Recap 12/7/2011 Trump as Debate Moderator-Time to Send in the Clowns

Step Right Up!

First of all, I want to salute the brave men that stood tall on December 7, 1941, after that dastardly attack on America’s Pacific Fleet anchored at Pearl Harbor, Hawaii. I made a point on the 50th anniversary in 1991 to go the memorial, my first visit to Hawaii, to commemorate the event with then President George Herbert Walker Bush, who was in the area on the occasion. I met a lot of the veterans; most who told me where they were at the precise moment the bombs fell. We went from tavern to tavern in Honolulu and they kept me plied with drinks for the better part of the day. I loved to listen to them talk about themselves, much like it was when I had the opportunity to visit London in my early 20s. I made it a habit of going to pubs, and I found many of the older gentlemen that spoke with pride as to how they stood tall during the London Blitz, in WWII. They always made the point that although Hitler had the continent, this little island, this England, was determined to stay on the map. The youngest of the Pearl Harbor survivors had to be around 70 years. I took snap shops with a few of the men, and had a chance to experience living history from their accounts

I don’t want to Digress, but I Guess that it is Rant Time?

I couldn’t help but chuckle at chicanery going within the Republican rank and file, regarding those that aspire to be Commander and Chief. In this portion of the article, I will be as objective as I can. The question is this, why are the GOP presidential candidates involving themselves or even considering involving themselves in the next debate moderated by Donald Trump? It looks bad; it is a Bozo Show, to be sure.

It looks bad for two reasons. I think my reasonable conservative friends recognize that association with this man is not advantageous. I could understand if someone like the late William Buckley would moderate such a forum. Every time he spoke on his “Firing Line” program, I made it a habit to scramble for a dictionary. Mastery of the English language and superb reasoning skills made him a must watch even for ‘libbies’ like yours truly. Don’t you want a moderator that is exemplary and represents the GOP ideology and philosophy in an intelligent light, at its best? Trump was playing games with the GOP electorate by saying he is running then backing out? Even the rank and file, Karl Rove and others, know that the word is out about dropping the “birther thing”. I would recommend getting somebody with credibility, someone who does not have us snickering every time his name is mentioned.

Secondly, Mr. Trump is a pompous egomaniac. If I were GOP, I would take offense at the idea of having to ‘kiss his ring’ to get his blessing. The idea that he is a kingmaker fits well into his psychological makeup. Does any one of the contenders really want to be seen in deference to this fellow, hat in hand and bent of knee? If you participate, it does not look very presidential to me. I am surprised that it could look that way to conservatives. Here comes Newt Gingrich, all ready soiled with a past background that included unethical behavior. Is he crazy enough to show the world how easily he can be bought, once again? In a conversation with the press, Trump gave a disparaging comment or two regarding Mitt Romney’s expressed desire not to attend the debate. Unlike the folks on Trump’s “Apprentice” program, he is at least smart enough to not to be made a fool of on national television. The test will be how many of the GOP contenders will actually make a showing at the sponsored debate or risk the wrath of Trump!

http://credence2.hubpages.com/hub/Richie-Rich-for-President

Of course, I am not particularly attracted to any of the GOP contenders at the moment, but seriously, Republicans, you can do better than this. Honestly, it is good that you all took a sigh or relief when Cain stepped down, but there were certainly a great number of you who supported this guy. “Bruther from another muther”, for Pete’s sake! At least try to furnish a real challenge to the incumbent. The President made a sterling address in Kansas on December 6th. Whether you like Obama or not, he did put aside his professorial hat and made clear the choices available to the American people. You can either say yes or no, but there is no equivocating as to the message. Mr. Obama is finally listening to me, I told him to do something like this long ago. The right and their rebuttals have fallen woefully short, but they still scramble to try to mute the message. In doing that, they are just going to make the president’s message all the more distinct and clear.. .

http://credence2.hubpages.com/hub/One-Progressive-Viewpoint-The-Week-in-Review-September-4-11-2011

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31 comments

Ghaelach 4 years ago

Hi Credence.

Not being American, not living in the states and not viewing American TV i don't get to hear a lot off what is going on over there.

Being in Europe we tend to concerntrate on the 4 big nations around us.

After reading your very interesting hub i wonder are these people serious or what. But then i wonder what did American's think when the peanut man or the cowboy ran for office???? I do get your point though.

What would you be thinking/saying if Hugh Heffner or Larry King ran for office??

Take care and have a nice day.

LOL Ghaelach


GA Anderson profile image

GA Anderson 4 years ago from USA

Good point about Trump - it just makes me shake my head when I realize how shallow things can be. Not just the candidates giving him the obligatory nod, but also the media that puts him on the air.

but then again - I shouldn't be surprised, after all a public that keeps dumb reality shows like Jersey Shores on the air probably deserves to be insulted.

You had me with you all the way to the end - Obama's speech. I was so disappointed - because I was initially so impressed. The first 10 minutes or so the man was speaking the truth of our current situation - calling things what they are, but then.... geez more big government - government can solve it all with just more money, more control, more "government knows better than you do" philosophy.

Sorry, but when judged on it's record of running things - government fails - both party's versions.

Nope - we need another choice, Dems and Repubs don't seem to be what the doctor ordered this time.

Donald Trump, really? Is that really a serious thought?

Spot on! Bring on the clowns.

GA


Thomas Thyros 4 years ago

Hello Cred2:

Good article. Indeed I did watch the President give his Kansas speech and loved what I heard.

As to Trump moderating for the GOP? I say, "Thank you." There could be no better news for the White House. I am sure many Democrats are saying the same.

It is laughable on its face, and strategically damning at best. Trump has been a punch-line for years now and this move will surely add many more. Personally, I welcome it. This is another “Newtism” and he should be thanked publicly as well.

Moreover, one look at the Republican candidates will show that the likes of Trump is a perfect fit. He’s one of the “boy’s.” Cue up the circus music, bring on the jugglers, soothsayers and the fortune-tellers. It is sure to be an entertaining show folks.

Thanks,

Thomas Thyros


Borsia profile image

Borsia 4 years ago from Currently, Philippines

I'm no fan of the Donald and I would be agreeing were it not for a few things.

First; I've heard Trump talk about the issues and he is far brighter and comprehends the sad state of the country better than any candidate with the possible exception of Dr. Paul.

Trump is far more likely to fair to all of the candidates than any other moderator. I don't think he will let Romney & Perry argue about who cuts their lawns for 5 minutes while giving less than 2 minutes to some of the others.

I expect Trump to set guidelines and then nail the candidates to them. Something that I haven't seen in my 43 years of following presidential elections and debates.

Debates, especially in main elections, tend to be nothing but canned platitudes that say nothing. It is mostly the direct fault of the moderators.

Probably the only exception were the debates when Ross Perot ran. Too bad that he turned out to be a bit wacky because he was the best candidate in most ways.

Unfortunately the debates aren't on the air down here so all I usually see and the YouTube bits & pieces, even YouTube is problematic due to our slow connections.

Whether you like or dislike Trump the man is a self made millionaire / billionaire who started out a poor kid from a poor family. And in this case his aggressive personality might be the best thing to happen to the debates.

If I had to bet on it I would say that I expect this debate to be tough on Gingrich and Romney, not too good for Perry and better for Paul.

Trumps political views are most closely aligned with Paul's.


Auntie D profile image

Auntie D 4 years ago from California

Hi Cred2, hey, I think the majority of candidates fit in a clown mold, this just may be the closing act.I think the Trump Debate will be highly watched just for the entertainment it might bring.

I thought President Obama made a great speech and I hope he stands firm and tough.

Regarding Borisa's statement: Donald as being raised poor...he was a beneficiary of his father's estate of $400 million dollars left largely to his kids.


Auntie D profile image

Auntie D 4 years ago from California

Hi Cred2, hey, I think the majority of candidates fit in a clown mold, this just may be the closing act.I think the Trump Debate will be highly watched just for the entertainment it might bring.

I thought President Obama made a great speech and I hope he stands firm and tough.

Regarding Borisa's statement: Donald as being raised poor...he was a beneficiary of his father's estate of $400 million dollars left largely to his kids.


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Aloha to you Ghealach, I am humbled that you come to visit, sit down and have some tea and biscuits I won't bore you with all sordid details of American politics these days. Let it be sufficient to say that our choices leave much to be desired. You folks have not let things deteriorate to the point that you have clowns aspiring to the office of Prime Minister.

We take pride in the concept that anyone can grow up to be President. Oftentimes, honey is not the only thing that flies are attracted to. This is the first presidential contest in my recent memory where those that would one would consider to be great at stand up comedy are now contending this lofty office.

Well, let me tell you, you're not missing much. Hugh Heffner or Larry King would be far more qualified than the current selection we have under the big top!

Thanks for coming by, please visit again...Cred2


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Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, GA, thanks for reading and providing your thoughtful comment.

I dislike this Trump guy intensely as Thurston Howell in the real world, the very personification of what OWS and progressives complain about regarding the current system and those that abuse it, struting around like a peacock who owns the place.

Of course it is natural that I as a progressive was going to find Obama's speech more appealing than any conservative would. I think that he has a point and that the conservatives are going to be on the defensive as to how Obama's vision for America is not the right one. Better yet, what is their alternate vision and can any one of those that aspire to be king properly present that vision showing its rectitude, relative to that of the President. The president's presentation of structural unfairness is a hard point to dany before the masses, I wish the GOP luck.... Cred2


Ghaelach 4 years ago

Hey Credence.

I can't let you go without saying that your comment was a great reply. Still got a smile on my face and besides i've still got some tea left.

Believe me we have are clowns over here as well it's just that we call them idiots and unfortunatly they're the best of a bad bunch and it doesn't matter which partie we talk about.

Mr. Lincoln, Mr. Washington, or Mr. Churchill will be turning in their graves at what's going on.

Well now that we've got two great nations warmed up i'll go and make another cuppa.

LOL Ghaelach


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Ghaelach, Best to you, always remember, mi casu es su casa


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Thanks for reading and commenting on the article, Thomas. I think that the president has defined for people what their real choices are in the speech, do we move forward to a viable society that includes a vibrant middle class or backward to a world of serfs and lords?

Basically, that is what it is coming down to.

As to Trump moderating for the GOP? I say, "Thank you." There could be no better news for the White House. I am sure many Democrats are saying the same.

We have to remember that every circus has its two-bit shysters, Newt and Donald can point fingers at each other as to who is the best of the genre! The GOP and it troupe will insure a democrat victory, and there is that elephant in its tutu, again, what a show!

This is the Newt and Donald Show, we can laugh along with the prerecorded laugh track. They are both made for each other, whose ego will tower over the other. Newt will be deferential so as not to get the wrath of Donald Duck, kingmaker.

Thanks, see you around the hubs, Cred2


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Well, Borsia, we will have to agree to disagree, I have never thought much of Trump. Why do you think that Trump will do anthing outside of promote himself? There are plenty of people that have the credentials and style to be good moderators, why Trump? Even if we disagree about the man, his brand is tainted. Why would the GOP risk so contentious a character as part of process where people and ideas need to be taken seriously?

You said:

"Debates, especially in main elections, tend to be nothing but canned platitudes that say nothing. It is mostly the direct fault of the moderators".

Perhaps, but anybody but Trump!

You said:

"Probably the only exception were the debates when Ross Perot ran. Too bad that he turned out to be a bit wacky because he was the best candidate in most ways."

We are going to disagree on that, after all you are a libertarian.....

Gee, Borsia, I am sorry that you are going to miss the festivities. I guess that not all of the creature comforts available in the states are available to ex-pats. But, I bet that you have learn to accept the trade-off as to your advantage. I have been thinking about Ecuador and a couple of nations in Central America to get away from the outrageous costs of living here. I will have a look at some of your articles. But I am spoiled, and need a certain amount of familiar infrastructure to be comfortable.

YOu said:

"Whether you like or dislike Trump the man is a self made millionaire / billionaire who started out a poor kid from a poor family. And in this case his aggressive personality might be the best thing to happen to the debates."

Where did you get this info about Trump. I read that he inherited 400 million from his father and have been imbroiled in bankruptcies, lawsuits and failed business ventures ever since. Gee, Borsis, do you think that if you inherited $400 million, that you could avoid screwing the pooch? That's a lot of money, and it means never having to say you are sorry. The conservative view and his view of being this rugged individualist aka "Marlboro Man" is BS. He represents every thing about the arrogant 1% that I and the OWS find troublesome. He is anything but a self made man!

I am sure that you have followed as of late, that Dr. Paul has said that he would not attend. Comparing a man of integrity like Ron Paul with a 2 bit shyster like Trump is like comparing apples to hand granades. Paul would be troubled to be in the same city with Trump. Trump is a "let them eat cake" aristocrat, who with his very presence is the antipathy of what America should be about. Born with a platinum spoon in his mouth, what does he know about the virtues of hard work and self-reliance conservatives always carp about?

Borsia, as always thanks for stopping by, Cred2


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, Auntie D, thanks for reading and commenting, yes I wished that the major networks would carry this, bringing it all into our humble households in primetime. It will be great watching Newt receive his coronation ceremony from the Trumpster. I agree that the president's speech allows the public to determine and to separate the wheat from the chaff in a distinct fashion. I am glad that he is rolling up his sleeves in recognition that it is futile to try to negotiate with those that won't cooperate. Let him explain to the people the nature of this quandary and let them decide if they truly want the plutocrat in charge. Thanks for the point on Trump, I suspected that he is anything but a sterling example of the virtues of a free-enterprise system. Regards, Cred2


Borsia profile image

Borsia 4 years ago from Currently, Philippines

Hi Credence; I saw Trump on a show that aired down here and Trump talked about his childhood. But it was a long time ago and I wasn't really paying much attention so I might have mixed stories and he might have been talking about his father.

As I said I am not a Trump fan, I've never watched his BS TV shows. I find him rather irritating to watch and I can see why candidates might want to avoid him.

My problem with every debate I've ever seen is that the moderators have absolutely no cajonas. They let candidates babble on off topic or go back to a question that has already been done. They don't slam the door on them when they run overtime and they don't give equal time to all candidates.

A moderator's job isn't to pander to any candidate or to be polite and merely mention that they are going overtime. What they should have is a switch that only turns on 1 microphone at a time, and when their time is up their mic should be shut off.

Every candidate should be allowed to respond to the same question.

The one thing that I think Trump would bring is that he doesn't care about being perceived as rude and might make the candidates stick to the subject and not run overtime basically stealing time from the others.

My point about the debates with Perot was that he forced them to say more than their party platitudes. When the other candidates claimed they were going to do this or that he demanded that they explain just how they are going to accomplish it. For the most part they had no real answers.

These candidates all claim that they are going to fix the economy and create jobs. With the exception of Paul I haven't heard any of them say just how that is going to work, but as I mentioned I haven't seen the entire debates.

Yes there are always trade offs to being an expat. The cost of living is much less, the women are much more,, lol;-

As a whole the Republicans baffle me, they say they want change and demand that we don't get "the same old thing" yet Gingrich is leading? He is horrifically corrupt and you can't possibly any more SOS than him.

He is just plain slime in a suit.


Ghaelach 4 years ago

Morning Credence.

You've got me a bit there.

Mi casu es su casa. ??

My home is my castle. ??

Portugiesisch or Spanisch ??

LOL Ghaelach


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, Ghaelach, you know me, always trying to be clever. I checked this out Mi casa es su casa, it should mean my home is your home. I wanted to extend a warm welcome so that you may decide to visit me again. I typoed the second word, it should have been casa not casu, sorry.

Enjoy your day!! Cred2


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Your preaching to the choir here, Borsia. How does someone like Newt get so much support with so soiled a resume. Seems like that is the last person you want fix the system. There is your classic fox in the hen house.People these days are pretty 'hard up' to have deal with the likes of him.

As for the women, if only I were single again, I could set myself up as a "patron"? From what I understand 4-5K per month would allow me to live like a king. This is an exciting prospect deserving further study. Best regards, Cred2


Ghaelach 4 years ago

Morning Credence.

If it where possible i'd take the next flight out of Europe to Hawaii and arrive to a welcome you could only receive in Hawaii and yourself.

Take care Credence from a very chilly Europe.

LOL Ghaelach


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Good Evening, the opportunity to show a little "Aloha", nothing would give me greater pleasure. Wish that I could send you a little sunshine, but it has been raining cats and dogs here for 2 days, almost reminiscent of the "Great Flood". You know, we have got to be almost 11-12 hours apart. Every now and then I like to watch the video cam at Abbey Road in London and watch the people getting about and assess the weather.

Keep well bundled, regards... Cred2


Borsia profile image

Borsia 4 years ago from Currently, Philippines

;-) Credence on that much you would have a full staff and a full bed.

I hope you speak Spanish.

I managed to see the debate, or most of it, and my expectations to be disappointed were fully met by the ABC / Yahoo coverage was as dismal as possible.

It was the Newt & Mitt show with a taste of Perryaire' on the side.

The moderators, yes I am laughing at that wording too, managed to completely ignore Paul, Bachmann and that other guy. with only the slightest lip service in the form of asking Paul a question and then asking the Bobbsey twins what they thought about Paul's answer.

It was humorous, especially when the twins argued about who was the old dog Washington insider / SOS politician.

Paul was the one getting big applause from the crowd and the one getting the most votes online. But needless to say they claimed it was "Another win for the Newt".

If you checked the stats given by their own website Yahoo rated Paul above the Newt and Bachmann had a better showing than either of the twins.

After the betting incident both Mitt & Perry were toast.

The one thing that PO me the most?

When ABC went to commercial break Yahoo had the 4 Yehoos discussing the debate so far. They didn't even mention that other guy a single time.

Every time they mentioned Paul, I believe it was twice, the monitor behind them was on the Newt then Mitt and finally, in the very last second, they switched to the video feed of Paul.

Insulting in that it showed the degree of pandering and $ss kissing they were up to.

It is very sad that if you want to see unbiased real accurate reporting these days you have to go to Al Jeezer!!! Absolutely pitiful America.


feenix profile image

feenix 4 years ago

Hello, Cred,

This is an awesome hub. Really. And I agree with almost everything you wrote.

The only thing that I will add is, not only is Donald Trump a "pompous egomaniac," he is a narcissistic psychopath.

And the man has got to do something about that comb over. Every time I look at his hairstyle, I want to grab my surf board and head for your state of residency ;-)


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Borsia, "I hope you speak Spanish", not well but under the circumstances, I think that I could learn pretty quickly.

Paul is the only one with conjones. The one that will not pander or equivocate. I think that he caught Mitt with his pants down when Paul said that Reagan, because his promoted so much deficit spending, should not be the hero and icon conservatives make him out to be.

For me, I am democrat, so I am not heavily involved. But is easy to see that Mitt is wimp, panderer and doesn't have the true grit, that is why conservatives seem to continue to distrust him. Newt is a skunk in a suit, with ethical problems and the bull in the China shop persona that will never serve as commander and chief. Truly a legend in his own mind. Huntsman has a solid record but he is far too moderate to attract those that dine on red meat. It is all remains under the big top! Thanks Cred2


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Thanks, feenix, while I am certainly not GOP, we on the left welcome a credible contest between ideas so folks can make the appropriate choices. Someone like Trump disqualifies the conservative side, before the contest can begin.


Borsia profile image

Borsia 4 years ago from Currently, Philippines

We can't blame the Republicans for having the Donald any more than we can blame the Democrats for having Moore or Baldwin. Funny how they swore they were going to leave America for good if they didn't get their, what ever it was, passed.

Why are they still there?

Both sides have their rich wackos.


Auntie D profile image

Auntie D 4 years ago from California

Well, I'm still waiting to see how 'The Donald' gets himself out of the debate he was certain everyone he invited would be involved in...it should be an ego breaker but may fly over his head since he's very much into his own world.


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, Borsia, The GOP ned to ignore Donald and not continue to feed his ego. We have no one on the left who tenacles go so far and so deep into the nominating process. It is true, both side have their wackos, but Trump has gone beyond the pale. There was no one having to kiss George Soros or Michael Moore's rings back in 07 and 08 Thanks Cred2 Simply stated, Trump has no equivalent on the left.


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, Auntie, it has to be hard on the ego to have all the Presidential contenders dare to not gather round as directed. It will stick in his craw, who will receive the wrath of Trump for this outrage? Your guess will be as good as mine.

Star Trick II-The Wrath of Trump- now in your local theatre,


SweetiePie profile image

SweetiePie 4 years ago from Southern California, USA

Why are Americans still paying attention to Donald Trump after the 80's. I have considered him a show boat for years, especially when him and Rosie got into it over the Miss California drinking debacle. Like who cares about a beauty pageant, but apparently they both argued a length about it.


Credence2 profile image

Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, Sweetiepie thanks for your comment. How a major political party would want to link its fortunes to "show boat" is beyond me. Unless he does something crazy like become a third party candidate, maybe he will just quietly exit the stage with minimum fanfare. We can only hope... Best regards Cred2

PS

Maybe he just might take some of those billions and have somebody do something about that mop on his head!!


islandantoinette profile image

islandantoinette 4 years ago from The Big Island of Hawai'i

I have certainly enjoyed reading these comments and the creativity and intelligence that eminates from within them. Credence2 has a brillant mind and very inquisitive ideas indeed that he expounds upon in all his hub pages, I am thoroughly enjoying them. A great way to get to know someone even better!


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Credence2 4 years ago from Florida (Space Coast) Author

Hi, islandantoinette, your compliment is most appriaciated. Come back and visit again and often.

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