This question is in specific reference to two important pieces of legislative evidence. Both, the 1st Amendment and the Treaty of Tripoli (Article 11). Keep in mind that the Treaty was ratified by many of the original founding fathers, and was signed into law by none other than John Adams in 1797.
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Jefferson was tutored by the Reverend James Maury, a learned man, in the finest classical tradition. He began the study of Latin, Greek, and French at the age of 9. He attended William and Mary College in Williamsburg at sixteen years old, then conti
Again, all of us are flawed. There is none righteous, not one. You simply need to read the news in any culture to validate this truth. Christians are people also with human flaws. Love, forgiveness and relationship is fundamental to Bible doctrine
d.william, you are ignoring historical facts that are all clearly documented. The First Amendment, also, was to protect religious practices from government interferance--quite the opposite from what you believe to be the case.
And you wonder why some heretics would be burned at the stake. They run around lawless (no moral foundations) proclaiming lawless actions & behavior, forming mini-tyrants in the process, chaos here they come!
please read my whole comment not just the part of it that irks you.
The U.S. is a nations of Christians, Buddhists, Jews, Muslims. non-believers and others. If the majority of the nation happens to believe in Christianity, then that is just a fact you have to accept--maybe not like--but must accept.
A signer Charles Carroll was born into a wealthy Roman Catholic family in Annapolis Maryland. He began his rather remarkable formal education at the age of 8, when he was packed off to France to attend a Jesuit College at St. Omer. He graduated the C
Ms Dee, regarding historical facts, I think that is what D.William said, "and that the government would not interfere in religious practices in the new world".
By the same token, neither did the Founders believe Christianity should be resisted or war attempted against it. The very government they designed was based on Christian principles with no intent on those founding principles being changed.
The founders wanted people to exercise their free will. If that free will resists Christianity, than that is exactly what they wanted. Christian principles once enslaved men and treated women as property. Thank God, for resistance to those principles
"intent of the founders was a free democracy" not true, it's a free Republic! Washington talks about a free REPUBLIC. Republics fall when moral values fall, history books can attest to that! History of the democratic Greeks, where are they today?
A Republic is in the Democracy tent. The will of the people is executed through the representatives they elect. I didn't disagree with the necessity for morals, just that we don't need Christianity to supply us with them.
Yes, the will of the people is executed through the representatives they elect, but many are lying to get elected. They hide their true beliefs even while swearing under oath on a bible. Power WILL corrupt the lawless.. GOD is them now!
junkseller, I'll take Christian principles over free will any day. I do not agree that it was the following Christian principles that men were led to enslave or degrade others. Other principles were at play, as well.
"[Slavery] was established by decree of Almighty God...it is sanctioned in the Bible, in both Testaments, from Genesis to Revelation..." - Jefferson Davis. Not an uncommon opinion at the time (and some still believe it).
junkseller, Jefferson Davis was not one of the nation's founders. That was decades, almost a century, after the nation's founding.
That's besides the point. It was one example from the multitude. You can find people using scriptural support for slavery and religious leaders who owned slaves going back throughout most of Christian history.
God commands the master to treat the slave well. Women, the old & children would have died after war if they were not taken in by the victory. No food, no protection, nothing!
junkseller, This thread is about the founding of the nation and whether "the Founding Fathers intended a Christian Nation". I'm trying to keep on topic.
I haven't disagreed with you, merely pointed out that those Christian principles haven't always been so terrific (e.g. slavery, Manifest Destiny) which is why we need thoughtfulness and free will versus rigid ideology.
junkseller, I agree with you that principles alone do not keep a society on a good track. It takes responsible people to adhere to them.
Very common, Wealth people hired tutors for their children of the cloth, signer William Williams studied theology with his father, Pastor of the First Congregational Church in Lebanon.
America certainly has a Christian heritage. However, America unlike other countries does not have a state religion. We do not imprison or persecute citizens or non citizens for their religious beliefs and speech.
Well said, America does have a Christian Heritage! The skeptics WOULD like to change history anyway the can, by spreading non-truths. Many of our founding fathers and their ancestries come from Europe and was Europe predominantly christian.
If you trace the philosophies of the founding fathers you'll find yourself at the Greeks and humanist philosophers of the enlightenment far more than you'll find yourself at the Bible.
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Exactly! So, freedom means free to follow whatever religion and no other power is to oppress it, as some other commenters here imply. I do not understand how some take Christianity as oppressing free will.
Hear, Hear, stated very well!
amusing. christianity (and all other organized cults) is the epitome of indoctrination/brainwashing techniques. No 'free will" there.
d. williams--no one says you have to follow a religion of any kind. It just says no laws can be enacted that would interfere with the right to a person's religious choice. I do not understand your comment
According to d.williams " I am deeply opposed to the indoctrination and brainwashing techniques that history has so distastefully imposed on all of the children of this world in the name of religion that only adds to the mental disturbances, anguish
Signer Robert Treat Paine was a native of Massachusetts, born in 1731. He was expected, by family tradition, to become a Minister. He got high marks at the Boston Latin School and was admitted to Harvard College, where he graduated in 1749. He taught
The Holy scriptures in the Bible clearly teaches us that we all have fallen natures. Every man, woman and child is capable of make good and bad choices; being wise or foolish. That does not in anyway take away from the truth of the scriptures.
These ignorantly biased religious "errors" of the past certainly cannot be used for any governmental religious foundations of today, or be allowed to influence our gov. Christianity is far from being all that is pertinent.
The question had to do with what was the *past* intent. Your response, d.william, is therefore off topic.
Without a moral direction to follow, society becomes lawless. This is happening right now in the western world. Our morals are attacked daily by men who dream up their own wisdom and call tradition beliefs fantasy. Hell or bust for them!
That is true. But our government is unique that we live the truth of the Bible by accepting others and respecting their right to their own beliefs. It seems however that many others want to reject, persecute and shut the mouths of Christians.
modern day christians still live in a fantasy world all their own. Thank god for diversity in this world.
As in the days of Kings & Princes (some of religious cloth) were tyrants and believed they were human-gods of & for the people. To mock ones belief is just another tyrant who sees themselves as greater than thou.
It a shame that the form of government by the people seemingly now no longer exists. Tyrants are back and they hate anything that is based on Christian morality. Judges making or changing our laws??? Their job is to uphold the constitution.