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THE CUP WILL NOT PASS - 'How It Is' By Biblical & Other Text Sources

Updated on January 27, 2017

Torah Scroll - Scripture

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INTRODUCTION

Ba'rukh ah'tah YHWH, no'tayn haTorah. (Blessed are you Jehovah, giver of the Torah.)

A good book, so they say, has an overall theme, an introduction, a body, then a conclusion. To me a bible has all this and more. It is kind of like two books, then again it is not. I read and I see how the Old Testament, in particular the Pentateuch (I will use the term Torah henceforth, but distinguish from connotations such as Talmud, although Torah itself has another more 'dictionary' meaning), compliment the New Testament. I might compare Revelation, Jude and 2Peter to Genesis. Acts Of The Apostles is akin to Exodus. Hebrews becomes the new Leviticus. The gnostic gospel of John has the majesty of Deuteronomy. Seldom do we look thoroughly at how these things mesh. The cup theme was revealed to me in 2011 through the blessings of the Priesthood and after much study of the Old Testament. I wish others will make a fresh examination of the biblical texts, or even scriptures, if you can read Hebrew, Greek and occasionally Aramaic. For it is said that all the prophets point to a coming Messiah (Luke 24:27).

The New Covenant

The day of the atoning sacrifice Of HaMoshiach Yeshua (aka Christ Jesus) ended in the time of the Preparation (Ex.12:6, Num.9:3-4,10-12, 28:16, Deut.16:1-2,6-7, Zech.3:9) and the growing twilight of the imminent festival High Holy Day (Lev.23:4-7, Num.28:18, Deut.16:8, Mark15:42, Luke23:54). It began with the last supper (Matt.26:20-30, Mark14:18-31, Luke22:14-38, John13-17). For the ancient calendar reckoned days as sundown to sunset (Gen.1:31, Lev.23:32). Historically, Jeremiah alluded to the Sacrament, he spoke of a new chadash (covenant, Jer.31:22,31); though not by any means a brand new one (Gen.14:18, Ex.24:9-11,13, Num.11:16-17,Luke10:1). For chadash signifies renewal. His words found fulfillment through the actions of the High Priest (Ps.110:4, Heb.5:6) who invoked the ancient blessing that Abram first heard upon victory (Gen.14:19-20, Heb.7:1). For the similitude of the priest of the New Covenant is to be found in Melki-zedek (Heb.7:15); My King/King Of Righteousness, the Melek-salom; King Of Spiritual Peace. Titles worthy of God Himself, then pronounced; without parents, nor genealogy, eternal and deathless (Prov.8:23, Micah5:2, John8:58, Heb.7:2-3). In seeing him, Abram rejoiced (John8:56). So happy was he then seeing the great day had come (John8:56); knowing more fully as his life progressed how well YHWH brings his promises to fruition (Gen.17:15-17, Isa.55:11, Hab.2:2-3, Surah2:260,14:39,15:53-55,37:112,51:28-30).

"New" / Renewal / Renewed

A brit[h] chadash[e] or renewed covenant can be compared to the New Moon. It is still the same Moon you knew in past days. By saying renewed He has rendered the former aged; that growing aged and decrepit is nigh to vanishing (Heb.8:13).

From Sinai To Midian

Gethsemane - Ministry's End

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Covert Mission

It is well understood that Moses' mission was to deliver the Hebrews from Egyptian slavery (Ex.5:1). Thus did they descend beneath the waters of the eastern Red Sea in a strange type of baptism (Ex.14:22, 1Cor.10:2). So was the ministry of Yeshua to save both the living and the dead (Ruth2:20, Ezek.37:5-6, Matt.27:52-53, John5:21, 1Pet.3:19, LDS Doctrine & Covenants128:15-18) a far greater mission yet. He desired only slaves of righteousness (Ex.32:7, Rom.6:18). Now consider this, Abram's brother was no longer a captive of Satan (Gen.14:16, Ps.119:45, John8:33). Father one (Ezek.33:24, John8:39), three hundred and eighteen men (Gen.14:14). Although Israel's blood would be diluted through the Diaspora (Jer.31:27, Amos9:9), the days of the beast are numbered (Dan.5:26 [Babylon then and now is holding sway over the natural man], Rev.13:18). Somewhat ironically (Num.20:11), Jews consider a Goy (Gentile) to be little better than an animal. It must be pointed out, even to this day (barring the recently ended Israeli military Hannibal Directive, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/29/israel-ends-the-hannibal-directive---military-policy-to-kill-you/ , 1986-2016), the modern Israelis will trade one hundred, even one thousand Palestinians for one Jewish prisoner. Hence the word beast has an extra meaning. It was nighttime, probably early in the morning and the Messiah's followers were around him in a place called Gethsemane. As written in Matthew; Jesus went a little further and fell on his face and prayed, saying "Oh my Father if it be possible, let this cup pass from me, nevertheless not as I will but as Thou wilt." (Matt.26:39, cf. Gen.18:23-32, Ex.32:30-32).

He Carried That Wood In Similitude Of A Sacrifice To Come

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The Question

People of different faiths, or even no faith, have tried to understand the context of what the Messiah meant. Some have even questioned the integrity of Matthew's account. Many possibilities arise in terms of this recorded statement. We may ask, did Yeshua, son of Mary, fear the shame of punishment, the associated pain, or even death? Did he disbelieve in his own worthiness or ability to provide an atoning sacrifice? Did he surmise that his sacrifice could in no way bring about the redemption of mankind? Was the Messiah questioning God's will? These are the most obvious possibilities arising from this famous New Testament quote. Most of these issues have been considered by theologians over the centuries.

The fundamental question is whether Yeshua was questioning God's will on this matter. We know from the canonical Gospels that the Messiah had obedience, confidence in his mission and ministry; he knew how important it was to the future of mankind. This matter may be addressed by the relevant citations in the previous section, pertaining to Abraham and subsequently Moses asking God directly for mercy upon his erring creations. Indeed the scriptures testify the Messiah had to bear that cursed wood (John19:17) until he could walk no more (Matt.27:32, Mark15:21, Luke23:26) under the load, an ordeal worse than what Abraham's firstborn son faced(Gen.22:6). Yet it is clear that in Gethsemane he pleaded with God for an alternative pathway to realise the salvation of Israel. Yeshua always challenged the thinking of man in one way or another. In this case we have to refer back to another section of the Old Testament in order to derive a specific precedent.

Jerusalem Falls - Babylonian Exile

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The Covenant, The Ark [and] The Holy Place

Up until Yeshua's ministry, the last of Israel's great prophets was Jeremiah. Although Ezekiel was his contemporary, Ezekiel was sent into Babylonian exile as a youth. Jeremiah was the last Israelite by virtue of the Old Testament Covenant and the first Jew, a concept to be expanded upon shortly. In Jeremiah's time of power in prophecy, the most dramatic changes to the fortunes of Israel finally brought Judah down. Rabbi Moredecai Schreiber, in an August 2011 Tikkun Magazine interview, declares this period to be "the most critical period of his people's long history". Jerusalem was laid waste and Jeremiah's people either slaughtered, exiled or taken into captivity. When the Babylonians approached Solomon's Temple, the ancient texts of Kings and Jeremiah record that the entrance pillars, Jachin and Boaz (commonly understood to mean "Yah founds/establishes"; representing King Solomon, and "strength" representing King David respectively (Tony Badillo, The Secret of Solomon's Pillars Jachin and Boaz, 2007, Ruth2:20)), were significantly shorter than their original height by 2 cubits on the brass capitals (2Kgs25:17 vs 1Kgs7:15-16, Jer.52:21-22). The Ark Of The Covenant was never seen again in Jerusalem and yet the Babylonians never discovered it there. It must be noted that the seven branched lampstand, the table of showbread and altar of incense were also gone (2Kgs25:13-15, Jer.52:17-19). Without the glorious, golden Ark and Tabernacle there was no fullness of Mosaic Covenant for Israel/Judah (1Sam.4:22). The Ark is fundamental to the fulfillment of the Festive Law which the Messiah declared to be valid for all time. "'Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the Law (Torah, nomia [Greek])..." (Matt.5:18). Come Day; Judgement (Yom Kippur; Ex.30:10, Lev.16:29-30, 23:27-28, 25:9, Num.29:7) only those who uphold the Torah shall be deemed worthy (Matt.7:21-23, 3Ne.14:23); "..depart...ye that work iniquity [non-nomia]". The eternal importance of the Ark is validated by Leviticus 17:11, Hebrews 9:22, Ezekiel 37:26-28 and Revelation 11:19. The Messiah entered into the holy place of Mt. Moriah (Gen.22:14, 2Chron.3:1).

How The Ark Was Removed From The First Temple, And Hidden.

Solomon's Temple - Brass For Babylon

Although the entrance pillars were pulled down, the ingenious Egyptian technology that King Solomon's workers utilised (1Kgs3:1) ensured the foundations and flagstones beneath appeared to be legitimate items.

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Pillars Of The Kings

Careful analysis of Solomon's Temple blueprint reveals it to have been proportioned like a human with male and female aspects ( http://www.templesecrets.info/ ). Two men were crucified before Yeshua, although he himself was not killed through crucifixion (Gen.22:11-12, Deut.21:22, Isa.53:9, John19:30,33, Heb.7:3, Surah4:157-158). Like strange pillars of flesh, not brass (Rev.3:12). Just as in the story of Pharoh's servants imprisoned with Joseph; one to live, the other to die (Gen.40:12-19, Surah12:41, Luke23:39-43, Rev.19:7 vs 19:21). So there shall ultimately be two groups on the Day Of Resurrection. One gathering of the blessed, the other wretched souls. The concept of one gathering of mixed emotions is familiar to Judaism and Messianic Followers Of The Way (Deut.27:2-8, Josh.3:15,4:1-9, Ruth1:20,4:14, Neh.8:9-11, Job5:17-27, Trad. proto-gospel; The Birth Of Mary/The Revelation Of James 17:2). Hence the stage was set, so to speak. The ground of rock split as Earth convulsed (Matt.27:51). The unique blood had been shed (Isa.53:5, Matt.27:49, John19:34, 1John5:6-8, Trad. proto-gospel; The Birth Of Mary/The Revelation Of James 8:1) and completed the journey. The Messiah entered not by the blood of animal sacrifices, but with his own blood into the Most Holy Place on this world. The greatest sacrifice of all time. Hundreds of years before this day it had been clearly prophesised that his blood would consecrate the Holy Of Holies (Dan.9:24) and this was the time.

Moses' Victory

The origins of a universal law of excellence in human behaviour and mystery in prophecy.
The origins of a universal law of excellence in human behaviour and mystery in prophecy. | Source

The Eternal Covenant & Ark Of Testimony

The viewpoint of contemporary Judaism leans towards doubt over the relevance of the Ark and Temple ceremonies in the Orthodox schools. There are contemporary references made to a "Temple Cult". The absence of the Ark from the First Temple has to be seen as no coincidence in terms of Judah's defeat; on the basis of early Old Testament history (Josh.6:6-13). Israel would never rise again to even a fraction of her old strength until the latter-day prophecies of chapter 36 in the Book Of Ezekiel came to pass. Some years after the great Atonement For Mankind, the apostle Paul (Saul) spoke regarding the sacrificial atonements and other aspects of the Torah versus the living sacrifice of Yeshua. When he made statements like "..ministry of the New Testament is Spirit not [written] letter; the letter kills but the Spirit gives life." and on to comparing the tablets of the Ten Commandments to death (2Cor.3:6-7, Heb.10:28), the stage was set for progressive misunderstanding of the "Old" versus the "New". It is easy to take such statements out of context and forget other truths like Paul acknowledging the teachings of Yeshua and Moses; "..the righteousness which is of the Law, that the man which doeth these things shall live by them." (Rom.10:5, Gal.3:12, Luke10:25-28). Paul was clearly stating to the audience of his day that all men must repent (Num.23:19) to inherit the Spirit of Mercy And Truth (Ps.85:10); the "living" Testament of HaMoshiach Yeshua, the only way out of hypocrisy (John1:17,8:7 [8:7 does not exist in the earliest manuscripts], Gal.5:4). The only sure means to grace and mercy from the Lawgiver. Furthermore, to quote Tony Badillo, the Temple was of stone, its lessons of the spirit.

Yet the fall from Torah had to be (2Thes.2:3 [see Wikipedia, Textual variants in the New Testament], 2Tim.4:3-4). In the so-called Epistle To The Ephesians (note textual variations), probably not actually directly attributable to Paul, nor in alignment with his teachings, it was alleged that Yeshua abolished the Torah (Eph.2:15) to reconcile Goyim (Gentiles) and Jews. The analogy was; two become one new person. This would bring peace (Eph.2:16), contrary to the message of Yeshua (Matt.10:34, Luke12:51). Truth resides in the message of more than one prophet; one renewed covenant (Ps.85:10-11, Gal.3:14). Just as the ministry of Moses eventually failed Israel, so the first Messianic ministry failed the Goyim in the succeeding centuries; a cyclic process (Zech.13:7, Matt.26:31, Mark14:27, Luke22:31, John21:18-19). People at the time did not have John's Book Of Revelation for certainty regarding the other Ark prophecy in Ezekiel. There can be no room for doubt when an Old Testament prophecy is repeated in the New Testament. The Jews were certainly correct in their position that Moses' Law is [essentially] eternal, and indeed Jeremiah dictated that the Ark Of The Covenant would be forgotten for a time, and could not suffer an imposter (Jer.3:16).

The Ark Of The Covenant and Associated Items

To this day they await the return of the Messiah and the ultimate fulfillment of Moses' Law.
To this day they await the return of the Messiah and the ultimate fulfillment of Moses' Law. | Source

Solomon's Secret

If it was indeed Jeremiah who was responsible for moving the Ark to a safe hiding place then he did so without any witnesses recording its passage through the city. Yet no Jewish account provides any hint as to how such a precious supernatural object could have passed unnoticed outside of Solomon's Temple. The obvious inference is that the Ark was never brought into a public place since its journey into the First Temple. Then did it simply vanish into thin air? Was it carried to the hidden heavens by angels? The Ark with its precious accompanying Tablets cut by light (Ex.31:18, Deut.5:22) were given for the benefit of all mankind (2Chron.6:32-33, Ps.2:8,22:27,31,86:9, Isa.2:2,43:6,56:7,66:20, Hag.2:7, Mark11:17, Rev.15:4). Surely God would never withdraw them from Earth and not bring such a failing to the mind of Israel? Especially when they are inexorably linked to the Messiah. This is borne out by the preceding Old and New Testament references as well as Matthew 5:17 (3Ne.15:7). Let us consider again the premise some Christians consider doctrine; that the Ark of Moses is in a heavenly temple (Ps.18:6, Jonah2:7) rather than a terrestrial tabernacle. King Solomon utterly quashes this notion. In the book of 1Kings he beseeches YHWH "I have surely built thee an house to dwell in, a settled place for thee to abide for ever [aeons; an age]." Yet God provides this prophecy to the greatest king of ancient Israel (2Chron.1:12) to defy any notion of permanence "[YHWH] he said; to [be] to shakan (an established place to inhabit) in orphl (the thick darkness; a lower level)." (1Kings8:12). That is to say the domain of his personal presence to the sons of Adam upon e-artz ([the] Earth) shall one day be established below, and in an area sealed from daylight (1Kings8:27). A most logical conclusion is that some secret passage built into the Temple permitted the Ark to be transported beneath the city in the extensive tunnel network. The fulfillment of this matter is alluded to in certain passages telling us that what is sealed or carefully concealed on Earth shall indeed become known to all on a great day (Ps.85:10-11, Luke12:2, 2Ne.30:17).

Few church members of any Protestant denomination read apocryphal works. It is not commonly known that before 1666 A.D. the KJV bible incorporated an apocrypha. Yet in 2Macabees, chapter2, lies record of a lost scripture (2Mac.2:1,4) containing hints of the fate of the lost Ark. There is confusion over which mountain the original record refers to. The scripture speaks of the mountain Moses ascended (Deut.34:1). Then the story says Jeremiah's companions went back later to mark the path to the "cave-dwelling" (2Mac.2:5-6) and were thwarted. If this was an open pathway above ground then re-tracing their steps should not have been a great challenge. Are there remote mountains in Israel with extensive cave networks? Significantly the scripture gives us these words from Jeremiah, "The place is to remain unknown until God gathers his people together again and shows them his mercy." (Zech.8:7-8). Indeed the writings in Ezekiel, chapter 36 have already come to pass. Jews suffered the ultimate humiliation of the final European [Nazi] holocaust and God restored their fortune for the sake of His own holy name (1Sam.12:23, Ps.23:3,31:3,79:9,106:8,115:1, Isa.65:8, Ezek.36:22, 1John2:12, 1Ne.20:9, 2Ne.29:14).

King Solomon's Glory Fulfilled

Solomon's audience with YHWH when his Temple is endowed with the fabulous golden Ark.
Solomon's audience with YHWH when his Temple is endowed with the fabulous golden Ark. | Source

The Great Hebrew Patriarchs

Around and within Jerusalem there are three mountains. Mt. Zion, the Mt. Of Olives and Mt. Moriah. Jeremiah, peace and blessings be upon him, was the first Jew according to the reckoning of Rabbi and author Mordecai Schreiber. His words and the hand of his scribe Baruch are certainly to be found within serious works of the Old Testament (Friedman, Richard Elliott. Who Wrote The Bible. Harper Collins, 1997 edition, p.147). Works central to the development of Judaism. Works common to Christianity and endorsed by the [later] Qur'an (Surahs3:3,48,50, 5:44,65-66,68, 32:33, 62:5). Moses, peace and blessings be upon him, was the first Israelite by reckoning of the Old Testament Covenant. That is to say a nation became more than a people, they were indeed a race with one legal religion. Abram became Abraham, peace and blessings be upon him; the first Hebrew. As is it is written, Abraham offered a sacrifice of his firstborn upon the Mount Of The LORD (Heb.11:17), a lamb God will provide himself (Gen.22:8,14). The same Mt. Moriah is the location of Golgotha. Not so far away, on the high ground, are the remains of the Jerusalem Temple.

Ultimate Blood Sacrifice Upon Moses' Ark

Snapshot from a lecture DVD given by Jonathan Grey in Auckland, New Zealand.  Not to scale.  Inscriptions in Hebrew, Latin and Greek.  Messiah on the cross.  The fissure where blood issued into the hidden chamber.  Golgotha backdrop.
Snapshot from a lecture DVD given by Jonathan Grey in Auckland, New Zealand. Not to scale. Inscriptions in Hebrew, Latin and Greek. Messiah on the cross. The fissure where blood issued into the hidden chamber. Golgotha backdrop. | Source

Moses' Law Is Not Fulfilled

The mental powers of men from all nations have been dulled. For to this present day a veil remains unlifted at the reading of the New Covenant, because by no means is the work of Yeshua to supersede the Torah, nor is it possible without the Law. If one thing is true that does not automatically render another event false. Yet even as a badly behaved child I did witness the light (2Sam.24:12, 1Chron.21:10, Ps.19:12,94:12, Rev.3:19). The glory is in the Messiah, and blessed is YHWH who gave us the greatest mercy, bismillahir-Rahmanir-Raheem (in the name of God, Most-Merciful, Merciful Beyond Reckoning) (Gen.4:7, Ex.34:6, Ps.103:8, Isa.55:7, Lam.3:22, Luke6:35-36). As it is written; Goyim from all the ends of Earth shall turn to YHWH saying "Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity and things wherein there is no profit." amen (Ps.94:11, Jer.16:19). In the Book Of Mormon (Ezek.37:16-20) it is written; "..the law of Moses is fulfilled." (3Ne.9:17). Then the exoteric teaching of the Latter-Days became one of a redundant Torah that Jews blindly follow (Old Testament Student Manual, Genesis-2Samuel, Religion 301, Third Edition, The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter-Day Saints, Salt Lake City, Utah, 2003, Section 2-4, p.29, section 12-4.4, p.139). "Old things are done away, and all things have become new." (3Ne.12:47, Jer.3:16). Such was YHWH's decision that strong delusion and lies shall overwhelm (2Thes.2:11) and even the elect may be deceived (Mark13:22). By all the wisdom of Solomon, is it not written "..there is no new thing under the sun." (Eccl.1:9)? The esoteric teaching of the Latter-Days is that the scriptures concerning the First Coming are fulfilled (3Ne.9:16) and that regular sacrifices and burnt offerings shall cease (Dan.9:27, 3Ne.9:19). Concerning the words of the prophets, they were yet to be fulfilled (3Ne.15:6), particularly as regards the Latter-Days (Gen.49:22-24, 2Ne.3:5). The Messiah declared he is the Law, that sacrificial aspect has an end, but the Covenant is not all fulfilled (3Ne.15:8-9). Have Heaven and Earth passed away? (Matt.5:18). Recall the parable of the fig tree and an approaching Summer (Matt.24:32), is this not the time of work in the fields (Ruth1:22-2:2)? The Feast Of Trumpets and more, indeed all the Autumn Feasts await us (Lev.23:24-25). For the Law is real; our Way and life here is literally to live out the Torah. Every week, every day, another jot, another tittle.

Christians readily denigrate The Book Of Mormon and the Qur'an. In my own experience they say that they have their bible, then they say these books borrow too much from their bible. Islam becomes an easy target when purported muslims forget the Injeel (Gospels) they are commanded to embrace. For Gabriel said to Mary that this child will be a sign to the people and a mercy (Surah19:21,23:50). What is that sign (Matt.12:38-41,16:1-4, Luke11:29-32)? It was surely written three days and nights (Jonah1:17) from the exact middle of our week (Dan.9:27). Yet we have all been hypocrites on a time. Cast aside that beam (Matt.7:1-5, 3Ne.14:3-5)! Do we now live the Law Of Consecration? (Acts5:1-5). Verily the New Covenant is not about "living a higher law" as the saying goes, but attaining a higher understanding of the Law. Is it not stated, "In the beginning..." (Gen.1:1), Abel was of righteousness and Cain won disapproval before God (Gen.4:4-5, Surah5:27)? Indeed Abel "turned the other cheek" (Prov.24:29, Isa.50:6, Lam.3:30, Matt.5:39, Luke6:29, John18:22-23, Rom.12:17-19, 1Pet.2:23, Surah5:28). By this inaction Abel promised Cain his inheritance would be the sin his life accumulated (Surah5:29). So it should be apparent, from the earliest period of humanity's history, in Eden, then upon Earth, the laws were being made plain regarding obedience, knowledge, temptation, sin and its migration (Gen3:1-4:16).

Prophet Jeremiah In Judah

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Jeremiah's Overlooked Clause

Jeremiah and his scribe Baruch ben Neriah, peace and blessings be upon him, recorded a fantastic promise by God to his people Israel, more specifically their remnant, Judah. In chapter 33 of The Book Of The Prophet Jeremiah there begins a Messianic prophecy of security through the posterity of King David (Jer.33:17). The Levitical Priesthood is promised continual service according to the sacrificial Mosaic/Festive Law of the Torah (Jer.33:18). This is what evoked Yeshua's plea at Gethsemane. It is the out-clause in regard to Isaiah's chapter 27. He was calling upon this ancient promise to Jeremiah to be executed for the salvation of Judah. Unfortunately for Judah they violated the condition for the LORD's pledge (Zech.6:15). In the middle of the week they broke the covenant of day and night (Gen.1:4-5, Deut.28:29a, Josh.10:12-14, Ps.105:15,132:12, Hab.3:11, Surah34:12) on the side of Mt. Moriah, beneath Golgotha, where the highway runs to Jerusalem. "Now from the sixth hour [noon] there was darkness all over the land unto the ninth hour." (Dan.9:27, Amos8:9, Matt.27:45, Mark15:33, Luke23:44). With the day turned to night for a period of hours, the warning in Jeremiah 33:20-21 ensured Yeshua's prophecy of destruction for Jerusalem and Herod's Temple (Matt.26:61, Mark14:58, John2:19) had to be fulfilled. The Messiah referred to the Old Testament once again, and The Book Of Daniel (Matt.24:15-22), to make things plain to his followers. Only those of Judah [born of that generation] who followed their new king could have hope in their mortal future. Some may have exited Jerusalem (J. Gray, The Forbidden Secret, 2011, p.424-427) even as the Zealots vainly pursued the retreating Romans (Josephus, Wars, Vol.2, 19:6-7). The final ancient victory of the Jews in Israel was but a temporary respite. These refugees were the Followers Of The Way (Deen) Of HaMoshiach Yeshua (Ex.18:20,32:8,33:3,13, Deut.28:9, 1Sam.12:23, Ps.1:6,2:12,5:8,18:32,25:4,77:13,85:13,95:10,103:7,119:1,3,5,9,14,27,32-33,37,143:8, Zech.3:7, John14:6, Acts9:2,22:4,24:14, Heb.10:20). Some of their remnant remain the Messianic Jews and in the Hebrew Roots movement.

Golgotha In Modern Israel

An ancient highway into Jerusalem remains to this day.  It was the site of many executions by crucifixion in biblical days.
An ancient highway into Jerusalem remains to this day. It was the site of many executions by crucifixion in biblical days. | Source

God's Judgement On Judah Soon After The Execution Of James, Bishop Of Jerusalem & The Destruction Of The Second Temple.

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    • theomajor profile image
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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      This Hub is not really concerned with the character of God but the records of history, men and scripture in regard to the mission of the Messiah. These issues are fundamental to gaining insight into how to build a relationship with God that fulfils your potential before the imminent end of this age. If you wish to define God, that is your business.

    • Donna Suthard profile image

      Donna Suthard 3 years ago

      Respectfully sir, I too do not agree or believe that God would ever order up any of his children to kill others..having read the advanced teachings of Jesus Christ in the A Course in Miracles...and experienced mystical experiences, I know this to be the most consistent teachings I have ever read or experienced..He claimed, that His Father, our Father's messages were only the message of love.. The disciples out of their own sense of guilt, of abandoning Jesus during his crucifixion wrote false teachings..as a way of projecting their own need for punishment..which is what the ego does when it becomes afraid..it seeks someone else to punish for what it has not forgiven in self..These fallible, and misguided men, made a fearful God in their image..Jesus said, we are all innocent in truth...what is not Love is fear, and fear is a call for help or love..so I do agree with Jay C's statements..He said, "Our function in life is to be totally loving, gentle and kind to everyone we meet or even think about." God is unconditional love..

    • theomajor profile image
      Author

      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      For specific definitions see "Pillars Of The Kings", ref. Dan.9:24 as above. Also the last paragraph of "Solomon's Secret".

      The other covert key part of the Messiah's mission is also alluded to in the section entitled "Covert Mission" as the salvation of the dead. Perhaps you have not actually read the entire article. If you wish to understand it fully, you need to read the article and check out all the references, unless you are already familiar with them.

      For a proper book on the Messiah's exoteric ministry I recommend a work by the Karaite Jew, Nehemiah Gordon, loosely entitled The Hebrew Yashua vs The Greek Jesus. This work exposes the true Messiah buried by centuries of christianity.

    • Jay C OBrien profile image

      Jay C OBrien 3 years ago from Houston, TX USA

      That which the mind of a soul dwells upon it becomes: for Mind is ever the builder.

      What is: "...the covert aspect of the Messiah's ministry which is openly spoken...?"

    • theomajor profile image
      Author

      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      To be honest I thought there might be other hub forums for general discussions. The How It Is aspect of this hub is concerned with the covert aspect of the Messiah's ministry which is openly spoken of in what was originally a Protestant text now removed, amongst other things. There are many bibles which contain books you may not have read. Certain christian and Islamic theology is based on the books of Enoch, for example. All bibles take parts of Enoch. Enoch makes things very clear regarding the lineage of man. This is one reason why most religions hate them as a stand alone document. I disagree with your conclusion that certain Hebrews did not witness the true God, or angels. Personally I have seen things and after much study I know much of what they saw, nor am I a single witness. One thing you don't believe in is, probably, the sanctity of the tabernacle. I believe in the Ark, I testify of it and know YHWH would not hesitate to zap the unworthy for approaching with ill intent, as happened in the days of Moses. I think this is a good example of what you deny. Your quip on categorising people is a nice thought but not particularly practical in theology.

    • Jay C OBrien profile image

      Jay C OBrien 3 years ago from Houston, TX USA

      Asking: "What do you think God is like" goes to the heart of any theological discussion. I am trying to understand your view. What do you say? Is God always peaceful, always violent or does He vacillate between the two?

      I am trying to grasp Your understanding of the Bible. As for me, I see it as a series of books or a series of reports.

      I believe the Hebrews misidentified human beings as The Lord and his angels. This theory would absolve God of allegations of child abuse while maintaining Hebrew history. The Hebrews incorrectly deified people. The OT is one big misidentification.

      Simply put, I reject any story which depicts God as violent.

      Further, There is no difference between Hebrews and any other person. We all come from the same stock.

      We should stop referring to people as Hebrew, Hindu, Muslim or Christian. We are all connected to one another. We are all part of the same energy.

      The whole point of Hubpages is for discussion, Q&A. The questions are for clarification.

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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      I can see why you have some issues with specific historical events but these subjects are well outside the scope of this hub.

      I am working on a hub which will look at NT works and pseudepigrapha. I maintain that God is in control of everything so it could be stated that "Star Wars" was divinely inspired. There is a clear difference between the concept of inspiration and the spoken word of God. You have not addressed what you think a bible is. To me the word bible could mean many different things.

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      Jay C OBrien 3 years ago from Houston, TX USA

      As best I can figure out the Answers are:

      Q1 Does God Order the killing of one person by another?

      A1 Yes

      Q2 What do you think God is like?

      A2 What do you say?

      Q3 Does God vacillate between being peaceful and violent?

      A3 Yes or No?

      Observation: from the above answers, God is Schizophrenic. This is based on my understanding of your answers. Therefore I wish to clarify your answers. I agree, to call God schizophrenic is blasphemy, but I did Not do that.

      Q4 Where did you get these ideas or training?

      or Did you attend a theological school?

      Q5 Are all the books of the Bible divinely inspired?

      or which book(s) do You receive as scripture?

      Q6 Are any of the books of the Bible Not divinely inspired?

      A6 You wrote, "Clearly where there are irreconcilable contradictions in matter commonly construed to be scripture then it cannot God speaking through man."

      Yes, I agree. If you and I know better than to be violent to each other, surely God knows this as well as He is better than us. Therefore I see a contradiction between a command to kill by God (the covenant in The Book of Joshua) and the moral principal of God not to kill. See Q1.

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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      Your A2 does not take in context the nature of God. God is above human emotions. We might see God's works as being one thing or another. Do not try to ape God.

      I find your A3 observation to be blatantly blasphemous. These are your thoughts or statements; "Observation".

      Regarding Q4 I have personally studied theology for the past 7 years, drawing knowledge and conclusions from many sources.

      Regarding Q5 you have not stated what bible, which edition, etc, you are talking about. Perhaps you think every bible is divine. Every bible contradicts another. Where does this leave you?

      Regarding Q6 you raised issues with the entire Tanakh and wished only to consider works written up to 70 years after the Messiah's ministry. This article takes certain bible references as a given although some are not certain and these have often been noted above. Clearly where there are irreconcilable contradictions in matter commonly construed to be scripture then it cannot God speaking through man. This issue not withstanding, many biblical texts are corrupted. Perhaps the best example of this would be a KJV, Matthew, Chpt.1. Here we encounter a God who cannot count. The Cup article tries to reconcile known facts with divergent views by mainstream and other forms of religion. Mainstream religion does not attempt to reconcile the obvious errors in their sources or teachings.

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      Jay C. O'Brien 3 years ago

      As best I can figure out the Answers are:

      Q1 Does God Order the killing of one person by another?

      A1 Yes

      Q2 What do you think God is like?

      A2 Merciful and also Angry, yin and yang, punishes and rewards

      Q3 Does God vacillate between being peaceful and violent?

      A3 Yes

      Observation: from the above answers, God is Schizophrenic.

      Q4 Where did you get these ideas or training?

      Q5 Are all the books of the Bible divinely inspired?

      Q6 Are any of the books of the Bible Not divinely inspired?

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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      The article clearly shows God's "mercy" and also his "anger". God created night and day, life and death, yin and yang. He creates our eternal soul then places us within a finite world. God cannot be compared to anyone. He is exalted and the only entity deserving of worship. His Law states explicitly punishment and reward. "Do", "Do not". Maybe Job from the Tanakh would help your understanding. God created the Demons/Jinn and the sons of Adam. Both Iblees and Yashua.

      If he can allow the elite of Jerusalem to nail his designated son to a cross then what makes any other human born of a woman exempt from punishment? Whatever form death takes, God is in control of the matter. His Judgement will decide the matter of guilt or innocence and it is righteous. Yes God allows killing, it doesn't mean he approves of a particular act resulting in death.

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      Jay C. O'Brien 3 years ago

      I am confused. You wrote, "Joshua is clearly favored by YHWH and under his later rule Israel acted in accordance with the will of the Great One (Josh.24:31), on a level never quite repeated."

      Are you saying that God Does order the killing of one person by another?

      What do you think God is like?

      Does God vacillate between being peaceful and violent?

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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      "The Eternal Covenant & Ark Of Testimony" references Joshua 6:6-13 purely in the context of Moses' Ark being the focal point of Israel's strength. I probably should also have referenced Numbers 14:44. The differences are significant though. In the first instance Joshua is a commander of men but Moses holds the true authority. In the succeeding instance, Moses is no more and the Israelites have entered Israel. In Numbers 14:38 Joshua is clearly favoured by YHWH and under his later rule Israel acted in accordance with the will of the Great One (Josh.24:31), on a level never quite repeated. If you saw someone about to murder a child would you not act against the person? Perhaps you should argue your case on the will of God on Judgement Day for certainty.

      Regarding the Qur'an, anyone can show you passages where pagans are to be killed, dead. Of course Mohammad didn't begin his ministry in this way. He was alone and persecuted, yet most forgiving. Later he received specific revelations through Gabriel before fighting.

      Regarding Krishna theology, Krishna appears to be a priest or prophet but is clearly taghut. Devotees appear to appeal to the higher authority of Govinda/Vishnu when Krishna cannot oblige them (Bhag. Gita2:9). Krishna actually commands Arjuna to fight and kill (Bhag. Gita2:18).

      Both the OT and Islam teach the higher way of Abel over Cain (READ Moses' Law Is Not Fulfilled; above) but evil abounds and mortal combat is too frequently necessitated. The blood sacrifice of the Messiah is in line with this teaching. Note this, his return will not be a passive one.

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      Jay C OBrien 3 years ago from Houston, TX USA

      You wrote:

      "From the tone of your article you have not considered why Joshua was ordered to commit genocide. These Canaanite people had a twisted religion that impacted heavily on Israel (see for example 2Sam.5:20-21) in later centuries. Some of these religious systems required child sacrifice and other things I'm not interested in discussing. "

      Let us be clear: The Lord never ordered Joshua to commit genocide. We know this because God/Krishna/Yahweh/Allah does not and never has ordered killing of anyone. Agreed?

      Yes, the Canaanites may have done child sacrifice, but killing is not the answer. Agreed?

      Citations were given for completeness.

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      theomajor 3 years ago from New Zealand

      I will try to respond in brief. YHWH is God, the only and eternal. His most dramatic order was the baptism of Earth which marked the end of the First Age. Only eight men and women survived to represent humanity. There is solid scientific evidence for the Great Deluge. It should be obvious that by telling Noah to prepare the Ark vessel he knows the beginning from the end. God is in control, not man, nor some demonic entity that Christians named Lucifer (the Roman-Catholic encyclopedia does not support this Luciferian doctrine). From the tone of your article you have not considered why Joshua was ordered to commit genocide. These Canaanite people had a twisted religion that impacted heavily on Israel (see for example 2Sam.5:20-21) in later centuries. Some of these religious systems required child sacrifice and other things I'm not interested in discussing. Without the OT the NT would not exist, this is why I usually refer to both in my references. Moses declared to Israel the curses that would come upon them for not adhering to the Torah. That included enslavement and war. What you probably do not realise is that significant parts of any bible, OT and NT, as well as prophetic parts of Islamic theology are based on ideas first recorded through the books of Enoch.

      I have to say some obvious things regarding the holocausts, plural. Early christians distanced themselves from Judaism and Messianic Jews some centuries after the Messiah. The Roman Emperors ensured the rifts became fractures. Eventually greater persecutions arose like the medieval Disputations as well as apartheid and mass murder throughout Europe with the final key event being the rise of Nazism. Martin Luther and the Roman-Catholic Church were key players in a number of these dark events.

      I am working on some NT specific hubs but they involve a lot more research yet. Your comments are at times somewhat removed from the content of this hub and you should not make lengthy bible quotes in future.

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      Jay C OBrien 3 years ago from Houston, TX USA

      SEE BOOK OF JOSHUA

      After the death of Moses the servant of the Lord, the Lord spoke to Joshua son on Nun, Moses’ assistant, saying, “My servant Moses is dead. Now proceed to cross the Jordan, you and all this people, into the land that I am giving to them, to the Israelites. Every place that the sole of your foot will tread upon I have given to you, as I promised to Moses.” 1:1-3

      Then they devoted to destruction by the edge of the sword all in the city (Jericho), both men and women, young and old, oxen, sheep, and donkeys. 6:21

      Then the Lord said to Joshua, “Do not fear or be dismayed; take all the fighting men with you, and go up now to Ai. See, I have handed over to you the king of Ai with his people, his city and his land. You shall do to Ai and its king as you did to Jericho and its king; only its spoil and its livestock you may take as booty for yourselves. Set an ambush against the city, behind it.” 8:1-2

      Then the Lord said to Joshua, “Stretch out the sword that is in your hand toward Ai: for I will give it into your hand.” 8:18

      And the Lord said to Joshua, “Do not be afraid of them (See 12:7-24 for a list of Kings of the “Holy Land”), for tomorrow at this time I will hand over all of them slain, to Israel; you shall hamstring their horses, and burn their chariots with fire.” 11:6

      God does not make war. The God who makes war is not God at all. God does not order the death of women and children. No land is holy if it is gotten through killing people. There never was a covenant between God and the Israelites. God does not select nations to kill for him and reward them with land. Stop teaching that there was a covenant or a “Holy Land.” Do not teach the Old Testament, there is no justification for it.

      The Book of Joshua (first oral tradition) was written down as a political statement used by the Rabbis to motivate their army and justify their claim to the “Holy Land” by Divine right. In reading the Bible from beginning to end, Christians must read the Jewish version of events before they even get to the story of Jesus. The Old Testament is a false claim of Divine right. Christians do not need Judaism to be Christian. Teach only the New Testament, a God of peace, not war.

      God does not order a Holocaust. The Holocaust of the Jews by the Germans is documented in Holocaust museums around the world. It is time for the Jews to acknowledge the Holocaust of the Canaanites by the Jews within the Holocaust museums.