Are You Ready to Hate Hillary?

1. 91

   Dr Billy Kiddposted 9 years ago

   Now that the 2014 elections are over (hooray!), it's time to look ahead at the 2016 campaign. Senator Rand Paul started it off 5 months ago by declaring that the Clintons are immoral. Now the billionaire stealth money will turn against Hillary. Will it start at Thanksgiving, Christmas, or January when Hillary declares she's running? Will the line be: "Hillary's an Obama Democrat?"
   Your thoughts.

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   1. 78

      Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I will support Hillary if she is the nominee for the party for president in 2016. But, I would prefer Elizabeth Warren as the genuine real article who does not sleep with  the enemy and has fire in her belly in bringing the right-winger to heel. She has a laser like focus on issues of interest within the progressive community and would not coop to make peace with Thurston Howell III.

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      1. 89

         GA Andersonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         Do you think Elizabeth Warren has a chance of taking the nomination away from Hillary and her political machine? I am doubtful.
         
         But....... Hillary has a lot of old baggage that will be spotlighted - once again - when she starts her run.
         
         I would not vote for Hillary because  her history strongly suggests I could not trust her. I know very little about Warren. Although I do recall something about her legitimate, (as in not knee-jerk anything for business), pro-business positions when she beat-pot Scott Brown for the Senate.
         
         GA

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      2. 78

         Credence2posted 9 years agoin reply to this

         hi, GA,
         Yes, Hillary can be derailed. As mentioned in a subsequent post, Hillary misjudged the electorate in 2008, was outflanked by a dark horse no believed could stop the 'heir apparent'. His name was Barack Obama, who won fair and square by running a smarter campaign.
         
         Warren touches on populism, and it is my opinion that if she decides to throw her hat into the ring it would give Hillary C. a run for her money.
         
         Here is the link to a rather long article, but you can grab the appropriate morsels from it as to why so many of us lefties are fond of her.
         
         http://www.newrepublic.com/article/1155 … -nightmare
         
         Wouldn't compare her with Huey Long in her populist appeal, she seems so patrician, like Woodrow Wilson. I just see Hillary as part of the economic inequities that more of us would like to more seriously address, in other words she has far too great a stake in the status quo to really want to take the gloves off against the perpetrators.
         
         I sensed the same situation back in 1984 when Fritz Mondale was the heir apparent. Many of us desired that the Dems move away from its image, much of it negative, of excessive government  largesse. It continued to play into Reagan's hand. Even though I doubted that anyone could have beaten Ronald Reagan in 1984, I was anxious to see the rise of a native son, Gary Hart, get the nomination. He wasn't carrying the same baggage that many accuse Hillary of carrying now, and what Mondale was overrun with then. We did not get it right until Bill Clinton in 1992, with his center left politics. Many of us were on board with it.
         
         Many of us blue/purple are not interested in business as usual, but a shake up in the many issues that concern us most.
         
         Hillary is not one to repeat a mistake, when Warren's star rises she needs to be on guard.

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   2. 64

      PhoenixVposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I sure hope she does not leave us all to die in Benghazi and blame it on Youtube, and then quit or fall down or get the flu or get a concussion or get brain damage etc. Maybe she can run for junior senator for/from Lithuania or something.

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      1. 77

         Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         

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   3. 70

      rhamsonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I am sure the GOP will work to try and tie everything Obama to her tail in the up and coming Presidential election. The negative edge does seem to work especially with recent events. What is funny is that McConnell and Boehner are immediately going back to the repeal of the ACA which they know Obama will veto. Some change huh.

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   4. 82

      Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      And the soap-opera continues. Will this character survive? What will that character do now this has happened? Will he tell her about that thing? Will they come clean about this thing? Ooh the drama, the suspense. How easily people are distracted by shadows flickering on the wall. It's plato's cave, and it would be funny if it wasn't all so terribly sad.

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      1. 91

         Jean Bakulaposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         I don't think any of them have our country and it's problems at heart.
         
         Hillary is a strong candidate, but as mentioned here, Obama snuck up on her once before. She's not getting any younger, and if she doesn't win this time, she probably won't run again.
         
         Then there's the issue of how sick are the people of Clintons? Does Bill view this as a 3rd term? I'm sure she can fend him off, and she is more conservative than him. I also felt he had the US best interests at heart, and even when he messed up in his personal life, he kept on working. The other side will try to pin all his baggage on her, plus she has much of her own, though a lot of it is exaggerated.
         
         I also like Elizabeth Warren, but need to research her better. Anything can happen in two years in politics, again, look how fast Obama became a rising star. Lots of drama!
         
         I admit I'd like to see a woman President in my lifetime.

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         1. 61

            Florida Economistposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            For some perspective:
            
            If Hillary were to run and win, then since 1988, there would only have been 8 years (the last 8 years) without either a Bush or Clinton in the White House.

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         2. 82

            Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            This is an example of what I'm talking about. Do you remember the show Dallas? This is how I read your comment:
            
            Sue Ellen is a strong candidate, but as mentioned here, JR snuck up on her once before. She's not getting any younger, and if she doesn't win this time, she probably won't run the company again.
            
            Then there's the issue of how sick are the people of the Ewings? Does JR view this as a 3rd term? I'm sure she can fend him off, and she is more conservative than him. I also felt he had the family's best interests at heart, and even when he messed up in his personal life, he kept on working. Cliff will try to pin all his baggage on her, plus she has much of her own, though a lot of it is exaggerated.
            
            See how easily this transitions into soap-opera. No offense intended, it's just that none of this stuff actually matters. None of it.

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            1. 61

               Florida Economistposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Maybe Hillary will wake up and find Bill in the shower and it will turn out that all of this has just been a dream.

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               1. 82

                  Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  What?! Good grief. The image of Bill in the shower. Brain bleach someone please . . .

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            2. 89

               GA Andersonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               For such a critic of soap operas you sure seem to know a lot about that one.
               
               Also, as forum topics for discussions - yes, it does matter.
               
               Of course your "big picture" analysis of our most important  political problem is important too, and I  bet you would generate some worthwhile exchanges if you started such a thread - and participated, but your constant denigration of discussions of other issues without offering any substance beyond  condemnation just isn't much of  a contribution. Why do you bother?
               
               GA

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               1. 82

                  Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  I'm not a critic of soap operas. I have nothing against soap operas whatsoever. That doesn't mean the business of running the country should be one though.
                  
                  Why do I bother? Because (as I said in another thread) I choose to express an opinion, just as you choose to express your opinion of my opinion. That's the beauty of a free society.

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            3. 91

               Dr Billy Kiddposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Don W, if the 2016 election is really a recasting of Dallas, then the patrician class will fight it out again! That means Jeb Bush versus Hillary Clinton.
               Yes, this would be a comedy in some respects. So in 2017 Jeb takes 20 American's healthcare plans to a Texas barbeque and dumps them in the snake pit! And the Clinton's cry foul! "Them people's plans deserve a better burial than a rattler pit."
               What drama!

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            4. 91

               Jean Bakulaposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               I was merely pointing out ideas I think that will be running through people's minds, and didn't expect what I said to be turned into a soap opera analogy. I normally avoid political forums because during the last Presidential election they got so nasty, people were resorting to name calling. Beware what awaits you.
               
               I think Hillary Clinton is the most qualified person in the country to run at this point. She has experience as a partner in a law firm, a 2 term First Lady, a Senator, The Secretary of State, and has built strong relationships with other political people. She knows how to play the game, whereas Obama was too new to have built up trust or friends to help him see his visions through.
               
               I can't think of any R who can beat her, because their whole platform is "hate Obama and get him out of Office" and they don't seem to have any other ideas about how to solve this country's many problem issues. This will hurt them. But there is a certain amount of Bush/Clinton burnout too. It should get interesting, and a lot can happen in 2 years.

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               1. 82

                  Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  *sigh*

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2. 77

   Kathleen Cochranposted 9 years ago

   You don't want mine.  I wonder if you will hear from anyone who doesn't agree with you.  So you are encouraging people to hate a candidate?  How admirable.

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   1. 89

      GA Andersonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I don't agree with him. But I certainly don't trust her to put our country's interest above her own either, no matter what kind of Democrat she is.
      
      I have read a lot about the Clintons, and I always come away with the feeling that no matter his shenanigans, at least Bill wanted what was right for America in his heart. But I was also always left with the opposite impression of Hillary - it was/is always what's right for Hillary in her heart.
      
      GA

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3. 61

   Florida Economistposted 9 years ago

   Remember back in late 2001/early 2002 when everyone just knew that Rudy Giuliani was going to be the next President? Remember how his getting the nomination was considered fait accompli, and how November wasn't going to be an election so much as it was a coronation?
   
   The came the Primaries and he got like 5 votes in Iowa and 3 in New Hampshire. The point is: while I'm sure the Cable Channels will beat this horse into the ground, it's a looooong time between now and then.
   
   Exaggeration aside, it's easy to get sucked into the "Hillary-as-a-forgone-conclusion" discussions that will certainly rage between now and 2016, but remember: we've seen this movie before with Hillary. She was all but filling out change of address cards in '08... then a freshman Senator from Illinois showed up.

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4. 91

   Dr Billy Kiddposted 9 years ago

   Yes, Warren has a populist message and Hillary seems to be a defender of the status quo--like several people have mentioned.
   And then there's the message, here, that Hillary really doesn't have the nomination sewed up--just look at 2008!
   But I can't think that my message is hate. That's the Tea Party's message. That's the gun-carrying new Senator who is armed, she says, to fight government agents! And look at 6 years of the hate Obama message. I just wondered if that message will be transferred to Hillary.
   But everyone seems to agree that Hillary can be taken down without the hate message.
   Thanks for the ideas.

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