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This is absolute brilliance. Thank you, Phil, for your guidance as an intellectual.
That is a better question Link! Did you ask it?
You can quote as many bible verses as you want. But can you prove that your God exists outside of the pages of this ancient Bronze Age bible? The atheist is not the problem. Your inability to deceive us with these lies is the problem.
And you gave an excellent answer to this question, Phyllis Doyle. I really did gain something very valuable from it.
Thank you, Feenix.
Wonderful answer Phyllis , exactly the case as we live this example, God has allowed bad to exist by not interfering with most human choices , to prove a point that everthing experience have been tried and tested.
Now we see the results .
That seems kind of cruel. In that scenario, Atheists are pawns of god, used to prove a point, before being sent to hell.
M.T wow, your imagination really leads you to think so.
First there is no actual hell, next the choices people make are not his, so like chess, you make your own move , next regardless rather you are Atheist , or a believer we all are examine .
Wouldn't the historical and scientific justifications for atheism require understanding and effort?
Why would it?
If would be easy if the non-believer never knew about a god to begin with. If you know about that god, then you need justification for not believing in him. Considering theists are the majority, justifying atheism requires a lot of effort.
Really? How have you justified your belief in God's non-existence?
The same can be said about Believers, Joseph. After all, Believers are the ones who've made the claim of His existence...
"Can you show me your god?"
"Then I dont believe he actually exists."
Its a rather simple justification for the most part, unless you're talking to a closed minded idjit that doesnt care to listen to anything past "I dont believe".
Interestingly enough, almost all atheists admit that there is evidence for God. Daniel Dennet, Christopher Hitchens and Sam Harris for instance don't deny it. They just claim that, in their opinion, the evidence is not convincing enough.
Sounds about right.
So...what exactly is your point?
My point is that many simple choose to ignore the evidence for God's necessary existence.
Before it was evidence for god, now its evidence for his necessary existence. Must be pretty convincing to create millions of different beliefs..
Personally I wouldn't say evidence, rather than a reason to not deny the possibility.
Atheists pull from astronomy, biology, history, literature, and mythology (just to name a few) to justify their non-belief. Where as a theist only pulls from one source: the bible (or whatever religions text they were raised on). Hence, more effort.
I don't follow. How do these prove God does not nor cannot exist?
Because the only document serving as justification for god's existence is flawed. It would be like pitting an entire school curriculum against one Harry Potter book. They do not compare.
I think that it takes a lot of strength and courage to acknowledge that something you have always been taught was right might actually be wrong, often in the face of criticism from loved ones & strangers, and given the threat of eternal damnation
And yet the historicity of the Bible has been validated time and time again: http://bit.ly/192WmfR
Having some elements of history does not validate the bible's supernatural claims. Again using Harry Potter as an example, it's a work of fantasy fiction, yet it references real places, like London and France, and takes place in the 1990s.
Then how do you explain all of the Bible's fulfilled prophecies?
There is no evidence of fulfilled biblical prophecies. And prophecies, by nature, are vague enough to apply to anything. Its a literary technique employed by storytellers.
Sure there is: http://bit.ly/1Hrjzck
Perhaps you could provide an alternate link. That one gives me a loading wheel and never displays any text.
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But atheists don't deny anythings existence. A lack of belief is not the positive assertion that it does not exist. I would also like to see you expand on atheist willful ignorance.
The definition of "atheism" is "No God." To me, that means that they believe that He does not exist. Let me rephrase myself. Atheists know the Creator exists, but they willfully suppress the truth in unrighteousness (Romans 1:18-23).
HAHA that is the most illogical statement I've ever heard. I hate to hurt your feelings, but that's far from the truth, glynch1.
I'm sorry, but an atheist means without God. We have failed to be convinced, and despite what you interpret Romans to mean, we absolutely do not "know" god exists and reject him any more than you "know" Allah exists and reject being a Muslim.
So what if a baby was never exposed to any holy books or forced indoctrination? What if that baby grew up to never believe in things that he has never known to exist? Would that be willful ignorance and spiritual blindness.
The actual term--atheist--means "no god." The alpha-privative does not mean "without."
THEISM and ATHEISM are about BELIEF in God. Not God verses no God. Theism is a belief in a God or gods. Conversely, Atheism is a lack of belief in a God or gods. Your definition is COMPLETELY incorrect. Atheist is not defined as NO GOD!
And just what do you call someone who believes God does not nor cannot exist?
A gnostic atheist. There are actually names for these things.
So you weren't being genuine when you claimed, "atheists don't deny anythings existence."
Whatever you say, Joe.
Atheist says, there is no God. I don't see him, I don't feel him. He does not exist. If someone use this logic, Julie McFarland and the atheists does not exist because someone does not see them nor touch them.
1. That's a ridiculous statement. People see me, hear me and touch me all the time. You're talking to me right now. 2. Some gnostic atheists say that no God exists. Most atheists, including me, do not say that. We lack belief. Period.
What kind of atheist you are? You said gnostic atheists say no God exist. You added, you lack belief in God or in God's existence. Therefore lacking in belief does not mean there is no God. So God exist whether there is belief or unbelief.
Sure, as long as you believe that saying something exists means that it exists by default. You have not demonstrated a claim in any God to be true, aside from just asserting that it is. I don't believe you as there's no reason to.
You said most atheist including you don't say that no God exist as some gnostic atheist do. In a clear statement, God exist base in your words. You just ignore or deny him because you need visible and tangible proof.
Believing there may be a possibility of something does not mean that something necessarily exists. You don't seem to understand that not accepting something isn't an affirmation of existence or non existence. It's just a lack of belief in it.
I don't believe mystical wish granting dragoons exist. By default then, according to you Ponce, they exist and I just ignore them.
Do you believe mystical wish granting dragoons exist? If not you ignore and deny them, and that's just silly to do...
Why atheist ask proof of God's existence? In the first place they already denied it.
Ponce, if I told you a flying goblin that poops gold was my god who told me i can tell you what your beliefs are, and because they don't match up with my obviously correct beliefs you will suffer eternally as fact, would ask me 4 proof?
You guys seriously have to stop arguing/discussing against this guy...You won't get anywhere. His mind is blocked away. He won't ask questions and will not listen to reason...obviously.
Guys, I'm asking a legitimate question, why atheists ask proof of God's existence. Your answer is a curve line not a straight line. And what can I get also to all of you? A curve mind?
My question was rather straightforward Ponce, and your answer will lead me into showing you why any atheist would ask for proof.
I'll tell you, Ponce, because Atheists don't "see" proof. Then you'll say, "Atheists avoid seeing proof." Then I ask you, where's your proof of God's existence?
No eyes could see God because God is a spirit, I'm not forcing you to believe it. His creation is the only visible proof of his existence because no logical mind will deny that creation has no creator. I'm not forcing you to believe it also.
Ponce, I would imagine that also applies to Hindus, Muslims, Vikings, Greeks, and just about any other group that says life is proof of their god, right? Or are you saying that they are all wrong and only you are right?
gods are not God, the creator. If you believe in their claims to deny the real creator you no longer be an atheist but a believer of gods. the gods exist only in man's mind but the real God lives in the heart of his people.
How do we know you're right and they aren't? They also believe in a God. They believe in a Creator just like you - who's right? What do you mean by "lives in the hearts of His people?"
As long as your beliefs make you happy Ponce. All that counts in the end.
I'm rather certain MT is an atheist as well, and that this question was meant to be answered primarily by theists who think god made no mistakes in creating people.