strongly: He attacked his opponent's statement. To try to destroy, especially with verbal abuse: to attack the mayor's reputation.

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I never started any hostilities with Motown, a Catholic.  That was a response, or an attack back, to Emile's bringing up of the Vatican.  I was on the defensive.  I attacked the Vatican and blamed it bitterly, etc.  And, yes, I argued with Motown because she attacked what I said.

            1. Castlepaloma profile image23
              Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              1. How many lesson must we learn about turning the other cheek, too many times to strike up many real fights and disrespect?

              2. How many revenges must one have to dig up two graves, for one to understand the one grave is for your enemy and one for your self.?

              3. Why would a tree fight with fight with it's own branches like the many domination of Christian fighting each other?

              4.Why are Christian the world champions of war, these kind of lesson in life will only continue in your life endlessly on earth and in your after life if you don't?

              STOP IT!!!

              From your friendly and loving forum member.

            2. 0
              Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I was not going to respond to this thread at all, Claire, but you are being blatantly dishonest here.   I did not attack you.  I said that you were wrong, and then declined to argue with you about your point.  That is it. 

              Thankfully, the thread is still here, and anyone who chooses to may see that I in no way attacked you personally regarding your statements.  If I had, I'd have been banned from the forums for responses in that thread, and I was not.

              I have not called you a liar, nor attacked you.  I have disagreed with you.

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Is this not an attack?



                This is arguing so therefore you didn't decline an argument and merely say I was wrong.

                To quote Castlepaloma:

                ATTACK To set upon in a forceful, hostile, or aggressive way,with or without a weapon; begin fighting with: To begin hostilities against; start an offensive against: to attack the enemy, to blame or abuse or bitterly, To direct unfavorable criticism against; criticize severely;argue with strongly: He attacked his opponent's statement. To try to destroy, especially with verbal abuse: to attack the mayor's reputation.

                You were on the offensive.  I never addressed you first. 

                I personally feel this is a silly thing to argue about.  It doesn't impress me, however, that when I say things that are hostile, I'm on the attack.  When someone else does this, they are just merely arguing.

                1. 0
                  Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I did not address you - I spoke to the irony of your original post by pointing out that you and another poster had very clearly attacked Catholicism after claiming that you never bashed another's belief. 

                  I found it interesting.

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    The Vatican isn't a "belief".  You don't worship the Pope.  At least I hope you don't. 

                    I am just stating a fact.  Time and time again when I correspond with Catholics they tell me the same thing.  I'm a Catholic-basher.  Have you ever criticized Mark for being disrespectful to those who love Jesus?

                    You say this:

                    "Mark and I have been round and round on more than one occasion, but we've had fruitful dialogue as well.  He's a person - even if you disagree with him.  And he most certainly has a right to his opinion (AND for it to be heard in this forum)."


                    He then writes to Margie:

                    "Lying that your religion is a "personal relationship with god," then claiming it to be under attack because mandatory prayer has been removed from schools is plain old dishonesty."

                    He is attacking Christianity and accusing Margie of being a liar for claiming she has a personal relationship with God.  This should have offended you because if you have a personal relationship with God, he is calling you a liar, too." 

                    Is the Vatican more important to you than Jesus?

                    You say we have a right to an opinion.  Why attack me then (except mine is more fact)? I am a person even if you disagree with me.

              2. Castlepaloma profile image23
                Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Maybe it was another thread you ticked her off, or maybe just being Catholic is enough, it's mysterious

                1. Claire Evans profile image90
                  Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I was talking to her about the previous forum, Margie's one, that got closed down. I have absolutely nothing against the Catholic people, just the Vatican.

                  1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                    Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I thought learning and teaching is the same thing or leaders and followers are the same thing, or Catholic and Vatican are the same thing.

                    Which one of pieces of  the wonderful misery mysterious puzzle fits?

                  2. Castlepaloma profile image23
                    Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I don't use words like augments, debates or aim to be against anything just have discussion with people about many facts, things and most often agree and sometimes disagree.

                    Claire Evans you posted  about the Pope IV evil infiltrating the church.  It was later that the Illuminati infiltrated the Vatican and took control over it and the Jesuits.

                    You say you are against the Vatican, if I am against something I am likely to attack somehow, since there is no hate in me there will be no attacks or have any desire to against anyone, I practice the art of ignoring negative people and they go away.

                    Then you posted, you can only know the love of God knowing the hate of Satan. How Do Christians Stand Firm Against Satanic Attack or Institute?

                    It's real hard to make out the where the head of God starts and tail end of the Devil ends.

    3. 0
      jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      wow! how many bones were broken??

    4. 0
      jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      As if somebody cares!

    5. YogaKat profile image91
      YogaKatposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      My Grandma, one of the most genuine Christians I have ever known, chose the Catholic Church to show her devotion.  She would be horrified to hear about a satanic Vatican.  That information - whether fact or fiction would truly break her heart.  History has clearly shown how far Catholicism misses the mark, but "Religion is the opiate of the people."  Who said that?  Lenin or Stalin or Rolling Stones big_smile

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It doesn't matter which church one belongs to as long as a personal relationship with Christ is strong.  Satanism is rife.  Christians need to know the power of Satan and that Satan would never choose not to get involved with the Church which is supposed to be dedicated to God.

        1. tohimilook profile image61
          tohimilookposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The Catholic Church is a powerful religious "institution".   This church is the richest in the world

          www.thefix.com/.../catholic-church-mexi … drug-mo...

          en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacrament_of_Penance_(Catholic_Church)

          www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,91 … 25,00.html

          www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatican/esp_vatican29.htm
          www.vatican.va/roman_curia/swiss_guard/ … ria_en.htm

          I am a member of another networking site ( a Christian one) and I was given a warning for making similar statements against the Catholic church.

          How can a church that has allowed pedophilia to run rampant, called a man Holy Father, (something that is condemned in the bible)  Praying to the Virgin Mary...people want to be poltiically correct, everyone who is sensible can locate the origins of the Catholic Church.  When a church has to use terror against those who refuse to tow the line, in my books IT CANNOT BE THE TRUE CHURCH OF GOD. THE VATICAN IS A STATE WITHIN A STATE.

          People are afraid, but true Christians have nothing to fear.  People are afraid of the devil.  His reward is coming.  Even posting these things online can cause us to be marked.  But as long as we are soldiers of Christ we have to take a stand.

          Stand firm Claire Evans...

          1. Castlepaloma profile image23
            Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Then what? Christian soldiers continue killing more people in the name God, more so than for any other reason.

            Demons only appear when to believe and support them, don't all Christian believe in demons (sub human) or in hell, if not,  Take HELL out of your bible then watch how many members show up, that impress me enough to maybe join...... on second thought ....not, still not plausible

            1. Claire Evans profile image90
              Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I've always wondered how many people would still be Christian if no such thing as hell existed.  Then again, you can only know the love of God knowing the hate of Satan.

          2. 0
            Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Just what we needed. Someone to cheer on the madness.

          3. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Thank you!

            1. Castlepaloma profile image23
              Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              lol lol lol Lord Satan would be proud of all the fighting Madness, I'm waiting for better entertainment , something with humor and that makes good sense too

              1. mischeviousme profile image61
                mischeviousmeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Sky faries and boogymen, do not horror insight nor inspire anew. These things keep us trapped to our attachments, desires, identity, opinion, blah, blah, blah. What's the point of wasting time and energy on such trivial pursuits, when living is all one needs. Tomorrow is heaven, as long as I'm still breathing and whatever troubles I had are yesterday's news.

                1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                  Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  My imagination tries to follow good sense.

                  When God sits on one side of my shoulder and the Devil sits on the other shoulder. That means it's time to cancel my hard prescription drugs

    6. Slarty O'Brian profile image86
      Slarty O'Brianposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Well it is obvious you are a heretic, my dear. To go against the one true church is a sin and you will no doubt roast in hell. May I respectfully suggest that it isn't too late. Get yourself to the nearest Catholic church, repent and ask forgiveness, If your heart is pure you will see the light.

      I want everyone to prey for her, ok? She knows not what she says as the devil has her. Oh for the days of the inquisition. Why must god put up with this blasphemy day in and day out?

      1. tohimilook profile image61
        tohimilookposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        That is what the Catholic church calls those who oppose her.  Even the disciples of Jesus left his company there is no mention of the disciples and Jesus using terror methods to get them back in the fold.

        If the priests of Baalam had to be here today they would feel at home in the Catholic church.

    7. Friendlyword profile image61
      Friendlywordposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      So many people are caught up in this cult; people feel that if you speak out against it in any way; God will personally reach down and smite you.  Christians expect you to be mindless sheep that need no explanation of anything.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Unfortunately, this is true.  This is why there is so much division in churches.  Many people aren't willing to hear someone out if they say things that are contrary to their belief what the scriptures mean.

    8. nightwork4 profile image60
      nightwork4posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      it's a powerful institution is one of the reasons. it has power, glory and just look at the churchs they build, people want to be part of it and they want to be a voice that represents it. i never understood why people believe the vatican is a holy city, corruption is a part of life there.

    9. Dubuquedogtrainer profile image60
      Dubuquedogtrainerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I do not know, but I share your sentiments. I feel very concerned for people misled by the teachings of the Catholic church.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I have nothing against Catholic people but I am concerned that they are unable to handle criticism of their denomination.  Submission is what the Vatican wants.  No questions, just blind obedience.  I find this with fundamentalist Christians also.  Do not question the "infallibility" of the Bible or go to hell.

        We aren't going to learn in life until we question, question, question!

        1. gmwilliams profile image85
          gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Totally concur!  Many traditional religionists blindly follow their beliefs.   They view their perspective viewpoint as a security measure.   They are in their particular "comfort" zone and believe that if they question their beliefs, they would become quite uncomfortable with it.    Oh no, they do not wish to be uncomfortable so they blindly follow and to be purgatorially comfortable rather than to face the truth and leave their religion to grow!

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I'm really glad others share my views!

    10. waynet profile image47
      waynetposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      They could cut their fuckin feet! big_smile sorry for the bad language, but the Devil made me do it and my Hamster!

      1. lyndre profile image82
        lyndreposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        You are on a roll this morning with your posts. lol

        1. waynet profile image47
          waynetposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes...it is quite fun this....big_smile

      2. MelissaBarrett profile image61
        MelissaBarrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I'm confused... is your hamster involved in the Olympics demonic terrorism plot?  Cause THAT finally makes everything make sense...

        Is the hampster's name Boo?  (if anyone gets that joke let me know about your massive coolness)

        1. waynet profile image47
          waynetposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yep my Hamster is Bad Arse.....but his bollocks swing too much lollololol! big_smile Sort of like an Olympic sport of his very own!

    11. Mmargie1966 profile image91
      Mmargie1966posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I am not convinced that the roman catholic church is holy.  I am convinced, however that some of its members are devout Christians.  This is why I stress the personal relationship between each individual and God.

      The church is man made...inclusive of flaws.  Jesus is perfect.  The church is full of politics.  God is almighty.

      I learned a valuable lesson with the thread I started.  Those who are against you will attack and condemn you.  It doesn't matter if you accept them, they don't accept you, just because of what you believe.

      Claire, I will respond to you and others who have proven to accept me whether we have differences or not.  ...and so I did.  Amen.

    12. lstCitizen profile image60
      lstCitizenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Why is it so hard to accept that evil has infiltrated what is supposed to be a representative of God?

      That's a fair question.  Here's a response from a Roman Catholic.

      First, is there evil in the Church?  Yes there is.  But then there always has been.  The Church started with 12 leaders, the apostles.  One sold out for 30 pieces of silver.  One denied Jesus 3 times.  One doubted Jesus' resurrection.   We are a church of sinners.  We always have been.

      Second, Is the Church a representative of God?  Yes.  In our creed, we say the Church is holy.  We believe the Church was started by Jesus, who is God.  The Church was not started by man.  And we believe that God in the Holy Spirit protects the Church from doctrinal error just as Jesus promised.

      So to answer your question, the evil we see in the Church comes from sinful people who've rejected the Church.  It's hard to accept especially when these people are priests and nuns and bishops.  Thankfully, the vast majority of the Church leaders are good and holy men and women.  The evil we see is hard to ignore and it's easy to make the mistake of equating that evil, with what the Church actually preaches.

      So you see Claire, your condemnation of the evil in the Church is not without merit.  I condemn it too.  If you focus on what the Church teaches, you may see that the only evil comes from those who do the condemning.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        There's a difference between just mere sinners and those who deliberately deceive and worship the devil.  The Vatican is full of devil worshipers and is an institution for him.  I believe that those who love Jesus should be the church.  An institution is rife with corruption and evil and cannot be called holy.  There are many good people who have rejected the church but still have a close relationship with God.

        I cannot believe you just said that the only evil comes from those who condemn evil.  Jesus condemned the Pharisees.  He must have been evil then according to your logic.

        1. lstCitizen profile image60
          lstCitizenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Devil worshipers in the Vatican?  Really?  Did I say that evil comes from those who condemn evil?  Seriously?  Claire, when you make up stuff like this, you lose all credibility.

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Devil worshipers in the Vatican?  Really?  Did I say that evil comes from those who condemn evil?  Seriously?  Claire, when you make up stuff like this, you lose all credibility.


            Yes...



            http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6659264.jpg

            devil worshipers.

            Pope Paul IV alluded to it.  He said the "smoke of Satan has entered the temple of God".

            http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/paul_ … t.html#top

            Fifth paragraph from bottom.



            "OF THOSE that have accused the Vatican of being infiltrated by satanists, none has been as widely noticed as the late Malachi Martin. An expert on the Dead Sea Scrolls, he also wrote about such widely diverse topics as exorcism, Church history and modern geopolitics. None of his books have been so controversial — or so misunderstood or ignored by the mainstream press — as his works that deal with this ominous and sensitive topic.

            Martin had first made explicit reference to a diabolic rite held in Rome in his 1990 non-fiction best-seller about geopolitics and the Vatican, The Keys of This Blood, in which he wrote:

            Most frighteningly for [Pope] John Paul [II], he had come up against the irremovable presence of a malign strength in his own Vatican and in certain bishops’ chanceries. It was what knowledgeable Churchmen called the ‘superforce.’ Rumors, always difficult to verify, tied its installation to the beginning of Pope Paul VI’s reign in 1963. Indeed Paul had alluded somberly to ‘the smoke of Satan which has entered the Sanctuary’. . . an oblique reference to an enthronement ceremony by Satanists in the Vatican. Besides, the incidence of Satanic pedophilia — rites and practices — was already documented among certain bishops and priests as widely dispersed as Turin, in Italy, and South Carolina, in the United States. The cultic acts of Satanic pedophilia are considered by professionals to be the culmination of the Fallen Archangel’s rites.
            (p. 632. Emphasis added)

            "Malachi Martin documents that a Black Mass was held in St Paul's Cathedral in 1963.  During this heinous affair, several cardinals "installed Lucifer to his appropriate place" in the Vatican, as "head of the church."
            Martin claims that a good deal of the child molestation occurring now is actually Satanic worship.  Part of the Luciferian rites of many of the priests, nuns, and hierarchy.  He intimates that many who engage in this kind of "worship" are indeed secret Masons.

            Malachi Martin was himself a Jesuit priest, in a high official capacity in the Vatican.  "In God's Name" has a photograph of Malachi Martin, seated right next to Pope John Paul I--the Pope that was murdered.  Martin is seated between Pope John Paul I (who is on the Papal Throne) and Diego Lorenzi, an aide who accompanied John Paul I from Venice, where he was previously.

            Alberto Rivera also says that he attended, as a Jesuit, a Black Mass in the Vatican.  With the Jesuits.  Martin himself did not attend the Black Mass, but he knew of it.  He later resigned the Jesuits--around 1972.He was "Laicized" so that he could write books on the corruptions he had seen in the Vatican.

            He recently passed away in 1999.  Some Catholics think he was murdered.  He also wrote a blockbuster entitled "The Jesuits: The Society of Jesus and the Betrayal of the Roman Catholic Church."  In that book, he details how the Jesuits became Communists in the 1960's, under their then Secretary General, Pedro Arrupe.  And he documents how they fomented Communist revolutions in several countries--especially in Latin American and Africa."

            http://www.puritans.net/news/malachimartin.htm



            "If you focus on what the Church teaches, you may see that the only evil comes from those who do the condemning."

            I now assume you meant those who condemn the scriptures are evil and not those who condemn evil like the Catholic Church? Sorry, if you meant the former.

            1. lstCitizen profile image60
              lstCitizenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Claire, are you really so gullible as to fall for all that nonsense?  I see you have a picture of a cross turned upside down.  So what... anybody can photoshop.  Someone writes a book and you fall for anything written there.

              Does Satin exist in the Catholic Chuch?  Yes, I wouldn't doubt that he does.  I believe that Satin is most obsessed with trying to defeat anything that stands for God's truth.  And so the Catholic Church is target #1.

              So if it is as you say, that Satin is in the Catholic Church, it must be that the Church stands for God's truths.  There must be a war between being waged for people's souls.  The war is between Satin's evil and God's love. 

              As for me, I am with God and His Church.  What side are you on?

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                IstCitizen, that picture was on CNN.  Anyway, you can see the footage of it.


                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tijz4M-EChk

                That author was a Vatican insider.  I wouldn't just take his word for it.  Other evidence, like Satanic symbols, need to corroborate it.

                The question needs to be asked, "Why has the Catholic Church incorporated pagan symbols in the church."

                Sun worship is devil worship and characters such as Baal are solar deities.

                See the obelisk at St Peter's Square?


                http://s2.hubimg.com/u/6662957_f248.jpg

                Obelisk means "Baal's shaft".  His penis. 


                One Luciferian author writes that "... the lingam [male phallus] was an upright pillar" [W. Wynn Wescott, Numbers: Their Occult Power and Mystic Virtues, Theosophical Publishing Society, 1902, p. 33]

                The Egyptians created the obelisk, believing that the spirit of the Sun god, Ra, dwelt in there. [H.L. Hayward, Symbolic Masonry:  An Interpretation of the Three Degrees, Washington, D.C., Masonic Service Association of the United States, 1923, p. 207; 'Two Pillars' Short Talk Bulletin, Sept., 1935, Vol. 13, No 9; Charles Clyde Hunt, Some Thoughts On Masonic Symbolism, Macoy Publishing and Masonic Supply Company, 1930, p. 101]

                A Masonic author both admit that these pillars of the obelisk were used to represent sex [Hayward,Symbolic Masonry:  An Interpretation of the Three Degrees, Washington, D.C., Masonic Service Association of the United States, 1923, p. 206-7 and Rollin C. Blackmer, The Lodge and the Craft: A Practical Explanation of the Work of Freemasonry, St. Louis, The Standard Masonic Publishing Co., 1923, p. 94]


                "Go in, and slay them; let none come forth. And they smote them with the edge of the sword; and the guard and the captains cast them out, and went to the city of the house of Baal. And they brought forth the images out of the house of Baal, and burned them." -2 Kings 10:25-26 The Amplified Bible translates it...  … King Jehu said to the guards and to the officers, 'Go in and slay them; let none escape'. And they smote them with the sword; and the guards before the king threw their bodies out, and went into the inner dwelling of the house of Baal. They brought out the obelisks [pillars] of the house of Baal and burned them." [2 Kings 10:26, Amplified Bible]

                http://www.remnantofgod.org/steeple.htm

                Look at this picture:



                 


                http://s2.hubimg.com/u/6662925_f248.jpg

                That hand signal is called the Cornuto or "El Diablo" hand signal prominent in Satanism. 

                Below is the picture of the founder of the "Church of Satan".






                http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6662932_f248.jpg



                This video explains that hand signal:

                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uisbOL55 … re=related



                A few other things to consider about the Catholic Church like where the sacred heart came from.

                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6oGEIUd … re=related

                So obviously Satan owns the Vatican.  I mean, why leave the most powerful Christian institution untouched?




                I'm on the side of God which automatically means I'm against the Vatican.

                1. MelissaBarrett profile image61
                  MelissaBarrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  That hand signal looks very much like an old man with arthritis... it also is very  close to the sign language "I love you"

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Melissa, are you serious????

                    Can people be so in denial? A man with arthritis? You can't be serious on that one.  Helen Keller was an occultist and she is the one who made the connection with that hand signal with, "I love you".  Properly translated, it goes, "I love you, Satan."

                    It's an ancient symbol dating back thousands of years ago of witch-craft.  I've given all the material there.

                  2. Aurora Lebeouf profile image60
                    Aurora Lebeoufposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    Nikki Minaj at the Grammys


                    http://s1.hubimg.com/u/8892060_f248.jpg

                  3. Aurora Lebeouf profile image60
                    Aurora Lebeoufposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    Aliester Crowley was pretty cozy to catholic church as well.

                    Ordo Templi Orientis : Google it

                    How do you people not see it.....

                    I started out as an atheist. I've made comments just like Rad Man, like everybody else here critizising Claire...until I just started to notice things. Did a whole lot of research...it always leads back to Rome. Always, always always leads back to to rome. Illuminati. Hollywood. The mindless programming on tv. The tweaked history. The crusaders..on wikipedia...it's funny how they replaced the words "roman catholics" to just "christian" thus programming the masses to generalize everything. 

                    Organized crime pretty much originated from Italy...oh gee what do you know, the vatican is in Italy!  I truly believe that the roman empire is the root of all evil. And that's pretty much all Im going to say on the topic. Claire...these people have to discover it on their own these people need to ask god for truth. They can only have it if they actually want it. The seeds can't always fall in the right places.

                    It's just that their knee jerk reaction to anything related to religions and the like are all P.C. training they learned growing up in our schools systems.

                2. 0
                  Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  The bull hand gesture does not always mean what you think it does to everyone. For instance to Italians it's superstitions and is a way of waving off the evil eye (jealousy).

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I do not care what meaning they assign to it.  It's what it originally means that counts.

                3. Disappearinghead profile image89
                  Disappearingheadposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  How on Earth can an obelisk be satan's willy? If you Claire have ever seen one that looks like that, then I suggest the man in your life needs to see a doctor. hmm

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Please don't display your ignorance.  Phallic worship was very common in ancient times.  Here's an example:

                    "Among the Assyrians, the supreme god, Bel, was styled the "procreator"; and his wife, the goddess Mylitta, represented the productive principle of nature, and received the title of the queen of fertility. Another deity, the god Vul, the god of the atmosphere, is styled the beneficent chief, the giver of abundance, the lord of fecundity. On Assyrian cylinders he is represented as a phallic deity. With him is associated a goddess Shala, whose ordinary title is "Sarrat," queen, the feminine of the word "Sar," which means chief. Sir Henry Rawlinson remarks, with regard to the Assyrian San, or Shamas, the sun-god, that the idea of the motive influence of the sun-god in all human affairs arose from the manifest agency of the material sun in stimulating the functions of nature. In Phoenician mythology, Ouranos (heaven) weds Ghe (the earth), and by her becomes father of Oceanus, Hyperon, Iapetus, Cronos, and other gods. In conformity with the religious ideas of the Greeks and Romans, Virgil describes the products of the earth as the result of the conjugal act between Jupiter (the sky) and Juno (the earth). According to St. Augustin, the sexual organ of man was consecrated in the temple of Liber, that of woman in the sanctuaries of Libera; these two divinities were named father and mother.

                    Evidence that this worship extensively prevailed will be found in many countries, both in ancient and modern times. It occurs in ancient Egypt, in India, in Syria, in Babylon, among the Assyrians, in Persia, Greece, Italy, Spain, Germany, Scandinavia, and among the Gauls. In Egypt, the phallus is frequently represented as the symbol of generation. According to Ptolemy, the phallus was the object of religious worship among the Assyrians and also among the Persians. In Syria, Baal-Peor was represented with a phallus in his mouth, according to St. Jerome. The Jews did not escape this worship; and we see their women manufacturing phalli of gold and of silver, as we find in Ezekiel xvi. 17.[1] Among the Hindoos a religious reverence was paid to the Lingam and Yoni, and among the Greeks and Romans to the Phallus and Cteis. Among the Teutons and Scandinavians, the god Fricco, corresponding to the Priapus of the Romans, was adored under the form of a phallus; a similar god under a similar symbol was adored in Spain, whose name was Hortanes."

                    http://www.sacred-texts.com/sex/pw/pw.htm

                4. lstCitizen profile image60
                  lstCitizenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Claire, I’m not sure what to think about you…  It sounds to me like maybe someone in the Church has done some evil to you, and now you have this hatred for anything Catholic.  If that is the case, I am terribly sorry.  It may just be that the Church has preached some truth to you that you didn’t want to hear.  If that is the case then OK.  You are free to reject her.  You seem to have an obsession that is causing you to fall for any anti-Catholic nonsense you read. 

                  There’s no need to “walk on eggshells”.  If you have a criticism of the Catholic Church, let’s have it.  If you want to be taken seriously, be sure to source your work from the Catholic Catechism.  If you disagree with the Church, then OK.  If you have an issue with the pope, the person, it might help if you actually read something he has written.  Joseph Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI, has written extensively, on Christianity.  He is quite a scholarly man.  If you disagree with him then OK. 

                  Claire, when you reference Masonic sources or any of these other satanic works, you lose all credibility.  You see, even if it is as you say, that Satan has gotten into the Church, I say so what?  For 2000 years Satan has been obsessed with destroying the Church.  This isn’t anything new.  There have been countless efforts like these over 2000 years, but even the “gates of Hell shall not prevail against it”. (Mt 16:18)  If you stand for God, don’t let yourself be used by Satan.

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    For the umpteemth time, I have nothing against Catholics.  It is the Vatican I despise.    The Vatican has preached the truth to me.  She told me she's the Whore of Babylon and that is why I reject.

                    As common with many people, you completely disregard all the material I've posted.  If the Pope associates himself with an upside and bent cross, both Satanic, and waves his hands around signalling the sign for the devil, then what am I to think?  Why the hell is the Vatican associating itself with obelisks which is Baal's penis? Answer these questions!

                    And why have I lost all credibility when citing Masons? Did you know that the devil can cite scriptures? Does this make him a Christian?


                    Unfortunately with many Catholics they don't realize they have been blinded by Satan when they view the Vatican as good. I cannot make you see the obvious.  I assume you were brought up as a child in Catholicism.  That makes it even harder to permeate people.

    13. 0
      Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Well, I have to say Claire this is a no brainer.

      I am no fan of the RCC, but I don't call them Satanic and evil and wonder why I"M getting attacked.
      You're forgetting that you are doing the attacking and others are defending.

      I don't believe this but I'll use it as an example of how your comments stir up emotions.

      YOU can be seen as Satanic and Evil and I can back it up. You spread fear and hatred against fellow christians and you feel no remorse. Catholics feel they are just a right as you and yet you are spreading Hate propaganda towards them. That is Satanic and Evil.

      Again, I don't believe the previous statement, but anyone can spread hate towards a group or person.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        And what if it is a fact? People can defend their position without getting into attack mode.  Take for instance 1stCitizen.  He answered the question in a calm and mature way.



        I suppose Jesus was Satanic for coming to bring a sword and causing division in families because of the truth.  No, I will not feel remorse when it comes to exposing evil.  And Rad Man, have I ever condemned regular Catholics? It's the Vatican I have a problem with.  If you condemned the Crusaders are you now condemning all the Christians?

        1. 0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I agree with you on the Vatican for different reasons, but calling them Satanic only makes most laugh and a few yell. You will convince no one this way. Regular Catholics as you call them don't see the distinction between them and the Vatican. Remember Sinéad O'Connor?

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I do not care if they laugh.  I do not care if they are convinced or not.  It only matters that the truth gets out there.

    14. amymarie_5 profile image88
      amymarie_5posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I wouldn't call the catholic church satanic, but it is definitely a corrupt organization.  I was raised catholic, left the church as an adult.  I don't follow religion anymore but I do see where you are coming from in regards to the catholic church.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The symbols make it very obvious it's Satanic.

        1. MayG profile image86
          MayGposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Ah dear, when I first posted a reply to this forum topic I thought it was a reasonable comment that deserved some responses but all this nonsense about Satanic hand gestures and phallic symbols?  Please!  Talk about going too far.  I'm no great fan of the Pope, but would he really, deliberately, make a Satanic hand gesture in public?  I have to laugh.

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            It's a fact that the obelisk represents Baal's shaft (his phallus).  He can make a deliberate Satanic hand gesture in public because most people are too dull to pick it up or take it seriously.  This Satanists can also say, "Oh, I meant to say "rock on" or "I love you".

            1. Randy Godwin profile image92
              Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Wow!  You are really out there, aren't you? You see evil in everything, apparently.  lol

                                                        http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                No, only when there is evidence for it.

                1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                  Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  But only you see it, Claire.  There is a word for this, you know!  lol


                                                         http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

                  1. 0
                    Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    She's a hoot.

            2. Randy Godwin profile image92
              Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Ah, but you, in your infinite wisdom, picked right up on the secret handshake, right? lol  What a hoot!  yikes

                                                     http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                It wasn't a secret handshake, obviously.

                1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                  Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  You say "obviously" like everyone agrees with you.  I assure you, they do not!


                                                         http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    A handshake is when one person puts their hand into another.  Clearly that wasn't seen.

    15. Druid Dude profile image61
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It is an obvious fulfillment of prophecy.

    16. MrMaranatha profile image86
      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Really?  Egg Shells are fun to walk on... they sort of make a nice Crackly sound... Very much like the crackling and popping of peoples brains when they hear something that they know in thier hearts is the truth but that they do not want to hear..  Snap Crackle Pop and Fizz...  then comes the reaction: Attack the Messenger!!!   (Sounds like the same way the prophets were attacked by the Pharisees and rulers in their day... and then later...  Jesus was attacked and killed by the Pharisees and rulers of the Jews in his time as well ...   But Just remember... Jesus told us "Take up your Cross and follow ME"  That means Jesus not Mary... and the Cross means they will probably assassinate you for doing so...  (Either in character... or in Real life.)   Just keep following Jesus.

      1. 0
        Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Don't feed the beast.

      2. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I do believe people think there is some truth in what they say so they try and catch me saying something false so that it gives them excuse to dismiss EVERYTHING I say.  Or they just make up stuff like me hating the whole of humanity.  Why are all these people still hanging around my threads when they despise what I say?

        The worship of Mary is just plain wrong and is not biblical.  It's actually Isis worship.

        Thanks for stopping by!

        1. 0
          Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Claire, I don't despise what you say at all. You are correct in that Catholics should not worship Mary. They worship everyone that is sainted for different reasons.

          I hang around because I just can't wait for what you will say next. I'm trying to get a glimpse inside you mind. Something is going on in there and I just want to know what. I do hope you are stable and seeing someone. This is not meant as an insult, but is only drawn from concern.

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Some do, Rad Man.  Some people jump down my throat.  I can't say I think of you as one of those.

            I am 100% stable, I assure you.  I most certainly would not sound reasonable in things that can be proven.  When it comes to the Holy Spirit, however, it defies all reason so those who preach about Him automatically sound unreasonable. 

            Jesus was called mad by His own family because calling Himself the son of God sounded very wacko.  Like a David Koresh?

            Mark 3:20-21
            New International Version (NIV)
            Jesus Accused by His Family and by Teachers of the Law

            20 Then Jesus entered a house, and again a crowd gathered, so that he and his disciples were not even able to eat. 21 When his family[a] heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, “He is out of his mind.”

            1. 0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Let's imagine for just a second that every word in the bible is factual. If at that time his own family thought he was crazy what does that tell you. Shouldn't his father and mother have know who he was? Were they not told? Going of topic here a little but, if my wife was a virgin and pregnant I would be a little confused about a lot of things. One, married women don't remain a virgin for long and Two, he must have been told how this pregnancy occurred or he wouldn't remain. So, if he knew this baby was the son of God, why would he think him crazy? Way to many problems with this story. You see this is how indoctrination works. You are taught not to listen to me because it's Satan trying to get in. But it's not like that at all.

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                It tells you that what is not logical is very hard to believe without faith.  Now Joseph was dead by the time this incident happened.  He was convinced that Mary was carrying the son of God because of the angel that appeared to Him.  Obviously Mary was, too, convinced.  It is not clear if she was present or not when Jesus was called crazy.  She most certainly wouldn't have called Him crazy but I've heard his siblings thought He was a bit weird.  However, it was probably Jesus' extended family that thought He was nuts.  In Mark 4:31 it says, "The Jesus' mother and brothers arrived..." after he was called crazy. 

                It is only natural to accuse someone of being crazy that person is not understood.  If someone said they were the son of God today, I'd not believe him.  We tend to want facts.  I'm a logical person except when it comes to my faith.  Logic and faith do not go hand in hand.  The thought of someone rising from the dead with all His wounds healed seems way out there.  That is why He was not recognized when He rose from the dead.  People who aren't indoctrinated always look for a rational explanation.  We have doubting Thomas who even had doubts when Jesus appeared to Him!

                It is only the Holy Spirit that casts out all these doubts and makes one realize that the seemingly impossible can be done.  I only wish others could experience the peace and joy I have from God.

                1. backporchstories profile image84
                  backporchstoriesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I for one, believe with great faith in the Creator and I follow Jesus's teachings.  However, what I found unsettling is how the Churches use those teachings.  The Bible is full of conflicts, certainly, but then again it is comprised of several authors and their points of view.  You and I can witness the same event and because of our individual way of looking at things, may describe the same event differently.

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    True, but the scriptures are all unanimous in that Jesus was crucified, died for our sins and rose from the dead.  This is good enough.


                    It's actually amazing how close the gospels harmonize.  If they were copied verbatim from another, there wouldn't be variances and sometimes contradictions, which is perfectly natural.

              2. aguasilver profile image88
                aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Actually what was said would be just as valid today, of course the family knew the score, they may have tried to ignore it, but like the elephant in the room, it would have always been there, and when Christ drew the crowds, when He showed His true self, it would be perfectly normal for those not so empowered to consider him mad.

                What Christ was doing was challenging their whole belief system, and bringing them close to what God was doing, folk get very nervous when things around them challenge their cosy belief systems.

                Just as you consider those who follow Him today mad, and try to shut us up so that you will not have to hear inconvenient truths..

                Mark 3 7:26

                Jesus retired with His disciples to the lake, and a great throng from Galilee followed Him.

                Also from Judea and from Jerusalem and Idumea and from beyond the Jordan and from about Tyre and Sidon—a vast multitude, hearing all the many things that He was doing, came to Him.

                And He told His disciples to have a little boat in [constant] readiness for Him because of the crowd, lest they press hard upon Him and crush Him.

                For He had healed so many that all who had distressing bodily diseases kept falling upon Him and pressing upon Him in order that they might touch Him.

                And the spirits, the unclean ones, as often as they might see Him, fell down before Him and kept screaming out, You are the Son of God!

                And He charged them strictly and severely under penalty again and again that they should not make Him known.

                And He went up on the hillside and called to Him [for Himself] those whom He wanted and chose, and they came to Him.

                And He appointed twelve to continue to be with Him, and that He might send them out to preach [as apostles or special messengers]

                And to have authority and power to heal the sick and to drive out demons:

                [They were] Simon, and He surnamed [him] Peter; James son of Zebedee and John the brother of James, and He surnamed them Boanerges, that is, Sons of Thunder;

                And Andrew, and Philip, and Bartholomew (Nathaniel), and Matthew, and Thomas, and James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus (Judas, not Iscariot), and Simon the Cananaean [also called Zelotes], and Judas Iscariot, he who betrayed Him.

                Then He went to a house [probably Peter’s], but a throng came together again, so that Jesus and His disciples could not even take food.

                And when those [who belonged to Him (His kinsmen) heard it, they went out to take Him by force, for they kept saying, He is out of His mind (beside Himself, deranged)!

                And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, He is possessed by Beelzebub, and, By [the help of] the prince of demons He is casting out demons.

                And He summoned them to Him and said to them in parables (illustrations or comparisons put beside truths to explain them);

                "How can Satan drive out Satan?, and if a kingdom is divided and rebelling against itself, that kingdom cannot stand, and if a house is divided (split into factions and rebelling) against itself, that house will not be able to last, nd if Satan has raised an insurrection against himself and is divided, he cannot stand but is [surely] coming to an end."

                Later those powers were extended to all believers who would receive them, they still function today, and people still try to pretend that this is not all real, but it is, and although you may not see what is happening in the spiritual realm, it continues, and those who are called to combat it, are still doing the same as Christ did back then, and still meeting the same resistance to the truth.

                1. 0
                  Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  lol lol

                  The world has waited for proof. Surely, someone as powerful as yourself could offer something. Other than mindless rantings.

                  Give us a miracle. Something simple. Make my laptop move. Or post a video of you walking on water. That should do it.

                  1. DoubleScorpion profile image87
                    DoubleScorpionposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I was reading these last few comments...And one would think, that Jesus' mother would have believed everything he said and did...After all, She would have been the one person who would have known for positive sure who he was, right?

                    I think an early poster had a valid point. I am curious as to why some of these things never get questioned by the "christian types" (I know why of course, but still)
                    And some of these folks seem very intelligent, one would think...well never mind...smile

          2. 0
            Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Just a clarification.

            Catholics do NOT worship Mary.

            Catholics do NOT worship Saints.

            We speak to them (pray to them) for their intercession before God the Father because we believe they are already standing in His presence in Heaven.  Like we ask our friends on earth to pray for us, we do the same with Mary and the Saints.  They are not worshiped.  They do not perform miracles.  Miracles may happen through their intercession.

            If you have further questions, the Catechism of the Catholic Church (what the Church ACTUALLY believes and teaches) is available in its entirety online right here.

            http://usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/

            Happy bashing, all.  big_smile

            1. 0
              Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Don't you think facts might muddy the waters?

              1. 0
                Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I know, Emile.  Every once in a while, those of us following the satanic Pope speak something akin to rationality.

                It tends to confuse people.

                wink

            2. 0
              Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Hail Mary, full of grace.
              Our Lord is with thee.
              Blessed art thou among women,
              and blessed is the fruit of thy womb,
              Jesus.
              Holy Mary, Mother of God,
              pray for us sinners,
              now and at the hour of our death.
              Amen.

              I think that is worship.

              1. 0
                Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                The words of the first half of the Hail Mary are taken directly from Scripture.  Luke's gospel when Mary visits her cousin Elizabeth.  The second half proceeds from it.  Elizabeth herself asks Mary "Who am I that the mother of my lord should come to me?"

                It is not worship.  It is called honor.

                That paid to the saints is honor (in latin - dulia)
                That paid to Mary is high honor (hyperdulia)

                Notice we do not ask Mary to take us to Heaven only to pray for us at the hour of our death.

                Again, happy bashing.  Hopefully you'll only run into folks who don't know what they're talking about.

                Neither Mary nor the saints are worshiped - they are venerated.

                1. 0
                  Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  You are splitting hairs. It's worship when you pray to mary or a saint because you think they have the power to help. You can call it something different if you like, but praying to someone other than God is worship. Not that Catholics are any more wrong than any other Christian.

                  1. 0
                    Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I suppose there is no sense in arguing in the grand scheme of things.  Catholics who know and are comfortable with their faith feel no need to convert others to their way of thinking/believing. 

                    I always just hope that people will come to understand the difference as we see it. 

                    Till then, I'm all about peaceful disagreement.

                    smile

                2. aguasilver profile image88
                  aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  My only comment would be that Mary is dead, and venerated as she deservedly is for being Christ's mother, she is still as equally dead as every other person who has died, and will not be regenerated until the resurrection, along with everyone else in Christ who has ever died.

                  I see no special provision for Mary to escape 'soul death' in scripture, and plenty of scripture that backs soul death until the resurrection.

                  This would make prayer to her redundant?

                  Please correct me if I am wrong.

                  1. 0
                    Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    The teaching of the Church is that those who are dead are alive in Christ - which means in Heaven already awaiting the final resurrection.


                    Hence the veneration is to souls who are living in Heaven now.

                    smile

                  2. 0
                    Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Acts 12:15 refutes your statement, for one.

        2. MrMaranatha profile image86
          MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I was going to make more Jokes.. but ... forget it.. its too serious really.. Have you ever seen the different versions of "Mary"...  The Catholic Mary has nothing to do with the mother of Jesus... I mean really you can take you pick of which "Mary or Maria" you want cause there are thousands of them... they range from the mundane Gothic styles from old europe.. to the outright Satanic junk that you would find in santeria worship of south and central america and other forms that blend well with the Dark Afrikan witchcrafts and other forms of Satanism...   All roads lead to rome.. and as long as you pay your taxes nobody gets hurt....  right?

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            "All roads lead to rome.. and as long as you pay your taxes nobody gets hurt....  right?"

            Except little children.

            1. Castlepaloma profile image23
              Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Those are ancient roads, more like the roads led to the US, which now changing to a Global economy which changes the story again

    17. MayG profile image86
      MayGposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I think there's a danger in any religion where there's a leader who is supposed to somehow be closer to God then other mere mortals.  It sounds as if the Vatican is just another organisation with power-hungry individuals trying to get to the top.  Kind of goes against what I think religion should be about, although having said that, the Catholic Church as a whole also does do a lot of good charity work around the world.  There's also a lot of superstition rather than religion around some aspects of the church too.  I'll never forget when my son was christened my mother-in-law told me to not wash his head for a couple of days, so the holy water could sink in.  I mean really?  What did she think it was going to do?

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Evil people often do charity work to divert attention away from their evil. 

        Unfortunately, often than promoting a healthy personal relationship with God, religion often turns people weird and unreasonable.  It's probably got to do with fear of hell.

        To be honest, I do get a irritated, and often angered, when people try to coerce others into their religion by making threats.    It has the opposite affect and repels people.

    18. 59
      BillBBposted 3 years ago in reply to this

      Claire, I could waffle on but time is short in the Last Days so I'll be to the point - the RCC is heavily satanic.

      Satanists use the RCC mass as a template for a satanic Black Mass.
      When catholic priests call down "jesus" into the wafer, they are practicing WITCHCRAFT.  Any time a priest/"holy man" calls up a spirit its not christianity, its witchcraft.

      I recalled once I saw a comment by an occult Alchemist, who said the catholic mass was "magic par excellence - it cannot be improved upon".

      Imagine whole congregations of well meaning people participating in a magic occult rite and unaware of it?

      And the RCC has persistent child abuse issues that just wont go away - why?  They have "doctrines of demons" forbidding priests to marry.

      The RCC is full of occult practices and is *not* christian.

      People walk on egg shells around them because they have large POLITICAL clout and as history has shown will kill people also who severely question them, and they generally dont tolerate anything but complete blind obedience. That isnt Christianity.

      Add to that the aggression you get from them when you question their faith and most of them you'd happily avoid.

      The RCC is a black hole for human souls and a massive demon "magnet".

      May God open the good Catholic peoples eyes before its too late.

  2. janesix profile image59
    janesixposted 4 years ago

    Because claiming that the vatican has been infiltrated by the Satanic Superforce is pretty comical.

    1. aguasilver profile image88
      aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      ...if it was not so true... smile

    2. Claire Evans profile image90
      Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Not really.  When a Jesuit Vatican insider and a Pope himself says so then I don't think it's comical.

      1. 0
        jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth


        1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

        2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

        3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

        4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

        5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

        6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

        7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

        8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

        9. Do not harm little children.

        10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

        11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

        So the church has decided to improve, after all!!!

        1. noenhulk profile image55
          noenhulkposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          what? where am I when this rule was made? ...

      2. 0
        Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I watched a show on tv last night. Ancient Aliens. At least four people were interviewed who believe that ancient aliens genetically altered humans and animals to develop species who would mine gold for them. Do I automatically accept that as true? Two were archeologists.

        Was I wrong to laugh?

      3. MrMaranatha profile image86
        MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        If the Bible pretty much nails it down to that in Revelation 17-18 then that settles it for me.  Vatican is the city on 7 hills... and that thing they call marry is another matter.

  3. 0
    Emile Rposted 4 years ago

    Claire, aqua expresses a more compassionate way of complaining about the Catholic church and I think janesix is correct.

    What fascinates me is how Christians continue to belittle each other's faiths, but insist their own is divinely inspired. The faithful Catholic is no different from the faithful Baptist or any faithful believer. That is the window they found to understand their God.

    You, and all others, demand respect for your beliefs. A modicum of respect for the position of the pope is useful when respecting the belief of a catholic. If the average believer respected other believers, that believer would get more respect.

    And, to be honest, catholic means universal...correct? Sometimes I wonder if the disrespect of catholics isn't jealousy. The person speaking thinks they have the truth. They want their belief to be universal. They want to be in the position of the catholic church.

    1. 0
      jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      If I say you are or what you believe is satanic, that is just telling you the facts.
      But if you say I'm paranoid and delusional with irrational beliefs, it is ATTACK, PERSONAL ATTACK. It proves you are satanic and I'll report and ban you.

      1. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
        Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        But what if it is matter of fact that the person IS paranoid and delusional with irrational beliefs?

        Why is it not an attack to call someone satanic but not any of the others?

        I hope you were being sarcastic, it's hard to tell on here...

        1. aguasilver profile image88
          aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Or gosh, shock horror, I cannot believe this.....

          Maybe they are only 'paranoid and delusional with irrational beliefs' in your opinion, because your thinking has been infiltrated and personality shaped by hostile spiritual entities that you deny exist?

          Or are these rhetorical questions only one sided?

          1. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
            Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            My point is that it works both ways. Since satan has never been proven to exist, then that is just an opinion.

            1. aguasilver profile image88
              aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Well it's an opinion you are basing a whole lot of your destiny upon.

              1. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
                Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Satans existence is not my opinion. I base my "destiny" on evidence and facts, not what some guy down the road thinks he knows.

              2. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                So before the earth was proven to be round if was only an opinion to say so and not the truth yet?

                1. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
                  Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I didn't say anything about truth. I was stating that the claim satan exists, is not based on any facts hence it is just an opinion. It may be truth but if noone has knowledge of that truth, any claim of such is just opinion.

                  Similarly, if noone has ever seen any evidence or knows anything about the shape of the earth, and one simply claims it is round based on no facts at all, then that would still be an opinion although it would be coincidentally true (unbeknown to the claimant).

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Are you telling me that nobody has knowledge of Satan? Have you been in the shoes of every person that ever existed? Over thousands of years people have reported demonic activities.  Are they ALL wrong?

                    1. aguasilver profile image88
                      aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      It's 'inconvenient' for folk to go anywhere near allowing that the enemy exists.

                      If they once do that, they must examine their entire belief system.

                      That is why they twist and turn so radically to avoid contemplating what millions of people know to be fact.

                      There is a spiritual realm, there are two sides to that realm, good, represented by Christ and evil, represented by the enemy, and ALL humanity will serve one team or the other.

                    2. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
                      Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      Millions of people have reported experiencing completely different gods. They can't all be right so yes, many people can all be wrong.

            2. 0
              jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              How do you know for sure, that it is not you who is infiltrated?

              1. aguasilver profile image88
                aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Maybe because I have worked on both teams, and I know the difference?

                If I had 'encountered' you when I worked for the enemy, you would most certainly have been suffering some unexplained health issues a long time ago, as it is, we just ask God to bless you and reveal Himself to you.

                BTW, if you ever come across a Satanist, I suggest you just walk away from the discussion, they do not play nice.

                1. 0
                  jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  You worked with 'for' god and 'against' god teams, not no god teams,
                  I just checked the satanic church rules, they appear similar if not better than the rules played by Christians.

                  1. aguasilver profile image88
                    aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I worked for the 'no god' team (as you describe it)for the first 35 years of my life, then I slipped into the enemy team, and finally, having recognised who was pulling my strings, defected by election to God via Christ.

                    If you find the 'rules' of Satanism "better than the rules played by Christians." I would suggest you are more infiltrated than I first thought.

                    The Nine Satanic Statements from The Satanic Bible, ©1969

                    by Anton Szandor LaVey

                    1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence!

                    2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!

                    3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit!

                    4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates!

                    5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek!

                    6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires!

                    7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his “divine spiritual and intellectual development,” has become the most vicious animal of all!

                    8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!

                    9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!

                    Small wonder that this perversion is so attractive to those who seek to reject Christ.

                    1. 0
                      jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      Those are the same rules Christians live by, though you give lip service to loving your neighbor. At least the satanists are not hypocrites.
                      If there is no god, how can you be against god?
                      You decided before hand there is god and you are against him. Then you later became for him.
                      Saying there is no god for some personal reasons or just not liking bible and not doing it is not 'no god' team.
                      And why only two are bolded?

                    2. 0
                      jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      I assume from this statement that you are a true believer. Since I've not seen you answering the forum whether you are a true Christian I ask the question here.
                      Can you heal the sick by putting your hands on them?
                      Can you drink poison without it causing any effect on you?
                      If you cannot do any of These, you are not a true believer and hence you are the satanist.

                    3. Jesus was a hippy profile image61
                      Jesus was a hippyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      If putting people in hell is not vengeance then I don't know what is. Flooding the planet? The rapture?

                      Gratification is a bad thing? lol lol lol

                      None of the laws you showed were bad in any way. Just because you think that your god thinks they are does not make them bad. Many people who use their own morals have no problem with these laws.

      2. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I will not be "compassionate" when it comes to the Catholic Church.  It is not to say that any other denomination is perfect but the Vatican is unquestionably evil. I think Jesus must have been accused of belittling the beliefs of the Pharisees just because he said the truth. 

        Let us differentiate between a church and the follower of that church.  Catholics aren't Satanic.  They are good people.  I just believe they are ignorant of their church.  Even so, it is the Vatican I have a problem with, not the individual churches you find in your area.  My church, an Anglican one, obviously has aspects of Catholicism in it.  Priests wear the Dagon fish hat, for example, but it doesn't make them evil. 

        Just to set the record straight, I was not aware that Motown was present when I spoke out against the Catholic Church.  Someone else brought it up and I responded so it wasn't a dig at her.

        1. 0
          Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          In retrospect Claire, I think I'm the one who brought up the pope and the corporations. But, it doesn't matter who brought it up because we both know this is an open forum. What is written today can stil be read tomorrow.

          From your opening statement you made it clear that you are the one who cried foul to the moderators. I have a rule of trying not to interact with people on this forum who expect to have the right to insult broad groups of people, but then run for the moderators when they take offense.

          So, continue on with the delusion that the Catholic church is somehow more 'evil' than any other religious attempt to sway humanity into thinking humanity, itself, is at war with cosmic forces. Apparently common sense won't stop you.

          1. 0
            jomineposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            The only one who can stop/cure her is not doing his job properly!

          2. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So? That doesn't stop you posting things that Christians may read and take offense to later. Anyway, people need to know the truth and the truth is not palatable.   



            No, it was not me that went to the moderator.  When I went to Margie's blog and saw I could not reply to anyone's post, I saw that the moderator had closed the forum remarking that it was closed because of the number of valid personal attacks.  I believe the moderator did the right thing.  Hubpages ought to encourage civil discussions.  We aren't school kids.  I was afraid my forum would be seen as a continuation of Margie's so I stated that if it did then the moderator would have to step in.  I actually found the last forum distressing.  Usually they are okay but that specific one was getting out of control.



            Common sense tells me that any Church who pledges allegiance to Satan must be Satanic.  I'm not the one that made up the fact the Vatican associates itself with occult and pagan symbols.

    2. jacharless profile image82
      jacharlessposted 4 years ago

      Because after the Easter Sunday egg hunt, no one cleaned up all those shells. {crunch, crunch crunch}.

      1. Jerami profile image78
        Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        This too was an invention of the RCC

        1. Claire Evans profile image90
          Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          It wasn't an invention.  It was just appropriated pagan traditions into the church.

          1. Jerami profile image78
            Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Exactly ...   But

              This is just an opinion and it is also mine

              The RCC and Islam are the two beasts which John saw rising up out of the sea in Rev. 13.
              And 1000 years later it morphed into a different kind of body keeping the same head. This is something which God preordained.
            THEN  or should I say ... at the same time (Rev 11) ...two witnesses are sent down from heaven which infiltrates these two worldly organizations.

              I say at the "same time" because the Beast mentioned in Rev. 13 is given 42 months to blaspheme the Lord.  The two witnesses are given 1260 days to offer a counter testimony. Both of these time periods end approx. the same time.

               1260 days is exactly 1260 days while 42 months is the same amount of time, yet it can be said that 42 months can be 1260 days give or take a few days and still be 42 months.
               These time frames are prophetic references in time. 62 weeks equal approx 568 of our years.
               
               If these things are true, the spiritual battle that people are talking about, is taking place within the churches themselves, and then spilling out into the streets.
               Why was this planned this way?  I don't know but I have a few ideas.

            1. Claire Evans profile image90
              Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Yes, the ultimate spiritual battle is happening in the churches.  As I posted, the purpose of the Illuminati is to break down all religions in favour of a one world religion and that is the worship of Lucifer. 

              I've read a book by Perry Stone suggesting that a Muslim will be the Anti-Christ.  He makes a compelling argument but I always thought he was to be Jewish.  Perhaps he is half Jewish and half Muslim? I think, however, that the Vatican will be the one to groom him into power.

              1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                The Ultimate spiritual reality is about the 99% unknowns. What you are talking is the over known and over ego battles of ancient Religions and worst, within their own domination

            2. 72
              Robertr04posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Jerami, I'm surprised. The two beasts represent the Papacy and the good ol' U.S. of A.

    3. Jerami profile image78
      Jeramiposted 4 years ago

      I am going to have a busy day today so in closing I'll just say

        I know ten times as many people that do believe in God and Jesus Christ than I do that that believes in Church.

        How much faith in religion did God ask us to have.
      He didn't say "Have no other religion before MINE"

        He did NOT say "This religion is the only one which brings you to me"

         See Ya ...  much later today.

    4. Jerami profile image78
      Jeramiposted 4 years ago

      What everyone keeps doing is to refer to OT prophesy about the AntiChrist OR the "Little Horn" and the Dragon and the beast as described in Rev. 13, as being one entity. They are NOT the same persona according to that which is written..
         Until these are separated and put into proper chronological order there will be no understanding of prophesy what so ever..

    5. jacharless profile image82
      jacharlessposted 4 years ago

      According to Nostradamus, who supposedly has been correct two-for-two out of three anti-anointed, the third is to rise out of Mongul or Asia.

      Personally, I have yet to see the validity of the Revelation version of anti-anointed. From everything I have studied, this letter is a front-to-back revealing of the entire event known as salvation.

      James.

    6. Jenna Pope profile image61
      Jenna Popeposted 4 years ago

      People are in the Vatican, and people make mistakes. I think the heat behind the responses is the desire to stop all the bashing of what is intrinsically true. My theory. I'm a Catholic and accept the mistakes.

      1. 0
        Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Me too, Jenna.  smile

      2. Mark Knowles profile image60
        Mark Knowlesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Without millions of deaths, there would be no Catholic priests.

        Was it worth millions of deaths and child molestations? That continue to this day with the protection of the Holy See.

        I guess you think so. Or would you throw it away to change the past?

        1. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The Pope asked for forgiveness for the pass killings.

          Let see if a leopard changes his spots he may get more, he may get less, still he is a leopard

      3. tohimilook profile image61
        tohimilookposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        We would call other churches cults EXCEPT the Catholic Church.  This church has always been fixing their eyes on the Pope instead of Jesus.  Sure the Roman church does a lot of good things for the lest fortunate.  But drug lords do the same. 

        The CC will continue doing what it is doing because people continue to look up to the pope as a god.  If the sexual molestations done by the CC were done by an individual they would be in jail.    People are AFRAID of the church.   They hold power.   The pope is the only human religious leader that is repspected by all human governments.   
        By the way, the Vatican has a BANK.    Did Jesus own a bank. 
        www.businessweek.com/.../vatican-bank-c … -money-...

        It is interesting that the chief at the bank is removed...but priests who molest children  (and all the evidence is available)
        Vatican told bishops to cover up sex abuse | World news |
        www.guardian.co.uk › News › World
        They are transferred to other diocese...something is so wrong here. PERHAPS MONEY IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN PEOPLE.    The bible says something about money...THE LOVE OF IT IS THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL. 

        The CC teaching are as far away from the bible as the difference between chalk and cheese.

        1. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes,Jesus would be helping the poor and Jesus only got angry at the money merchant at the church

          1. tohimilook profile image61
            tohimilookposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So you think he would be silent at what is happening re. the abuse of children. 

            Parents brought their children to Jesus so he could pray for them

            Mark 9:42

            And WHOSOEVER (includes anyone priest or not) shall offend anyone of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

            How many altar boys have been violated.

            1. Castlepaloma profile image23
              Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Yes, a million children have been molested by Clergymen in the USA and the Catholic church protect such people.

              The Pope John said he is the the light and the way to God,
              Jesus is like in 6th place of importance of being spoken about

            2. 72
              Robertr04posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              How many nuns have been violated? The lime pits under the convents?

              1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I always thought -want nun, get none

                1. 72
                  Robertr04posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I should have said allegedly, but I'm comfortable with my resource. This is not priviledged info and there have been no lawsuits. Until a few years ago I thought the same thing. But as the saying goes "what we don't know will make a whole new world."

                  1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                    Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Humans that suppress sex extremely also often enough express themselves unnaturally

                    1. 72
                      Robertr04posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      What do you mean by unnaturally? If you are referring to nuns & priests, what's not natural about that? Male, female together, sooner or later something is going to happen. The fact that we are led to believe this graet act of celibacy is taken place is just one more deception.

                    2. gmwilliams profile image85
                      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      This point is quite obvious regarding the abuse of children by Roman Catholic priests and nuns.   Need I say more!

    7. YogaKat profile image91
      YogaKatposted 4 years ago

      I enjoy reading all the comments to this Catholics and egg shell question.  While I know that Satan rules the earth, it is (now - to me) obvious he is behind organized religion as well.  I guess it only makes sense if you read the bible. but on a daily basis it is something you ignore.

    8. backporchstories profile image84
      backporchstoriesposted 4 years ago

      From what I have been learning lately in the Book of Daniel, from out of Rome came the Vatican and from those rulers will walk the Anti-Christ!  That alone is enough to place fear in any Christian's heart!

      1. Jerami profile image78
        Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        When reading the book of Daniel we will see that these earthly kingdoms are without a doubt; Babylon, Persia, Grecia and the Roman Empire.
          Chapter two states that Babylon is the first of four consecutive Kingdoms.
          Chapter 8 identifies the second and third as Persia and Grecia.
          Grecia is described as being divided into four smaller kingdoms, the fourth kingdom will rise up to power from one of these four smaller kingdoms.

            If there is a person described as an antichrist in the book of Daniel;  It was the little horn. (C.7:24)  The fourth kingdom (Roman Empire) will have 10 kings; (Titus who destroyed the temple in 70 AD was the 10th).  Another shall rise  AFTER  him replacing three other kings which are after the first ten kings.   This is talking about the 14th emperor of the Roman Empire.

          Hadrian was the 14th and last emperor to have dominion over the Hebrew Nation. Hadrian scattered the power of the Holy People as described in    Daniel 12:7.   A time times and an half begins at this date in history      138 AD.

      2. 72
        Robertr04posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        There will be many antichrists, not just one (1John2:18-22).

    9. LewSethics profile image60
      LewSethicsposted 4 years ago

      Something to do with all those birds.

    10. Druid Dude profile image61
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago

      Cat claws, cat claws!!! Emile. Some people can't see. Some can see far, some can only see what is right in front of their faces. Some people can't see color, and some live lives in complete darkness. The eye is connected to the brain, and the brain can suffer the same maladies as the eye, yet leave the occular sight intact. You need to determine if there might just be a possibility that your brain needs glasses.smile

      1. 0
        Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Well, if you think there is an entity called Satan moving us around like  puppets,  it might mean you are smoking from the same pipe as claire and aqua...not that I need new glasses.

        1. Claire Evans profile image90
          Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Tell me, what makes you so sure Satan doesn't exist? Are you omniscient? Do you know what happens in other dimensions?

          1. 0
            Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Are you omniscient claire? That's an odd opening you've provided, since we both know you aren't.

            Although I lay no claims of secret knowledge, as you religious do, I do claim to know and accept what happens in this dimension and I don't pretend there is more to it than what there is.

            All of this fantasy you continue to post, all of the over reaching by the church in an attempt to convince us they know more than they do and the ego driven behavior of the self righteous religious pulls our attention away from what little we do know.

            If everyone could stop chasing rainbows and unicorns (or ogres and gargoyles as is your bent) and work together from a starting point of  only what we know to be true; we might, collectively, make progress in our search for knowledge.

            Right now, as it stands, spirituality is not much more than a circus sideshow; if the research behind this thread is any indication.

            1. Castlepaloma profile image23
              Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Ancient spirituality can not exceed knowledge greater than 1%

              Because the 99% unknown spirituality is under endless speculation and imagination until it is manifest into our ego group or ego self. Then it joins our total 1% knowledge of the world and even much less so, than 1,0% knowledge of the Universe

            2. Claire Evans profile image90
              Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Having a relationship with the Holy Spirit means you don't have to be omniscient.  That's the gift.  Jesus has bridged the gap between us and God.

              1. 0
                Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                So, thats a yes.

              2. 0
                Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                lol So, what are you saying Claire? You channel God? You've got all of the benefits of omniscience because you are somehow tethered with a mystical cord? That would be cute, if you weren't obviously serious.

                1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                  Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Yahweh knows everything, we humans are stupid, very very stupid

                  If we are very stupid, how do we know enough to know Yahweh knows everything?

                2. Randy Godwin profile image92
                  Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Many believer think THEY are god's messenger.  Funny how they all seem to get different messages!  lol


                                                                 http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

                  1. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Surely the messages shouldn't be in conflict with what Jesus taught?

                    1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                      Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      You have no idea what Jesus taught, Claire!  The closest you've ever gotten to Jesus is simply hearsay from those dead over 2,000 years.  lol  Who are you trying to kid?  lol


                                                           http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

                3. Claire Evans profile image90
                  Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  If you mean by benefiting from God who has omniscience, then yes.  Am I omniscience? Absolutely not, thank God.  God will only allow us to know what we need to know.

                  1. 0
                    Emile Rposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Interesting. I know you are off base with this whole thread.  Why do you think God thinks I need to know that?

                    1. Castlepaloma profile image23
                      Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      Always on a need to know bases from God, starting from the Pope down

    11. Druid Dude profile image61
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago

      The proof is everywhere if you had the eyes to see it. The proof is in physics, both universal and human. The problem is is that someone has sold you a VW, told you it was a Jag, and YOU believe it.

    12. Johnathan L Groom profile image60
      Johnathan L Groomposted 4 years ago

      They do?

    13. Druid Dude profile image61
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago

      I don't. They are, and always has been non-compliant with the original teachings of Jesus. But, the Protestants aren't much better.

      1. MrMaranatha profile image86
        MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Depends on what sort of "Protestants" you are talking about... Some are more the Daughters of Catholacism than others... Some are pretty near back to the Bibles... and others are just not really Protestant to begin with.. having never been in that mess to start with.

    14. Druid Dude profile image61
      Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago

      If any of them truly understood, then they would close the church doors forever, If they understood, there would be no more religion...but, we're getting close.

      1. MrMaranatha profile image86
        MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        If any truly understood... "What" ?  Sounds like your out there a ways too... oh... hence you sign on of "Druid Dude"... Ok.. never mind.

        1. Druid Dude profile image61
          Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Understood the true teaching of Jesus. Don't let the monicker fool you. It's a trap to disarm you.smile

      2. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Yes, we are closer to the new one world religion, which is Luciferianism!

        1. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          nonsense

          The closest we came to One World Order or Religion was World War two

    15. ALL4JESUS profile image84
      ALL4JESUSposted 4 years ago

      Democracy and love cannot live unless it is given oxygen. We are the oxygen. If we don't contribute, if we don't speak out, we live in fear - we hurt the world - we hurt ourselves.

      God is about love and trust. If man's actions are wrong - they must be exposed. We cannot sub come to intimidation - peacefully. Evil will lurk even in what we thought were holy walls. If you find love and kindness, that is where God resides.

      God is too immense for one religion to be perfect because that religion contains man who sadly has sin. Jesus died for our sins.

      1. backporchstories profile image84
        backporchstoriesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Amen, Brother!

    16. look4signs profile image62
      look4signsposted 4 years ago

      They could walk on egg shells to prove to God that they don't like eggs...I think that this needs proving actually.

    17. MrMaranatha profile image86
      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago

      You need to get out of the United States for a little while... take a vacation and go see what your Church is doing in other parts of the world...  Because as soon as you get out of your little local area where they try to look like and act like and talk like Protestants... you will quickly discover that they DO WORSHIP MARY and they DO Flagellum themselves and DO mix in with other beliefs etc...

      I think you need a Vacation... :-)   Good as Excuse as any... Go take one!!!  :-)

      1. 0
        Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Perhaps you need to understand that the teachings of the 'catholic' church are universal.

        And, you might want to trust that a former nun (who has belonged to a community which has international branches - including in Africa) might perhaps know more about Catholicism than either you or the OP.

        Just a thought.

        Now, as to the vacation, that's a damn good suggestion.

        big_smile

    18. MrMaranatha profile image86
      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago

      Im not confused a bit... You do need a vacation...   To Olinda PE Brazil during Carnival...  and take a good  Look around at all your fellow Catholics...  Go to the art exhibits and look at all the "Nice Images on sale everywhere"  and whatever you do... do not Read  your Bible where it says in Exodus 20:  And God spake all these words, saying,
      2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
      3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
      4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
      5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
      6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

      And you probably should not read verse 14 either where it says:  14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

      It would really mess up your Catholic Vacation if you started to accept God's way of looking at all of that Junk.

    19. MrMaranatha profile image86
      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago

      By the way... you said you were a nun... that tells me that at one point in your life you wanted to serve the Lord... and you tried to do so... Great.  My hat comes off to you... But if there was ever any sincerity in that, you should truly read HIS WORD and seek HIS WAY.  You might just discover that some of us have allot more of a relationship with Jesus than you think we do.

      1. 0
        Motown2Chitownposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        No need to be defensive.  I never implied that you did or did not have any sort of relationship with Christ.  I'm sure you do.  No, I did not once wish to serve Him.  I still do, just not as a nun. 

        Are you trying to say that in many places around the world, the Church has perverted herself to follow local customs in ways that are antithetical to Christ?  Sorry, friend, that is both true - and not news to me or anyone else. 

        I simply directed you to the ACTUAL teachings of the Church, which are born straight from the Word. 

        And, I find it interesting to assume that you think I've never been through the Word and know its teachings. 

        Keep preaching what you know, not what you don't.  And try to stay away from speaking so condescendingly.  You make a great number of assumptions about people and steer your conversation from them.  That may not always be wise.

    20. Wesman Todd Shaw profile image95
      Wesman Todd Shawposted 4 years ago

      Hello all, Claire is temporarily banned from the forums, and she asked me to let you all know.

      1. MrMaranatha profile image86
        MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Stepping on too many toes?

        1. Cagsil profile image84
          Cagsilposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Something she might have been construed as a personal attack on someone else, which resulted in her ban.

          1. 0
            Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I did try to warn her a while back. Hate speech is hate speech.

            1. Cagsil profile image84
              Cagsilposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Hate speech is different than a personal attack(insult). wink

              1. 0
                Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Where did she insult?

                1. Cagsil profile image84
                  Cagsilposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  How am I supposed to know that? hmm I didn't report that I can remember. lol

                  1. 0
                    Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Well then how do you know it was an insult?

                    1. Cagsil profile image84
                      Cagsilposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      I don't. I'm guessing. lol I try not to look at things some people say as "hate" because it's so subjective to begin with.

                  2. aguasilver profile image88
                    aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Either way, Claire has a break, and that's fine, when I get banned it's normally a good thing, stops me getting too involved.

                    1. MrMaranatha profile image86
                      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      Deleted

                    2. 0
                      Rad Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      I've seen people get banned for things they should get banned for, but I didn't see anything out of Claire's ordinary. She does admit to using hate speech, but I've never seen her directly insulting or threading someone, besides the "if you don't do as I do you'll burn in hell stuff".

    21. MrMaranatha profile image86
      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago

      Aquasilver:  If the RC CHurch "Through out" as you put it... the ones who have tried to reform it back to what was originally taught.. and that they have done... Not just in the last 400 years, but for the last 1700 years because of Power plays and control of masses and governments etc.
      History bares this out...  If that is the case.. .and it is...  Then since they have always thrown out whatever was done to reform them to the ways of God.. .how can we then percieve that institution as being *98% correct as you put it?  Or for that matter.. how can we even continue to view it as a Christian Church? 
      If we do consider them "Christian" then at best we could look to that mess as being a "Backslid Mess" and as far as the "Body" is concerned.. .While they think of themself as the most beautiful part... the Nose even on the face... they would be better likened unto a festering sore on the backside... where it is hard to reach and difficult to cleanse...  every festering... and never able to accept that the smell of its wound is not really "An exotic Perfume" its wearing.

      98% Correct???  Good grief man.. take your bible down off the shelf and read it.

      1. aguasilver profile image88
        aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I am referring to what their scriptures contain, as compared to ours, I seldom use  a Roman bible, but when I have compared parallel verse, I have not seen substantial differences from my KJV, and they rate better than some of the modern bibles out there.

        The organisation I have no time for, but there are good believers in that body, so to castigate someone for being a Roman Catholic is unwarranted unless you can sit with them and ascertain that they are in error, aware of it, and wish to stay that way.

        I know some Romans who have seen through the crap and accepted where the error is, they stay Romans because God has not told them to move, and they correct where they can.

        1. MrMaranatha profile image86
          MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes I know that there are a great many saved Believers inside the RC yet...  But as for Doctrines... Here is a Book recommendation:

          Understanding Roman Catholicism by Rick Jones  He takes a good look at  37 of the primary Doctrines... If you want to know the truth.. get a copy and read it...  If not.....

          1. aguasilver profile image88
            aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            If it's available on-line, sure, I will read it, getting a hard copy, more difficult, as I live in a Muslim country so bible bookshops are not that well stocked.

            1. MrMaranatha profile image86
              MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              hmmm Here is a link.. (hope it gets through) where you can read it chapter by chapter online.. if the link does not make it through, then go to chick dot com and then click the link in left column marked Books and then the one for Understand RC... Then down at the bottom you will see another link to "Read this book online" and when you click that, it will list the book by chapter links.

              1. MrMaranatha profile image86
                MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this
                1. MrMaranatha profile image86
                  MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Well thats cool.. last time I tried to give someone a link on here it would not go through...  this time it did..

                  Anyway.. its allot of info... I would just print it out a chapter at a time and go through it with a fine tooth comb... Pray about it too.

                  1. aguasilver profile image88
                    aguasilverposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I will, but do you know that Chick has a bad reputation for it's tracts?

                    1. MrMaranatha profile image86
                      MrMaranathaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                      So did Paul the apostle... and most every other Christian of any substance...
                      Eat the meat and spit out the bones...

    22. ylime120 profile image61
      ylime120posted 4 years ago

      Maybe everyone is just tired of hearing others complain or even bring up the Catholic Church? I get that way a lot of the time and I'm not even a practicing Catholic!

    23. webclinician profile image59
      webclinicianposted 4 years ago

      I think it goes with every religion. Make a negative comment about them and you could get negative feedback. It is even taboo and against social norm to talk about religion nowadays.

      1. Castlepaloma profile image23
        Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        webclinician
        It is even taboo and against social norm to talk about religion nowadays.

        It dose seem that way, when you don't agree will some other persons mystic core beliefs system

        1. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          webclinician

          Welcome to Hub pages

      2. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It does but I find it especially the case among Catholics and fundamentalists.  Sometimes Muslims will be on the defensive which is hardly surprising.  They are depicted by the media and world leaders as being the "axis of evil".

        1. Castlepaloma profile image23
          Castlepalomaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The Axis of evil is a religions tool label by the greedy to use to fight for oil and power. It's works on predominated Religious countries where they over obedience and easily brainwashed again and again.

          1. Claire Evans profile image90
            Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Unfortunately, moderate Muslims are treated with disdain because of the jihadists.  However, if you read the Koran you wonder why good Muslims want to be Muslims as the Koran encourages violence to non-believers.

            1. Randy Godwin profile image92
              Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              One might say the same for christians if they read certain parts of the bible.


                                   http://s1.hubimg.com/u/6186572.jpg

              1. Claire Evans profile image90
                Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                In the Old Testament, right, which Jesus came to set right?

                1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                  Randy Godwinposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  And where the the prophets predicted the Messiah would be a great military leader too!  This is why the Jews do not accept Jesus as the Messiah, because he did not fit the prophecies.  There have been many false Messiahs over the centuries, with Jesus just being one of them. 

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                  1. Jerami profile image78
                    Jeramiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    This was "Their" interpretation that the Messiah would be so.

                  2. Claire Evans profile image90
                    Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    A great military leader? Can you point to that verse? Not all the prophecies did not apply to Jesus.  He was pierced for our iniquities and born of a virgin. 

                    Interestingly enough, the Muslims believe that a prophet will be a great military leader to promote Islam around the world.  Jihadists like to behead people and that is the fate of those who don't worship the Anti-Christ.

    24. Jerami profile image78
      Jeramiposted 4 years ago

      Castlepaloma wrote:
      The Axis of evil is a religions tool label by the greedy to use to fight for oil and power. It's works on predominated Religious countries where they over obedience and easily brainwashed again and again.

      Claire Evans wrote
      Unfortunately, moderate Muslims are treated with disdain because of the jihadists.  However, if you read the Koran you wonder why good Muslims want to be Muslims as the Koran encourages violence to non-believers.

        Randy Godwin wrote
      One might say the same for christians if they read certain parts of the bible.

      =====================================

      ME
         I think all three of you may be correct?

      - -
      Claire Evans wrote
      In the Old Testament, right, which Jesus came to set right?

      - = - =

      me
        I think he did make it right up to that point in time ... AND THEN ???

    25. 60
      augustine72posted 4 years ago

      I do not know if this forum is still live.  Still I would like make this post to appreciate Claire. There were so many people against you but you stood for the truth. I pledge my support if this forum continues.

      1. Claire Evans profile image90
        Claire Evansposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks so much!  I appreciate it.

    26. word55 profile image82
      word55posted 2 years ago

      I'll point out one thing, the Catholic Church had the gumption to change God's 7th day sabbath from Saturday to Sunday (the 1st-day of the week). Read Revelation 22: 19.

      1. 0
        Motown2Chitownposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        The Catholic Church doesn't keep the sabbath.  That is a Jewish directive and tradition.  We commemorate the Lord's Day-on the first day of the week, as commemorated by the first Christians.  See Acts and the many New Testament epistles.

        1. 59
          Joquin98posted 2 years ago in reply to this

          That's kind of weird. Doesn't that break the 4th commandment?

          1. 0
            Motown2Chitownposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            The 4th commandment to set aside a day of rest devoted to The Lord?  I don't think it does, but I guess that would be a question you'd want to ask the earliest Christians since the change was made then, and not by any current church in modern times.

            I'd say it's far more of a concern for his followers when we do it and what we call it than it is for him.  He wants a day of rest and a day devoted to him.

     
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