Another Ad Problem

1. 85

   Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

   Noticed another massive drop in CTR in comparison to the last few weeks, and when I checked the hubber shares of ads, I noticed another problem with the same type of link box. IMG below.
   
   Perhaps it's coincidence, but I'd like to request they go back where they were before. And if not, at least please fix these.
   
   

   replyreport
2. STAFF

   pauldeedsposted 16 years ago

   We haven't changed anything related to ads since the big update in mid-february.  A vast majority of authors that we've heard from have reported significantly higher earnings as a result of those changes.
   
   There is one scenario where we know the ads can render a little funny.  It happens when the content that is in floated to the right (in one or more capsules) is taller than the content in the capsule that they are floated in.  It's hard to tell from the screenshot if that is what is happening, but I suspect it is.  We're hoping to fix, or at least reduce the frequency of that sometime this month.

   replyreport
3. 85

   Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

   You're aware that I've reported a significant increase since the new ad layouts began. And there have been significant drops, as well.
   
   Perhaps you're referring to the ads youre running in HP shares -- those *haven't* seemed to vary very much at all in the last few weeks. I'm referring to the ones that are only being tested in Hubbers shares.
   
   I actually have kept a very close eye on the ads, and they are not the same day in and day out. The colors vary, some days some colors aren't used at all, some days certain types of ads aren't used at all, sometimes positions are hugely varied.
   
   It's interesting that I don't see that mistake anymore, and I've checked several times, and the CTR has improved since I posted this, despite being very down from the start of the days earnings.
   
   Perhaps you might explain how the variations occur, if you're not making changes? Is it set to change after a specific number of views? Because there was a lot of green a few days ago. Now I see a lot of pink, and havent seen much green. How's that work then, if you haven't changed anything?
   
   And while you're here, maybe you could tell us when the testing is expected to end?

   replyreport
4. STAFF

   pauldeedsposted 16 years ago

   With the amount of traffic you have to your hubs, seeing large day to day variations in CTR and CPM is completely normal.  Even in our considerably larger group of impressions, we frequently see swings of 10-15% from day to day.
   
   As I'm sure you are aware the ad layouts are controlled by YieldBuild which is a technology that constantly searches for the best performing ad layouts.  To answer your question specifically, this means that the testing will never end.
   
   To address your insinuation that we are somehow more careful with our own share of impressions or that we make more effort to make money in our share: there is absolutely no difference between the YieldBuild configuration  for the author's and the HubPages' share of impressions.  They are identical.

   replyreport
   1. 85

      Isabella Snowposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Alright, I'll take your word for that.
      
      
      
      This is confusing, as, to me, you seem to be saying that HP hasn't been doing any testing at all, and that yieldbuild is simply trying new ad layouts?? That's not what you're saying, is it??
      
      
      
      And this is most confusing of all, because I definitely see a specific pattern repeating over and over again in HP shares, and several repeating over and over in my shares, and they are not at all the same. I'm not insinuating -- I'm saying that's what I'm seeing, for whatever reason.
      
      I would love to see some of the layouts I see in HP shares in my own shares -- but I haven't seen them in at least a few weeks, if I ever saw them at all. And I check on a regular basis, every time I get new comments or when I'm editing something.
      
      If you'd like screenshots of what I'm talking about, I'm happy to post them for you. If this is something that's somehow only happening to me -- and I certainly havent checked other people's hubs -- it would be nice to fix it.

      replyreport
      1. STAFF

         pauldeedsposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         That is exactly what I'm saying.  By it's very nature YieldBuild constantly tests and measures different layouts.  The worst ones are discarded, and the best ones are kept around.  Typically the return starts out a little worse than a generic static layout, then grows gradually over the course of a couple weeks, and finally stabilizes around a mean (the deviation around which will depend on the amount of impressions you are doing a day).  However, just because the CPM is fairly stable, doesn't mean that the ads will all look the same.
         
         This is precisely what we've seen happen over the last 3 weeks or so.  I'm fairly confident (based on the few authors whose data I have seen) that if we could aggregate the results of all the authors for their shares, we'd see the same pattern.
         
         You can learn more about it on the YieldBuild site or the YieldBuild blog, and if you have a site that is doing several million page views a month you can even sign up and use it yourself.

         replyreport
         1. 85

            Isabella Snowposted 16 years agoin reply to this

            I took your advice and I went to see what Yieldbuild was all about... and I must say I was a bit surprised to find that you *are* Yieldbuild. I'd been under the impression (from the way it's always referred to in the third person) that it wasn't something HP owned and operated. My mistake.
            
            Since you're the YB programmer (assuming I've read that correctly...), does this mean you'll be able to tell me how to get those nifty ads (previous post) showing in my shares?

            replyreport
5. 85

   Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

   Are you saying you have no margin of control over these ads -- how were Yahoo and eBay ads run only in HP shares?
   
   Regardless -- there are certain types of ads that are only showing in hubbers shares. (I checked other hubs yesterday) I can tell whose adsense code is going to show up in the page source just by looking at the ads, so please don't tell me HP and Hubbers ads are identical. You may expect them to be, but they just aren't. If you're saying you have no control over it, and if you're saying the ads SHOULD be the same, perhaps there is an error somewhere and you can fix it -- or ask Yieldbuild to fix it.
   
   I'll give you two examples anyway.
   
   The top photo is an ad style I've only seen in my shares and not those of HP. I may have seen one similar ONCE (not gray, but standard white) in HP shares, but haven't seen this since. Not in my hubs, anyway.
   
   The bottom photo is an ad style I've yet to see in my own shares, and would like to. I have seen this style with 1 ad, but the 2 like you see here, and even 3, I have never seen in my own.
   
   If we should all be running the same ads, why are these always this way, and how does one fix that?
   
   
   
   

   replyreport
   1. 0

      terrygposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      I have to agree with Isabella. This has been a issue for me as well but after my last post in the forum I let it drop.
      
      It is very simple. The source code does show the adsense code. I am seeing the same thing on my hubs. Especially one that generates a lot of search engine traffic.
      
      Heres the typical source code from a visit to my HUB from a search engine listing:-
      
      yieldbuild_client = 1;
      yieldbuild_loc = "halffold";
      yieldbuild_layout = "hub_12345";
      yieldbuild_options = {
      google_adclient: "pub-6958755572607374",
      google_channels: "7068007925+5917491105+7412356896",
      cj_pid: "2103840",
      ypn: "1586517541"
      
      I presume the adsense code is HP's.
      cj_pid sounds like commission junction and ypn is Yahoo.
      
      On my hubs I can only sign up with Google, Amazon and Ebay only. So basically from this we are not getting the same ads.
      
      As Paul said, "To address your insinuation that we are somehow more careful with our own share of impressions or that we make more effort to make money in our share: there is absolutely no difference between the YieldBuild configuration  for the author's and the HubPages' share of impressions.  They are identical."
      
      Clearly we are not getting identical ads served.
      
      

      replyreport
      1. 85

         Isabella Snowposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         I believe you are getting the 60/40 share you are supposed to get. That's not actually something I was trying to address here, if that was the impression I gave. When one of your hubs is landed on, the adsense code is already embedded before it loads up. That's my understanding anyway. So any clicks are going to the respective code automatically.
         
         I am not saying some ad types are better than others for sure, I am only saying I'd like to see those specific types I've indicated in mine, as they might do better than what I am seeing now. That said, I do believe there is a correlation between steep drops in CTR and certain ads I've already mentioned.
         
         The issue here is that my understanding of what Paul has said thus far is that HP and Hubbers ad layouts and types are identical, and from what I can see they are different in terms of what you see in those images I've posted previously, and where they sometimes are placed. Though, for the most part, the ads seem to be in the same locations across the board.
         
         I am certainly getting my 60 percent, and it's easy enough to calculate when comparing number of adsense page views to total number of pageviews in analytics -- which is the same as the total shown in your HP list.

         replyreport
6. 78

   LdsNana-AskMormonposted 16 years ago

   Isabella -
   
   Thank you for the work you are doing to make some clarifications here.  I have learned a lot by reading this thread and I appreciate your asking these questions.
   
   tDMg
   LdsNana-AskMormon
   
   By the way... where is everyone when YOU ask a question:-)  LOL

   replyreport
7. 85

   Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

   Oh, believe me, if I was definitely wrong about these ads (and actually I would love to be wrong about them, so if someone has seen them in my hubs under my adsense code do speak up -- I'd be grateful), there are 2 hubbers in particular who would have posted their usual drivel by now. I've actually received 8 emails since posting this issue, from hubbers who have said they've checked their own hubs and see the same thing I am seeing. I told them to post that here, but they replied by saying they were afraid to offend HP.
   
   If the differing types of ads were intentional, it wouldn't really be so strange, as it would be the fastest way to test the different types of ads. But Paul seems to be saying they are not doing this, and that theirs and ours are identical -- which I just don't think is an accurate statement.
   
   Perhaps they are too busy to have noticed. I'd hoped the images I posted would clarify what I meant in case there was any confusion as to what I, not being technically inclined, was referring to.
   
   But he seems to have gone quiet and I'm not sure what that means.
   
   In any case, I started seeing a new type of ad layout 2 or so days ago, and since that time my CTR has dropped massively. Yesterdays CTR for me was 1/2 what it was BEFORE the testing started. My earnings were also about where they were before the changes, which is considerably lower than where they were for the last 2 weeks. Which, to me, says whatever started 2 days ago should go back to wherever it was.
   
   Of course, I realize Paul has said that HP is not testing anything, and YB is -- but since HP and YB are the same company, I guess I'm hoping that whoever does that bit could go back to whatever they had before.
   
   If they say they haven't made any changes at all, I guess I'm hallucinating. But I will still mention it, as I have noticed a magical correspondence between my complaining and an increase in CTR, for some reason. Maybe God takes pity on me, I dunno. So I guess I'll just have to cross my fingers for that, since it seems like no one is going to address the issue of the 2 ads I posted pics of.

   replyreport
8. 59

   Mark Knowlesposted 16 years ago

   What about as an average over a longer period?
   
   Say the last month? - My CTR and income has gone up noticeably since they started playing around with the ad setup. Although, I do have the odd bad day and see some what I think are poor ad placements.
   
   But average, it's definitely up. Personally, I am quite happy to let them experiment to their heart's content until they get the optimum setup.
   
   Also, I would think that YB is under instructions not to show a returning visitor the same ad they saw last time so when you visit yourself, you will probably be seeing a huge range of further down the list ads. Try visiting from a different IP address and see. I don't know the technical stuff too well, but I would guess this is the case.
   
   And Nana- no one else is jumping all over Isabella (and I mean that in the nicest way) -  because she is well respected here, will rip you a new one if you try and this is not a silly question.

   replyreport
9. 85

   Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

   In general, as I have personally told Paul and Jason, my CTR has skyrocketed and my earnings have tripled. And it was consistent, apart from the few times I have seen certain colors and certain layouts. For example, my CTR dropped when ads stopped showing up beneath my top right image capsules, and when certain colors that make links/text illegible were used.
   
   Personally, I am more interested in maintaining a day to day CTR/earnings goal, than a monthly add-it-all-up result, because the ads I see vary. For nearly 2 straight weeks my pageviews and number of clicks were the same, and so were the bulk of the ad styles I saw.
   
   In case anyone has misread this -- I am not accusing HP of some kind of scam. I'm more or less pointing out the types of ads Im seeing when my CTR happens to plummet, because we have a shared goal.
   
   As an aside, I think I was wrong about those link boxes -- I think perhaps they perform well, given that I saw them consistently throughout the last 2 weeks, but I have no way to know if those were what was being clicked on.

   replyreport
10. 85

    Isabella Snowposted 16 years ago

    Well, here's an interesting update, indeed: I am now seeing those ads I mentioned in my shares. And those of other hubbers.
    
    (Terry I used yours as a reference, and from what I can tell your account looks perfectly normal, if that's of any help to you.)
    
    I am not sure if they've flipped entirely, or if they've just been added into the views, but the link boxes (that's what I call them, anyway) are now showing in HP shares, as well.
    
    I dunno if that was a coincidental change or not, but I'm excited to see how these ads perform.

    replyreport