Muslim Ummah mourns "HEADSCARF MARTYR"

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   usmanali81posted 15 years ago

   This is the story of a martyred Sister Sherbeni, who embraced Shahadat while trying to uphold the ruling of Hijab in Islam. We are proud of our Sister who didnt sell her dignity, honor and respect for cheap. Rather, she did what Allah told her to do and gave her life for the same. Allah grant her peace and highest level of Jannah. Ameen
   
   The body of a Muslim woman, killed in a German courtroom by a man convicted of insulting her religion, has been taken back to her native Egypt for burial. Marwa Sherbini, 31, was stabbed 18 times by Axel W, who is now under arrest in Dresden for suspected murder.
   
   http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8136500.stm
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgQCzaQasGI

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      earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Suspected murder? Surely the charge is murder.

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      aka-djposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      "Insulting her religion". They went to court over THAT? Seems to me your religion has little backbone. Doesn't take much to offend it. Cartoons in newspapers is all can take. Beats me how it can be "THE" (one true) religion?
      Maybe I just don't know enough.

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   Shil1978posted 15 years ago

   Why don't they have headscarves for men in Islam? Why should the woman be required to wear it or the Hijab/Burqa? Surely, men should maintain their dignity as well!!!

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      janni321posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Most innocent questions the most difficult to answer

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         Shil1978posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         You didn't answer the question though, too tough to answer

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      usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      HIJAB FOR MEN:
      
      People usually only discuss ‘hijab’ in the context of women. However, in the Glorious Qur’an, Allah (swt) first mentions ‘hijab’ for men before ‘hijab’ for the women. The Qur’an mentions in Surah Noor:
      
      “Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do.” [Al-Qur’an 24:30]
      
      The moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze.
      
      HIJAB FOR WOMEN:
      
      The next verse of Surah Noor, says:
      
      “ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...” [Al-Qur’an 24:31]
      
      SIX CRITERIA FOR HIJAB:
      
      According to Qur’an and Sunnah there are basically six criteria for observing hijab:
      
      1. Extent:
      
      The first criterion is the extent of the body that should be covered. This is different for men and women. The extent of covering obligatory on the male is to cover the body at least from the navel to the knees. For women, the extent of covering obligatory is to cover the complete body except the face and the hands upto the wrist. If they wish to, they can cover even these parts of the body. Some scholars of Islam insist that the face and the hands are part of the obligatory extent of ‘hijab’.
      
      All the remaining five criteria are the same for men and women.
      
      2. The clothes worn should be loose and should not reveal the figure.
      3. The clothes worn should not be transparent such that one can see through them.
      4. The clothes worn should not be so glamorous as to attract the opposite sex.
      5. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the opposite sex.
      6. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the unbelievers i.e. they
      should not wear clothes that are specifically identities or symbols of the
      unbelievers’ religions.
      
      HIJAB INCLUDES CONDUCT AND BEHAVIOUR AMONG OTHER THINGS
      
      Complete ‘hijab’, besides the six criteria of clothing, also includes the moral conduct, behaviour, attitude and intention of the individual. A person only fulfilling the criteria of ‘hijab’ of the clothes is observing ‘hijab’ in a limited sense. ‘Hijab’ of the clothes should be accompanied by ‘hijab’ of the eyes, ‘hijab’ of the heart, ‘hijab’ of thought and ‘hijab’ of intention. It also includes the way a person
      walks, the way a person talks, the way he behaves, etc.

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         earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         All mis reads. Nowhere in the Quoran does it instruct women or men to wear the hijab.

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            usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Brother,
            
            Dont even try to compare ISLAM with your deceptive INDIVISUALISM, MADITATION, HALF SLEEP HALF AWAKE. Islam is the ultimate final way of life for the whole of mankind. There is no religion without a Prophet and following the traditions of Prophet is as compulsory as following God.
            
            Qur'an, Ch 3, THE FAMILY OF IMRAN, V 32: Say: "Obey Allah and His Messenger.: But if they turn back, Allah loveth not those who reject Faith.
            
            So, all the major and minor details related to almost every dos and donts are there in the traditions of Prophet Muhammad and his companions (peace be upon them all), to follow.

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      onthewritesideposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      It's all about keeping their "biotches" down!  Maybe someday they will join the ranks of the 21st century living...

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      Madame Xposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      So their men don't ever have to grow up and develop self control. The reason women can wear sexy clothing in the west is because our men openly appreciate our beauty. That's not a crime - it's the nature of a man, and a wonderful one at that!

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         earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Eloquently stated and right on Madame!

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         Shil1978posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Nice way to put it Madame X. I read somewhere that their men aren't supposed to wear shorts too. But, I've seen a lot of their teams play football and other sports wearing shorts. So, wonder what's up with that? Maybe someone can clarify on that?

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            usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Your answer is under the heading EXTENT
            
            Allah (swt) in the Glorious Qur’an first speaks about the Hijab for the man, and then for the women.
            
            HIJAB FOR MEN:
            
            People usually only discuss ‘hijab’ in the context of women. However, in the Glorious Qur’an, Allah (swt) first mentions ‘hijab’ for men before ‘hijab’ for the women. The Qur’an mentions in Surah Noor:
            
            “Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do.” [Al-Qur’an 24:30]
            
            The moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze.
            
            HIJAB FOR WOMEN:
            
            The next verse of Surah Noor, says:
            
            “ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...” [Al-Qur’an 24:31]
            
            SIX CRITERIA FOR HIJAB:
            
            According to Qur’an and Sunnah there are basically six criteria for observing hijab:
            
            1. Extent:
            
            The first criterion is the extent of the body that should be covered. This is different for men and women. The extent of covering obligatory on the male is to cover the body at least from the navel to the knees. For women, the extent of covering obligatory is to cover the complete body except the face and the hands upto the wrist. If they wish to, they can cover even these parts of the body. Some scholars of Islam insist that the face and the hands are part of the obligatory extent of ‘hijab’.
            
            All the remaining five criteria are the same for men and women.
            
            2. The clothes worn should be loose and should not reveal the figure.
            3. The clothes worn should not be transparent such that one can see through them.
            4. The clothes worn should not be so glamorous as to attract the opposite sex.
            5. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the opposite sex.
            6. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the unbelievers i.e. they should not wear clothes that are specifically identities or symbols of the unbelievers’ religions.
            
            HIJAB INCLUDES CONDUCT AND BEHAVIOUR AMONG OTHER THINGS
            
            Complete ‘hijab’, besides the six criteria of clothing, also includes the moral conduct, behaviour, attitude and intention of the individual. A person only fulfilling the criteria of ‘hijab’ of the clothes is observing ‘hijab’ in a limited sense. ‘Hijab’ of the clothes should be accompanied by ‘hijab’ of the eyes, ‘hijab’ of the heart, ‘hijab’ of thought and ‘hijab’ of intention. It also includes the way a person walks, the way a person talks, the way he behaves, etc.
            
            HIJAB PREVENTS MOLESTATION
            
            The reason why Hijab is prescribed for women is mentioned in the Qur’an in the following verses of Surah Al-Ahzab:
            
            “O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing
            women that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad); that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.” [Al-Qur’an 33:59]
            
            The Qur’an says that Hijab has been prescribed for the women so that they are recognized as modest women and this will also prevent them from being molested.

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         usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         That's the reason USA, Australia and Europe has the highest number of illegitimates as compared to any other country of the universe ... wow ... what a self control and what a beautiful way of appreciating beauty by giving birth to BASTARDS ... wow ... what a nature ... JUST WOW

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            earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Just wow to your ignorance of western culture and what it is like ... like just Wow!

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            Madame Xposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Our self control is self imposed. Your "self control" is non existent. Real jihad is man's struggle against his base instincts - not against other people. The fact that your men need their women to be property, and therefore covered from head to toe so other men can't see them, shows an immaturity in your male population that exists in no other culture.
            
            A friend of mine here in the US, her 12-year-old daughter has a Muslim friend, also 12, and as is common among girls that age, wanted to have a sleep-over. The Muslim parents said no. When asked why, they said that in their Muslim country girls never had sleep-overs because the men where the girl would be a guest assumed she was fair game, and she would be raped.
            
            So usmanali, all your quoting of scripture does not make you right, and it certainly doesn't make you knowledgeable. The world is disgusted with Islam. When you guys finally decide to join the 21st century, and act decently toward your fellow man (and women, starting with your own) and quit trying to shove scripture down all our throats, then maybe, just maybe, we will be more inclined to listen to what you have to say.

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               usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

               LOL
               
               what do you think i am requesting you to listen, forget it. If you think we treat our women as cautious as dimonds and you refered it as an immaturity then we are very happy with this immaturity.

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                  Shil1978posted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  No Caps please - shouting doesn't make you sound anymore intelligent or enlightened!! Why do you have to raise your voice to make a point? Btw, you aren't making any point here.
                  
                  Nobody told you to have "bastards" in your nation, so why are you fixated with that? You have your laws in your own countries, be happy and live happily with those. Why expect other countries to allow those laws in their countries?
                  
                  They are not obliged to do you and your community any favors. Its their country and they frame their laws - they have a right to it!!!

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                     usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

                     Yes, nobody told us to have bastards but the evil ideologies of the west related to Freemasonry, Humanism, Materialism, Capitalism, Zionism ... are affecting us through MEDIA. They have appointed Honorary Masons upon us who are working as their agents. They spoiled and still spoiling our lives with their Pagan doctrines and practices. WE WILL NOT BEAR THIS ANY MORE.
                     
                     Further, the false notions of equality which you gave to the ordinary people of the world are facing severe damages. People are loosing jobs, People lost their family lives, People make a mockery out of their innocent old parents, People rape and share each others wives, People are made to live their lives indivisually, their family structure is totally destroyed, they are made to follow the living together notion instead of marrying which is ultimatly increasing the number of BASTARDS especially in the USA, Europe and Australia. People are forced to rape juveniles repeatidly as the rapists are not getting death penalty and the top notch SADISTS of Freemasonry and all the ISM based doctrines enjoy watching this cruelty. Fathers and Priests are not allowing their nuns to marry which has forced them to make graveyards of BASTARDS under the foundations of churches.
                     
                     So, you see my dear, we can not bear with this, we can not watch you people throughing you and ourselves in HELL. At the least, we are bound to show you the right way, no matter you follow it or not.
                     
                     Qur'an, Ch 3, The Family of Imran, V 110: Ye are the best of peoples, developed for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors.

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                  Madame Xposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Hit a sore spot, didn't I.

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            ledefensetechposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Well you know we're not a backward nation that requires a bribe....excuse me, dowry....to pawn our girls off on men.  Our kids actually marry and have kids for the sake of love.  Not always, no there are always irresponsible people, but at least we don't make an innocent child suffer for the mistakes of their parents.  Backwards barbaric cultures do.  But then again we've had this conversation before.  We actually allow our kids choice, it's really a marvel.  You savages might want to try it.

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      ledefensetechposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Because it's about control.  Much like Calvinists, Muslims need to control their women and set strict rules about the house.  If it were for the woman's good it might be acceptable, but it's not of course.  Muslim men have their "honor" to protect, but the way they do it is so contrary to human nature that often times they slip into psychotic territory.  How else can you explain how someone can blame a woman for being raped while wearing a hijab?  They blame the woman, not the waste of space who did the raping.

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   JonTutorposted 15 years ago

   HIJAB FOR WOMEN:
   
   The next verse of Surah Noor, says:
   
   “ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...” [Al-Qur’an 24:31]
   
   
   
   Above rule must have been invented by Muhammad when he started lusting after his adopted son's wife Zainab (seeing her in scanty clothes)...... his son had to divorce his wife so that Muhammad could marry her.... talk about double standards... incest prohibited for others but not for himself... 4 wives for others but for himself 11-13 official wives not including....

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      usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Dear Paid Degrader of Islam (JonTutor),
      
      I do agree with you, the Qur’an mentions in
      
      Surah Nisa, Chapter 4, Verse No. 3: that you can maximum have 4 wives.
      
      But there is another Verse in Surah Ahzab, Ch. 33, Verse 52: which says that... ‘O Prophet you cannot marry more women, neither can you exchange any other women for the present one, even if their beauty attracts you, except what your right hand possesses. This Verse of the Qur’an, gives the permission to the Prophet, to keep all his wives, but at the same time, cannot marry any other women, except which your right hand possesses.
      
      If you analyse why Prophet Muhammed was not allowed to marry more wives - and besides that, he could not neither divorce them, because there is one more Verse in the Qur’an, which says that… ‘As for the wives of the Prophet, whether they are divorced or whether they become widows, no person can marry them, because they are Um-ul Mominin… they are the Mothers of the believers’. So since no one could marry the wives of the Prophet, but natural, the Prophet could not divorce them also.
      
      And if you analyse, that all the eleven marriages which the Prophet did were either for social reform or for political reason.
      
      The first marriage that he did, was with Bibi Khatija, (May Allah be pleased with her). She was at the age of 40,when he was only 25 - And she was a widow twice. Imagine, if he married for sex, why would he marry a woman who was fifteen years elder to him, and who was a widow twice. And if you analyse, till the time Bibi Khatija (May Allah be pleased with her) was alive, Prophet Muhammed did not take any other wives. When he was the age of 50, Bibi Khatija (May Allah be pleased with her) expired. Only between the age of 53 to 56, did Prophet take all the other wives.
      
      Imagine… if the Prophet was hyper sexual, he would have married at a young age. Science tells us… ‘The older the man gets, the less sexual he gets’. It is an insinuation, on the Prophet. Only 2 of his marriages were usual - that with Bibi Khatija, and that with Bibi Ayesha, (May Allah be pleased with them both). All the other marriages were due to circumstances… either of a social reform, or a political gain.
      
      If you analyse all, only 2 wives were below the age of 36 - All the other wives were between the age of 36 and 50 - You can give instances… each marriage had some reason. For example Bibi Johariya (8th wife), who was from the Banu-Mustalik tribe… which was very powerful tribe, and which was at logger heads with Islam - After a certain time, they were suppressed by the Islamic Army, and later on, the Prophet married her. And after he married her, the companions said…‘How can we keep as captives, the relatives of the Prophet’ - And they freed those people…and after that, both these tribes became friendly. There are examples, when he married Bibi Maimoona (May Allah be pleased with her)(11th wife), who was the sister of the wife of the chief of the tribe of Najad, which killed 70 Muslim, men of the Islamic deputation. After Mohammed (May peace be upon him)… when he married her, they accepted Medina as their leadership, and they accepted Prophet as their leader. All the… all the marriages which he did, had some political reason or social reform. He married Umme Habiba (9th wife), who was the daughter of the Chief of Makkah, Abu-Sufiyan - but natural this marriage played a great importance in the conquest of Mecca. Other example like Bibi Safiya (May Al¬lah be pleased with her)(10th wife), she was the daughter of a powerful Jewish leader - After this, the Jewish became very friendly to the Muslims. If you see, all the marriages had some social reforms - he married the daughter of Hazrat Ummer, Hafsa (May Allah be pleased with her)(4th wife), to get closer relationship between the companions. As a social reform, he married a lady who was divorced…the first cousin Zainab -  After she was divorced, he married her. All the marriages have some political reason or social reform - So all his marriages were based, to improve the community and to better relationships.
      
      Hope this removes the harsh sickness of your head.

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         lrohnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         I just gotta ask... If this guy was a criminal, what the heck was he doing in the courtroom with a knife? Do you guys really let criminals possess weapons in courts of law? And how was he able to stab her 18 times? Don't you have security?
         
         Just asking is all...

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            janni321posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Point to ponder

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   chukra Gposted 15 years ago

   did you realise a thing. the things that should stop attraction of the opposite sex in the desire for sex, now takes her life's away not because of sex desire at all. WHY???

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   JonTutorposted 15 years ago

   @Usman You really don't get it... I'm not paid by anyone... stop throwing accusations around.... would you like me accusing... you get paid by Islamic folks to degrade freemasons?
   
   When you're rude to nice folks like Paraglider.... how do you expect others to be nice to you?
   
   Why haven't you mentioned about Muhammad's marriage with his own daughter in law?
   
   Ever since I lost my favorite cousin in 911....I have been looking for answers.... He was the elder brother I never had.... taught me so many things.
   
   In my high school I met Z.... He was Afghan American whose parents came as refugees.... They were totally against Taliban.... they blame Pakistan for destroying Afghanistan.
   
   I know some good aspects like 5 pillars of Islam... but overall based on my studies and observations of Moslems around the world.... I started researching about the source... Muhammad... He gotta be more of an example for the followers.... they surely have a prophet who believes in spreading religion by sword.... followers believe in killing innocent folks in the name of Jihad.....I hate all fundamentalists... those who kill innocents or treat women like shit.... don't go trading accusations..... I'm done talking to you.

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      usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Oh my dear,
      
      Islam was not spread by sword.
      
      For more information please visit http://hubpages.com/hub/READ-NEXT

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   SweetiePieposted 15 years ago

   On this one I have to say, poor girl.  She had the right to wear a headscarf if that is part of her religion, and no one can judge her for that.  There are actually some very independent minded women who wear the hijab, and I went to school with a few.  Personally I am not a Muslim and I do not wear the hijab, but any woman that wants to wear it should be given the respect she deserves.  The man that killed her was clearly harassing her and a jerk, which is why she was suing him.

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      irfanshaikh25posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I really appreciate ur message that she had right to wear hijab becaz its a muslim culture, in the west women has right to be nude, to do anything in public what they want becaz it's a western culture,in west when any man looks at women by wrong eyes & looks at her body from leg to head, women feels so happy, i just want to ask u, plz tell me it's a good for women or not ? is it respect to women ? i don't know u r married or not but if ur boyfriend or ur husband will see to any other girls/women except u, and he may have relations with her, so will u accept it, i m 100% sure u will not accept that, becaz u don't want that ur husband/bf look at other women except u, becaz women beauty always attracts men to her, women need to cover body, don't expose body becaz we r human, we r not animanl, we have common sense, women never need to wear such clothe, which always expose her body, Allah has created men/women & there is a very huge difference between men and women. My message is not about to hate western women.

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         earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         So you condemn Western women, even when they agree with you. Peoples dress code is none of your business, and it is obvious you know nothing about the culture or the reasons we see it differently, and you just do not want to know.

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   MBP42posted 15 years ago

   I will add this. I was stationed in Saudi in the 90's and saw a car with what appeared to be a large black bag sittng in the front passenger seat. A man got out went to the store and was gone for a half hour. When he came out the bag started moving it was a woman in one of those large black body veils. He left her in the car with the windows up in over 110 heat. That is not compassion or love it is ownership. The qu'ran does not justify this kind of conduct. No bible does.

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      JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      That is a pathetic treatment of women.... Thank God I wasn't born a woman in Saudi.

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   earnestshubposted 15 years ago

   Having educated men who know women as equals would help eliminate the problem. Western men allow the same freedoms to both sexes.

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      usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      If you treat them equal then why in WWE they wrestle separatly. why is a male wrestler not allowed to wrestle with a female wrestler ???
      
      This equality which you people gave is totally RUBBISH and LIE.

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         earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         As usual you pick an outrageous example which is un-related. As I have said before, your ignorance of culture is breathtaking!

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            usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            you are unable to answer my question

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               earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               It is not a matter of equality it is a matter of social etiquette.

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                  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  then
                  
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette not rape women,
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette to kill the rapist,
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette to treat women in the descent relationships of mother, sister, daughter and wife.
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette not to treat women as society butterflies and sex symbols in your beaches, bazars, residents and offices,
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette not to bring your women almost clothless for promoting your products in ads.
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette not to produce ILLEGITIMATES from your respectable mothers, sisters and daughters.
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette that your governments support prostitutes for their living so that they refrain from selling out their modesty.
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette to keep your old mothers with yourselves in your homes.
                  it's also the matter of social etiquette to give your mistresses the status of your wives and share your wealth and possessions with them.

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                     Shil1978posted 15 years agoin reply to this

                     You say --- "it's also the matter of social etiquette not rape women"
                     
                     Are you saying no rapes occur in muslim countries? As I've stated countless times, offical reports of rapes are based on victims reporting it. In muslim countries, victims don't gain anything from reporting rape. On the contrary, they are likely to be labeled as adulterers and punished by lashes/stoning to death/social ostracization, etc. So, why would they report rape, and if they don't report rape, does that mean - no rapes occur?
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette to kill the rapist"
                     
                     Your system of justice leaves a lot to be desired. Your system of justice (Islamic one) doesn't give the victim a fair trial in most cases. So - what makes you think the death sentences you impose on rapists are being given to the right person(s)? So - giving or not giving the death penalty isn't relevant. Fact is rapes continue to occur in muslim countries and most of it is undercover for reasons mentioned above. Women just don't report it!!
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette to treat women in the descent relationships of mother, sister, daughter and wife."
                     
                     What makes you think western countries don't treat their women well. Is your image of the west colored by what you see on TV? I think so, in which case I guess its understandable. But, is that the real picture - hardly so!!! On the contrary, do conduct some surveys in the muslim world - ask women if they feel empowered/strong/independent? It might be a revelation to you!!!
                     
                     You say ----  "it's also the matter of social etiquette not to treat women as society butterflies and sex symbols in your beaches, bazars, residents and offices"
                     
                     You mean to say most muslim men don't watch porn/don't have perverse fantasies, etc? Well, I read a while back that most of the online search queries from these muslim countries search for sex and sex-related material. So, why is this? Are these guys just depraved sick people, who behave decent on the outside but are in reality frustrated sexually? Most women are treated with lot of respect and decency in the west. However, that cannot be said of much of the muslim world, where they are often treated as objects/as property, etc. They most often aren't allowed to express their thoughts/feelings. They are to fall in line with their father's/brother's wishes. Have you heard of honor killing, where fathers and brothers kill their daughters/sisters for loving another man? I don't think that to be decent!!!
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette not to bring your women almost clothless for promoting your products in ads."
                     
                     What's wrong in that? Is any of it enforced? If not, why is it wrong? Its their choice and its the way they choose - so why does it affect you so much? Is it because young people in muslim countries too like western culture/fashion, etc. Does that make you insecure as a fundamentalist? Would you too like the Taliban like to see enforcement of rules and regulations to maintain a false facade of religiosity?
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette not to produce ILLEGITIMATES from your respectable mothers, sisters and daughters."
                     
                     Who knows how many illegitimates exist in muslim countries? Everything being hush-hush over there, no one can say for sure. So, I'd propose you conduct some DNA tests back home. you might be enlightened with the results you find.
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette that your governments support prostitutes for their living so that they refrain from selling out their modesty."
                     
                     Prostitutes exist in muslim countries too - I am suprised you haven't heard of them yet. Please do some research on the web and you'd be well informed. Please have your governments protect the modesty of these poor hapless women who, unlike their counterparts in the west, have been forced into the sex trade by middlemen and other sick muslims (who are always supposed to be pure and religious).
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette to keep your old mothers with yourselves in your homes."
                     
                     You have to note that in the west, they don't live in large families, which always have some member or the other to take care of the aged. So, would you leave your aged mom home alone or send her to a nursing home where you expect them to be provided good care?
                     
                     You say ---  "it's also the matter of social etiquette to give your mistresses the status of your wives and share your wealth and possessions with them."
                     
                     How many muslims do that? How much muslims openly acknowlege the status of their mistresses?

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                        Madame Xposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                        Shil1978 - very well said.

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         Shil1978posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Your example is laughable really. Equality doesn't have anything to do with it. Why don't you survey the workforce in these countries and compare it to your own back home?
         
         Equality in education, politics, work environment, etc - can you deny that the west denies women equality in all these spheres?
         
         In contrast, you have women in the Middle East fighting for the right to vote/right to drive, etc. Please look within before jumping to judge others!!!

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            usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Yes, equality does have to do with it, think about it again.
            
            I know about my home very well. We prefer to give equality to our men and women but under the well defined domains. e.g. men and women are allowed to take part in education, politics and work BUT in SEGREGATION and HIJAB. We prefer to have separate schools, colleges and universities for them or atleast segregation in classrooms. We prefer to have our men and women in workforce but under segregation and hijab, take for example the work environment of "ISLAMIC BANK OF BRITAIN" or work environment in IRAN.
            
            Now come to driving, tell me is this an issue to discuss. if women dont drive, it does not harm society as a whole and i think there is not a single mishap happened till now related to the families or society of middle east by not allowing women to drive there.

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   earnestshubposted 15 years ago

   Your way or the highway eh usmanali? Believe as I do or perish eh? You know, because your smarter right? Tell me it would not be the Muslims that own the truth would it?

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      usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Fortunatly, Some Muslims are and are constantly presenting you the truth. You like it TAKE IT, you dont like it DONT TAKE IT, SIMPLE

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         earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Now why would I assume your truth, I am not a Muslim. your right, I don't like it and wont take it.

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            usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Non Muslims can also recognize truth.

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    earnestshubposted 15 years ago

    You only have to see the TV footage of women being beaten in the street. Makes me angry.

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       JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

       I have seen Taliban videos.... those fundamentalists bring a bad name to mainstream moslems.

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       usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

       TV is under full control of Zionists and Freemasons.

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          earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

          The videos I have seen are not controlled by anything but the drive to be first with a story.
          I also have friends in some of these places who have seen this abuse, one of these people I would trust with my life and have known her for thirty years.She has footage from her mobile as many others have. These abuses of women are well documented and denying the videos are real will not convince anyone. you think the truth can hide in a world full of phone cameras? There are thousands of videos! You have crazy beliefs, then you enforce them on your women and the world is watching.

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             JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

             @Earnest He is gonna believe only.... Taliban/Al Qaeda folks... similar products of Pakistani Madrasa.... We are talking to a wall here.

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                earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                Yep! I already admitted I do that sometimes. I have seen the same sort of narrow thinking in other religions too, but this guy is running on ideas that stopped being useful hundreds of years ago if ever and I have been hoping for some Muslims to find this and say something about these antiquated beliefs... not lookin good!

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                   JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                   I concur.... but these days Jihad attacks done only by these folks... from NY,London, Mumbai... all attacks.... done by fundamentalists trained in those Madrasa schools.... So far Australia is safe...  you folks must have good screening procedures for filtering terrorists.

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             usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

             Taliban is the political game plan of Zionist Jews, Zionist Christians, Zionist Hindus and Zionist Muslims to gain full control of the most important parts of the world, to sweep away the hurdles for the awaited Antichrist by Freemasons, New Conservatives and Zionists.
             
             Talibans are mercenaries just like the Tamil Tigers taking money, food and weapons from their Zionist God Fathers just for promoting chaos, killing of innocents and dome the the whole territories with evil clouds, this same thing was also prophecized by Prophet Muhammd (peace be upon him) as a sign of the arrival of Antichrist-Dajjal. Talibans have got no businesses, no bank balances, no jobs, they are getting their stuff from Zionists and their agents. Even when some Talibans were caught dead by Pakistan Army or Tribal Elders, they were found un circumcised bearing enough evidence for these people to be mercenaries bought from different locations of the world like Russia, India, Arab, Pakistan etc., AMAZING HA, for conformation have a look at some of those videos on YouTube (if they are not banned). Circumcision is compulsory in ISLAM.

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                JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                Taliban are homegrown terrorists from Pakistani Madrasa... you have MASSIVE delusions..... get checked up soon... "Circumcision"... LOL.... Afghanistan when under Taliban control was only recognized by Pakistan/Saudi Arabia.... Pakistani Madrasas and Pakistani Army/ISI  were primarily responsible for funding, training and creating Taliban.... you gotta listen to some mainstream news instead of the material  fundamentalists use to brainwash folks like you.

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                   usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

                   what about Osama being American??? what about his close ties with Bush ???

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                      JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                      Do you believe in conspiracies?.... next you will state 911 is an inside job.... you folks are getting really desperate... Pakistani Madrasas training (partly funded by Saudi) along with Pakistani Army/ISI responsible for Taliban creation ... Do you wanna see links?

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    earnestshubposted 15 years ago

    As usual you ignore the evidence and avoid confronting all the other footage taken by residents of beatings in the street done by extremists who have beliefs similar to yours.

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       usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

       As usual you also ignore the evidence and avoid confronting the footage where some Talibans were caught dead by Pakistan Army or Tribal Elders, they were found un circumcised bearing enough evidence for these people to be mercenaries bought from different locations of the world like Russia, India, Arab, Pakistan etc.,

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          JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

          Thank God for a change.... you don't speak on behalf of Allah..... who seems to have drilled all the "answers" you need directly through special pipes... and just for your information.... Pakistani ISI/Army is considered Rogue... not a very reliable source.... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne … lysis.html

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             usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this

             What the heck those 10 French soldiers were doing in Afghanistan ??? They dont belong to Afghanistan. They must get out of Afghanistan and can come back as tourists, then nobody will kill them

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                JonTutorposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                To begin with..... what the heck were Pakistani Madrasa products Taliban doing in Afghanistan... last straw was 911.... and we folks only went to remove those idiots who consider women as animals with no education/health access... who destroyed Afghanistan's glorious history... even destroying Bamiyan Budha statues... those primitive ideologies completely destroyed Afghanistan...... I've first hand account from a Afghan refugee family... who simply hate Pakistan for there role in destroying Afghanistan...and if you support those folks then you must also be a Madrasa product.... answer yes or no...... and from reading about Pakistan... 4 regions.... Most educated to least in this order... Panjab, Sind, Baluch, NW.... and you must be from the most backward part of Pakistan, NW... Peshawar area folks openly sympathize with Taliban/Al Qaeda.... Who knows Pakistan ISI/Army must be giving safe asylum to those top leaders so that they can squeeze more money from us... We folks in America do watch news and read stuff.....your BS not gonna rub on us.

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    JonTutorposted 15 years ago

    @Usmanali You totally ignored this.... truth hurts

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