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The Trinity Doctrine is Illogical

Updated on January 28, 2018
PlanksandNails profile image

PlanksandNails' goal is to be a catalyst in encouraging the followers of Christ to pursue Biblical truth for themselves.

The Trinity doctrine is the foundation of the modern church system. The seminaries of men birth their church clergy to indoctrinate the masses by twisting Scripture to worship a God whom they call a 'Trinity.' Unfortunately, many take their beliefs for granted without questioning what they have been taught. When one critically looks at the Trinity doctrine, it becomes a theory much like evolution that cannot be substantiated. On the surface, Trinity doctrine may seem plausible, but it must use eisegesis, lots of bias and cherry-picked Scripture verses. However, under critical examination when the entirety of Scripture is taken into consideration, the Trinity is nowhere to be found.

Those that teach the Trinity have to resort to words and explanations that are not found anywhere in Scripture in an attempt to explain something that is illogical and cannot be proven. The Trinity is merely a hypothesis formulated by ecclesiastical men using conjecture that must be imagined into Biblical text and theorized through guesswork.

Would anyone base their spirituality on human invention and speculation?

It seems so.

With the modern church system, esteemed titled men are deemed to be the professional teachers and purveyors of man-made doctrine where they convey a conception that has been systematically developed into a paradoxical notion. When we rely on select men to give their renditions of God, we find that Trinity dogma becomes an unintelligible expression that becomes meaningless, incoherent, contradictory and nonsensical.

And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? So with yourselves, IF WITH YOUR TONGUE YOU UTTER SPEECH THAT IS NOT INTELLIGIBLE, HOW WILL ANYONE KNOW WHAT IS SAID? For you will be speaking into the air. – 1 Corinthians 14:8

1+1+1 = 1
1+1+1 = 1

Fitting Square Pegs Into Round Holes

In order for the Trinity doctrine to fit into Scripture, it must be butchered by adding or taking away from Scripture. The worst culprits are men who are part of the modern church system because they fail to rightly divide the word of truth and do not use the pattern of sound words. In fact, it is the traditions of men that perpetuate a futile exercise of claiming 1+1+1 = 1.

To even attempt to understand the Trinity, one would have to spend endless amounts of hours of theological speculations and still must concede that it is a paradox and illogical.

It is interesting that those who deny the Trinity are deemed as heretics or part of a cult. The reality is that ad hominem attacks are all the ammunition that they have against anyone poking holes in their man-made theories.

Why would anyone rely on church clergy and creeds to tell them what to believe in?

We are all capable in this day and age of looking into Scripture and testing it with the original languages to find the truth for ourselves.

He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to REBUKE THOSE WHO CONTRADICT IT. – Titus 1:9

At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and REVEALED THEM TO LITTLE CHILDREN – Matthew 11:25

Man-made doctrine.
Man-made doctrine.

The theory of modern Christianity is based on the terminologies and concepts of the Trinity that are missing from Scripture. Rather, they have originated and were conceived in the minds of men. These men do not understand the words of Christ because they believe they are wise in their own theories, hypotheses, speculations, notions, conjecture, guesswork and a lot of wishful thinking in the conveyance of their doctrine.

Isn’t it ironic that they have framed credentials upon their walls, but Scripture give them no credence anywhere?

The Fallible Claims

Men with doctorates of Divinity use their imaginations with unbiblical concepts and call it 'truth.' Many have fallen for their presentations explaining the concept of what 'triune' means, but you will find nowhere in the interlinear, dictionaries and lexicons where God (Elohim) means three in one.

The lack of exegesis is an epidemic among self-professed church ministers. In the real world, unscholarly presentations on various different subjects would rip apart their works of fiction to shreds.

There are many Scripture verses that seem to allude a Trinity, but these are simply cherry-picked illusions that have been masterfully compiled to deceive the gullible into believing God is a hypostasis of a triunity or some other form of gobbledygook.

Supposed Popular 'Proof' Texts

For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and THESE THREE ARE ONE. – 1 John 5:7

The problem with this above verse is that it is not Scripture at all. Many Bibles do not contain these words because they have been proven to have been added. The evidence reveals that this verse is not adequately supported by the original manuscripts. In fact, it does not appear in any manuscript pre fifteenth century.

I and my Father ARE ONE. – John 10:30


Does 1+1= 1?

If we apply logic, we should understand that anything that is of or from something is not the same thing no matter who or what it is.

A father and his son cannot be the same person, but what can be said is that different people can be one in unity, purpose and even in spirit.

Christ never said, 'I and my Father are one God,' but this is how Trinitarians cherry-pick verses to impose their eisegesis into something that is not there. It is unfortunate that even little children could understand what is revealed in the following text.

For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) But to us there is but ONE GOD, THE FATHER, of whom are all things, and we in him; AND ONE LORD JESUS CHRIST, by whom are all things, and we by him. – 1 Corinthians 8:5-6

1+1=2. One God, the Father and one Lord, Jesus Christ equals two different entities. The math is unbelievably easy, but when talking to the church officials, they will say that we need to throw our brains away and believe their fairy tales that utterly defies logical comprehension.

When we throw out church indoctrination and simply read the words and do the simple math, the logical conclusion couldn’t be easier. We don’t have to guess or speculate unless we allow others to think for us.

For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I CAME OUT from God. I CAME FORTH from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father. – John 16:27-28

Christ did not come out from the Trinity, but came out from the one God, the Father. He came out from the Father and all else would come through him.

In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: FOR BY HIM WERE ALL THINGS CREATED, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created BY HIM, and FOR HIM: And he is BEFORE ALL THINGS, and BY HIM all things consist. – Colossians 1:14-17

Christ was the firstborn of the dead. All those born of the spirit would become new creations among the ekklesia as part of the Kingdom of God headed by Christ.

AND THERE WAS GIVEN HIM DOMINION, AND GLORY, AND A KINGDOM, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. – Daniel 7:14

The Kingdom was given to Christ by His Father. Christ is not God, but the Son of God. He is a man who was the firstborn of the dead who is the image of the invisible Father.

For there is one God, AND ONE MEDIATOR between God and men, the MAN Christ Jesus – 1 Timothy 2:5


1+1=2. One God plus one mediator equals two entities. No Trinity here. It is illogical for one to be both. By simply reading the above verse, it becomes crystal clear that there is no Trinity to be found.

I am going to the Father, for THE FATHER IS GREATER THAN I. – John 14:28

When all things are subjected to him, then THE SON HIMSELF WILL ALSO BE SUBJECTED TO HIM WHO PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIM, that God may be all in all. – 1 Corinthians 15:28

But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and GOD IS THE HEAD OF CHRIST. – 1 Corinthians 11:3

That the God OF OUR Lord Jesus Christ, THE FATHER of glory, may give you the Spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of him – Ephesians 1:17

There is no equilateral Trinity here in these above verses at all.

The Trinitarian will use their favourite pet verses to allude to a Trinity, but with all the verses that they quote there must be a preconceived notion applied to the verse because there is never any explicit terms in the text that states, 'three in one.'

Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT – Matthew 28:19

Where is there proof of three in one Trinity?

Does mentioning three things make them three separate persons of a multi-person God?

The fact is, the names are not one identity, but they are in unity in purpose of authority, which is of the Father that was given to His Son in His Holy Spirit. The disciples were commanded to do nothing until they received the Holy Spirit.

And while staying with them he ordered them not to depart from Jerusalem, BUT TO WAIT FOR THE PROMISE OF THE FATHER, which, he said, “you heard from me; for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” – Acts 1:4-5

In Matthew, it says that Christ was conceived by the Holy Spirit. If the Holy Spirit is a separate person from the Father, then it would make the Holy Spirit the 'Father' rather than the Father.

It should be common sense that Christ is not the Son of the Holy Spirit, but the Son of Yahweh, the Father who is the only on true God.

And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and THE POWER OF THE MOST HIGH will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy—the Son of God. – Luke 1:35

He will be great and will be called the SON OF THE MOST HIGH. – Like 1:32

The 'Most High' refers to the Father, not a separate person called, 'God the Holy Spirit.' The Spirit of God and the Holy Spirit are the same Spirit. It is the power that God possesses who gives gifts by His power to those who are begotten of Him.

If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will THE HEAVENLY FATHER GIVE THE HOLY SPIRIT TO THOSE WHO ASK HIM!” – Luke 11:13

Christ has an intimate relationship with his Father. Both the Father and Son possess the same spirit and impart it to us. They both dwell in those who are among the ekklesia. Again, Christ said, 'I and the Father are one.' We too become one in spirit with them when we are born again.

When Christ ascended to the right hand of the Father, he became part of the spirit that was in unity with the Father. We can see in the following verses that the Spirit of Truth (Spirit of the Father) is in unity with Christ and all who follow him are one of the same spirit, not a separate third person of a Trinity.

And when they bring you before the synagogues and the rulers and the authorities, do not be anxious about how you should defend yourself or what you should say, for THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL TEACH YOU in that very hour what you ought to say.” – Luke 12:11-12

When they deliver you over, do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say, for what you are to say will be given to you in that hour. For it is not you who speak, but the SPIRIT OF YOUR FATHER SPEAKING THROUGH YOU. – Matthew 10:19-20

God, the Father is greater than His Son. The Son is in subjection to the Father who freely gave all things to him.

Jesus, knowing that THE FATHER HAD GIVEN ALL THINGS INTO HIS HANDS, and that he had come from God and was going back to God – John 13:3

The Spirit of God is the same spirit that Christ has in himself, which is the same spirit that all of his followers have too. The Spirit of Truth and the Comforter is Christ's spirit that is one with his Father.

“I will not leave you as orphans; I WILL COME TO YOU. – John 14:18

In that day you will know that I AM IN MY FATHER, and YOU IN ME, and I IN YOU. – John 14:20

‘I am going away, and I WILL COME TO YOU.’ – John 14:28

A Simple Test on the Concept of Hypostatic Union

It is interesting that the Trinitarians insist on using the term 'God the Son,' yet with simple reading, the Son of God is quite evident as the proper title in Scripture.

The foundation of the Trinitarian faith is a mystery as they say. They insist on using unscriptural words (a language of mystery) to define what they believe and even have their own 'math' they like to use.

A simple test to see whether the phrase 'hypostatic union' is possible is to try to fill one glass (100%) with milk up to the brim. Then try filling that very same glass with an equal amount (100%) of water.

After you clean up the mess that you have made, take another glass and fill it 50% with milk and then add 50% water to the same glass bringing the glass to 100% full.

Then think about whether it is possible to have both 100% man and 100% God at the same time.

The result of the experiment should conclude that when one liquid is diminished or elevated, it is impossible to be fully either at the same time in one vessel. It would be illogical, a contradiction of substance.

Here is is an interesting conversation.

Joe asked a Trinitarian for five dollars, and he responded, 'I don’t have five dollars.' However, Joe noticed that he was holding a five dollar bill in his hand.

He then questioned him and asked, 'Why did you lie to me?'

The Trinitarian replied, 'When I said I didn’t have five dollars, I meant that in my right hand I did not have it. However, it is true that in my left hand I do have five dollars.'

Joe responded, 'Either you have the five dollars, or not.'

'How can you have, and then not have five dollars at the same time?'

© 2015 PlanksandNails

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    • Rich kelley profile image

      Rich Kelley 

      3 years ago from The Ekklesia

      Luke 7:28 "I say to you, among those born of women there is o one greater than John; yet He who is least in the Kingdom of God is greater than he."

      Matthew 11:11 "Truly I say to you, among those born of women there has not arisen anyone greater than John the Baptist! Yet the one who is least in the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than he.

      "both were men, both were sent by God and both were witnesses."


    • profile image


      3 years ago from those of the Ecclesia

      PandN- If I can just add to your comment to Earl in that Jesus was not the only man sent by God as a witness, but sent John the Baptist, who also was a man. Note in John 1:6-8 (NKJV) it states 6 There was a MAN sent by God whose name was John. 7 This man came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all through him might believe. 8 He was not the Light, but was SENT to bear WITNESS of that Light.

      Just like Jesus was SENT to bear WITNESS of the Kingdom and truth, John was SENT to bear WITNESS of the Light who was Jesus Christ. But it should be said that in the four gospels the main focus is on Jesus as it should be.

      Although John was NOT born of a virgin birth, he was sent by God as a witness just as Jesus was sent by God as a witness. Both, who witnessed, had a different purpose. But the task given to both were vital. Both had an interest in the Gospel of the Kingdom. This is made clear in Matthew 3: 1-2 (NKJV) which states 1 In those days John the Baptist came preaching in the wilderness. 2 and saying." Repent, for the Kingdom of heaven is at hand." John's statement in this verse is almost word for word in Jesus statement noted in Matthew 4:17 which states; 17 From that time Jesus began to preach and to say; " Repent, for the Kingdom of heaven is at hand."

      It is without a doubt that Jesus had a much greater purpose and task to be fulfiled. And God gave Jesus the power and authority to do so. But both were men, both were sent by God and both were witnesses.

      This, as PandN explains, is also the same task Jesus has given to His disciples, to spread the Kingdom message just as Jesus and John the Baptist had done.

      And now Jesus Christ is seated at the right hand of God, as we, his ecclesia continue spreading the Kingdom message.

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      Jesus Christ was not just man, but a man his Father sent into the world. All disciples of Jesus Christ too are also sent into the world. Jesus said, "They are not of this world JUST AS I am not of this world.” When Jesus Christ rose from the dead, he anointed his disciples with the Holy Spirit and sent them out into the world, just as the Father sent him at the Jordan River. (John 10:36)

      "They are not of this world just as I am not of the world."

      "Just as You sent me into this world, I have sent them into the world."

      "Just as the Father has sent Me, I also send you. And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit."

      Jesus Christ is God’s anointed one who did Kingdom signs and wonders while he was on the earth with the authority to forgive sins. He testified as a MAN that his word and works were not of his own, but the Father who sent him.

      Jesus announced that he was sending his disciples just as the Father had sent him, and when he anointed them with the Spirit, he said to them, "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they have been retained." Jesus had been given the authority to forgive sins in the same manner. When his God and Father anointed the MAN Jesus Christ with the Spirit at the Jordan, the Father had authorized this MAN to forgive sins.

      There were some men who were completely unaware that such authority to forgive sins had been given by God to this MAN, Jesus. On one occasion some men brought a paralytic to Jesus, and seeing the faith of these men, Jesus forgave the paralytic's sins. The Pharisees objected and declared that only God Himself had the authority to forgive sins, but Jesus demonstrated their error by showing them that the son of MAN had authority on earth to forgive sins, that is, a MAN had been given this authority. Jesus did this by asking them a question, "Which is easier to say, "Your sins are forgiven," or "rise up and walk." So to prove he had this authority to forgive sins, Jesus demonstrated he had the authority to do something even greater - to completely heal a paralyzed man and cause him to walk. He healed the paralytic who rose up, picked up his pallet, and walked home. Jesus clearly demonstrated to the Pharisees that a MAN, he himself, had been given authority to forgive sins by demonstrating he had the authority to do something even greater.

      And so, we read in the Scriptures that the onlooking crowd was absolutely amazed that God had indeed given such authority to men. Jesus had proven that the Pharisee's declaration - that only God could forgive sins - was now completely wrong. God had given the authority to forgive sins to a MAN. This MAN had been anointed with the Father's Holy Spirit and was authorized to forgive sins in his Father's name. Everything Jesus did was according to his Father's will and in his Father's name.

      The English word "apostle" is simply a form of the Greek noun apostolos. The verb form of this word, apostello, means to send out. Jesus was sent by his God and Father. Jesus was his Father's Apostle. The MAN Jesus was sent into the world in the name of his God.

      Just like his disciples who were not of this world and sent into the world, Jesus too was not of this world and sent into the world. He was sent into the world from the Jordan River when he was anointed with the Holy Spirit,

      "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me wherefore He has anointed me... He has sent me."

      Anointing this MAN with the Holy Spirit at the Jordan, God had sent a MAN into the world to do His will.

    • profile image


      3 years ago

      P&N, if there is no triunity then Jesus was just a man then?

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      You keep coming back??? Now you must resort to threats, fear tactics and manipulation. You have exposed yourself as a "Jezebel" under that spirit that is controlling you. Of course you would say that I would have my head handed to me. Don't waste your time here with your cult propaganda. Your comment will be allowed as proof to others to aware of people like you. All further comments will be promptly deleted.

    • lionswhelp profile image


      3 years ago

      Now you have Jesus Christ peeved at you for slandering his name and his Egalitarian work with the Holy Spirit by saying they do not teach God's truths. Now you have the Holy Spirit as Jezebel - pure blasphemy! You will more than likely get your head handed to you some day in the future to see just what you believe is you foundation 1 Corinthians 3:10-15. It is a matter of how much the Elohim Godhead will put up with you and your Gnostic Semi-arian or is it modalistic philosophies but still Gnostic. Cheer up Christ will be here soon and will reward you with what you deserve, Revelation 22:12-13. Even the Kabbalah knows that the Shekinah glory is the female Holy Spirit. I don't follow them and their Babylonian Talmud and Noahide Laws. Neither did Jesus Christ Yeshua. Be careful how you refer to Ruach haKadosh, she has her own power Zachariah 4:6. Also all Three are Holy Spirits because the Father is Holy, Jesus is Holy and so is Ruach HaKadosh Holy as Elohim and Yahweh. Jesus said out of His own mouth that they are Spirit, John 4:24.

      No ,no I am an independent follower of Jesus Christ that keeps God's Holy Sabbath day and Holy Days. How about you? Adventist are Gnostic Cathars that have a Freemason hiearchy leadership. We follow Jesus Servant leadership examples, Matthew 20:25-28, and at Passover, John 13:1-17. Why can't you understand me? I never liked being a hatchet man. The last guy wouldn't give up his gnostic ways either and went the way of all flesh very quickly. Hopefully, God will forgive you for not knowing what you are doing. Cheerio

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      A sect is a subgroup of a religious, political or philosophical belief system, usually an offshoot of a larger religious group as you have admitted being an independent Adventist Christian.

      You have failed to answer my questions concerning the leader who is over you in your hierarchal group. Man-made hierarchy ignores the principles of the Kingdom of God as the greatest in the Kingdom is a servant, which disqualifies you, your sect and its doctrines on that basis.

      (("So you don't beleve what the God of Israel - Jesus Christ taught Moses to write according to the OT in Genesis 1-2, or He taught Nicodemus in John 3:3-8,16"))

      Why would you ask this question?

      Did you not read the article?

      No, I don't. I don't believe that Jesus is God; therefore, not the God of Israel.

      (("Keep trying but remember Isaiah 8:20. You can only understand God's Word if you let the Holy Spirit teach you, John 16:13, 1 Corinthians 2:4-16. Also Mother Wisdom the Holy Spirit - Chokmah says this to you in Proverbs 1:20-33; 6:20."))

      I am familiar with feminist theology, it is simply eisegesis. Just like the examples I gave you in my last comment, in the same manner you use "Wisdom" as "proof" that the Holy Spirit is female. I guess you would have me believe too that the personification of Abel's blood that cried from the ground means that it is a person.

      What you are doing is taking Scripture verses and stripping them of their context and them bringing them together to support your false doctrine. The fact is that your doctrine is can be traced to the mystical writings of Kabbalah.

      You essentially offer the same "arguments" as the Jewish, Mormon, Catholic, feminist and New Age groups as you appeal to Scripture for "support."

      Your use of Hebrew has proven to be superficial and does not harmonize with the rest of Scripture because it is eisegeses.

      (("The Holy Spirit wanted me to help you."))

      Yeah, as if I haven't heard this phrase before. Take your Jezebel doctrine somewhere else.

      But I have this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess and is teaching and seducing my servants to practice sexual immorality and to eat food sacrificed to idols. - Revelation 2:20

      Your comments are no longer tolerated as you have exposed yourself for who you are.

    • lionswhelp profile image


      3 years ago

      Oh, I see a real weird Idea. I like some of your hubs though. I don't belong to any sect but am a independent Seventh Day Christian that keeps God's Holy Days. How about you? So you don't beleve what the God of Israel - Jesus Christ taught Moses to write according to the OT in Genesis 1-2, or He taught Nicodemus in John 3:3-8,16. Most people like you ignore Jesus Teachings for the teachings of men. I understand very well how Gnostics and Semi-Arians work and even Modalist. It is very hard to understand the identity of the Holy Spirit for some. Keep trying but remember Isaiah 8:20. You can only understand God's Word if you let the Holy Spirit teach you, John 16:13, 1 Corinthians 2:4-16. Also Mother Wisdom the Holy Spirit - Chokmah says this to you in Proverbs 1:20-33; 6:20.

      Oh ,I saw one of your hubs hanging around on my ralated hubs section on one of my hubs. The Holy Spirit wanted me to help you . At first I thought it would be a waste of time but She insisted. So did Jesus Christ and our Holy Father insist that I help you. I was out numbered Three to one. I hope you will be successful with whatever you think you are doing. See 2 Peter 1:20-21. Have a nice day

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      It is interesting that the Trinitarians insist on using the term "God the Son," yet with simple reading, the Son of God is quite evident as the proper description in Scripture.

      The foundation of the "trinitarian faith is a "mystery" as they say. They insist on using unscriptural words (language of mystery) to define what they believe, and even have their own "math" they like to use.

      A simple test to see whether "hypostatic union" is "possible" is to try to fill one glass (100%) with milk up to the brim. Then try filling that very same glass with an equal amount (100%) of water.

      After you clean up the mess you have made, take another glass and fill it 50% with milk and then add 50% water to the same glass bringing the glass to 100% full.

      Then think about the phrase, "Both 100% man and 100% God at the same time."

      The result of the experiment should conclude that when one liquid is diminished, or elevated, it is impossible to be fully either at the same time in one vessel. It would be a logical contradiction of substance.

      Joe asked the Trinitarian for five dollars, and she responded, “I don’t have five dollars, but he noticed that she was holding a five dollar bill in her hand.

      He questioned her and asked, "Why did you lie?"

      The Trinitarian replied, “When I said I didn’t have five dollars, I meant that in my right hand I did not have it, although it is true that in my left hand I do have five dollars.”

      Joe responded,"Either you have the five dollars, or not." "How can you have have, and not have five dollars at the same time?

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      Maybe you are still unclear, or English might be your second language and you do not understand fully what I am saying to you. Again, I am not part of any organized religious group, or sect. I do not ascribe to any group where their doctrines can be traced back to a certain man, or woman. Pointing me to the Messianics and Steve Santini shows me that you have been heavily indoctrinated into a man-made hierarchal sect.

      Who is your leader over you in your Seventh Day Adventist religious group? What is his name?

      Are you trying to tell me that because a Hebrew noun is feminine that it necessitates a feminine, or female thing?

      You said,

      (("The Spirit Ruach HaKadosh is a female because Ruach is a Feminine noun here."))

      By your reasoning, since "Torah" is also a feminine noun, then the laws must only apply to women. Also, it would mean that Pharaoh (Genesis 41:8) and Jacob (Genesis 45:27) who are identified as “ruach,” (feminine noun) are females also.

      You said,

      (("I know its hard to understand the right trunity when you reject the Holy Spirit Ruach HaKadosh as a member of the Elohim Godhead. Look at it this way: 1+1+1= 3 as Elohim plural 1."))

      In similar manner, you use the word Elohim and imply it necessitates a "trinity" because it is a plural Hebrew word. This is simply wishful thinking and must be imagined into the Biblical text because there is nothing that precisely says “trinity,” "triunity," or "three in one." Elohim occurs more than 2500 times in the Hebrew text with various meanings from Egyptian deities (Exodus 12:12) to "the god of Moab" (1 Kings 11:33). Elohim also refers to demons and seraphim and other supernatural entities (1 Samuel 28:13).

      Elohim does not describe a "trinity," but the Father's domain and the individual(s) it refers to. The One God, the Father is YHWH; therefore, Elohim would be His DOMAIN of having ALL power, authority, magnificence, excellence, etc...

      When Elohim refers to an angel (s), it is delegated as sub-DOMAIN of the Father and then to a personal name if identified. In the same manner, when humans are referred to as Elohim ("kings" and "prophets"), they too are a sub-DOMAIN of the Father.

      Since your Seventh Day Adventist sect, which has a hierarchal structure, I reject any doctrine that comes from it as it denies the principles of the Kingdom of God for man's traditions.

    • Rich kelley profile image

      Rich Kelley 

      3 years ago from The Ekklesia

      Matthew 4:3 And the tempter came and said to Him, "If You are the Son of God, command that these stones become bread."

      Matthew 8:29 And they cried out, saying, "What business do we have with each other, Son of God? Have You come here to torment us before the time?"

      The devil and demons have no problem whatsoever $6 with who Jesus is. He is the Son of God and they know it. What a shame that self professing Christians only know what their religious doctrines teach. There truly are many different Jesus out there. May we all be drawn by the Father to the way the truth and the life.

      John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

      John 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.

    • lionswhelp profile image


      3 years ago

      Well Planks,

      It seems that you are a true Gnostic of some sort that seems to be semi-arianistic. Jesus Christ taught about a Triunity similar to the Jews teachings of theTorah. Jesus was the Torah in the OT as the God of Israel. He was the One that inspired Moses to write Genesis for us today. We can see the Father in Genesis 1:1 and John 1:1-14. Genesis 1:2 Moses wrote here that The Spirit Ruach HaKadosh is a female because Ruach is a Feminine noun here. Also Jesus spoke to Nicodemus in John 3:3-8 about how we need to be born of the Holy Spirit. Jesus Spoke in the Aramaic Syriac dialect Hebrew and would hae called the Spirit Ruach HaKadosh. I see two Beings Here plus verse 16, The Father is called the One who begot Jesus not the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit Conceived Jesus in Mary's womb as Jesus Godly Mother not another Father, Matthew 1:18-23, Luke 1:35. You need help so try reading this article about the Torah from a group of Messianics and Steve Santini - and . I hope this helps you. I know its hard to understand the right trunity when you reject the Holy Spirit Ruach HaKadosh as a member of the Elohim Godhead. Look at it this way: 1+1+1= 3 as Elohim plural 1.

      Have a nice Day,

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      I already answered your question. I am not part of any organized religion. Unless you want to address the content of the article, take your guessing games somewhere else.

    • lionswhelp profile image


      3 years ago

      Hmm, you seem like a Semi-Arian dualist like many of the WCG splinter groups who got their Cathar Gnostic teachings from the church of God Seventh Day which split from the Trinitarian 7th Day Adventist. Are you part of the Illuminati or Roscrucians, and the Knights Templars from that church in Scotland called the The Catholic Apostolic Church, a Protestant church?

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      I follow none of these, nor any other religious groups that have their origins in any man or woman. I consider myself among the Ekklesia and following the teachings of Jesus Christ and the Apostles and the principles of the Kingdom of God as set forth in Scripture.

    • lionswhelp profile image


      3 years ago


      Are you a Arianist or Semi-arian Gnostic? I agree that there is a false Trinity which is part of the Babylonian Mystery Religion mentioned in Revelation 17:1-5 and started by Nimrod and his mother in Genesis 10 :8-10, Genesis 11:1-8. There are also trinitarian Gnostic's like Pope Francis, and Pope Benedict and John Paul the 2nd who where and are Master Freemasons which are normally Dualistic like the Church of God 7th Day and other parts of the SDA splinter groups. the SDA has a Freemason leadership hierarchy. Ellen White and her husband James where both Freemasons even though they were trinitarians. but still gnostics. So yes there are false trinities and false dualistic churches and Arians that believe Jesus and the Holy Spirit were created by the Father God. Which do you follow or not follow?

    • profile image


      3 years ago from Clearwater, Florida

      Planks - It was after I left the church and found a ministry that actually teaches ALL that Christ taught, including the harder teachings, that I realized how badly off are the teachings within churchianity. Truth is God pulled me out of the false church so that He could lead me into the wilderness (where I am now). Those deceived by the false doctrines of churchianity are in danger, but I'm confident that God will, in His time, reach those within churchianity that can hear, with the Gospel of the coming Kingdom.

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      They do all their deeds to be SEEN BY OTHERS. For they make their phylacteries broad and their fringes long, and THEY LOVE THE PLACE OF HONOR at feasts and the BEST SEATS in the synagogues and greetings in the marketplaces and being called rabbi by others. But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brothers. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. Neither be called instructors, for you have one instructor, the Christ. The greatest among you shall be your servant. – Matthew 23:5-11

      Men who seek special status among the brothers and sisters in Jesus Christ are deluded into believing that their academic status on a piece of paper hung on the walls of the church from a denominational seminary gives them the right to have authority over God’s people. These men are in direct disobedience dishonoring the very words of Jesus Christ.

      And Jesus called them to him and said to them, “You know that those who are considered rulers of the Gentiles LORD IT OVER THEM, and their GREAT ONES EXERCISE AUTHORITY OVER THEM. But it shall not be so among you. – Mark 10:42-43

      Here is a verse never spoken among ecclesiastical men.

      Do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility COUNT OTHERS MORE SIGNIFICANT than yourselves. – Philippians 2:3

      There are no hierarchical expressions of titles among the Ekklesia, but expressions of function. We are fellow brethren, not superiors.

      Thank-you, I concur. God Bless.

    • profile image

      Neil Braithwaite 

      3 years ago

      Rich Kelly -

      Paul's words in Acts 20 to the elders at Ephesus imply that he wanted them to be aware of the many trials and tribulations that lay ahead for them as ambassadors for Christ. Paul also wanted to leave no doubt in their minds that "leadership" positions, by any worldly standard or definition, do NOT exist within the Ekklesia - only positions of service, and that being a servant does NOT carry with it any formal title used to distinguish them as greater or above any other believer, but simply men who embrace service to the Ekklesia as a sacrificial gift to God.

      It's clear from Paul's examples and teachings on the service of ministry that Jesus was his greatest influence. Speaking to His disciples on the issue of leadership, Jesus made it very clear that their ministries were NOT going to be like anything the world had ever seen before. In describing the worldly (Gentile) hierarchy model of leadership, Jesus said that while "great" men have positions as "rulers" and exercise "authority" over their subjects, it would NOT be this way among His disciples. Jesus' words imply that there will be NO ruling positions of authority among His disciples - only servants, and with that, those wishing to be "first" among them are to become a slave to ALL. Unfortunately, the position of vocational "pastor," within the corporate church system today is synonymous with the worldly hierarchy leadership model that Jesus described. And even more unfortunate, is that this worldly model is also widely accepted by a majority of Christians as a biblical standard. Today's hierarchical corporate church system is clearly at odds with the examples and teachings of both Jesus and Paul, and should be exposed as the unbiblical counterfeit system that it is.

      This is from a piece I wrote, "The Apostle Paul on Personal Rights and the Gospel"

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      The other points you bring up are certainly valid. I have come to realize that most of what is taught in the church system cannot be substantiated under critical examination. It is amazing the rhetoric that is sold in the "Christian" bookstores that leave the masses even more confused and deluded in their double-mindedness within their religion of "human techniques." I am encouraged that you think critically about these important issues.

      Thank-you for your comment, it is appreciated.

    • PlanksandNails profile imageAUTHOR


      3 years ago


      Thanks for the encouragement. God Bless.

    • Rich kelley profile image

      Rich Kelley 

      3 years ago from The Ekklesia

      Aaron you mentioned:

      “Isn’t it ironic that they have framed their “credentials” upon their walls?”

      Mar 13:2 And Jesus said to him, "Do you see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left upon another which will not be torn down." (NASB)

      The institution of religion has reversed everything Christ said would happen. The buildings including the temple were all destroyed. God destroyed the religious system of the time. Man has spent a little over two thousand years rebuilding the walls the schools and everything else needed to please man. Now that they have the walls they can hang their piece of paper. The religious system pleases mankind the fact they have walls which they can hang their boasting of self on. Spiritually I believe that if they don’t repent they will be twice dead.

      I search for words in the scripture and you know one that is absent in the Bible...........................Leadership. If we are servants as Christ called us to be we are not worried about leadership and credentials. There is one Head of the body and it is not The Reverend Dr. Soandso . If you are a shepherd to the body your fruit will show it, teacher, evangelist, etc. the fruit will speak for itself, not the title before your name. Look at all the men of scripture that were without titles wonder how they made it. What they were doing could be described with a word, but they didn't put it before their name.

      Keep feeding the flock


    • profile image


      3 years ago from Clearwater, Florida

      I agree with you regards the Trinity -the truth is that God is the Father, Christ is the Son and the Holy Spirit is the One who testifies of the Son. You comment that Trinitarian thinking is the foundation of the modern church system, and I agree that it's part of the foundation. The foundation contains at least one other key element: the watering down of the Gospel overall so that Christians are led to believe lies such as 1) Once saved always saved. 2) Upon salvation the heart is cleansed OR the heart is still in need of cleansing (true!), but the Christian is given human techniques for cleansing instead of being told that Christ is the architect of that process.

      3) The pre-trib rapture. This keeps Christians in a state of denial about the condition of our hearts, thus robbing the Christian from establishing a solid relationship with Christ; this puts the Christian at risk.

      I'm glad to see someone writing concerning the deeper things of God - voted up.

    • profile image


      3 years ago from those of the Ekklesia

      PandN- Another outstanding article. Keep up the good "works."

      God bless


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