Why do fellow Hubbers fawn over a Hub filled with errors?

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   pagesvoiceposted 12 years ago

   Why do fellow Hubbers fawn over a Hub filled with errors?
   
   Many times I will see an attention grabbing title and within the first sentence there will be a misspelling of a word. Okay, to err is human and we have all made typographical errors. However, in proceeding further into the story presented I will notice numerous mistakes and grammatical missteps. At that point, I simply can not go any further and I leave the Hub. What amazes me though will be the number of comments decrying accolades to the author. So I ask, how can other readers fawn over an article filled with one mistake after another? Am I the one who is being unreasonable?

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   peeplesposted 12 years ago

   Some of us are more concerned with the point of the hub. One of my favorite hubbers has horrible grammer. The point of his hubs though is heart warming and just great. It's kind of like being in a relationship. There will be flaws, but if overall it works you stick with them. I know personally my spelling is not great and I often have run on sentences. I would hope if it was seen by one of my fans who usually reads my work they would tell me, instead of just moving on to another hub.

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      Insane Mundaneposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That is the best answer, right there...

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      peeplesposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Pagesvoice, I want to make it clear I wasn't saying you were being unreasonable, just that my opinion differed!

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   chef-de-jourposted 12 years ago

   I fully understand where you're coming from and empathise with your position. Is it that we're from the same old school and demand utter precision when it comes to spelling and, hopefully, grammar and sentence structure? It must be.
   However there are circumstances in which I will persist and trudge my way through the swamps of mistakes in order to try and find meaning within the tangle of word and image. You see, being a newcomer I find myself in the unenviable position of complete ignorance when it comes to things like RSS, SEO, CPM and other such terms - so I battle on, reading some hubs which, yes, are woeful in grammar but rich in the content I crave. I don't pretend to know a half of what I read on technical hubs but I'm getting there.
   Seems I'm a mercenary some of the time but a purist - like you - most of the time.
   
   So I don't think you're being unreasonable, you're just applying personal standards which are different to most. In a way what you're doing is a positive - HubPages will benefit because quality of hub should increase over time. Perhaps if you left a comment on those hubs that make you wince and diplomatically pointed out the mistakes you'd feel better plus the author might twig and start improving their writing!
   
   Thanks for the question, I enjoyed answering.

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      First of all, I have no idea why someone would give your answer a down vote. Secondly, I too have acted the mercenary at times. It is just too disturbing for me to see people dote on authors of poorly worded Hubs...I just don't get it.

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   Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years ago

   pagesvoice, as readers, some people are willing to wade through the errors or ignore them.  And some people will vote up or give praise to any author without thinking about how the article is presented.  I find it annoying when there is an error in the title, so when I see that, I will move on because I feel it is the sign of things to come.  Many people are writers, but they certainly aren't editors.  I am certainly no editor, but I do know what I want to read.  There are writers on this site that I have given the X to because I know they are careless with their writing, and I don't want them on my feed.  I know writers who call themselves writers.  But when it comes to writing skills, forget it.  They can't write themselves out of a paper bag, and can only depend on their cyber friends to pump up their writing.  Sound familiar?  There are people like this online.  They aren't going to change their writing, and I'm not going to be a part of their readership.  No, you are not being unreasonable.  And neither am I.

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you Arlene and I concur with the cyber friend angle. I am curious why your honest response has resulted in 2 people voting you down.

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      Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      pagevoice, I have been writing for money since the late 70s, and with it comes the expectation that there will be those who don't want to deal with what you put out there.  But at the same time, they are entitled to their opinions.

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with your comment Arlene. There are some of us who take the written word seriously and then there are some who feel entitled to $$$ for everything they write. Horrible writing doesn't equate to a wonderful Hub.

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      fpherj48posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Hey Arlene!  "GOOD ANSWER!!  You go, girl!

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      Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Ah, Paula. Thank you! But what's a writer to do but be grateful that people aren't hunting you down to throw eggs at you? When readers start slinging bad criticism, this is where you borrow that shield from Captain America!  Back!  Back!

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   TIMETRAVELER2posted 12 years ago

   I am with you pagesvoice.   I don't think we should be praising substandard work, regardless of the content because substandard writing affects all of us.  Many people depend on this site for income, but when too many people are sloppy, suddenly Google starts downgrading Hub Pages...and all of us fall with it.
   
   Even worse are those people who continue to use gutter language in their hubs or use them as personal blogs. This is not the place for those things.  Someone made the comment that standards like yours are not the norm... disagree.  Hub Pages sets those standards and they are right to do it.  This is a business and should be run as such.
   
   One more thing:  Even though I'm a retired English teacher, I grammar and spell check every hub and edit carefully.  This takes a lot of my time and effort.  I really resent it when somebody else slaps a piece of garbage together and throws it on the site and then people tell them how great they are.  They're not great, they're either uneducated or lazy.
   
   Sorry for going on and on, but you hit a hot spot with me on this one.  Obviously, I agree with you 100%.

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you for your honesty. Your reasoning makes perfect sense to me. I agree that poorly worded Hubs lower the standards and how this site appears to others. Since when do we award praise for slipshod work? To be a pro then act the pro.

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   Byron Wolfposted 12 years ago

   Like Peeples, I'm concerned with the point of the hub. However, there's a point when there are so many errors, it's distracting, even laborious to read.
   If it is clear English is not the writer's native language, it's easier to ignore the errors for some reason. I know they're doing their best to communicate.
   
   Generally, I'm not bothered by errors until it becomes too distracting to read.

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   lbramosposted 12 years ago

   For most of us, English is not our native language, so it's "normal" to make some spelling and grammar mistakes...
   
   I think there's two things we can do to try to improve the quality of the hubs:
   
   1 - send a message to the hubber pointing out the mistakes so he can correct them...
   2 - try to create another option on the "flag this hub", something like "grammar errors" or "spelling errors", so hubbers can know that and try to fix it!
   
   I've been called to attention on a few hubs of mine, and I've made every correction they pointed me!
   
   If we focus on helping each other, we'll get amazing hubs from all over the world!

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      While I appreciate the reasons pointed out in your answer, I don't feel it is up to me or other Hubbers to act as editors for someone else. Of course, this is just my opinion.

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      lbramosposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      You wouldn't act as editor, but instead of voting up or down, or "funny", "amazing", or whatever, you would mark it as "need revision" or something like that...

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I am merely a writer on this site. If an article is written in a way that captures my attention and is presented professionally, I will vote up, awesome, etc. I'm not the word police and would never tell someone to revise their work.

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      Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      It is best to be responsible for your own writing and publishing and not depend on strangers' comments.  Otherwise, pay someone to edit your work and not rely on anyone but yourself to do the writing.

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   fpherj48posted 12 years ago

   pagesvoice.....The FIRST paragraph in the comment by "chef-de-jour," echos my identical sentiments.
   It is  beyond my control, to not CRINGE, when reading some hubs.  When errors are numerous and blatant, most often, I cannot even finish reading a hub, to say nothing of leaving a comment.
   
   Having said this, I can only slightly agree with those readers who say that despite numerous errors/flaws within a hub, they will read and comment, based upon the "point" (gist?) of the article.   IMO, if the message is valuable or a topic is very interesting, this only serves to cause me more disappointment, in considering the numerous mistakes.
   I don't believe it is our job as fellow-writers & readers to "correct" other hubbers.  I have, done some editing for hubbers who have asked me to do so.
   Most hubbers are very generous and helpful.  This is a sharing & caring group of individuals here on HP.
   Further, I do not believe it is for any of us to ADMONISH other writers about the verbiage they may use and/or whether or not they feel HubPages is "strictly a business!"  I would suggest, that in business, especially, it is more than acceptable for people to be friendly and personable with one another.
   Shall we allow ourselves to be directed by nazis?  I think not.  These matters are left to the administrators who do an excellent job at monitoring hubs for violations.
   pagesvoice....your concern as to "why" someone would give a down vote in response to an obviouly sane and intelligent comment.....  As in many groups, there are always idiots on the loose with unacceptable behavior.  You will see this and more, sorry to say.  We have our "moles," as well as, what I refer to as, the "stupid stalkers," who bounce around for the sole purpose of causing trouble.  IGNORE them.
   Reasons for poorly written hubs can be ...laziness, pure ignorance, English is a 2nd language, neglecting to edit one's work, believing quantity is more vital than quality...this last one?  a huge mistake!
   Finally, kind Sir, what this may boil down to is, our "Freedom of Choice."    Do not read anything you find very poorly written, undeserving of your time and/or frustrating.  You have this right.
   As I'm sure you have found, there are far more interesting and beautifully-written  quality hubs, by extraordinarily talented individuals, than the few written by people, who, realistically, should find another hobby.
   I appreciate your question.

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      Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Dear, dear Paula. Thank you for your comments, and I hope people learn from what you just wrote. There are so many gifted writers on this site, so I have learned to focus on them and give them encouragement to write more of their magic.  Write!

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      What a super. analytical and easy to understand response you have given, You are so right regarding freedom of choice. I'm reminded that to be a winner then you should stick with the winners. Thanks again for your comment.

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   ChristinSposted 12 years ago

   Perhaps there is a "buddy system" in play or something where groups are kind of supporting each other without considering all of the ramifications?
   
   I am torn on this because I can see some of both sides.  For example, there are several excellent hubbers that have more errors in their hubs, but it is due to them not having English as their first language.  I appreciate English is a very difficult language to master so I cut those particular people some slack sometimes. 
   
   I do recognize though, that poor quality does bring us all down and that is not good.  I do flag hubs regularly that are of substandard quality and I have no reservations in doing so.  I believe that just as bad hubs can bring us down, hubbers that do the best to "clean up the neighborhood" so to speak also bring us all up - so I try to help in that respect. 
   
   Like you, I have seen some cringe worthy hubs shared and praised which boggled the mind though. I think in those cases it has to be a buddy system or something.  People can't truly enjoy hubs that are so horribly written it's painful can they?
   
   As for people with bad spelling - one or two errors slipping through maybe, but that is why we have spell check for crying out loud.  It is a huge pet peeve of mine to see numerous typos and misspellings.  It equates to laziness in my eyes and complementing and praising this kind of work does the writer no favors either in helping them improve. 
   
   Even if they have stellar ideas, how can they reach their potential as a writer if people are dishonest in giving praise to pieces that obviously don't deserve it? Good question

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      pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Wow, there are so many excellent answers. How am I going to select a "best" answer? I have never "flagged" a Hub, but after reading your explanation maybe I will become more involved. It is a great community here and I love being a part of it.

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      Arlene V. Pomaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you for the excellent question, pagesvoice.  As a writer, I allow myself to be my harshest critic.  But I have learned NOT to leave bad criticism because not all writers can take it. Without developing tough skin, how can one truly write???

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    DMartelonlineposted 12 years ago

    You are NOT being unreasonable. I often run across hubs during "hopping" that actually have typographical errors in the title which I find inexcusable.
    
    With the number of spell check programs available (free) there is simply NO excuse for poor spelling.
    
    I can "overlook" some challenging grammar in a hub if the spelling is correct. I am aware that we have many "non-native" English speakers and they are more prone to poor word choice and grammar challenges. However, typos are inexcusable.

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    donnah75posted 12 years ago

    I know I am late in entering this conversation, but I just wanted to say thank you for asking this question.  There is nothing worse than having to read someone's error filled work.  I often see on this site that people "give a little slack" to those who don't speak English as a first langauge.  Although I can appreciate their effort, I think that they should respect the fact that they have not yet become fluent enought to publish in English.  Harsh?  Maybe.  All I know is that I have tried to get my husband to write a few articles, and he doesn't want to because he doesn't think his English is good enough.  (He speaks English as a second language.  His first language is Polish.)  He writes and speaks better than most of my American students, so he would do great on this site.  However, he feels it best to err on the side of correct grammar and decent writing.  I so wish others would do the same.

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    innerspinposted 12 years ago

    Oh my, this may be going off at a tangent, but now I'm unsure of comments on my own hubs. I have certainly read hubs that I didn't think rated well, and seen good comments. Thought it was me being picky about grammar and such. I think the response about buddies rings true.
    I started on here to learn more about writing to please readers, now I'm wondering if people comment for the right reasons. ( Appologies to anyone who has been kind enough to leave me a comment.) Aargh. What a question!

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       pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       I hope the question wasn't upsetting, but I really was curious what motivates some with their replies based on a Hub that has been poorly written.

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       innerspinposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       I meant "what a question" in a good way, as it's gained a lot of interest. It was something I wondered about myself. Please don't think I'm upset.

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       pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       No pun intended, but I'm glad we are on the same page.

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    Faceless39posted 12 years ago

    I don't know, but they keep winning Hub of the Day.
    
    Sometimes I feel like the standards are completely gone, and with it, the pride of doing things well.
    
    About all I can do, though, is my personal best on the things I write.  I wrote seven grammar hubs in the hopes that people will learn something.  Alas, you can't tell someone how to spell-check or to give a damn!

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       pagesvoiceposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Bravo. I agree with you completely.

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