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IS JESUS GOD?--WHAT DOES SCRIPTURE SAY ABOUT THIS.

Updated on March 13, 2017

IS JESUS GOD? WHAT DOES SCRIPTURE SAY?


Gal 6:7-8 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.


So many people that profess to be Christians (followers of Christ) believe and promote the satanic lie that Jesus is God.


WHY would they do that?


By believing this lie they are saying that Jesus is not a man, that He had no choice in dying for us, that the scriptures are lying when they say it would take A Perfect MAN to fulfill the law and finish it, thereby bringing the new covenant into force, replacing the law with its harsh penalties for failure, with forgiveness for trespasses.


The answer lies in the fact that they DO NOT do the things that scripture requires for them to be real Christ followers. The failure is a result of not knowing or not believing the scriptures that tell us to read and understand the scriptures for themselves. They believe the lie from the church system (self protection by the hirelings therein) that they have to be taught by a man but.

The scriptures say the Holy Spirit was sent to teach us ALL things.


They believe the church system” lie that they are NOT SMART ENOUGH to read and understand the scriptures themselves instead of the scriptural TRUTH that they must be filled with and be controlled by the Holy Spirit in order to understand the scriptures. Since they trust in men, not as scripture teaches to trust in the word and the Holy Spirit's teaching them as they study scripture, they are ripe to believe the falsehoods men teach to achieve their goals rather than those of The Lord. They do not know or understand that what they call “church” is a false replacement of the temple run by men that was done away with at the cross. That Christ's true followers do not “go to church”, they ARE the church. That the title “pastor” is not a scriptural title, but a title bestowed by man and his interpretation of scripture.


Doesn't it bother anyone;

That scripture tells us that the temple (place to meet God )was given to Israel and only for a season until the Christ would come and fulfill the law thereby ending it?

That the scriptures show the veil covering the place where God dwelt in the Temple was rent, destroyed, to let God free from the confines of the system that was polluted by men?

That there is no such thing in the new testament as a building called “church”?

That there is no such thing in scripture as a “pastor”, pastor is a function of GOD ANOINTED ELDERS, NOT A TITLE or POSITION.

That in the new testament there is no man “over” another man as the “churches” teach.

And all the other thing taught by the “church” hireling that are not in the new testament.

Certainly it does not if you do not read and study the scriptures by yourself with the aid of the Holy Spirit .


OF COURSE IT DOES NOT IF THEY DO NOT LEARN IT FROM THE HOLY SPIRIT they will never learn it in a “church” led by a man appointed by men because it would remove their place as the great teacher and leader that they have assumed in the place of Christ. They would lose their “position” and have to get a job. True ministry is not a paid job, it is a work of love as a SERVANT .


The New Testament IS THE PATTERN for the church (people, followers) of Christ. In it The Holy Spirit dwells (lives) IN HIS PEOPLE, not in a building, He is present WHEREVER YOU ARE you need not go ANYWHERE to meet Him, his residence is in you IF you are are a true follower of Christ and are baptized in/with the Holy Spirit without whom the scriptures say it is impossible to understand .


1 John 2:26-27 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him. These things I have written to you concerning those who try to deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.


Those who follow man will by man be deceived, but those who follow Christ according to His directions will NEVER BE DECEIVED.

JESUS CHRIST IS THE SON OF GOD. God has given Him ALL AUTHORITY in heaven and earth UNTIL-- THE END OF THIS AGE (until the judgement ) when JESUS returns it to GOD and sits down at His right in submission to GOD THE FATHER. JESUS IS NOT GOD. JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD to whom ALL AUTHORITY has been given for a season, until the end of this age.

This authority was necessary for Him to become the salvation of mankind., it did not make Jesus God, it only gave Him the authority of God as His delegated representative UNTIL HE has fulfilled His mission at which time he gives up His delegated authority and returns it to God His Father.


Matt 28:18-20 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen.


1 Cor 15:20-28 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. 23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ's at His coming. 24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27 For "He has put all things under His feet." But when He says "all things are put under Him," it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted. 28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.


Matt 24:11-13 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved.


Contrary to what many teach scripture tells us we must follow CHRIST, HIS WAY, until the end to be saved, you may be born again but you are not saved (or are told I never knew you ) untill the end. When you die, where you stood with Christ at that time is your position for ETERNITY.


FOLLOW CHRIST ONLY, ITS THE ONLY WAY.

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  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    CHEVY- GREAT let us know how it goes.

    I am sure it will be a great blessing for you

  • Rich kelley profile image

    Rich Kelley 3 months ago from The Ekklesia

    Hi Michael-Milec

    Thank you for your comments to my thoughts. What everyone knows is not known. My assumption was that anyone having been in prayer and study concerning one of the foundations of the Catholic and Protestant religions, would have considered or been directed to the first part of John chapter one. You make a good point in that the original scriptures did not have chapters and verses. In my studies I've taken the entire New King James Version (NKJV) New Testament and removed the chapters and verses. I have that in a PDF file if anyone is interested and would be glad to send it to them. I removed what man had put in to original scriptures so I might be one step closer to what may have come from the pens of the inspired writers.

    What I have found is that the first part of John chapter one is always approached with the thought that Jesus is God. That belief has been said, penned, and grown to be a "matter of fact" statement. What I have learned no matter the translation, "IT", "He" or "Him" no where does it say JESUS IS GOD, that thought has to be injected into the scriptures. I can find tremendous support in all scripture, that says Jesus is the result of God's efforts or plan, but not the exact statement "Jesus is God." Jesus Himself never said "I am GOD." There are plenty of documented moments for that teaching to have been give but it never happen.

    It is only evil that would take the statement "I and the Father are one" and turn it into a religious talking point resulting in doctrine that turns man into God. This thinking comes right out of the Greek God handbook 101 and some sick minds.

    We will see Jesus (our Lord), turn all the power and authority he has back over to God, and sit down at His right hand. (It is written)

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    Alright, then im gonna spend extra time studying and praying.

  • Michael-Milec profile image

    Michael-Milec 3 months ago

    Rich Kelly Hi. Among others interesting points in your comment “Everyone knows The start of John chapter One “ this one caused me to react “really?” reading only a translation version mainly verse ends as a misconception leading to theological persuasion , and endless discussion. On the other side if we realize that original Greek test is written without chapter and verses as The One complete thought, the message will produce desired results. There is one whole passage here beginning with verse one up to # fourteen which must be understood in the light of the verse revelation. First of all literally the Greek may be translated “The Word was with God and God was the Word.”

    ‘WORD’ the Greek LOGOS means ‘word’ as a unit in a sentence and is the basic means of communication . Wit words we express our thoughts. However LOGOS has other meanings which the English “word” does not contain. For example LOGOS represents the Hebrew word DABHAR, the creative Word of God as it is found in Genesis - ‘God said… and it was’. Thus the Word of God appear as active, powerful and effective in Hebrew biblical recording. (Proverbs 8:22-31 might help to understand Hebrew thinkers as of Wisdom an eternal , divine Person who existed before creation and was present at creation.) Was this idea in John’s mind when presenting the word LOGOS in the opening verse? But the full meaning of the term becomes abundantly clear at verse 14, we are told that the LOGOS became a human being who came to stay for a while among men. we have to be careful here to obtain total revelation.

    Now lets go back to first verse of English translation “The Word was with God and God was THE Word. The article makes a difference (?!). the second use of THEOS- God in that phrase - if we think Greek, means ‘ The Word was DIVINE - which translation of whole sentence the is “ what God was, the Word was” … ( Neither any of our guessing (He, or it)

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    amen aaron

  • PlanksandNails profile image

    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    Chevysbowtie,

    You will need to get some study aids such as a Lexicon and an Interlinear and make some more effort of your own to study the context passages in the inspired language as well as the English language with the whole counsel of Scripture.

    Isolating verses on their own is not a very good idea.

    You want Christ to be God; however, let's not isolate, but confirm and complement instead of contradicting.

    For example:

    But THESE ARE WRITTEN so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name. - John 20:31

    Nathanael answered him, “Rabbi, you are the Son of God! - John 1:49

    She said to him, “Yes, Lord; I believe that you are the Christ, the Son of God, who is coming into the world.” - John 1:27

    When you reference John 1:1, you are implying the opposite of what the purpose of the book of John was meant to convey.

    But when Jesus heard it he said, “This illness does not lead to death. It is for the glory of God, so that the Son of God may be glorified through it.” - John 11:4

    Christ is the Son of God, he is not God. Christ spoke the words of his Father, but that does not make him God. He is the image of his Father, but that does not make him God. He is the word of God in God's plan and purpose manifested in the flesh, but that does not make him God.

    This is all confirmed in Scripture many times. The word of God does not contradict itself when applied in its right context.

    The book of John was written to show who Christ is. He is the Son of God, but you are trying to turn him into God the Son.

    I hope that helps.

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy- No translation of scripture can be fully trusted. But if we ask the Holy Spirit to reveal ALL truth to us He can and will, if we are willing to let go of all we believe and let Him teach us truth. and you can use any old bible. But - when one has been conditioned to believe certain things it is hard to let go of them no matter who is telling us. So in order to receive truth get ALONE WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT and tell Him, I have been taught this, now someone is telling me that this is truth, please show me the truth whatever it is. then take the information you have and study with the attitude of I do not care who is right or wrong I just want the truth of scripture. For people with no knowledge of the original languages the interlinear bible is a great helper. It gives a word for word translation without the added words and ideas of man.

    It is hard to lay down years of being taught for new understanding. But if we want truth there is no other way.

    You will be rebuked by the church hirelings but you will find a new freedom and a more loving and fulfilling relationship with the Lord, You will also see the scriptures come alive and make more sense, have a much greater depth and meaning to you.

    Try it you will like it and it will please God. be blessed

    you might want to read my hub on how to study scripture?

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    Ok then, how am i or anyone supposed to know which version is correct enough to get them to Heaven If they are all messed up by man?

    I mean i can say the Holy Ghost confirmed to me many times over that KJV is correct, and then soneone else says the Holy Ghost confirmed to them some other version?

  • PlanksandNails profile image

    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    Chevysbowtie,

    You also quote Isaiah 9:6, but again the verse does not prove that Jesus is God. here is a different translatiion,

    For a child is born to us, and a son is given to us, whose government is upon his shoulder: and his NAME is called the MESSENGER OF GREAT COUNSEL: for I will bring peace upon the princes, and health to him. – Isaiah 9:6 [Breton Septuagint Translation]

    For a child is born unto us; and the government is upon his shoulder; And his NAME is called El Gibbor father of Ad, ruler of Jerusalem. – Isaiah 9:6 Dead Sea Scrolls

    As you can see this rendering is quite different. Whatever the differences are, and what is common to both passages is that the child will be called, or given a name(s) in the verse. We must take note that within the ancient Hebrew culture that all because someone, or a place has God’s name as part of a title, or name they use does not necessitate that they, or it is God Himself.

    For example, the name Isaiah means, Isai = saves and iah = Yah. When we put the two pieces together, we get Yahweh saves. Just by having the name of God in the name does not mean, or imply that Isaiah was Yahweh Himself.

    A given name does not necessitate that the individual is God Himself, as in the example of Isai-ah and Yah-shua. Rather, they are agents, servants, or appointed rulers acting in God’s authority.

    The descriptive name given to the Messiah in Isaiah 9:6 is actually given in scripture in singular form from the transliterated Hebrew that is rendered as, 'Pele-Joez-el-gibbor-abia-ad-Sar-Shalom,' or 'Pelejoezelgibborabiaadarshalom.' Most English translations give the 'name' in different titles as seen in the NIV version where there are commas separating the descriptive titles of the one singular name.

    When many read Isaiah 9:6, they are confused because they have been taught doctrines where they must force their own eisegesis on the passage.

    Since the many English translations have a separated capitalized name dissected from the one singular name, many read 'Mighty God' and believe that this verse means that Christ is literally the one true God.

    There is no God besides our Father, Yahweh and there is nothing equal to Him. The child in Isaiah 9:6 is not mentioned as being God Himself, yet many must imagine and assume things into the verse that are simply not there. When we come to understand that Yahshua our Messiah is God’s appointed agent who comes in the name (authority) of his Father, the clarity of the verse resonates about the man the child will become.

    More Alternative Renderings of Isaiah 9:6

    Wonder-Counsellor, Divine Champion, Father Ever, Captain of Peace. - Byington Bible

    A wonder of a counsellor, a divine hero, a father for all time, a peaceful prince. - Moffatt Bible

    In purpose wonderful, in battle God-like, Father for all time, Prince of Peace. - New English Bible

    Wonderful Counsellor, Mighty Hero, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. - Revised English Bible

    Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty One, Potentate, Prince of Peace, FATHER OF THE AGE TO COME. - The Septuagint 21, as found in the Codex Alexandrinus, translated by Sir Lancelot C.L. Brenton, c. 1850.

    God anointed and raised up a Son who was given a singular name in Isaiah 9:6, 'Pelejoezelgibborabiaadarshalom.' This name describes what God was going to do through His agent to bring salvation to the world. Knowing the purpose and intent of how the ancient Israelite's used names reveals what God would do through His human representative.

  • PlanksandNails profile image

    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    Chevysbowtie,

    When you isolate Scripture verses without understanding the context, that is where you get false interpretations. Remember scripture must interpret scripture; otherwise, you have God's word in contradiction.

    Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” – John 20:28

    When all the evidence is honestly weighed, there is simply no doubt that Thomas was affirming Christ’s earlier teaching to him, that to see and believe in him was to see and believe in the Father. Christ declared/explained the Father in terms of everything he said and did. He is the way to the Father and through him we know the Father. Christ explained that they saw the Father when they saw him because the Father abiding in him did the works.

    How much more then was the Father abiding in that dead body which had the Father had risen from the dead by the power of His Holy Spirit?

    Since seeing Christ meant seeing the Father, Thomas said to Jesus, "My Lord and my God. Thomas is confessing and affirming what the entire Gospel of John is about and understood Christ's earlier teaching to him.

    Christ made the Father known to the people of the world. The only begotten declares/explains the Father. For that reason, to see Christ is to see the Father. To see the Lord Jesus is to see the Father, our God, and Jesus Christ's God.

    Blessed are you Thomas. Because you have SEEN, you have believed. - John 20:29

    He who believes in me, does not believe in me but in Him who sent me.

    He who sees me SEES Him who sent me. - John 12:44-45

    That is the meaning of, "My Lord and my God."

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy= If you have read anything I have written by now you should know that I DO NOT WANT YOU OR ANYONE TO BELIEVE what I write/teach/say UNLESS AND UNTIL THE HOLY SPIRIT CONFIRMS TO YOU IT IS TRUTH.

    Up to this point you have not asked me 1 intelligent question, all you have done is throw the same scriptures back at me, the ones that contradict others which shows they are being INTERPRETED wrong.

    That is not what a person seeking truth does.

    Look at my responses to you, I have used many scriptures and different ways to show you the truth but you do not study them to prove me wrong or to see if they be true, you just keep throwing the same tired stuff at me.

    When someone repeatedly uses scripture in a manner that it contradicts other scripture as you have done here, that person Is DECEIVED in that application, scripture says that, not me..

    IN REGARD TO IS 9:6 Who is "God" to man during this age?

    I will give you the answer. It IS NOT GOD, IT IS HIS SON, HE WHO HAS BEEN GIVEN all authority on heaven and earth FOR THIS AGE. HE IS NOT GOD but for this age He is acting as God to man.

    please read what I wrote to rich a few minutes ago.

    I love you enough to tell you the truth whether it is welcome or not. I WILL NOT AGREE WITH or pass over anything that is written as scripture truth if it is not TRUTH ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE properly translated and in correct context. That was Paul the apostle's charge to all who are anointed by God to teach.

    The reason God HAS NO PART IN the church system of man is because it has been TOTALLY CORRUPT FROM ITS INCEPTION. The hirelings that run it are unable to recognize truth because they have decided to follow man and have rejected God as the ultimate authority causing God to leave them to their own thoughts.

    There is much ERROR in the bibles today because the men that translated them put in extra words and meanings that are not in the scriptures. Bibles ARE NOT SCRIPTURE, they are translations by men that have opinion that they insert.

  • Michael-Milec profile image

    Michael-Milec 3 months ago

    chevyssbowtie , Hi. Is this a heart to heart talk your later comment on this page. Following statement seems to me a very friendly dialog content "You come on here and quote scripture and then tell us how wrong translations are, and tell others"...

    Sir, we know a bit and and we learn some more, while strongly depending on the Spirit of Truth who proceeds from the Father and teaches us... ( Now, if, we say something of "our own" trying to ascribe to the Spirit's wisdom, that part of human knowledge would cause disharmony among commentators as testimony to the rest of the readers how immaturely and selfishly we can be... Aren't we here on HP given chance to support each other's walk in righteousness trying to become true " light of the world and the salt of the earth", just saying.

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    Rich- thank you. Sometimes I come across different than I am, but those that know my heart know that my love for my brethren and the Lord is what drive me. After 40+ years I still have to deal with being offended when I see error called truth. I for sure do not know it all but what I know and teach I know is correct because IT HAS BEEN CONFIRMED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT OVER AND OVER. ALMOST EVERYTHING I TEACH I HAVE LIVED. BUT I always am open to check what others have for me with the Holy Spirit to see if it is of God. If I can be proven wrong by scripture in context and properly translated I will quickly repent and change.

    When I have repeated the same thing 3-4 times and still get the same answers from the doctrines of men I am finished. But when there is a true desire for truth I will continue as long as necessary. you know , dont waste time go on to one who has a desire for truth at any cost. And I ALWAYS SAY do not believe what I say unless and until the Holy Spirit confirms it is truth. Each person is RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT THEY BELIEVE, I am responsible for what I teach. I will not teach anything that I can not put my life on the line for because I believe that is what James is talking about.

    God bless you as you follow Jesus

  • Rich kelley profile image

    Rich Kelley 3 months ago from The Ekklesia

    Charlie

    Thank you for the write. The remarks are where the application and understanding of what you have written comes to light with the people that read and respond. Showing people how to remove confusion to get to the truth can be hard. Most people don't want to be told what they already understand may be wrong. I fight my understanding daily. I hear things I may not understand because I've learned/been taught something else. You said it differently but the teacher is the solution, the Holy Spirit sent by God on behalf of Jesus can solve any perceived misunderstanding. If my beliefs are upset it is up to me to get with the word and allow the real teacher to bring the comfort.

    I have in my past went into scripture and cut and pasted 3-15 different scriptures in a row that support the thoughts I've been taught by man. Then someone would post ONE scripture that made my point a lie so my brain says I have 15 you have one I must be right. There can be no way MY understanding of black and white can be wrong. (sarcasm)

    I have discovered that many of the main doctrines of men have come from the Catholic church but it doesn't stop there, it goes back to what we call the "Early church fathers." As soon as man has a doctrine he begins to ensure any translations of scripture will fit his doctrine.

    I'm going to post just one example and it is a big one, that concerns translating something wrong and what results after that.

    1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men 5 and the lyght shyneth in the darcknes but the darcknes comprehended it not.

    Everyone knows The start of John chapter One. This lays the foundation for many deceptions because of misunderstanding and the aid of translating something to suit the needs of Man's doctrines. This translation is John Tyndale's bible translation published in 1494, way before the famous KJV. Mr. Tyndale knew that "word" was an "IT" not a person. Tyndale knew if a man’s word was his bond that would be magnified with God's word. We know from the beginning that it is with God's word (speaking) that all was created, but when we read John we want to change everything. I'm sure that God in the beginning had a plan of redemption and like everything else God did, He spoke it into being. The prophets told of Jesus and it happened.

    I have found that regardless the translation the Holy Spirit will show any deception that man may have built into written translations. If I can make a list of 15 that says God is not Jesus and someone else can make a list of 15 that says Jesus is God, there would seem to be a stale mate, but God's word does not divide, man does and like you said at the start of the remarks the truth will be shown to us by the power of the Holy Spirit.

    I thank you for your patients with me and others as we run the race. God has blessed you and all that will follow after His word.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    Just how is it that you are always the one who supposedly follows the Holy Spirit and all your believing is coming from the teachings of the Spirit?

    If man according to you is always wrong including the translations because man translated them, then where is it that you get any scriptural ideas and beliefs? I suppose whatever they translated you and the Holy Spirit are correcting for our benefit.

    You come on here and quote scripture and then tell us how wrong translations are, and tell others that we are the ones deceived and you are giving us truth, how is it that you are the one with the most accurate teachings?

    I've read your ideas and ive also found you to be very inaccurate at times, not to mention straight out condescending to anyone who challenges your thinking. For instance when you think someone is wrong you automatically accuse them of being deceived. Because they dont see it your way which supposedly is the teachings of the Spirit.

    Did you ever think maybe people like to bounce different views off you or others so they might learn something?

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy-- no. I have wasted enough time showing you truth that you continue to deny because of your pride in your false understanding. you trust men, the bibles which are translations by men including emphasis on their false doctrines instead of doing a real study with the help of the Holy Spirit. You need to at least get an interlinear -word by word translation with no added or changed meanings.

    if and when you are willing to study what I give and either prove me wrong of see the truth instead of just trying to prove your false doctrines I am here but as long as you are not willing to study to see which of us (or prove neither) there is no sense in me repeating myself for you again.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    The Book still says the Word was God and the Word was made flesh.

    So you deny that the Word which is God was made flesh.

    Isa.9:6 still say His name shall be called The mighty God, The everlasting Father.

    And that dont mean thats what some people will refer to Him as.

    Even Thomas called Him My Lord and My God.

    You fail to look past the veil of His flesh and see God.

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    ERIC- No it does not belong in this conversation. It is here because chevy was trying to manipulate it to prove his false doctrine

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    CHEVY- I WILL TELL YOU FOR THE FINAL TIME, NOT WHAT I BELIEVE BUT WHAT GOD DECLARES IN SCRIPTURE WHICH MAKES IT ALSO WHAT I BELIEVE. SCRIPTURE DECLARES that ALL POWER AND AUTHORITY ON HEAVEN AND EARTH ( WHICH IS OWNED BY GOD) HAS BEEN GIVEN (DELEGATED) TO HIS SON JESUS CHRIST FOR THIS AGE. At the end of this age (the day of judgement) those who belong to Christ and have endured to the end will be allowed ENTRY INTO GOD'S ETERNAL KINGDOM and those who have not repented and submitted to Christ will be sent into the lake of fire with satan and his minions. Then JESUS CHRIST THE SON OF GOD WILL RETURN ALL POWER AND AUTHORITY TO GOD, HIS FATHER AND SIT DOWN AT HIS RIGHT IN SUBMISSION TO THE FATHER. THEN ONCE AGAIN GOD WILL BE ALL IN ALL.

    SCRIPTURE CLEARLY STATES--no man has ever seen God. Jesus, because he is the image of God states if you have seen Me you have seen the Father. Not the He Jesus is God but because He is the image of God. And scripture says we were also created in their image. Jesus IS the image of God and HiS disciples ARE CALLED TO BE THE SAME. SCRIPTURE SAYS WE ARE ALSO TO BECOME OF THE SAME SPIRIT AS THEY ARE. ALL THOSE THAT ARE TO ENTER THE ETERNAL KINGDOM OF GOD are to be if ONE SPIRIT. NO OTHERS WILL BE PERMITTED TO ENTER.

  • Ericdierker profile image

    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Chevy I wonder whether or not anything is God or part thereof. Can't we accept the way of seeing it as Christ is not God? I see Christ as I think God sees his children. My sons are a part of me and a wonderful part. But are they me? So much more for our God in heaven.

    If my son signs or speaks for me- it is true. I will cover his debts. My son and daughters my use my name and sign for me. This is authority. I give it. I release it.

    But they are not me.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    So then you all believe there is more than one, Jesus is not God then?

    And Jesus never claimed to be God or the Almighty?

  • Ericdierker profile image

    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Am I missing something. One being raised from the dead is significant here - how?

  • PlanksandNails profile image

    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    chevysbowtie,

    For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my soul so that I may take it again. No one has taken it away from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.” - John 10:17-18

    Christ was given the authority to take it up again by a command of the Father. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to claim John 2:19 means 'Jesus is God' because he raised his own body if he needed to be given the authority to do so by God.

    In the Gospel of John, Christ insisted that he was not able to do anything from himself. As he himself testified, it was the Father abiding in him who did the works (John 14:10, Matt 12:28, Acts 2:22). Now if this was true of Christ while he was alive and well, how much more was he unable to do anything of himself when he was laying dead in a tomb?

    The New Testament consistently declares that God the Father raised Christ from the dead by the power of His Holy Spirit.

    Please read the following Scripture references:

    Acts 2:24, Acts 2:32, Acts 3:15, Acts 4:10, Acts 5:30, Acts 10:40, Acts 13:30-37, Romans 1:3-4, Romans 4:24, Romans 6:4, Romans 10:9, 1 Corinthians 6:14, 1 Corinthians 15:15, 2 Corinthians 4:13-14, Ephesians 1:17-20, 1 Thessalonians 1:10, 1 Peter 1:21, Galatians 1:1.

    In light of the overwhelming evidence, we can see clearly that you have again cherry-picked verses and have not allowed scripture to interpret scripture.

    Unfortunately, you are imposing your own beliefs into the passages and it has become quite obvious that you trying to make God's word contradict itself. This is not a good idea.

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy- EVERY SCRIPTURE YOU HAVE SHOWN WAS MISUSED IN A MANNER TO MAKE IT APPEAR TO PROVE YOUR POINT.

    We have shown you that and you do not accept that FACT.

    YOU SAID " If the Eternal Spirit takes on human form and sacrifices that human form that means the human form died, the Eternal Spirit never died that's why the eternal Spirit could raise that human form back from the dead.

    You make it SOUND LOGICAL but it is not scriptural and not truth. Scripture DOES NOT conform to the logic of man, man MUST CONFORM TO SCRIPTURE.

    THE TRUTH IS scripture (not man) says. ALL AUTHORITY ON HEAVEN AND EARTH WAS GIVEN TO JESUS (by the owner of that authority that has the ONLY right to delegate it, His FATHER, GOD and for THIS AGE only) . So since ALL THE AUTHORITY OF GOD was His to use for this age, NO PROBLEM rising from the dead. This is PROOF THAT HE HAS THIS AUTHORITY but DOES NOT MAKE HIM GOD, it makes HIM possessor of God's AUTHORITY as scripture says, proving He IS THE SON OF GOD as scripture says. and it does NOT contradict any other scripture as your explanations do.

    as far as your statement " My very first post were all scriptures and they complement each other."

    that may be true BUT YOUR USE OF THEM CONTRADICTS MANY SCRIPTURES MAKING YOUR UNDERSTANDING OF THEM FALSE.

    its time for you to lay down your false pride in your incorrect (doctrines of men) understanding and let the Holy Spirit and His promise to show all truth, guide you instead of the doctrines of men.

    I am not attacking YOU, I am attacking the FALSE DOCTRINEs you promote with the hope you will let truth reign in you instead of the false doctrine of apostate men.

    If this is not possible then our dialog is over as you have repeatedly rejected truth even though it has been explained over and over. There is no sense in reapeating it again if you choose to be blind. The scripture tells us when the blind follow the blind they BOTH fall in the ditch. but the TRUTH WILL SET US free. GOOD DAY

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    If the Eternal Spirit takes on human form and sacrifices that human form that means the human form died, the Eternal Spirit never died that's why the eternal Spirit could raise that human form back from the dead.

    Surely you can see and understand that.

    John 2:19,21 Jesus said "destroy this temple and three days I will raise it up.

    If Jesus is not God how could He raise Himself from the dead?

    And just what scriptures that i give are contradicting other scriptures?

    My very first post were all scriptures and they complement each other.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy- WOW- your indoctrination and deception are deep-- to the core. Every single one of your "explanations" twist, assume something that is not there or just misrepresent what the scripture actually says. The normal for hirelings, are you a "pastor"?

    If Jesus is God and Jesus died then GOD died and your explanation is not valid.

    The real problem you still are unable to explain away is that every one of your uses of scripture and explanations contradict another scripture which cannot be done if truth is being presented. NO SCRIPTURE CONTRADICTS ANOTHER SCRIPTURE unless it is not being correctly interpreted.

    God is not a man, true BUT HIS SON IS. JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD WHO DIED AS A RANSOM FOR whosoeverwill.

    God gave a MAN, His Son Jesus ALL OF HIS AUTHORITY ON HEAVEN AND EARTH FOR THIS AGE and Jesus the Man will return that authority back to God at the end of this age......

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    @PnN

    You said "Did the Almighty God himself die for the 'church?'

    If so, then, the Almighty God died, which of course, scripturally is totally impossible. If God had flesh and blood, then this would make him lower than the angels. (Psalm 8:5; Hebrews 2:7)"

    ~ of course God cannot die being Spirit, thats the reason God took upon Himself flesh, the man Christ, for the purpose of death.

    There is only One sinless one, that is God. We also know Jesus was sinless

    Since it takes sinless blood for the atonement of mankind God had to take on humanity to be able to offer up a sinless sacrifice, because no human is sinless, thats why there was a virgin birth, Christ's blood is untainted by man.

    And Heb. 2:9 says that Jesus was made a little lower than the angels "for the suffering of death".

    PnN- If Christ is God, then why does it state in Scripture that no one has seen God.

    No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made him known. - John 1:18

    ~ Christ is the visible image of the invisible God, we are not "the image of the invisible God" we are in His image. And that image is Christ.

    The only image God has is the Christ. Before this image, Christ, is why no man hath seen God.

    So to see God you have to look at His image, the man Christ.

    As Jesus Himself said when you see me you see the Father.

    PnN- Christ, being our high priest was appointed by God to be the man who would offer his own blood.

    God is not a man. (Numbers 23:19, Samuel 15:29, Hosea 11:9)

    How do reconcile these verses?

    ~ John 1:1,14

    The Word was God..., the Word was made flesh.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    CHEVY-- NO you and I DO NOT agree on your false belief. For many reasons the main one being, if what you say was true there would be NO JESUS THE SON to sit down BESIDE HIS FATHER at the end of this age.

    There are two things YOU MUST LEARN.

    1.NO SCRIPTURE CONTRADICTS ANOTHER SCRIPTURE.

    2. YOU CANNOT TRUST ANY MAN'S INTERPRETATION OF THE SCRIPTURE (BIBLE), YOU MUST CHECK THE ACTUAL WORD FOR WORD TRANSLATION

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    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    chevysbowtie,

    Did the Almighty God himself die for the 'church?'

    If so, then, the Almighty God died, which of course, scripturally is totally impossible. If God had flesh and blood, then this would make him lower than the angels. (Psalm 8:5; Hebrews 2:7)

    Do you believe the one true God Yahweh was lower than the angels?

    Yahweh said that there is no other besides Him.

    I am Yahweh, and there is none else. Besides me, there is no God. I will strengthen you, though you have not known me. - Isaiah 45:5

    If it was actually the blood of God rather than the blood of the man Christ, then there has been no ransom, for it is the blood of one lower than the angels, a human that was needed to make satisfaction for the sin of Adam.

    You may say that Christ was both a spirit being in nature as God and a human being in nature at the same time, or a God-man, but no scripture says such a thing.

    Christ, being our high priest was appointed by God to be the man who would offer his own blood.

    God is not a man. (Numbers 23:19, Samuel 15:29, Hosea 11:9)

    How do reconcile these verses?

    You are right that God Almighty is a spiritual being and does not have flesh and blood. (John 3:24; 2 Corinthians 3:17)

    However, Christ was made a life giving spirit in his resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:45). He was not a spiritual being while he was a human being (1 Corinthians 15:38).

    You stated,

    (((Sure it does, you say Jesus is not God in the flesh, so I post a scripture that says He is.))

    God manifested in Christ as he was the image of God in the same way we portray the image of Christ when he manifests in us. If we portray the image of Christ, it does not make us literally Christ. Those in the NT who saw Christ 'saw' the Father, just as those who manifest Christ today will portray the image of Christ to others. God is revealed through His Son, just as Christ is revealed through all who follow him.

    If Christ is God, then why does it state in Scripture that no one has seen God.

    No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made him known. - John 1:18

    You stated, 'The Word says it better than i can.'

    Well, here are some other translations Acts 20:28:

    Keep watch over yourselves and over all the flock, of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God that he obtained with the blood of his own Son. — New Revised Standard Version.

    Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God which he obtained with the blood of his own Son. — Revised Standard

    Be careful for yourselves and for all the people the Holy Spirit has given to you to care for. You must be like shepherds to the church of God, which he bought with the death of his own son. — New Century Version

    Take heed, therefore, to yourselves and to all the flock, in which you the Spirit Holy placed overseers, to shepherd the church of God, which He purchased through the own blood. — Jay Green’s Interlinear.

    So, what "Word" says it better?

    If you allow Scripture to interpret Scripture, the ambiguous verses you keep quoting that appears to confirm your slant fall flat.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    "Simply quoting a verse adds no value to the discussion"

    Sure it does, you say Jesus is not God in the flesh, so I post a scripture that says He is.

    The Word says it better than i can.

    God Himself came in the flesh to redeem man, His flesh was the physical and visible manifestation of His person (singular).

    So yes Jesus was God. And once the end of all things is done the Sonship will be complete so the Son (flesh) will be subject to God. Because God has no need of a fleshly body other than the purpose of salvation.

    So i agree with Charlie on that point.

    Does that help?

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    @Pn'N

    I was not trying to say that God has blood, i was pointing out that God cannot shed blood because He is a Spirit, therefore He took on the nature of man to be able to shed sinless blood for mans redemption.

    Acts 20:28

    Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the Church of God, which He hath purchased with His own blood.

    The Holy Ghost hath purchased the Church with His own blood.Where did the Holy Ghost get "His own blood"?

    There is only one sinless one, that is God. And it takes sinless blood to redeem man, since God is a Spirit and has no blood He had to take on humanity in order to shed that sinless blood.

    Thats in line with John 1:1,14

    The Word was God..., and the Word was made flesh.

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    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    chevysbowtie,

    What's the point of quoting Scripture if you have nothing to say about them. You say you are just posting Scripture.

    FYI, we all have access to Scripture, so what's your point?

    Simply quoting a verse adds no value to the discussion unless you tell us what you think 1 Timothy 3:16 means to you.

    Why don't you tell us who you the Christ is?

    Is he God the Son, or the Son of God?

    Are you saying you do not know, or are you just playing games?

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    I did not try to give any meaning or interpretation of 1 Tim. 3:16, I simply quoted it. So I dont know why you keep judging my understanding of any particular word or verse.

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Go ahead and call me crazy. But my wonderful bride in Christ told me today that my sons were acting just like me. A little worrisome, but it brought me back here to make clear that those sons born from me are of me. Yes I admit they are also me of them. That don't make them dad, it makes us one and the same. I reflect them and they reflect me.

    It would be wrong to call them Eric. They are Brooks and Gabriel. They are so distinctively part of me, yet they are not me and I am not them but they are a part of me. Which is also true of my adoptive sons Khanh and Elmer and Jared.

    My sons do not want to be me. Good idea for my burden is different.

    Is Christ and His Father any different?

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy== The following was left off the last post.

    Your final comment "God was manifest in the flesh" is correct EXCEPT FOR the fact YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE MEANING of the word "manifest" . It does not mean that it was God, it means the character of God was shown, which ALL disciples are supposed to show.

    NT:5319 phaneroo (fan-er-o'-o); from NT:5318; to render apparent (literally or figuratively):

  • celafoe profile image
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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    chevy- Yes you are posting cherry picked scriptures with your incorrect understanding of them. No SCRIPTURE CONTRADICTS ANOTHER BUT ALL OF YOUR SELECTED ONES USED TO "PROVE" YOUR false doctrine do just that.

    You say you do not believe in the trinity yet you believe Jesus is God, so you have your own personal false doctrine a duoality instead of the common "church" catholic false doctrine of trinity?

    What part of " all power and authority on heaven and earth has been given to Me (Jesus) until the end of the age when I return it to The Father (God) and sit down BESIDE Him in submission to Him" , can you dismiss with scriptures in context and correctly understood?

    you are deceived (by the teachings of apostate men) and try to deceive me and others with false proof, a terrible thing for you to do. It is an effective method used by all hirelings to get weaker (in understanding of scripture) persons and those trusting in man to believe your false doctrines. It will not work with mature Christians that learn from the Holy Spirit as scripture tells us to do. you need to repent to God for maligning His Word.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    Eric-may I send you a private email? I would like to share some things with you that do not belong on here

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Oh no way did you call me a heretic Charlie. I love to learn from you. And I learn a lot. Though our views are not in exact alliance maybe they will be some day.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    John 1:1,14

    It does not matter if the "w" in word was capitalized or not.

    the sum of that verse is still "the Word was God" and v.14 says that same Word was made flesh.

    That does not imply two persons, its simply letting us know God came in the flesh.

    1 Tim. 3:16

    God was manifest in the flesh...

    God was

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    Just clear up something, i do not believe in the trinity idea, and im not cherry picking scriptures, i am simply posting scriptures that show that God was manifest in the flesh.

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    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    chevysbowtie,

    Why have you not acknowledged your error on 1 John 5:20?

    Before you keep posting Scripture, it is better to research a bit more in depth first because it exposes that your are cherry-picking Scripture verses instead of rightly dividing them.

    Both the American Bible Society and the Institute For New Testament Research in Germany (which produces the Nestle-Aland Greek text) agree that the manuscript evidence supports the reading 'tou haimatios tou idiou,' which is literally, the blood of His own (Son), not 'idiou haimatios,' 'his own blood.'

    God paid for our salvation through the blood of His own Son. The notion of God having blood is not supported anywhere in Scripture.

    In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace - Ephesians 1:7

    This verse speaks of Christ, the Son of God, or are we to impose God into this one as well.

    FYI, the English translators capitalized 'Word' in John 1:1 to make it appear as a person, but in the original text the 'word' is not capitalized. Again, when scripture interprets scripture, we find nowhere in context that Yahweh as a plurality of separate persons.

    Once this presumption is taken away, John 1:1-3 can be read without indoctrinated bias.

    John 1:1-3 speaks of one person, Yahweh the Father. In the beginning was His word and His word was with Him. There is no 'Word' as a separate entity with a personality. Yahweh was His word and His word was with Him. The word that is 'with God' and 'was God' is Yahweh's plans and purposes.

    God's plans and purposes (word) manifested in His Son in the flesh as it states in John 1:14.

    Scriptures repeatedly says over and over that, “I alone am Yahweh.” To infer something else defies the words of the one true God Himself. Scripture interpreting Scripture reveals truth and exposes someone's twisted agenda.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    mm- you stated. "Charlie you don't need my explanation (won't do any good). " which is a lie. IF YOU could give me an explanation, using scripture in context, that does not contradict ANY OTHER scripture, I would consider it. But since you can only use scriptures plucked from their context THAT ALL CONTRADICT OTHER SCRIPTURES and are used by all that teach that false doctrine in the same manner I can not consider them because I know the TRUTH that you you reject and in doing so you reduce the value of Jesus The Name above All Names and the only way to enter the Kingdom of God to not being a perfect man as scripture required to fulfill the law and replace it to zero. What a terrible thing to do. you have revealed yourself as an antchrist, and proved you do not understand scripture. repent

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    eric- I did not call you a heretic. If you are referring to the list of things that shows what is required of a true believer then your argument is with scripture, not me.

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    PlanksandNails 3 months ago from among the called out ones of the ekklesia of Christ

    chevysbowtie,

    The phrase “true God” that is found in 1 John 5:20 is also is found in 2 Chronicles 15:3, Jeremiah 10:10, John 17:3 and 1 Thessalonians 1:9. In all four of these places, the 'true God' refers to the Father and not the Son. Especially relevant is John 17:3 in Christ's prayer to his God. Christ calls his God 'the only true God.'

    These examples are very powerful considering that 1 John is a late epistle. This means that the readers of the Bible were already used to God being called the 'true God.' Add to that the fact that the writer of both the Gospel of John and the Epistles of John, it would be most likely he use the phrase the same way and in the same context. This is a very reason to believe that the “true God” of 1 John 5:20 is the heavenly Father, and there is no precedent for believing that it refers to the Son when Scripture interprets Scripture. Isolating verses on their own and using them as 'proof' texts is not a good idea.

    Even a considerable number of Trinitarian scholars say that this phrase 'true God' in 1 John 5:20 refers to the Father and not the Son.

    The facts are shown all throughout Scripture is that Jesus is not God, but he is the Christ, the Son of God unless Scripture is twisted.

    I would suggest using the who counsel of Scripture instead of cherry-picking because what you are doing is making Scripture contradict itself. You may be surprised to find that through a more thorough study with the help of the Holy Spirit that you you may be imposing your own preconceived notions on Scripture.

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    So I am in my 4th year of Catechism, near thirty years past my theology/philosophy degree and a faithful prayer and reader of the word. I spent my time preaching and working with homeless.

    And I am a devout believer in not following man and church. I taught my flock not even to believe me and was never compensated or spoke behind a "podium", although I think Christ might have been behind one to read the scripture of OT word.

    So am I discounted as a heretic for not believing as you?

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    eric- remember only those that fully submit to and FOLLOW CHRIST are brothers. Those that only "believe" He is the Son of God are not, (satan believes He is the Son of God) you must submit to and follow Him in the way He tells us to to be a son. Loving the brethren is a major part but not everything. "you will know them by their love" it also says "we will be known by our fruit". Love is only one of the fruits of the Spirit.

    eric- my "way of thought " is only good when it is HIS way and because we are to become like HIM I strive to only have his way. Also remember he said;

    Matt 10:22-23 And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.

    To people that are devoted to the "church system ", which is of man, not of God, anything other than what makes them feel good is wrong. The new testament makes it clear that the only way to learn truth is from the Holy Spirit, not from men. That is why we MUST when we hear any thing taught by man, go to scripture and the Holy Spirit to see if these things be of God. God uses men to expose error and show truth, but men also bring false doctrine. Just because something does not sound right to us may only be because we do not understand it correctly. If we do as we should, the Holy Spirit (for those baptized in the Holy Spirit) will tell us and show us in scripture whether it is of GOD or of man.

    If everyone believed and praised me for what I teach It would tell me that I am not doing as Christ did because they killed Him for what He taught. He constantly upset the religious ones. They don't like being exposed by truth.

    I see you growing in your understanding keep it up, but never believe man (you know I mean me too) without confirmation that it is of God. If it is not of God throw it in the sewer where it belongs.

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    So in your way of thought this actually strengthens and makes more important our concepts of us all being truly brothers with all man kind, of course sharing love so freely given but also the same blood as was shed for us?

    For me this is a very strong reinforcement of the commandments of loving God and each other.

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    Michael Milec 3 months ago

    Charlie you don't need my explanation (won't do any good). I live what I know and believe the rest ; a time is committing when we'll be like Him, then I will tell you rest of knowing it all...

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    eric-- correct, He is the first born of many sons, we who belong to and follow Christ according to His requirements are also sons of God and we are His brothers.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    MM- I have no desire or authority to crucify you, nor will I crucify Christ again, call Him a liar or accept any explanation of scripture that contradicts any other scripture, no matter who gives it.

    You can believe anything you wish, the Son of God, a man as we are, died for all but only whosoever will accept Him on His terms can receive the benefit of His sacrifice. . HE DIED TO GIVE US THAT CHOICE

    The scriptures NEVER contradict each other. Jesus says He and the Father are one and we are to also be one with Him, BUT THAT DOES NOT MAKE US GOD ANY MORE THAN IT MADE HIM GOD. When people see us they should see God but we are imperfect beings and fall short but He opened the door to forgiveness by repentance when we do fall short.

    Please explain to me how if Jesus is God the Father, how can Jesus return his delegated authority to the father, SIT DOWN BESIDE HIM and submit to Him at the end of the age as scripture says ?

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Celafoe, this is really interesting and I like it. So you are saying that God is God but Jesus is my brother? That sounds right for some reason that I like.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    And by the way, I didn't parrot anyone, I only posted scriptures.

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    1 John 5:20

    And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

    This is the true God

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    Michael-Milec 3 months ago

    What the Scripture says-as we know its translations ?!

    Dear Charlie,

    You can stone me to death or crucify me for my public statement, standing on (translation's) Scripture "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father" (Christ Jesus speaking) presumably "Father" here means "God", as well as "Don't you believe that I am in the Father and that the Father is in me." Now, presently as I live and walk this earthly sod, for over a three quarters of century, The God "in heaven" is my Father, residing far away sitting on His throne while always with me in the Spirit as a SPIRIT being ("mistakenly" believing of Jesus is my God, as the Father is my God until the moment when ALL this will be clarified after the time we all meet with Him in the glory.)

    May your God bless you as my God is blessing me. HalleluYAH.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    Chevy-

    great job of parroting the false claims of those who teach the lie that Jesus the Son of God, is God. Unfortunately it is a lie from satan, designed to cause confusion among believers, which it does.. That doctrine is from the minds of men that do not have the infilling of the Holy Spirit and therefore cannot understand the Spiritual side of scripture. Then it is parroted by those that either are without the Holy Spirit or too lazy to study scripture with the aid of the Holy Spirit, the ONLY source of ALL TRUTH.

    My first thought was to go through the scriptures you list and explain each,but instead I will give you the key to removing the confusion and revealing the truth.

    The reason for the confusion is misunderstanding the use of words. First there ARE NO CONTRADICTIONS in scripture, all of scripture fits together to make the whole picture. I have given you the scriptures saying that Jesus is THE SON of God. To understand the truth you must also understand a simple fact regarding the rights and abilities of the possessor of any authority to delegate that authority. The owner of any authority has the exclusive right to delegate that authority to whomever he wishes. When the person to whom the authority is delegated is possessor of that authority for as long as it is delegated to him. The person with the delegated authority is acting with the authority of the owner of the authority and is standing in place of the owner, in effect the person to whom the authority is delegated can be called the owner during the period in which the authority is delegated to him.

    EXAMPLE:

    ALL authority of the President of the USA is owned by the citizens of the USA per the Constitution of the USA. BUT, under the Constitution This authority is delegated to a man, designated by the election by the citizens of the USA and for 4 years He Possesses ALL of that authority. He is called President during the time he is authorized but at the end of that time he no longer is president. In fact the practice of calling an ex president by the name president as he no longer possesses that authority is incorrect, he is an ex president.

    Accordingly scripture tells us that ALL AUTHORITY ON HEAVEN AND EARTH has been Given to Jesus UNTIL THE END OF THIS AGE. HE is acting as God, with the authority of God, but he is not really God, He is the delegated authority acting in God's stead.

    Most of the scriptures that you quotes say He will be called, or they will call him etc. which is correct because of this scripture that you misquoted. Col 1:15 (Jesus) ... is the image of the invisible God..., they do say He is God. So yes it is ok to refer to His authority as the authority of God, but HE IS NOT GOD, He is the SON of God. And He has this authority to act as God until the end of the age when He gives that authority back to God and sits down at the right hand of God IN SUBMISSION TO HIM. HIS TERM IS UP AND ONCE AGAIN , GOD is ALL in ALL.

    Matt 28:18-20 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

    1 Cor 15:24-28 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27 For "He has put all things under His feet." But when He says "all things are put under Him," it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted. 28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

    You cannot have it your way without calling Jesus a liar contradicting other scriptures, but if properly understood there is no confusion as it fits perfectly with scripture with NO contradictions

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    chevyssbowtie 3 months ago

    Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

    Fulfilled in Mattehw 1:21-23

    21 - And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: ...

    22 - Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,

    23 - Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, GOD WITH US.

    Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: ...and his name shall be called ...The mighty God, The everlasting Father...

    Jesus is The God

    Jesus is The everlasting Father

    John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, ...and the Word was God.

    John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us,...

    John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him,...

    John 8:24 ...for if ye believe not that I am he,(the Father) ye shall die in your sins.

    John 8:27 They (Jews) understood not that he spake to them of the Father.

    John 8:58 Jesus said unto them,...Before Abraham was, I am.

    - I AM is God, this is why those Jews wanted to stone Him because He was telling them He was God.

    John 10:31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.

    John 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

    John 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying,...because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

    - Here again Jesus was telling them He was God, and again they wanted to stone Him.

    2 Cor. 4:4 ...Christ, who is the image of God...

    Col 1:15 (Jesus) ... is the image of the invisible God...

    - This is how God was seen,

    John 12:45 he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.

    John 14:8 Philip saith Lord, shew us the Father...

    John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, ..he that hath seen me hath seen the Father;...

    1Tim. 3:16 ...great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh...

    John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name...

    Christ's name is Jesus who happens to be God, The everlasting Father.

    Remember Isaiah 9:6

    Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

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    charlie 3 months ago from Planet earth. between the oceans

    eric- the context is establishing that we who come to Him His way are in fact Gods children. we are not Gods but as children of God we are in effect little gods and expected to act like Daddy. the context explains it since we know there is only one true God,and He is eternal, we are not equal to Him but are His kids.

    Please DO NOT misunderstand me, I am stating the truth of what is available to any Christian, not bragging, anyone can do it.

    as far as gnostic teaching I do not even know what it really is and I follow ONLY THE SCRIPTURES AS LED BY THE Holy SPIRIT WHO has been sent to teach us all things and to give us the power to become real disciples of Christ. No man has taught me, hundreds of hours alone and nights with no sleep with Him and the scriptures and He has given me much (not all, I dont know it all) correct understanding. that is available to anyone willing to pay the price. most people want someone else to do the hard parts rather than doing it themselves as scripture declares we must to get TRUTH.

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    Eric Dierker 3 months ago from Spring Valley, CA. U.S.A.

    Very comprehensive and well done. Carry me through on a couple deals here.

    What does this psalm mean? I have trouble here with the very straightforward verse from Psalm 82:6

    "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'

    And my understanding is that you follow the Gnostic holding. Please I seem ignorant on that one, please explain.

    Let us learn from one another and not the morons in the fancy robes.

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    KingdomCome 3 months ago from those of the Ecclesia

    celafoe- I don't know why I didn't see this sooner. It's full of truth. You are correct, most people do not study the bible for themselves. If they did they would realize as you pointed out, no such position as a pastor described anywhere in the bible. This concept of pastor is just another false dictrine of man made churches.

    I think this is a outstanding article and subjust that needed to be said. And you did. Thank you

    Blessing brother.

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