comparison ,Hilary Clinton and Abraham Lincoln ?

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   ahorsebackposted 11 months ago

   Please ........................What a stretch that one was ,  I laughed out loud and then almost  went into a fit of irreversible -reverse peristalsis  !
   
   Honest Hilary ?
   

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      Stevennix2001posted 11 months ago in reply to this

      Not a Trump supporter, as I plan to vote for Jill Stein myself, but I think old Abe Lincoln is probably rolling in his grave being compared to Crooked Hilary.

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   Live to Learnposted 11 months ago

   In fairness to Hillary, history made Lincoln the man we perceive him to be. I tend to believe many of his day did not view him kindly.
   
   With Hillary's penchant for lies and deception she might be able to pull the wool over the eyes of future generations. She's doing a bang up job of doing it now.

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      Stevennix2001posted 11 months ago in reply to this

        Well that's rather obvious.  I mean the man wanted to abolish slavery, which was going to hurt the South economically for awhile because they depended on free slave labor too much.  Therefore, I think that's kind of a given not everyone loved him back in those days. 
      
      Edit:  Not endorsing slavery or anything, as that should go without saying.  Just pointing that out is all.

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         Live to Learnposted 11 months ago in reply to this

         I wasn't really thinking about the southerners when I said that. More the abolitionists and the black leaders. I don't think Lincoln's ideas on sending freed blacks out of the country were popular among them or his belief that blacks should never be fully equal to whites.

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   ahorsebackposted 11 months ago

   Always important to waste a vote on a non-electable candidate ? 
   
   Lincoln- probably sacrificed the most of any president , for the people , in America .   
   
   Hilary , on the other hand , has taken the most sacrifices OF the people,  in America .

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      Stevennix2001posted 11 months ago in reply to this

      Un electable candidate?   that sounds like something the establishment wants to us believe to where they want us all to be stupid and brainwashed to think we don't have another choice.  Having said that though, I know Jill has virtually no shot to win the presidency this year.  However, she shares a lot of the same platforms that i supported about Bernie Sanders, and I refuse to vote for either Hilary or Trump because neither have earned my vote.  Both are disgusting human beings that don't deserve to be president.

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         ahorsebackposted 11 months ago in reply to this

         Yours is one of the attitude that begs  , " Why can't I have what I want ?",nothing personal but   Since the introduction of face-book , many Americans believe that the LIKE and FRIEND  factors are  most important and have transferred that to the elections .
         As someone that's voted since the seventies , I can tell you this , I have never voted but that part of me said to myself '"Just hold your nose and vote for the best selected candidate "  We have a system ..... it works as well as it can ,  use it within it's design parameters. 
         
         Independent candidates  ?     Like it or not ;They need to work through the system to become  viable ,  Jill , Bernie  , both beaten down by  the system .  Bernie   is from my state and  has O provability to political character he appeals to eighteen year olds and socialist  dreamers with  no  legislative accomplishment  whatsoever  ,I  don't know Jill but there you have it - nobody else  does !

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            Stevennix2001posted 11 months ago in reply to this

            Well you can believe what you want.  I honestly don't care.  I personally think we're screwed either way if Hilary or Trump get elected. If Trump wins, then I can see us heading into World War III, and another civil war.  Or if Hilary wins, then I predict that we'll probably suffer an economic collapse that'll send us back to the great depression, while also sending us into another World War III. 
            
            I have nothing to back up these predictions, but this just more of a hunch that fear will happen if either is elected, as I don't trust either of them.  Jill may not win, but she supports many of the policies that I liked about Bernie's campaign.  Also the reason why you never heard of her is because this goes back to the media only telling you what they want you to know.  Everyone knows that the establishment has money invested in both the GOP and Democratic parties to the point that it would be counter productive for them to support any other party because as long as they keep people ignorant about their choices, while keeping the other third party candidates from ever joining the live debates, then they can keep the perception of how the little guy only has two viable options.
            
            I don't know why you and others on here think I sound young, as I'm 36 years old, so I wouldn't call that young.  I'm not daft to think that I have to like someone to want to vote them, as that's just silly.   I personally think Michael Moore is an idiot, but I think he's  a brilliant filmmaker.  I don't like how Michael Jordan cheated on his wife by having an affair, but I still think he's the greatest basketball player of all time.  I personally wish I could punch D.W. Griffith in the face for his god awful racist film, "Birth of a Nation " (Not the new one in theaters, but the 1915 version), but at the same time, i can't argue against the historical significance of that film. 
            
            So trust me when  I say that I never allow myself to get caught up in the idea of "I have to consider the "Like" and "Friend" factor in all my choices.  I just want to vote for Jill Stein because she supports many of the platforms Bernie supported, and I refuse to vote for the other two that i firmly will ruin this country.  Whether you want to vote for Hilary or Trump is irrelevant to me because you'll get screwed one way or the other if you pick either of them.

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               ahorsebackposted 11 months ago in reply to this

               The assumption that I or anyone my age ......"believes whatever the media sends us "....Is ludicrous  , Iam in my sixties ,  am a media junkie , All media ,in fact  I even listen to democracy now but I'll tell you this  , this country needs to wake up to the fact that the "hope and change" of Obama , didn't happen ,  For Bernie , it didn't happen , for Hilary won't ever happen .
               
               The left in America .......and  you ,  are naive  to the course of  political possibilities , you are blind  naïve  to inside or outside system politics , you cannot see it when a real "changer " comes along because  you DO want to "like" him .    My advice to you and to all younger voters   don't  try to Like the boss !
               The boss is there for a different reason than your social media mentality tells you that he should be there for !

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         rhamsonposted 11 months ago in reply to this

         I happen to agree with you as this campaign has certainly exposed the crooked and disgusting side of the two party system we now have. In this country we are told to vote our conscience and have the freedom to do so. The cattle call for voting in many cases in this election against the one you don't like is the perversion that the two party system has developed over the years. In this case there is no throw away vote as whoever wins between the top two parties is a horrible choice and we are all losers. Is being the winner only what we are after in this rat race society? Or should it be for a higher purpose that serves the best for the country? These choices we have been given are so negative that we have bought into a deprivation of the other side scenario. I will not vote for either one of these terrible candidates but will vote a write in. My only hope is that the result of this election will show the utter failure of the power players of the two party system and direct an open understanding of how it is a disservice to the country. It may be a painful four years but the rotten fruit obtained from this election will show us all how the country and its' system is a sham.

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            PrettyPantherposted 11 months ago in reply to this

            How do you propose we fix the system? I have seen you post these same sentiments many times, so I am interested in your thoughts on how to fix it.

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               ahorsebackposted 11 months ago in reply to this

               The climb out , has to start at the bottom rung of the ladder . Congress , senate ,  These two political entities have to be changed soon and first !
               Term limits now
               Campaign finance reform now
               Block corporate donations and influence peddling now
               Tax revenue controls by voting bottom up policies , state and local levels
               It has to begin with term limits !

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                  PrettyPantherposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                  So, are you voting against the incumbents in your state?

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                     ahorsebackposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                     I am exactly ! And I have for five years , hoping for change .

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               rhamsonposted 11 months ago in reply to this

               I believe ahorseback has the right idea. But to do so we have to stop bickering with each other about semantics of who is a what and what is a who as that is the run around we are manipulated and stuck in now. Vote out the career politicians is a start but to stop the influence at the higher levels we must take their biased opinions out of the mix. If we can see past calling each other names maybe we should conduct an Article V Convention whereby we amend the Constitution to two terms for any elected official in the country. No more full retirements with full benefits for Congress and a limit of 6 years before they or any family member can work as a lobbyist after serving. Publicly financed campaigns based on a percentage based petition of support for federal and party based funding. No more agenda based judicial appointments to the Supreme Court but instead have an impartial based Court that gets back to interpreting the Constitutional law questions brought before it. The money in it has to go and the influence it buys for those fortunate enough to be wealthy has to be remedied.

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                  wildernessposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                  "Publicly financed campaigns based on a percentage based petition of support for federal and party based funding. "
                  
                  Won't that result in those that are rich enough to mount a massive petition campaign getting even more money to buy votes with?
                  
                  "have an impartial based Court that gets back to interpreting the Constitutional law questions brought before it"
                  
                  While I agree 100% and am completely sick of party based "decisions", I don't have a clue how to accomplish that.

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                     rhamsonposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                     "Won't that result in those that are rich enough to mount a massive petition campaign getting even more money to buy votes with?"
                     
                     There's always a way around anything isn't there? In that case it would need to have a stipulation that any outside (private or commercial) funding in the process would be prohibited. As the candidate accrues signatures the federal campaign funding would be released. It could begin at a local level proceeding through the state and finally the federal levels.

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                        PrettyPantherposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                        I wonder if the key to changing the system is to teach our children critical thinking skills at a very young age. It seems many people lack the ability to properly evaluate the barrage of information that is thrown at us.

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                           ahorsebackposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                           Unfortunately , our kids are being taught the opposite !

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                           rhamsonposted 11 months ago in reply to this

                           I think that would be a good start but the disinformation and selective reporting of the press and media would not make that enough. Is it not a responsibility of the parties to present acceptable candidates if they expect to promote their theories? How can we assure that the most qualified and dedicated public servants rise to the occasion if they are canceled out by big money interests? I have always said that if we are to turn around this country and get it back on a path to prosperity and guaranteed freedoms there are three things imperative for it to happen.
                           
                           1. Term limits
                           2. Publicly funded campaigns
                           3. Lobby reform
                           
                           By addressing any of these alone or partially will not change a thing and we do need to change.

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 11 months ago

   I heard Lincoln was King Herod in a previous incarnation. He had karma to clear up.
   Big time. And he did. Was his idea to send blacks back to their own country so terrible? This is a brave question to ask. The devil made me do it.
   

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      PrettyPantherposted 11 months ago in reply to this

      That is a brave question, and I think if he was going to make it compulsory, then it was a bad idea.  If he intended it to be an individual's choice whether to go or stay, then it was a great idea.
      
      I never knew that he had wanted to do that.

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 11 months ago

   Honest Hillary / Honest Abe!  Washington could not tell a lie either!!!! 
   
   Ramblings about Hillary: She sounded pretty good in the debate. She was very sophisticated and shows good will for the people. If I did not know her past I would vote for her. Why, oh why does she have to have a past? Why, oh why did her methodist priest indoctrinate her with socialistic ideals?
   
   Maybe she could rise to the occasion and become a worthwhile POTUS, I think to myself. But then I consider, she is getting up there in age. And she herself mentions being a grandmother. We will actually be voting in a grandmother soon to be in her seventies. She is showing health concerns, although she seemed pretty strong in this last debate. Thanks to eyeliner, mascara and face powder she seems younger / stronger.
   
   If she would go back to her moral roots and hold true to the precepts of the constitution and Listen to the Warnings of Germany to NOT let in ANY MORE Syrians, she would be fine,
   but will she?

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