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"Sin Bin" for Banned Hub Pages members

  1. Eric Graudins profile image60
    Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

    Hi,

    I haven't been active on Hub Pages for a while, but have made a lot of friends here.
    Hi to everyone who knows me - and also to those who don't.

    I've recently become aware that quite a few of the more intelligent and helpful members of the community have been banned for what I understand to be petty recrimination for posts that they have made on various forums.

    So I just set up a facebook group where banned HP members can go to keep in touch with each other while you wait out your suspension in the HP "Sin Bin"

    So far there's Mark K. and Ernest  in there, and they want some of their friends to join them.
    So if you want to keep in touch with the peopl who are temporarily not allowed to post here, please apply to join this private group.

    http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=gro … 3&ap=1

    regards,
    Eric G.

    (Pastafarians very welcome)

    1. 0
      Audreveaposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Ernest got banned? When did that happen?

      Mark gave a lot back to HP - very sad to see him banished. Hopefully it's a temporary thing?

      1. BobbiRant profile image60
        BobbiRantposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Kind of makes me want to not come to the forums anymore.  Yikes!  Banned for comments in forums?  OK Backing out of here now.

        1. Evan Hutchinson profile image81
          Evan Hutchinsonposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Someone who makes money on hubpages should look at it as a being similar to a business or a place of work. I make money here, and I make money at work, and at my job I wouldn't go participating in religious or philosophical arguments, or anything that could ultimately prove detrimental to my relationship with either my supervisors or my work as a whole. So I have learned to treat Hubpages the same way and to keep it professional and disciplined.

          1. bulalo profile image75
            bulaloposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Exactly.

            To be on the safe side. I stay away from forums of income-generating sites like HP entirely.

            IRL, I seldom go to office parties unless it is mandatory. Then I just walk around a few times to ensure that the boss has seen me and leave to have some fun time with my friends.

          2. Abbasangel profile image80
            Abbasangelposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I have had these exact same thoughts, and whilst I am new, alot of things that I have wanted to write, I have taken panstaking time over to ensure that I am not offensive to anyone as you say this is a proffessional place.

      2. NightEmpress profile image60
        NightEmpressposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        There are a lot of hubbers I've seen using baits to ban other members, among your 'friends' on that FB. So no thanks, I'll pass!
        It seems you don't really know what was going on around here. Or maybe you do ? I wonder...

      3. 61
        nbbatt.composted 6 years ago in reply to this

        My id is not banned but I can't joint forum for several days, I don't know why, I got the message when replying the topic on forum. Bad Experience.

    2. Susana S profile image91
      Susana Sposted 6 years ago

      Good Idea Eric - I'm missing Mark and Earnest around the forums!

    3. Eric Graudins profile image60
      Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

      Hi Susana,
      Welcome to the group.

    4. skyfire profile image71
      skyfireposted 6 years ago

      is that permaban ?  sad 

      or temporary ?

    5. 0
      china manposted 6 years ago

      alternate poet is on permanent ban - but cannot access Facebook from China sad  Luckily, he is me so not so bad, although I hanker after the other guys sometimes.

      1. Pcunix profile image88
        Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        "luckily he is me" ?

        Do you mean that is one of your alternate Ida?  I would have expected that banning one would affect all.

        I think I have had two three day and one seven day ban.  I understood two of those but did not agree with the other, so now I feel like I have to walk on eggshells.

        The "You have been banned for comments you made in this thread" can be  vague - which comment? 

        I have mixed feelings about all of this.  I understand the motives but am not sure it really accomplishes anything.  Banning spammers, yes, but insults seems pointless to me.

        1. 0
          china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Banning one would affect all - HP police were very kind and pointed out that it was against the rules to have two and asked which one I would like to keep.   That I have two is a completely open secret - I state this in my profile even - but it took a slimy 'grassing up' complaint to prompt any action - christians losing arguments often revert to type I notice, and the ganging up to 'report' is also a normal trick.

          1. Pcunix profile image88
            Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Many of them operate under "the ends justify the means" mentality. That disgusts me, but they are what they are.

      2. 0
        Baileybearposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        did you use both your alter egos in the same forum?  Accidently or deliberately?

      3. Anesidora profile image81
        Anesidoraposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Wasn't alternate poet started when you as china man got banned? LOL Ironic.

        I've never been banned, but I am a pastafarian! Can I still join? (I think I can arrange a ban if necessary.) wink

        1. Eric Graudins profile image60
          Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Sure. Sending you a message.

          regards,
          Eric G.

        2. 0
          china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          AP was already in the making as a place where I could put just poetry - then the first ban arrived for telling somebody they were 'in bed' with someone else - and their deliberate misinterpretation and screaming about how they were a married woman big_smile     religious of course.

          And them damn Ozzie's deserve banning just for the outrageous words they use that nobody understands - just in case they are talking about us big_smile

    6. Cleanclover profile image58
      Cleancloverposted 6 years ago

      why are some banned temporarily while some are banned for life?

      1. 0
        ralwusposted 6 years ago

        That's a grand idea Eric. Put my request in as I may need it someday myself. My sin has been forgiven, I think. big_smile

      2. 0
        ralwusposted 6 years ago

        Mark told me it was for a month for calling someone a monkey. LOL

        1. Pcunix profile image88
          Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          In the context of a thread about evolution, that may have even been quite appropriate.

          I think that might be too much. Devoid of context, maybe.  In context, I don't see the harm.

        2. rebekahELLE profile image91
          rebekahELLEposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          lol..

          people need to learn not to take things personally. it's an online forum. I can understand some of the hate/racist comments, but a monkey?? I wondered where Mark was.

          1. 0
            Baileybearposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            it's tempting to call some individuals Neanderthals

        3. 61
          C.J. Wrightposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          LMAO! He definitely needs a Cape.

      3. Uninvited Writer profile image84
        Uninvited Writerposted 6 years ago

        And I've seen much worse insults go unpunished. I guess it depends how whiney the person who reported it is... Some people treat every disagreement as a personal insult.

        1. Eric Graudins profile image60
          Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I would have thought that HP staff would have a bit more maturity as to deciding whether to ban people or not.

          Or is there a quota system or something, where "3 complaints = 2 weeks ban.
          6 complaints = 4 weeks ban".

          If HP are operating with this sort of system, then it would be very easy for people to club together and get somebody banned.

          regards,
          Eric G.

      4. 0
        ralwusposted 6 years ago

        So true UW, and his remark was, like mine, so innocuous. I think his ban was to the extreme for it myself.

      5. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        Hi,

        I don't know whether bans are temporary or permanent.
        I don't know why the bans have taken place.
        I'm not interested in the politics of it.
        That's one of the reasons why I have made myself scarce from HP for quite a while.

        What I DO know  is that good people are being banned by HP, and not permitted to take part in the forums.

        So I set this up as somewhere that they can keep communicating with others who are interested, during the time that they are not permitted to post here.

        @Ralwus: I can't put a request in.
        You will have to go to the link in my first post, and request membership to the Facebook group.
        One of the group admins will then approve the request.
        (There's a few people now who have joined)

        And yes, you'll need a facebook account and use it to join the group.

        cheers,
        Eric G.

        1. 0
          ralwusposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          LOL Eric, I should have rephrased that. I meant I put in my request upon seeing this. done. big_smile

      6. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        Quite a few new members now!
        All have been approved so far :-)
        Nice group  shaping up there!

        Wonder if I'll be banned  for starting this thread ?

        regards,
        Eric G.

        1. ceciliabeltran profile image86
          ceciliabeltranposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          went there  out of curiosity was surprised earnest was banned.

        2. Maddie Ruud profile image82
          Maddie Ruudposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Looks like you're quite happy with "banning" as long as you're the one in charge of it. wink

          For the record, HubPages used to have a much more lenient rules in the forums.  It was in response to complaints about nastiness/personal attacks being allowed to stand that we changed our policy.  We strive to apply the policy without preferential treatment for one group or another.  If you see something which escapes our attention, please flag it.  There are simply too many posts per day for us to read each one.

          1. Randy Godwin profile image94
            Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            If the moderator(s) were a bit clearer on some of the bannings, it would probably help more than anything!  But I am sorry, some of the bans are utterly confusing as to why the particular post caused a ban.

            You make it sound as if is the luck of the draw on the forums whether one gets banned or not!  Not very encouraging at all!  Let the "E"s help out if you need more moderators.  Surely someone in the HP hierarchy can come up with a better system than this one!

            1. Maddie Ruud profile image82
              Maddie Ruudposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              We try to be clear to the person involved should he or she contact us about it, but we do not announce bans or make the reasons for any ban public.

              I don't know what I said that gave you the impression that it's the luck of the draw.  By no means.  But we do count on the community to flag rules violations in the forums, to a certain extent, to bring them to our attention.

              1. Randy Godwin profile image94
                Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Perhaps in some instances the moderators are clear in their notices, in my case they were not.  I was put in a position of having to contact the other banned members to assure them I didn't report them so as to not cause more strife than the actual banning.

                I contacted staff to inform them of my concerns but they apparently didn't have time to respond.

                What you said to make me think it was the luck of the draw was your asking assistance for suspected infractions.  If some were not slipping by (and you may or may not admit some do) then you would not need help.  If one is lucky, he or she might get by  with insults if the moderator isn't reading every thread.

              2. Eric Graudins profile image60
                Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                I'm one of the moderators on a a large internet marketing forum. (No, not Warriors :-) )

                I have recently explained in detail why I have deleted some posts, why I have not deleted posts that on the surface of it appear similar, and why people get banned.

                To me, these explanations clear the air, and give people more certainty about what they can and can't do.

                By not making your reasons public gives fertile ground for all sorts of theories about what is going on behind the moderators cloak.

                regards,
                Eric G.

          2. Eric Graudins profile image60
            Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            This is a common rule for any internet group, forum, etc.

            It's not the rule that is the problem - it's  the application of it. And it would appear that many people believe that it's not being applied consistently at HP.

            As is evident, I don't post here much any more. I have the utmost respect for the difficulty of your task as a HP moderator, and know that it's impossible to please everyone.

            I don't know about the criteria used for bannings, and I'd agree that Mark Knowles and Earnest and a few others can be major pains in the neck if it suits them.

            But anyway, if some positives can come out of this discussion, that would be great.

            regards,
            Eric G.

          3. Arthur Fontes profile image92
            Arthur Fontesposted 6 years ago in reply to this



            Maddie this sounds like a fair policy. 

            Thank you for the effort to provide us with a great place to engage in educated and civil discussions.  smile

            1. 0
              china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              It's ok Arthur - You are always civil and you getting banned is as likely as me winning the lottery !!!!!!  No need for you to to grovel  big_smile

              1. Arthur Fontes profile image92
                Arthur Fontesposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Play your numbers, I have been banned three times!

                The last one was for four weeks.  I do not "grovel" to anyone!

                My bannings was because HP felt that it was appropriate, then it is what it is, I must have been wrong.  It is their forums and I respect their authority!

                1. 0
                  china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Just pulling your virtual leg young Arthur big_smile

                  I have absolutely no respect for authority and this gets me into deep doo doo both in these forums and in life - most of the time, I have a fantastic, slightly dishevelled and always interesting life based on being mildly innapropriate most of the time smile

                  1. qwark profile image61
                    qwarkposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    Hi China Man:
                    Do you live in China?
                    Communism is kinda "authoritative" isn't it?
                    Just asking.
                    I've never been to China. It's the only country on this planet  I'd really like to visit.
                    I've been just about everywhere but China and Russia.
                    Qwark

      7. skyfire profile image71
        skyfireposted 6 years ago

        Eric,

        joining request sent. My Name on FB is Mahesh smile

      8. Ohma profile image79
        Ohmaposted 6 years ago

        Though I have never been banned and never hope to be, it seems that many of the most interesting people have to go through this. I sent my request it will be nice to be able to keep in touch with the banned folks.

      9. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        Hi Ohma,
        I don't know you, but you have passed the entrance test.
        Welcome  cool

        regards,
        Eric G.

        1. Ohma profile image79
          Ohmaposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Thanks Eric.
          I think all the fun is taken out of HP when the more outspoken members get banned. At least they are the ones who are willing to talk about what really matters instead of the crappy threads about nonsense.
          I understand the site needs to keep things peaceful but I honestly think that they go to extreme sometimes too.

          1. Pcunix profile image88
            Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I have to agree.  The phrase "redeeming social value" comes to mind, as does the value of satire and humor.

          2. Pcunix profile image88
            Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Maybe one forum should be a free speech zone where anything but spamming and overt racism/ hate speech  is tolerated?  Might be fun to see what happens in such a pen.

            1. mega1 profile image79
              mega1posted 6 years ago in reply to this

              That's the way the HubTribe was - seriously fun  but there has to be a little controversy now and then - we all agreed with each other so much that it sorta turned into a "hi, howareya" place and got boring.  But if people want to shock each other, and call each other names, good grief, why?

      10. Jonathan Janco profile image81
        Jonathan Jancoposted 6 years ago

        Maybe there are certain trigger words or phrases one can use that gets them banned. b/c I've made very harsh, sweeping indictments on the deeply held beliefs of many and have never been banned to my knowledge.

      11. donotfear profile image91
        donotfearposted 6 years ago

        When the insults go out and are personalized directly at someone by using the pronoun "you", that's when it goes over the line.

        The following example is NOT from a forum, it's just what I consider 'over the line'.

        Example: "Your idiotic belief in some superhuman entity is as underdeveloped as the ape you came from; which makes you that: a monkey in human skin, or perhaps maybe not that smart".

        Here is an example of how the above statement could have been worded as to not be so offensive:

        Example: "I believe your belief in a superhuman entity to be ridiculous. We came from apes & if you don't believe it, that's your business, but the facts speak for themselves. Go read your textbooks".

        I do not hold these beliefs above. I'm merely trying to point out how a supposedly intelligent discussion/debate can be worded in a way as to not offend the sensitivities of others & can still make the point.  If those who made statements like these would apply their gifts of communication in a less offensive manner, it would prevent those who have been offended to take such a defensive stance as to actually have to report the one who made the statement.

        1. 0
          china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          This is a good way to deal with one aspect of htis issue.  The bigger problem is that some people 'report' as a form of attack - usually on losing an argument.

          I was banned for telling someone that they were 'in bed' with another - they were 'vocally' incenced but clearly knew what the common phrase means and infers -I got a 3 day ban.

          1. Pcunix profile image88
            Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Yeah, that is just ridiculous. HP ought to have more sense than that.

            1. 0
              china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I don't think it is an issue of sense - more of how many people hit the report button and how much time the mod has to read and understand.

              1. ceciliabeltran profile image86
                ceciliabeltranposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                they probably just do a kind of tally.

              2. Marisa Wright profile image93
                Marisa Wrightposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                I think that's it in a nutshell.  The HubPages team is small and it's understandable if sometimes, they make decisions on the run - especially on the Forums, which (let's remember) are only an adjunct to HubPages, not its main purpose.

                The big problem with that is that the moderators don't take the time to read back in the thread, to find out why the personal attack happened. Often they've been baited into an outburst, yet the person who did the baiting gets off scot-free. 

                Maybe the moderators do read back in the thread, but the baiter managed to word their goading in such a way that it didn't actually break any rules - but to allow them to get away with that is wrong, IMO.  Because that's when we get people saying that certain people are immune, or others are being picked on.

                From what I've seen, the HubPages team do seem to be applying the "no personal attacks" rule very strictly - just saying "you're stupid" to someone is enough to trigger it.  Donotfear hit the nail on the head - you can call someone's idea or story stupid, but you can't use that word "you".

            2. Eric Graudins profile image60
              Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I've found that as organisations grow, common sense gradually gets replaced by systems and rules.

              cheers,
              Eric G.

              1. Haunty profile image84
                Hauntyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Cowardice always leads to downfall.

      12. Dame Scribe profile image60
        Dame Scribeposted 6 years ago

        We have a 'online Gang' of malcontents? yikes I is afeared now. So many forked tongues that can incite, use and weave confusion into others for the purpose of banning the rational minded. What does that say? where are we going? hmm such good people getting banned from others havin a temper tantrum? geeez. tongue its good that you have a site for them. Great idea! smile

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I suppose the "forked tongue" bit was for my benefit eh, DS?  Malcontents?  Rational minded?  Incite, weave confusion, temper tantrum? 

          This could actually be considered a personal attack!  Oh, I see, you want to get banned so you can join the group!  LOL!

      13. mega1 profile image79
        mega1posted 6 years ago

        I just opted out of the SinBin - Proudly Banned Facebook group because (a) facebook kept sending me emails everytime anyone did anything even though I had turned of the email from Proudly Banned and (b) the stuff being said was boring and just not even interesting and mainly one on one conversations between people - I don't need to go there to be ignored, I can be ignored here! where I'm used to it!  So if anyone is wondering - that's why - its a silly group anyway full of people who are just hanging around watching.

        1. ediggity profile image61
          ediggityposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Did you say something?big_smile

        2. Eric Graudins profile image60
          Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          (a) I've turned off the notifications, and don't receive those messages. Is it at all possible you may have not done it properly?

          (b) Yes, it's conversations between people who are not able to talk to each other on HP.
          Exactly what was advertised  on the box.

          What is it that you were expecting?

          I see that you have made almost 10,000 posts in 14 months.
          That's an average of about 25 per day. I'm sure that they were all very interesting, rivetting,, and entertaining to those who read them.

          I wrote a forum thread on my theory of empty vessels some time ago. Maybe you should look it up sometime and let us know your thoughts.

          regards,
          Eric G.

      14. Dame Scribe profile image60
        Dame Scribeposted 6 years ago

        Hey Randy smile I surf the forums and see stuff that is said but do refrain from saying anything. I could easily take offence and sometimes do feel that but then I figure adhd or some other disorder comes to mind tongue lol so I just ignore them wink you know that quote - Don't try to fight with a idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. tongue wink big_smile no offence intended, btw. I think you do well, Maddie smile but is good keep in mind also - we can get easily manipulated by others. hmm

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          No problem, DS!  No one is forced to enter the forums, nor to read them for that matter.  I do believe in being as polite as the other fellow...er snake, but some are too sensitive and get angry.

          1. Dame Scribe profile image60
            Dame Scribeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I think anyone that takes regular glee and practice in successfully banning their fellow members is the problem and should be questioned. Just mho tongue

            1. Randy Godwin profile image94
              Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I agree DS!  But we have no way of knowing who does what!

      15. Dame Scribe profile image60
        Dame Scribeposted 6 years ago

        Well, least the Sin Bin will allow the banished to compare notes. big_smile could easily learn about the psyches involved tongue better if copies of the complaint is made available to the banished too. hmm least be given opportunity for a fair hearing? tongue lol

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Now you've got it!  Now we can get the particulars of the ban and decide for ourselves if it was merited.  Yes, I know it makes no difference to HP, as we have no power to appeal the ban, but at least you get input from others concerning the cause.


          Now do I look like your everyday, run of the mill, malcontent?

      16. mega1 profile image79
        mega1posted 6 years ago

        Once I was banned - when I asked the staff to tell me why, they referred me to the actual post in the forums and what I said that was offensive and a personal attack - it involved the word "stupid"  that was ok with me and I was happy to have the answer, but didn't really care whether anyone else knew what was said or where, and no one really cared about it either.  They were surprised I'd fallen into a bait and push trap, but I had.  Aren't most forums like this?  If someone gets banned it isn't really anyone else's business is it?  It's obvious to me, now that I've been here a little longer who the baiters are and where they hang out and so I just stay out of their way.  You want those baiters to be banned?  But then, that would mean more rules, wouldn't it?  and also, what is bait for one isn't for others - how would you word this new rule against baiting?  I just don't see how it could be done.  It doesn't do a lot of good for the banned to go rehash it with each other, does it?  Will they establish a blacklist against some "bad" hubbers or something?  How does that work?

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Top secret!  You are not allowed to ask!  You have been banned from the facebook group because you are suspected of being a mole!
          A mega-mole, as a matter of fact! 


                                             


           






          (not serious)

          1. Eric Graudins profile image60
            Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            No, nothing as exciting as that.
            She just had a look around, decided it wasn't for her, and decided to leave. (as has been discussed earlier in this thread)

            regards,
            Eric G.

            1. Randy Godwin profile image94
              Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Come on Eric, there's always a mole!  Or a snake!  LOL!

              1. Eric Graudins profile image60
                Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                I believe we already have our snake cool

                @bobbirant:
                Oh yeah! Forums can be dangerous  places!

                regards,
                Eric G.

          2. mega1 profile image79
            mega1posted 6 years ago in reply to this

            of course I'm not a mole or spy or anything - if so I would have stayed on the facebook page and acted all interested!  but actually I wouldn't do that because it would take time away from my "empty vessel" posting in the HubPages forums, which is obviously where I belong - hey, haven't gotten in my 25 posts today!  I must be slipping!  lol

            1. Randy Godwin profile image94
              Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Check your shoe!

      17. 0
        china manposted 6 years ago

        Maybe this is relevant to the topic - after posting a few times to balance the vitriolic attack of two hubbers on paarsurrey in this thread

        http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/55098?p … ost1290040

        which consists of a torrent of rage and abuse and ranting personal attacks on paar - I got this reply from Libby101

        Whatever you say China man! Apparently you like following me around and posting to my comments? Isn't this against the rules to follow someone and harrass them? Hmmm???

        I do recall posting a few replies - but less than is my 'norm in resposnse to themore ridiculous posts in the religious threads.

        This threat is not new and always from fundie type Christians - so call me a conspiracy theory lover if you like but if it smells like it, tastes like it - then it probably is what you think it is.  Maybe HP should look again at the reasons some of the prominent and valuable members of HP are in the sin-bin at the moment, and all at the same time ???

        1. 0
          Baileybearposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          some people get quite emotional and it shows through - because they take a statement that challenges their belief system as a personal attack

          1. Eric Graudins profile image60
            Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I think that is an automatic human reaction.

            But the only real way to grow as a person is to develop the ability to put that to one side, evaluate new information that may challenge what you believe, try new things, and make changes accordingly.

            regards,
            Eric G.

      18. frogdropping profile image85
        frogdroppingposted 6 years ago

        Well what can I say China man. I have also noted how many people insinuate, use condesending flavors in their replies ... and the usual suspects fall foul.

        TBH - those getting banned should steer clear. You cannot educate carrots. If an individual has a deep seated belief in anything, you're not going to change their world.

        They won't listen or hear your voice. I know to some degree there's an argument for debate in all things. But it's counter productive when a ban follows suit. I would imagine it would please many to see some silenced permantently.

        That then defeats the object.

        I still don't see how HP admin can follow each and every thread to effectively identify cause and effect. It would be difficult to be 100% clear in every case so I understand their current viewpoint. As it stands, it's the best fit.

        Some of the more active debates run into page after page. There'd need to be a lot of scrolling back in order to understand the full picture.

        I do think there's a case for looking at a hubbers overall input. And I'm not talking favoritism, I'm talking about community participation. This is a 'write and publish' site after all.

        Those that publish little or nothing, yet persist in wandering the sub-forums and posting in thread after thread, reply after reply, are not really here to utilize all that HubPages has to offer. Do they provide help and assitance for the hubber community? Do they add to the site's base ethos in any way?

        To that end - there are countless forums out there that are purely for the purpose of posting at will, with no emphasis on anything other than discussion and debate.

        I don't mean the sub forums should be removed, only that those that use them use the rest of the site as it was intended. And this is not about publishing hundreds of hubs, this is about contributing across the board. If all those that successfully publish here, for whatever reason, removed all their content and went elsewhere, it would become a forum only.

        Business would drop, ranking would tank. Not that it's going to happen of course - just ideal world stuff smile

        1. Marisa Wright profile image93
          Marisa Wrightposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          No reason for posting, other than I think the above is the best post in this whole thread,by far.

          1. Eric Graudins profile image60
            Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Yes, our eloquent Frog has provided an excellent  analysis.

          2. 0
            china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Agreed.

            However, is it just my imagination, or are the numbers of evangelical threads increasing along with the number of ads for some god based product ?    This seems to go hand in hand with the number of times lately that I have seen some slimy kristian threatening to 'report' over the most trivial challenge to their nonsense.

      19. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        An Excellent, well thought out discussion. Well done Ms. Frogdropping.

      20. Uninvited Writer profile image84
        Uninvited Writerposted 6 years ago

        Nope, I've already made up my mind about everything and I am always right smile

        Well, actually not. I really am open to hearing reasoned, sane arguments. Unfortunately, they are very few and far between in the religion and politics forums.

      21. The Bard profile image82
        The Bardposted 6 years ago

        Nice to see a Tasmanian devil. (If that's been used earlier then I apologise). I've been banned three times from Squidu forums (I'm innocent guv!Honest!)

        I'm currently banned for life (I think). I've tried to get banned from Hubpages, but they seem more reasonable and understanding than aforementioned. Still, there is still time, and I'm trying hard.

        Just trying to post there from the Philippines is a job. They banned the whole country. And I thought I had problems! Still, I got my pennyworth here somehow.

        Nice post mate...I feel comforted!

      22. 0
        Deborah Sextonposted 6 years ago

        A lot of members, like me, haven't been banned, just find the forums uninteresting

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I'm sure the forums feel the same way about you! LOL!

          1. 0
            Deborah Sextonposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            _______________
            Do you think you will ever grow up?

            1. NightEmpress profile image60
              NightEmpressposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Impossible ! He's still in Prep.

            2. Pcunix profile image88
              Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Let's hope not. Growing up is one of the worst things that you can let happen to yourself. 

              Some say that life is a serious business and that is a reason to grow up. That is a serious mistake in judgment. 

              If you have accidentally grown up, it is said to be possible, though admittedly quite difficult, to grow down. I cannot think of anyone who has ever done that, though. For that reason, I think it is safer never to grow up at all.

              I'll be 63 in February and have avoided this so far. I remain watchful for signs and will take whatever actions are necessary.  I'm pretty sure Randy feels the same way.

              1. Uninvited Writer profile image84
                Uninvited Writerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                That is very deep smile

                1. Pcunix profile image88
                  Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Actually, I'm fairly serious. If you lose your inner child, you have lost something very important.

                  You are never to old to be silly, to giggle, to have wonder.  You are never too old to trust, to skip, to lie down in the grass, to play hooky..

                  Never let go of that child.

                  1. Uninvited Writer profile image84
                    Uninvited Writerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    Definitely agree with that, not losing that inner child does not mean you are childish.

                2. NightEmpress profile image60
                  NightEmpressposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Deep in nonsense

                  1. Pcunix profile image88
                    Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    I think you let yourself grow up.

                    How sad.

              2. NightEmpress profile image60
                NightEmpressposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Not growing up means :
                1- That you don't know how to love another truly
                2- You don't know how to forgive
                3- You don't know what your responsibilities are
                4- You constantly lie
                5- You don't know what living is about
                6- You don't have any conscience of death and what it means.

                1. Randy Godwin profile image94
                  Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Experience always speaks tons!  Thanks!

                2. 0
                  china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  This list is completely a** about face - to be child is to really know how to love truly, forgive totally and unconditionally, to be without responsiblity, and the rest - well I can only guess that you were never a normal child.

                  1. Pcunix profile image88
                    Pcunixposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    People who have killed their inner child want the rest of us to do the same.

                    1. 0
                      china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                      I could not agree more - but usually it is someone who has killed it for them which is even more sad.

                  2. Randy Godwin profile image94
                    Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    As a child at heart, I fully agree with you, CM!

                  3. 0
                    Whikatposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    China Man,
                    I know this sounds odd coming from me, but I completely and 100% agree with you. It seems to me, that it is when someone loses their child like innocence or qualities, that is when things turn to sh**t. Thank you for the comment. I also apologize, because I am the one who misjudged you. I do respect some of your comments in the threads and would love to call a truce. My sincerest apologies for my prejudgment on you.

                    BTW, Twas not me that grassed up AP, I can be overly sensitive, but not brutal.

                    1. 0
                      china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                      Very gracious post - truce accepted.   A little more tolerance and civilization like this in these forums would not go amiss I think.

                      AP never thought it was you, the smug slimy perp already posted to indicate who it was.  -  a kkkristian of course, but then it is only a game big_smile

                      1. 0
                        Whikatposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                        Thank you for accepting my apologies. And I couldn't agree with you more, "A little more tolerance and civilization like this in these forums would not go amiss I think." I do not know what came over me,

                        I normally don't make a  misjudgment on people so quick, do you think the "kkkristian Devil" has come to haunt me? lol Just kidding - Kind of hmm

              3. 0
                Deborah Sextonposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                ____________
                Being grown up and young at heart, are two different things

                1. Randy Godwin profile image94
                  Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  I truly believe one can be both!  In fact, I am sure of it!  But you wouldn't understand!

                2. 0
                  china manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  I would say that Pcunix and the rest of us are talking about the principle of 'seeing with the eyes of a child with the mind of an adult' - I think is close to the quote.

                  1. Randy Godwin profile image94
                    Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    She plays with Tarot cards and numbers as predicting tools!  Very adult pastimes for her, I suppose!

                    1. 0
                      kimberlyslyricsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                      lol

            3. Randy Godwin profile image94
              Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I don't know, I hope not!  What about you?

            4. 0
              kimberlyslyricsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Oh come on Deborah, you set that one up, and as uninteresting as you find these threads you certainly spend way more time here with the types of comments ike this,

              Example I hate sushi, but have been denied ordering 5 times (I know)

              Do I order the sushi and just stare at it telling everyone how much this suchi smells, and kep coming back and back, every evening but never touch the stuff?

              Devborah your much smarter than that, I mean hid not to attack you but do not understand why yoyu find HP so uninteresting but are always pesent?

              Well it was an attempt at a question!

              Cheers

              Kimberly

        2. NightEmpress profile image60
          NightEmpressposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Totally uninterested. That's why I'm seldom here

      23. tritrain profile image74
        tritrainposted 6 years ago

        I don't understand why anyone would feel the need to be rude.

        If someone doesn't like what is said just ignore it.

      24. jondav profile image64
        jondavposted 6 years ago

        Seems to me that a lot of the problems occur from the religion forum. It also seems to be the forum that attracks a LOT of pointless spam.

        Having a religion (or politics) subforum on any website is asking for trouble IMO, and only makes the overall website look like it's frequented by lunatics to the outsider.

        If it were my site i'd delete both subforums immediatley.

        1. earnestshub profile image86
          earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Me to. smile

        2. 0
          Baileybearposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          they're taken over by one group anyway

      25. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        UPDATE:
        Many of the people who have been banned from here for various reasons at various times have found a great new home where they can chew the nice green grass, moo contentedly, and have great conversations.

        In fact some of them like it so much that they have decided that they will rarely visit these forums any more.

        Which is a bit of a shame, because they were some of the most witty, interesting, and entertaining people here.

        cheers,
        Eric G.

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          And thanks to you for giving us such a place where we can express ourselves without fear of being banned for vague, and often unexplained reasons, Eric! 

          Notice how dull the forums are now?

          1. Pearldiver profile image87
            Pearldiverposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Dambbbba... I could have called in to say hi to some of real people last week during my Last Banning for telling a Current Troll to respect women!!  lol  Gotta be the accent Eric and Eric! hmm

            1. Randy Godwin profile image94
              Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              So it's the accent, huh?  Damn Yankees!

      26. Aficionada profile image92
        Aficionadaposted 6 years ago

        I'm thinking that maybe the people who want to discuss religion without "interference" by those who disagree with them could follow your example and set up their own HubPages Religion Discussion Facebook Group - accessible by invitation only.  Maybe that would solve a whole lot of problems.  lol  lol

      27. Eric Graudins profile image60
        Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago

        Seems like lots of banning going on at present for very trivial reasons.

        I understand that someone was even banned for addressing someone else as "sweetie pie".

        What a joke!

        Pretty soon will be nobody interesting left on these forums.

        Or maybe that's the master plan.

        regards,
        Eric G.

        1. Randy Godwin profile image94
          Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          So that's what HUB means-How Utterly Boring!

      28. Cagsil profile image60
        Cagsilposted 6 years ago

        It was asked to bump this thread. So, I have. wink big_smile

        1. 0
          sandra rinckposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Well, you know... if you move too many over to the 'sin bin' it WILL eventually turn out the same way as it has here.

          I am certain that Misha is correct when it comes to forums.  Besides, it's not as much fun talking to people who mostly always agree.  I actually like the diversity of HP but I really don't like bans without a reason. 

          I think that part sucks the most.  You don't get to know why, you don't get to dispute it or at least say your part or why or whatever, you just get banned.  End of story. 

          It's fine though.  I got over it and am really trying to not personally offend anyone though luck would have it, almost everything I say is offensive.  Just ask Randy. lol. big_smile

          1. Randy Godwin profile image94
            Randy Godwinposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Not true, Sandra!  Just some things!  LOL!




                                      Peace!

      29. Shadesbreath profile image89
        Shadesbreathposted 6 years ago

        Hey Cags, go click Like on my new Shadesbreath page.  I finally started one of those damn FB things. Now I can be cool and make millions of dollars like the rest of you more tech-savvy hubbers.  smile

        1. Cagsil profile image60
          Cagsilposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Hey Shades, I click like and posted to your wall. smile I also sent it to about 30 others. smile

          1. Shadesbreath profile image89
            Shadesbreathposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Sweet.  Thanks.  I haven't figured out how to promote it without seeming, well, promotional.  LOL.

            1. Cagsil profile image60
              Cagsilposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              You're welcome. smile I hope you get lots of people. smile

            2. Eric Graudins profile image60
              Eric Graudinsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Go away Shadesbreath.

              How dare you hijack my thread to promote your stupid facebook fan page at http://FaceBook.com/shadesbreath.

              I won't stand for this off topic nonsense!!

      30. Misha profile image74
        Mishaposted 6 years ago

        One man professional place is another man comedy center big_smile

       
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