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Weight Watchers Points, Into The Future.

Updated on September 13, 2016
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I remember being a skinny kid and wishing I could be bigger. Be careful what you wish for! ...

PointsPlus is the new name for the Weight Watchers plan, and it’s a good name. Weight Watchers built a great business on teaching people to watch their food intake by associating point values to all foods and recipe components.

Points Plus is remake of the points formulation that is more nutrition friendly and hopefully will lead to more effective weight maintenance for the millions of Weight Watcher followers.

Weight Watchers released the new plan in the US on November 29, 2010. The US plan is called "PointsPlus", has shown up first in Europe as ProPoints. Weight Watchers International did a good job of keeping this plan under wraps, while they trained their meeting leaders and developed all the new collateral material like: meeting materials, calculators, recipes, cookbooks, and food items.

The year end introduction was perfectly timed to be in place for all of us that routinely think of starting a new diet after the year end holidays.

Weight Watchers Points Plus is fruit friendly...

Weight Watchers points plus is fruit friendly..
Weight Watchers points plus is fruit friendly.. | Source

What's new in the new Weight Watcher Points Plus Plan.

The new PointsPlus Plan is more than a new name. The essence of the new plan is a dramatic change to the points formulation which now rates all foods on the relationship of carbohydrate, protein, fiber and fat content.

Fruit lovers are delighted because fruit is rewarded in the new plan. Pasta and potato lovers are saddened by the negative value assigned those common comfort food items.

Generally speaking, protein and fiber are positively valued, and carbs and fat are more negative in the point calculation.

Calories are eliminated from the points calculation by inclusion of protein

This is not just a formulation change, it is a better nutrition approach to food valuation.

Food quality counts

The new Weight Watchers program places an even greater emphasis on food quality:

  • High nutrient foods are encouraged, while low nutrient foods are discouraged.
  • Point calculation makes us think in terms of protein (more), carbohydrates (less), fiber (more), and fat (less).
  • A good example is that brown rice is less points than white rice.
  • Daily fruit intake is encouraged because fruits are free.

Fruit is free! .... in moderation ...

Great news for fruit lovers - fruit is free. This includes previously pointy fruits like bananas and mangoes.

Great news for those who don't generally eat enough fruit - this new emphasis on fruit can help us try new things and build new habits...

Caution - if you are already eating a lot of fruit, adding a lot more might be counter productive. Eating a large quantity of calorie rich fruits like bananas could backfire. Use common sense here.

What about tomatoes? Are they fruit or vegetable? Doesn't matter, they are free!

Points are up!

A person's allowed daily points are still calculated from a combination of weight, height, sex and age, but the daily allowance is up for all of us. Of course the point cost for foods is also typically up.

This can get confusing for veteran Weight Watchers as they try to change their mind sets and aids such as point charts.

Could this be the weight watchers points plus formula?
Could this be the weight watchers points plus formula? | Source

Points on products

The old good news is that more resturants and food packagers are adding WW point values to their menus and product packaging. That is helpful, and I'm sure leads to added sales.

The new bad news is that all the current menus and grocery store food packages on shelves and in freezer sections are not in sync with the new plan. Certainly WW and the vendors are busily depleting inventory and recalculating the menu and the store published point values.

However WW plan followers will have to be on their guard when making purchases to verify PointsPlus values are displayed. More than one person will eat a 5 point product that really is carrying a higher value.

Weight Watchers 2011 Points Plus Deluxe Member Kit
Weight Watchers 2011 Points Plus Deluxe Member Kit

"Real Living" bonus points

In addition to your personal daily point target number, each plan follower gets an extra bonus allocation called Real Living points. These Real Living points are design to include some real life diet deviations, take away the guilt and feeling of failure for those of us that chafe at diet boundaries and find temptations everywhere.

The 49 "Real Living" bonus points to help people deal with party foods and snack situations that are part of real life.

What kind of weight watcher are you?

See results

WW Online vs. WW Meetings vs. WW on your own

Which is best?

WW became famous with their meeting program. Weekly weighing, motivational thoughts from meeting leaders, and a supportive group help thousands of people to stay on track with their weight loss program.

We have become an online generation. A recent study indicates that online weight loss programs have a higher success rate for losing and keeping weight off.

WW has developed a very popular online program to capture those of us that live in the Internet. Many people prefer the online program. Maybe it's shyness. For some, it's a time issue. Others might not relate to the people at the meetings.

The third alternative, to follow the WW plan on your own, leads the list of alternatives!

What kind of weight watcher are you?

New points = New WW Accessories

The change in points calculation means lots of changes in thinking and the accessories WW products:

  • Point charts and references - all point charts, food point information, recipes need to be re calibrated to the new points values.
  • Smart Phone Apps - take your phone shopping with you, but make sure you upgrade the app first.
  • Points Calculators - send your old points calculator into retirement because you'll need a new Weight Watchers points plus calculator.
  • Books - WW gets to sell a bunch of new books. The recipes may have little or no change, but the resulting point values for food portions is different.
  • Web resources - every weight watcher with an Internet connection learns to surf for weight watchers points plus recipes, restaurants, WW articles to find point values, and WW friendly eating ideas. Now we need to check the dates and titles for new values. Look for PointsPlus to find new calculations.

Is the new program just a marketing gimmick?

Undoubtedly, Weight Watchers International is a for profit business, that needs to concern itself with marketing and profit considerations. We are used to companies repeatedly introducing new products that are barely differentiated in quality but drive new purchases.

Weight Watchers will get some great marketing buzz and sales boost from the new program.

All WW products, and many other vendors products feature the old points system. These inventories will need to be sold off and replaced by products with new packaging for the new points values.

Yet, the new program stands on its own with improved quality and value for those who follow the WW plans. This program fixes some problems with the old plan and adds new value:

The old plan, with its calorie/fiber/fat formulation allowed or encouraged some unhealthy food choices that worked in a diet, but not as well in the body. The old plan created a diet that was difficult to maintain for weight loss for many, and difficult to follow for a lifetime (maintenance).

What is in a name?

Early scuttlebutt on the Internet had the name of the plan as ProPoints. This the name used in some other countries, and is still valid there. In the US it is PointsPlus. Whatever the name, Weight Watchers is attempting to bring the international WW community together under one points formulation.

Early releases of the promo video used the ProPoints title. Some teaser material had the November 28 date.

Like this article? Please rate it up, share it, leave a comment... thank you.
Like this article? Please rate it up, share it, leave a comment... thank you.

Are you a weight watcher?

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    • profile image

      Val1951 5 years ago

      Because I am not very tall, my goal weight is low. I just want to be in the middle of the "box" rather than the high end where gaining 5 lbs will put me into the overweight category. I have lost 30 lbs. and have had 13 lbs. to lose to reach my best weight for the last year on Points Plus, but have not been able to make any progress. I have my 26 points a day and only a small amount of the weekly allowance. We seldom eat out anymore. I probably have 4-6 servings of fruit a day, including one half of a small banana. I exercise at least 5 days a week for 1-2 hours. I have an active job. The Simply Filling is even worse, because they assume we are so disciplined we will not overeat things like brown rice, whole wheat pasta, oatmeal, etc. I didn't get fat because I have self control. I do not think it is possible for someone my size (and and age) to lose that last 10 lbs on this new program. I think they need to modify the plan for smaller people close to their goal weight. If I ate those 49 weekly allowance points plus maybe ate my activity points (they allow you to do both) I would be gaining 3-4 lbs a week. We shouldn't have to tinker with their plan to make it work.

    • profile image

      Mandi 6 years ago

      Well, I have read a bunch of complaining and it kind of hurts my ego since I just started WW point plus for the first time ever. I started 5 days ago and already lost 3 lbs. I'm not using my extra allowance points, just the points they gave me, and I eat the fruit and veggies when I am hungry between meals. If you are gaining are obviously doing it wrong. Too much of anything makes you fat people!! Who in their right mind eats lbs. of fruit anyway? I'm not going to gain weight because I eat an apple and a banana in one day. Ignorant, that is what many of you people are.

    • profile image

      InfoBug 6 years ago

      I have several family members that are on ww and some don't want to change over to the new points system. you know, you get used to a certain way of calculating and you start knowing many of the point values of the foods you often eat by heart. However the old point system is being faded out. They have found an app for the iphone that has both old and new point calculators in it. It is really GREAT! It is the only ww calculator I ever use!! Best thing about it is it is only $0.99. Here is the link.

    • profile image

      Nancy 6 years ago

      I've read about the new points plus system and don't see why I'd change a good thing. The old point system works well for me. I'm losing approx. 2lbs. a week! I know that if I eat in accordance with the new system I won't be successful.

    • profile image

      Daksh Singh 6 years ago

      In Today';s Life Everybody want to look attractive & fit so this is such a useful post for everyone.

      Web development company in jaipur

    • profile image

      Curby 6 years ago

      I wrote to WW to complain because i was disgusted that they were selling off the old products cheaply without warning that they would be obsolete in the next few weeks. I was a big fan of the old points programme but after that I would never go back to WW. I still use the old plan. I never had a reply to my complaint. I dont think WW care about its customers it is about making money. Also many people sign up for the monthly pass (pressure to do this) and end up paying for meetings that they dont go to because the monthly pass comes out 2 weeks before your old one expires.

    • profile image

      JohnsonWIldlife 6 years ago

      I have been a lifetime WW member and on the old points program I lost an average of 1-2 lbs a week. I loved it! When I recently gained a few pounds I joined again and learned the new points plus program. I did not abuse the fruits and veggies - that was a no brainer however, from day one I felt like I was eating a TON of food. Going from 21 points a day plus an extra 30 per week to 29 per day and an extra 45 per week plus free fruits is the worst!!! I work out hard daily, watch every bite I eat and sure enough, I have gained weight in the three weeks since I started points plus! I still have my stuff from the old program and starting my new week tomorrow I am back to my 21 pts and I know I will lose the weight, WW is trying to increase their bottom line while adding to ours! I am so disappointed in them!

    • profile image

      liz 6 years ago

      when I started trying to lose weight recently, I tried a few different diets, then remembered that the best way for me was when I went on weight watchers I got out all my old materials and started keeping track again...then went on line and read about the new plan so I signed up on line for 3 months...after following the new limits for 2 days and gaining weight back, I went back to points...I'm still using the on line meal tracker, but I'm only allowing myself 15 points a day...29 is way too much...I'm also using my old magnetic dry erase food tracker, and don't think I'll be signing up husband is annoyed because I insisted that I had to have the new plan and now I'm not following it...that was $65. wasted...the points plan is the best for me anyway, but I've only got 15 pounds to lose, perhaps if I had 100 to lose it would work...

    • TheMonk profile image

      TheMonk 6 years ago from Brazil

      I was doing WW for over six months. I lost a lot but had to stop. Too much to handle in my life. This article sure made me realize I must go back. Thank you!

    • profile image

      BlueButterfly 6 years ago

      Hi Everyone,

      I have been on Weight Watchers seveal times over the past 30 years.This program so far with the Points Plus is the easiest. If I get hungry between meals I grab a piece of fruit or some vegetable,or aglass of skim milk.I have been on it for 9 weeks and lost 18 pounds,but usually I don't have more than 4 fruits a day usually it is about 3.I do think you need to use a little common sense.I have no cmplaints with the points plus program I think it is the healthiess one they have had. I am very seldom hungry.

    • profile image

      Karl 6 years ago

      One problem I have with Points Plus is that while they were keeping it under wraps, they kept selling items using the old points.

      My wife and I bought several cook books, a scale, and two pedometers a month before they announced the new system. All our money was wasted, and in addition to replacing these items, we have to buy points plus calculators because the new formula is too complex.

      WW should not have sold us the old points products when they knew they would be obsolete. Of course, they would not have made as much money if they had done that, or let us trade in the obsolete products for the new ones.

    • profile image

      AC 6 years ago

      The points plus program is awesome. I did the old WW program in 2005 and lost over a 100lbs. I kept if off until a year ago. But in the process I was eating a lot of processed and pre-packaged meals. Which is not healthy but I remain in my points allowance and lost. I gain like 40lbs back a year ago due to emotional eating of everyday life. So I decided to go back to WW. I know for a fact if you read your literature that you was given from cover to cover it tells you that everyday you need 2 servings of fruit, 3servings of vegetables, 2 teaspoons of healthy oils, whole grains, and 2 serving of non-fat or low fat dairy, 2 to 6 oz of proteins, 6 or more glasses of liquids (water) and a multivitamin. That are the things that need to be in your daily points. That is what I eat everyday since I started. What can be more healthy than that and lose weight along with exercise. And if you want to eat your weekly of 49 use power foods not icecream, cookies, chips. Not saying you have to totally give up these things but if you eat them for weekly points do a serving and stop at a serving so you wont feel deprived. Dont eat the entire 49 in junk food. We all need a healthy lifestyle. Yes it feels good to see the numbers go down quickly on the scale but if you are not eating properly what good is it because the numbers will go back up again and your health is going down. By the way I started the points point May 2 and June 10 I am downing 15 lbs. Points Plus only works if you have made up your mind I want a healthier lifestyle.

    • profile image

      Juney 6 years ago

      Those people who are not losing weight CANNOT be following the plan properly!!!

      If you stick within your points, weigh food and count the points accurately then you will

      Lose the weight!!

      I have lost 2lb every week for the last 7 weeks and my best friend

      has lost nearly 4 stone!!!!

    • profile image

      Terrie 6 years ago

      I too like the old WW program better. Found that I could stay on it better and had better results.

    • profile image

      SuzeeQ 6 years ago

      I've been a dieter all my life and certainly someone who would hoarde my calories/points (what have you) for unhealthy processed foods. I've tried other WW programs, Atkins etc...Long term, none of them cut it.

      This new program is the best, most natural way of eating I've ever experienced. I've lost 20 pounds in 2 months....I am never hungry. A few weeks here and there I gained but when I stuck with it, I would make up for it with a bigger loss another week.

      See, the thing about other weight loss programs is the artificial way they would make some healthy foods "bad"....with each diet, I would come away with one more healthy food struck off my list (and deep down inside, knowing it was wrong and unsustainable). Not all calories are created equal and this is what the new program is trying (successfully, IMO) to address.

      People are less likely to sit down and eat an entire bunch of bannanas or bag of apples the way they would with a bag of chips...and if they did that one day, they are not likely to do it the next (unlike a bag of chips or cookies). Also, the calories in fruit comes packed with other nutrients, unlike the refined carbs that have made all of us fat.

      Of course everything must be done in moderation and no diet plan including this one would promote eating beyond the state of fullness (and this one stresses not to ignore ones hunger or it could trigger a binge)....and that's they way a person is supposed to eat in a healthy way.

      What this plan DOES allow you to do, is not feel guilty if you grab a bannana to curb afternoon hunger. A lot of calorie counters of old (or the old points program) would forgo the bannana in favour of some less nutritious snack.

      Quick weight loss is not the goal here, sustained healthy eating for life is. If one eats healthy foods and cuts down radically on unhealthy foods, they will lose wieght over time...period. Just bedcause they say the fruit is zero points, this does not mean that you can eat a lot to "get away with something"....or push the envelope trying to proove this program can't work.....'cause it does.

      The only thing I would di if I were WW wouyld do to make a special consideration for diabetics....If some people find counting the fruit using the new calculator works for them, fine....but don't start thinking that an orange is the same as a cookie....It isn't...In the long run, the orange will help you on the road to health, but the other snack won't.

    • profile image

      TxGirlinSeattle 6 years ago

      Duh, they changed it to make you lose weight slower so they can make more money. It's not rocket science people, just good ol' economics! More fat people=more money!

    • profile image

      Lisa 6 years ago

      I am not happy with the new points plus plan, for some reason, I just can't stick with it. I find it very frustrating, and I HATE the calculator. They should have kept both, as obviously points plus is working for some people, and not for others. It is extremely frustrating that they gave us no choice. The week it started, I went to sign up again, and the woman I paid at the front told me I wouldn't need any of the old stuff anymore, and grabbed them and threw them in the garbage! Soooo, of course I HAD to buy all the new stuff, and I am so upset my old stuff got thrown away. I don't like the new plan, it doesn't seem to work on me, and I don't feel like I'm losing on it. I've tried joining 3 times now, and for some reason, cannot stick to the new plan, but with the old plan, I stuck with it. Dieting is hard enough, and I felt I had the old plan figured out, re-learning a new plan is frustrating and I'm going to look for other options. If WW was smart, they would bring the old plan back and give people the option to do both, if they're reading any of the comments out there, they would see the new program is not for everybody!

    • profile image

      Bread 6 years ago

      I am not what you would consider an overweight person. However, when I gain a few lbs I always head to WW. The old points system worked great. I have been on the new PP system for two weeks and lost 1.5 lbs. I exercise at least 4 times a week, never go over my 29 points and never eat fruit. I am going to give the program one more week and then I am ordering NS. I personally think ww has really screwed the pooch on this one and it will cost them customers.

    • SaraMarieJames profile image

      SaraMarieJames 6 years ago from Louisville, Kentucky

      I've tried SO many diets but I've found that Weight Watchers really invests in the success of its members. I've had some great success with it and have actually implemented some additional strategies to compliment the new Points Plus program.

    • profile image

      Carol D. 6 years ago

      I don`t understand why your points don`t go under 29. Some people were at 19 points and then the new program came out and now they have 29. Doesn`t make any sense. You can be over 200 pounds and have 29 points and you also can be 140 and still have 29 points. How can that work? So if you weigh 210 and have 29 points then lose 70 pounds you still have 29 points. Your points don`t go down with weight loss. It`s not right. As of nov 2010 i had lost 80 pounds was soo happy now it is march2011 and I am at 67 pounds. I am gaining on new program, not happy. Isn`t there someone at corporate that we can talk to. Our leaders can`t talk about old program. If they do they will be fired. We should have had the choice to what we wanted to do.This is just a money making thing for them. Do you know that the leaders only get paid minium wage. They are pulling so much money and don`t pay the leaders anything. What`s wrong with this picture?????

    • profile image

      riley 6 years ago

      My mom put us on w w in june I was then 241 and mom was 290 now we are 196& 200 not real sure what dad started at but he is down to 340 and I know he has lost more than a 100lbs. We all were stuck and had stoped loosening when we started pp and the weight has started to come off again I am so happy that ww. Has changed our lives I am starting baseball soon and I am excited to see how well we will do in the future.

    • profile image

      mommywag123 6 years ago

      i think everyone who is a current ww member and not having success on the new program needs to speak up at the meetings. so many of the members at my meetings (about half i'm told) have reverted to the old program. no one will tell our meeting leader so she thinks they are all losing on the new program. i am changing back starting today because i lost 20 pounds with the old program and zero since we started points plus in november!! i am frustrated like so many people and think they should offer both as an option.

    • profile image

      Lesley 6 years ago

      Hi I'm a 25 year old female and I'm new to weight watchers. Joining this program is exciting and scary for me at the same time. The last and only time I lost weight I did it the unhealthy way. I fell into the trap of Bulimia.. Now I have many cavities and little faith in losing weight any other way.

      I have been on the new weight watchers plan for 1 week so far and I have followed it religiously and actually mentally prepared myself for failure; however, when I got on the scale after my first week was up I lost 3.5lbs.. IN A WEEK. This is very exciting for me because it tells me there are other ways to loose weight that are healthy. I hope that if there are other men/women out there who thought the only way to loose weight was the unhealthy way can have faith in themselves and the program to try it the right way. Thank you so much Weight Watchers for giving me back my faith!!


      Age 25

    • profile image

      Just cancelled 6 years ago

      I Have joined WW in the past but hate the meetings so was excited to try the online version. I lost weight (water likely) the first week and one pound since then - and i am just ended my second month. I exercised and did weights every day and followed religiously. And the couple of times I used a few 'extra' points, I realized there was no room for them or the exercise points if I wanted to lose weight. I ate one or two bananas and two oranges a day. It was shocking to work so hard and not see results on the scales. I found the literature from he old program and will follow that on my own. I can't imagine how frustrated the program leaders are. I am very disappointed and feel ripped off!

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      Jenniebee26 7 years ago

      I think the biggest flaw with the new system is that it relies on people having common sense and understanding moderation. The problem is that if people had common sense and could eat in moderation, they wouldn't need a plan like WW in the first place. People join WW because they need help. They need specific guidelines and they need structure, but I don't think the new plan provides either.

      First of all, WHAT you use your points on counts as much as how many points you have. You could eat McDonalds, pizza, cookies, and chocolate everyday and still stay within your points allowance, but that doesn't mean you will lose weight. You need to use your points wisely! You need to be eating lean meats, fish, whole grains, low fat dairy, and healthy fats. If you are just using your points on junk food everyday, don't expect the scale to budge.

      Also, eating fruit in "moderation" does not mean eating fruit all day just because it is "free". It means eat 2-3 servings a fruit a day for free. If you are eating more than that, count the extra fruit as points. If you eat 7-8 servings of fruit in addition to your daily points, you are consuming enough extra calories to gain a pound a week just by eating fruit.

      For those who are complaining that they are only losing a pound or so a week on the new plan, that is all it claims you will lose. 1-2 lbs a week is healthy. If you are looking to lose more than that, WW likely isn't the program for you as it is about HEALTH first and foremost. Also, just because you used to lose more but now lose less doesn't necessarily mean the new plan isn't working. It is easy to lose 4-5 lbs a week when you are 100 lbs overweight, but as the numbers on the scale go down, so does your weekly weight loss.

      Lastly, drink lots of water!! It doesn't matter how closely I follow a diet, if I don't drink enough water the scale does not move.

      Have realistic expectations. No matter your efforts, your body changes. Some weeks you will lose less than others, you may hit plateaus, and you may even gain the odd week. It is the long-term, end result that is important.

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      Syllabub 7 years ago

      My endocrinologist does not endorse the new program. He does not understand how fruit, high in fructose and carbs and basically hands-off to diabetics, can be considered a "free food." He agrees it's a marketing tactic. Use the old points system, or Dan's comments below (thanks, Dan!) to calculate your fruit intake.

      I lost 15 pounds on the old system, and this new system has brought 6 pounds of it back. I'm eating exactly what I ate before, and exercise 3-4 times a week. It's very disheartening.

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      Chuuby Chaney 7 years ago

      I had little to no success with the "old" points program, so little that I was going to take WW off my taxes as a charitable deduction. Since I started Points Plus in January, I'm down 15 lbs and more satisfied that I ever was before. It seems to work for me. I don't care why, just that it does.

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      kimboy9-9 7 years ago

      he US plan is called "PointsPlus", has shown up first in Europe as ProPoints. Weight Watchers International did a good job of keeping this plan under wraps....................Good Artical

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      Anne 7 years ago

      I agree with a lot of the posting here. I lost 20 lbs on the old ww point system. I've been very frustrated with the new points plus system. Over the last 7 weeks I have gain more weight. Will plan to go back on the old system.

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      MaryWelch 7 years ago

      I'm so glad to see I'm not alone! I'd lost 68 lbs. on WW before the new Points Plus program. I'm diligent with my tracking on-line every night. I do 6-8 hr. fairly strenuous hikes every weekend and rack up exercise points I don't dare use anymore. My group leader cut me back to 26 daily points, saying I was "one of those 5% that the new program just doesn't work for". I was consistently losing 1-2 lbs. a week on the old plan. Now I've been on a plateau since the new program began. The past two weeks I had over 40 points left over at the end of the week, and this week, I gained 2 lbs. And I know it's not a matter of I didn't eat enough, because if I ate more, I would weigh more. Other long term members in my group are having the same problem. I don't know what to do.

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      Vickie 7 years ago

      I have been on the New WW PP Program for 6 weeks and have not lost any weight. I exercise faithfully 6-7 times a week switching from cardio to jazzercise to good ole calisthenics. I earn 10 or more AP every day. THis is frustrating to say the least. A few more weeks and I will try something else. :-( Disappointed

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      Kathy 7 years ago

      I started weight watchers 8 weeks ago on the New Points Plus Program and have lost 22 lbs. I eat fruit and veggies allllllllll day long, and do not calculate them at all in my points for the day. 21 more pounds and I have reached my goal.

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      Linda 7 years ago

      I lost 50 lbs on the old program. Never gained whe I was on it. I started the new program and only lost 1 lb the 1st week and gained .4 the 2nd. Too many points. I am going to try the old one this week and see what happens. I am very unhappy with this new program. My motto is "If it's not broken, it doesn't need to be fixed"

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      Laura 7 years ago

      on the old system you gained points back w/ exercise. How do i claculate the this into the points calculator?

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      Teinell 7 years ago

      Hello everyone... I was really excited about begining the weight watcher program new points plus...but now must admit a bit discouraged. I'm still going to do it though. I'm just hoping that all this weight gain that most of you on this hub have reported, is from the excess in fruit intake...granted I'm with you, WW should be more,no VERY clear when stating that fruits and veggie are fruit intake. Also I'm hoping sense I don't know about old system...this new ponts plus will come easy and successful for me...I hope you all do well. God blessing and remember real peace, is in Jesus :-)

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      Sherri 7 years ago

      I have been doing WW for 5 months. The first 3 were on the old Points system and I average 1-1.5 lbs weekly. On the new PointsPlus program I am averaging 2-2.5 lbs weekly and feel less like I am dieting.

      The important factor to keep in mind when using the 0 points for fruits and vegetables is that you are allowed SEVEN servings at 0 points. A large banana actually counts as two servings! If you eat more than this, the points do need to be calculated.

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      Rachel 7 years ago

      After my sister lost 90lbs on the old WW points plan, I decided to give the new one a try. I was on it for four weeks and steadily gained weight each week. I already eat plenty of fruits and veg and the amount of points it allowed me each day w/o counting fruit and veg was ridiculous. I never met my points, not even once. It would have been WAY TOO MUCH FOOD! The new points plan is a total failure as far as I'm concerned. I'll never recommend WW to anyone.

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      Elizabeth 7 years ago

      I was so glad to find this hub and find others who are also having trouble losing on the new Weight Watchers program. I lost 30 lbs. on the old system and with the Points Plus I haven't lost anything at all. I'm going to start counting points for any fruit I eat and see if I lose. Thanks to Dan for calculating and posting points for various fruits. Weight Watchers definitely got it wrong this time around.

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      clare 7 years ago

      I love weigth watchers.

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      Brian 7 years ago

      Previous comment started '8 Days ago'

      It has been 3 weeks and I have lost 6 lbs, so counting the fruits are necessary. 2lbs/ week is my target. How come wine is 4 points and it used to be 2 points on the old system?

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      Kimberly Kautzman 7 years ago

      We have a weight loss team at work and we are using points plus! There are five of us and we lost 18lbs collectively in one week and after the second week we totalled 35 lbs lost. No one has lost less than two a week. Everybody likes it and it is not hard at all. This diet doesn't work well for everyone and that is because it is not a diet, it is a lifestyle change. In case anyone can't tell, there is an increase in points, but the foods are also increased. What was 6 points in the old plan, is 8 in the new. That is why you have a higher point intake. AND YES, it figures in your fruits in that calculation. For those who want an easy way to figure out points plus.....divide the calories by 40. (Round UP) It comes out the same as entering fat, protein, carb and fiber check it out.

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      DNewman 7 years ago

      I am please to see all this feedback on the new WW. In 2010, I tried 3 different diets...low cal, Phentermine from the DR and Low Carb...I lost ZERO. I started the old WW 3 weeks ago and have lost 8.5 lbs! I'm down from 150 to 141.5! I feel I'm doing great with the old and am scared to try the new...I'm glad to see you guys have validated my fears. Good luck to all!

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      OWAIS 7 years ago

      I am not sure these would be helpful to me as I am more prone to be underweight. However, I am diabetic and weightwatcchers techniques seem to be quite like what I do follow.

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      bombi 7 years ago

      I have been using ww for several years and have lost weight but after using the new points plus i have not increased my fruit intake nor have i used any "extra" points - i have a lot of activity points and never use them - but still haven't lost a lb on the new porgram

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      capnrap 7 years ago

      I am one of those who does not like the new Weight Watchers points plus program. I was very successful on the previous program and have gone back to that one. The points plus may be good for people who need to lose a great deal of weight (what program wouldn't) or for maintanence. Sorry Weight Watchers, I think they will lose members. I did not overeat fruit and counted every bit of food that went in my mouth. Not losing wt but have since I have been back on the Flex Plan.

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      Bonnie 7 years ago

      I was on weight watchers in 2005 and I only stayed on it for 11 weeks I lost 27lbs but I couldn't handle it. I felt like I was starving, I have been on the new point plus program for 3 weeks, I have more points and I am less weight then I was in 2005 and I don't feel like I'm starving. I have lost 10 lbs in 2 weeks. It took me 4 weeks before on the old program.

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      Dawn 7 years ago

      I lost 51 lbs over a period of a year on the old program. I attended a meeting every week. Over the period of 3 years I have regained 15 lbs. I started the new points plus program 3 weeks ago online and I am consistently gaining and the reloosing the same 3 lbs. I do not like the new points plus program. I am starting back to weekly meetings this week. Maybe that will get me back on track. I think the old program was easier to follow. I agree with someone that said " if it ain't broken why fix it."

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      WW fan 7 years ago

      I loved the old WW. Seeing that I have their formula memorized, I am going to continue to follow it. I lost over 100 lbs on that diet and I am not really buying this zero fruit gimmick (I always calculate points for it). I bet WW is only revamping their program to get more ppl in to buy it. All of the old members (online) no longer need their online version or meeting version. I did it all on my own (with their info) and after a couple months, I no longer needed to go to meetings. These are the types of ppl that they are trying to bring back in. That being said, WW is an EXCELLENT program. I loved the old version and not too sure about the new. I would def. try one or the other if you are in need of a good diet plan.

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      Rod 7 years ago

      Why is it so difficult to find a list of WW points plus foods and their values. Does WW not want to publish a list?

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      Sandy 7 years ago

      I stayed on the PointsPlus plan religiously the past 10 days but went to a meeting this morning and I have not lost an ounce. I have been on this PointsPlus program for about 5 weeks and have only lost 1.2 lbs. The first week I GAINED 1.5 lbs because I ate a lot of fruit. The only weeks I have lost weight on this PointsPlus program was when I was counting fruit - went on web, got nutrition info for each piece of fruit, put that info in the WW Calculator to get the points. (Someone early on in this comment thread also posted the points for various pieces of fruit gotten this way) The last 2 weeks I have not been counting fruit, but will have to go back to doing that. What they tell you about fruit being 0 points is wrong - I keep hearing in my meetings and in this post about people who are gaining weight on PointsPlus. It's because of the fruit. This morning in my meeting two people said that. The leader said fruit has a lot of carbs and has to be eaten "in moderation," but did not define that. This "free fruit" thing is designed to bring in more members, I think, but it is sullying Weight Watchers good reputation. It's going to get around that people GAIN weight on PointsPlus, and then Weight Watchers will lose members in the end. I lost 25 lbs on the old program, and it worked. I never heard of anyone who consistently followed the old program gaining weight on it. It's too bad Weight Watchers is ruining a great program with this free-fruit B.S. on PointsPlus.

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      Zest 7 years ago

      The old WW program worked for me and I reached my goad and lifetime status and maintained my weight. When the Points Plus program came out, I followed it to the letter. I have gained over 6 pounds! It does not work like the old WW. I had been a huge advocate and fan of WW and a walking example of how well it worked. Now, I'm quitting, pulling my business and working on losing the 6+ pounds of GAINED on the new program! Ouch!

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      Misty 7 years ago

      Remember, you don't HAVE to join meetings. You only really have to buy the books that show the points. With the books you don't need a WW calculator. With the calculator (and don't pay more than $10 for one!), you don't need the books. You can get either at a place of WW meetings. You can get ripped off if you order online. You really don't have to join. It is good to join, but a lot of us DON'T have that kind of money. Good Luck. Weight Watchers is a good program. They are only trying to make weight loss new and unboring and tolerable for us out here!

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      Brian 7 years ago

      8 Days ago, I mentioned I would count the fruit in the daily allotted point, so I did for a week and lost 1.5lbs. I only used the daily points and exercised every other day. I think the key is to count anything eaten. My goal is 2 lbs per week, I guess exercise is key.

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      LJ 7 years ago

      Very useful site & blog. Thanks everyone for sharing!!! I am new to WW and on the new program, and had a 40 pt day and a 60 pt day when I'm only allowed 29. I stopped counting for a few days but am back on the horse and am going to keep trying. LJ.

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      MM 7 years ago

      Been on the new WW program for 3 weeks now and completely frustrated. I don't have a lot to lose but I have lost more in a week without even trying than on WW. I joined WW so I could follow a program and it's just annoying and frustrating that at the end of the week, after all the point counting and shopping and following the so-called rules etc, that I have no success, and am being told that I have may have to "modify" some things...the whole reason I paid for a program was to make it easier and to follow THEIR program, not my own! Eat less fruit, drink more water, lower my points...why should it matter when the basic premise is simply just to stay within your points?! Lost 2 then gained 2, disappointed with the dining-out companion, giving it another 2 weeks then back to my old diet, getting my money back, and selling all the WW crap on ebay! I wanted to lose the weight by my bday and worry I am wasting time! Wish me luck.

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      Mom of Two 7 years ago

      I was on the old system of weight watchers and recently had 2 friends join the new system. I've never been to a meeting but got information from a friend who didn't want to be bothered and gave me a copy of the old WW point book. According to my friends they can eat up to like 38 points now. I have begun to follow the old point book that I have because I financially can't afford 60 a month for a once a week meeting and weigh in. It's all about moderation really isn't it? I mean obviously if your filling your old binge habits with fruit it isn't going to be helpful. I believe the idea with WW is to educate yourself on portion control, and just how much you should consume in a day to lose weight. Naturally exercise is a huge factor in weight loss also, but learning how to eat for a food addict is a challenge. I've lost weight and have maintained for the past 4 years but still have like 30 to lose. I've started doing the old weight watchers again and am learning that my portions are huge and I have become more conscious about what I put in my mouth and when. Old system, new system whatever........"A SYSTEM" to help me change my eating habits and be aware of what and how much I am eating is what is important. I can't say I know anything about the new system with the exception that you have more points and fruit and veggies are zero points now. What else has changed, I'm curious to know.

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      Liz 7 years ago

      Having success on the old programme I was keen to try the new programme. However, my old point allowance was 23 but I only lost weight eating 14-18 points per day. My new allowance is 30 and having followed it for a couple of weeks I'm glad to see others feel that the points are too high as I'm having limited success. I think that for people who eat far too much in a day, this will lead to a calorie defecit as stated but for people like me, who had my diet under control portion wise, just needed to shift some baby weight, the points are leading to a far larger basic food consumption - without eating more fruit & veg! I'll be cutting my points tomorrow!

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      Ms. "D" 7 years ago

      I started the new WW Points Plus Program on December 30,2010 and as of last week I have lost 12lbs. I gained 1.4 back because I begin to do some heavy cardio work outs and my muscles are retaining water. Please make sure that you all are drinking plenty of water. As it pertains to fruit please remember "ALL THINGS IN MODERATION. To be honest if one eats 5-6 bananas per day, it's only common sense that you would gain weight. To begin with bananas are very high in sugar. What I usually do because I am not a huge fruit person to begin with is, I may have "Low Sugar" oatmeal in the morning and cut 1/2 of a banana in the oatmeal. Then I may eat the other half later in the day. WW points plus is an awesome program that provides lots of flexibility. Just Please, please, please make sure you are drinking plenty of water. Water does wonders for losing weight. Best of luck to all of you. P.S. - This hub is totally awesome. Be Blessed and stay ENCOURAGED!

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      lake88 7 years ago

      I started the new PointPlus two weeks ago and love it! I have lost 6.5 points. I count and measure everything and I do not eat more than 3 or 4 fruits a day. It has worked for me... and my mom, who started 2 weeks ago, she has lost 10.5 lbs!! Try it, trust me!

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      Lynne 7 years ago

      Dan and Sandy are spot on. Thanks Dan for the fruit information.

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      Brian 7 years ago

      My first week on the new plan and I have not lost a single lb, however, reading the other comments I feel less discouraged than I felt this morning, thanks for the comments.

      I think the fruits have to be counted, I don’t eat a lot of fruits per day (1 banana, 1 apple and a Kashi bar), so let’s see for points not counted 5 for the banana + 2 for the apple= 7 points or 20% of my allowed points.

      I work out for 24 min per day at a moderate rate which equates to 3 points, if that much, so if I don’t count these points as plus points and count the fruit as points, I suspect I will lose 2-3 ibs per week, as I did on the old plan.

      I will let you know next week if this worked. Cheers.

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      karen 7 years ago

      I liked the orignal WW so many proteins, fruits vegets. dairy a day that was the best. wish it was back

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      Lex 7 years ago

      I have something to say about people denouncing the validty of the science in this new Points Plus plan. I have recently joined Weight Watchers again, after years of college and gaining weight. I had great success on the old plan; I lost over 40 pounds. I gained it all back and then some, like I mentioned, because I moved out, went to college, drank too much beer, and ate too much pizza, like most people do. I tried to sign up again about a year ago, but I just couldn't stick to that "core" plan. The thought of exercise repulsed me, and I was hoping to have a "quick fix" which I could not find in the core plan. Essentially, the old weight watchers plan WAS easier, and much more of a "quick fix." You were ENCOURAGED to drink soda, for pete's sake!

      Which brings me to my point: just because drinking diet coke in lieu of water works, DOESN'T mean it's healthy... and in this case, just because the old plan worked, DOES NOT mean we were all healthy on that plan. This new plan encourages HEALTH above all else, and I find it incredibly invigorating, as well as SUCCESSFUL! Of course you can't binge eat fruit... if you're really looking to change your life and the way you think about food (and exercise), this plan WILL work for you! I'm 3 weeks in and I've lost 8 pounds! I am a busy woman; I work full time, I go to school full time, I'm a DJ at my college's radio station, AND I still find time to exercise at least one hour every day (with the exception of Sundays, because frankly, I think I deserve a day off sometimes lol). ANYONE can do this plan and do it well!

      If you're binge eating fruit, it's obvious you need to re-evaluate not the points values of the fruits themselves, but with your own food addiction. I know... I am a food addict, through and through, just like so many of you guys. But like any other addiction, in order to replace your bad habits that were once your driving force, you need to recognize them as bad habits in the first place... and then find new, successful habits. I know it's easier said than done, but once you begin really LIVING the plan, the same way drug addicts LIVE the 12 steps, in every single minute of your life... you will see results.

      I have never felt so motivated about anything in my life as I have about this plan. I can say with full certainty that while it is much harder to master than the old plan, it provides a healthy lifestyle I want to continue for the rest of my own life. Give it a chance, it DOES work!

      The body is like a well-oiled machine; what you put in is what you'll get out of it. Remember that, whenever you have doubts. It helps me. :)

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      S.R. 7 years ago

      To Natoya Green...

      Hey Natoya,

      Just wondering how your doing. Please post something. I would like to see how your doing.

      S.R. =)

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      jojoj12 7 years ago

      I don't understand. The old ww program worked for me the new one doesn't. I don't overeat fruit. I don't even like fruit. But all the snarky comments calling people idiots because they think they can eat all the fruit they want and not gain weight...isn't that exactly what ww is promoting? Otherwise why didn't they just leave things where they were and lower the point value of fruits and veggies? The whole part of this remarketing campaign (and that is what this change is really about marketing and making money) is that you can eat all the fruits and veggies for 0 points. We all know that is not why change the program if it was working for so many people before??? Why not just add to the existing program that you can eat two free fruits a day? Because they could not rebrand their product and get the PR campaign going on that alone.

      I am gaining weight because the point allowances are too high. You can say then "why don't you eat less"...and my answer would be if the plan is so far off, then why do I need to follow weight watchers at all? There are a thousand other low calorie diets out there...

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      Trinsick 7 years ago from Cali

      I'm doing this atkins type diet, and it's actually working. I've lost 10 pounds in about 3 weeks.

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      7 years ago

      I think the point of the 'free fruits' is that you may choose a banana over a brownie now whereas before you wouldn't want to waste points on fruit in favour of 'treats'. I am finding that I am eating more fruit now and I don't need the cake/cookies etc. I think it was a great move from WW!

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      S.R. 7 years ago

      this is for Natoya Green...

      i know that life can stink,and that there are so many things that we have no control over,that rob us of happiness. But, please see that you CAN change some things .And there are other ways to find peace of mind and self respect, other then what you look like. You are a valuable human being that who has a great value .The Bible says : “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.(John 3:16{John chapter 3, and verse 16})...yes, Natoya, Jesus died for all of us...that includes you. Your creator cares for you as an individual and provides real love and support in His word The Bible.Look up 1 Peter 5:7 ,it says:" while YOU throw all YOUR anxiety upon him, because he cares for YOU". The "YOU" that is mentioned in this scripture means YOU, as an individual, not just people in general.Please look up Psalms,chapter descibes the true God of the Bible, and His position in this universe.There is no problem to big for Him, and He will help you. I know this because I have personally found happiness, balance, and coming to know Bible truths...also I have benefited greatly by associating with ones who also respect Bible truths.It has brought a balance to my life that enables me to cope with day to day disappointments in myself, as well as others.

      I hope this helps you, and please know that you are valuable, and more then a number on the scale.



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      Lisa 7 years ago

      Are you people idiots? It clearly states on the WW website that fruit are zero points, but you must eat them in moderation. Don't blame WW because you chose to eat a crap load of fruits. Common sense would tell you that "moderation" would be five servings of fruit a day max.

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      Brian 7 years ago

      I dont know what all you are talking about. You can eat all the protein vegetables and fruit that you want and lose weight. Its what the mediterranean diet is based off of which is not a truly a diet. If you are gaining weight while counting your "points" I dont think you should be blaming the fruit.

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      natoya green 7 years ago

      i was watching the weigth watcher and deside to start the progam i need to take half this weigth i am so unhappy with my life sometime i wish to kill myself

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      monkey mom 7 years ago

      I am not loving this but not giving up. I lost 50 lbs on the old program. I am up 7lbs and so I restarted. Only lost 1.6 lbs in week one and 0 in week two. I run 14-18 miles a week (which I never did on the old program) and expected to be losing more like 4-5 lbs in the first 2 weeks. VERY discouraged. I am going to hang on there....

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      Diana 7 years ago

      I am interested to hear if eating the 49 extra points hinders the weight loss? I have been on 2 weeks . Gained 1 pound week one but lost 4 the next . I did allow myself the "allowed" extra points but not all. Thanks

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      Sherry F-H 7 years ago

      I am a lifetime Weight Watcher from back in 1998 and I had the old plan memorized as far as points for what foods etc., but now I am just starting to follow the Points Plus system and for an old timer like me, its really hard to change your mind set! I'm struggling but its worth the effort tho. Good Luck!

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      dpatullo741 7 years ago from UK

      Today, obesity is a common problem. I feel the program you have mentioned is a good initiative to make people fit and healthy.

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      candy 7 years ago

      does anyone know the daily point allowance for the new weight watchers plus for a female 44 who is 5 ft 4 in.thanks

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      luminita1977 7 years ago from New York

      Good article,thanks

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      lose weight quick and easily 7 years ago

      Thanks for the article ... it really works

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      Joyce  7 years ago

      I lost 55 # on the old WW last year. I believe understanding and tracking what goes into your mouth plus a commitment to a lifestyle change which includes regular exercise is what makes the difference. WW gave me the tools and I built the road to weight loss.

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      Kate 7 years ago from England

      excellent hub

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      waterprincess 7 years ago from Davie

      What a great hub page! I recently started again and am very excited!

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      Wishing_Well 7 years ago from Dublin, Ireland

      Thanks for the info. I just started the new plan and I'm not sure how it will work for me. I can't understand how someone who weighs 120lbs is allowed the same amount of points as someone who weighs 195lbs and still lose weight.

      I'm sure it would be effective for people who need to lose a larger amount of weight.

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      suejanet 7 years ago

      I think I will stick with my old plan. . . it works for me

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      Pamela99 7 years ago

      Great program. I appreciate the information.

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      gagan000 7 years ago from NAGPUR

      nice information for me.i like this....(.)(.)

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      ML 7 years ago

      I have never heard of anyone eating 5 bananas and three oranges a day. Sorry to say it, but that is just plain stupid. You're lucky you only gained 1.4 in the week. You

      still need to use common sense.

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      Kristy 7 years ago

      Dan, did you recalculate the foods are were already eating? With the new formula, just about everything I normally ate went up a point of two so not sure how you can "fill in". It also says IN MODERATION. I don't think many people could eat 30 fruits and manage to eat anything else anyway. :-)

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      Mike 7 years ago

      i have made a points calculator that is accurate and easy to use... if anyone wants it email me

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      Nelle Hoxie 7 years ago

      It seemed that the original WW program very closely aligned to diabetic exchanges and was nutritional sound and without gimmicks. Not it seems every year they feel that they have to come up with something new.

      Thanks for writing the hub though, it was very interesting to hear what this year brings.

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      sarah 7 years ago

      I actually am making up my new w.w. plan... i love the idea of free fruits and veg.... bc before i would choose something else, because i didn't want to waste 1 point foods on fruit... so my new w.w. plan is eat fruits and veg free... and only allow 10 points for the day, based on old points. i do this during the week. I actually feel less bloated... then on the weekends i only eat 18 points... I feel better this way...

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      summer4fun 7 years ago

      I have lost 20 pounds on the old plan and was excited about the new program, as something new and better is always great. However, I have been mostly discouraged by the points going up in all of my previously healthy carbs. Vitamuffins, Skinny Cow, and Earth Grains Organic breads to name a few. I realize that the 100 point snacks were not healthy, but whole wheat pasta, wheat bread, cereals, etc. have all gone up as if they are bad foods. These little white buns that were always 2 points are still two points, but the whole wheat has gone up. Weird. It feels like a high protein, low carb diet to me. I haven't really given it a fighting chance, I have to admit, and I will, but it feels frustrating to me, maybe because I don't want to eat healthy and I am just fooling myself, or you can't teach and old dog new tricks.

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      jklkj 7 years ago

      WW hasn't worked for me until this new version.

      I certainly get that it is a profit making organization but I appreciate their help. I am enjoying the fruit and am using a variety. Losing successfully!

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      jstankevicz 7 years ago from Cave Creek

      I've been following the comments here with interest. It's clear that common sense applies when using either version of the Weight Watchers (or any diet plan). I've replaced the banana graphic with a pic of grapes. Accented the cautionary note in the "fruit is free" discussion. Thanks to all for the useful comments about your experiences.

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      Sandy 7 years ago

      I am the person who gained 1.4 lbs on the new Points Plus program my first week on it - see my earlier post. I was eating 5-6 bananas and 3 oranges per day during that first week, since fruits are supposedly free on the new program. This past week, my second week on the program, I lost 3.3 pounds. The difference this past week is that I counted fruit. In other words, fruit cannot be free for a quantity eater like me. I went on the web, got the nutrition information (amount of carbohydrates, fat, fiber, etc) for the fruits I ate, plugged that into the new $10 Weight Watchers calculator, and found the points for each fruit. I ended up eating about 2 pieces of fruit per day, and that did not include bananas, which come out to 5 points on the calculator. Yes, as some posters have commented, one cannot stuff one's face with fruit and expect to lose weight on this new PointsPlus program. But saying fruit is free (0 points) is misleading. You can only eat fruit "in moderation", as some of the literature given to the leaders says. The problem is that "moderation" is never defined, and "moderation" is not the same as "free." For me, counting fruit results in eating it in moderation. If you are having trouble losing weight on PointsPlus and you are eating a lot of fruit, I recommend that you start counting all fruit using nutrition info from the web and the Weight Watchers calculator, as I did.

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      Sharen 7 years ago

      WW has been the best of all the diet programs out there. Why fix something if it ain't broke? Their new program sounds like something I could get in the tabloids. Dang, WW, there was confidence in your trusting us to make good decisions by using your great point system. Could this have something to do with the government's interference in deciding what is best for us to eat?

    • lender3212000 profile image

      lender3212000 7 years ago from Beverly Hills, CA

      Very informative article! Nicely done. I must say I was surprised to read some of the comments where people literally assume "fruits are free" means you can just sit and eat fruit all day. If you want to lose weight, calories going in have to be less than calories being consumed. Quality contributes to overall health but you still have to burn calories. I'm amazed at how some people try to make things so much more complicated than they need to be.

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      REALLY? 7 years ago

      Lets not forget the reason you are doing weight watchers and why. If your going to continue to stuff your face with food, regarless if its fruit or anything else your losing the whole meaning behind the program and weight lose. It's all about mederation and being sensible. 5 bannana's and 3 oranges a day is excessive! And of course your not going to be losing. Really look at the program, why your doing it and be smart about it. It is only going to work if you let it! Don't try tricking yourself so you can make more excuses on why it is ok to keep eating more than you need!

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      Tara 7 years ago

      I love the new program. I was a quantity eater also, but I have discovered the quantity of food that I was eating was crap! I'm not looking for a a quick fix diet, I am looking to change my eating habits and to make better choices. Do you really need 5 bananas to be satified? No... It's kinda how you treat your money in this economy... is it a need or a want? If it's a want, is it worth the cost? 16 weeks in and I've lost 37 pounds.. 3 of which was just last week on the new program.

    • donotfear profile image

      donotfear 7 years ago from The Boondocks

      I lost 20 lbs on the old program. This seems to be a re-arrangment of the old program. So fruits are zero, but proteins are more. That's the impression I get. Still the best program out there.

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      Sandy 7 years ago

      This new Points Plus program is awful, at least for people like myself who are "quantity" eaters. During my first week on PointsPlus, I GAINED 1.4 lbs, even though I followed the program to the letter, and kept up my normal 1 hour per day aerobic exercise. The problem is the free fruits. I ate an average of about 5 bananas and 3 oranges per day, which is a large amount, but not unusual for people who are quantity eaters. (We are the people who laugh at the 100-calorie pack idea for sweet treats, for example, because we know we would just eat all 10-12 packs in the box at once.) This large fruit injestion led to my weight gain, which is understandable since this amount of fruit represents a very large additional calorie intake per day. FRUITS ARE NOT REALLY FREE IN THIS PROGRAM. The literature says that Weight Watchers has incorporated into the daily points allowance the free fruits you will eat during the day. But this means they are assuming that you will eat a certain amount of fruit each day. If you eat much more than, that, then, you will probably not do well on this program. My meeting leader showed me one piece of Weight Watchers literature on the new program which said that members can eat as much fruit as they want, except right next to that, in parentheses, it said "(in moderation)". He said, "What does that mean, 'in moderation'? " He noted that this "in moderation" warning does not appear elsewhere in the PointsPlus literature. So it looks like Weight Watchers is telling us we can eat as much fruit as we want without counting it, but secretly is telling its leaders that fruit can only be eaten "in moderation", with that left undefined. I agree with the other poster, Dan, who said this new Weight Watchers program is probably meant to generate more revenue, since if they tell the public that people can lose weight eating al the bananas they want, naturally people will join the program. In the meantime, quantity eaters in WW are being screwed. I am trying the PointsPlus program one more week, counting the fruits as Dan indicated. If I still gain or don't lose, I am going back to the old program on which I lost 25 lbs in 2006. (Since then, 7 lbs has crept back on, which is what I am now trying to lose.) Fortunately, I saved my old materials. MY MAIN MESSAGE: BEWARE OF THIS NEW POINTS PLUS PROGRAM. IT IS TELLING LIES - THAT "CALORIES DON'T COUNT" AS FAR AS FRUITS GO. YOU MAY GAIN WEIGHT ON THIS PROGRAM AS A RESULT.