Americans Hold Atavistic Beliefs About The Origin of The Universe

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   Sooner28posted 11 years ago

   http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/0 … 71127.html
   
   46% still believe in pure creationism.  Are some people beyond hope?  Are their minds so closed to scientific discoveries that it doesn't matter how much education they receive?

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   UnnamedHaraldposted 11 years ago

   Please... the idea that 46% of Americans believe in Creationism is too depressing to comment on.
   
   On the other hand, I know (I almost said "think", but "knowing" is a lot easier than "thinking") there is a conspiracy involving NASA and our government. How many years have we been "orbiting" the world and NOT ONCE have we seen the GREAT TURTLE the Earth rests on!!!

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   chefsrefposted 11 years ago

   I notice an inverse relationship between education and belief in creationism. Unfortunately these same uneducated people are easily manipulated.
   Climate change deniers, Obama Birthers, polluters, have a natural constituency in people that put irrational faith before science and reason.
   
   I would like to see a conversation about how do we reason with  people who espouse beliefs that contradict empirical facts.
   In my experience that is like trying to talk someone out of their religion. How do we change the mind of someone who has faith rather than facts?

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      Sally's Troveposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Obama birthers? Please explain.

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         chefsrefposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         People that believe Obama was born in Kenya in spite of his birth certificate

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            Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The mentally deranged, the vacuous, and the theocratic.

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      livelongerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Maybe by making them more secure. Anti-science fundamentalism is a modern invention among those who think science jeopardizes their belief system. It's a form of insecurity.
      
      Since there are many more religious people who don't feel that way, maybe they can best communicate why evolution, the big bang theory, etc. don't necessarily invalidate their faith.

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         Shanna11posted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I believe in both, in a manner of speaking. We don't know how God created everything, just that the Bible says he did. Going off of this belief system, then God created everything, so he would have created science and all its principles. I think the Big Bang is a plausible explanation for the way he created the universe. We don't know how long a "day" was for God--- we really don't know a lot of things!
         
         And clearly, I believe in evolution and in the fact that things evolve-- the flu vaccine is the most ready example. Every year I get a new vaccine-- why? Because the virus evolves and changes. Bam-- evolution exists, right there.
         
         I'll be the first to admit that I don't understand and probably will never know for certain in this lifetime how the universe was created, so I'm open to theories and ideas, and for me the Big Bang and creationism don't invalidate each other, but maybe that's just me.
         
         I go to a private Christian college, and the first thing we did in my microbiology class was talk about the Big Bang and discuss how long it took for protons and particles to form afterwards, etc. My teacher gave a great mini-lecture on why he felt that the Big Bang and creationism can coexist together. I'm definitely not as eloquent as he was.

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            livelongerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            I agree that if there is a God and he's behind everything, why wouldn't the laws of nature, and our ability to observe and interpret natural phenomena (science), be part of that creation? I think it's only among those who are insecure about what they don't understand that lash out and condemn it all.
            
            I think "creationism," though, specifically refers to a literal understanding of the Biblical story of creation: 7 calendar days, the order of creation (water appearing before the sun and moon, etc), 6000 years as the age of the universe, man and dinosaurs coexisting, etc. I don't think you can support that version of creationism and evolutionary theory at the same time.

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               Shanna11posted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Ah, I guess I don't believe in "creationism" then. I don't take that part of the bible to be that literal, and it just makes sense to me that God would have followed the laws of nature.... plus, whatever method of dating they use for rocks and such clearly prove the earth is older than 6000 years. Maybe humans have been on it for that amount of time or something like that, but the earth is definitely much older.
               
               I remember being in Sunday school as a little kid and asking where the dinosaurs fit in to the whole biblical story. It always struck me as odd that no one could explain that....

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                  livelongerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Yes, and plenty of religious Christians of various flavors see it the same way you do. It doesn't necessarily have to be an ultimatum between science and religion.
                  
                  As for the nature of cosmogony, or the origin of existence, I think we are all agnostic.

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            Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The issue isn't really with people like you.  Theistic evolution isn't what's alarming.  It's the people who say God created every species in it's present form that are irksome.

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   Sally's Troveposted 11 years ago

   Huffpost isn't one of the world's most reliable sources of truth, but, even the idea of 46% believing in creationism is pretty scary.

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      Cagsilposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      +1

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      Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

      They cited the Gallup poll and linked to it..........

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      Uninvited Writerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I've seen it mentioned in several places. According to Wikipedia it's the same, with sources, and it also notes that only 22% of Canadians and British believe in creationism. The US is second only behind Turkey in the Western world in believing solely in creationism.

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         livelongerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Don't forget that, by keeping the death penalty, we're also in similar company: Saudi Arabia, Iran, North Korea, China, etc...

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   peoplepower73posted 11 years ago

   They believe the earth was created 3,000 years ago, but yet they drive around in cars that are powered by fossil fuels created from dinosaurs million of years ago. Ya just can't have both ways!

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      Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

      You can have it both ways if you don't care about intellectual honesty :p.

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         Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Wait. That's two separate things they don't care about.

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   Sally's Troveposted 11 years ago

   Obama birthers?

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      Cody Hodgeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      There is a group in America who believes that Obama was born in Kenya. They are known as "birthers." Most of them are conservatives.

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         Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         most of them are dinosaurs.
         

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            Cagsilposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            

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         Sally's Troveposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Thanks. Geeze, how stupid is that? I mean, the whole concept is mind-boggling.

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   Mighty Momposted 11 years ago

   
   
   
   You don't know what you're talking about, boy.
   God talks directly to ME.

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      Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

      That's an awesome hat!

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         Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Thank you.
         God made it.
         

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            Sooner28posted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The grand design gives it away

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               Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               We have a special name for it.
               We call it Unintelligent Design.

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   Thomas Swanposted 11 years ago

   If we can describe why people become religious then we could make the faithful realise that they came to a belief in God through natural means. For example when people have an illness, a NDE, or suffer the loss of a loved one, they often turn to religion. Anxiety seems to make it easier to become religious. Unfortunately, many religionists would claim that God put them in that horrible situation to help them become religious. I don't think there's any way to remove faith from someone. We just have to be patient and wait for it to die out. In Europe, at least, the trend is going in the right direction.

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      Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      The old "there are no atheists in foxholes" argument.
      Very true that people turn to God to make sense of tragedies that will never make sense.
      
      Still, there are many people, including Christians, who do not find faith in God incompatible with scientific evidence, but rather a confirmation of same.
      Who understand the Bible is allegorical, not literal.
      
      Hmmm. Maybe we should do our own poll here on HP and see if 46% of hubbers believe in creationism.
      

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   peoplepower73posted 11 years ago

   Our closest star is Alpha Centauri.  It's 4.35 light years away.  The speed of light is 186,000 miles per second. One light year is how far that light travels in a year. I'm not even going to calculate it.  But if you mulitply that times 4.35 years, that's how old the light is that we see from that star.  There are stars that are millions of light years away from us.  That means the light that we see from those stars is million and million of years old.  So how can the universe be created just thousands of years ago?  I sound like Carl Sagan!

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      jacharlessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      The only error in that calculation is this: that calculation is of human origin, as is creationism, as is evolution, as is deism and every other form of science {the original Theos}. A substantial affirmation and change of "thinking" can only come from a supported -evidentiary- source, other than humans, to back up these age old claims.
      
      If most truly believe we are not alone in the universe, then we need to stop with the absolution and those other life forms out there need to man-up and say howdy.
      James

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         peoplepower73posted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Here is a question to contemplate:  If man didn't exists, would God?

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            jacharlessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Well, the term god is erroneous to begin with, which is for an entirely different thread.
            
            But even looking at the Judaic approach and the Evolutionary approach both highly suggest this universe is nothing less than a mere breath from Creators own mouth. One says flow, the other bang!
            
            Socially, according to human history, by writing or otherwise, deems 98% of the population since humanity existed has believed in something that made this beautiful scape we call universe. Still, looking at millions of things that form planetary nature seems in line, yet not concerned.
            
            Man's position and purpose, in this event, seems to be the greater quest and question. Was man designed by either Nature or Creator? Where did he come from, what did he come from and why did he come from?
            
            As a friend of mine says, who does not know a single verse of any religious text, nor who Mr Dawkins is, and barely recalls who Galilei was, "There's gotta be something, right?!" And I can't argue that, given the things I have witnessed as a member of society through other human ideas, texts, observances and that of my own. Staring through and viewing the movement of sub-atomic particles ... Well, let's just say, "there's gotta be something to that."
            
            If nature is chaos or random, than nature has doomed itself by its very appearance/existence.
            
            James

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    Will Apseposted 11 years ago

    These beliefs are a classic illustration of the dangers of popularism.
    
    Most US churches are small. The leadership is poorly educated. They tend to ignore most of theology and imagine that they have some unique insight into the meaning of the Bible (inevitably delusional).
    
    The congregations are parochial, frightened of the outside world, frightened of change, desperate for certainty (usually at the cost any serious critical thinking).
    
    Given that most of the great advances in Christian thought since the Gospels were written never made it West, you cannot expect much more than these polls generally show.
    
    An interesting article from an Anglican on the official C of E website: http://www.churchofengland.org/our-view … brown.aspx
    
    Pope Benedict XVI on Creationism v Evolution:
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19956961/ns … 89-mbBYsdw
    
    Grownup churches hold grownup views.

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       Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

       You said the magic words there, Will Apse.
       Poorly educated.
       The results of this poll are an indictment of America's education system.
       
       And we wonder why the country is slipping (quickly) into third world status.
       We are dumbing down and clinging to our guns and religion.
       
       I fear the next poll will find 46% of Americans believe the world is flat.
       
       

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          Paul Wingertposted 11 years agoin reply to this

          The Flat Earth Society (about 3000 strong) does exist in Briton and here in the US.

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             Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

             Are they related to the Birthers, by chance?

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                Paul Wingertposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                Wouldn't be surprised. Maybe they don't believe the existence of gravity either. I bet these kind of people get taken advantage of and get ripped off alot.

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          Disturbiaposted 11 years agoin reply to this

          You mean the Earth isn't flat?

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