For those who believe the Bible is the infallible word of God, regarding Hebrews

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   Faith Reaperposted 9 years ago

   For those who believe the Bible is the infallible word of God, regarding Hebrews 10:26-27 ...
   
   What exactly does the following scripture mean to you?
   "For if we go on deliberately and willingly sinning after once acquiring the knowledge of the Truth, there is no longer any sacrifice left to atone for [our] sins [no further offering to which to look forward." (Hebrews 10:26-27) Does this mean that every time we sin, we have to go and be saved again?  Does this only apply if we turn completely away from the Lord God and deny He is Lord?  It is a bit puzzling to me, for I know Jesus said, "It is finished" and that His blood and what he went through on that cross and He rose, covered me.
   
   

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   Kiss andTalesposted 9 years ago

   Very good Question Faith Reaper.
   The Answer is there in God's word as always. First the scripture you quoted is very interesting and does make one wonder how can anyone be saved because we all sin, but as Jesus always use illustration there is also one in mind for this question,
   Think of an Insurance policy . We all know that a insurance life policy covers death, even if it was accidental , also natural death , but there is a clause that may say suicide is not covered Because it is self inflicting ,you purposely caused your death. And will end your coverage.
   The point is Jesus death is an example of a valuable policy that has covered many people and generations,of us for the future life, rather we die ,we can come back , rather we do not die  ,he paid our policy in full by his own death ,to walk into the New world under his own Government and Administration . To be future citizens .how wonderful and merciful the Heavenly Father is and Jesus for the love shown.
   
   Now can we cancel our policy in a spiritual way ! Yes ,The statement of the scripture tells us so as a clause in a life policy. Hebrews 10:26-27
   If you practice sin willfully after receiving accurate knowledge of truth ,there is no sacrifice for sins left.   
   
   References on the subject gives a good example ,like Judas,
   He worked against the God's Holy Spirit to betray his son Jesus.
   Remember Jesus quoted that he came to do the will of his Father who sent him and to finish his work.John 4:34
   
   At Math 12:31 says Blasphemy against the Spirit of God will not be forgiven. Any other can be forgiven.
   
   That is how valuable the life Jesus gave up to give us a future .we should not treat it like it is nothing.
   
   We must remember the Heavenly Father provided the cost of this policy
   He is the run that created the value and worth in our behalf and he gave us his very best .
   
   We can surely show our love and appreciation .

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Wonderful answer Kissadntales I love how you put it over.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you ladyiddler.

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      You are welcome dear

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: You got it! I still believe Judas was "a vessel" to fulfill scripture. Jesus went into the grave & "how mercy on whom He pleases." But it is our job to "Follow Him" & leave His business alone. Re: Deliberately (willfully) sinning: He

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you so much, Kiss and Tales, for sharing your insight into this scripture. Yes, indeed, how wonderful and merciful the Heavenly Father is and Jesus for the love shown! He paid the highest price for our sins. Praise Him!  Let us not turn away.

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      quildonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I love this answer, however according to the John Gill commentary, true believers do not sin in that way. Hebrews 10: 39 says, But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Ang: What is your definition of "shrink back & are destroyed?"

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine if u kno your scriptures u wil know that Judas fully fulfilled that scripture. Judas came from HELL & went back to hell he blasphemed the holy ghost. That is an unpardonable SIN. Yes he had to also the Jews for us Gentiles but they still P

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady: Not for me to say! But Jesus (The HS) TOLD Judas to do what he had to do! Script had to be fulfilled! I dont thk Jesus uses a vessel & throws away like man! We dont no what happened in the grave do we? He forgave Peter why not? Grace!

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       NORINE as we  all can see this question was asked by Faithreaper & not "U" i answered what she asked to the best of my ability. I owe you NO explanations so i think you can back your cart & take fresh load. I wonder then y did God created a h

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady:  U asked me about what I'd written re:Judas & I responded!  What's the problem? Didn't say what you've been "taught?"  Didn't ask u for explanation, just stating "truth!"

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Madam Norine...Though it be an angel from on high that preach any other GOSPEL LET IT BE A CURSE...Judas received NO GRACE he blasphemed with he turn down truth and betrayed the Messiah. Satan was in Heaven also a vessel GOD USED!!! WHERE IS HE 2DAY?

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady:"..But there are some that trouble u, & would pervert the gospel of Christ.."As said, we don't KNOW! HS told him to "GO," Not Satan!There's much not written in this Book.I'm not Jesus,  He how mercy on whom He pls! Did Satan Repent? Jus sayi

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine this is for you concerning Judas
       MARK 3:29 kJV
       
       29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Judas was a pic under holy spirit by God , next satan has always tested God's loyal servants, in this case  Judas  failed his test
       He was not Destin because anyone could have betrayed Jesus, those in the temple were already plotting his death Jews.

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Kiss and Tales thanks for your take on it as everyone is entitled to their opinion. However my own is that I DO NOT & will never believe Judas was saved. Judas was a vessel used by Satan.. yes the Jews were guilty as well and they did pay.. .P

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T:He thru money bk, confessed & could've "repented" in grave.I would have if Jesus came down! I don't thk Jesus would say "but not you Judas,"do u? Let's just follow Jesus, this is not our concern! Just "food for thought." "in danger of" no

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine have you missed the thought that what is in the Bible is there for our business , if not we would not know about Judas. Many people are examples to us how not to be. What ever is not our business  God knows how to keep it sealed.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: And He did!It is "serious" business! Like I said, Jn21:22: ".If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee, Follow thou me!" Merciful Jesus is shown n Script is all I'm saying! I'd hate Judas 2 if carnal but we r not, but Spiritu

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Exactly kiss and Tales I agree what is in the bible surely is for our ensample/example that we may Learn from those experiences. Norine : Its appointed unto man once to die and AFTER DEATH IS THE JUDGEMENT JUDAS COULDN'T REPENT THERE AND BE SAVED!!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine I appreciate that you love Jesus. And you address the holy spirit
       But I think that what ever is in the bible is for us to read and God has made it our business. .Next following Jehovah and Jesus is also a personal responsibility.  Like love.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady:When Jesus went into grave all souls became alive & was given 2nd chance, never again! "After death" applied after He preached to the prisoners n grave didnt accept, then judgment!K&T: Jn21:22. Jehovah & Jesus Same!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine Jesus had a beginning at John 1:1 says so .yet the heavenly Father is the acient of days , he is eternal with no beginning.
       Jesus is written as in
       Reference Bible
       Col 1:15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Who spoke those Words in Rev 1:8;11 (& they're in red)? Did He lie? Don't let "religion" fool you! Study! II Timothy 2:15. But u must do it in the Spirit (Jn 4:24)! Don't try to make "sense" of it. Prov 3:5.  Believe what is Written! Col

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine who put those words in red? What Translation are you reading
       Again If King James he has errors,  and he has removed God 's name .
       I am a bible student for many years , I just do not quote beliefs but I post scripture as proof.

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine go and read 1st Timothy 2:9-12 and see why God doesn't want a woman to handle the word it's for people like you who lacketh understanding to know how to divided the word rightly , will mislead others. Y was hell created? for GRACE?

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       To Lady fiddler there were female prophets,  yet there worked for the point that women are used to spread the truth. RUTH, , MARRY ,
       Martha. Also again hell is a word King James uses and substituted for hebrew sheol, hades .there is no hell fire.

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       You don't believe there is a hell kiss and tales ? Maybe we can talk more via my email address : absonlinework@live.com . I really think we ought to stop debating on Faith's question it's looking a little rude on our behalf as she isn't doing it.

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I so agree with you ladyiddler,  Faith is showing us an attribute of patience and consideration.  I appreciate that. It is hard to not reply right way before the thought gets away. So I speak for the moment of thought, I will contact you by emsil.

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Yes Kiss and Tales..... Faith I sincerely apologize for debating her like it's my question . I guess it was going good as neither of us was angry but just trying to get over our point to each other.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: I agree! Although uninvited, I will email you!  You MUST know "The Truth!"  I will give Scripture only when giving answers! Again, re: Judas, It's not our concern, Just "Follow Me" Jesus said in John 21:22!  K&T: I will email you also THEY

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       OK no problem

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine you are welcome to email me anytime, that goes to my follow hubers as well . ladyiddler did you recieve my email?  I sent it yesterday.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady/K&T:  Thanks guys!  It's been a pleasure sharing the Word of God! To be continued...

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Yes k&t i did and i responded about an hour ago. Np Norine

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady & K&T:  May I send the correspondence sent to me from each of you to the other? I would like to continue a 3-way conversation, if it can be done?  Please let me know!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       To Norine as on HP we seem to come at different ends with each other.
       But for the sake of peace and  not argument,it would just be nice to just direct the subject to one person at a time. That is why we rerouted to emails.
       Because one answer is enoug

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Only trying to show both at once my belief! (II Tim 3:16).  Never want to argue! (I Cor 14:33)   Just wanted to continue 3-way which would have been less time consuming, but OK.  Will do!  Did u get email?

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       No I did not recieve your email? Norine did you use the one from HP?

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T:  Yes, I used HP for that's all  I have!  I hope it holds the 3 page data for I had to "repeat" responses to Lady!  I had attachments too but was afraid it wouldn't  accommodate. I love to work "easy" but, Oh well! God knows our hearts!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       The Old Testament with law was like training wheels , the purpose was a written code  of laws that would help us understand the future sacrifice of his gift to us the Messiah  his son Jesus.
       He paid for generations of people  to walk into a New earth

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Yes, and the Messiah (Jesus) is full of "grace & truth!" God showed "wrath" in the OT but Grace in the NT under New Cov! The HS convicts us from sin, yet when we unintent do, He gives us His Gift!  Grace!

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Yes, "Schoolmaster!" He's given us the gift of Grace, but no one wants it! Like u'd give me a gift & I'd throw it back at u!  Look how we treat Jesus! Want to "stay" under law & called evil when told?

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Wow, Dear Sisters, I really should have posted this in a forum so there would be more room for discussion.  I apologize. Love you all so much.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Faith: I don't know who posted something that implied Judas was lost but I saw an incorr resp according to Script & had to reply! Sorry we took it to another level! 
       Love you too!

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Dear Norine,  I understand and welcome all discussion, but I just wish I had thought enough to put it in a forum.  Love you too and all here.  God bless you all, my dear sisters in Christ.

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Another important thought, Judas betrayed Jesus before his death. Jesus death was to cover all sins  as the last sacrefice of animals.
       Judas sin came under the old law covenant , where did a priest offer up for his deliberate sin ,he died. With out

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Yes, Judas died under OT law but Jesus went into grave after grace! Could do what He wanted! That's why Jn 21:22! Faith has been more than kind. Any further questions direct to norinewilliams4035@att.net

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hmmmm the HOLY SPIRIT DO NOT LIE .. U r lying by saying u don't know who posted it Norine "I don't know who posted something that implied Judas was lost but I saw an incorr resp according to Script & had to reply" judas is AWAITING THE LAKE OF FI

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: Trivial! Give it up before u show ur true colors! See how "christians"  react when "TRUTH" is told? Instead of researching scripture, you act like Satan! Give it up! U will "never" win over "truth" which is Jesus! John 21:22! God forgive me!

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       My true Colors is already shown which is to DENOUNCE ANY HERETICAL DOCTRINE that deviates from the WORD OF GOD. I stand firm in my beliefs and no devil in hell can sway me or throw his dogma and creed into my laps. I refuse to hear JUDAS was saved!!!

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady:Does Matt 27:3-4 deviate? Do u refute the Word of God? Who does that? A Christian? Who says Judas was saved? But based on Scripture, he did the same we do when asking forgiveness! Confess & Repent! It's up to Jesus - Not me!  John 21:22!

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       NORINE R.I.P . I realise that Satan himself did not give up until he himself brainwashed 1/3 of Heaven to believe his doctrine so i understand......I will remember you in prayer because you not reading them scriptures sitting upward! Shalom & Pea

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: Showed u something in Scripture "man" never taught u - Matt 27:3-4 & u can't remove it! Lesson: Study, don't let "man" fool u! Don't remain I Cor 14:38! Hosea 4:6!

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I study to shew myself APPROVED to the living GOD ...not to Norine and please i beg of you do not show many anything in the scripture you will  mislead souls but be assured this one cannot be Misled!! R.I.P. sweedie

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       King James Version Mt 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost( Father), it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come..

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T i am not debating on Faith's platform any more. I am yet awaiting and email response from you to my questions. Thank U , bye

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: Study to show thyself approved unto "MAN" for God already "KNOWS" by looking at one's heart! II Tim 3:16 says use Scripture for "proof"... to "MAN!" for He ALREADY knows & for us to find out by discussing & correcting, Scripture says Ot

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   cam8510posted 9 years ago

   This verse should be seen to be as simple as it is written.  If a person who has followed Christ, wanders to other paths, those paths will not lead to a place of salvation.  That will only be found when the wanderer returns to Christ.  This is how I have understood the teaching.

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Chris, I am so happy you have taken time to answer here!  I appreciate you sharing how you have understood the teaching.  It is interesting to know how each one interprets it, and that you found it simple.  God bless

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      cam8510posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Faith, If the Bible is God's Word to humankind,then it was written for the common man, not the theologian.The meaning will be a hard hitting, simple truth. The longer the explanation to a single verse, the more I doubt the validity of such an answer.

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Chris, Yes, that is a great point you have there!  Before I was saved and read the Bible, I did not understand it, but since being saved, now when I read it, He makes it clear to me.  Thank you for that, Chris!  God bless you.

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      tsadjatkoposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The Bible's purpose is in 2 Timothy 3:14-17.The whole theme  is as simple as it can be,it is redemption,we lost it in Genesis&we're going to regain it in Revelation,we regain it through the inspired word of God.Still the Bible says to study it.

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      cam8510posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Jesus taught in stories that revealed one, powerful truth. If He is the author of the whole book, it will all have this signature quality of simplicity. That is why I look for the simplest meaning.For Heb 10:26-27, Acts 4:11-12 is a parallel passage.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I wanted to be more sure , I did research on the Newer Translation,  it does not have God's name in there at all, totally deleted
      At least The first does recognize the Author
      'S name.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:Yet the Msg is the same!Jesus created the world, came as ex, died for rem of our sins, sent HS to help us w/His Words, giving us oppt to "STUDY"& rightly div His Word,for He will return! Why bother w/ALL trans when HS teaches & guides

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine Jesus Colossians 1:15-17
      He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
      If man has first born sons ,and we exist why is it impossible to create his own first born being Jesus. Why do you limit God's power and Glory.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: Jesus Fathered Himself! Did u rd v16? "For by HIM (JESUS) ALL THINGS were created..." THE Spirit was "manifested in the flesh" JESUS! While every place else! (Col 2:9) Don't relate flesh to Spirit! Rm 8:5! Jn 4:24! Come on Now!Not apples&amp

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine you refuse the truth of the scriptures
       you are saying Jesus has no Father, when Jesus says he does,  he prayed to him.
       you do not accept what is written. And you do not agree with anything written. Sad.

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   word55posted 9 years ago

   I suggest to also read the scriptures included here for preciseness and more clarity.
   
   The Nelson Study Bible that is the New King James Version of Hebrews 10:26 and 27 says in its explanation/break down of the scriptures,
   
   10:26 sin willfully: The reference here is not to an occasional act of sin (which can be confessed and forgiven; see I John 1:8, 9), but to a conscious rejection of God. The Old Testament speaks in Num. 15:30, 31 of committing willful sin A person who sinned presumptuously was to be cut off from the people. To sin deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth is apostasy. If a Christian rejects God’s provision for his or her salvation, there is no other remedy for sins (see also Num. 15:29-31), since forgiveness of sins can only be found in Christ’s perfect sacrifice.
   
   10:27 With no hope of forgiveness (v. 26), all that one can expect is judgment, described here as a fiery indignation. Those who choose to disobey God become His adversaries (see James 4:4).

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      word55posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Now, to answer the question in my own words, that scripture means to me that I should not sin willfully. There is a high price to pay for doing that. God has helped me to understand that to sin is to oppose Him, myself, maybe someone else and or othe

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Word, Thank you so much for sharing your insight into the scripture. Yes, sin blocks our relationship with Christ, and even our prayers. Looks like your answer was cut off a bit, but since I've commented, you may continue to comment now. God bless

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Reference Bible
      Mt 26:24True, the Son of man is going away, just as it is written concerning him, but woe to that man through whom the Son of man is betrayed! It would have been finer for him if that man had not been born.
      Judas did the unforgivable

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: What do we have to do to be forgiven of sins?  Confess & repent, right? Read Matt 27:3-4.  What say ye?

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine your statement is true about forgiveness,  but we must remember all things have a limit , Adam and Eve, Judas, satan, and remember the sin is not against humans but the Heavenly Father . And he is the only one that can read hearts we can not.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:In that we agree "we cant read hearts" That's why I say dont be hard on Judas for we do not KNOW! It goes against Scripture when we say he is lost for we dont know what happened In the grave!  Jn 17:12 was spoken under law THEN He went to gra

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine Jesus already made the Judgment against Judas, he did not have to carry betrayal out. New World Translation Mr 14:21 but woe to that man through whom the Son of man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.”

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:Jesus told him to "go!"&He allowed Satan to take him over!Judas had no choice!Jn 17:12 "..that script might be fulfilled."When he spoke the Words,He hadn't shed His blood!Rd: Matt 27:3-4!Judas confes'd & repntd!  Isn't that what we do

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Judas felt remorse after the betrayal, but he never repented of his deliberate sin. Consequently, Judas is not worthy of a resurrection. Jesus therefore called him “the son of destruction.”—John 17:12; Matthew 26:14-16

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T: Read Matt 27:3-4 again! Do u not see the word "repented?" What r u reading? Why do u say he did not repent of this deliberate sin? Did Matt 27:3-4 lie? Matt & John under "law" there was no grace until the grave for prisoners!

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   tsadjatkoposted 9 years ago

   
   
   Hebrews 10:26 doesn't say that it has happened but only if it were to happen, what the consequence would be so it should be righteously feared.
   
   It is important to remember that before "acquiring the knowledge of the Truth" everyone "goes on deliberately and willingly sinning." Also the Bible says Only To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.  God does not demand immediate perfection.  The seeking after God is most important.  God accepts all who seek him, not what we attain, but our gradual transformation as we allow the Lord to change us.  If we fall, the Lord picks us up.  This fits with God’s judgment as being patient as he waits, “he does not grow tired or weary”, but he waits.  This is why a spirit of judgmentalism has no place in the church, because only God knows the human heart; we do not know the personal demons, the internal struggles of others, and how God is working. Only God, who is aware of all the facts, is able to judge people righteously. Only God knows the human heart: Rom. 2:2.
   
   I believe when we truly accept Jesus (which is what "acquiring knowledge of the Truth means, not simply understanding it) he begins to change us through our seeking after him. If to us, who cannot know one's heart (not even your own as the Bible says in Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?) one appears to have been saved and then "goes on deliberately and willingly sinning", I believe he has never actually acquired the knowledge of the Truth" as Hebrews puts it and so is still what he was before presented "the knowledge of the Truth." and so if they have never really acquired Jesus, only God knows their heart, they will be exactly where they were before being introduced to Jesus, unsaved.
   However that is not to say that someone can't actually totally accept and embrace Jesus and then reject him, though I can't imagine that ever happening.
   
   In the end 1 John 1:9 says "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness."
   
   Hard to imagine that someone would "really" accept Jesus in their heart and then "go on deliberately and willingly sinning," but according to this scripture if that were to happen, "all unrighteousness" means they could still confess their sins of "deliberately and willingly sinning," stop wanting (deliberate & willing) to sin and still be saved. Thing is, they probably wouldn't, just like most who deliberately choose to sin.               .

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I think you are correct on the subject , I believe this is like a person has lost respect for the value of Jesus blood poured out in our behalf,
      It is like you give a person a diamond to only find it laying by the garbage can, and you are shocked !

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi TSAD, Wonderful insight into the scripture. I, too, believe that if one is TRULY saved one, would not go on willfully sinning.We are all a work in progress and once the Holy Spirit is in us TRULY, He will continue to do a mighty work in us.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine do not mix bible truth with misuse of Jesus. I love Jesus ,you love Jesus,lady loves Jesus and it would be wrong to say one does not because
      What you believe and say is not what the scriptures is saying.You have knowledge but not all accurate

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady I am just replying to your comment not a debate of scripture . It is the truth of the subject as you also just posted on faith topic.
      It is important for the truth to be spoken to all as well, we will be in contact with email still compiling .

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: One can "love" Jesus but if not doing what He says "in rt context" u still err! What I blv is fm Script & it'd behove u to "search the Script" to see! No one "willfully" sins if they love the Lord. Look at Peter! But LOOK AT JESUS!  GRAC

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      To Rich I used that scripture to prove that he does not burn anyone in a fire. It never came up in his heart to do a detestable thing. Where do you see a problem I don't. I am aware of what has happened worship to Molech.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: Jn 4:24. Not a "literal" fire! "Consequences" of Sin! Consequences are "HELL" or so I've noticed! "They "caused" their sons & daughters (by sinning) to pass through "the fire" means suffer consequences which we will do in "hell" if  we s

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Moraine you just quoted (given ) to Jesus. ,Who gave it! ? The Father who is greater gave it.
      King James Version Mt 3:17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
      A voice from heaven ,while on earth.

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   LadyFiddlerposted 9 years ago

   Hi Faith no you do not have to go back and get saved "again" the question there in lies if a person was save by what transformation in their lives. However we sin everyday in thoughts words and deeds. I do not think God was referring to that ,SIN is unbelief in God's word lying, thieving, etc are attributes of sin. Real sin like what God is referring to i believe is like fornication, adultery etc for those sins are within and not without the body.
   
   Sin within is defiling the temple of God  and this what He speaks about in this scriptures is when a sinner gets saved and hear the true word of God knowing right from wrong and yet not applying it there is a punishment...because before a person  might have lived in fornication but thought it was right but after knowing it is disapproving by God and u continue to do it you will be punished because you know better.
   
   And anyone that keep on living in those kinds of sins after knowing the truth doesn't believe God. If ye believe you will hear Him and do as He command us to live. Just as how a student believes what a teacher teaches in order to pass his or her exam.
   
   To go into heaven and be saved we must pay a price which is surrendering our will to God. It's not saying I am born again but do everything the world does.....
   
   ROMANS 12:2 Be ye transformed  by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable , and perfect , will of God.
   
   Matthew 7:22-23
   Many will say to me in that day , Lord, Lord , have we not prophesied in thy name? And in thy name cast out devils? & in thy name done many wonderful works?
   And then will I profess unto them , I never knew you : depart from me , ye that work iniquity.
   
   Iniquity is knowing to do right & doing wrong still.
   
   Hadn't judas heard the word? Walked? Eat and sat with the Messiah , he knew right from wrong but he choose to be evil and count what he heard as nothing. He had no regards for all what he heard.
   
   MATTHEW 26:24
   The son of man goeth as it is written of Him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! It had been good for that man if he had not been born.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady: It's not our concern re:Judas, but what happened "in the grave?" Jesus being merciful, and Judas knowing Jesus, (for someone had to be "used" to fulfill scripture), .. However, I just "follow Him!"

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Wow, Jo (ladyfiddler), You know your scripture no doubt. My hubby and I were talking about this and I was just curious how others interpret it. I do not believe one has to continually be saved; ONCE does it!  Praise Him! Thank you for your insight!

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Faith well that's nice to know i am happy you have gotten several responses to your question. Have a wonderful weekend dearheart.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady: Matt 26:24 spoken "under the law!" And "it had been good for that man if he had not been born" because he suffered mentally until he hung himself.  However, when "Grace" came & Jesus went into the grave..Jesus may have forgiven him???

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I hope u realize you targeted my response 1st. THE OLD TESTAMENT IS UNDER THE LAW..NOT THE NEW TESTAMENT it's about grace but plz tell me is every1 going to heaven? y was hell created? Wat did it mean in romans 1? & how hardly will a richman ente

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady: Maybe He loves u more? The NT (Matt,Mk,Lk,John=The Gospels) although in NT r OT r under the law! Why?Jesus came to fulfill law & didn't happen until it began at "the cross" or the shedding of His Blood! New Covenant bgan Acts 2:2.

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Norine .......Re: Judas
      JOHN 17:12
      those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
      
      Who was the son of perdition may i ask ?

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Another example of a car you buy it in perfect condition, until you hit a car and recieve a dent , it was not Destin for the incident,  you did not plan on hitting another car. But you did.
      Good people can turn bad, like apples,

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      LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The devil cannot do anything unless God grants him permission as we see in the book of Job. Therefore Judas was incarnated by satan to carry out this act, plz  Read. Rev 1:18, Rev 20:10. Rev:20:14:15, Rev 21:18 & U will see the wrathful side of G

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: Did he not speak those words "under the law?"Did He not fulfill law (giving Grace) & THEN went n the grave?We don't KNOW! But with Jesus ALL things are possible & He gave ALL grace including Judas! Who knows what hapnd in the grave. Jus

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine God said He'd have mercy on whom He'd have mercy and certainly He is a God of grace & love He is also a God of wrath and judgement so do not mix up GRACE with punishment. If He forgives everything why did He create a hell? was He bored?

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T&Lady:U miss the pt! Grace!Judas confsd, had the once in a lifetime oppt to see Jesus face to face after grace, which Jesus"only" has pwr to give mercy!U thk Judas didnt repent? U dont thk Jesus didnt give?From Script He forgives ANYONE wh

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine dear: he do not forgive blasphemy against the holy ghost, lOOK UP BLASPHEMEY in the book of Hebrews..LUKE 16:22-28 gives the story of Dives who went to hell and wanted to come out but he could NOT. Even if he repented there remaineth no sacrif

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine if I was to ask you who is your first born , you would tell me a son or daughter by name.
       You would not say that is your husband,  or the Father of your child.
       Because they are two separate beings.

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       TheHealthGuy LMposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       For those who think that the "Law" of the old testament does not apply now maybe you should listen to what Jesus said in Matthew 5:17-20, By Grace we are saved but that doesn't mean we can sin without judgment

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       LM: Matt 5:17-20 I agree, but spoken "under the law." Jesus was still "fulfilling." After "fulfillment" Gal 3:24 "..the law WAS our schoolmaster..." for those coming UNTO Christ!  Or are you still "in school, "Spiritually?"  No intent sin under HS!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       That is  simple ,saying it would better if you had not been born ,means you are living for nothing from that point and situation. , If Judas was forgiven why would he try to kill himself. He knew his life had ended spiritually .

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       TheHealthGuy thank you so much for backing up that point I AGREE madam Norine is ignorant of that fact, she believe because we are under grace everyone will waltz in heaven. NOT SO!! Kiss and tales i think you should really ignore her #makesnosense

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: I'm sorry you're "blind" to Scripture! "I" didn't say it, Jesus did! Heb 3:10;12;15. All I did was show ur n err, "from Scripture!" The world needs to know "truth!" Sorry LM, she talking re: Judas!   John 21:22.

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Woman make up your mind if you are of God or of Satan please. One minute Judas is a good loving saved soul. Now i talking Judas ??? U admit he bad!! Thank you. U  will wind yourself off the beaten track. Stop trying to force us to believe ur doctrine

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Which is unforgivable. God's Holy Spirit chose Judas who was a good person at the time. He alowed satan to enter.
       New World Translation Lu 22:3 Then Satan entered into Judas, the one called Is·carʹi·ot, who was numbered among the Twelve,

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: RE:Judas means regarding not like Judas! I've read Mat 27:3-4 & saw Judas did the "same thing" we do to day when we sin! Goes against ur teachings? But it is "still" the Word of God! K&T:Satan may enter but Jesus CAN remove!

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Though it be an angel from on high that preach any other doctrine LET IT BE A CURSE. People that will shift and scramble the words of the bible to soothe their own interpretations are sewing seeds of discrepancy and crossing the line to be saved!!

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: He is the Judge!He wrote It, I didn't!What is the Doctrine?Do u know Jesus' Doctrine?Do you "observe all things" the apostles did after the FIRST Church was  establ?Acts 2:42?That's the DOCTRINE  that Scripture is referring to! I Tim 1:4-7!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Two different  beings one you can be forgiven on everthing. And the other limit is limit not to Blaspheme ,against him ,not forgiven, Judas worked against the Heavenly Father's hand by helping to kill son ,not forgivable by the Father.  But by Jesus

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T:We don't serve"2"different Gods!What 2 beings? Jesus fathered Himself!Didn't THE SPIRIT(God)get into Mary? Wasn't Jesus there fm the beginning(Let "US"..., Gen 1:26)?This is a mystery! But not if you rd His Word in SPIRIT v carnally! Col 2:9!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine if I say let us talk there is more then one person involved.  Do not say it is a mystery when you know that is the truth of a matter, Joh 4:34 Jesus said to them: “My food is to do the will of him who sent me and to finish his work.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T:U see,u r looking at Word in the flesh & not in Spirit! God is not like us 2 say more than 1 is involved!God is a Spirit="I AM!"  IS ALL at ALL TIMES! Col 2:9!The Word relates to "man" Father & Son, so we could "half way" understand H

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       TheHealthGuy LMposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I agree with Lady Fiddler. To many people think and are teaching that you can say a prayer of acceptance (Jesus), by faith be saved and then continue to willingly sin. The willingly sin part is bunk. Everyone seems to forget the word REPENT. TBC ...

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       LM:When one"repents"he usually wholeheartedly means it at the time!Take Peter for inst!Willfully 3x's!Jesus knows our "hearts!"Thk God for grace & Mercy for Peter's & my sake!It's a "GIFT""Work" on ur New Yr's resol, I belv the Holy Spirit's

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   Norine Williamsposted 9 years ago

   Great question Faith! You know, there was once a question on HubPages  (and it might still be on here), "Why Don't Christians Read Their Bibles" or something similar, and it could possibly be that they don't want to find out exactly what they are supposed to be doing, for if and when one knows, they are in danger if they continue in sin, without repentance (Hebrews 10:26 "...after we have received the knowledge of the truth...")!  However, it would behove one to study the Scriptures so they will know what they should "repent" from!
   
   For example, Paul, who previously "killed Christians," when he came into the "knowledge of the truth" didn't return, as we should not today!  He did not say "he was free from sin" for he said in Romans 7:15 "For that which I do I understand not; for what I would, that I do not; but what I hate, that I do."  See, we struggle between the two natures (fleshly and spiritual) daily!  But thank God for His Grace and Mercy!   
   
   Therefore, as with Paul, we all sin daily!  For even our "thoughts" can be sinful, but this is not the kind of sin Jesus is talking about.  He is talking about "planned" or "deliberate" sin which is spoken of in the Word of God, without repentance! I Corinthians 6:9-10 says, "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?  BE NOT DECEIVED:  neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, (v10) Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."  If you commit one of these sins "after coming into the knowledge of the truth," and do not repent, you will not "inherit the kingdom of God!"  (Rev 22:15 and Galatians 5:19-21.) Hebrews 10:26 says "...go on..." which means continues in (without repentance).     
   
   Thank God, He "looks at the heart" and "how mercy on whom He pleases" for there are believers in Scripture that had some of the same sins listed above (Abraham:liar, David: adulterer, Noah: drunk, Peter: liar, etc.)!
   
   That's why we need to seek the "gift" of the Holy Spirit, to help us "war against the flesh!"  Paul said in Romans 7:25 "I thank God through Jesus Christ, our Lord.  So, then, with "the mind" I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh, the law of sin."  This is a spiritual war believers and the "only way" one can win is with the help of the Holy Spirit Who is Jesus!

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Norine, You have shared great insight into the scripture here! Yes, praise God for His Grace and Mercy. Salvation is a free gift, and we must repent. I am so glad He knows our hearts.  The Holy Spirit immediately convicts me in such matters.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Faith: II Peter 3:9 "...but is long-suffering toward us, "not willing that any should perish," but that all should come to "repentance."  Yes, He "..immediately convicts us in such matters." It's so easy for He "Works" not we yourselves! Thk u Jesus!

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, He came to save the world and loves us all so much that He does not want anyone to perish.  Praise Him!  So great is His faithfulness  Thank you, dear Norine.  In His Love, Faith Reaper

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      You see Norine that is the problem we are not to throw stones ,name call , to prove a point. But we are to be sure of the more important things.
      Jesus Judged Judas before he completed betrayal . The point is there was no return once he  finished.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:Where did I throw stones w/o using Word of God which is "the most important Thing?" "I" don't judge, the Word does!Judas "lost" under "law" which hadn't been fulfilled when spoken!But Jesus took "grace" to the grave! Thk u JESUS! KNOWS?Jn 21:

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Lady burning people is a detestable thing to the Heavenly Father , he does not do this to anyone, you are mixing Jesus parables and illustrations of fire
      ,fire was used to understand no return. Death can not be burned in fire . But ended .

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:  I'm opened to your discussions regarding "there is no hell!"  Please "prove" this from Scripture? I want to "know" & "grow" in His Word.  Not argue, but "rightly divide His Word," w/o complacenty!

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   word55posted 9 years ago

   The first man,  Adam was to blame for the misleading of Eve giving him the forbidden fruit to eat as she did. According to God, he should have known better and to maintain God's order instead. read more

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Word, Yes, I have heard that before too.  Thank you for sharing that insight.  God bless you and yours

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Word:Yes, true, if there is a "spiritual man" in the family for that's how God intended marriage. For those without "a man" or a "spiritual man" (which he has no "Spiritual Word) Christ is the head!Rem:Gal 3:27 "...there is neither male nor female...

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      Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Eve brought the fruit to Adam not Adam mislead Eve. Eve was deceived.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Rich: He didn't have to eat knowing God told him not too! Both disobeyed, both deceived, both cursed! What does this have to do with "no man" involved, then Christ is the Head? Or are u defying Gal 3:27?

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      Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine
      my comment was to correct what word55 had written. Adam did not mislead Eve.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Rich: In line w/his topic, Word's trying to show that "man" should "stand up" & be resp to the Word! Adam DID NOT have to eat if he would've "stood up" things would've been diff! But this was NOT God's Will! He knew fm begnin He would have to com

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      Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Norine
      Until the statement "Adam was to blame for the misleading of Eve" (not what scripture says) I don't care what point is trying to be made. You don't start off wrong and expect people to believe the rest of what you say. That is deception.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Rich: Did you not hear me say "But this was not God's Will?" This says untrue! Adam was deceived by woman, Eve was deceived by snake, both sinned!He knew their sinful hearts & He would have to come! As u ovrlkd my words so does man ovrlk God's Wo

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   Jackie Lynnleyposted 9 years ago

   Go on to Hebrew 10:29 "Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?" Clearly says to me that man can be saved and choose afterward to intentionally sin against God and the Holy Spirit by not letting Him lead us in truth but on purpose choosing to do wrong. I think it is so very dangerous and of course we all know there are people who claim to be Christian and openly sin; claiming their sin is not sin when the scriptures clearly tell them right from wrong (if the Holy Spirit does not tell them which I am sure He does.)
   (Sorry I did not see this before.) We do sin of course because it is our nature but to intentionally sin I think is very dangerous ground. A decision we make consciously and on purpose. There is chastisement but apparently there is a difference in that type sin and one that goes against the Holy Spirit who is in our soul to lead and guide us and so we must push Him out to do this sin I think and so then would He come back in? Maybe not according to this. I think that sorer punishment is beyond chastisement.

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks Jackie for the great answer!  Yes, sin separates us for sure from Him. The ones who intentionally sin day after day without repentance makes me wonder if they were truly saved. We are all sinners no doubt, but intentionally that is dangerous!

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Faith I appreciate your answer, we all were born to sin, but difference in the sin is say you go and murder some one, then you also pray and say forgive me to a priest, then you walk right out the door an repeat the same thing tomorrow.prayer in vain

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      Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Kiss and Tales, Yes, I would not think that person was ever truly saved in the scenario you described. Thank you for your participation here.  God bless you.

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Notice at Jere 32:35 ! in order to make their sons and their daughters pass through the fire to Moʹlech, something that I had not commanded them and that had never come into my heart to do such a detestable thing, causing Judah to sin.
      Detestable !

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: Does this show ur belief there's no hell? Jer 32:33-35 "Baal" idol, Satan. Of course "detestable"  to God "causing them to pass through fire" (hell)!  Rightly divide the Word for in It is "eternal life!"

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Written never came up into God's heart to pass people though fire as written
      That includes children,  Fire of eternal simply means in Jesus parables to end life forever  not to return. Jesus would not speak unless he used illustration as written.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T:Put Script in "right"context or u will err! Seek HS guidance! Jer 32:35 has nothing to do w/hell! It's about idol worship & consequences incurred (pass thru fire) which God detests seeing His children suffer bcuz disobedient.  Are u testi

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      Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Also Norine Jesus was created like us and also remember he died for us. The Heavenly Father does not die he is Eternal.  Notice
      King James Version Isa 26:4 Trust ye in the LORD for ever: for in the LORD JEHOVAH is everlasting strength.

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      Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      K&T: Jesus was NOT created like us thru intercourse! "Died" so u could relate to "It is Finished" (Law fulfilled/FLESH, Manifestation died-but NOT Spirit)! He was in grave (I Pet 3:18-19) "Preaching to prisoners!"  Was NEVER dead then! Jesus is G

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    TheHealthGuy LMposted 9 years ago

    You certainly chose a difficult verse to understand and in order to understand Hebrews 10:26-27 which actually reads:
    
    "If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God." we must go back to Hebrews 6:4-6 which states:
    
    "It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen[a] away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace."
    
    Many people believe that the two passages above are only applicable to the unsaved. The Holy Spirit may convict the unsaved of their need to repent because a Christian is praying that they repent yet the Holy Spirit does not indwell an unsaved person and so ...
    
    what both of those passages say to me is that one can possibly lose their eternal life in some way. Continually sinning is not a fruit of the Spirit coming from a truly repented Christian. To repent not only means to confess sin but to have a complete "change of heart." IF there is no complete change of heart I personally don't believe the person became a Christian. Yes, I know there are tons of verses in scripture that merely say "believe in Jesus and you'll be saved BUT consider this:
    
    Satan and his demons believe in Jesus. They all know Him. Most have even met Him! What does that or should it tell someone? There has to be more, right? That is where repentance (complete change of heart) comes in. Anyway, sometime I ramble yet here's my take:
    
    I think if one continually sins after supposedly accepting Christ as their personal savior their heart did not change and they are not saved. I also think that one can choose to give up their eternal life by renouncing the Son of God (taking the mark, avoiding death) like Esau who gave up his birthright to Jacob for a bowl of stew and could never again repent even though he tried. So ...
    
    That's my 2 cents lol

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN. Well said we share the same understanding. Norine is propagating that Judas was saved when Jesus went to the grave when the bible says he is LOST. Indirectly she is calling the word a lie. N If he was saved then satan to is!

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Also we must remember who sent Jesus, King James  Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.the sin was against the Father.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady: Why do u continue? Jn 21:22!  U read Matt 27:3-4? That's exactly what we do to b forgiven! I Jn 1:9; Acts 3:19 Did Jesus Lie?Jesus spk Matt 17:12 under law before grave & grace!Let's Lv Jesus' bz alone! Jn 21:22 & stick 2 quest! Forgive

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       LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       U remember pharoah's words to Moses when he told him see my face no more Moses? he was rude!! But i will take this opportunity to ask you to see my face nor speak to me no more Norine Williams Ischariot!

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lady? Sounds like the Scribes & Pharisees to me! Thank you!
       I Cor 14:38!

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you so much, TheHealthGuy LM, for putting in your two cents which I believe are worth a lot more than two cents. Wow, I should have posted this in a forum, so that responses to comments are not so short!

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Faith: Thank you so much for your patience with us!  I do see the fruit of the Holy Spirit in you! Again, thks for listening to my revelation! I know it's unheard of n "religion" but if they 'look at Jesus in the Spirit, His Mercy, they'd "see"JESUS!

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Dear Norine, Here he mentions the fruit of spirit, and He tells us in His Word, they shall be known by their fruit.  God bless you, Jo, Kiss and Tales, and all here who have taken the time to care enough to answer.  Hugs

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       TheHealthGuy LMposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       In regards to Judas. Well, I am certainly not God and can't judge but I can take a scripturally educated guess. #1 Judas betrayed (rejected) Jesus. John 3:16-20 for his fate. #2 He committed suicide (self murder) Exodus 20:13  He's cooking as I type.

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        LadyFiddlerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Healthy guy well it is only normal that we sum up where he could have gone to. He is in hell being tormented ..hell is a place of Torment and when Christ comes he will cast death ad hell into the lake of fire . Rev 20:14. The oven has been heating up

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        LM: Betrayal & Suicide are not unforgivable! Matt 27:3-4? Judas C&R as we do today! U fail to realize that grace wasn't eff yet! Then Jesus went into grave w/grace for ALL prisoners! TRADITION/RELIGION KILLS!        STUDY!        John 21:22!

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Lady  a wonderful thing to remember
        New World Translation Ro 6:23 For the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord. 
        Death is payment for all we do.It did not say we pay by a torment  fire

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        K&T: The "second death" is hell if we have not obtained "everlasting life" through Christ Jesus (Rm 6:23)! You can't get around Rev 20:14! Let's not just "pic & pull" to justify our beliefs but "rightly divide" by putting ALL words n right co

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Also Norine you need to do more research on translation and words the Greek translation for the word King James used is stake. Jesus did not die on a cross to pieces of wood. That is false . Kingdom Interlinear Col 1:20 Greek uses the word stake.

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    Biomedicalposted 9 years ago

    When Jesus said, "It is finished," He referred to the plan God established from the moment Adam sinned. Job said, "I know my Redeemer lives." He referred to Jesus, the Promised One, the Messiah, the Christ.
    *
    Paul still sinned. He could not stop. He wanted to stop. But, he did the thing he did not want to do, and he did not do the thing he wanted to do. He said that if we are saved and still sin, it is sin living within us.
    *
    The key word there in Hebrews 10 is WILLINGLY. Because you are bothered by this, and desire to be right with God, you are seeking. This shows you are NOT willing. Your choice is to be right with God, and to not be living wrong.
    *
    However, all of us continue, like Paul, to do things we regret, and to fail in what we believe we should have done per our responsibility.
    *
    When we are all caught up, at the 7th Trumpet blast, we will be perfected as we rise up. That is a hint that we were not already perfected. Keep seeking God. Develop a personal relationship. Determine in your heart to always seek Him every day, in conversation, in praise, in prayer, in confidence, or however the Holy Spirit moves you.
    *
    Last note: Beware of the spirit of condemnation. It finds fault in everything you do, and even in others. It's real job is to keep you from testifying, casting out devils, and healing the sick. The Kingdom of Satan greatly fears demonstrations -proof- of the Kingdom of God.

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Robert, I was having a discussion on this scripture with my husband, and was curious as to how others may interpret it. Yes, we are a work in progress and He is not through with us. I am happy that His mercies are new each day. Tx, God bless.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rob: Why are ur words speaking to me re: condemnation?  It's like the Holy Spirit's talking to me thru you! Thank u Robert!  Thank u Jesus!

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rom 6:12  Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts.

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       True Rich we all are battling the flesh that we should not die based on not conquering the flesh.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rich/K&T:  Yes, it's a battle!  Thank God "He" looks at the "heart" to see if  we've sinned "willfully" !  Not as "man!" Paul sinned! Never conquered flesh! Sin will be a battle as long as we're alive in body!  "REIGN" "OBEY" key words Rm 6:12!

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       The mortal body is what has to be looked at not the heart not the spirit, the flesh. Paul's words are very clear, no need to read into and change the meaning of what is written. We are to die daily, Christ said so not Paul but they both agree no sin.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rich:Agreed!We die daily!The "mortal body" changes (for we have no desire) when the HOLY SPIRIT kills (chgs) us, not we ourselves, lest any man should boast!Do u no HS spoke thru Paul & HS is Jesus?Why do u see them as 2 diff persons?

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Rich, thank you for your participation here and insightful answer.  God bless

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       ALL: When we ALL learn John 4:24, then and "only then" will we understand! Not by works, for He "Works" not us!

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Very true Norine we must worship the Father in spirit and in truth.
        That is just as important to tell the truth that will Glorify the Heavenly Father Jehovah, and his Son Jesus. That is written on the foreheads
        King James Version Re 14:1 
        Both !

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        K&T: "At the name of JESUS every knee will bow..." What name do u thk is in their foreheads? Jesus Fathered Himself! We're talking SPIRIT not "man!" Tradition errs, Religion errs, u err if u don't belv He is "I AM!"

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        Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        "Jesus Fathered Himself"
        A statement right from the father of lies. May the Lord rebuke you.

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Rich: Who got into Mary's womb? THE SPIRIT (JESUS) otherwise John 1:14 lies! Rightly divide the Word or you will err! TRADITION & RELIGION KILLS! John 4:24 or you can't "SEE!"

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Norine how did you get into your mothers,.Joh 14:28 You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        K&T:Don't compare flesh w/THE SPIRIT!JESUS can b n heaven,get into Mary, & be in everyone at once!Come on now! We're talking THE SPIRIT whose NAME is Jesus!U no why the said "going to the Father?" From whence He came SPIRIT! No more flesh! Jn

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        He also said Father is greater, not the sane ,not equal, simple
        Jesus was flesh on earth and died, only flesh can die, But the Father is eternal. A spirit that does  not die .
        You are saying God can make humans and he can not make a son.

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        THE SPIRIT (aka God to u, JESUS to me) can do ALL things! Dont underestimate by comparing flesh to Spirit or father & son as "man" does! But here, there, everywhere at once!ALL Power has been given to JESUS so where's God?

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        Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        Rich if you read the intire account these people build Alters to their God Molech and really burned their children as a sacrefice.
        They did this many times. This is literal . Do reseach on Molech.

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        Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        K&T: Prove your belief? Where is God? Stand BOLD in your doctrine! II Cor 7:2-4 "Great is my boldness of speech toward u.." for it comes from Scripture! Where's yours?

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    Rich kelleyposted 9 years ago

    Heb 10:26-27  For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. (NKJV)
    
    I find it really hard to comment on this scripture without reading the entire chapter and maybe the one before. Willfully sinning is the topic. When I do something that I have come to know as wrong then it is being done willfully. The blood of Jesus was accepted by God the Father as a sacrifice for our sins. Because of Christ’s blood my sins are forgiven. If I choose to continue to sin after I have asked for forgiveness via Christ’s blood, then His blood will no longer be a sacrifice for me. Am I to crucify him over and over again as some are in the habit of doing?
    
    Many today twist the scripture and have all kinds of excuses for their continued behavior that is not going to be allowed in the Kingdom of God. One I read here goes something like this: “I just keep trying but if I don’t make it, no matter, because when I’m called up to the sky I’ll be changed so I will never do it again”. The people that are going to meet Christ in the air are those that have died in Christ.  If you are an active unrepentant sinner when you die, you can expect a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour you.
    
    Today many of the professing adult Christians have their fingers in their ears and are saying la la la la la. They don’t want to hear they must repent, sin no more, turn away from darkness.
    
    Without a sacrifice for sins, there is no forgiveness and if there is no forgiveness then you/we must pay the price. The more attractive way is to repent and accept the sacrifice that Jesus made for “Who so ever will”. “Go and sin no more” Jesus.

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Rich, Thank you for your answer.  Yes, "Go and sin no more".  Good points make here and insight.  God bless you

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rich are you using the Newer  King James Version ?

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Looks like he is, Kiss and Tales, as he indicated such at the beginning there.

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       26-27 For yf we synne willyngly after that we have receaved the knowledge of the trueth there remayneth no more sacrifice for synnes but a fearfull lokynge for iudgement and violent fyre which shall devoure the adversaries
       (Tyndale 1526)

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Very Interesting Rich, can you post hebrew and greek? That translations would be Jesus language .

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       K&T
       I just tossed that in because very old English reads funny compared to what we read and speak today. As does King James a 400 year old dead dialect not spoken except by die hard KJV preachers.

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Thank Rich , an important thought to consider , and I try to help others under stand what you have just proven , we are living in a generation of a different Dialect
       And certain words have a different meaning.. yet I watch for changes that take away.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       ALL: Yet the msg is the same! If we "continue," ("GO ON" sinning w/o repentance)"willfully" "there is no more sacrifice" "only fearful judgment" is all we have to look fwd to! Who does that unless "reprobate mind?" Which has been given over to Satan!

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    lawrence01posted 9 years ago

    Faithreaper
    To answer the question you really have to look at why the Book of Hebrew was written and whom it was written to.
    The early church was dealing with a few issues all at the same time. One was dealing with the fact that many of the new believers were from a Jewish background.
    The writer is trying to make a point that what we have in Christ is so much better than what the Jews had in the old covenant. The writer goes through this quite thoroughly in the chapters building up to this.
    The reason he was so emphatic on this is because there were groups of Jewish Christians who were going round teaching that while faith in Jesus was good they still needed to follow the Jewish Law to be 'saved' his first Missionary journey, telling the church in Jerusalem about what God is doing and then having to deal with the faction that was teaching this doctrine.
    Acts 15 is the record of the Church in Jerusalem meeting to deal with that problem and the decision was that provided they abstained from eating meat with blood in it then the church considered them brothers and sisters in Christ.
    The writer to the Hebrews (we don't know who wrote the book) takes the next step and in writing the book shows just how much better what we have in Christ is than the old covenant.
    One thing to understand is that the writer never says that the old covenant has been replaced, it's still in force! The issue is that Jesus fulfilled it so that we don't have to!!!
    If Jesus fulfilled it then what is the point of going back to it? He argues that by doing so they negate the work that Jesus has done because they choose not to live under what he has done!
    It's also a timely reminder to us today about the times when we add extra rules to what Jesus did for us. How many churches add those little extra things for membership?
    The book of Hebrews warns us that in doing those kind of things we run the risk of literally trampling on what Jesus did for us.
    Can we lose our salvation? I don't know! And I really don't want to find out!

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Lawrence, what an insightful answer here! Yes, He fulfilled the law and we now have a new covenant. Nothing can take away what He did on that cross for us. We are sealed in the Lamb's book of life. Praise Him! And God bless you. In His Love, Faith Re

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Exodus 32:33  And the LORD said to Moses, "Whoever has sinned against Me, I will blot him out of My book.
       Sin can "unseal" one's destiny. Kind of what Hebrews 10:26-27 is saying.

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Thanks, Rich, I know sin blocks our relationship with Him and we must repent. I do know what He did on that cross, His blood covered our sins and once we accept Him as Lord over our lives, we are sealed. Yes, we may sin, nothing can undo the cross.

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Rich: It's a New Day (New Cov=Grace)! "The Cross" chgd that (fulfilled law).Under New Cov=Confess/Repent! The law was HARD, Grace is EASY! It's such "GOOD NEWS" no one can blv it! Want to stay under LAW! They don't mix! Did Christ die in vain?

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       Rich kelleyposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine
       You believe in a different Jesus than I do. Nothing you say will be taken seriously no matter the amount of scripture you quote. Sorry that you have created this situation with your apostate beliefs. May God have mercy on what you say.
       Rich

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       lawrence01posted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Faith
       Yes Grace is wonderful! God loves us and the writer shows us how much better the New covenant is, but with it comes a warning not to go back to the old!
       It's not sin that's the issue but turning our backs on Grace by adding those little extras

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       Norine Williamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Law: You got it! I Wish they'd READ Gal:3&4! We're no longer under "Schoolmaster" Gal 3:24 (Law)! Turning back or not acknowledging GRACE is the problem! Did Christ die in vain? Why don't ALL come fm under law? Can't mix! Gal4! If do, belief errs

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       Kiss andTalesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Norine you have not explain how Jesus in the water being baptized  . King James Version Mt 3:17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased . A voice in heaven while Jesus on earth being baptized.

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       Faith Reaperposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Hi Lawrence and all here, thank you all for your participation and passion for the Word of God. Yes, not turning back and adding the extra rules of religious doctrines ...God bless you all. In His love, Faith Reaper

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    savvydatingposted 9 years ago

    It looks like all the answers you need are covered here. Nonetheless, I'll put my two cents in. I see this scripture as a simple warning which tells us that being saved does not mean we have a "Get out of jail free" card. We still have to allow the Holy Spirit to works in our lives. We must continue the work of having our hearts and minds transformed, even though we will fall many times. However, we do not have to keep going through the ritual of baptism, or being saved.
    Once we have learned the truth, it is our duty, and should be our desire, to live the truth. If we do not keep striving and growing in the Holy Spirit, then we are willfully ignoring the Holy Spirit. That is a sin we choose, but it isn't a wise choice as it will lead to our ultimate destruction.
    Another way of putting it is: We do not get to ignore the Ten Commandments every single day of our lives, and expect to get to heaven. If that were the case, why follow God? We could just do whatever pleases us, right or wrong and call it all relative---and things like holiness, agape love, and salvation would mean nothing.   
    For Jesus said in Matthew 7:21: Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom …

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