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A conversation about Health.

Updated on November 6, 2009

Facebook conversation on the Goverment Role.

This conversation on the governments role in Health care began after the Elections of Republican Governors in Virgina and I think Maine.  Louis had the opinion that the elections heralded a new era of Conservative Victory. Louis is more of a Capitalist Libertarian than a regular Republican and I was curious as to why he wished to ignore the defeat of a true Conservative in the Congressional race that elected a Representative who could actually vote in Congress.   I guess we paint the picture of the view we want to see.

Louis Ayoub How about that push back on the social agenda that a MAJORITY of this great country does not want? Looks like your guy better shove it through or forget it!

William Hodge  Shove it through sounds good. We did win that Congressional seat in New York against the Conservative Candidate after the Republican was shoved out by the Radical Right Wing. But I guess you didn't notice that while celebrating your new Governors. Governors don't vote in Congress.

Louis Ayoub  William, who are you kidding? Not me. Maybe yourself.

Sure the conservative was beat in NY. But need I remind you that he is an unknown, came from nowhere to show the true colors of that RINO and only lost by 3 points. That in itself tells a story.

The bitch was no Republican and she was surly not conservative. Dumb ho-bag endorsed the Democrat.

Go ahead and shove it on through. You support a bunch of thugs and that is there only option. If the bill was that great it wouldn't be so hard to get support now would it?

William Hodge  Name calling. Thats cute! The conservative lost. Now the Democrats have another seat. Point for our side. Enjoy the Governors.

Louis AyoubI call em like I see em!

Hey, seat... why don't they take a vote tomorrow and get your health scam passed?

Let me answer for you. Because power corrupts and none of your team members want to give up their cushy jobs. Ahhhahhahhhahh!!! You have the numbers and the poser yet you have nothing!!!!!!
William Hodge I would like to introduce you to someone who doesn't have a cushy job and qualifies as one of the dregs of society that you and Harold are so fond of painting as parasites. Does his life have intrinsic value

Louis AyoubThank your crook friends in government for this atrocity.

This is a rich country with plenty to go around. You just can't take it as you see fit, let some bureaucrat handle it and expect it to get to the needy.

William Hodge The blind who cannot see deserve compassion. The blind who will not see deserve "Pity" All life has intrinsic value either as friend or food. I guess all the advice i can give to you and Harold is - "Eat me".

Louis Ayoub You are spoiled food. No thanks!

William Hodge LOL.

Louis Ayoub William, I dressed like an ugly woman and helped raise money for mentally challenged people on Halloween. I also donated money. I don't need anyone to take from me to give to those in need.

I believe most people are like me and care. Give them a chance and you won't be disappointed. Take form them and they will hoard what they can hide, keep and spend.

Want to see a picture of me in drag?
Louis Ayoub HARC is the organization. Its the Hillsborough Achievement and Resource Center. It used to be called the Hillsborough Association of Retarded Citizens.
Louis Ayoub You scared now?

William Hodge LOL I don't think so Louis. At my age, fear is not an option.

Louis Ayoub So you like my get up for charity? You see I don't need no stinking government to tell me what is right to do for another.

I am good people. most are. You will ruin it if you push too hard.
William HodgeJohn D Rockefeller was good people who tithed to his church as he use government to help him sell his waste product from making Kerosene(gasoline) and establish a monopoly. He destroyed a great many people making his fortune. But he was "Good People"
Louis AyoubThe only gas you can accuse me of making is after dinner and no one will pay me for it. I am good people with bad gas.
William Hodge LOL - OK Louis. You get the bad gas award. Still does not change the truth. Man is a community animal. His survival depends on the community. Any man who believes he survives solely by his own efforts does not face truth. Being alone is to die.
Louis AyoubYou said it wise man. We are animals and we understand about survival as do the animals. No one tells the lions who to kill, who shall eat and who should survive so that the pride survives. Its all instinct.

Show me one lion that sits back and doesn't pull his weight in the hunting and gathering ing and I will show you a lion that doesn't eat.

Show me lioness that bangs the pride, has multiple cubs from various lions and looks for handouts and I will again show you an outcast.

Left alone we will do what is necessary to survive. That includes looking out for each other. Force a lion to hunt for the unwilling and you are asking him to go against nature.

William Hodge Show me the Lion who who picks the cotton, spins the thread weaves the cloth, cuts the pattern, and sews his own clothes. Show me lion who builds his house and grows his food and manufactures the car he drives. Show me the lion who takes his neighbors land to build roads and drives through his Kingdom. You are not a Lion. You are a human dependentupon the community in which he lives. Even the proud free lion does not provide for himself. He depends upon the female to kill the food that he eats. You live in a fantasy world, Louis. The words you use are in your head as concepts that are not a part of reality. Try living in the real world with the rest of us.
William Hodge I live with the firm belief that socialised democracy is a good thing. It recognizes the fundamental fact that we are "The Community of Man"
Louis Ayoub I will live with and die for my firm belief in freedom. Try as you might, you can not take it from me. Just like the lion is free I will be too.
William Hodge Whoa to you who have eyes but will not see, ears but will not hear.!! The Lion is not free. The lioness feeds his pride. With out her he is dead. And yet he does not know that he is nothing.
Louis Ayoub What kind of crack you smokin there Willie?

William Hodge Delusion is the eye of the Beholder,my dear friend Lewis. Perhaps you should study how the social structure of the Pride works before you "roar like the Lion".

Louis Ayoub  None of this is real. None of us matter. We are just matter. That is what you think so why waist your time here?
Louis Ayoub  William, how much is enough for the average family to live on today? What is a fair amount of income?
William HodgeYour point being what Louis. Are you willing to be taxed to support a minimum level of existence in return for working a job created by the government Do you just want to prove that no one is lacking in means to survive. Give me your agenda and we will discuss.the applicable facts.    One more reference to your hero of freedom. The Lion has the same role in the Pride as the Drone does in the Bee Hive except that he doesn't die after the mating. Perhaps the Hive Collective is your concept freedom. You have complete Freedom in the Hive until you get you Shoot Your Load.

Louis Ayoub  I am asking because I want to see what you deem to be a living wage. It really doesn't matter what number you toss out, I am going to accept it.
Lets say $100k is a fair number for a average family of 4. Is the good for you?

Let pass a bill that says anything you make over that get sent to the gov. for redistribution.

How is this plan sounding to you?

William HodgeI don't ever remember advocating confiscation. I have always advocated greater reward for greater effort and contribution to society. I just have a hard time believing that millions of dollars in income a year is a justifiable income. I cannot believe that there is any justification for 5% of the population to own 95% of the Nations wealth while millions die without health coverage. I believe that the burden of survival for the whole nation should be carried in large part by the Lion before he cries" Let me be Free." I have no problem with the accumulation of wealth as long as it is not done standing on the bodies of fellow human beings.

Louis AyoubYou would have to agree that many wealthy folks get that way the legitimate way without standing on the bodies of fellow humans, correct?
Louis AyoubSo are athletes and actors great contributors to society? Are politicians? Are garbage men and janitors?

Come on Willie I need clarity.

William Hodge You are quite right, Louis. Men like Warren Buffett and Bill Gates contributed to the community making their money and then gave most of it back to improve the world. Men like Andrew Carnegie who believed his fortune was A PUBLIC TRUST. It is the exception that proves the rule. If all men of wealth held that view then government would have to compel nothing. But they aren't and Government exist to the protection of all and not to the benefit of the few.

Louis add a couple more comments to the thread while I was preparing this for publishing but they did not add anything new to the story so I did not go back and include them.  The main thrust is that I believe in a Democratic Society that compels the owners of massive wealth to contribute to the wellbeing of all of the citizens of the Society.  Louis believes that  ownership of property is a "Right" granted by god that cannot be compromised by government intervention even if it means the death of the innocent.  Property Rights are equated to "Freedom" and citizen right to life is to be reduced to a secondary consideration .  I admit that I have written this piece to favor my own opinions but the comments have not been edited in any material way.  They can be found on my Facebook Page for verification.  I report. You decide.


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