the different forms of government systems

1. 66

   SparklingJewelposted 14 years ago

   I have no problem saying I did not realize the difference between a democracy and a republic.
   
   Watch this short video and let me know what you think.
   
   
   http://www.flixxy.com/political-systems.htm

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      Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Good film. Many Americans have been fooled into believing they are in some way being taken into consideration by the gov. I myself was shocked to discover when I moved there that there is no proportional representation, having been fed the "by the people for the people" line.
      
      Oh well. As I have always said, I have a tough time seeing any differences between any parties.
      
      And I agree with knolyourself. Too much glorification of the "republic," and it is really an oligarchy. No matter the right-wing/left-wing BS. The same here in France. A republic where 100 people can change the laws to suit themselves.......

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      1. 81

         Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Sadly, the same applies in the 'Home of Democracy.' Mind you, the Greeks break stuff if the government goes too far - maybe democracy by direct action

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      2. 61

         AlexiusComnenusposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         My goodness. I could no agree more. Being in the army I am especially sick of the "We're the greatest government in the history of the world" talk. Whatever your opinion there can be no accepting of that statement without a true understanding of the past governments OF the world. People who have no knowledge of the past cannot claim that ours is the best simply because other countries tremble in fear of our army.
         This truly is an oligarchy. The founders envisioned a govt. of representatives close to home where people could voice their grievances quite directly. However, over the course of 200+ years the representatives have distanced themselves that most people go their entire lives without sometimes even knowing their congressperson's name, let alone ever actually meet them.
         I would be very interested to hear what the people in this forum believe would be a better form of government. This is an issue very dear to my heart as I have studied this for about 12 years now. Of course I have my own carefully guarded ideas of government. What say you?

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         1. 58

            Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I say less is more.
            
            We have too much damn government all over the world. Seems to me like 50% of the population is supporting the other 50% that work for The Government Inc. Almost no matter the country - and America is certainly no better than many.
            
            The only politician I have heard say anything that makes sense is Ron Paul. Can't say I agree with everything he says, but he makes some good points. Of course, he is unlikely to get the necessary backing to get anywhere.

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2. 71

   AngloSaxonposted 14 years ago

   This video is spot on. It is very sad that so many do not comprehend the very basic truths presented in that ten-minute video.
   
   Thanks for posting!

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3. 60

   knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

   "Watch this short video and let me know what you think."
   Excellent little film. However I would quibble with the glorification of 'republic'.
   The US is a republic meaning representative government. The question becomes who do the representatives represent? I would suggest the US is already a hybrid republic/oligarchy.

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4. 60

   knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

   I was in the service in Greece. The government was overthrown soon after I left. When I came back a year later there were notices posted at all the cafes:
   no political discussion allowed. But that didn't last long. The students overthrew the dictatorship, after I think 2 or 3 years.

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   1. 81

      Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks, knolyourself - interesting that you witnessed it!
      
      One of the reasons that the Greeks still cherish freedom - the dictatorship was a horrible part of history. The students indeed started the overthrow process - that is the reason why the Greek police are barred, by the constitution, from entering university premises.

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5. 72

   EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

   Color me very unimpressed.

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6. 60

   knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

   "Color me very unimpressed." So how does life work out without stop lights?

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   1. 72

      EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I would imagine it wouldn't work too well. What's your point?

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7. 60

   knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

   "I would imagine it wouldn't work too well. What's your point?" Would imagine the point is an anarchist would not believe in stop lights since these things would requiree governent.

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   1. 72

      EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Right, it's impossible to put up a stop sign without the government. I woulda never got that tree planted in my back yard the other day, if the police hadn't showed up to hold the shovel for me.

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8. 60

   knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

   "Right, it's impossible to put up a stop sign without the government." Try Las Vegas.

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9. 72

   EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

   We've got plenty of stop lights in Vegas. In fact, the bigger issue has been the complaints that the city won't allow people to pay for stoplights at dangerous intersections in newly constructed neighborhoods. That kinda kills your theory.

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10. 60

    knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

    "the city won't allow people to pay for stoplights at dangerous intersections"
    So you't saying the city won't allow the anarchists to put up stop lights?

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11. 72

    EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

    We do organize parties where we get drunk and run from corner to corner installing unauthorized traffic devices. It's quite the rush.

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12. 60

    knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

    Used to know people who installed unauthorized traffic devices. Think they were a little more serious though.

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13. 72

    EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

    You shoulda explained to them that, if they really were serious, they would have to join the government in order to learn how to properly erect signs.

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14. 60

    knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

    I take you draw your own water, generate your own heat and electricity,
    make your own roads and figjht your own fires.

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15. 72

    EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

    I would be the first guy to ever do that wouldn't I?

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16. 60

    knolyourselfposted 14 years ago

    Would think so EYEAM4ANARCH

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17. 72

    EYEAM4ANARCHYposted 14 years ago

    You're probably right. I've never heard of a private road or a volunteer fire department. In fact, I'm pretty sure that the settlers of California and other western states waited until the government showed up to drink anything or build a road.

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18. 71

    AngloSaxonposted 14 years ago

    I've been studying principles of sound government off and on for about 16 years. It's my belief that the US Constitution represents the best founding document for a just form of government that the world has generally ever seen. Alas, it has been amended badly at times and interpreted even more badly so that if you compare the government in the US today to the one established and envisioned by the Framers you would see two quite different creatures. Much of this difference came and comes about because of the blurring between a "democracy" and a "republic".
    
    A poster above says he is in the army. He might be interested in the old U.S. War Department's training manual (see link for details) definition of the difference between these two forms of government:
    
    
    
    LINK: http://www.1215.org/lawnotes/lawnotes/repvdem.htm
    
    
    I'd agree that Ron Paul sticks close to the principles of the Constitution - in both his walk and talk I would add - and the original intent of the Framers.
    
    From what I have been able to garner I believe Joel Skousen's ideas on government and a Constitution most clearly adhere to the spirit of just laws and liberty. You can find his "Foundations of the Ideal State" here: http://www.joelskousen.com/Philosophy/philosophy.html
    
    My own blogs are an attempt to simplify and put together some of the basics of "Understanding Liberty" - though I have written only 2 thus far and have little time Tom Mullen's blogs also cover many principles of sound government, usually taken from the starting point of a current issue.

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    1. 81

       Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Howdy AngloSaxon - good to hear from you.
       
       Reading your definition of democracy, that seems to fit the Greeks perfectly - discontent and mobocracy!
       
       Mind you, I have a lot more personal freedom here than in the UK, so it always seems to be a case of 'swings and roundabouts.' I am not sure about US government, as I only have a grasp of the basic structure, but the Greek Constitution was largely modelled on the US version, albeit a little more modern, as you would expect. It works well and still serves the people rather than the 'elite.'

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19. 71

    AngloSaxonposted 14 years ago

    I'm from the UK. Much of the philosophy of the US Constitution was taken from the old Anglo-Saxon Common Law libertarian (aka classical liberal) tradition of England.
    
    The US Constitution did have a good effect on the constitutions of other countries - indeed, the British Prime Minister of the time (Gladstone) remarked that the document was the most marvellous work ever struck off by the brain of man (or words to that effect)...

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    1. 81

       Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Yup - Anglo-Saxon law is a little more familiar to me. I am originally from the North-West of England - although my favoured area was Viking history, the two traditions were very similar!
       
       Sadly, we did not like the way that the UK is going, one of the many reasons that we moved to Greece (apart from the weather, food, sea and scenery!). In Greece, because the Fascist regime lies within living memory, they refuse to allow the government to sneak in restrictive laws by stealth. The news reports showed that the Greek riots were a result of 'anarchists,' but that was very lazy reporting - the underlying reasons run a lot deeper than that.

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