I thought I knew the answer to this question. But something interesting happened in the last week which I found it hard to explain. I'd be interested to hear opinions.
I have a hub which is nine months old and had just reached 250-300 hits per day.
I was experimenting to see how many tags I could use over a week ago. I put in quite a few on this particular hub and then never got around to checking back. When I did check back, I had an automated warning that I had too many tags and my hubscore had taken a serious dent - between 60-70 (usually 85-95).
I went in and took off quite a few tags till the warning was removed. However the weird thing is, my traffic dropped by between 60-80 over that 6-7 days with the warning on the hub. And now that they've been removed the traffic and hubscore are both climbing rapidly.
250-300 hits per day to 60-80 per day? I think you lost most of the HP traffic.
Nope it went down about that much.
From about 275-300 hits a day down to 195-220 hits a day.
And I only get maybe 5-10 HP traffic. Nearly 90% of traffic to that hub is from google, bing, yahoo & backlinks. It's ranked number one on some decent keywords.
I would say it does. Your hub score will affect your hub on HP. If you have a lot of outside traffic, then I don't think it makes much of a difference.
For me, I am lucky if I get 100 views over the life of a hub so the score effects me a lot since most of the views are from HP. You probably get a lot of outside views so it does not affect you too much.
Did HP flagged your hub and it was no longer published for a while? If so,it may happen that in the meantime your hub was unpublished it lost its position in search engines that resulted into less traffic later.
That is interesting,
so hub score is important for traffic - that is your finding.
Tags do not effect traffic?
I read Habee say all words are Keywords, so should we bother putting in keywords?... these keywords just link other hubs on the subject....
Anyone care to explain? ... getting more confused than clear..
Saleheens, it was not unpublished. It just had a warning at the top of the hub.
Sofs - tags are not about telling your keywords so much as :
1. Each tag creates a backlink to your hub (click on the tag name and you'll see it takes you to a new page with a list of all hubs with that tag.)
2. Tags also help HP put relevant hubs in the right hand box (you'll see similar topic hubs displayed there.)
I'm unclear still on whether it effects hubs score.
I think the best hubs on hubscores and how it all works are darksides. or go into the learning center where a lot of this is covered.
as far as I understand hub scores have no bearing on outside traffic unless the hub score is below 40.
Likely a coincidence. Google does not know any hubscore.
There is a possibility though (just theoretically, I did not check this) that HP will convert all tag pages links to your hub to nofollow, if you exceed the number of tags. This can create a pattern you are describing, though I would expect it to have much bigger time lag...
Thank you Misha.
That sounds quite plausible and might be the closest explanation I get!
I was actually thinking this too. It is as if HP have had an algorithmic update of their own! Also, if you get a an unnatural organic peak of traffic, you can bet your life that your authorscore will go down. I think this has something to do with the system identifying this as unnatural and alerts to possible spam. Of course, this is an observation, rather than a fact!
Did you notice your Hub Score drop below 70 during this time?
That sounds like that might be the underlying problem Misha
I think hubscore can influence traffic in a kind of circuitous way. If your hub gets on the first page of the hot hubs, then it gets a backlink from a PR 5 page or if it's on the best hubs a PR4 link. If google crawls thse pages when your hub is on there you'll get a boost in terms of google kudos and possibly higher serps and therefore traffic. If your hub got penalized you are much less likely to get on one of those pages.
P.S. This is just my theory
Plus there is another possible way - from those who land on HP by typing the HP URL, or come to the website and start browsing around using the links at the top and go a couple of levels deep - the "Hubs" link at the top takes to the highest scoring hubs.
When people come to read a hub they are likely to read your other best hubs also shown in your best/hot hub RSS in a particular hub. When your hubscore goes down the RSS don't show it anymore and you may miss some traffic for that particular hub though you are not totally missing the traffic rather these traffic are going to another hub.
Where was the traffic coming from?
Hubs can benefit from a higher hubscore, but any effect would probably not have such an instantaneous affect.
Have you had any other random traffic drops with this hub in the past? It could be seasonal!
The traffic was nearly all from google.
And I don't (think) it's seasonal. It's a baby/pregnancy related hub.
What was the number of tags on this Hub? I have not known, until hearing about this now in this post that there's a warning that appears if Hubs have to many tags.
# of tags depends a lot on length of your hub. for that many relevant tags, your hub would have to be close to 1700- 2000 words.
I think there's a forum thread about too many tags if you do a search. I remember Maddie giving some figures.
I'll have to check on some of my lengthier hubs. I don't think I've ever used more than 25- 30 tags.
50? *gives a low whistle* interesting. I don't have more than 25 on any of mine. Can confirm this once I check each one, lol.
If you notice something like this happening again, check to see if Google has either deindexed you (temporarily) or that your hub may have simply dropped in rank for the desired keywords.
It is possible that it is not related to Hubscore. One of those "correlation does not imply causation" situations.
I haven't read the responses, but here is my opinion...
I started off on this site by using loads of tags, hundreds. Then I discovered that Hubpages DISREGARDS tags over a certain number. So you may use 100 tags, it will only take notice of a certain number, maybe 20 or 25. Your hub may have a particular tag, but will be excluded from the lists for some of those tags (over a certain number).
It is widely accepted that 10-15 is the optimum number. I use 20 as a maximum, never more. When adding lots of tags, Hubpages probably disregarded some of your most important ones.
The result is your hubpage not appearing in the related hubs sections of some hubpages where it would have appeared previously. The way to repair your traffic is to try and remember what your previous tags where, as far as you can, and restore the hub to its previous state.
This would have had no SHORT TERM effects on your SERPS, at least not likely. But tags do have SEO benefits, and taking a hub out of a highly relevant tag list could have longer term effects (especially if you dont shove it back in). You would have lost your traffic through Hubpages internal systems, such as the Related Hubs boxes.
My favourite hub about tagging is this one http://hubpages.com/hub/Hubpages-Traffic-Use-of-Tags
I followed that word-for-word, changed the tags on all of my hubpages, and saw a 40%-50% rise in traffic. I must have reduced my number of tags by about 75%.
Do you have a source for the Hubpages tag usage limit? I might have to change my optimization if it is so low.
I know Google has a limit, but I thought hubpages used all the tags listed.
Oli, no I do not know the limit. There definitely is one though, I have had tags disregarded before. I wish I had experimented to find the threshold, on hubs of different word counts, but frankly I do not have the time to invest in such a project. Maybe Paul Deeds or Paul Edmundson will answer? Has anybody tried asking before?
Of course, you could just click on all of the tags on one of your mature hubs... to make sure your hubs is in the list...
I remember during Hubtrails, Marisa mentioned that HP picks up the first 15 tags? I've never read it anywhere, but I recall her saying something like that. that we could have more, but to make sure the Hubtrails tags were in those first 15... but I think it was in relation to showing up on a RSS feed.
This was a misconception that many people thought true. The truth of the matter is that HP had a bug in the tagging system. Edweirdo gave HP the heads up on this one and now... after a few months... the bug has been elimiated from the system. Now all tags are working fine!
that's nice to know. I reread the thread talking about it, and it seemed to be talking about being picked up on the RSS feed. I don't know. I don't usually go over 20 tags. I probably could on a couple of my hubs. but I still get confused if I can include a tag if I only mention a location or word in the hub.
that's interesting. I guess too many tags might look like keyword stuffing with the length of some hubs.
Not sure, I have just visited one of Misha's hubs at it has 50 tags. I clicked on about half of those tags, and his hub was shown on every list.
So I don't know what the rule is. All I know is that optimising my tags and cutting them down from around 50 or 60 to between 15-20 resulted in massive traffic gains. And I mean REALLY massive.
So I just stick with my little way. I don't even bother tagging for the first week or two, then I tag in group. I find highly relevant tags, with a nice amount of competition, and stop at 20. Sometimes I stop at 15.
I put at least 50% on my traffic doing that, and I certainly wasn't struggling for traffic before that point. So I just stick with what works for me.
Ryan, I would love to see something more than your pure speculation confirming your conclusions about the number of tags. Hub you referenced does not confirm the limit.
Just to clarify, I do not know the limit. Neither did I state conclusively that I did, hence the line:
"it will only take notice of a certain number, maybe 20 or 25."
But I can 100% categorically state that there is a point where tags are ignored, I know this because I have experienced it.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to know how the limit works, but neither have I sought to give the impression that I do know this limit. 'Maybe' is certainly a word commonly associated with 'speculation', I will give you that.
I have seen it come into effect with less than 40 tags before though, I am sure of that. Whether or not that depends on hub length is another question - and one which I cannot answer.
Here's the scoop on Google and it's use of Meta Tags.
http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot. … a-tag.html
Meta tags: http://searchengineland.com/meta-keywor … ines-12099
So, Google doesn't really care about meta tags much. It is an important part of Hub Pages internal linking structure, however.
I have no idea what Hub Pages has set as a limit for keywords.
Is there a benefit to having a lot of hubs , that is as the number of hubs goes up, does this improve hubscore and hub traffic
In what I have observed (keep hold of the idea of the 30 day challenge), it seems that a hub a day with good quality content can give a boost to your overall traffic. Back to the 30 day challenge... why do you think that HP actively encourages this idea? Everything on this site has been thought about and set up to optimise your success! All you have to do is write good content!! Easy eh?
Having many related hubs would provide a huge benefit to you.
Group them together and use similar/same tags. You'll get the benefit of linking them together, which will increase the likelihood of traffic between them, but also help with Google.
I've gone back and looked through a bunch of your hubs and it seems to me that your general tag usage is sensible and judicious.
What were you thinking when you put 50 tags on one hub?
I don't mean that as a wise guy question at all - were you following someone's (very bad) advice or were these tags that you really thought made sense for the particular subject matter?
Just curious. I tend to under-tag - at my main site I often have only one or two tags, here I do a little better.
Sorry Pcunix, as you know I'm a prolific forum poster and after this fell off the main page I never checked back.
I'm not sure if it was 50 tags. Didn't count. But it was quite a few. I actually wanted to see what the limit was
And I believe they were all relevant - it was a big health one with a lot of information covering a lot of different things from food to teas and natural treatments.
I just wanted to see what would happen, since I like to try everything once. Just didn't expect such an immediate result.
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