What is the Alternative? Someone Please Tell Me!!!

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   megs78posted 14 years ago

   There is much debate about the health care reform proposed by the President.  I would like to know, from those who oppose it, what would be a good alternative?  I really want to know...
   
   Thanks

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2. 63

   Mishaposted 14 years ago

   If you ask me - good ole times when patient paid the doctor, and there were enough doctors. If you ask people who lived like 50-60 years ago, may be even younger, they do remember those times. And yes, poor people got their healthcare, either free of charge, or paid by rich people.
   
   not gonna argue over this. You asked, i honestly answered.

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I second Misha.

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         badcompany99posted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, I love the sheep

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            ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Seeing as he grew up under socialized healthcare, I'm more apt to believe him rather than you.

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               badcompany99posted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Proving my point you are a sheep lol, can you not think for yerself you loser !

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                  tksenseiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Ah, being a D-bag as performance art again? Gosh, how 'edgy'...

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      smokenchicposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with yeah misha...but do yeah think the doctor would accept my cow as payment today as in yester years...lol

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         Jane@CMposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         This is still practiced in many small towns around our state.  You might not get a cow, but you might get a freezer full of beef

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            badcompany99posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Lol only in America, the land of the free !

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            megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Hutterites still practice it...I think bartering is cool!

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               ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               It's not that efficient.  If bartering is so great, why did the use of money spread from ancient Lydia in the first place?

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                  megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  are you serious?  did you not 'feel' the sarcasm in what I just wrote?

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                     ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Sorry my sarcasm detector must be broken.  Either that or I've been spending too much time arguing with naifs. 

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   3. 92

      Rochelle Frankposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I agree -- I wrote about how my parents did it 50- 60 years ago.
      http://hubpages.com/hub/Do-it-Yourself- … -Insurance
      
      I don't know if that strategy would work today.
      
      Medical costs have skyrocketed since then, partly because doctors have to charge more to make up for the uninsured people they treat and partly because of the huge investments in all of the diagnostic technology that is now available.

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         ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         And because we have fewer doctors and more people, per capita than we did back then.

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   4. 69

      lrohnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      When I was a kid (I was born 50 years ago), doctors actually made house calls. My Dad worked for the federal government, so paying for it wasn't an issue. But it was completely different back then. Everyone had insurance.
      
      Does that mean I agree with Obama's plan? Hell no. Maybe we should have had a healthcare Czar many years ago to make sure that insurance rates didn't skyrocket like they did and that malpractice suits for gazillions of dollars weren't awarded for frivolous stuff.

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         Rochelle Frankposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         No "everyone" didn't have insurance. My dad was self- employed, health insurance was just beginning to grow and it was quite expensive compared to earnings back then.

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            badcompany99posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, love the 40s !

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         ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         That's because there were fewer people and more doctors back then.  When you have a population of 100 million and 500,000 doctors, doctors do housecalls.  When you have a population of 300 million and 600,000 doctors you make doctor's visits.

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            badcompany99posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Omg its the new Einstein lol !

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      megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I don't want to argue either.  Thanks for answering.  But is this ever going to happen?

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         Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Definitely not as a direct intended result of Obama's plan

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      Aya Katzposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I'm not sure I like that rich person/poor person distinction. Most people are not rich, so in a free market doctors couldn't afford to charge what an ordinary person could not pay. If they did, people would seek out a different doctor.
      
      One of the problems we're dealing with  is government licensing of physicians. This creates a monopoly. The other, more obvious problem is government mandated insurance.

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         Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Well, poor/rich was mentioned because of current concern that poor people don't get a healthcare, so from that perspective they are not average people, they are really poor.

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         Debby Bruckposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Good Points Aya
         this is the first time I've visited forums

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3. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   Ah, but oncologists never made housecalls did they?
   Or open heart surgeons?
   The sophistication of medicine as practiced today is, quite frankly, expensive. Somebody's gotta pay for all the equipment in the OR. And nurses are paid quite well, too.
   
   That said, it would be lovely to have more GPs (the old fashioned term that has been replaced by PCP) who have one-on-one relationships with their patients. Of course students would need to be incented rather than disincented to become doctors. These days the money's in highly specialized work.
   
   One thing that seems to be missing in the debates (and this is a great topic, BCC) is discussion of alternative medicine and moving patient care to physicians assistants for more routine appointments. How do people feel about that?

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      That's why I'm working on becoming a PA.  It's a reaction of the market to the shortage of GP's.  If you leave things along a way will be found to meet the demand people have for healthcare.

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Your first examples are things I could consider candidates for real insurance, insurance should not be used to pay for doctor's visits.  Even so, new medical technology are in some cases better than traditional oncology treatments or bypass surgery, etc.  A free market would put pressure on lowering costs.  You can't keep someone as a patient, after all, if you let them die.

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4. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   Hi Megs78,
   Not sure if this 'advice' is going to be helpful or not. Generally speaking, the only way people can detect sarcasm in these forums is by the liberal use of smilies .
   However, overuse of smilies will get you attacked for using too many smilies.
   Been there. Felt that!

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Do we have the rolleyes emoticon?  That one is great for sarcastic comments.

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      megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      advice taken!  thanks, I really thought though, that the sarcasm was pretty obvious.

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5. 63

   Mishaposted 14 years ago

   Come on MM, who can dare attacking the supergal?

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6. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   LDT.
   Let's take a deep breath. Something MUST be wrong. One of us must be hallucinating, on drugs, or otherwise deranged (momentarily, anyway).
   We are, seemingly, in agreement on an issue in the politics forum.
   Can this really be happening?
   BTW, like your new avatar. MM

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      Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Oh, I second this

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      We may disagree, but we're both educated people.  We're sure to have some ideas in common.  I just don't put any trust in government or it's agents.  I've read too much history for that.
      
      Thanks, I had that taken in my old hometown last year.  I'd like to be able to move back someday.

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7. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   The rolleyes is not one of the options under "formatting tips" but I notice that some hubbers have access to really nifty animated emoticons. Not sure where they get them.
   
   Who would dare attack Supergirl?
   I will give you three guesses and the first two don't count.
   And no, he is NOT in this discussion at the moment.

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      Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Umm, the best guess would The Darkside of the Hubpages?

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8. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   That's interesting, LDT.
   You come from the land of white cars (at least from the background in that shot).
   
   But personally, I agree with Thomas Wolfe.
   You Can't Go Home Again.

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   1. 69

      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Oh I know, but St. Charles is a very lovely city.  Their Main Street has been restored and lined with very good restaurants and shops.  I took my fiance up there and she fell in love with the place.

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9. 77

   Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

   Meg -- The sarcasm would only be obvious to people who know what Hutterites are (invisible smilie goes here to punctuate sarcasm).

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      megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      

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      Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I don't, BTW

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      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I figured Hutterites were like Amish or Mennonites maybe Shakers, but have to admit I don't know for sure either.

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         megs78posted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Youre right.  They are like the Amish.  However, I believe they have less severe rules.  For example, the girls are not supposed to wear makeup, but are known to come into stores and offer meat or dairy as payment for makeup.  They are shy, but nice.

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         1. 69

            ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Most of those groups are very nice.  The best part is that they live their lives and let everyone else do the same.  If we all did that, I think we'd see less conflict in our society.

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10. 77

    Mighty Momposted 14 years ago

    I had a good friend from high school who went to college in Lancaster PA, neighborhood of the Amish. She said the culture clash when they came into town was interesting.
    
    There deff is something to be said for the simple life (and I do NOT mean the TV show with Nicole Ritchie and Paris Hilton!)

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