Defending Human Rights in America Today: A Conversation in Review
I was browsing a popular social media site recently reading about all of the rantings and ravings of people who stand with Phil from the A&E show 'Duck Dynasty' when I just came across a piece of what I consider to be disgusting bigotry that I could no longer handle. It appears peoples ignorance comes to a massive high point when there is all of a sudden a controversy surrounding one of their beloved reality television stars(which just says a massive amount of where we currently are as a country). Below is a recap of the conversation I inserted myself in to as what I saw a necessary standing for human rights. This is a real conversation only the names have been changed.
- Lady1: Yep, you sure got that right. LOL I am fed up with this bull. Paula Dean, and now Phil. It's getting out of hand when the heathens mandate to us what we should and shouldn't say or think. God said homosexuality was a sin. I don't get why anyone would think this was normal!!!
- Lady1: animals don't even do it that way. They have better sense.
- Lady2: You got that right ! If Fido knows better then there's no excuses no matter what the psychiatrists say. The government sees it this way ,if they cant screw em over join em now matter wrong or right because fighting back means losing all those thousands of gay votes.
- Lady2: What worries me is if a popularity contest is what dictates every aspect of our lives then who can say what other kind of criminals will be fighting for their rights to . Child molesters can say they were born that way to so really what are they opening the door for?
- Lady2: Or rapists? Need i continue theres a long list. We need a new system started from scratch.
- Me: Are you seriously comparing child molesters and rapists to gay people and considering them the same? Are you high? Not to mention the comprehensive list of animals that do display gay behavior but lets not go off on a tangent here. What world do you live in exactly where its ok to shit on other human beings, because you disagree with their lifestyle choices? Where is this place of untouched nonsensical bigotry of massive proportions where its ok to tell a human being they are as bad as a child molester because of their biology? Oh that's right you read it in the bible. Tell me again where jesus says to persecute the gay people. You can't? Huh that's weird. And while were at it what is this new system you speak of? Kill all of the people who are different from you? Easy Adolf I think you might have some push back there.
- Lady1: Me, Have you ever read the story of Sodom and Gomorrah. This is not a lifestyle, it's a sin. Period. You need to read your bible a little more in depth. God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Adam.
- Lady1: give me a break on this video. Jesus NEVER changes, I don't care what year it is. LOL How stupid.
This is the video Lady 1 was referencing
- Me: Lady1, you completely missed the point. And if it's a sin then let god sort it out. It is not yours or any one elses place to tell people who are different than you that they are equivalent to child molesters and rapists and then act like a superior human being for doing so. We are all equal regardless of race, religion or background. If you don't believe that then you don't believe in being an American. We are not united under a religious banner we are united under the banner that says all men were created equal. Not to mention that we should be very careful about throwing around old testament quotes/stories and using them for moral guidlines. There are 613 laws of the old testament most of which neither you or anyone else in the country follows. If were going to cast stones of morality based on the old testament be prepared to have stones cast back in your direction.
- Lady1: You have your believes and I have mine. I believe that homosexuality is a sin and not a lifestyle. I am not judging anyone, I will leave that to God. I am just saying what I KNOW to be the truth.
- Me: To be fair I wasn't directing my comments at you Lady1, I'm perfectly fine with you believing what you believe so long as it doesn't impose on another persons rights or ability to pursue happiness. But I KNOW that it is my duty as a human being to stand up for other human beings who are being persecuted, ridiculed or having their humanity taken from them through words or otherwise.
- Lady1: Me, you are entitled to your opinion, so we will agree to disagree. LOL
- Lady2: Obviously Me, your easy to jump to conclusions. I never once judged or made the assumption that gays are the same as child molesters only that in a professional point of view based on what the psychologist have used for justifying gays for their sins and earning them their rights by saying they were born this way makes it possible for any given criminal no matter who or what they choose to be or do can justify their actions by using the same excuse. " I was born this way", because no matter what people say everything the psychologist speculate on is only evidence of mental disability or psychological problem or as they say a brain disorder. So what about all of the people like sexual predators who also have psychological or mental disabilities cant they to claim they were born this way? Should we just stand back and leave it up to god to judge them to? While they are free to run the streets and rape and kill our children . Whats more important gay rights or whats right in general?
- Lady2: As far as i can see gay people may have a good reason for being who they are and doing what they do but if i say this and go against whats right and and go against all i believe in just to make the gays a normal part of society then i would also have to treat all the other millions of mentally insane people with equal respects no matter what they do or how much of a threat they are because they suffer from the same problem just in different ways and no one can prove otherwise.
- Lady2: I can see you are compassionate,you value life and i can see that but we cant let our hearts put our lives and our our children s futures at risk for what is but sin to begin with. I feel sorry for people who are setting in prison for killing someone who kidnapped and killed one of their loved ones i cant imagine what pain they have suffered ,what that did to their hearts but their in prison regardless of what their heart feel because they broke the law so if they can set in prison for life because they loved someone who was murdered then a gay should be able to understand that his or her hearts are no acceptation to the rules .There is only right or wrong and if we dont distinguish between the two then i dont even want to know what will become of life as we know it.
- Lady2: By the way Adolf had a mental illness also why dont you justify him for being born that way?
- Me: ok so let me see if I have your argument correct, you are saying that you never said homosexuals are like child molesters or rapists. What you are saying is that homosexuals suffer from the same mental disorders as child molesters and rapists. Therefore homosexuals are the same as child molesters and rapists......What the hell are you talking about? Lets clear the air here with some facts:
1. Psychologists do not justify gays because there is nothing to justify. There is no moral ineptitude by being gay regardless of what the old testament says. Again this is America we are a secular nation that is overseen by the rule of law brought about by our elected representatives which forms the social contract by the agreement of the citizens. Not a religious banner or religious law. If you want to see what christian law would look like all you have to do is look at sharia law and connect the dots. Two consenting adults are making personal choices about their personal lives that neither affects anyone but themselves nor harms anyone in the process. You and I should not be involved in in any way shape or form. To disagree with this is to disagree with the foundations of the constitution of the United States.
"AMENDMENT I Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."
Do you see it now? You see in that first line they have what’s called an ‘establishment clause’. The establishment clause is what is used to prevent the government from endorsing or supporting ANY religion; this also means the endorsement of religion over non-religion. To emphasize this, the courts that uphold the constitution also have what is called a ‘Lemon Test’ which is as follows:
(1) Does the law have a secular purpose? If not, it violates the Establishment Clause.
(2) Is the primary effect either to advance religion or to inhibit religion? If so, it violates the Establishment Clause.
(3) Does the law foster an excessive governmental entanglement with religion? If so, it violates the Establishment Clause.
So you see, the first line in the first amendment to the constitution is held together by an establishment clause whose first test is to determine whether or not a law is secular. I don’t know if it can be more clear to anyone who reads this that our government, our country was based on secularism not Christianity. But hey here’s a thought let’s compare what our constitution says to what the bible says:
US Constitution: Power is derived from the consent of the governed.
Bible: Divine right of kings.
US Constitution: Representative lawmaking.
Bible: God is the lawgiver.
US Constitution: Equality under the law.
Bible: Some groups are God’s chosen ones.
US Constitution: Freedom of and from worship.
Bible: "Thou shalt have no other gods..." etc.
US Constitution: No cruel or unusual punishment.
Bible: Leviticus & Deuteronomy.
US Constitution: Right to question leaders.
Bible: Render unto Caesar...
US Constitution: Freedom from coercion & surveillance
Bible: God watches and judges every thought and action
US Constitution: Right to self-determination
Bible: God’s will is your destiny
2. Psychologists did not earn gays their rights. Gays were granted their human rights and dignity the day they were born period. Yes molesters and rapists were born with the exact same rights, the difference being child molesters...MOLESTED CHILDREN AND RAPISTS RAPED PEOPLE. The fact that I have to describe to you the differences between rapists, child molesters and law abiding citizens that happen to be gay is #*&@ing disgusting and ridiculous but never the less here we go. Gay people do not harm society or other human beings by their actions or lifestyles regardless of how offended by them you may be. No one is scarred for life because two men or two women are having sex in the privacy of their own home. No one is being emotionally destroyed because 2 human beings love each other. No one is being forced to be gay or have gay sex, if you don't like it don't have it. The reason we lock up child molesters and rapists is because they violate the social contract. They force their actions on others which is neither wanted nor consented to. Your rights stop as soon as they involve another person who does not or cannot consent to the actions you are taking with them. EX. RAPING THEM. So for the safety of the people who form society we lock them away so that they can no longer endanger or force their actions on to other people. Which is quite literally the exact opposite of being gay.
3. Whats more important gay rights or being right in general? Do you or do you not agree with this statement: All men are created equal. If the answer is yes then being right would be allowing gay people to have the same rights as all other people. If you say no, then you are not only a bigot but you also do not understand the social construct of the country in which you are currently residing. Again please reference sharia law.
4. Gays ARE a normal part of society. Your line of thinking is NOT. Not only is it not rational and exclusive and persecution its hateful and degrading to your fellow human beings that have not done anything to deserve the treatment that is being bestowed upon them. To deny any person the same rights and dignity that any other person has is bigotry plain and simple. Regardless of what ANY holy book or orthodoxy may say about the situation. Either we are all created equal or we are not. Again this isn't really a choice but instead is the social contract you agree to by living in the United States.
5. I am a humanist, and there is not anything I value more than the lives of my fellow man and children. Which is why I must vehemently disagree with you. The only thing that is putting lives and children at risk in this situation is the backwards logic, thinking and literal interpretation that the old testament is right in regards to homosexuality. Again there are 613 laws in the old testament that we can point to right now, most of which you would be stoned to death for. Either we evolve as a society and as a species for the betterment of mankind or we continue to persecute and kill one another for the sake of being offended by other people's personal choices that do not effect any one but themselves. I am literally begging you, you have the entirety of human knowledge at your fingertips right now reading this. Use it and better the world in a different way than by persecuting your fellow man. Do this and teach your children to do this and you will never have to worry about what will become of life as we know it.
6. I really wanted to let this go but I felt as if I didn't address hitler you would simply say AHA! see can't address hitler, your wrong. Hitler was a mass murdering nazi f*^# that cannot and should not be justified. Please let me know if I need to go in to detail about the differences between hitler and gay people.
- Lady2: I deny you .
- Lady2: I will never accept wrong no matter who it offends or how it offends them and no matter what they say were are not the same . even if i go to hell judging ill burn in hell knowing i didnt betray myself or teach my children that it ok for them to be this way because i would rather burn in hell then to be the reason my son never gets to live a normal life not because of the choices he made but because of what i made him to be .Ill face my judgement and they will face their own but while im here on earth i will never justify someones wrong just to make them feel better about themselves. This is hateful and this i know ,but when i think about my own flesh and blood being subjected to this filth and being manipulated into believing its right and putting their entire futures at risk because of someone who chooses to do wrong to himself and wants the world to make him feel less guilty im sorry but i would rather die.
- Lady2: I dont care if this created problems for the gays ,because even though you believe in equality and harmony of humanity god never spoke of peace on earth he only spoke of the Antichrist who speaks of blasphemy and peace on earth. What i gather is the fact of life we will all die and be judged for our sins but ill be damned if i myself or one of my kids will be condemned because of false prophets .
In closing I left it at this. I guess that's the first time I've been called a false prophet or maybe the anti-christ not sure what she was going for there at the end. But I think I gave them something to at least think about and I truly hope that at some point their humanity will kick in. I can always hope.