Democrats 2020 Call , Go Left ...no ...Further Left ?

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   ahorsebackposted 7 years ago

   One guaranteed way for Democrats to stop their down hill slide on the political capital slope where they have sat since 2016  : Go Further towards the left ?
   Can you spell political suicide ?
   
   
   
   
   

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      Live to Learnposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      It would be a bad move. Sure, a socialist won an election. Can that be parlayed into a successful national movement? I don't think so. The majority tend to be liberal when young and gravitate toward a more conservative bent as age and life experience take their toll.
      
      The Republican party does not completely meet my ideological requirements and the Democratic doesn't either. I think this is true of the majority. The democrats would favor better by attempting to understand the populace than by attempting to create an umbrella for every ideology other than Republican to park under. Diverse special interest groups will consistently remain at odds on most things. You've got to find that home run to get them all to agree on a national election. The home run that shuts out concerns over fiscal responsibility is a tough sell in this environment.

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         ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

         
         
         Let's assume that the one major truth out of the New left is that they can't agree on much at all , still holds true,  When it looked like Sanders would  take the party it in 2016 the DNC acted accordingly . Cheating . Super delegates . Was that simply Hillary power ?

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            Live to Learnposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            I don't think that was solely Hillary power. It's a liberal ideology of ' you can't make good decisions for yourself so I should have the power to do it for you'. The base understood that which is why you didn't see prolonged outrage.

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               wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               'You won't make the proper decisions yourself, so I will make the decisions my God wants you to make for you'.
               
               Whether liberal or conservative, it's always about forcing others to act as we think they should.  Never an acceptance that others have different goals, different thoughts, different wants and desires...and that it's all right that they do.

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         Credence2posted 7 years agoin reply to this

         L to L
         
         "It would be a bad move. Sure, a socialist won an election. Can that be parlayed into a successful national movement? I don't think so. The majority tend to be liberal when young and gravitate toward a more conservative bent as age and life experience take their toll."
         
         That is a conservative promulgated myth. The only people that really become more conservative (politically) with age are white people.
         
         People in my immediate circle, with gray hair and bald pates are more radically opposed to Trump and conservatives in general than ever before You just have to go to your typical barber shop and listen.

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            Live to Learnposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Um, let's think about this Credence. 'Your typical barber shop'. I envision a small group of old men validating each other. Not an image typical of the majority or diverse dialogue. I suppose, that would be a fun afternoon, but far from putting my finger on the heartbeat of America.
            
            Either way, I do agree at some levels. The older we become, the less the rat race holds our interest. The more broad our perspective can become. The more we see what constitutes a better world.
            
            The problem comes with 'how can we achieve this?' Believing Marxist ideals which have failed miserably, repeatedly, when we give people power to enforce them cannot be the answer. We are old enough to have come behind the generation which came of age while millions upon millions were slaughtered proving it not possible.
            
            I'm a firm believer that communism has proven its ability to only fail. Socialism fails. But, capitalism is also, in its ways, failing. Capitalism is, in my opinion, the world's best hope but it needs to evolve in favor of the populace, not those at the top. It needs to reflect a consideration of those who make it possible as much as those who manipulate it.  Not be replaced.
            
            Capitalism cannot exist without those who choose to work within it, those who support it with consumption. We are more powerful than we know but we cannot use our power to affect positive change if we remain at odds.

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               Credence2posted 7 years agoin reply to this

               My typical barber shop is comprise of many oldsters, whose prime of life was during the civil Rights era and were a bit older than me. I would think that some of those fellows virtually lived there.They don't forget and fear the current climate of backsliding from the gains made from the struggle. Much of their lives are defined by the "struggle", and the youngsters forget as not appreciating its relevance the contributing factor for the relative decency of their lives today.
               
               It was very similar to my visits to British pubs during the 1970s. The older guys when they see a new comer, a 'yank', consistently brought up the heroism that they and their country displayed in the Blitz of London during World War II.
               
               I just don't think that all of our 'heartbeats' are in unison, they are more Balkanized than many would like to admit.
               
               The rat race holds less interest for me only because, as a well compensated retiree, I no longer have to negotiate it as the key to survival. According to Maslow, I can move beyond survival needs toward broader goals of achievement and satisfaction.
               
               
               
               I agree with you regarding excesses of Socialism, where conservative and progressives differ is what constitutes excess? I don't want the capitalist class to gut the EPA  as 'overreaching' because as a regulatory agency it can stop their companies for depositing untreated wastes into my water supply. These people know that without federal protection the little guy has no chance of bringing suit against them and afford the litigation costs. So, in that aspect, I am for more Government, not less. There are plenty of other aspects of American life where I have the same attitude.
               
               I am for fundamentally for capitalism in America as its economic system as long as it is kept on a tight leash and watching eye.
               
               It is just that the things conservatives speak about as collectivism and socialism is just good government in my opinion. Who would want to do away with Social Security or Medicare for example? In spite of all the complaints about ACA, I agree with the idea in principle. Does that make me a socialist?

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                  Live to Learnposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  You aren't a socialist any more than I am a hard core far right republican.  I do not believe we are Balkanized in any way, other than when we pander to the skewed reality shown on the media. I believe we do all want the same thing. We just have different ideas on which ways are the most expedient to achieve them. But, fighting is not the way. All fighting does is allow those in power to retain it.
                  
                  I believe, bottom line, each and every one of us wants everyone to have the chance to chase the American dream. Each wants to be left in peace to find their pursuit of happiness. No one wants to trample on the rights of others nor do they want their own rights to be trampled.
                  
                  But, remember this. For all the wrongs left to right within the world Western civilization has done more to advance the ideals of individual rights than any civilization before us. Western civilization has done more to help pull the world out of poverty than any before them. That is our civilization. We are part of it and we should be proud of its achievements.
                  
                  I'm proud to live in the America that has, with each generation, become a kinder and gentler place. I am not interested in divisiveness.

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