Do you feel that Revelation, in particular , how the signs are supposed to be incredibly apparent to God's children, is taking place in this day and age?
First mistake in interpretation. The signs will NOT be apparent and were never meant to be apparent to the worldly mind. All the scriptures are relevant - none greater than another. The scriptures and the events in the world around us must be viewed with a gospel "lens". In other words to discern life around us accurately one must study and apply the gospel in their lives. Only then will they begin to understand how God really works His wonders upon mankind.
Many of the events in Revelation have taken place but can only be seen through the gospel "lens." Revelation is filled with imagery as was used in the old language. The imagery is symbolic of world conditions and condition leading up to the coming of Christ and the resurrection of all mankind.
goldenpath, I very much agree with you on this (The Earth will eventually be gone someday and nobody will be able tell you exactly when. No matter what your belief system is, this should be apparent; e.g. Stars explode, nobody can be sure of exactly when, and the sun is a star; You are Christian, hence you are familiar with the phrase, "do not believe anyone who claims to know when these events are to take place.").
I would also like to point out what may be happening in the world today. The year 2012 is fast-approaching. While a few sources throughout time (Mayan and Aztec calenders, and their connection with the Egyptians. I believe there is also something in ancient Chinese culture) put Dec. 21, 2012 as the end of the CURRENT EARTH CYCLE; not the end of the world.
I believe with this knowledge that we can assume SOMETHING will happen, but it most likely won't be the end of the world.
BTW, I didn't mean "you" (goldenpath) specifically. I just meant "you" as anybody who is Christian.
I think both of you are right! There will be changes and we must be prepared.
The bible contains great teachings but as far as your last post goes sneak it is common sense. Life is change. When that date does come it will mean nothing but another day. Not trying to make people mad but I believe Revelations to be ramblings of a lunatic. You can not have prophesy and free will. They negate each other.
I don't think that they are taking place in this day and age.
They are finishing up in this day and age.
Why do you suppose Jesus is seen as a bloody Lamb of God as if it had just been slain when he is opening the seal judgments?
Why was he depicted in this manner?
One minute John was weeping because no one in heaven or earth was found who was worthy to take the book. and the next minute The bloody lamb was standing opening the seals. ?????
The seven seal judgments were inflicted upon that Hebrew Nation who had just rejected and killed him; Just as Jesus told in the story of the evil husbandmen that killed the son of the owner of the vinyard.
The prophesy of Revelation "began" their fulfillment around 30 AD and have been unfolding through the ages ever sence.
We recently had a debate on this topic - the most interesting and maybe most obvious conclusion (of that debate) was that it could very well be the end for god's children - that is - the end of monotheist religion.
And about time too. The replacement for religion is long overdue and hopefully will be more rational, more acceptable to more people, and about the basic tenets of love and peace that the current teachings are supposed to be based upon - and which they then over-write with hate, hellfire and damnation.
I totally believe in the bible/Revelations
Its very relevant. Its Gods and his sons life.
What they did.
my favorite part - and what I feel is the most relevant - is Matthew 6: 5-16
It takes a person who considers himself to be very wise as to discount any scripture until God himself removes it. As a student of scripture, there is much in Revelations as well as other such esoteric books that was intended to leave its impression on the reader for them to consider and study life to appreciate the hand of God when it moves. there may be some of it that has already happened but until all of it happens few if any will be able to nail down what has or hasn't and what exactly happened when as it was spoken of by who.
I consider all of the Bible to be relevant. And the prophecies mentioned in the book of revelations are especially applicable to this day and age.
food for thought.
I would also say that the Bubonic plague of the 14 century was when the first bowl judgment was poured out. (Rev 16:2)
I agree with Jerami, while all of you are correct, the question does not revolve around one specific sentence but the general descriptive story of key signs to look for before the Son Of God returns. For instance, with over 200 quakes that have taken place so far this year alone ( that fact was stated on CNN earlier today ), the sentence stating " ...and there will be earthquakes in diverse places.....", when I heard that on the news today, my mind immediately snapped to that specific passage (another quake has hit China and there are 64 dead at last count ).
I want to state the exact verses, but, I do noy have my bible here at this location as we speak. But, I tell you this, I will try my best to correlate factual, recorded events with Bible Scripture, as well as Holy Q'uranic texts that describe the disbelievers in this advent in time, when the signs were plain to see amongst those that do believe in God's Sovereign word ( as it applies to the Apocalyptic Verses ).
One specific event to watch is whether we will see the Pope dethroned. Many scholars believe that Catholicism was referred to in the instance of the beast with ten horns. I am only restating what I have read and I am not in any way trying to insinuate conjecture, but, the summary of the analogy is when the last of the beast's horns fell, that is the moment that Christ will appear. Not as a loving Christ but as an avengeful Christ that will make war , and defeat the devil over a period of 1000 years. Many scholars have compared that last horn with the Roman Catholic church. The horn representing the fall of Catholicism.
Do you think that is near with the beginning of a few Catholic priests speaking out and demanding he leave the papacy due to covering up a sex abuse scandal that he denies as "rumor". Watch the related articles and please scrutinize and dig deep! I know I will! I will be watching these stories develop and post or reply accordingly.
Thank You for your comments and participation! Feel free to reply,
Sab Oh ...Sorry comrade, but religion isn't going away any time soon. Just be satisfied with yours.
IF we are to understand prophesy we have to stop interpretating it to suit our own imagination
I am stating what is actualy written in the KJV of our bible. It is clearly written in scripture, if we can just keep ourselves from interpretating the truth out of clearly stated passages.
In the book of Daniel; Gabriel gives us the ("key") interpretation of these simbols that are represented in the book of Revelation. Gabriel has interpretated them, they need no further interpretation. If we are to believe what is written in scripture we must not change a single one of these meanings
I think that there will soon be an end to Religion.
There will be no place for "Religion" in Gods presence.
The very last two signs will soon unfold, the 7th trumpet being sounded and 7th bowl being poured out. All others seal, trumpet and bowl judgments have already been accomplished.
These last two are to come at the last minute, before we destroy ourselves. We will bring ourselves to the brink of destruction first. And THEN ...???
One such KEY to understanding prophesy is to understand that In Matt. 24:3 Mark 13: Four desciples came to Jesus
"PRIVATELT" and ask him when are these things going to be?
Jesis answerd them PRIVATELY and personaly.....
"When YOU see..." "When they take you before the synagoge"
"When YOU hear hear of wars and rummers of wars "KNOW" that it is near"
Verily I say unto "YOU" this generation shall not pass till all of these things be fulfilled but no one knows the day or hour.." He wasn't talking to some generation to come some 2000 years later.
The BEAST (Rev.13) can not do his job if everyone knows who he is; so he has to hide the truth of prophesy under a ton of false interpretations.
The seven seal judgments WERE inflicted upon that generation; "that" Hebrew Nation that killed their messiah instead of anointing him as described in Daniel 9:24.
That Hebrew Nation that ceased to exist in 135-138 AD.
It was after this that the trumpet judgments were handed out and began being fulfilled one at a time over the next1000 years.
And then the bowl judgments began; starting with the bubonic plague (1340 ish)
We need to stop believing Interpretations and read scripture as it is written.
This might raise some eyebrows and spark a bit of controversy, but if you do some research on the book of revelation (especially through the Church fathers) It seems, at least a good portion of the time, to be a mystical description of what takes place during the Catholic mass. Obviously, there are parts of revelation that refer to end times and things of this nature, but a good portion really does seem to match up with elements of the mass. I cannot go into detail here, because that would require explaining the catholic mass which would take up pages. Suffice it to say, that early Christians did not get as worked up over Revelation as we do now in our sensationalist world.
I've been trying to raise some eyebrows since I arived.
All that I can get are a few rolling of the eyes.
What no one wants to recognize are the timeframes that are consistent through out prophesy.
These are of great significance or they would not have been included in scripture.
Until we study these references and understand that language, there will be no correct understanding of these prophesy.
These timeframe references are all lined up like dominos waiting for someone to put their finger on one of them.
..... "and they all fall down" ....
And you are correct The Czar; The Catholic Church is very
There is so much in that OP to consider.
"incredibly apparent" is precisely the phrase.
I would has no, it is not apparent.
With all certainty, from personal experience with a wide variety of approaches, there is little of any actual visible proof. By the same token, it is strongly believed that the teachers of this Amazing New Life have no idea themselves. They really to not teach, rather enjoying the title of preach.
Yet, the words they preach point to exactly their own failure to teach about those apparent abilities...
There seems to be a new veil over the eyes of people, who still remain complacent -though zealous- and apparently are expecting Him to do all the work, while they sit and 'woop-woop' in sing-a-long or spew fire-brimstone at those outside. I refer to that as hissing and gnashing of teeth. An old custom when someone was venomous toward another....
The beast in revelation almost certainly refers to Nero. If you break Nero's name into Hebrew letters and then sum their value you get 666.
All the early Christians believed they were living in the end times. Jesus even told his followers that they would not die before his second coming. And they believed him.
John the revelator was almost certainly writing about the events in his own time with some metaphorical code.
Every generation has thought they were living in the end times and each has been wrong. I would be surprised if this generation has any greater claim.
I think we live in the time if the acceleration of things... and some who are paying attention and have lived long enough to see it... do.
Yes I feel the bible and revalations is very relevant to today's world.
I think if you follow the golden rule and use what gods givin you then you'll be fine. If he truely created us he knows we may stray, as long as we come back to him we'll be alright.
Ok you got me.
When it comes to Revelation I need help but I like watch on TV
John Hagee when he teaches on Revelation as he appears for me to unveil the mysteries with such passion you can almost hear the angels blowing those trumpets.
People today do seem to mirror the action fore told in Revelation.
A true speech will move you, so to speak. Thanx for sharing.
Trying to make money from women with breast cancer? I have flagged your hub "Ways to cure breast cancer" as misleading garbage parroted from the Internet.
<snipped text of another users's hub>
Dear me. Jesus would be proud of you trying to screw a few adsense dollars from sick women.
No morals. None.
All Scripture is inspired. That doesn't mean that it's significance is immediately apparent to everyone who looks at it. Sometimes its meaning requires repeated reading and study over many years. Even if someone does understand a passage on first reading, meditation on it over the years will bring out new meanings as a person's life circumstances change.
As for Revelation, get a hold of a Bible (any translation)that is printed in such a way that you can easily distinguish between prose and poetry. Then look at the poetry and notice how much of it has become a part of our hymns and other sacred music. I don't try to make Revelation line up with the six o'clock news and try to learn something about end times (which surely started as soon as Jesus rose from the tomb). I just worship through it.
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