What if there was no land ownership?

Jump to Last Post 1-10 of 10 discussions (52 posts)

78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Can you imagine what life would be like without land ownership?
Its a very interesting mind-expanding exercise...
and very mind boggling.
...and yet the majority of the indigenous people lived on this continent without owning land.
When you think about it, how CAN anyone truly OWN land? Some tribes tried to claim their territories because they were farmers. These were the more waring types of tribes.

We are so used to the concept of buying a house or two or three that this goal seems to make life go around. Without this goal/reality/concept, what would life be like?

If society decided to try for a more anarchistic existence, could it transition away from the pursuit of land ownership?

Personally, I don't believe we will ever willingly stop playing "Monopoly".
reply report
1. 95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  No homes. No factories. No sewage treatment facilities. No roads. No energy production plants. No water production. No mines or quarries to produce raw materials. No significant food production.
  
  The stone age peoples were able to live in spite of this because they were hunter gatherers, without large populations. Any real population growth requires ownership of land, whether by government (communism, socialism) or individuals.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  …groups of people living together, some wandering nomadically, some living as large tribes of family members and friends... car production would cease.
  no need for gas or oil as travel would not be undertaken…. too much work to do on a local level, either wandering and setting up tents, or maintaining farm-lots where people have rolled cars to live in. (Farm-lots would be abandoned parking lots claimed as territories to live on in a communal way.) They would, of course, need land nearby to farm. They would have to tear up asphalt and cement. Roads would stop being maintained and pipes would not be replaced for water distribution. The farm lots would have to be near natural sources of water. Commune members would most likely own guns and ammunition to protect their territories. Water and ammo would become as valuable as gold.
  Those with the most ammo/water source would survive and rule. They would become ruthless in quest for power and might even take slaves… I dare not imagine further.
  So much for anarchy.
  reply report
  60
  janesixposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  I'm glad you finally thought this through. Anarchy isn't good for anyone.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  As you know I think things through "out loud" to analyze them objectively. No need to insult me.
  reply report
  60
  janesixposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  LOL, so worries, I do the same thing all the time.
  
  I wasn't trying to insult you:)
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  (you said "finally"…)
  Anyway, I would love it if an anarchist would enter.
  
  Calling all Anarchists!!!
  ( I mean, you don't have to wait for a national holiday to insult!)
  reply report
  60
  dianetrotterposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  You and I are alike Kathryn. I say things and people think I'm nuts. I tell them it's for the sake of conversation and getting the viewpoint of others. There is no right or wrong response, just "What do you think?"
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Right. I am bored with my own opinion, usually based on a limited amount of actual facts. Others' insights and points of view are interesting. Also, I prefer understanding an issue objectively, rather than subjectively.
  (Although, I do have an agenda…see below.)
  
  PS Keep up the good work, Diane.
  reply report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  You're part way there. But it's hard to tear up reinforced concrete roads with a few sticks, and there is no iron to make anything else. Or fuel to run existing equipment. And no chemicals to make gunpowder or bullets.
  
  Nor will putting farms (no farms, either) by rivers help as there are no pumps or energy to power the pumps if there were any. Even digging a ditch from the river is fruitless as you don't have the land to dig on.
  
  No livestock as you can't pasture them or fence them in - we'll become vegetarians. Better not die, though - no graveyards (would that be the new meat source?).
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  ...or to serve what they glean from graveyards to their captives.
  So much for anarchy.
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  What's any of that got to do with land ownership?
  Without the vast amount of capital tied up in landownership there would be so much more to develop those things that you think are dependant on land ownership!
  
  If you doubt the stupidity of land ownership look at the UK where the majority of the cost of a new house can be taken up in land costs.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  What if land ownership was outlawed in Britain?
  The return of knights on horses wearing armor?
  (and white satin underneath of course.)
  not even!
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  More likely the return of affordable housing.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  I think here, it is a matter of supply and demand.
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  It is here, demand far outstrips supply.
  reply report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Where will you build your auto factory? Where will you get the ore to put in the smelters, and where will you put the smelters to make the steel to build cars with? How will you get the steel to the auto factory without roads?
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  None of those things require land ownership.
  reply report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  I repeat, where will you put your automobile factory if you have no land to put it on? Float it in the clouds? Where will you dig the ore to make the steel for the plant, and how will you get it to the manufacturing facility?
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Where has all the land gone?
  reply report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Right where it always was. Available for anyone to do with as they wish. Whether there is a factory (or other valuable things) on it or not. Maybe hold a road race down the aisles. Maybe just vandalism. Maybe a bonfire. Maybe salvage all the iron (as no one has a mine anymore).
  
  Same with a farm; available for anyone to pick and take whatever they wish.
  reply report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  So, why shouldn't you still have zoning laws or whatever it is you call them?
  
  BTW in the UK land ownership gives you no rights to anything under the land, all you own is the surface. I expect it's the same in the USA.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  ?
  reply report
  90
  Rochelle Frankposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  In the US, property owners usually have mineral rights and water rights. We have a well for our water, and we could even sell the water. Mining and mineral rights for property or claim owners were established during the California Gold Rush and became the basis for property laws across the country.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  - that sounds better.
  report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Cool.
  Does that mean if a mine wants to extract coal, oil or minerals from under your house they have to make an agreement with you?
  report
  90
  Rochelle Frankposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Yes. (and that would depend of if they could do it without infringing on the rights of your neighbors.-- or messing up the environment.) Any profit from leasing or selling mineral rights would be counted as personal income and taxed, of course.
  http://homeguides.sfgate.com/mineral-ri … -7961.html
  report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Note it says that the USA is one of the few countries that allow private individuals to own private mineral rights.
  report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  This is interesting. Who owns the mineral rights in the UK? Government? And how does a mining company get an OK to mine on land they don't own? Just walk in and do it, get a permit, what?
  report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  That may take me a while to answer. I'd never considered it before.
  report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Seems a lot simpler tan I thought.
  Coal is owned by the coal authority, petrol and oil owned by the crown who also own all gold and silver.
  The rest owned by the land holder.
  
  http://www.inbrief.co.uk/land-law/land-ownership.htm
  report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Interesting. Wonder what would happen should large deposits of platinum, uranium, lithium or some other valuable resource be found. Take that from the owner as well?
  
  I did see something about water, though, and it seems much like the US. Water, whether underground, running or still, doesn't actually belong to any person although they may have rights to some of it. An interesting one in my local area is hot, geothermal, water - while wells may be drilled and water used (for household purposes, not irrigation), any hot water must be left alone. It can't even be pumped up, heat extracted and put back into the ground. If hot water is encountered the well must be sealed off with Bentonite clay or some other method.
  report
  60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Hot and the UK do not go together in any way shape or form
  report
  95
  wildernessposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  No, I don't imagine. But I'm not too far from the pacific "ring of fire" and even closer to the biggest volcano in the world - Yellowstone national park. We have lots of hot springs around here, and Boise, biggest city in the state of Idaho, has most of it's government buildings heated with natural hot water. So do quite a few of the older homes.
  report
2. 63
  PhoenixVposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  As long as there are property taxes, no one owns land. But then again if there were no property taxes, children would be forced into the mines to shovel coal, society would come to a grinding halt and more than likely the world would stop spinning on it's axis.
  reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
http://libcom.org/news/article.php/land … k-10032006
http://libcom.org/history/articles/digg … rs-1642-52
reply report
1. 60
  John Holdenposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  "The state’s planning laws means that land for housing is sold at over-inflated prices by the land-owning classes. For those at the bottom of the social scale even being able to rent or buy a small home is becoming increasingly difficult."
  reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Will I never own the land under my house here in US??
I am working and struggling for only this shack?
It (this shack) does seem way (edit: extremely) over priced, if that's the case.
reply report
66
steve8millerposted 8 years ago
Oh I wish that were reality. To exchange this demonic artificial simulated reality with true God given reality would be a blessing!

I have a feeling that God is going to come through for us all who want to go back to the reality God gave us.
reply report
1. 78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  - are you an anarchist?
  How do you view common land ownership as opposed to state land ownership.
  reply report
  66
  steve8millerposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  I believe no one should tell anyone what to do so I am no communist. I also do not believe in the state absorbing all the land in these national parks and telling people when they can go in and out. I also do not believe in the banks telling you that your house is a bank and having you barrow against it, thus people on fixed income loose their house.
  
  I believe we should not disassemble the nuclear family. I believe we are being destroyed slowly but surely by the dismantled nuclear family.
  
  Because I believe that we should all live together as families on farms, like the Amish they have it right. I guess I would be called an Amish man stuck in a world gone mad.
  
  God gave us the land and some people have tons of money and right now they are stealing all the land look at the BLM. Everyone will see soon enough what we have allowed to take place in America and around the world.
  
  But hey do not take it from me just turn on your television and wait until September rolls around. After September the people (I won't say you I don't know your understanding of reality) will realize what they have given up to live in this brave new world. It is a brave new world indeed.
  
  They seek to undermine the reality God gave us and this world will surely pay for that. Microchips, televisions, computer pets, and so on while oil washes upon the shores and radiation baths us and the sky is full of toxins.
  
  But hey maybe they all can live forever in this bodies we have, that one goal shows me how insane and delusional they really are. The body is a vessel and the masses worship it, not realizing their own true power. The deception is getting so heavy now it will not be too long before it crashes upon all our heads.
  reply report
  78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  I agree, steve8miller, except for the farm part.
  We are/were fine in cities. Farm life is not for everyone. City life is okay. Why do you not agree with cities? People can live harmoniously and happily in cities with all modern conveniences, including technological items. We need the discipline to use technology for good, not bad. I believe some day we will stop going ga ga over the latest items .. (now, the apple watches) and get back to real living.
  
  BTW: Equal opportunity is provided by the Constitution… Land ownership made this country get up and go.
  
  I agree with your comment about the gov't taking land. Obama just took some of our mountain areas away from people who had homes there:
  
  "President Obama designated the San Gabriel Mountains outside of Los Angeles as a national monument Friday, setting aside 346,177 acres of national forest as a recreational area.
  Using his authority under a 108-year-old law, Obama's executive action will permanently protect the forest from development and set it aside as an outdoor recreation destination.
  The move is not without controversy. Some park neighbors worry about what the move would mean for fire suppression efforts and restrictions on hunting and off-road vehicles.
  The San Gabriel Mountains National Monument is the 177th such designation since President Theodore Roosevelt signed the Antiquities Act in 1906. Obama has established or expanded 13 of them, all but one of them without congressional approval.
  And I'm not finished," Obama said, hinting that he was actively considering additional national monuments."
  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli … /17027331/
  reply report
66
steve8millerposted 8 years ago
THE FARM - BEST HOME OF THE FAMILY - MAIN
SOURCE OF NATIONAL WEALTH - FOUNDATION OF
CIVILIZED SOCIETY - THE NATURAL PROVIDENCE

Union Station
Quote East Side inscription.
reply report
1. 78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  How do I get one?
  reply report
  66
  steve8millerposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  The next line on that building talks about how the "Railroad" elite power house bought up the land and created a new world. Breaking free from that horrible prior existence of having to deal with our nuclear families on farms.
  
  Just hope all the Walmart's do not close hope these elites continue to want to feed us. lol
  reply report
  66
  steve8millerposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  Interesting article indeed just goes to show.
  reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Some history
"The Norman conquest of England in 1066 saw all land taken under the ownership of the monarchy. To this day the monarchy - in theory at least - owns all the land. The Normans changed the ownership of land with the King giving land as tribute to Norman lords and barons and depriving the Saxons. The Domesday book was the first audit of land. And the resulting system of feudalism exacted free labour, goods and produce and free military service to the land-owning classes for the rest of the middle ages."

http://libcom.org/news/article.php/land … k-10032006
reply report
66
conradofontanillaposted 8 years ago
Power for human beings (I am not talking of god or other creatures) is the origin of land ownership. it is by means of power that the Europeans grabbed lands in Americas and other settled lands. We have to deal with power.
reply report
1. 78
  Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years agoin reply to this
  We have to deal with the desire for power in others.
  So true.
  Usually power has to do with survival…
  and those who have the strongest desire to survive.
  They are also usually the most intelligent.
  Sometimes they have heart, sometimes they don't.
  
  I have observed that those with the most will-power have the highest IQ.
  Maybe they are also the ones with the most heart...
  hopefully… but look at the state of the world!
  teetering due to the richest!
  Are they helping or hindering?
  They COULD be helping.
  What prevents them from helping?
  lack of awareness of the suffering of others?
  How many have to suffer before they (the globalists) grow a conscience?
  I don't think they care about land.
  - just money.
  true or not?
  unless they really do want own the whole entire globe!
  reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Jumping ahead:
Meanwhile, here in the democratic republic of the USA, without morals and education/informed citizenry, the possibility of liberty diminishes. By abandoning The Constitution and not defending our founding principles, we hand over our section of the globe to the globalists. Lucky them.

Will THEY give us freedom?
HA!
No, they will see us as their captives and slaves.
We will not be allowed to acquire land.
or have individual power.

Have fun with that no land ownership, Anarchists.
reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Just remember there are more of us than them. We have power in our numbers
...if we are on the same page
United we stand, divided we fall.
We must keep our country for ourselves.
WHY NOT?
reply report
78
Kathryn L Hillposted 8 years ago
Repeating:
HINT:
Do NOT vote for either Clinton or Bush!
OR ELSE!

I believe we are fighting the Globalists.
And we, the citizenry, need to be on the same page in the next election.

We must vote for someone who has NO connection to them.

Additionally, I also believe we need to to resist any force (influencing us through the news media, educational institutions/programs, movies, etc.) trying to split us up over:
1. Racial issues
2. Cops vs the people issues
3. Poor vs rich issues.
4. Youth vs. elders
5. Sexual Identity issues

We must not fall for it!!!

TWISI
http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/post/130478
reply report

Post a Reply

jump to first post

Necessary
HubPages Device ID	This is used to identify particular browsers or devices when the access the service, and is used for security reasons.
Login	This is necessary to sign in to the HubPages Service.
Google Recaptcha	This is used to prevent bots and spam. (Privacy Policy)
Akismet	This is used to detect comment spam. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Google Analytics	This is used to provide data on traffic to our website, all personally identifyable data is anonymized. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Traffic Pixel	This is used to collect data on traffic to articles and other pages on our site. Unless you are signed in to a HubPages account, all personally identifiable information is anonymized.
Amazon Web Services	This is a cloud services platform that we used to host our service. (Privacy Policy)
Cloudflare	This is a cloud CDN service that we use to efficiently deliver files required for our service to operate such as javascript, cascading style sheets, images, and videos. (Privacy Policy)
Google Hosted Libraries	Javascript software libraries such as jQuery are loaded at endpoints on the googleapis.com or gstatic.com domains, for performance and efficiency reasons. (Privacy Policy)

Features
Google Custom Search	This is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google Maps	Some articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google Charts	This is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host API	This service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTube	Some articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Vimeo	Some articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Paypal	This is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook Login	You can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Maven	This supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)

Marketing
Google AdSense	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClick	Google provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index Exchange	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Sovrn	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook Ads	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad Marketplace	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexus	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Openx	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon Project	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLift	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say Media	We partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing Pixels	We may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking Pixels	We may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.

Statistics
Author Google Analytics	This is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
Comscore	ComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking Pixel	Some articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)
Clicksco	This is a data management platform studying reader behavior (Privacy Policy)

What if there was no land ownership?

Arts and Design

Autos

Books, Literature, and Writing

Business and Employment

Education and Science

Entertainment and Media

Family and Parenting

Fashion and Beauty

Food and Cooking

Games, Toys, and Hobbies

Gender and Relationships

Health

Holidays and Celebrations

Home and Garden

HubPages Tutorials and Community

Personal Finance

Pets and Animals

Politics and Social Issues

Religion and Philosophy

Sports and Recreation

Technology

Travel and Places

About Us

This website uses cookies

What if there was no land ownership?

Related Discussions

This website uses cookies