Is It Impeachment Time?

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  1. Valeant profile image96
    Valeantposted 2 months ago

    Can you imagine how things might look if Hillary Clinton had won the presidency, and, two years later ?

    • Five of her campaign advisers had been convicted of crimes — one of them implicating her — and a sixth indicted.

    • A prosecutor documented numerous instances in which Clinton had interfered with investigators.

    • Clinton refused to let aides cooperate with subpoenas and dismissed an unfavorable court ruling as “crazy” and partisan.

    • She directed the Justice Department to investigate the front-runner for the Republicans’ 2020 nomination.

    • She directed the White House counsel to lie about her deceit, then ordered him not to testify.

    Can anybody imagine, in those circumstances, a Republican speaker of the House and the Republican presidential front-runner (the one Clinton ordered investigated) steadfastly resisting calls for impeachment?

    Using the same circumstances with Hillary WHY would you not proceed the
    same way with Trump ? Go ahead, we want to hear your explanation!

    1. PrettyPanther profile image86
      PrettyPantherposted 2 months agoin reply to this

      I believe Trump needs to be impeached, and this is not directly on topic, but just want to say that, today, Trump took away one of the oft-stated reasons why Democrats should not pursue impeachment.  He emphatically stated that he will not work with Democrats as long as they are investigating him.  If he is not going to work with them on legislation, it frees up their time to pursue impeachment.  In other words, pursuing impeachment will not take time away from other business, since Trump has clearly stated there will be no other business.

      He's brilliant, isn't he?

      1. lobobrandon profile image89
        lobobrandonposted 2 months agoin reply to this

        But the people in line after him are worse off, could this be the reason they are just waiting to imprison him once he is not president anymore and not impeach him right now?

    2. James A Watkins profile image89
      James A Watkinsposted 2 months agoin reply to this

      Generally speaking, the president has to commit a crime to be impeached. President Trump has committed no crime. Now if Trump had deleted 30,000 emails that had been subpoenaed, destroyed all his associates' Blackberrys with hammers, and used BleachBit to wipe his servers clean, gave our country's uranium to Russia in exchange for millions of dollars, sold military secrets to China for personal gain, I would say yes, impeach him. Oh wait, that was Hillary.

      1. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
        JAKE Earthshineposted 2 months agoin reply to this

        Just FYI: Here in the USA, a "CRIME" is not a requirement to be impeached although there is a MOUNTAIN of evidence in both the public domain and within the pages of the Mueller Report that indicates he has committed crimes and there are a MOUNTAIN of former prosecutors from all sides of the isle who would love to prosecute him now or when he's finally removed: The EVIDENCE to this day is STILL mounting by the way:

        Donald could be IMPEACHED for his erratic mad behavior and serial lying alone which investigative reports have tallied at about 10,000 so far;

        1. wilderness profile image97
          wildernessposted 2 months agoin reply to this

          Certainly he can be impeached for a crime or, with Democrats willing to go to any lengths at all, for nothing at all.

          But you DO realize that impeachment means nothing changes?  That it takes a 2/3rds majority of the Republican Senate to remove him from office?  That a Democratic impeachment simple means Democrats don't like Republicans, which we already know?

          You DO know and understand these things?

          1. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
            JAKE Earthshineposted 2 months agoin reply to this

            Like I said, Donald could be impeached for his erratic mad behavior and serial lying alone which investigative reports have tallied at about 10,000 so far: Amendment 25 should have been invoked long ago as well:

            I see nothing in your comment which challenges my previous comment so my previous comment stands:

          2. Readmikenow profile image96
            Readmikenowposted 2 months agoin reply to this

            Wilderness, a president can only be removed from office for "High Crimes and Misdemeanors."  This is a legal concept I've not seen a liberal or someone from the left show they comprehend.  When they speak of impeachment, it is so painfully obvious how much they don't know.  There is no substance on the left, there is only putting on a show of their ignorance.  It's entertaining at times, but now their ignorance is becoming very annoying.

            1. GA Anderson profile image91
              GA Andersonposted 2 months agoin reply to this

              Mike you should look into "High Crimes and Misdemeanors." It may be a "legal concept,"  but it is very definitely not a legal concept that is constrained by any legal statute-type applications. It could, (and was intended to), encompass something as vague as abuse of office.

              There are several good sources that look at the original meaning as considered by the Founders in their precise construction of the wording in the Constitution, and, there are other good sources that trace the meaning to Old English Common law, (which was the Founder's basis for their choice), but here is a brief in-a--nutshell explanation;

              "English common law tradition, crimes were defined through a legacy of court proceedings and decisions that punished offenses not because they were prohibited by statutes, but because they offended the sense of justice of the people and the court."

              GA

              1. Readmikenow profile image96
                Readmikenowposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                GA have to disagree with you.  All things in the Constitution are legal concepts.  I agree that there is no legal statutes that cover impeachment. 

                Neil J. Kinkopf is recognized as one of the top Constitutional scholars in the US.  His view on the subject is as follows:
                "If the Constitution means to allow impeachment on any ground whatsoever, then why would the Constitution bother to set forth that impeachment and removal may be based only on conduct that rises to the level of “treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors”? In fact, the Framers debated this phrase and settled on this formulation precisely to prohibit Congress from impeaching officers for any reason at all."

                I would like to help people on the left by letting them know that "High Crimes" does not refer to drug usage, crimes that occur on airplanes in flight or on a mountain top.  It also does not refer to constructing a building above the height of the local zoning ordinance.  Just so they know.

                Do the people on the left forget what happened when Bill Clinton was impeached in 1997?  He won in a landslide in 1998.  I wonder if they realize how impeaching Donald Trump will result in no conviction in the Senate and him being unstoppable in 2020.  Will history repeat itself?



                https://constitutioncenter.org/interact … ment-power

                1. GA Anderson profile image91
                  GA Andersonposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                  We may not be in complete disagreement Mike. I did agree that high crimes and misdemeanors was a legal concept, and I did not mean to imply that they could be interpreted to include just any reason.

                  I understood your comment to imply they were tied to statute-type violations, and that, I disagreed with. Perhaps I misunderstood your intent?

                  To your point about Mr. Kinkopf, and drawing from what looks to be the same source you found; What are High Crimes and Misdemeanors by Neil J. Kinkopf, he prefaced your quoted statement with this:

                  "...but the concluding phrase “other high crimes and misdemeanors” is anything but clear.

                  It is open-ended for the reason many constitutional provisions are vague and open-ended."


                  Followed by;

                  "In the context of impeachment, this means that the Constitution cannot be expected to specify in detail every ground on which impeachment is or is not permissible. If it attempted to do so, an individual who should be impeached might evade this punishment because the officer’s conduct does not meet some technical element of the definition even though the officer’s conduct had so harmed the nation that all agree the officer should be removed.

                  Instead, the Constitution sets forth the general principle of impeachment and leaves its more specific definition to be developed by the House of Representatives and the Senate.

                  [my emphasis]

                  So like you, I stand by my original comment.

                  GA

                  1. Readmikenow profile image96
                    Readmikenowposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                    GA,

                    You are right.  So, what is and is not high crimes and misdemeanors is and continues to be a topic of debate. 

                    Aside from legal theory, which I could debate all day.

                    The practical application of impeachment is an entirely different legal interpretation.  It is not a matter of crime and punishment as much a part of political positioning.  A sitting president has never been successfully removed from office using the impeachment process. 

                    President Donald Trump's approval rating are too high for impeachment to succeed.  In the political arena, Senators who would be presiding over such a trial, would not want to be on record of impeachment, with these approval numbers. 

                    Again, Clinton was impeached in 97' and won in a landslide in 98.

                2. Randy Godwin profile image92
                  Randy Godwinposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                  A Trump impeachment will be a different animal than either Nixon's or Clinton's, Mike. Neither of them were suspected of colluding with a foreign Govt. or being in their pocket. Sure Nixon ran into trouble with his taxes, but he nor Clinton never threatened to not do his constitutional duty as Trump did yesterday.

                  1. wilderness profile image97
                    wildernessposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                    "Neither of them were suspected of colluding with a foreign Govt. or being in their pocket."

                    Nor is Trump...except in the minds of those that allow their hatred and emotions to overcome reason, truth and fact, and who cares what they suspect?

            2. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
              JAKE Earthshineposted 2 months agoin reply to this

              lol: I guess CONservatives are unwilling to even search words in our constitution for their definitions because if they did, they would find this as it relates to "High Crimes and Misdemeanors"

              mis·de·mean·or
              /ˌmisdəˈmēnər/
              Learn to pronounce
              noun

              a minor wrongdoing.
              "the player can expect a lengthy suspension for his latest misdemeanor"
              synonyms:    wrongdoing, evil deed, crime, felony, criminal act; More
              LAW
              a nonindictable offense, regarded in the US (and formerly in the UK) as less serious than a felony.

              ABANDONING his job as Donny did yesterday after Nancy made him cry in a fragile little state, is a much higher OFFENSE than a "Misdemeanor":

              But don't you all worry none, the IMPEACHMENT process has essentially already begun if you haven't noticed or simply refuse to accept reality, and Donny's ARTICLES will include much more egregious offenses than "MISDEMEANORS"

              As Nancy "POWERHOUSE" Pelosi said a while ago, and I paraphrase, Donald is "Self Impeaching" kinda like a rump roast that makes its own gravey only this is a "TRUMP Roast" making its own bed, in prison, next to CRUSHER the 400 pounder who despises pedophiles and those idiots who endorse pedophiles for U.S. Senate:

        2. profile image74
          Hxprofposted 2 months agoin reply to this

          How many of those lies were as consequential as this one: "If you like your insurance plan, you can keep your insurance plan"?

          1. PrettyPanther profile image86
            PrettyPantherposted 2 months agoin reply to this

            Sad rationalization. This question has been asked and answered so many times I can't believe you haven't  seen it.

            1. profile image74
              Hxprofposted 2 months agoin reply to this

              Haven't seen it, sorry.  Please provide.

              Even so, it's a legit question.  Obama lied not once but repeatedly in order to get legislation that HE wanted, and that impacted millions negatively.  Some of Trump's lies, and possible obstruction, MIGHT be grounds for impeachment.

              I'll be watching.  If I believe that Trump can't be allowed to serve another term, I'll not vote for him in November 2020.  Count on it.

              1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                Randy Godwinposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                As Pretty said, this has been answered ad nauseum. Google it!

                1. profile image74
                  Hxprofposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                  I might, but I'm not the one claiming it's already been answered!

                  To add, I'm not justifying Trump's lies.  I AM truly curious though about this: Where was the freakin' outrage on the Left when he did that?  Everyone wants to know why the Right and Republicans won't reject Trump for his many lies.  I believe my question is exceedingly fair.

                  1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                    Randy Godwinposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                    Google it and you will answer yourself, Prof. They do have Google in Florida I'm sure.

                2. Castlepaloma profile image75
                  Castlepalomaposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                  Randy
                  Most US President in America's history have had the people attempted to impeach the Presidency, yet none have successfully done it.

                  Since Trump has no conscious, he won't step down. The system is ridged, so let the abuse run its course. The bright lights of the internet will heat up so intensely hot. Then all Trump's volcano piles of BS will self- implode. Then the universe will stop evolving around him.

                  1. Randy Godwin profile image92
                    Randy Godwinposted 2 months agoin reply to this

                    It's already started, Cas!

      2. promisem profile image96
        promisemposted 2 months agoin reply to this

        Interesting. If what you say about Hillary's alleged crimes is true, I wonder why the Republican White House and Republican Congress didn't put her in jail.

        1. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
          JAKE Earthshineposted 2 months agoin reply to this

          https://hubstatic.com/14536690.jpg

          Isn't that a hoot promisem? Almost every time the Trump cultees holler "Lock Her UP" !!!! A corrupt Trump Campaign crony goes to prison:

      3. Randy Godwin profile image92
        Randy Godwinposted 2 months agoin reply to this

        That's what Rush and Hannity claim on Faux News, James. Day after day after day.....


        I suppose that makes it okay if Donnie breaks the law? Hillary did it! Hillary was never the POTUS, James. Do you want Trump to be better than Hillary, or not?

  2. Valeant profile image96
    Valeantposted 2 months ago

    It's clear there are grounds for impeachment.  What is also clear is that a McConnell-led Senate cannot be trusted to do an impartial investigation of the reasons for an impeachment.  The leaders in the Senate are Trump loyalists and are willing to let Trump get away with his crimes to achieve policy goals.  That is the sad statement of the political landscape today.

 
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