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Chemtrails and Contrails - my story and research - chemtrails do not exist

Updated on February 20, 2016

How I came to believe and disbelieve in chemtrails

I first heard the term chemtrails several years ago in Nexus magazine. It is said that "there are two types of people in the world - those that read Nexus and those that don't," and I am one of the former type.

What this really means is that there are people who are fascinated by and believe in the reality of all manner of subjects that never get mentioned in the mainstream media, and that if you are one of these people and want to keep up to date on the latest info on conspiracy theories, alternative history, alternative health, UFOs and suppressed scientific discoveries then Nexus is the publication to read.

I had read an article by Canadian journalist William Thomas, who was one of the first people to bring the phenomenon to public attention and he even wrote a book on the subject - Chemtrails Confirmed.

Contrail photos

Persistent contrails over Tenerife
Persistent contrails over Tenerife
Persistent contrail over Cardiff
Persistent contrail over Cardiff
Cardiff contrailed sky
Cardiff contrailed sky
Artificial or manmade?
Artificial or manmade?

Dr Strangelove

Thomas claims that barium and aluminium oxide are among substances being sprayed by planes into the sky. It is theorised that this operation was started because of a proposal in 1998 by Dr Edward Teller aka "Father of the H-Bomb" and "Dr Strangelove," who suggested that a sunscreen of reflective metallic particles could be formed to curb the effects of global warming, and he put forward this idea when he addressed the International Seminar On Planetary Emergencies.

Thomas also suggested that widespread illness was being caused by the barium and other toxins in the chemtrails, and that epidemics of "flu-like illnesses" were due to the trails.

When I first saw info about this in Nexus I didn't take that much notice but filed it away as something to be aware of as a possibility. I also thought it was a problem perhaps in Canada and America but for now the UK was safe.

Then over the years I started to notice trails being left by planes that didn't fade away quickly like the contrails I had been seeing since my childhood but that stayed for hours. I love walking and looking at the natural world about me and I noticed that these trails were different.

These new trails didn't look right. These new trails messed up the beauty of the sky. These new trails were not what I was used to.

I realised that what I had been seeing increasingly frequently were what Thomas calls chemtrails and that now they were being created over Cardiff and South Wales where I lived. It was as if the threat of chemtrails had come into my world.

I had read about how the chemtrails make people ill and that flu and respiratory problems are some of the main symptoms of having been exposed to toxins in the air that have come from the trails. I noticed how every time there was a lot of flu going around, or "the lergee" as many people call it in Cardiff that there had been these new long-lasting trails in the skies.

The strains of flu over the years had been getting to make people much more ill it seemed than the illness used to. People would say "this flu's a killer" and "I just can't seem to shake it off."

I do my best to keep healthy and take a range of supplements and use colloidal silver if I feel I am going down with anything. As it happens I learned about this remedy in Nexus magazine too.

Having said that there were a couple of times I did get ill with terrible colds or flu that lasted a long time and were not like I was used to. I point this out because the severity of the flu-like illnesses appeared to coincide with the increased presence of what I now knew as chemtrails.

I didn't have many friends in Cardiff who shared my beliefs or interests in conspiracy theories and my studies in these areas were personal or shared with like-minded people I would meet online.

I read all leading conspiracy theory author David Icke's books and I studied other sources of information on the subject. I was becoming even more a conspiracy theory and chemtrail researcher and spent time on conspiracy sites where I found loads and loads of info about chemtrails.

That they existed I was very sure of. That they were harmful I also believed.

In 2004 I moved to Tenerife and amongst a long list of things that attracted me to the island was the fact that besides the excellent weather we usually had very clear starlit skies at night and plenty of sun by day with no chemtrails even though there are plenty of planes arriving and leaving the two airports daily.

But then one day I saw them - they were the long-lasting trails that linger and spread out into hazy whitish sky. Oh no, I thought - even here in Tenerife we are being sprayed by chemtrail planes!

And at this point in time when there were chemtrails over Tenerife there was also a flu-bug going around and terrible rainstorms. I connected the dots and thought the trails were causing the illness that was affecting people as well as the really bad weather.

You see, weather modification experiments and the use of chemtrails for military purposes is also a strong belief in chemtrail conspiracy theory. By that time I had become so disgusted with what I believed was being done all over the world that I had befriended countless other chemtrail-believers and had even bought a "Say No To Chemtrails" T-shirt.

I had read up on many websites about how weather modification was being used by the elite or the shadowy Illuminati to bring about deliberate droughts and crop failure as well as to be used as evidence of climate change and Global Warming as being pushed by Al Gore and many others. Conspiracy theorists were saying this Global Warming drive was a scam.

Further, that these evil people known as the Illuminati were engaged in a cull of the populations of "useless eaters" and wanted to get rid of most of us as they admitted openly on the Georgia Guidestones - http://www.radioliberty.com/stones.htm - where it states in the first of 10 points: "Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature."

Websites such as this one have plenty of information on the global cull that the elite are believed to be bringing about - http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/esp_sociopol_depopu.htm - and chemtrails are one of their methods. Besides the dangers of the barium and aluminium other pathogens and fungal spores, moulds and viruses are said to be in the trails, as well as artificial fibres and even nanotechnology. The plan being to kill people slowly and to weaken their immune systems by the accumulative strain on them from all these toxic attacks.

Clifford Carnicom is as well-known in chemtrail conspiracy circles as William Thomas and he has said much about the deliberate use of bacteria and viruses as biowarfare against the masses using chemtrails to disperse the agents of death - http://www.rense.com/general39/finally.htm

Weather modification as warfare is also something that is believed to be a reality. Scott Stevens on the website http://weatherwars.info/ says: "Weather is the new terrorism. Remember, the best weapon is a secret weapon. Let weather control be a secret no more. Look up and see what is going on just over your heads. Please for your own well being inform yourself."

Weather as a Force Multiplier: Owning the Weather in 2025 details how the military can use the weather for warfare.

As well as these ideas, there is the belief that HAARP (High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program), which is based on research and the work of Nikola Tesla is being used in conjunction with chemtrail programmes for various purposes including mind weather modification, warfare and mass mind control.

Speaking of mind control it is said that psychiatric tranquillisers and antidepressant drugs such as Valium and Prozac have been converted into aerosol form and are added to some chemtrails to keep the masses easier to control.

It is being circulated among conspiracy theorists that Donald Rumsfeld once admitted that Prozac and Valium combined with other compounds would be sprayed over the American people. http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?action=printpage;topic=35964.0

The HAARP site is at http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/ and whilst it is claimed that it is all harmless research, conspiracy theorists and chemtrail believers do not accept this at all, and in fact there are many photos circulating and chemtrail videos, which show what are said to be cloud formations that have been created by HAARP. Some people have described this as "boiling the atmosphere."

Dr Nick Begich, the co-author with Jeane Manning of Angels Don't Play This HAARP - Advances in Tesla Technology, is a leading writer and speaker on the subject - http://www.earthpulse.com/src/category.asp?catid=13

Anyway, I knew about all that and also that it is believed by chemtrail believers that there is a blanket ban enforced on the mainstream media by its Illuminati masters, which prevents any news stories getting out about chemtrails and even preventing the use of the word. Being a writer for Tenerife News, I decided to see if I could do my part in getting an article published.

I succeeded in getting Contrails or chemtrails and freak weather included in the newspaper and Jeff Rense, David Icke and others soon picked up the story. I pointed out that whilst most people think that freak weather is being caused by climate change there is the possibility that it is being created as deliberate weather modification using chemtrails.

I quoted Dr Stephen McKay, who has become well respected amongst the chemtrail-believer community for speaking out as a scientist against the threat. Dr McKay was a member of the Yahoo group forum for chemtrail tracking usa - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/chemtrailtrackingusa/

I had also quoted Rosalind Peterson in my article. Rosalind runs http://www.californiaskywatch.com/ Her website asks "How do you like your skies ... Natural or man-made?"

And states: "We believe that no one, no government agency or private corporation, has the right to pollute our air or drinking water supplies, modify our weather, or impact the living environment around us - including the upper atmosphere."

Rosalind suggests that the use of the term "persistent contrail" is far preferable to chemtrail because the media and officials have been informed that chemtrails are a hoax and not to use the word. This means that if chemtrail-believers and activists want to get anywhere with their complaints and letters and calls to official authorities that they are more likely to get a response if they refrain from using the chemtrail word and use her description.

As a user of Myspace I was regularly blogging about the latest news on chemtrails and posting videos of chemtrails there. I had fully bought into the belief that the matter of chemtrails was such a danger to the world and was controlled by the evil elite who run everything that even the word was not being allowed in the media or for official sources to use.

Andre, who runs Outlaw News had said, and I agreed with him, that chemtrails were the most important issue of all and the most serious danger to life on Earth. This view is actually held by many chemtrail-believers who are sure that the elite are really trying to kill as many of us off as possible.

One topic that often crops up though, is how are the elite ensuring that they remain safe when they have to breathe the same poisoned air and eat foods from the same poisoned environment?

There are many sub-topics that get discussed under the main subject of chemtrails. Another is the new disease of Morgellons in which sufferers feel crawling sensations under their skin, which produces coloured fibres that emerge from it and cause intense suffering.

Wikipedia has this entry on the subject: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgellons

Due to the great danger considered to be the case from chemtrails many people are asking what can be done to combat the effects of the trails and to get rid of them. One of the main answers, which is now being marketed by various small companies is to use orgone energy, as proposed by the late Wilhelm Reich. Orgonise Africa is one supplier of orgonite devices and jewelry - http://www.orgoniseafrica.com/

Reich had invented what he called a "cloudbuster" but this has been adapted into what is now known as a "chembuster" and these can be bought for quite a lot of money or made up utilising epoxy resin, metal shavings, semiprecious stones, copper rods and a base to hold it all in. The idea is that pointed at the sky the chembuster will cause chemtrails to vanish.

Orgonite pendants are on sale as well, and these are believed to offer some protection from the poisons in the chemtrails. Freeman of the Freeman Perspective - http://thefreemanperspective.blogspot.com/ - has spoken about orgonite on one of his shows and said that he believes he has suffered illness due to chemtrails. Having a lot of respect for Freeman's views and the amount of work he has done I got myself an orgonite pendant.

Meanwhile in Tenerife I had seen sun halos on days that there were chemtrails in the sky. The halos were clearly being caused by the whitish haze that is made as the trails spread out and form artificial cloud cover. I had read that such halos were very rare and, indeed, I had never seen any in my entire life apart from in pictures.

I found Michael Irving's website - http://www.worldgathering.net/stop/information.html - that links chemtrails with prophesies by the Hopi and the Plains Indians, and as a sign of the ending of this system and the "Day of the Purification." Michael says on his site: "Crazy Horse (Tashunca-Uitco) saw a great darkness fall upon the people, followed by visions of great machines moving across the land and flying in the air to produce what some North American Plains Indians refer to as the Death Winds. Is it possible that the Death Winds and the Chemtrails are one and the same?"

With this sort of information in my thoughts I was really depressed when I went back home to Wales for a week in July 2007 to find that the skies of Cardiff were covered in chemtrails on a daily basis and that no one appeared to notice or care. People I spoke to including my father and personal friends seemed to think they were nothing more than "vapour trails."

I returned to Tenerife even more concerned about the danger of chemtrails, although I had a new mystery added to it all. I had been led to believe by fellow chemtrail-believers that the air was being poisoned and that the environment too was being filled with toxins, however, on my walks just outside Cardiff, but still under chemtrailed skies, I noted that vast amounts of lichens were growing on fences, tree trunks, rocks and walls, thriving in the very wet weather the UK had been experiencing. Something did not add up because I knew very well that lichens growing well are a sign of how pure the air is - the very reverse of what the chemtrail believers were telling me.

JazzRoc debunks chemtrails

Back in Tenerife I carried on corresponding with fellow chemtrail-believers and posting blogs and wrote a hubpage article on the subject. Now I have a friend who lives on the island called Tony Duncan but who posts on the Internet as JazzRoc and one day I was surprised to find that he had found my chemtrail blogs at Myspace and disagreed so much with them that he was calling me a "fool" and "deluded." He said that he was "going to fight me on this." And he did!

JazzRoc, who is a scientist and does know what he is talking about, started posting his opinions in the comments area at all chemtrail videos he could find online and very soon got a name as a "debunker" and a "paid disinformation agent." He was also being called a "CIA employee," a "shill,"and accused of "working for the government."

I knew this was madness from people who knew nothing about him at all and in fact the last job I knew he had was a community gardener - a far cry from CIA employee! JazzRoc was adamant that chemtrails didn't exist and that what we were calling such were no more than persistent contrails and were made up of water vapour. He also explained that the phenomenon has been caused by a vast increase in air traffic and that contrails like this were nothing new but had been recorded and photographed at other times in the last century.

There was no room for agreeing to disagree with him and at one point because I considered him to be very rude I blocked him from my contacts at Myspace. We also got into a heated argument at hubpages and by e-mail.

Meanwhile JazzRoc had become so infamous as a "professional debunker" that he managed to get himself banned from YouTube and was later to repeat this at the David Icke forums.

However, in the course of our argument he asked me if I realised that halos (of sun and moon) were caused by ice crystals, and also pointed out that dust and solid particles, which chemtrail-believers say are in the trails cannot create halos or rainbow effects of any type at all. Chemtrail-believers even have a new term "chembow" for colours being seen in the new artificial clouds made from the trails.

That was all it took to break the spell I was under. I knew that halos around the moon were made of ice crystals so it was obvious they were what caused the sun halos too. I knew also that solid particles cannot create halos or rainbow effects. On this island we get dust clouds from the Sahara that are known as calimas and whilst they make the sky really foggy looking they never ever have halos around the sun or moon.

I could see that somehow my belief system and association of sun halos with what I was calling chemtrails was wrong and that my belief had blinded me to logical reasoning. I had to apologise to JazzRoc and thank him for teaching me something that all my research had failed to do. I now knew that there were no threats from chemtrails because what we are seeing are contrails as the authorities have maintained all along.

I now could see that all that white in the trails and the hazy skies and around the sun when there are halos was nothing more than fantastic amounts of ice crystals. This is why the lichens were doing well in Wales - because the air was as I had thought very pure and not contaminated at all with barium, aluminium and all the other toxins and pathogens said to fall from the trails.

I announced in public that I was no longer a chemtrail-believer and directed people to JazzRoc's blog here, which is entitled "Contrails Facts and Chemtrail Fictions": http://jazzroc.wordpress.com/ and also to the excellent Contrail Science site where a scientific explanation is given for all the points raised by chemtrail-believers: http://contrailscience.com/

What happened next was as bizarre as JazzRoc being accused of working for the CIA because some of my chemtrail-believer friends suggested I had "had a breakdown," "had been got at," had "had a gun pointed at my head," had been "drugged," and even that I had been "hypnotised."

It appears that believers in the conspiracy do not want to hear any opinion that does not fit within their belief system and do not want any good news, which says that their fears are unfounded. It also appears that all the leading writers on conspiracy theories are either as blinded to what I have found to be the truth as I was, or, which is much more worrying, are knowingly presenting information that is not true.

© 2008 Steve Andrews

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    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 17 months ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thank you for commenting and confirming what I already know that there is no evidence but still the insane belief continues being spread! Yes, I know metabunk and have posted there but thanks for sharing here!

    • profile image

      Geo 17 months ago

      Wow, Bard, kudos to you for continuing to respond to people who obviously have chosen to not read any of the links you have provided that clearly answer every single question. These days, people must know that https://www.metabunk.org/ is a great resource to answer any questions people might need answering.

      What is amazing is that this article has been up for 7 years and people still seem to feel that in nearly a decade there is something going on yet STILL zero proof. I am a geologist who analyzed the surface water, ground water and soil of a Northern California city that on the internet is known as a "chemtrail" town among the believers. I was out there every morning at 6 am in my hip waders, I spent all day long on drill sites and UGST sites and I would climb all over the landscape dipping tubes in wells to analyze the ground water. I did this independently of the government and worked by contract with the city where I lived and my friends and family lived. I never ONCE found elevated levels of the supposed "chemtrail chemicals".

      Good job hanging in there for 7 years and counting. Keep it up, my friend!

    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 21 months ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      You are making the mistake of thinking contrails have to be short-lasting which they do not and this has been pointed out many times. The trails that are being seen and called chemtrails are simply persistent contrails!

    • profile image

      Are you blind? 21 months ago

      I don't need anyone to tell me what is going on.

      When I was young I was really observant, I would lay in the fields and watch the planes fly by. The trails would always disappear seconds after the plan,, NOW, the trails linger in the sky ALL DAY!

      We know what you are doing Bard, and it's not going to work.

      These next few years the world will awaken and your time will come.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 2 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      They are not spraying anywhere and there are no chemtrails!

    • profile image

      Sarah Jenkins 2 years ago

      The interview at this link is the best explanation of chemtrails I've seen; a means of hologram projection; the same technology that was used on a much smaller scale to create the illusion of airliners crashing into the WTC on 9/11. This site has a video of a recent hologram seen in China.

      http://www.stopsprayingcalifornia.com/SCALAR-Waves...

    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Geo engineering is NOT chemtrails and neither is cloud seeding. These terms are being used incorrectly by those pushing this belief system.

    • isaiahkimgoodwin profile image

      Kimberly Goodwin 4 years ago from Concord, NH

      I truly hope people research and think for themselves. Today is the worldwide chemtrail march. I am watching them spray right now and no way is this not true. Look at the space weapon billm it uses the word chemtrails,but correct word is geo engineering.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      In your opinion! In mine they are not spraying anything at all. I see contrails and cirrus cloud and you see chemtrails!

    • isaiahkimgoodwin profile image

      Kimberly Goodwin 4 years ago from Concord, NH

      Spraying the sky with tons of chemicals. Really?? Waste of time.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      What a waste of time that was. He didn't use the word chemtrails at all and neither did she and he was only talking about proposals that I am well aware of and that are NOT in use. This was an example of deceptive titles and wording being used as propaganda. I agreed with what Gore had to say, as it happens.

      PS They are not "spraying" anything!

    • isaiahkimgoodwin profile image

      Kimberly Goodwin 4 years ago from Concord, NH

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZFNJplylns Discovery Channel

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf0khstYDLA What in the World are they Spraying

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ViozGhdecg Some combined information about chemtrails.

    • isaiahkimgoodwin profile image

      Kimberly Goodwin 4 years ago from Concord, NH

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA1YZzI0wSs

      Here is the link to this video hearing him say it for himself. Ellen knows about chemtrails.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I am very surprised that Gore "admitted" this! What did he say? Some links to your sources would be helpful.

    • isaiahkimgoodwin profile image

      Kimberly Goodwin 4 years ago from Concord, NH

      I have also been studying Chemtrails for a long time, and I am surprised that you changed your mind. I have seen it in NASA and Military documents, and in actually a space weapon passed bill. I heard Al Gore admit it on the Ellen show, and was even against it. I am not a fan of him at all. I just have to watch them spray over my head everyday, and turn the cloud from blue to hazy and lined, and nothing would ever change my mind. Watching the film What in the World Are They Spraying and learning more about Haarp. I heard a conversation with military and NASA on the issue. Pilots are protesting against these planes that have caused many near misses, and one actually crashed a few years ago. A Fed Ex plane and Chemtrail plane had a near miss caught on film. I have seen the inside of Chemtrail planes. People are testing the rain water, hair samples, blood, and aluminium levels are so high. Looking up and watching 6 planes at once making x's all over the place I just can't see how it could be ignored or denied. I really hope people don't shut the door to it, because someone else did. I know with all my being they are real.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thanks for your comments! You make some very good points! I am glad to know that you can see how unreal all this chemtrail belief is too!

    • profile image

      moon batchelder 4 years ago

      glad to have found this....i'm sure that the gov't is capable of doing monstrous things...at least the US gov't...but try as i might it has been impossible to reconcile a programme in which poisons were distributed over everybody as having any benefit to the elite or anyone else.

      why would they?

      depopulation?! insufficient method this since one couldn't be selective about targeted population. the elite would also be poisoned ~ vaccines would work better...those who get vaxxed via programmes paid for by public taxes i.e. welfare, medical assistance vs those whose insurance premium covers it would ensure that only the very poor would be subjected to the poison.

      then there's the "in broad daylight" aspect of it all...in my experience, gov't tries to hide its evils a bit better.

      yes, there are indeed poisons that can be measured in our air and water. but these are present in places that are highly industrialised, so being 100 % certain whence the aluminum, strontium, et.al. is impossible since so many sources could be contaminating the samples.

      still many folk and friends of mine seem convinced of the phenomena of planes spreading toxins about willy-nilly, despite my best efforts to inspire in them just a couple of the many questions i pose as to the why of it all.

      i was beginning to think i was the only blind man in a world of those who see clearly a danger that eluded my ken.

      thanks

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I am waiting for my wages too! lol

    • profile image

      Darrow 4 years ago

      I don't need to tell you again why I came out of this whole "truth" movement except to say that this subject is the New TV Evangelism scam - and a very lucrative one for the people selling it. Just watch how these people react to basic questions and that should ring alarm bells all over the place. I'm also a fellow CIA, Mind Controlled, Shill, Agent etc for daring to ask questions but I'm still waiting for my Million Buck Check for services rendered!

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      It doesn't come from anywhere but in your mind and those people promoting this crazy belief system!

    • profile image

      admin 4 years ago

      use binoculars or whatever and watch the planes...it comes from the jet engines.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Yes, James, cloud seeding which has nothing to do with chemtrails at all!

    • James Peters profile image

      James Timothy Peters 4 years ago from Hammond, Indiana

      Sorry, but you have not convinced me.

      The USAF, as well as the Pentegon, have OPENLY admitted that they can manipulate the weather.

      Since the 1940's - they called it "cloud seeding".

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      This is nothing new and it is not a "current" programme at all but proposals and estimated costs - in other words not in practice! This is yet another example of why I am so tired of all this chemtrail nonsense!

    • antonrosa profile image

      antonrosa 5 years ago from USA

      Have you looked at this news article concerning the current chemtrail program? Let me know what you think. http://www.infowars.com/cost-of-chemtrail-program-...

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I personally don't think they exist but that there are very many contrails up there and that is all. What is attributed to them is due to other causes.

    • antonrosa profile image

      antonrosa 5 years ago from USA

      Chemtrails do exists and I see them every day in the U.S. They continue to persist each day and can be very overwhelming, especially when you have a family and each time you go outside you get either a runny nose or start sneezing because of a breakdown in the immune system. Thanks for getting the word out about these dangerous chemicals that we are breathing each and every day.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      What was the point of posting that? The entry in Wikipedia makes it clear that first of all it is volcanoes that are the main source and that otherwise it is no further than proposal stage!

    • profile image

      E.J. 5 years ago

    • Bard of Ely profile image
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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I don't think we should either!

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      E.J. 5 years ago

      Weather Modification is localised for sure. It's geoengineering in it's infancy, yet it's been going on officially since 1961 (and earlier). Why not make it rain in Africa? I'm not opposed to the idea of this, but I don't think we should eff with nature.

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      My thoughts on weather modification are that any such efforts are minimal and localised! Also, nothing new because cloud seeding has been used for many years. Most geo-engineering ideas are at the proposal stage.

    • profile image

      E.J. 5 years ago

      Hi, I've been watching the sky for years. I call "them" persistant contrails and some days it's worse than others. I watch the jets fly back and forth, and as Estee mentioned make Uturns in the sky. They create such cloud cover that it usually rains. I don't care what's in contrails, but I care that it's messing up my blue sky. We need viteman D from the sun and over the past 4 years I've not gotten enough. I blame persistant contrails. Also, the lack of viteman D weakens one's immunity. Contrails are the cause of mild summers and mild winters which is also bad for colds and flu. I don't believe it's intended to kill people, but I can't help but still suspect there is a large scale weather modification that they're working on. What are your thoughts on Geo-engineering?

    • Bard of Ely profile image
      Author

      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Kay, it is simple, I am heartily sick of the subject which as far as I can tell is about something as real as Santa Claus! It has become like an albatross around my neck that I was ever involved in believing in this! I will ask you some very simple questions: if chemtrails are part of a depopulation agenda don't you think it has failed miserably? Secondly, if this is real and the air is being poisoned, don't you think the so-called Illuminati and their families get poisoned too? When I was in Wales in the year I abandoned this belief I found the air to be even cleaner than usual so that lichens were doing well under heavily-trailed skies. I'd trust nature over people any day! And finally, do you really think that all airport staff and pilots are controlled in some worldwide conspiracy?

    • Kay Irgens profile image

      Kay Irgens 5 years ago from Nesoddtangen, Akershus, Norway

      Please forgive me my rudeness. It is not badly intended, so take my apology. I can see how that line was out of touch. I don't for a second believe that you are less intelligent than me. I just thought that you might have gone far into the dark side of this phenomenon’s spin off. I 'm well aware of all the gruesome ideas people are presenting in relation to chemtrails. But I usually also find the debunkers work to be quite useless as well. Whilst they are dismissing the accusations from chemtrail believers, they usually do so from a very little well documented standpoint. I find that they often dismiss it without any real evidence proving they are right neither. I'm actually horrified that anybody can take the pages you referred to, as a valid resource in debunking the chemtrail believers. Not ONE debunking accusation is verifiable on that site. It is like the presentations are being presented as facts, and not as any serious attempt to really prove that chemtrails don't exist. I can't really see that you have pointed out any proof of your claim that there are no chemtrails. The sites you refer to have the same problem in my view, although I must admit I’m still reading up on JazzRocs page. He just seems to lay down a lot of facts that doesn’t really concern the issue with chemtrails. The knowledge he put forth is both interesting and makes the topic more intricate, but I have still not found ONE, not ONE piece of evidence. The bottom line is that he presents a lot of aviation related facts, and dismisses the chemtrail issue, without any direct dissection of the chemtrail theories. If one should be taken seriously just because one are disagreeing with obvious unbalanced people like David Icke and other fear mongers, then this discussion is a waste. It is sad that you choose to dismiss my answer to you based on me calling you limited. Well first of all, so am I as well. I am limited, but I do my best with what I have. I have said I’m sorry, and I mean it. If you are a grown up, we can now get back into a serious discussion about the issue. There are people admitting the chemtrails existence in all departments, aviation, weather forecasters, military personnel, and it is growing. Thank you for the pages, but unfortunately it is in my view, not any better than the pages pointing in the direction of chemtrails being a real phenomenon. I hope you are right, that it is a grand illusion and that we don’t have nothing to worry about, but please present something really convincing, if you want to help others to dismiss the idea, it has to hold water, and this just doesn’t do it. If it does it for you, than that is fine, and if you don’t want any serious discussion on the topic, you shouldn’t go public with it in the first place, you know that don’t you? If you continue to disregard all my sane questions here, due to a line that I have already excused, then I take it that you are not really interested in a serious discussion, and just are happy that you have a concern less in your life. If it is so I respect that, and I will leave you in peace. But I thought that you were actually concerned, and would be interested in bringing forth those convincing articles. I don’t think you have brought any new evidence. Yes birds are flying again, and many things seem to be going on that are good, and life is still thriving on earth, but the planes was in the air two days ago and there is serious disturbed air traffic going on, and quite a few of them are spraying something, that has never been a contrail. You might believe what you want, but don’t expect others to buy into weak argumentation. It seems to me that you really are arguing that those presenting depopulation, lizards and all kinds of weird and bizarre ideas, are wrong. And I mostly think so too. I’m actually deeply concerned that so many of you buy into all this crap. I don’t say there aren’t any evil people or hidden agendas. I don’t even say there isn’t any UFO’s or other weird stuff. I just don’t get it that people like you and JazzRoc, makes such a big issue out of that. The only real issue here should be “WHAT COMES OUT OF THE PLANES, AND WHY. In all the material you present, I find a rather childish and weak debunking of the phenomenon, but excess ridiculing of chemtrail believers (not from you though). Please forgive me that you don’t convince me, and that I was a bit rude. I’m not English so sometimes my meaning gets lost in translation. I would love to see this issue resolved. I will continue to scrutinize the mentioned sites for viable evidence, but there are unfortunately more convincing stuff coming from other channels every week. If you want to help clarify the issue for people further, please pick up the stick. If not, don’t blame it on my rudeness please. Best wishes Kay

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      You are very rude saying this: "You got to be seriously limited if your world view depends on extreme peoples views, and their presentations."

      I have gone to great lengths to explain why I have changed my views and also pointed people in the direction of a site that explains it all at contrailscience. There are no chemtrails, there is no mystery apart from why are millions of people believing this?

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      Kay Irgens 5 years ago

      Although well written, seemingly honest, and well meant, I find some serious flaws within your conclusions here. Let me first say that I both respect and appreciate what you are doing here. We need an open and constructive debate on this, as with everything else concerning our global community. First of all. I don't take any considerations to any claims from the so-called conspiracy theorists. They are all insanely scary and distorting in my view. I don't say that they are wrong, I have no proof either, but they are seriously in lack of verifiable proof.

      At the same time I find your conclusion here to be insanely naive. I just can't grasp how someone with so much insight into all the chemtrail conspiracy suddenly would discharge any skepticism realizing the fact that water/ice crystals make halos. And that is it? You suddenly debunk an enormous amount of evidence because of that? I'm wondering if you are actually a real person. You can't be that easy to turn around? Do you expect others to take this as a viable proof of nothing going on??? I have sane friends and acquaintances who have taken photos from nearby military airports where they have exposed how NATO planes and drones, takes off, sprays, and lands again, on the same airport. Where is the report from trustworthy scientific institutions, on the change of air traffic, and sudden drop of temperatures in low altitudes? I had a big plane flying over my house a few days ago, where I could almost read the logo and spot the color scheme on, and there was a thick line of trails from it. You got to be seriously limited if your world view depends on extreme peoples views, and their presentations. I do understand that these people scare you with their fear mongering, and I don't agree with their agenda, although I don't dismiss their claims. However, I need to see real proof for every stand I'm going to take. Real proof to me is what I can see with my bare eyes, and feel with my body’s sensory system. Intellectually I'm really hard to please. There is no absolute fact or proof, but what is carried forth should point in a viable direction. Well, here we are. The public institutions are not even aware of the issue with chemtrail, other anti new world order communities will serve us any fact to go with it, and corporate powers are obviously taking the full focus for most people. I see the planes and what they do, as does millions of others, and it has NEVER been seen before, except for a few times during very special conditions, which now occurs 24/7 all over nato...? I see friends and others pictures of the ongoing activity, and you... You suddenly changed to tell me nothing is going on, because it is all ice crystals. You want to be taken seriously because you have believed in all the accusations of the so-called conspiracy theorists? I don't think that gives you any credit really. It shows me that you are easily persuaded in any direction. I’m sorry for being such a rant here. I have no disrespect for you as a fellow human being at all, but I want the truth, and it is yet not revealed in my world.

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      aml 5 years ago

      So, has anyone personally tested the rain/snow for these chemicals???

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thank you for sharing your experience of something that JazzRoc and Contrail Science had stated that these trails are nothing new!

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      Paulo (formerly known as nomorebsplease) 5 years ago

      Hi Bard, it's been a while since I visited your hub and I can see you have been on the receiving end of some nasty accusations from some people lately. It's sad that they have to resort to such tactics instead debating in a civilized and educated manner. Nonetheless, I can also see you have 'thick skin', and therefore they can't get to you, whatever they say. I commend you for your patience and eloquence.

      Anyway, you will be glad to know that I have changed my views slightly, and even though I never really considered myself a 'chemtrailer' but more of a truth seeker, I may now be veering towards believing that there may be nothing going on (as you've been saying for so long). I guess I'm still sitting on the fence for now, but at least I've turned to the other side, if you know what I mean! You may be asking yourself 'what made him change his views?' Well, it's a long story but I'll try to be quick.

      You see, I'm an absolute lover of 70's movies and music (you know, funk, jazz, soul, and films like Bullitt, The Mechanic, The Thomas Crown Affair, Bladerunner, etc). Having collected them throughout the years I'm constantly revisiting them and I always seem to find something new in them! And lately I've been noticing images of persistent contrails in some of these films! A good example is The Thomas Crown Affair (1968) where the main character, Steve McQueen is seen escaping in a jet leaving a massive persistent contrail behind. I guess it doesn't really prove anything either way, but at least it made me realise that persistent contrails did already exist in the seventies, even though I hadn't seen them myself back then. And that was one of my main arguments for my suspission. Anyway, I just wanted to make it official by posting on your hub again (I hate unfinished business!) and I'm not affraid to admit when I'm wrong either.

      So thank you for your devotion and patience once again.

      Be well,

      Paulo

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Hello Lynn! I am sorry to read that you are one of many very people who believes all this crap and that you even think I have been paid! You really haven't a clue! You see I have become so far away from your unproven conspiracy theories and bored with listening that I am not sure what to say! However, there is NO "spraying" being done and I recommend you have a look at contrailscience.com.

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      Lynn 5 years ago

      Well, after reading this "debunk" article and all the comments it is readily apparent to me who is telling the truth, who government shills are, and who the willfully ignorant ostriches are. "...according to the prince of the power of the AIR, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, among whom also we all (who now believe the truth) once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and the MIND, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others." Eph 2:2,3

      "For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the ruler of the darkness of this age, against the spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places." Eph 6:10

      To believe that the government is poisoning us with sodium flouride (rat poison/toxic industrial waste), aspartame (deadly neurotoxin), high fructose corn syrup and gmos (cancer causing), pharamceutical drugs that kill over 200,000 Americans annually, msg, mercury in vaccines, false flag slaughter of innocents (911), etc. and then to make a pronounced POINT of denying the obvious: PERSISTENT AEROSOL SPRAYING that did NOT happen 20 years ago or before, is absolutely ludicrous......unless that is one has an agenda to support or perhaps, one has been bribed with a cash sum so that they can "live their life" and not "worry about chemtrails." Really sad and pathetic. I would rather die then sell my soul for a lie!

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I certainly can maintain my belief that there are no chemtrails but simply contrails and cirrus cloud.

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      Jane E 5 years ago

      Bard, this has been a fun time, but please, after 3 years or so, the suspense is killing us. Either you are a genius troll who is a better writer than the current best-seller in the NY Times because you have developed and maintained the same ridiculous story line for quite some time. I'm just hoping that the small chance that you actually believe what you write is not the case. No one can really be that ignorant and naive in real life, can they?

      Of course chemtrails are real and they are not "ice crystals from "increased" air traffic."

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Well in my opinion it couldn't have come from chemtrails because they don't exist! What is this documentary you are on about? Sources please!

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      Larry Flinchpaugh 5 years ago

      One documentary I watched showed that the soil PH had changed drastically and many trees that had died in the Western states had high concentration of aluminum under the bark. Where else could this have come form if were not from chem trails?

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I'm not doing that as a lot of work went into it and it stands as a record of my involvement in the subject and feelings on it all! Besides you probably want it gone so it doesn't stand out on the Internet as a detailed explanation of why some of us do not believe in chemtrails and might even get a few people to see that there are none! !

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      Estee M. 5 years ago

      My suggestion to you Bard of Ely would be to close all comments to this thread..or delete the whole topic. Save yourself and others some aggravation. LOL.. best of the season to you and wishing you nothing but clear blue skies. (wait and wish)...

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      If you actually read when I posted this and why it explains in great detail how I used to believe in chemtrails and waste my time posting about them but how it was explained to me that I was wrong and looking at the logic I was presented with I could see that to be true. I really didn't expect an ongoing barrage of posts from chemtrail-believers like yourself years later. I was wrong about that too! I don't know what is wrong with you all but it's like a religious fundamentalist belief system as far as I can see. It is usually impossible to get a religious person to change their belief no matter how bizarre it is and many religious people seek to convert others. They are even told to by the scriptures of their religions and cults. You chemtrailers are the same - you repeatedly post comments, post videos, send emails etc and do this even when people say they are not interested and don't believe what you are saying! They also do not read or acknowledge information that counters the belief. You have shown how you haven't actually read this. I said last night at Facebook that I think the billions of people who know nothing about the chemtrail conspiracy are lucky because I am one of the unlucky ones who investigated it many years ago, believed in it, found out I was wrong, said so and have never heard the last of it!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      It is interesting how you mention you have a life to live and cant be bothered with chemtrails yet you are the one who very much made a point of starting this topic. You wrote the piece, afterall.

      I also work with Clifford who is testing fall-out for us without any payment. He is donating his time and service so we can help bring hard fact to the public. We back up his claims with a 3rd party certified lab.

      One must be careful to not question tyranny so long that before they know it tyranny is sitting in their living room. If you dont question the peculiar then it will run over you. When you see fall-out drifting from aerosol and landing all over your lawn and trees, you might think differently about just turning a blind eye and putting your faith in "the system". or whatever else it is you refuse to question.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      If I see the entire chemtrail belief as nothing more than a belief then surely all those who have created believers have conned them into this if it is untrue! The arguments against it being true far far outweigh any so-called evidence for chemtrails and the proponents for it are about as believable as David Icke or Alex Jones or any of the other conspiracy theorists! There are plenty more and ufologists too with more material and claims but little in the way of proof! With conspiracy theory and chemtrails it is deliberately alarmist material with no real evidence. You brought Carnicom into this and OK, you wanted me to say what I think so I did. The answer is I hold his work to have no importance whatsoever but rather find it to have caused a big disservice to many people who have a limited understanding of scientific matters and have accepted what he says. There are many more urgent matters that are definitely real and people would be much better off concentrating their efforts on them not on this. Another reason I get fed up is I have a life to lead, work to do and haven't got the time to spend on this, especially when there is nothing there to begin with to be concerned about - just ice in the sky and too many planes!

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      Estee M. 5 years ago

      You didn't really answer my question Bard of Ely.. when you refer to someone as a con man publicly you should be ready to back it up with evidence in the same way I back up what I see with my photography and the evidence I gather daily here on the westcoast. I call your responses "glossing".. just my own intuition. Thanks for the input.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Seeing as Clifford Carnicom is one of the main people behind this it is obvious he is conning people because there is no truth in the beliefs that form the main chemtrail conspiracy ideas. The whole chemtrail conspiracy is a con! The trails that get called chemtrails are contrails, the cloud cover they produce is cirrus, the stuff the trails and cloud is made of is ice crystals, aluminium is all over the planet anyway, etc etc. What you call a black light experiment I have seen years ago in the late 60s when they had violet light strips at discos that made anything white glow and that included any bits of dust all over your clothes that looked like they were covered in dandruff or something. I presume this is the same effect. And like I say the air is filled with normally invisible particles including pollen, soot, dust, micro-organisms etc. Some one is making money selling the Mini Jeweler Loupe Light are they not? They must be mass produced so if chemtrail believers will buy them there's a ready market! Oh yes, and people like myself, JazzRoc and all the billions of people who do not believe in chemtrails or even know anything about them are not in any way harmed by them. As a plan to make the masses ill or to cull them it has failed miserably!

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      Estee M. 5 years ago

      Thanks for the response Bard of Ely..I'm fairly certain this gentleman is not going to make a fortune on an item that sells for $2.00 on EBAY and it's not even his merchandise..as for the black light experiment.. try it and then comment. Do you have any valid evidence that Clifford Carnicom is a con man?

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Estee, now you bring the real reason behind these chemtrail conspiracy fear campaigns to light: stuff that people can sell to a gullible public. In this case a Mini Jeweler Loupe LED Light 60X Magnifier. Yes, the air is full of particles we don't normally see. It is dust, pollen, soot etc.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Estee, I believe Carnicom is a conman and one of the main people behind this nonsense. Rosalind Peterson I know and have corresponded with when I used to believe in all this stuff three years ago. The rest of the points you have made are all old 'evidence' too! Another reason it gets very boring: you chemtrailers keep rehashing the same ground but none of it provides scientific evidence.

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      Estee M. 5 years ago

      ..a member of Estee's Skywatch in Victoria, B.C. on Facebook has purchased a Mini Jeweler Loupe LED Light 60X Magnifier Microscope as it turns out for him a very valuable resource.This is what he says about it.."Everything that is sprayed into the sky eventually ends up on the ground. This little tool allows you to see it once it gets there. I could describe what I found in my house, but even the most hard core truther would have a hard time believing me. You kind of have to see it for yourself. I would call it the single largest dose of reality that I've ever experienced"..

      I personally have done the black light test.. go outside and then come in and stand under the light. You will be horrified..we are covered in this crap they are spraying on us. My hair was loaded and it showed webs hanging from my clothing. Estee

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      Estee, well done, and many mentions of sources we are working with at Chemtrails Project. We are looking for good info mining for an upcoming project, if your interested. It's a whole need approach, which I can explain to you separately if your interested (jjnotes01@gmail.com).

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      Estee M. 5 years ago

      Am I to understand then that you place no importance on Clifford Carnicom's latest findings? ..a reputable scientist and also Rosalind Peterson? www.californiaskywatch.com http://www.carnicominstitute.org/articles/bio2011-... Also you mention in your above post that no authority on the weather is aware..there are lots out there.. Scott Stevens was television weatherman at an NBC affiliate in the Pacific North West. He studied scalar weapons signatures within the clouds to better his forecasting record. He also maintains that weather is controlled...he became disgusted with "weather lying" and left the field.

      http://www.holmestead.ca/chemtrails/weather.html

      Aviation expert? how about Mark McCandish?..an aerospace illustrator who has worked for many of the top aerospace corporations in the United States ..http://youtu.be/qF1dRiqrR1Y Weather modidication is also a big money making racket for B.C. Hydro.. many articles out there on that subject...http://lailayuile.com/2011/07/28/why-did-the-bc-go... Evergreen Aviation talk openly about their impact as well. http://www.activistpost.com/2011/01/evergreen-avia...

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Well of course I don't have the air traffic routes or times but I can ask you how you are so sure that there was no air traffic when a lot of it cannot be seen anyway? The trails in your video just look like contrails and if I had seen them, like most people, I would have paid no attention at all! This is why I get fed up of the subject because there are loads of videos and photos being posted all the time like yours that show what appear to be normal contrails but the chemtrail-believers call them chemtrails. OK, fair enough, if the chemtrails look identical to ordinary contrails there could be a problem because we wouldn't know but why is it then that no reputable scientists or other authorities that deal with aviation or the weather are aware of these trails? In all these years we have none!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      Bard, it literally isn't possible in regards to flight patterns. LAX doesn't have routes of that consistency over Ventura County. There is no flight pattern from my area near the coast which would require East-bound access. Where I am located, that is only for international flights and that means 100 miles North or South from my location.

      On top of that; no air travel for days and then all of the sudden over 10 planes, all flying patterns East and South within minutes of each other and almost overlapping in terms of course?

      This requires not only studying air travel in the area to tell you it's not possible but also commonsense. There is no possible way for this to be "explained away" as contrails.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I just looked at your video which plainly shows contrails! If you wish to believe otherwise that is up to you! It is totally normal contrails shown.

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      I just wish you guys wouldn't abandon your intuitive "all knowing", and at least acknowledge that what you are seeing, well it "just isn't right". You cannot explain away what we see with existing flight patterns, it's impossible, I've tried. Here is an example, from my driveway: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJqpCkdj8xs

      From this experience I "know" 2 things:

      1) What Im seeing isn't normal and isn't from my experience base in the past

      2) Where I live it is IMPOSSIBLE in regards to flight patterns. Let me stress this point, it just isn't feasible, let alone practical or possible

      I know that you badly dont want to believe, and that is your path, but dont shut yourself out to the possibility. No "debunker" could ever convince me that the video I took in my driveway that morning is "normal". I use the best tools I have; my eyes and my intuition.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thanks, Fen! Some of them can get quite nasty and like I say I recently deleted one guy at Facebook who was calling me an "idiot"!

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      fen lander 5 years ago from Whitstable

      Wow! I'm overawed at the amount of feeling expressed by many of your commentors, Bard. It's as though you've said something..... heretical to the 'believers.' Now you know how Copernicus felt..... marvellous stuff!

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thank you for your very complimentary feedback, yosoysam!

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      yosoysam 5 years ago

      I had been meaning to research "chemtrails" for a while, as the amount of people linking videos on facebook was intriguing me.

      When both sides of an argument are written with everyone else able to see and comment and share links it is very easy to gain all the information you require to make your own decision.

      I am not a scientist or an engineer, nor am i particularly bright or well educated.

      I have made my own decision on "chemtrails".

      I enjoyed the high level chat on things i have never heard of and and greatly respect the time, dedication and research that has been posted in the search for knowledge.

      I wish i had been this keen to learn when i was at school.

      The very basic fact of the matter to me, is that it's logistically impossible.

      What was far more interesting to me was the social commentary been played out between the 2 hubs, this and the original one 'Are chemtrails real and con trails a con?'.

      I warmly commend you Bard of Ely. You came storming out of the blocks with a well researched and well written hub on something you had made your mind up to be true.

      After a venomous and insulting counter attack from Jazzroc you accepted your idea was wrong and praised and thanked him for telling you so. With the newly found knowledge you have proceeded to help enlighten other people with the real 'truth'.

      If everyone in politics behaved in the same way I truly believe the world would be a better place.

      I have to admit i was at first offended by Jazzrocs' harsh condesending attacks but by the end of both blogs i understood why he got so mad!

      I would liken it to a doctor who keeps getting patients coming in with a cold, or a taxi driver who keeps getting told the quickest route. Eventually they just want to tell you to get out. I never want to hear about chemtrails again.

      My hat goes off to you both and i would have liked to have joined you for a beer when you first met.

      As to all those who still believe in chemtrails despite all the information available to the contary, I have no impressive link to an answer. I would merely suggest that you have too much time on your hands.

      Best Hub i have read, well done to all.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      People use intuition to pick winning numbers and enter competitions. The vast majority are wrong and fail to win!

      Actually something is wrong, very wrong, and we all agree on that! The environment is very badly polluted!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      Please tell your sources who believe I am "dumb" and "ridiculous" that we are now including the testing of rain water from each region.

      That is impossible to explain away. I will let you know how those results come back.

      Here is what I was wondering, human to human - do you like to follow your intuition or your mind? Just curious. B/C it sounds like you followed your truth, your intuition before, and you "just knew" that something was wrong. Then "scientists" who work from mind, have convinced you it is a crazy idea.

      I "know" that something is wrong, I personally got heavy metals poisoning. I also "know" that what has been happening in our world over the last decade seems to be escalating to some end-game that I dont want to sit back and explain away. I want to look under every rock, and ask my intuition, my truth, my consciousness, if what I am seeing is right.

      "Intuition will tell the thinking mind where to look next."

      -Jonas Salk

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Also Tony sent me this link so please have a look at it: http://www.landfood.ubc.ca/soil200/components/mine...

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Here is an answer from Tony Duncan aka JazzRoc that makes good sense to me, especially because as already stated, I know that aluminium is in clay so would expect to find it:

      "Some of their samples are soil, others are water.

      Soils can be clay. Such soils can be 300,000 parts per million aluminum. Clay isn't poisonous. People have mud baths in it.

      Your starting figures are ridiculous. Where did you get them from?

      No distinction is being made between soluble and insoluble aluminum compounds. The same for barium. Soluble salts are dangerous, insoluble ones are not.

      Your figures would hold NORMAL SOILS to be poisonous, which is ridiculous.

      You are claiming YOUR errors to be those of other people.

      Soluble aluminum compounds in soils, if that is indeed what you have found (for you don't know) have a reason to be there.

      The reason is the sulfur in fuel oil, which when burnt, forms sulfur dioxide gas and then acid rain in the environment.

      The acid rain leaches out the insoluble aluminum in clay to form aluminum sulfate, which is soluble, and harmful to plant growth.

      The acid rain is the reality here. Are you going to do something about it? I thought not."

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      I can see that no matter the testing I show you, you are certain they dont exist. Of course that is fine, I just hope that you dont close off the possibility altogether, in case some day it comes full circle. It is better to have the knowledge of the possibility so you are least mentally prepared, as opposed to saying that it just cant be. Anything "can be", all is possible, so stay open minded, my friend! And with that, I wish you the best!

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Well, I would have thought you could get aluminium in you from a wide range of sources including deodorants even, so I don't see how what you claim proves it came from the air. I don't doubt there are heavy metals in the air. The world is a very polluted place - earth, air and water all contain toxic substances in many places. That just proves that not enough is done to prevent this and that companies and people are irresponsible. It doesn't prove that chemtrails exist at all! I was on a plane a couple of weeks back coming back from the UK to Tenerife and I could see a couple of contrails more or less parallel to the plane. I was thinking if there any chemtrail-believers on board they would be alarmed by this and yet all the passengers and the crew thought nothing of it at all, which was to be expected because they were simply contrails we could see!

      You say: "It's really quite obvious now, with all of the tests coming in." but I would say it isn't obvious at all! What tests?

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      I had my urine tested (I live in the region that tested at 10,500ppm for aluminum) and found it was more than 4X over the "safe limit".

      I tested myself b/c I had never thought of chemtrails until I got sick and then it was identified as "heavy metals poisoning". Then I researched where heavy metals are most likely to show up in your urine and its from the air. Heavy metals in the air? Right, then the path lead to chemtrails. It's really quite obvious now, with all of the tests coming in. It is so excessive at this point that it it WILL be a major health factor down the line. No doubt, no way around it. I think your scientist friends will agree that constant elevated levels of heavy metals in the air (no matter how they got there) will weaken immune systems and put too much stress on the liver.

      Let's just hope that all of that wildlife is still around in 10 years, I certainly do, and it is reasons like that why I want to help end this.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I have no interest in the subject which for me is about something that doesn't exist but I will pass your reply on to my scientist friends and maybe they will want to comment! If the world is being poisoned with aluminium and barium why don't I see any evidence for it? I am a naturalist and certainly in Wales where the skies are covered in trails all wildlife was doing fine and the people too!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      I had a feeling that might come up (the comments about it being isolated).

      So please go to our website and see the map, at the bottom of the home page, and you can see the other 13 spots so far around the country. They are all excessive except for one. So either we are getting poisoned from the sky, or by some other unified method. Otherwise what could the possible explanation be for country wide extremely dangerous levels of aluminum and barium? And very specifically; aluminum and barium!

      www.chemtrailsproject.com

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      JJ, I have just had these two replies regarding what you posted:

      Really, Bard. For all you or he knows, someone dissolved an aluminum pot exactly where he took the sample.

      The only way to check is to take an equispaced group of samples over a wide area about the point (1/4 - 1/2 mile), with the utmost of scientific consistency. You'll then find that particular point alone is unusual, or similar. If otherwise get back to me.

      Also check if he's in a metal ore mining area. The KSW whatever "rainwater" scam video was made smack-dab in the middle of the US barium mining area.

      Tony

      Hi Steve

      A lab result showing high aluminium levels in soils is I suppose worrying, it is not however evidence to support the chemtrails or being 'poisoned from the sky' - that's a HUGE leap, more likely a contaminated water source, or a contaminated sample.

      Moreover if it came from the sky further samples from around the world, where ever chemtrails/contrails are observed would produce the same result. A soil sample from some guy's front yard, near a tree proves absolutely nothing and its irresponsible (not to mention STUPID) to draw a conclusion from a single sample.

      Regards

      David Parkes

      Nuclear Internet - A fusion of great ideas

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thanks for that! I will pass the info on to some scientist friends and see what they make of it!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      Location: Ventura County, Southern California (however, this is just one of over 10 tests we have conducted across the country already and all are a min. of 4000ppm for aluminum)

      Lab: Summit Environmental Technologies, Inc (Cleveland, OH)

      Sample: 3 inches of top soil, nothing grown in the soil, no fertilizer or other growth agents. Just from my front yard near a tree.

      Results:

      Aluminum: 10,500 mg/Kg, method #6010

      Barium: 250 mg/Kg, method #6010

      Ph: 6.81@20.8 , method SW-846

      And I apologize, I didn't mean to call you absurd, just the notion that this is normal is absurd. We are being poisoned from the skies, it is raining down on us and is leading to these incredibility high heavy metal readings.

      Everyone is always entitled to their own opinions but please dont let a belief get in the way of seeing this for what it is. There is no possible way that these levels of heavy metals in our soil can be justified.

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Please give more accurate details like location, where the analysis was done and who by and using what method!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      Honestly, that is absurd. SOME aluminum is expected, but 10X over the "high" level? Seriously?

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      Steve Andrews 5 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      I would expect aluminium to be in any analysis of the soil as it is a constituent of clay and one of the most widely distributed minerals on the planet!

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      JJNotes 5 years ago

      I will let this speak for itself:

      HIGH Aluminum level in soil = 800-1000ppm

      EXCESSIVE Aluminum level in soil = over 1600ppm

      I just tested the soil outside my house in a 3rd party lab:

      Aluminum level = 10,500ppm

      Im not kidding, Im not preaching, Im stating fact. If you want to see the 3rd party lab report then give me your email address and I will send it to you. Dont close your eyes completely, look at some fresh data that is coming in.

      BTW, the Barium in my soil was 250ppm (generally 30-60ppm is considered acceptable).

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Not evasive at all! The title of that video called them "Chemtrail planes" and that being the first thing anyone viewing it sees is a very important factor. If I remember correctly the site that video is on has been guilty in the past of circulating a video supposedly showing spraying tanks on board a tanker when they were not what it was being falsely claimed so it is a deceitful site as has been pointed out by JazzRoc. Why should anyone pay any attention to its content after knowing that? The whole chemtrail conspiracy is deceitful because there are no such trails to begin with! You say you are not a chemtrail-believer and yet you argue trying to convince me of their existence. Surely this shows you believe in them? If not you are wasting my time and yours posting about something you do not have a belief in!

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      nomorebsplease!!!! 6 years ago

      Ha Ha! One can always be sure to get an evasive answer from you! Can you not see past the word chemtrail? Of course you can, but you just use it as an excuse to dismiss anything worthwhile that I and others try to show you. And who said anything about chemtrail planes anyway? The video is about certain planes which are being allowed to fly without their transponders on - if that's not a reason for concern I don't know what is...

      Your evasive methods are transparent and you know what? It really doesn't do you any favours. Right from the start I noticed your obvious way of dismissing relevant info from your readers by just concentrating on the word 'chemtrail'. You have never answered my (and other people's) questions properly by always finding something irrelevant and futile to pick on. But for the sake of all the other readers, I politely carried on trying anyway because I felt there was a need for someone to counteract the amount of BS you come up with (nomorebsplease, get it?) . Denial or deceit? I don't care to know which as they are both as bad as each other. And for the last time, I have never been a 'chemtrail believer'. Why would I have ever landed on your page if I was one? In fact I find them as repugnant as 'chemtrail non-believers'. Both groups are stuck in a stubborn paradox that doesn't allow them to learn and evolve. They are both playing into the hands of the ones who wish to keep us divided and conquered. They are only able to steal your free thinking if you let them. The choice is yours!

      Whatever you do, have a great life!

      Peace,

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      This is typical of the misleading nonsense being posted by chemtrail-believers! If chemtrails do not exist, and I see no evidence that they do, then "Chemtrail planes" cannot as well and so the title of this video makes no sense. The only mystery is why are so many people wasting my time and theirs on this?

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      nomorebsplease 6 years ago

      Hi Bard,

      I'm back to post a link for a youtube video that I'm sure I posted before, but it has been removed by youtube (I wonder why?). Anyway, you never cared to comment the first time, so here it is again

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yYaqGkBcoQ&ann...

      Even if there is nothing going on how can anyone possibly explain this? Tankers being allowed to fly at civilian altitudes without their transponders on? Isn't that the airplane's means of communication with the control towers? Isn't that at least slightly suspicious?

      Just wondering what you think...

      Peace

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      Ultimate Truth 6 years ago

      The whole known universe exists, without our permisssion. Life exists, without our permission, laws, statutes, money, or legal frameworks, and or agreements.

      Man appears to be turning against man! We cannot seem to agree. We are not in a human-race, as there would have to be rules to that concept, particularly a finish line. There is already a fight going on.

      To our basic senses, none of us is immortal. We know, with what senses we have, that we all will die somehow. Most healthy people, enjoying life with a purpose, do not want to die.

      Have we a soul? An eternal spirit? Have we a creator? God I hope so! Jesus, of the Bible said so and left clear instructions for us to follow. I know I had no choice to be born - did you? I could end my life now if I wanted to. What stops me?

      Chemtrails, contrials, exhausts, poo, wee, water...what difference does it make if our life is lived as if enslaved by a constant battle with our fellow human beings?

      If I could land and stick a Welsh flag on the sun, would that mean the sun belongs to Wales? Could I limit it's supply of light/energy that provides a vital help to outr earthly life systems?

      It's simple. Love God with all your heart, mind, soul and divinity, and love your neighbour as yourself. We all have to pass away, and then all this folly will be self evident - but nobody will be left to witness it.

      Amen, thankyou Jesus, half tidy, at Cardiff Arms Park wityh a pint of Brains Daaaaaaark!

      Peace and Love SHALOM

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      There is nothing to see apart from contrails and cloud!

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      Have You Seen the Map? 6 years ago

      It says it all - trolls - visit the map to see...

      Peace

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Hi Janet! Yes, funnily enough I have been through a period in which a flu bug was going about and whilst everyone else thought it was the time of the year I thought "chemtrails." Same goes for bad weather and that was the case when I wrote that article for Tenerife News. What I don't understand is why so many authors, speakers and radio presenters like Alex Jones for example are all saying chemtrails are real. They can't all believe this surely? If they are knowingly lying they are as bad as the people they blame and seek to expose! That's a conspiracy in itself!

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      Martian Kat 6 years ago

      There are a just a handful of us! It takes some real courage to "go public", but I believe the tide is turning. My primary motivation for going public was I felt very bad about my part in helping spread the chemtrail conspiracy theory. I can't go back in time and change that, and now that I've given it more thought I honestly I wouldn't go back in time and change that even if I could. What I have learned from the "waking up" experience and then "waking up again" is so interesting! I'm just scratching the surface of my own humanity, human nature, and it is fascinating. But I am still motivated by the obligation I feel to set the record straight, and guess what! I have one convert, that I know of anyway. He believed in the chemtrail CT for seven years, is now actively debunking, so that's great.

      I'm also ticked off at the "gatekeepers" who keep spreading this (and others), and if they are doing it knowing it's a lie (and I know some of them don't believe a word they're saying), I want to challenge them.

      But how weird...when I first "woke up" to "chemtrails", I was very ill with a bad cold. And I mean, it was VERY BAD. I was having difficulty breathing, my cough was...well, I won't describe it because it was disgusting. I've never gotten that sick before, and I was going out my back door on my way to the doctor and I saw my first lingering contrail. My first "chemtrail" sighting was on the way to the doctor's office, who put me on antibiotics and said if I got worse to get to the nearest hospital emergency room ASAP. A week later, Seattle experienced some of the strangest weather ever. More rain fell in that 24 hour period than had ever fallen before, my street was flooded, a woman actually drowned in her basement less than a half kilometer from my location, and I was off and running on chemtrail conspiracy theory.

      I've now read a few of your other blogs, and GOSH, we are on many of the same wavelengths. I really appreciate your writing(s). I blog over on Blogger, and if interested I have my two links posted in my "about me" on metabunk.

      Cheers!

      Janet (ooppoddoo)

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Thank you, Janet! I am glad to see that I am not alone in having seen through this conspiracy theory for what it is!

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      Martian Kat 6 years ago

      It is so good to "see" you again and thank you so much for writing this. BTW, I've been on the contrail science site for a while now, and I can't think of a single question that Mick and the others haven't been able to answer for me. I describe the experience as "waking up and waking up again". Ha ha ha...it is so good to know I'm not alone. It sounds like you started asking good questions sooner than I did, but yeah, I finally gave up my last little shred of chemtrail CT about 18 months ago. It's not easy telling people the story, so thank you so much for your integrity, honesty, and courage. I'm very happy to have found you again, and it looks like your blog is going to be very good reading!

      Janet (ooppoddoo)

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Estee, there is no "missing piece" and I feel I have more than adequately explained my reasoning. Not only that but far better qualified people such as Uncinus of contrailscience.com and JazzRoc have examined the situation and reports in detail and explained all that they have so far seen. I happen to agree with them because I have not seen any actual in the sky above me trails or other phenomena or photos and videos posted by chemtrail-believers that are not explainable as persistent contrails and cirrus clouds. So there is no conspiracy, no mystery and no chemtrails for me to be concerned about. If as you say there are military planes flying over I see no reason to suspect that the trails they leave are anything more than normal persistent contrails and that nothing is being "sprayed." Blue skies are missing because of the cloud cover and I don't like that too but the cloud cover is cirrus that is made from the contrails the planes leave. If people don't like it (and I am one of them) then the answer is get all the air traffic out of the skies but I don't see much hope of that happening in the foreseeable future!

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      Estee M. 6 years ago

      I find this whole debate strange..not the beginning because I agreed with Bards research whole heartedly. What I find so strange is the complete 360 degree turn that he did backwards in regard to denial. It's almost as though there is a missing piece of the puzzle here. Regardless.. I became aware of this phenomenon May, 2010 when six U.S. military jets honed down at 3,000 feet and began spraying above my six year old grand son's ballfield.We watched in shock as these jets circled back and forth playing x and o's in the sky while dumping tons of whatever on us.They methodically laid a grid and covered the sky in this haze and as for that rainbow around the sun.. I've called it a "chembow" from that day forward. It was alarming to watch and we all felt as though we were under attack. Thousands of us on Vancouver Island witnessed it and it was recorded extensively on UTUBE and photographed.The footage I shot is graphic and for me very revealing. Since that day I have not been able to take my eyes off the skies and what I'm recording here on the westcoast is alarming. We don't have the commercial flightpaths here to warrant all this bizarre air activity and those circles these jets do and ziz zags in the skies must be offering a thrill a minute to the passengers aboard these flights LOL. With the heavy daily spraying comes freezing cold air and non stop raining. Call thousands of us what you want here on Vancouver Island but we want our sunshine and blue skies back..

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      Not really! I investigated the matter and there is no evidence for any of the paranoid claims that are being made. All I see are skies with persistent contrails and cirrus cloud and a worldwide group of people such as yourself who believe they are harmful chemtrails. They certainly don't harm me and I have no worries at all about being out and about under such skies! What a welcome relief to the worry I once created for myself by listening to all the chemtrail conspiracy brigade! What is worrying though is how far this belief system has spread!

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      L. Smith Jones 6 years ago

      ... How pathetic your conclusions are! After doing an excellent job of summarizing information, and presenting appropriate web sites, you have gotten so overwhelmed and scared that you have copped to a ridiculous denial ...weigh the evidence, and get sick like so many of us, being bombarded daily by multiple poisons from the air that we are afraid to go outside, and cannot get any response from people in the know, or people in power... I feel sorry for you, and all the folks who are grasping at straws so that they can stick their heads up their asses again, and return to their useless and pathetic lives... BOO!!!

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      Steve Andrews 6 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal

      An anonymous mechanic and an anonymous so-called 'Airline manager' neither of which are very reliable as sources of evidence and a story about Project Cloverleaf, and to think that several years ago I used to believe in this rubbish too to the degree that when I saw an Aerlingus plane leaving a trail over Dublin and then saw that the airline's logo incorporated a four-leaf clover or shamrock I linked this with this Project! Of course, I thought - Project Cloverleaf being openly used by the Irish airline! Fortunately I have much better things to do with my life now than waste my time worrying about such fiction!

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      Bridget Yorke 6 years ago

      AN AIRLINE MANAGER'S STATEMENT

      Posted by C.E. Carnicom on behalf of the author May 22 2000

      I read the email you received from the anonymous mechanic and felt compelled to respond to it. I, too, work for an airline, though I work in upper management levels. I will not say which airline, what city I am located, nor what office I work for, for obvious reasons. I wish I could document everything I am about to relate to you, but to do so is next to impossible and would result in possible physical harm to me.

      The email from the anonymous mechanic rings true. Airline companies in America have been participating in something called Project Cloverleaf for a few years now. The earliest date anyone remembers being briefed on it is 1998. I was briefed on it in 1999. The few airline employees

      who were briefed on Project Cloverleaf were all made to undergo background checks, and before we were briefed on it we were made to sign non-disclosure agreements, which basically state that if we tell anyone what we know we could be imprisoned.

      About twenty employees in our office were briefed along with my by two officials from some government agency. They didn't tell us which one. They told us that the government was going to pay our airline, along with others, to release special chemicals from commercial aircraft. When asked what the chemicals were and why we were going to spray them, they told us that information was given on a need-to-know basis and we weren't cleared for it. They then went on to state that the chemicals

      were harmless, but the program was of such importance that it needed to be done at all costs. When we asked them why didn't they just rig military aircraft to spray these chemicals, they stated that there weren't enough military aircraft available to release chemicals on such

      a large basis as needs to be done. That's why Project Cloverleaf was initiated, to allow commercial airlines to assist in releasing these chemicals into the atmosphere. Then someone asked why all the secrecy was needed. The government reps then stated that if the general public knew that the aircraft they were flying on were releasing chemicals into the air, environmentalist groups would raise hell and demand the spraying stop. Someone asked one of the G-men then if the chemicals are harmless, why not tell the public what the chemicals are and why we are spraying them? He seemed perturbed at this question and told us in a tone of authority that the public doesn't need to know what's going on, but that this program is in their best interests. He also stated that

      we should not tell anyone, nor ask any more questions about it. With that, the briefing was over.

      All documents in our office pertaining to Project Cloverleaf are kept in locked safes. Nobody is allowed to take these documents out of the office. Very few employees are allowed access to these documents, and they remain tight-lipped about what the documents say.

      Mr. Carnicom, I am no fool. I know there's something going on. And frankly, I am scared. I feel a high level of guilt that I have been aware of this kind of operation but unable to tell anyone. It's been eating away at me, knowing that the company I work for may be poisoning the American people. I hope this letter will open some eyes to what's happening.

      Mr. Carnicom:

      Again, I wish I could give you documented information, but you have to understand why I must remain totally anonymous.

      Thank you.